2024/03/29

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2024-03-29 02:13:42 +0100 <koala_man> geekosaur: welp, my gitlab account request was rejected so I can't file those cross-compilation bugs
2024-03-29 02:14:07 +0100 <geekosaur> rejected?
2024-03-29 02:14:34 +0100 <geekosaur> ben was just clearing out a bunch of spam accounts, maybe he overdid it slightly
2024-03-29 02:14:55 +0100mizlan(~mizlan@c-69-181-82-43.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
2024-03-29 02:15:58 +0100 <Hecate> hey koala_man 👋
2024-03-29 02:16:31 +0100 <geekosaur> I'd apply again, especially if your account name included some non-ASCII
2024-03-29 02:18:58 +0100 <haskellbridge> <s​m> not easy to be a ghc contributor!
2024-03-29 02:24:35 +0100 <geekosaur> not easy to deal with spammers trying anything they can think of to roost in our project 😞
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2024-03-29 02:48:00 +0100 <haskellbridge> <s​m> what's up with that.. is it because ghc is on gitlab ? I don't see this on github
2024-03-29 02:48:36 +0100 <haskellbridge> <s​m> or because they are managing their own gitlab ?
2024-03-29 02:49:26 +0100 <geekosaur> it seems li,ke they din't (or possibly can't) abuse github that way, but they used to be able to get a github account, use it to access our gitlab instance, and get auto-approved
2024-03-29 02:49:37 +0100 <geekosaur> they now go into the approval queue
2024-03-29 02:50:15 +0100 <geekosaur> anyway yes, gitlab works differently from github here
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2024-03-29 07:50:43 +0100Sachin(~Sachin@103.134.250.242)
2024-03-29 07:54:29 +0100 <Sachin> hi
2024-03-29 07:57:05 +0100Sachin(~Sachin@103.134.250.242) (Quit: Client closed)
2024-03-29 08:40:05 +0100 <hololeap> I see a Binary instance for Data.Array.Array, but not sure where to find something similar for Vector
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2024-03-29 08:43:48 +0100vpan(~vpan@212.117.1.172)
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2024-03-29 08:53:47 +0100 <lyxia> hololeap: https://hackage.haskell.org/package/vector-binary-instances ?
2024-03-29 08:54:55 +0100tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl)
2024-03-29 08:55:21 +0100 <hololeap> thx
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2024-03-29 10:34:15 +0100 <Arsen> https://paste.sr.ht/~arsen/c61b0c595c9a100f2b4834d2064c8216eb4700bb emacs' haskell-mode indents this data declaration like this. is this the correct convention for wrapping record syntax? is it haskell-mode screwing up?
2024-03-29 10:37:42 +0100 <ncf> what's a correct convention, but also this looks mighty screwed up to me
2024-03-29 10:38:24 +0100waleee(~waleee@h-176-10-144-38.NA.cust.bahnhof.se) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2024-03-29 10:38:41 +0100 <Arsen> well, that makes it incorrect ;P
2024-03-29 10:38:48 +0100 <Arsen> correct = looks not-screwed-up
2024-03-29 10:40:58 +0100dcoutts(~duncan@cpc69402-oxfd27-2-0-cust903.4-3.cable.virginm.net)
2024-03-29 10:43:20 +0100tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl)
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2024-03-29 10:44:43 +0100gmg(~user@user/gehmehgeh)
2024-03-29 10:47:31 +0100 <Arsen> ah, the error is mine! naturally
2024-03-29 10:47:35 +0100 <Arsen> I had extranious commas
2024-03-29 10:52:47 +0100phma(~phma@host-67-44-208-48.hnremote.net) (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
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2024-03-29 10:54:35 +0100 <phma> Is there a stack command that gets rid of old versions of GHC in ~/.stack/programs/?
2024-03-29 10:55:24 +0100tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
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2024-03-29 10:59:34 +0100tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl)
2024-03-29 10:59:37 +0100 <phma> I have 16 GB in that directory.
