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2023-08-11 00:09:42 +0200 | chele | (~chele@user/chele) (Remote host closed the connection) |
2023-08-11 00:12:32 +0200 | hammond | (proscan@gateway02.insomnia247.nl) (Changing host) |
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2023-08-11 00:13:40 +0200 | tromp | (~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
2023-08-11 00:14:14 +0200 | titibandit | (~titibandi@user/titibandit) (Remote host closed the connection) |
2023-08-11 00:14:32 +0200 | grnman_ | (~michaelsc@c-66-176-3-51.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
2023-08-11 00:14:43 +0200 | zeenk | (~zeenk@2a02:2f04:a300:2a00::7fe) (Quit: Konversation terminated!) |
2023-08-11 00:16:32 +0200 | victor | (mirc-rockc@179.152.251.228) |
2023-08-11 00:16:39 +0200 | victor | (mirc-rockc@179.152.251.228) () |
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2023-08-11 00:37:29 +0200 | neuroevolutus | (~neuroevol@2606:2e00:8007:1::a31e) |
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2023-08-11 01:11:09 +0200 | mauke_ | mauke |
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2023-08-11 01:38:34 +0200 | [_] | (~itchyjunk@user/itchyjunk/x-7353470) |
2023-08-11 01:40:00 +0200 | [itchyjunk] | (~itchyjunk@user/itchyjunk/x-7353470) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
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2023-08-11 01:48:31 +0200 | mmhat | (~mmh@p200300f1c73a3bafee086bfffe095315.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Quit: WeeChat 4.0.2) |
2023-08-11 01:48:40 +0200 | TheCatCollective | (NyaaTheKit@user/calculuscat) (Quit: Meow Meow Meow Meow Meow Meow Meow Meow) |
2023-08-11 01:53:32 +0200 | jobhdez | (~jobhdez@2601:601:d00:f30::c0ac) |
2023-08-11 01:54:15 +0200 | shapr | (~user@2600:1700:c640:3100:af84:e012:3f8e:af18) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
2023-08-11 01:54:57 +0200 | <jobhdez> | hello you all; hope all is well. is servant the way to go if i want to build restful apis, full stack web apps with a js frontend and haskell backend? |
2023-08-11 02:01:57 +0200 | <jackdk> | The `servant-*` family of libraries are excellent and stable, and especially good for APIs. I dunno how good they are if you're doing more traditional webapp stuff |
2023-08-11 02:02:58 +0200 | <jackdk> | https://bradparker.com/posts/servant-types jobhdez I like this article which steps through all the typelevel stuff which makes it work |
2023-08-11 02:03:37 +0200 | <hpc> | a webapp actually is just an api, nowadays |
2023-08-11 02:03:44 +0200 | <mauke> | nothing restful about it, though |
2023-08-11 02:03:52 +0200 | <hpc> | so basically just use servant and your backend is done, with some static-hosted thingy for the frontend |
2023-08-11 02:03:56 +0200 | califax | (~califax@user/califx) (Remote host closed the connection) |
2023-08-11 02:05:28 +0200 | califax | (~califax@user/califx) |
2023-08-11 02:06:51 +0200 | <jobhdez> | oh ok, thanks. thanks for the article jackdk |
2023-08-11 02:07:28 +0200 | <jobhdez> | hows the haskell job market for juniors in the US? I want to get haskell job |
2023-08-11 02:23:54 +0200 | artem | (~artem@38.42.227.237) |
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2023-08-11 02:26:55 +0200 | L29Ah | (~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
2023-08-11 02:34:33 +0200 | L29Ah | (~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah) |
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2023-08-11 02:58:25 +0200 | [_________] | (~oos95GWG@user/oos95GWG) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
2023-08-11 03:00:23 +0200 | [_________] | (~oos95GWG@user/oos95GWG) |
2023-08-11 03:01:14 +0200 | TheCatCollective | (NyaaTheKit@user/calculuscat) |
2023-08-11 03:10:04 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@207-153-38-140.fttp.usinternet.com) |
2023-08-11 03:10:04 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@207-153-38-140.fttp.usinternet.com) (Changing host) |
2023-08-11 03:10:04 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@user/wroathe) |
2023-08-11 03:10:32 +0200 | albet70 | (~xxx@2400:8902::f03c:92ff:fe60:98d8) (Remote host closed the connection) |
2023-08-11 03:11:28 +0200 | razetime | (~quassel@117.254.37.226) |
2023-08-11 03:14:24 +0200 | phma | (~phma@host-67-44-208-159.hnremote.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
2023-08-11 03:14:49 +0200 | phma | (phma@2001:5b0:210f:78:f62c:b1a1:2992:8d3d) |
2023-08-11 03:16:39 +0200 | albet70 | (~xxx@2400:8902::f03c:92ff:fe60:98d8) |
2023-08-11 03:35:47 +0200 | [_] | [itchyjunk] |
2023-08-11 03:37:40 +0200 | phma | (phma@2001:5b0:210f:78:f62c:b1a1:2992:8d3d) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
2023-08-11 03:38:04 +0200 | phma | (~phma@host-67-44-208-159.hnremote.net) |
2023-08-11 03:39:32 +0200 | <EvanR> | hpc, an API that calls out to ruby on rails? |
2023-08-11 03:42:31 +0200 | phma | (~phma@host-67-44-208-159.hnremote.net) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
2023-08-11 03:45:22 +0200 | phma | (phma@2001:5b0:210f:78:f62c:b1a1:2992:8d3d) |
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2023-08-11 04:56:18 +0200 | FinnElija | (~finn_elij@user/finn-elija/x-0085643) (Killed (NickServ (Forcing logout FinnElija -> finn_elija))) |
2023-08-11 04:56:18 +0200 | finn_elija | FinnElija |
2023-08-11 04:57:34 +0200 | ddellacosta | (~ddellacos@146.70.165.10) |
2023-08-11 04:58:32 +0200 | [itchyjunk] | (~itchyjunk@user/itchyjunk/x-7353470) (Remote host closed the connection) |
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2023-08-11 05:13:25 +0200 | Square2 | (~Square4@user/square) (Remote host closed the connection) |
2023-08-11 05:13:40 +0200 | khumba | (~khumba@user/khumba) () |
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2023-08-11 05:44:19 +0200 | danza_ | (~francesco@151.44.134.29) |
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2023-08-11 06:02:08 +0200 | Unicorn_Princess | (~Unicorn_P@user/Unicorn-Princess/x-3540542) (Remote host closed the connection) |
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2023-08-11 06:06:19 +0200 | _ht | (~Thunderbi@28-52-174-82.ftth.glasoperator.nl) |
2023-08-11 06:12:51 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@user/wroathe) (Quit: Reconnecting) |
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2023-08-11 06:32:29 +0200 | jobhdez | (~jobhdez@2601:601:d00:f30::c0ac) (Quit: Client closed) |
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2023-08-11 06:40:08 +0200 | vglfr | (~vglfr@cli-188-239-201-89.bbn.slav.dn.ua) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
2023-08-11 06:40:57 +0200 | vglfr | (~vglfr@cli-188-239-201-89.bbn.slav.dn.ua) |
2023-08-11 06:43:16 +0200 | danse-nr3 | (~francesco@151.44.134.29) |
2023-08-11 06:43:45 +0200 | michalz | (~michalz@185.246.207.221) |
2023-08-11 06:48:55 +0200 | xff0x | (~xff0x@2405:6580:b080:900:c1c2:633:c03:e500) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
2023-08-11 06:49:19 +0200 | xff0x | (~xff0x@178.255.149.135) |
2023-08-11 06:51:36 +0200 | grnman_ | (~michaelsc@c-66-176-3-51.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
2023-08-11 06:54:12 +0200 | Lycurgus | (~juan@user/Lycurgus) |
2023-08-11 06:57:37 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | good morning #haskell |
2023-08-11 06:58:16 +0200 | <Lycurgus> | yello danse-nr3 |
2023-08-11 06:59:28 +0200 | xff0x | (~xff0x@178.255.149.135) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) |
2023-08-11 07:01:12 +0200 | Lycurgus | (~juan@user/Lycurgus) (Quit: Tschüss) |
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2023-08-11 07:03:00 +0200 | razetime | (~quassel@117.254.37.226) |
2023-08-11 07:10:11 +0200 | danse-nr3 | (~francesco@151.44.134.29) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
2023-08-11 07:10:34 +0200 | danse-nr3 | (~francesco@151.44.216.122) |
2023-08-11 07:12:51 +0200 | thegeekinside | (~thegeekin@189.180.79.225) |
2023-08-11 07:13:35 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) |
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2023-08-11 07:19:27 +0200 | bgs | (~bgs@212-85-160-171.dynamic.telemach.net) |
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2023-08-11 07:31:44 +0200 | whatsupdoc | (uid509081@id-509081.hampstead.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) |
2023-08-11 07:36:50 +0200 | _ht | (~Thunderbi@28-52-174-82.ftth.glasoperator.nl) (Quit: _ht) |
2023-08-11 07:38:54 +0200 | raym | (~ray@user/raym) |
2023-08-11 07:49:00 +0200 | sord937 | (~sord937@gateway/tor-sasl/sord937) |
2023-08-11 07:50:49 +0200 | Square2 | Square |
2023-08-11 07:51:06 +0200 | bgs | (~bgs@212-85-160-171.dynamic.telemach.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
2023-08-11 07:59:52 +0200 | trev | (~trev@user/trev) |
2023-08-11 08:00:04 +0200 | titibandit | (~titibandi@user/titibandit) |
2023-08-11 08:02:15 +0200 | sm | (~sm@plaintextaccounting/sm) |
2023-08-11 08:04:09 +0200 | trev | (~trev@user/trev) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