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2024-03-29 11:09:01 +0100 <cheater> can i have a list that has multiple different proxies inside? like [Proxy @Type1, Proxy @Type2, ...]
2024-03-29 11:09:03 +0100EvanR(~EvanR@user/evanr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2024-03-29 11:09:18 +0100EvanR(~EvanR@user/evanr)
2024-03-29 11:11:17 +0100Tuplanolla(~Tuplanoll@91-159-69-59.elisa-laajakaista.fi)
2024-03-29 11:13:13 +0100 <cheater> guess not
2024-03-29 11:13:23 +0100 <cheater> would like to figure out how..
2024-03-29 11:17:02 +0100 <[Leary]> % data HList c f xs where { Nil :: HList c f '[]; (:~) :: c x => f x -> HList c f xs -> HList c f (x:xs) }; infixr 6 :~
2024-03-29 11:17:02 +0100 <yahb2> <no output>
2024-03-29 11:17:07 +0100 <[Leary]> % :t Proxy @Int :~ Proxy @Char :~ Nil
2024-03-29 11:17:07 +0100 <yahb2> Proxy @Int :~ Proxy @Char :~ Nil ; :: (c Int, c Char) => HList c Proxy '[Int, Char]
2024-03-29 11:21:44 +0100 <cheater> i'll need a few stiff shots before i can understand that
2024-03-29 11:23:02 +0100 <cheater> hmm
2024-03-29 11:23:20 +0100 <cheater> ok, i guess this makes sense
2024-03-29 11:23:23 +0100 <cheater> thanks
2024-03-29 11:23:44 +0100 <cheater> is HList like a widely used thing?
2024-03-29 11:23:47 +0100 <cheater> does it come in some package?
2024-03-29 11:24:23 +0100hiredman(~hiredman@frontier1.downey.family) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2024-03-29 11:28:29 +0100gmg(~user@user/gehmehgeh) (Quit: Leaving)
2024-03-29 11:32:48 +0100 <lyxia> it's a widely known concept but there is no standard implementation because there are so many trade offs
2024-03-29 11:33:38 +0100 <lyxia> There's Hlist, vinyl, and a lot of the effect libraries also roll their own variant of it.
2024-03-29 11:34:49 +0100 <lyxia> a lot of the libraries that "solve" the record problem are some opinionated API on top of hlists.
2024-03-29 11:35:32 +0100 <c_wraith> Honestly, I don't really understand the use case for HList. vinyl at least names the fields so that they can be order-independent
2024-03-29 11:37:42 +0100mei(~mei@user/mei) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
2024-03-29 11:38:15 +0100myxokephale(~myxos@065-028-251-121.inf.spectrum.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
2024-03-29 11:41:28 +0100 <cheater> hmm right
2024-03-29 11:42:30 +0100myxos(~myxos@065-028-251-121.inf.spectrum.com)
2024-03-29 11:44:53 +0100hiredman(~hiredman@frontier1.downey.family)
2024-03-29 11:49:17 +0100 <[exa]> Is there something that would allow me to (invisibly and very naively) compare addresses of 2 things to detect if they are different? The use case would be something updating a structure (rewriting) and me detecting whether it (by any accident) changed. In STG it would literally be a comparison of 2 pointers, false positives are OK. I'd say this would be near `unsafeCoerce` but can't find anything
2024-03-29 11:50:15 +0100 <c_wraith> https://hackage.haskell.org/package/base-4.19.1.0/docs/GHC-Exts.html#v:reallyUnsafePtrEquality
2024-03-29 11:51:56 +0100 <[exa]> ok good I like the `reallyUnsafe` prefix
2024-03-29 11:52:02 +0100 <[exa]> thanks!
2024-03-29 11:54:29 +0100MajorBiscuit(~MajorBisc@2001:1c00:31c:8400:3d3d:8874:417f:fbf3)
2024-03-29 11:55:16 +0100 <c_wraith> I think it can have false negatives, but not false positives.
2024-03-29 11:55:48 +0100[exa]wondering which case is positive and which is negative
2024-03-29 11:55:49 +0100 <c_wraith> ie, it won't evaluate its arguments, so two things that might be the same when evaluated would return 0#
2024-03-29 11:56:12 +0100 <[exa]> yeah that's ok for me
2024-03-29 11:56:35 +0100tt12310(~tt1231@2603-6010-8700-4a81-219f-50d3-618a-a6ee.res6.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2024-03-29 11:56:40 +0100 <[exa]> I'm planning to shallowly `seq` the stuff anyway before testing
2024-03-29 11:56:50 +0100 <[exa]> perfect
2024-03-29 11:56:53 +0100 <[exa]> tahnks a lot!
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2024-03-29 12:10:48 +0100 <ski> @type Control.Parallel.pseq
2024-03-29 12:10:49 +0100 <lambdabot> a -> b -> b
2024-03-29 12:13:10 +0100skiwould indent the opening braces more than the data constructors, fwiw, Arsen
2024-03-29 12:14:33 +0100ncf. o O ( is haskell indented or discodered? )
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2024-03-29 12:29:43 +0100 <Arsen> ski: that seems to be the common theme yeah
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2024-03-29 18:18:07 +0100 <c_wraith> [exa]: I just realized what ski was talking about - that's a case where you need pseq instead of seq to guarantee the behavior you want.
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2024-03-29 18:32:46 +0100 <shapr> :t psq
2024-03-29 18:32:47 +0100 <lambdabot> error: Variable not in scope: psq
2024-03-29 18:32:49 +0100 <shapr> :t pseq
2024-03-29 18:32:50 +0100 <lambdabot> error:
2024-03-29 18:32:50 +0100 <lambdabot> • Variable not in scope: pseq
2024-03-29 18:32:50 +0100 <lambdabot> • Perhaps you meant ‘seq’ (imported from Prelude)
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2024-03-29 18:45:48 +0100 <geekosaur> :t Control.Parallel.pseq -- I think?
2024-03-29 18:45:49 +0100 <lambdabot> a -> b -> b
2024-03-29 18:48:00 +0100 <c_wraith> shapr: the difference is that seq says "when you evaluate the result of this, both arguments will be evaluated". pseq says "when you evaluate the result of this, first the first argument will be evaluated, then the second argument"
2024-03-29 18:48:25 +0100 <shapr> ah!
2024-03-29 18:48:27 +0100 <shapr> thanks
2024-03-29 18:48:44 +0100 <c_wraith> GHC has a lot of heuristics that make seq usually work correctly, but why rely on those when there is a different function that lets you specify exactly what you mean?
2024-03-29 18:49:27 +0100 <c_wraith> (I really wish pseq didn't need a weird import)
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2024-03-29 19:48:14 +0100mei(~mei@user/mei)
2024-03-29 19:50:25 +0100ajr0d(~ajr0d@cpc111119-wiga14-2-0-cust433.18-3.cable.virginm.net) (Quit: big sleep)
2024-03-29 19:52:34 +0100magus3(~Thunderbi@189.6.35.139)
2024-03-29 19:54:34 +0100ph88(~ph88@ip5b403f30.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de)
2024-03-29 19:55:09 +0100waleee(~waleee@h-176-10-144-38.NA.cust.bahnhof.se)
2024-03-29 19:55:20 +0100 <ph88> https://play.haskell.org/saved/SNDBgTcs does the function f already exist somewhere? or is there a similar function? how could one describe what f is doing?
2024-03-29 19:57:57 +0100 <ncf> f = foldMap pure
2024-03-29 19:58:29 +0100sawilagar(~sawilagar@user/sawilagar) (Remote host closed the connection)
2024-03-29 19:59:03 +0100 <mauke> are there non-semigroup monoids?