2023-08-11 08:09:34 +0200 | simikando | (~simikando@adsl-dyn-104.95-102-88.t-com.sk) |
2023-08-11 08:19:05 +0200 | dobblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) |
2023-08-11 08:19:05 +0200 | dobblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) (Changing host) |
2023-08-11 08:19:05 +0200 | dobblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) |
2023-08-11 08:19:18 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
2023-08-11 08:19:34 +0200 | dobblego | dibblego |
2023-08-11 08:28:58 +0200 | califax | (~califax@user/califx) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
2023-08-11 08:29:50 +0200 | califax | (~califax@user/califx) |
2023-08-11 08:31:17 +0200 | simikando | (~simikando@adsl-dyn-104.95-102-88.t-com.sk) (Remote host closed the connection) |
2023-08-11 08:31:40 +0200 | simikando | (~simikando@adsl-dyn-104.95-102-88.t-com.sk) |
2023-08-11 08:32:20 +0200 | thegeekinside | (~thegeekin@189.180.79.225) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
2023-08-11 08:36:21 +0200 | thegeekinside | (~thegeekin@189.180.79.225) |
2023-08-11 08:41:48 +0200 | lortabac | (~lortabac@2a01:e0a:541:b8f0:795b:2fff:e578:2af) |
2023-08-11 08:43:56 +0200 | danse-nr3 | (~francesco@151.44.216.122) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
2023-08-11 08:46:32 +0200 | oo_miguel | (~Thunderbi@78-11-179-96.static.ip.netia.com.pl) |
2023-08-11 08:46:41 +0200 | fweht | (uid404746@id-404746.lymington.irccloud.com) |
2023-08-11 08:53:38 +0200 | azimut | (~azimut@gateway/tor-sasl/azimut) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
2023-08-11 08:54:00 +0200 | dobblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) |
2023-08-11 08:54:00 +0200 | dobblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) (Changing host) |
2023-08-11 08:54:00 +0200 | dobblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) |
2023-08-11 08:54:05 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
2023-08-11 08:54:41 +0200 | dobblego | dibblego |
2023-08-11 08:58:11 +0200 | danse-nr3 | (~francesco@151.44.216.122) |
2023-08-11 09:01:00 +0200 | simikando | (~simikando@adsl-dyn-104.95-102-88.t-com.sk) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
2023-08-11 09:01:12 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
2023-08-11 09:03:14 +0200 | coot | (~coot@89-69-206-216.dynamic.chello.pl) |
2023-08-11 09:04:21 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) |
2023-08-11 09:04:21 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) (Changing host) |
2023-08-11 09:04:21 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) |
2023-08-11 09:06:23 +0200 | tromp | (~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) |
2023-08-11 09:08:13 +0200 | simikando | (~simikando@adsl-dyn-104.95-102-88.t-com.sk) |
2023-08-11 09:09:55 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
2023-08-11 09:12:24 +0200 | Wojciech_K | (~Wojciech_@maluch.mikr.us) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
2023-08-11 09:12:57 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) |
2023-08-11 09:12:57 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) (Changing host) |
2023-08-11 09:12:57 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) |
2023-08-11 09:15:59 +0200 | nate2 | (~nate@c-98-45-169-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
2023-08-11 09:16:36 +0200 | libertyprime | (~libertypr@203.96.203.44) |
2023-08-11 09:17:47 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) (Excess Flood) |
2023-08-11 09:19:17 +0200 | simikando | (~simikando@adsl-dyn-104.95-102-88.t-com.sk) (Remote host closed the connection) |
2023-08-11 09:20:44 +0200 | nate2 | (~nate@c-98-45-169-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
2023-08-11 09:23:06 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) |
2023-08-11 09:23:06 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) (Changing host) |
2023-08-11 09:23:06 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) |
2023-08-11 09:25:00 +0200 | vglfr | (~vglfr@cli-188-239-201-89.bbn.slav.dn.ua) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
2023-08-11 09:25:47 +0200 | vglfr | (~vglfr@145.224.100.231) |
2023-08-11 09:32:35 +0200 | mmhat | (~mmh@p200300f1c73a3bafee086bfffe095315.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
2023-08-11 09:32:35 +0200 | libertyprime | (~libertypr@203.96.203.44) (Quit: leaving) |
2023-08-11 09:38:37 +0200 | coot | (~coot@89-69-206-216.dynamic.chello.pl) (Quit: coot) |
2023-08-11 09:39:38 +0200 | tromp | (~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
2023-08-11 09:40:12 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
2023-08-11 09:41:32 +0200 | thegeekinside | (~thegeekin@189.180.79.225) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) |
2023-08-11 09:43:17 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) |
2023-08-11 09:43:18 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) (Changing host) |
2023-08-11 09:43:18 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) |
2023-08-11 09:43:20 +0200 | forell | (~forell@user/forell) (Quit: ZNC - https://znc.in) |
2023-08-11 09:44:13 +0200 | coot | (~coot@89-69-206-216.dynamic.chello.pl) |
2023-08-11 09:44:37 +0200 | coot | (~coot@89-69-206-216.dynamic.chello.pl) (Remote host closed the connection) |
2023-08-11 09:45:40 +0200 | forell | (~forell@user/forell) |
2023-08-11 09:45:47 +0200 | mima | (~mmh@net-93-67-213-210.cust.vodafonedsl.it) |
2023-08-11 09:46:36 +0200 | coot | (~coot@89-69-206-216.dynamic.chello.pl) |
2023-08-11 09:49:31 +0200 | jle` | (~jle`@cpe-23-240-75-236.socal.res.rr.com) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
2023-08-11 09:50:32 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
2023-08-11 09:53:14 +0200 | lisbeths | (uid135845@id-135845.lymington.irccloud.com) |
2023-08-11 09:53:26 +0200 | jle` | (~jle`@cpe-23-240-75-236.socal.res.rr.com) |
2023-08-11 09:53:31 +0200 | libertyprime | (~libertypr@203.96.203.44) |
2023-08-11 09:55:10 +0200 | machinedgod | (~machinedg@d198-53-218-113.abhsia.telus.net) |
2023-08-11 09:56:04 +0200 | chele | (~chele@user/chele) |
2023-08-11 09:57:28 +0200 | CiaoSen | (~Jura@2a05:5800:2d1:7200:664b:f0ff:fe37:9ef) |
2023-08-11 09:57:49 +0200 | jtza8 | (~user@165.255.137.178) |
2023-08-11 10:00:42 +0200 | zeenk | (~zeenk@2a02:2f04:a300:2a00::7fe) |
2023-08-11 10:03:33 +0200 | Sgeo | (~Sgeo@user/sgeo) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
2023-08-11 10:06:25 +0200 | sm | (~sm@plaintextaccounting/sm) (Quit: sm) |
2023-08-11 10:07:44 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) |
2023-08-11 10:07:44 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) (Changing host) |
2023-08-11 10:07:44 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) |
2023-08-11 10:10:32 +0200 | ft | (~ft@p3e9bcd02.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Quit: leaving) |
2023-08-11 10:10:57 +0200 | sm | (~sm@plaintextaccounting/sm) |
2023-08-11 10:11:13 +0200 | eggplantade | (~Eggplanta@104-55-37-220.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
2023-08-11 10:26:34 +0200 | tromp | (~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) |
2023-08-11 10:28:37 +0200 | vglfr | (~vglfr@145.224.100.231) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
2023-08-11 10:30:04 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) |
2023-08-11 10:30:32 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) |
2023-08-11 10:30:33 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) (Changing host) |
2023-08-11 10:30:33 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) |
2023-08-11 10:31:08 +0200 | mima | (~mmh@net-93-67-213-210.cust.vodafonedsl.it) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
2023-08-11 10:35:10 +0200 | vglfr | (~vglfr@2a0d:3344:148d:7a00:ece5:978b:e3a7:acd2) |
2023-08-11 10:38:57 +0200 | gehmehgeh | (~user@user/gehmehgeh) |
2023-08-11 10:39:47 +0200 | cfricke | (~cfricke@user/cfricke) |
2023-08-11 10:40:33 +0200 | phma | (~phma@host-67-44-208-159.hnremote.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
2023-08-11 10:40:57 +0200 | phma | (phma@2001:5b0:210f:78:f62c:b1a1:2992:8d3d) |
2023-08-11 10:46:50 +0200 | tzh | (~tzh@c-24-21-73-154.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) (Quit: zzz) |
2023-08-11 10:48:08 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
2023-08-11 10:52:36 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) |
2023-08-11 10:52:36 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) (Changing host) |
2023-08-11 10:52:36 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) |
2023-08-11 10:52:58 +0200 | mima | (~mmh@net-93-67-196-104.cust.vodafonedsl.it) |
2023-08-11 10:57:47 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
2023-08-11 10:58:02 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) |
2023-08-11 10:58:02 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) (Changing host) |
2023-08-11 10:58:03 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) |
2023-08-11 11:02:27 +0200 | codaraxis__ | (~codaraxis@user/codaraxis) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