2024-03-29 19:59:03 +0100gentauro(~gentauro@user/gentauro) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2024-03-29 19:59:09 +0100 <ncf> no
2024-03-29 19:59:11 +0100sawilagar(~sawilagar@user/sawilagar)
2024-03-29 19:59:22 +0100 <ncf> hmm... does this say that a Foldable is universal among functors valued in monoids or something
2024-03-29 19:59:48 +0100dcoutts(~duncan@cpc69402-oxfd27-2-0-cust903.4-3.cable.virginm.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2024-03-29 20:00:11 +0100 <ncf> well, it's not valued in monoids itself
2024-03-29 20:00:12 +0100dcoutts(~duncan@cpc69402-oxfd27-2-0-cust903.4-3.cable.virginm.net)
2024-03-29 20:01:36 +0100 <ncf> an equivalent function would be (Foldable w, Alternative v) => w a -> v a
2024-03-29 20:02:51 +0100 <ncf> (getAlt . foldMap (Alt . pure))
2024-03-29 20:03:19 +0100 <ncf> this seems to come up often
2024-03-29 20:03:51 +0100 <ncf> (as asum . fmap pure , which does the same thing)
2024-03-29 20:05:04 +0100 <ph88> does this "pattern" have a name? perhaps something out of category theory or so? from one functor to another functor ?
2024-03-29 20:05:05 +0100gentauro(~gentauro@user/gentauro)
2024-03-29 20:05:25 +0100 <ncf> well this says that there's a natural transformation from any foldable to any alternative
2024-03-29 20:05:55 +0100 <ph88> cool thanks !
2024-03-29 20:06:05 +0100 <ncf> so one level higher there's a natural transformation between the forgetful functor from Foldable to [Hask, Hask] to the forgetful functor from Alternative to [Hask, Hask]
2024-03-29 20:06:30 +0100 <ncf> er no
2024-03-29 20:06:46 +0100 <ncf> that makes no sense
2024-03-29 20:07:10 +0100 <ph88> :D
2024-03-29 20:11:02 +0100sawilagar(~sawilagar@user/sawilagar) (Remote host closed the connection)
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2024-03-29 20:28:27 +0100xal(~xal@mx1.xal.systems) ()
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2024-03-29 21:00:37 +0100sawilagar(~sawilagar@user/sawilagar) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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2024-03-29 21:05:25 +0100califax(~califax@user/califx) (Remote host closed the connection)
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2024-03-29 21:09:46 +0100ajr0d(~ajr0d@cpc111119-wiga14-2-0-cust433.18-3.cable.virginm.net) (Quit: big sleep)
2024-03-29 21:13:43 +0100ajr0d(~ajr0d@cpc111119-wiga14-2-0-cust433.18-3.cable.virginm.net)
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2024-03-29 21:15:54 +0100 <[exa]> c_wraith: ski: pseq noted, thank you!
2024-03-29 21:20:04 +0100tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
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2024-03-29 22:02:13 +0100AlexZenon(~alzenon@94.233.240.255)
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2024-03-29 22:29:12 +0100haskellbridge(~haskellbr@069-135-003-034.biz.spectrum.com)
2024-03-29 22:29:12 +0100ChanServ+v haskellbridge
2024-03-29 22:35:12 +0100sm(~znc@plaintextaccounting/sm) (Quit: ZNC 1.6.6+deb1ubuntu0.2 - http://znc.in)
2024-03-29 22:37:01 +0100sm(~znc@plaintextaccounting/sm)
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2024-03-29 22:40:23 +0100peterbecich(~Thunderbi@047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com)
2024-03-29 22:41:51 +0100sawilagar(~sawilagar@user/sawilagar) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
2024-03-29 22:42:12 +0100magus3(~Thunderbi@189.6.35.139) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2024-03-29 22:46:34 +0100smgets fancy and sets up an IRC bouncer
2024-03-29 22:46:58 +0100 <geekosaur> so I see
2024-03-29 22:47:31 +0100 <sm> IRC is still scary to me, I feel always a noob :)
2024-03-29 22:48:27 +0100 <sm> if it would have nicely disappeared I could have forgotten about it but I suppose that won't be happening
2024-03-29 22:48:44 +0100dolio(~dolio@130.44.134.54) (Quit: ZNC 1.8.2 - https://znc.in)
2024-03-29 22:49:17 +0100peterbecich(~Thunderbi@047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2024-03-29 22:49:36 +0100 <geekosaur> (oh look, there's another one)
2024-03-29 22:50:05 +0100 <sm> well continuing is also nice. And even improving, I see libera is planning to add persistence one of these days.