2023-08-11 11:05:21 +0200 | Pixi` | Pixi |
2023-08-11 11:05:26 +0200 | gugu256 | (~gugu256@131.87.95.79.rev.sfr.net) |
2023-08-11 11:06:47 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
2023-08-11 11:11:00 +0200 | danse-nr3_ | (~francesco@151.44.221.10) |
2023-08-11 11:11:01 +0200 | danse-nr3 | (~francesco@151.44.216.122) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
2023-08-11 11:11:43 +0200 | eggplantade | (~Eggplanta@2600:1700:38c5:d800:aca6:66d7:5365:1cde) |
2023-08-11 11:11:55 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) |
2023-08-11 11:11:55 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) (Changing host) |
2023-08-11 11:11:55 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) |
2023-08-11 11:12:06 +0200 | cfricke | (~cfricke@user/cfricke) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
2023-08-11 11:15:56 +0200 | eggplantade | (~Eggplanta@2600:1700:38c5:d800:aca6:66d7:5365:1cde) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
2023-08-11 11:16:27 +0200 | mc47 | (~mc47@xmonad/TheMC47) |
2023-08-11 11:17:38 +0200 | mima | (~mmh@net-93-67-196-104.cust.vodafonedsl.it) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
2023-08-11 11:19:48 +0200 | mima | (~mmh@net-93-148-97-15.cust.dsl.teletu.it) |
2023-08-11 11:24:01 +0200 | fendor | (~fendor@2a02:8388:1640:be00:b586:6c06:a58:19a3) |
2023-08-11 11:25:34 +0200 | cfricke | (~cfricke@user/cfricke) |
2023-08-11 11:32:52 +0200 | cfricke | (~cfricke@user/cfricke) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
2023-08-11 11:35:22 +0200 | nick4 | (~nick@ip98-162-147-230.pn.at.cox.net) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
2023-08-11 11:35:58 +0200 | libertyprime | (~libertypr@203.96.203.44) (Quit: leaving) |
2023-08-11 11:37:17 +0200 | tromp | (~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
2023-08-11 11:38:51 +0200 | acidjnk | (~acidjnk@p200300d6e7072f86688b70278123b2bd.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
2023-08-11 11:43:14 +0200 | tromp | (~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) |
2023-08-11 11:46:17 +0200 | cfricke | (~cfricke@user/cfricke) |
2023-08-11 11:51:13 +0200 | acidjnk | (~acidjnk@p200300d6e7072f86cd9244dbe28c67d8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
2023-08-11 11:51:16 +0200 | Lord_of_Life | (~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
2023-08-11 11:54:11 +0200 | Lord_of_Life | (~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915) |
2023-08-11 11:56:36 +0200 | Square2 | (~Square@user/square) |
2023-08-11 11:57:27 +0200 | Square | (~Square4@user/square) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
2023-08-11 11:58:29 +0200 | Square2 | Square |
2023-08-11 11:58:55 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
2023-08-11 11:59:29 +0200 | driib | (~driib@vmi931078.contaboserver.net) (Quit: The Lounge - https://thelounge.chat) |
2023-08-11 11:59:41 +0200 | stef204 | (~stef204@user/stef204) (Quit: WeeChat 4.0.2) |
2023-08-11 12:00:15 +0200 | driib | (~driib@vmi931078.contaboserver.net) |
2023-08-11 12:05:23 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) |
2023-08-11 12:05:24 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) (Changing host) |
2023-08-11 12:05:24 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) |
2023-08-11 12:05:58 +0200 | vglfr | (~vglfr@2a0d:3344:148d:7a00:ece5:978b:e3a7:acd2) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
2023-08-11 12:06:17 +0200 | econo_ | (uid147250@id-147250.tinside.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) |
2023-08-11 12:07:07 +0200 | vglfr | (~vglfr@145.224.100.231) |
2023-08-11 12:10:43 +0200 | td_ | (~td@i53870906.versanet.de) (Quit: waking up from the american dream ...) |
2023-08-11 12:14:45 +0200 | NewtonTrendy | (uid282092@user/bopqod) |
2023-08-11 12:15:37 +0200 | td_ | (~td@i53870906.versanet.de) |
2023-08-11 12:16:00 +0200 | titibandit | (~titibandi@user/titibandit) (Remote host closed the connection) |
2023-08-11 12:16:52 +0200 | titibandit | (~titibandi@user/titibandit) |
2023-08-11 12:17:04 +0200 | danse-nr3_ | (~francesco@151.44.221.10) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
2023-08-11 12:22:52 +0200 | lisbeths | (uid135845@id-135845.lymington.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) |
2023-08-11 12:23:08 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
2023-08-11 12:23:10 +0200 | tromp | (~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
2023-08-11 12:28:08 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) |
2023-08-11 12:28:09 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) (Changing host) |
2023-08-11 12:28:09 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) |
2023-08-11 12:29:01 +0200 | CiaoSen | (~Jura@2a05:5800:2d1:7200:664b:f0ff:fe37:9ef) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
2023-08-11 12:29:51 +0200 | sm | (~sm@plaintextaccounting/sm) (Quit: sm) |
2023-08-11 12:32:44 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
2023-08-11 12:32:50 +0200 | gugu256 | (~gugu256@131.87.95.79.rev.sfr.net) (Quit: Leaving) |
2023-08-11 12:36:02 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) |
2023-08-11 12:36:02 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) (Changing host) |
2023-08-11 12:36:02 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) |
2023-08-11 12:39:58 +0200 | mima | (~mmh@net-93-148-97-15.cust.dsl.teletu.it) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
2023-08-11 12:48:19 +0200 | glguy | (~glguy@libera/staff-emeritus/glguy) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
2023-08-11 12:49:08 +0200 | glguy | (~glguy@libera/staff-emeritus/glguy) |
2023-08-11 12:52:55 +0200 | HerlockSholmes | (~herlock@2001:19f0:5c00:27fc:5400:4ff:fe7a:1f8e) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
2023-08-11 12:59:15 +0200 | HerlockSholmes | (~herlock@2001:19f0:5c00:27fc:5400:4ff:fe7a:1f8e) |
2023-08-11 13:14:00 +0200 | eggplantade | (~Eggplanta@2600:1700:38c5:d800:846:1fe1:eed8:5e0) |
2023-08-11 13:17:39 +0200 | nate2 | (~nate@c-98-45-169-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
2023-08-11 13:18:36 +0200 | eggplantade | (~Eggplanta@2600:1700:38c5:d800:846:1fe1:eed8:5e0) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
2023-08-11 13:22:21 +0200 | nate2 | (~nate@c-98-45-169-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
2023-08-11 13:23:34 +0200 | MajorBiscuit | (~MajorBisc@145.94.40.195) |
2023-08-11 13:26:58 +0200 | [itchyjunk] | (~itchyjunk@user/itchyjunk/x-7353470) |
2023-08-11 13:27:20 +0200 | dcoutts | (~duncan@cpc69402-oxfd27-2-0-cust903.4-3.cable.virginm.net) |
2023-08-11 13:30:37 +0200 | waleee | (~waleee@2001:9b0:21c:4000:5bf9:6515:c030:57b7) |
2023-08-11 13:31:56 +0200 | flounders | (~flounders@24.246.133.1) |
2023-08-11 13:38:12 +0200 | Square | (~Square@user/square) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
2023-08-11 13:39:42 +0200 | danse-nr3 | (~francesco@151.37.245.142) |
2023-08-11 14:02:30 +0200 | Lycurgus | (~juan@user/Lycurgus) |
2023-08-11 14:04:43 +0200 | raehik | (~raehik@cpc95906-rdng25-2-0-cust156.15-3.cable.virginm.net) |
2023-08-11 14:08:16 +0200 | Lycurgus | (~juan@user/Lycurgus) (Quit: Tschüss) |
2023-08-11 14:17:36 +0200 | mikoto-chan | (~mikoto-ch@ip-83-134-209-157.dsl.scarlet.be) |
2023-08-11 14:23:17 +0200 | artem | (~artem@38.42.227.237) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
2023-08-11 14:26:59 +0200 | nurupo | (~nurupo.ga@user/nurupo) |
2023-08-11 14:30:58 +0200 | raehik | (~raehik@cpc95906-rdng25-2-0-cust156.15-3.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) |
2023-08-11 14:32:42 +0200 | Kuttenbrunzer | (~Kuttenbru@2a02:8108:8b80:1d48::9d59) |
2023-08-11 14:35:55 +0200 | ddellacosta | (~ddellacos@146.70.165.10) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
2023-08-11 14:38:50 +0200 | gatekempt | (~gatekempt@user/gatekempt) |
2023-08-11 14:45:03 +0200 | mikoto-chan | (~mikoto-ch@ip-83-134-209-157.dsl.scarlet.be) (Quit: WeeChat 3.8) |
2023-08-11 14:46:52 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | IsList is monomorphic, right? Wondering why ... makes me struggle to write a version of zipMatch that works for IsList instead of using Matchable |
2023-08-11 14:50:05 +0200 | <int-e> | danse-nr3: it allows things like instance Unbox e => IsList (Vector e) |
2023-08-11 14:51:24 +0200 | vglfr | (~vglfr@145.224.100.231) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
2023-08-11 14:51:28 +0200 | Pickchea | (~private@user/pickchea) |
2023-08-11 14:51:56 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | does that mean "if `e` is Unbox, `Vector e` is IsList"? |
2023-08-11 14:52:50 +0200 | <int-e> | yes |
2023-08-11 14:55:04 +0200 | <int-e> | Oh here's a purely monomorphic instance: instance IsList IntSet |
2023-08-11 14:55:58 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | yeah this makes more sense to me |
2023-08-11 14:57:59 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | thanks int-e |
2023-08-11 15:01:32 +0200 | Kuttenbrunzer | (~Kuttenbru@2a02:8108:8b80:1d48::9d59) (Quit: Where is it) |
2023-08-11 15:05:47 +0200 | ulysses4ever | (~artem@50-245-50-3-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) |
2023-08-11 15:10:17 +0200 | ulysses4ever | (~artem@50-245-50-3-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
2023-08-11 15:10:21 +0200 | mmhat | (~mmh@p200300f1c73a3bafee086bfffe095315.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
2023-08-11 15:10:27 +0200 | ulysses4ever | (~artem@50-245-50-3-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) |
2023-08-11 15:10:35 +0200 | gatekempt | (~gatekempt@user/gatekempt) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
2023-08-11 15:14:40 +0200 | ulysses4ever | (~artem@50-245-50-3-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
2023-08-11 15:19:47 +0200 | sm | (~sm@plaintextaccounting/sm) |
2023-08-11 15:22:44 +0200 | raehik | (~raehik@cpc95906-rdng25-2-0-cust156.15-3.cable.virginm.net) |
2023-08-11 15:24:31 +0200 | <probie> | danse-nr3: Are you trying to write something like `zipMatch :: (IsList l, IsList r, IsList res, Item res ~ (Item l, Item r)) => l -> r -> Maybe res`? |
2023-08-11 15:24:54 +0200 | ulysses4ever | (~artem@38.42.227.237) |
2023-08-11 15:27:45 +0200 | mmhat | (~mmh@p200300f1c7042764ee086bfffe095315.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
2023-08-11 15:31:16 +0200 | flounders | (~flounders@24.246.133.1) (Quit: WeeChat 3.5) |
2023-08-11 15:32:39 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | oooh |
2023-08-11 15:33:00 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | great! Thanks probie! |
2023-08-11 15:38:25 +0200 | flounders | (~flounders@24.246.133.1) |
2023-08-11 15:43:08 +0200 | raehik | (~raehik@cpc95906-rdng25-2-0-cust156.15-3.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
2023-08-11 15:46:00 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@207-153-38-140.fttp.usinternet.com) |
2023-08-11 15:46:01 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@207-153-38-140.fttp.usinternet.com) (Changing host) |
2023-08-11 15:46:01 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@user/wroathe) |
2023-08-11 15:47:40 +0200 | L29Ah | (~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah) () |
2023-08-11 15:48:23 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | ugh ... that is not type-safe because NonEmpty is an instance of IsList and when combined with a different instance could cause a compile time error |
2023-08-11 15:48:40 +0200 | lortabac | (~lortabac@2a01:e0a:541:b8f0:795b:2fff:e578:2af) (Quit: WeeChat 2.8) |
2023-08-11 15:49:57 +0200 | pavonia | (~user@user/siracusa) (Quit: Bye!) |
2023-08-11 15:50:03 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | i would be satisfied with having the same instance of IsList on both arguments, so that a NonEmpty can be used only with another NonEmpty, but again monomorphism does not make it clear how to do that. Maybe `IsList l ~ IsList r`? I doubt it |
2023-08-11 15:50:15 +0200 | idgaen | (~idgaen@2a01:e0a:498:fd50:fcc6:bb5d:489a:ce8c) (Quit: WeeChat 4.0.2) |
2023-08-11 15:50:44 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | sorry, a runtime error that is |
2023-08-11 15:50:55 +0200 | jtza8 | (~user@165.255.137.178) (Quit: ERC 5.4 (IRC client for GNU Emacs 28.2)) |
2023-08-11 15:53:57 +0200 | kraftwerk28 | (~kraftwerk@164.92.219.160) |
2023-08-11 15:53:59 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | it cannot be `IsList l ~ IsList r`, i would need equality just about the higher order type |
2023-08-11 15:54:27 +0200 | NewtonTrendy | (uid282092@user/bopqod) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) |
2023-08-11 15:55:44 +0200 | <probie> | danse-nr3: `zipMatch :: (IsList (t a), IsList (t b), IsList (t (a, b)), Item (t (a, b)) ~ (Item (t a), Item (t b))) => t a -> t b -> Maybe (t (a,b))` |
2023-08-11 15:56:58 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | err ... amazing, thanks |
2023-08-11 15:57:43 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | had not really seen that possibility ... not sure how to learn better about these kind of problems |
2023-08-11 16:02:59 +0200 | ft | (~ft@p3e9bcd02.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
2023-08-11 16:03:19 +0200 | cfricke | (~cfricke@user/cfricke) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
2023-08-11 16:05:00 +0200 | xff0x | (~xff0x@2405:6580:b080:900:c1c2:633:c03:e500) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
2023-08-11 16:05:19 +0200 | <[Leary]> | % :t \xs ys -> fromList (zip (GHC.Exts.toList xs) (GHC.Exts.toList ys)) |
2023-08-11 16:05:19 +0200 | <yahb2> | \xs ys -> fromList (zip (GHC.Exts.toList xs) (GHC.Exts.toList ys)) ; :: (Item l1 ~ (Item l2, Item l3), IsList l1, IsList l2, ; IsList l3) => ; l2 -> l3 -> l1 |
2023-08-11 16:05:36 +0200 | <[Leary]> | danse-nr3: I don't know why you expect a runtime error. |
2023-08-11 16:06:20 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | no, you are right actually. Since the lengths are checked, that should not happen |
2023-08-11 16:06:53 +0200 | xff0x | (~xff0x@ai086045.d.east.v6connect.net) |
2023-08-11 16:07:38 +0200 | <probie> | [Leary]: Assuming I interpreted the question correctly, it needs to be a `Nothing` if the lists aren't the same length, so it's slightly more complicated |
2023-08-11 16:08:14 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | yeah but still, if one of them is a NonEmpty, the other will not be zipped when null |
2023-08-11 16:08:34 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | had not thought that through |
2023-08-11 16:09:17 +0200 | <probie> | For the first type I gave, you could write something like `zipMatch ([] :: [Int]) ([] :: [Int]) :: Maybe (NonEmpty (Int, Int))` which would be equal to `Just (error ...)` |
2023-08-11 16:09:19 +0200 | <[Leary]> | That's just a matter of switching out `zip` for the original `zipMatch` (or a self-rolled equivalent for []) and the outer application with an fmap. |
2023-08-11 16:11:52 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | probie's solution is intriguing. I tried it with slightly different combinations and got a "could not deduce" error (i will write some instances afterwards). I found the phrasing a bit confusing, because i thought i was adding a constraint that did not need to be deduced |
2023-08-11 16:12:33 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | examples: `(Item (t0 c) ~ Item (t0 (a, b)))` or `(Item (t0 c) ~ (Item (t0 a), Item (t0 b)))` could not be deduced |
2023-08-11 16:15:10 +0200 | gatekempt | (~gatekempt@user/gatekempt) |
2023-08-11 16:16:40 +0200 | zeenk | (~zeenk@2a02:2f04:a300:2a00::7fe) (Quit: Konversation terminated!) |
2023-08-11 16:16:54 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | i guess that "could not deduce" means that those types do not make sense in combination with the others |
2023-08-11 16:19:25 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | basically before you had `IsList c` but when wrapping with `t` it seems to also need the tuple to be explicit |
2023-08-11 16:20:23 +0200 | waleee | (~waleee@2001:9b0:21c:4000:5bf9:6515:c030:57b7) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
2023-08-11 16:20:46 +0200 | thegeekinside | (~thegeekin@189.180.79.225) |
2023-08-11 16:20:55 +0200 | cfricke | (~cfricke@user/cfricke) |
2023-08-11 16:21:00 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@user/wroathe) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
2023-08-11 16:21:47 +0200 | hrberg | (~quassel@171.79-160-161.customer.lyse.net) (Quit: https://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.) |
2023-08-11 16:24:01 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | hum no i managed to get a "could not deduce" also with an explicit tuple ... i guess i should just practice more with these kind of constraints |
2023-08-11 16:24:21 +0200 | hrberg | (~quassel@171.79-160-161.customer.lyse.net) |
2023-08-11 16:29:54 +0200 | <geekosaur> | those `t0`s make me think something is not unifying that you think should |
2023-08-11 16:31:47 +0200 | shapr | (~user@2600:1700:c640:3100:a70d:d5ca:f9aa:e130) |
2023-08-11 16:32:00 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | good point |
2023-08-11 16:32:55 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | i am always confused when that happens. If i write `t`, what is the point of interpreting it as anything different? |
2023-08-11 16:33:04 +0200 | azimut | (~azimut@gateway/tor-sasl/azimut) |
2023-08-11 16:33:29 +0200 | Pickchea | (~private@user/pickchea) (Quit: Leaving) |
2023-08-11 16:33:58 +0200 | masterbuilder | (~masterbui@user/masterbuilder) |
2023-08-11 16:34:15 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | but ... mmm ... i guess i just need to understand better what is going on. Probably each `t` is a series of `t`s at some point, and then the compiler looks for unification |
2023-08-11 16:34:17 +0200 | <probie> | If `OverloadedLists` is enabled and you write something like `zipMatch [1..5::Int] [6..10::Int]` you'll get a type error |