2024-03-29 22:50:27 +0100 <geekosaur> slowly IRC continues to evolve
2024-03-29 22:50:29 +0100dolio(~dolio@130.44.134.54)
2024-03-29 22:50:30 +0100 <sm> (another one ?)
2024-03-29 22:50:36 +0100 <geekosaur> the problem there is getting clients to keep up
2024-03-29 22:50:46 +0100 <geekosaur> [29 21:48:44] * dolio has quit (Quit: ZNC 1.8.2 - https://znc.in)
2024-03-29 22:51:08 +0100 <geekosaur> znc, bnc/psybnc, etc.
2024-03-29 22:51:37 +0100 <geekosaur> quassel
2024-03-29 22:52:20 +0100Inst_(~Inst@120.244.192.126) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
2024-03-29 22:52:39 +0100dolio(~dolio@130.44.134.54) (Client Quit)
2024-03-29 22:52:47 +0100srk_(~sorki@user/srk)
2024-03-29 22:53:05 +0100 <geekosaur> (I'm lazy and pay irccloud, then connect to their bouncer)
2024-03-29 22:54:00 +0100 <sm> +1
2024-03-29 22:54:07 +0100 <sm> I spent a bunch of hours on this
2024-03-29 22:54:25 +0100srk(~sorki@user/srk) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2024-03-29 22:55:24 +0100 <geekosaur> sadly hexchat doesn't support the IRC extension to group messages I sent via /msg on other devices, so those end up looking odd on my desktop
2024-03-29 22:55:53 +0100mizlan(~mizlan@c-69-181-82-43.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
2024-03-29 22:56:14 +0100srk_srk
2024-03-29 22:56:30 +0100 <geekosaur> and yeh, I remember going through that back when I ran a znc on someone's droplet
2024-03-29 22:56:50 +0100 <geekosaur> that's the main reason I paid someone else to deal this time 🙂
2024-03-29 22:57:28 +0100 <geekosaur> well, that and having a semi-sane android client to go with it
2024-03-29 22:58:20 +0100dolio(~dolio@130.44.134.54)
2024-03-29 22:58:48 +0100destituion(~destituio@2001:4644:c37:0:6086:64f4:a213:b80d) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2024-03-29 22:59:32 +0100destituion(~destituio@2001:4644:c37:0:6086:64f4:a213:b80d)
2024-03-29 23:00:24 +0100mizlan(~mizlan@c-69-181-82-43.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2024-03-29 23:01:59 +0100 <sm> System Information: Model: MacBook Air (M1, 2020) • OS: macOS (Version 14.3.1, Build 23D60)
2024-03-29 23:02:00 +0100takuan(~takuan@178-116-218-225.access.telenet.be) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2024-03-29 23:03:09 +0100 <sm> ok then. (I'm pressing all the knobs and switches in Textual 7, a very fancy mac irc client.)
2024-03-29 23:03:25 +0100 <geekosaur> yeh, I used to use Textual when I had a Mac
2024-03-29 23:03:43 +0100 <geekosaur> Linu IRC clients ought to up their game
2024-03-29 23:03:48 +0100 <geekosaur> *Linux
2024-03-29 23:04:21 +0100destituion(~destituio@2001:4644:c37:0:6086:64f4:a213:b80d) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2024-03-29 23:11:14 +0100 <sm> last step: the reboot test
2024-03-29 23:11:18 +0100sm(~znc@plaintextaccounting/sm) (Quit: ZNC 1.6.6+deb1ubuntu0.2 - http://znc.in)
2024-03-29 23:12:28 +0100sm(~znc@plaintextaccounting/sm)
2024-03-29 23:13:04 +0100 <sm> \o/
2024-03-29 23:32:25 +0100euleritian(~euleritia@dynamic-176-007-133-071.176.7.pool.telefonica.de) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
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