2023-08-11 16:34:47 +0200 | <probie> | (unsure if that's your problem though) |
2023-08-11 16:35:42 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | uh? With your constraints? My constraints just do not compile ^^: |
2023-08-11 16:35:46 +0200 | raehik | (~raehik@cpc95906-rdng25-2-0-cust156.15-3.cable.virginm.net) |
2023-08-11 16:36:05 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | i do have OverloadedStrings on that file, if that matters |
2023-08-11 16:36:40 +0200 | gatekempt | (~gatekempt@user/gatekempt) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) |
2023-08-11 16:37:07 +0200 | <probie> | With my `(IsList (t a), IsList (t b), IsList (t (a, b)), Item (t (a, b)) ~ (Item (t a), Item (t b)))` constraint |
2023-08-11 16:37:44 +0200 | ddellacosta | (~ddellacos@143.244.47.84) |
2023-08-11 16:38:39 +0200 | <probie> | OverloadedStrings is harmless here, but OverloadedLists will prevent a concrete type being picked for `t`, which prevents unfolding `Item` which will stop it from being able to satisfy `Item (t (a, b)) ~ (Item (t a), Item (t b))` |
2023-08-11 16:39:37 +0200 | <probie> | if you want some help debugging the error your constraints give, feel free to throw a link to a pastebin |
2023-08-11 16:41:07 +0200 | acidjnk | (~acidjnk@p200300d6e7072f86cd9244dbe28c67d8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
2023-08-11 16:43:27 +0200 | cfricke | (~cfricke@user/cfricke) (Quit: WeeChat 4.0.1) |
2023-08-11 16:50:22 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | yes, OverloadedLists, sorry. Turns out my errors were actually due to not having updated the type signature after the constraints, which makes a ton of sense. When reading "could not deduce <constraint> from the context: <constraints>" i thought that the problem was somehow within the constraints themselves and became blind to the actual types. Now i see it can mean also "deduce <constraint> that i found in your <constraints>" |
2023-08-11 16:55:38 +0200 | titibandit | (~titibandi@user/titibandit) (Quit: leaving) |
2023-08-11 16:55:54 +0200 | titibandit | (~titibandi@user/titibandit) |
2023-08-11 16:56:50 +0200 | <danse-nr3> | in fact using an opaque `c` like in your first constraints works just fine. Great code, thanks again probie! |
2023-08-11 16:57:08 +0200 | misterfish | (~misterfis@87.215.131.102) |
2023-08-11 17:00:27 +0200 | titibandit | (~titibandi@user/titibandit) (Remote host closed the connection) |
2023-08-11 17:16:02 +0200 | Midjak | (~Midjak@82.66.147.146) |
2023-08-11 17:16:53 +0200 | tzh | (~tzh@c-24-21-73-154.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
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2023-08-11 17:17:26 +0200 | Midjak | (~Midjak@82.66.147.146) (Client Quit) |
2023-08-11 17:18:04 +0200 | Midjak | (~Midjak@82.66.147.146) |
2023-08-11 17:19:07 +0200 | Sgeo | (~Sgeo@user/sgeo) |
2023-08-11 17:19:12 +0200 | nate2 | (~nate@c-98-45-169-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
2023-08-11 17:20:10 +0200 | danse-nr3_ | (~francesco@151.46.136.226) |
2023-08-11 17:22:53 +0200 | danse-nr3 | (~francesco@151.37.245.142) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
2023-08-11 17:23:35 +0200 | trev | (~trev@user/trev) |
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2023-08-11 17:26:42 +0200 | thegeekinside | (~thegeekin@189.180.79.225) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
2023-08-11 17:27:52 +0200 | artem | (~artem@38.42.227.237) |
2023-08-11 17:27:53 +0200 | ulysses4ever | (~artem@38.42.227.237) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
2023-08-11 17:27:56 +0200 | trev | (~trev@user/trev) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
2023-08-11 17:29:56 +0200 | thegeekinside | (~thegeekin@189.180.79.225) |
2023-08-11 17:30:14 +0200 | stiell_ | (~stiell@gateway/tor-sasl/stiell) |
2023-08-11 17:31:56 +0200 | artem | (~artem@38.42.227.237) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
2023-08-11 17:33:31 +0200 | chele | (~chele@user/chele) (Remote host closed the connection) |
2023-08-11 17:37:07 +0200 | thegeekinside | (~thegeekin@189.180.79.225) (Remote host closed the connection) |
2023-08-11 17:40:19 +0200 | eggplantade | (~Eggplanta@2600:1700:38c5:d800:846:1fe1:eed8:5e0) |
2023-08-11 17:43:29 +0200 | gehmehgeh | gmg |
2023-08-11 17:45:39 +0200 | ulysses4ever | (~artem@172.56.193.75) |
2023-08-11 17:51:56 +0200 | econo_ | (uid147250@id-147250.tinside.irccloud.com) |
2023-08-11 17:52:27 +0200 | titibandit | (~titibandi@user/titibandit) |
2023-08-11 17:53:31 +0200 | MajorBiscuit | (~MajorBisc@145.94.40.195) (Quit: WeeChat 3.6) |
2023-08-11 17:55:35 +0200 | zer0bitz_ | zer0bitz |
2023-08-11 17:59:12 +0200 | _ht | (~Thunderbi@28-52-174-82.ftth.glasoperator.nl) |
2023-08-11 18:00:22 +0200 | <yin> | why is this getting me a "conflicting definitions" error? https://paste.jrvieira.com/1691769597718 |
2023-08-11 18:01:02 +0200 | <int-e> | you can't interleave function definitions |
2023-08-11 18:01:32 +0200 | <yin> | TIL ty |
2023-08-11 18:01:56 +0200 | <int-e> | (there's probably no *deep* reason for that) |
2023-08-11 18:02:07 +0200 | <yin> | i can't think of any |
2023-08-11 18:02:26 +0200 | <geekosaur> | afaik it just makes it harder for the simplifier to rewrite them into a single definition with a `case` |
2023-08-11 18:02:58 +0200 | <geekosaur> | although it might be ghc can handle it, but since the Report says "don't do that" they don't bother |
2023-08-11 18:03:13 +0200 | <int-e> | imagine you have a 100 line module, and you have one function called aux, but forgot about it, and now you add another... |
2023-08-11 18:03:49 +0200 | <int-e> | and then I'm not sure which case is worse: their types being the same so you use the earlier definition, or their types being different and you getting a total mess of type errors |
2023-08-11 18:04:06 +0200 | <int-e> | there's also TemplateHaskell to muddy the waters |
2023-08-11 18:04:11 +0200 | danse-nr3_ | (~francesco@151.46.136.226) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
2023-08-11 18:04:14 +0200 | <int-e> | so... there are definitely reasons. |
2023-08-11 18:04:33 +0200 | <int-e> | but none of them is fundamental in any way |
2023-08-11 18:08:53 +0200 | vglfr | (~vglfr@188.239.201.89) |
2023-08-11 18:29:24 +0200 | machinedgod | (~machinedg@d198-53-218-113.abhsia.telus.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
2023-08-11 18:29:39 +0200 | pyooque | (~puke@user/puke) |
2023-08-11 18:29:40 +0200 | puke | (~puke@user/puke) (Killed (silver.libera.chat (Nickname regained by services))) |
2023-08-11 18:29:40 +0200 | pyooque | puke |
2023-08-11 18:31:37 +0200 | titibandit | (~titibandi@user/titibandit) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
2023-08-11 18:31:48 +0200 | puke | (~puke@user/puke) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
2023-08-11 18:32:08 +0200 | puke | (~puke@user/puke) |
2023-08-11 18:36:23 +0200 | ripspin | (~chatzilla@1.145.221.89) |
2023-08-11 18:40:14 +0200 | ulysses4ever | (~artem@172.56.193.75) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
2023-08-11 18:40:55 +0200 | ulysses4ever | (~artem@38.42.227.237) |
2023-08-11 18:47:27 +0200 | Inst | (~Inst@2601:6c4:4081:2fc0:20bc:c565:40db:3ab2) |
2023-08-11 18:47:32 +0200 | <Inst> | quick question, can cabal be configured |
2023-08-11 18:47:42 +0200 | <sclv> | what do you mean |
2023-08-11 18:47:44 +0200 | <Inst> | to attempt to install required dependencies? |
2023-08-11 18:48:04 +0200 | <Inst> | like, say, i can get monomer working on windows relatively easily because i know how to screw around with msys |
2023-08-11 18:48:39 +0200 | <Inst> | but if say, i wanted the cabal to do that for me, would there be options to do that? |
2023-08-11 18:48:56 +0200 | <sclv> | doing that being "screwing around with msys"? |
2023-08-11 18:49:33 +0200 | <sclv> | that's outside the scope for cabal. it can check for system dependencies (i.e. non haskell packages that haskell packages link against) but it has no mechanism to install them. |
2023-08-11 18:49:42 +0200 | puke | (~puke@user/puke) (Quit: puke) |
2023-08-11 18:51:21 +0200 | <Inst> | so, would that be stack then? |
2023-08-11 18:51:56 +0200 | <[exa]> | if the "dependencies" are "operating system packages outside of *ackage", you probably want something more like docker |
2023-08-11 18:52:33 +0200 | vglfr | (~vglfr@188.239.201.89) (Remote host closed the connection) |
2023-08-11 18:52:42 +0200 | <Inst> | i guess i'm not really going to commit to that for now; i'd like a Haskell stack where learners can just screw around with a GUI package |
2023-08-11 18:53:06 +0200 | <Inst> | for windows users, 1-click/command gloss / gi-gtk / monomer is pretty important |
2023-08-11 18:53:14 +0200 | <Inst> | same with 1-click hmatrix, etc |
2023-08-11 18:53:52 +0200 | <[exa]> | somehow this is 1-click on most linux distros :D |
2023-08-11 18:54:14 +0200 | <[exa]> | (anyway sorry this was not helpful :D ) |
2023-08-11 18:55:03 +0200 | <[exa]> | there were some visualstudio packages that did something similar, was the thing called nuget? |
2023-08-11 18:55:33 +0200 | <[exa]> | but I think that got carried by M$ folks all the way over to dotnet-only stuff |
2023-08-11 18:58:02 +0200 | <geekosaur> | stack doesn't install OS deps either |
2023-08-11 18:58:16 +0200 | <geekosaur> | there are too many ways to do it and too many different package names |
2023-08-11 18:58:28 +0200 | <EvanR> | there's Setup.hs right |
2023-08-11 18:58:32 +0200 | <geekosaur> | and it usually requires sudo access which you should not give to stack or cabal |
2023-08-11 19:01:27 +0200 | robobub | (uid248673@id-248673.uxbridge.irccloud.com) |
2023-08-11 19:01:50 +0200 | swistak | (~swistak@185.21.216.141) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) |
2023-08-11 19:07:25 +0200 | raehik | (~raehik@cpc95906-rdng25-2-0-cust156.15-3.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
2023-08-11 19:08:18 +0200 | sord937 | (~sord937@gateway/tor-sasl/sord937) (Quit: sord937) |
2023-08-11 19:08:22 +0200 | ddellacosta | (~ddellacos@143.244.47.84) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
2023-08-11 19:09:49 +0200 | <Inst> | hmmm, maybe a better way would be for cabal packages to include a bash script that's user readable |
2023-08-11 19:10:11 +0200 | ddellacosta | (~ddellacos@146.70.171.233) |
2023-08-11 19:13:04 +0200 | ec | (~ec@gateway/tor-sasl/ec) |
2023-08-11 19:15:16 +0200 | ripspin | (~chatzilla@1.145.221.89) (Remote host closed the connection) |
2023-08-11 19:17:40 +0200 | <yushyin> | and the bash script contains what exactly? |
2023-08-11 19:17:56 +0200 | danza_ | (~francesco@151.46.136.226) |
2023-08-11 19:18:42 +0200 | tromp | (~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) |
2023-08-11 19:20:58 +0200 | <EvanR> | if cabal can negotiate the gtk-verse to build gtk bindings, it can do anything |
2023-08-11 19:22:43 +0200 | vglfr | (~vglfr@145.224.100.231) |
2023-08-11 19:25:01 +0200 | vglfr | (~vglfr@145.224.100.231) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
2023-08-11 19:25:14 +0200 | vglfr | (~vglfr@145.224.100.231) |
2023-08-11 19:25:33 +0200 | <int-e> | EvanR: I don't know, it needs quite a bit of help: https://github.com/gtk2hs/gtk2hs/blob/master/tools/src/Gtk2HsSetup.hs |
2023-08-11 19:26:51 +0200 | acidjnk | (~acidjnk@p200300d6e7072f86347ae895ac9e3181.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
2023-08-11 19:26:51 +0200 | vglfr | (~vglfr@145.224.100.231) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
2023-08-11 19:27:02 +0200 | vglfr | (~vglfr@145.224.100.231) |
2023-08-11 19:28:49 +0200 | vglfr | (~vglfr@145.224.100.231) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
2023-08-11 19:31:37 +0200 | vglfr | (~vglfr@cli-188-239-201-89.bbn.slav.dn.ua) |
2023-08-11 19:33:26 +0200 | <sclv> | Inst: my advice would be yeah, include bash/powershell/whatever scripts for platforms to install external deps |
2023-08-11 19:33:47 +0200 | <Inst> | but cabal can potentially support it |
2023-08-11 19:34:11 +0200 | <Inst> | i.e, provide a link to the powershell / bash etc script to do some minimum config work, don't make it plug and play for security purposes |
2023-08-11 19:34:32 +0200 | <sclv> | gtk2hs and etc all still require the system libs be already installed, eg https://github.com/gtk2hs/gtk2hs/tree/master |
2023-08-11 19:34:33 +0200 | <Inst> | wait, can cabal do this already? I.e, display messages on install attempts? |
2023-08-11 19:35:20 +0200 | <sclv> | no cabal has no custom error msgs on failures |
2023-08-11 19:35:37 +0200 | <sclv> | you just should put a link in the docs to a file with the commands the user needs to run |
2023-08-11 19:38:15 +0200 | <geekosaur> | but even that's fraught as they will depend on platform/distro |
2023-08-11 19:38:25 +0200 | <geekosaur> | and whether they use nix or not, etc. |
2023-08-11 19:39:03 +0200 | sm | (~sm@plaintextaccounting/sm) (Quit: sm) |
2023-08-11 19:39:10 +0200 | <int-e> | https://github.com/gtk2hs/gtk2hs/blob/master/tools/src/Gtk2HsSetup.hs#L547-L559 is funny... because while I'm sure that this was once part of every gtk2hs package, now it's part of gtk2hs-buildtools itself. |
2023-08-11 19:39:38 +0200 | <int-e> | (well there's still the PATH aspect which remains relevant) |
2023-08-11 19:40:18 +0200 | tromp | (~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
2023-08-11 19:42:09 +0200 | puke | (~puke@user/puke) |
2023-08-11 19:42:19 +0200 | coot | (~coot@89-69-206-216.dynamic.chello.pl) (Quit: coot) |
2023-08-11 19:44:55 +0200 | ystael | (~ystael@user/ystael) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
2023-08-11 19:45:17 +0200 | fendor | (~fendor@2a02:8388:1640:be00:b586:6c06:a58:19a3) (Remote host closed the connection) |
2023-08-11 19:48:27 +0200 | fendor | (~fendor@2a02:8388:1640:be00:9072:560d:ff8a:aeec) |
2023-08-11 19:54:56 +0200 | <EvanR> | gtk2hs-buildtools... groovy |
2023-08-11 19:55:26 +0200 | <EvanR> | ok good, it doesn't depend on gtk2hs-buildtools-buildtools |
2023-08-11 19:56:02 +0200 | fendor_ | (~fendor@2a02:8388:1640:be00:c73f:4c9a:e162:7d18) |
2023-08-11 19:59:33 +0200 | fendor | (~fendor@2a02:8388:1640:be00:9072:560d:ff8a:aeec) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
2023-08-11 20:02:52 +0200 | tromp | (~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) |
2023-08-11 20:07:42 +0200 | dcoutts | (~duncan@cpc69402-oxfd27-2-0-cust903.4-3.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) |
2023-08-11 20:08:28 +0200 | idgaen | (~idgaen@2a01:e0a:498:fd50:fcc6:bb5d:489a:ce8c) |
2023-08-11 20:10:19 +0200 | pyooque | (~puke@user/puke) |
2023-08-11 20:10:20 +0200 | puke | Guest137 |
2023-08-11 20:10:20 +0200 | Guest137 | (~puke@user/puke) (Killed (silver.libera.chat (Nickname regained by services))) |
2023-08-11 20:10:20 +0200 | pyooque | puke |
2023-08-11 20:13:41 +0200 | L29Ah | (~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah) |
2023-08-11 20:20:19 +0200 | connrs | (~connrs@user/connrs) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
2023-08-11 20:21:59 +0200 | tromp | (~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
2023-08-11 20:22:08 +0200 | connrs | (~connrs@user/connrs) |
2023-08-11 20:24:36 +0200 | tromp | (~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) |
2023-08-11 20:29:34 +0200 | titibandit | (~titibandi@user/titibandit) |
2023-08-11 20:29:35 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@207-153-38-140.fttp.usinternet.com) |
2023-08-11 20:29:36 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@207-153-38-140.fttp.usinternet.com) (Changing host) |
2023-08-11 20:29:36 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@user/wroathe) |
2023-08-11 20:42:14 +0200 | tromp | (~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
2023-08-11 20:44:17 +0200 | <Inst> | cool, finally got gi-gtk to install |
2023-08-11 20:48:43 +0200 | tremon | (~tremon@83.80.159.219) |
2023-08-11 20:53:28 +0200 | neuroevolutus | (~neuroevol@2606:2e00:8007:1::a31e) |
2023-08-11 20:54:04 +0200 | <EvanR> | Inst, are you doing something with GTK? |
2023-08-11 20:55:07 +0200 | simikando | (~simikando@adsl-dyn-104.95-102-88.t-com.sk) |
2023-08-11 20:57:20 +0200 | puke | (~puke@user/puke) (Quit: puke) |
2023-08-11 21:01:03 +0200 | <Inst> | well, trying to build a conway's game of life there |
2023-08-11 21:01:15 +0200 | <Inst> | and turn it into a haskell intro tutorial |
2023-08-11 21:01:38 +0200 | <EvanR> | so you want to learn haskell, first install GTK bindings |
2023-08-11 21:01:48 +0200 | <Inst> | i've had an obsession for the last 2 months for something like "Big Book of Small Python Projects", but for Haskell, and composed of tutorials teaching as much Haskell as needed per project |
2023-08-11 21:02:02 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@user/wroathe) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
2023-08-11 21:02:11 +0200 | <EvanR> | you might do better using text mode graphics for that |
2023-08-11 21:02:16 +0200 | <Inst> | Windows. |
2023-08-11 21:02:17 +0200 | <EvanR> | or gloss |
2023-08-11 21:02:18 +0200 | <Inst> | Uhhh |
2023-08-11 21:02:20 +0200 | <Inst> | Gloss works |
2023-08-11 21:02:55 +0200 | <EvanR> | so it's also a haskell-on-windows tutorial |
2023-08-11 21:02:56 +0200 | <Inst> | gloss afaik, isn't gloss a toy, though? |
2023-08-11 21:03:24 +0200 | <Inst> | i sort of gave up on monomer after the dev / maintainer didn't want to set up a team for it |
2023-08-11 21:03:24 +0200 | <EvanR> | toy? game of life? |
2023-08-11 21:03:45 +0200 | <Inst> | i mean, if you do conway in gi-gtk or monomer, shoudn't the skills be more portable? |
2023-08-11 21:03:55 +0200 | <Inst> | I just haven't been arsed to set up a widget in monomer that can support console display |
2023-08-11 21:04:50 +0200 | <EvanR> | I got another one, so you want to write game of life in haskell. First let me introduce you to some category theory: https://kukuruku.co/hub/haskell/cellular-automata-using-comonads |
2023-08-11 21:05:02 +0200 | <Inst> | yeah i was thinking of that! |
2023-08-11 21:05:09 +0200 | <Inst> | i don't get comonads yet |
2023-08-11 21:05:39 +0200 | <Inst> | the basic concept is simple, monads with arrows reversed, i.e, duplicate instead of join, extract instead of pure, same requirement for Functor |
2023-08-11 21:05:48 +0200 | <Inst> | there's lots of discussion of comonads for GUI but I haven't been able to grok it yet |
2023-08-11 21:06:42 +0200 | <EvanR> | if you really want gratuitous theory for GUI you might want to look at profunctors |
2023-08-11 21:06:56 +0200 | <probie> | I'm too lazy to follow the link. Is that one of the ones that's using zippers? |
2023-08-11 21:06:59 +0200 | puke | (~puke@user/puke) |
2023-08-11 21:07:28 +0200 | <EvanR> | data Universe a = Universe [a] a [a] |
2023-08-11 21:07:45 +0200 | <EvanR> | looks like it |
2023-08-11 21:07:46 +0200 | <Inst> | profunctors, i.e, a datatype that incorporates a functor and a contravariant functor? |
2023-08-11 21:08:10 +0200 | <Inst> | probably less level of comprehension than comonads with profunctors |
2023-08-11 21:08:21 +0200 | <EvanR> | a datatype which is a functor in one argument and a contravariant functor in the other |
2023-08-11 21:08:45 +0200 | <Inst> | also, trashy comonad tutorials are now a thing |
2023-08-11 21:09:03 +0200 | <EvanR> | lol |
2023-08-11 21:09:30 +0200 | <Inst> | https://dev.to/mikesol/frontend-comonad-backend-monad-1hfm |
2023-08-11 21:09:46 +0200 | <ncf> | now that's a URL |
2023-08-11 21:11:41 +0200 | <Inst> | tbh IO monad unironically is the best introductory to monads because the implementation isn't exposed and doesn't force you into "monads are burritos" idiocy (neither functors nor monads are containers; a monad is just a functor with join and pure operating together as a monoid, a functor, properly endofunctor, is a structure-preserving lifting of a type into the same category of types) |
2023-08-11 21:12:10 +0200 | <ncf> | their duplicate doesn't typecheck... did GPT write this? |
2023-08-11 21:12:16 +0200 | <Inst> | i still think starting with proxy is the best intro monad |
2023-08-11 21:12:26 +0200 | <Inst> | ncf: have you seen eric normand's articles on Haskell? |
2023-08-11 21:12:32 +0200 | <ncf> | who |
2023-08-11 21:12:33 +0200 | <Inst> | he literally had foo? |
2023-08-11 21:12:35 +0200 | <EvanR> | before you leave this cave and go reading monad tutorials, take this one-item checklist "does the post explain abstraction X by focusing on 1 particular example instance and leaving it at that" |
2023-08-11 21:12:42 +0200 | <Inst> | Eric Normand is a Clojure bigwig |
2023-08-11 21:13:07 +0200 | <Inst> | big popularizer, I think his formulation of FP (actions, computations, and values) is the most accessible one for mainstream developers |
2023-08-11 21:13:15 +0200 | <Inst> | but his comments on Haskell are hilarious because they're so silly |
2023-08-11 21:13:16 +0200 | Guest4879 | (~finn@81-67-22-3.rev.numericable.fr) |
2023-08-11 21:13:29 +0200 | <shapr> | I like this one https://www.jerf.org/iri/post/2958/ |
2023-08-11 21:13:46 +0200 | L29Ah | (~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
2023-08-11 21:15:02 +0200 | <EvanR> | so clojure has bigwig's now |
2023-08-11 21:15:15 +0200 | <Inst> | https://www.reddit.com/r/haskell/comments/j1nll2/the_user_wizard_scenario_we_start_with_a_haskell/ |
2023-08-11 21:15:31 +0200 | <Inst> | ummm, it had a BDFL in Rich Hinley |
2023-08-11 21:15:43 +0200 | <Inst> | I respect Clojure, I just think parens syntax sucks, and typed FP > untyped FP |
2023-08-11 21:15:56 +0200 | <Inst> | both have their merits, but typed FP is just better for day to day use, and typed FP can simulate untyped FP |
2023-08-11 21:16:18 +0200 | <Inst> | main drawback of typed FP is the conceptual complexity, which is a plus for the Haskell / Idris community |
2023-08-11 21:16:25 +0200 | <probie> | I mean, Rich Hickey has some interesting ideas. I think he also mainstreamed Haskell-bashing in the Clojure community |
2023-08-11 21:16:26 +0200 | <Inst> | or just the typed FP community |
2023-08-11 21:16:49 +0200 | <Inst> | this is the real story of FP langs |
2023-08-11 21:16:58 +0200 | <Inst> | there are 20 different FP langs that all bash each other / hate each other to some extent |
2023-08-11 21:17:02 +0200 | <EvanR> | nobody can bash haskell better than haskell users though, no contest |
2023-08-11 21:17:22 +0200 | <Inst> | because of the internecine conflict, no FP lang achieves critical mass, although F# is doing pretty well |
2023-08-11 21:17:51 +0200 | <probie> | I hate Haskell with a passion |
2023-08-11 21:18:01 +0200 | <probie> | it's just that I also hate everything else slightly more |
2023-08-11 21:18:06 +0200 | <EvanR> | ^ |
2023-08-11 21:19:15 +0200 | <Inst> | ^^ |
2023-08-11 21:19:42 +0200 | eggplantade | (~Eggplanta@2600:1700:38c5:d800:846:1fe1:eed8:5e0) (Remote host closed the connection) |
2023-08-11 21:20:28 +0200 | danza__ | (~francesco@151.44.191.133) |
2023-08-11 21:20:44 +0200 | nate2 | (~nate@c-98-45-169-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
2023-08-11 21:21:04 +0200 | danza_ | (~francesco@151.46.136.226) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
2023-08-11 21:23:33 +0200 | <EvanR> | Inst, eric was a regular in programming meetups in new orleans before covid. I stood in the way of many attempts to bash haskell inappropriately. Much progress was made in appropriate haskell bashing |
2023-08-11 21:23:52 +0200 | <EvanR> | important to get the bashing right |
2023-08-11 21:23:56 +0200 | <Inst> | on Twitter: |
2023-08-11 21:24:34 +0200 | <Inst> | what's the story behind this? |
2023-08-11 21:24:34 +0200 | <Inst> | https://twitter.com/ericnormand/status/1402591912167628805 |
2023-08-11 21:25:32 +0200 | nate2 | (~nate@c-98-45-169-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
2023-08-11 21:25:46 +0200 | <Inst> | btw, the real project i'm focused on right now is building a webapp that can integrate with github |
2023-08-11 21:25:56 +0200 | tromp | (~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) |
2023-08-11 21:26:12 +0200 | <Inst> | and allow Haskellers to post wishes and commitments for existing and potential libraries |
2023-08-11 21:26:31 +0200 | <int-e> | Tristan: "I am still to find a beginner friendly way to get into the mystical world of Haskell." |
2023-08-11 21:26:35 +0200 | <int-e> | hmmm |
2023-08-11 21:26:44 +0200 | <Inst> | Haskell Phrasebook? |
2023-08-11 21:26:45 +0200 | <EvanR> | does it translate the haskell code into whatever language that project is written in? |
2023-08-11 21:26:45 +0200 | <int-e> | (ignore that nick) |
2023-08-11 21:27:28 +0200 | <Inst> | ummm, thinking about learning persistent and esqueleto for it over servant |
2023-08-11 21:27:33 +0200 | <Inst> | have some experience with postgre simple |
2023-08-11 21:28:04 +0200 | <Inst> | int-e: I'm serious, the best way to get into the mystical world of Haskell is to have an equivalent to "Big Book of Small Python Projects" with full tutorials |
2023-08-11 21:28:09 +0200 | <EvanR> | mapM_ learn allTheThings |
2023-08-11 21:28:12 +0200 | <Inst> | it'll kill the mysticism quickly |
2023-08-11 21:28:41 +0200 | <Inst> | i'm wondering if you can rewrite it with forever :: IO a -> IO a instead |
2023-08-11 21:28:52 +0200 | <int-e> | Inst: There is no best way. |
2023-08-11 21:29:14 +0200 | <Inst> | i mean, there's actually a lot of "Haskell in 15 minutes" tutorials out there |
2023-08-11 21:29:24 +0200 | <Inst> | just need to collate them, and learning Haskell TBH is learning the library ecosystem |
2023-08-11 21:29:31 +0200 | <Inst> | we've made so much improvement in every foible of Haskell |
2023-08-11 21:29:51 +0200 | <Inst> | someone is working on parallelizing GHC to get 15-35% build time improvements (we already have features for that, but not ergonomic) |
2023-08-11 21:29:53 +0200 | <int-e> | And I suspect that there's no quick way to learn to appreciate HM types. It /might/ be easier with SML. |
2023-08-11 21:29:58 +0200 | <Inst> | the tooling is no longer trash |
2023-08-11 21:30:15 +0200 | <Inst> | there are LOT of great Haskell books out there |
2023-08-11 21:30:18 +0200 | <Inst> | only problem is ecosystem |
2023-08-11 21:30:29 +0200 | <Inst> | progress is being made, but slow |
2023-08-11 21:30:41 +0200 | <EvanR> | what's wrong with ecosystem specifically |
2023-08-11 21:30:56 +0200 | <int-e> | Anyway, I don't know what to make of that little thread. |
2023-08-11 21:31:07 +0200 | <Inst> | #1, lib doc sucks, every lib is equivalent to learning a language, #2, ecosystem is patchy in parts and tailored to the existing Haskell userbase, i.e, wizards |
2023-08-11 21:31:21 +0200 | <probie> | Also, going back half a dozen steps, I haven't really heard much about profunctors for GUIs. Is that just all the old arrow stuff, but now profunctors, because strong profunctors? |
2023-08-11 21:31:34 +0200 | <probie> | s/strong profunctors/strong profunctors are pretty much arrows/ |
2023-08-11 21:31:49 +0200 | <Inst> | which is the problem for Haskell GUI, we don't have a standard solution for Haskell GUI |
2023-08-11 21:32:03 +0200 | <Inst> | FRP GUIs, comonadic GUIs, now profunctor GUIs? |
2023-08-11 21:32:06 +0200 | <EvanR> | I'm kidding mostly, based only on the applemus blog, reactive banana stuff |
2023-08-11 21:32:36 +0200 | <Inst> | bleh, fuck this shit, i'm isntalling Nix, one day Haskell on Windows won't suck, but I assume we'll get dependent types before then |
2023-08-11 21:32:44 +0200 | <int-e> | . o O ( and then there's gtk2hs ) |
2023-08-11 21:33:28 +0200 | NewtonTrendy | (uid282092@user/bopqod) |
2023-08-11 21:33:32 +0200 | <Inst> | couldn't get it to build, or rather, couldn't get gi-gtk to build |
2023-08-11 21:33:37 +0200 | <Inst> | i might end up nuking my cabal and GHCup again |
2023-08-11 21:33:38 +0200 | <EvanR> | I kind of can't tell how important windows support is for the health of the haskell tutorial industry |
2023-08-11 21:33:42 +0200 | <Inst> | just to nuke away the msys |
2023-08-11 21:34:06 +0200 | <EvanR> | what percent of would be tutorial followers are on windows and not linux |
2023-08-11 21:34:54 +0200 | <geekosaur> | probably large |
2023-08-11 21:35:05 +0200 | <geekosaur> | I mean, de facto the world is Windows |
2023-08-11 21:35:07 +0200 | <Inst> | US-wise, Windows is dying, like around 50-60% market share |
2023-08-11 21:35:17 +0200 | <Inst> | but globally Windows is pretty entrenched, including Windows XP systems for god's sake |
2023-08-11 21:35:22 +0200 | <EvanR> | yes human beings on windows greatly outnumbered |
2023-08-11 21:35:35 +0200 | <EvanR> | outnumbering. But that want to follow haskell tutorials |
2023-08-11 21:35:47 +0200 | <Inst> | EvanR: more like, trying to develop a new market? |
2023-08-11 21:36:19 +0200 | <Inst> | point is, Rust keeps on murdering Haskell |
2023-08-11 21:36:35 +0200 | <EvanR> | I don't see how those are in any sort of competition for anything |
2023-08-11 21:36:42 +0200 | <geekosaur> | ^ |
2023-08-11 21:36:55 +0200 | <Inst> | in wizard market, you know we lost Hasura, right? |
2023-08-11 21:37:16 +0200 | <Inst> | important because Hasura is the first (and only, until Juspay or Mercury make it), Haskell unicorn |
2023-08-11 21:37:28 +0200 | <EvanR> | what are all these names |
2023-08-11 21:37:29 +0200 | <Inst> | they're rewriting their graphql engine in rust |
2023-08-11 21:37:45 +0200 | <int-e> | must be startups |
2023-08-11 21:37:55 +0200 | <int-e> | with "unicorn" being VC lingo |
2023-08-11 21:37:56 +0200 | <Inst> | Juspay is a 100m+ Indian payments provider |
2023-08-11 21:38:04 +0200 | tromp | (~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
2023-08-11 21:38:08 +0200 | <Inst> | Mercury employs Rebecca Skinner, author of Effective Haskell |
2023-08-11 21:38:16 +0200 | <Inst> | unicorn means start-up that gets over 1 billion valuation |
2023-08-11 21:38:22 +0200 | <geekosaur> | VC I would believe |
2023-08-11 21:38:49 +0200 | <geekosaur> | they force network appliances developed in *BSD to switch to linux and thereby screw up their network stacks too |
2023-08-11 21:39:06 +0200 | <geekosaur> | meaning VCs are idiots |
2023-08-11 21:39:18 +0200 | <geekosaur> | who destroy products in the name of quick money |
2023-08-11 21:39:31 +0200 | <Inst> | does that mean that everyone living in the capitalist world is an idiot? |
2023-08-11 21:39:34 +0200 | <Inst> | that's basic capitalist logic |
2023-08-11 21:39:40 +0200 | <Inst> | time discounting |
2023-08-11 21:40:05 +0200 | <geekosaur> | there is going for the money and there is shooting yourself in the foot |
2023-08-11 21:40:06 +0200 | <Inst> | it's supposed to be the job of governments and NGOs to have longer time horizons, but we all know how well that works |
2023-08-11 21:40:08 +0200 | Inst | shrugs |
2023-08-11 21:40:30 +0200 | <geekosaur> | we're talking products that could have been best-in-class rendered middle-of-the-pack by stupid decisions |
2023-08-11 21:40:44 +0200 | <int-e> | The idiocy is to look at a startup, see that they're using Haskell or whatever, forget that it's mostly about a vision for a product, people, and luck, and decide that you have to use Haskell too in order to have success. |
2023-08-11 21:41:18 +0200 | simikando | (~simikando@adsl-dyn-104.95-102-88.t-com.sk) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) |
2023-08-11 21:41:32 +0200 | <Inst> | Haskell is just an enabler, and a problematic one insofar as the quantity of experience for Haskell in production seems relatively scarce |
2023-08-11 21:41:34 +0200 | <int-e> | (Same for applying that kind of "logic" to *not* using Haskell.) |
2023-08-11 21:41:35 +0200 | <EvanR> | promote haskell usage, hire the most brilliant functional programmers, then switch everything to java and win xD |
2023-08-11 21:41:49 +0200 | <Inst> | EvanR: Tikhon Jelvis? :) |
2023-08-11 21:42:46 +0200 | <[exa]> | I invested precious 5 minutes into skimming over the discourse thread on that topic, what's the problem there? |
2023-08-11 21:42:52 +0200 | <Inst> | (He was working at Target, he seems to be in the same firm as Edward Kmett now, a start-up, but Target was actually using Haskell for many of their systems. Then they switched CTOs, the CTO wanted mainstream languages on everything.) |
2023-08-11 21:43:06 +0200 | <Inst> | [exa]: which discourse thread? |
2023-08-11 21:43:07 +0200 | <shapr> | sounds like my previous Haskell job |
2023-08-11 21:43:34 +0200 | <juri_> | I'm pleading the 5th. |
2023-08-11 21:43:35 +0200 | <geekosaur> | footguns for everyone! |
2023-08-11 21:43:40 +0200 | <[exa]> | https://discourse.haskell.org/t/hasura-migrating-to-rust/6620/34 ... they found the niche, discarded half of their functionality (remember hasura with sparql?) and to squeeze more they just specialize to rust, which is good |
2023-08-11 21:44:17 +0200 | <Inst> | i mean it's good for them, it's just, rust gives you more performance, more safety, has a larger ecosystem, more desperate rustacaeans than desperate Haskellers |
2023-08-11 21:44:38 +0200 | <Inst> | erm, not more safety |
2023-08-11 21:44:45 +0200 | <Inst> | comparable safety |
2023-08-11 21:45:42 +0200 | <[exa]> | you can't measure safety without knowing the adversary |
2023-08-11 21:46:04 +0200 | <[exa]> | rust certainly gives more safety against rust programmers' errors. :D |
2023-08-11 21:46:13 +0200 | <EvanR> | safety = security vs yourself |
2023-08-11 21:46:27 +0200 | <[exa]> | also good. |
2023-08-11 21:46:36 +0200 | <[exa]> | anyway this is a happy story I'd say |
2023-08-11 21:46:46 +0200 | dcoutts | (~duncan@cpc69402-oxfd27-2-0-cust903.4-3.cable.virginm.net) |
2023-08-11 21:47:07 +0200 | <Inst> | the lesson i seem to be deriving is that Haskell is powerful and flexible enough for fast prototyping, and if the guys working on Rust FFI get their way, can eventually be used to wrap Rust |
2023-08-11 21:47:14 +0200 | <Inst> | Haskell should be faster for iteration than Rust |
2023-08-11 21:47:16 +0200 | <Inst> | which is why: |
2023-08-11 21:47:27 +0200 | <[exa]> | IMO better than hasura trying to beat the shit out of haskell gc with 10 years of superspecialized hopefullyhelping ducttape patches to ghc |
2023-08-11 21:48:01 +0200 | <[exa]> | (oh noes apologies for s-word, I thought we're in #offtopic) |
2023-08-11 21:48:02 +0200 | <Inst> | https://mdwdotla.medium.com/using-rust-at-a-startup-a-cautionary-tale-42ab823d9454 |
2023-08-11 21:48:16 +0200 | <Inst> | https://www.propelauth.com/post/i-love-building-a-startup-in-rust-i-wouldnt-pick-it-again |
2023-08-11 21:52:49 +0200 | Natch | (~natch@c-9e07225c.038-60-73746f7.bbcust.telenor.se) |
2023-08-11 21:52:55 +0200 | <EvanR> | choosing the right language for your startup: an iterative process |
2023-08-11 21:53:49 +0200 | <int-e> | but if your goal is to write software, it's imperative to choose a languag. |
2023-08-11 21:54:01 +0200 | dcoutts | (~duncan@cpc69402-oxfd27-2-0-cust903.4-3.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
2023-08-11 21:55:09 +0200 | <probie> | I probably wouldn't pick Haskell as a language for a startup unless I already developers that I'm happy to write Haskell with |
2023-08-11 21:55:13 +0200 | idgaen | (~idgaen@2a01:e0a:498:fd50:fcc6:bb5d:489a:ce8c) (Quit: WeeChat 4.0.2) |
2023-08-11 21:55:14 +0200 | tromp | (~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) |
2023-08-11 21:55:42 +0200 | fweht | (uid404746@id-404746.lymington.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) |
2023-08-11 21:56:22 +0200 | <probie> | This has been on my mind a lot recently, because there's a non-zero chance that in the next few months I'll actually have to make that decision |
2023-08-11 21:56:59 +0200 | <Inst> | probie: is Haskell, the language and library ecosystem, suited to start-ups? |
2023-08-11 21:57:08 +0200 | <probie> | s/I already developers/I already has developers/ |
2023-08-11 21:57:11 +0200 | <Inst> | like, is the biggest problem the social factor wherein you can't train Haskellers fast enough? |
2023-08-11 21:57:12 +0200 | eggplantade | (~Eggplanta@104-55-37-220.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) |
2023-08-11 21:57:18 +0200 | <EvanR> | Good luck. We're all counting on you. |
2023-08-11 21:57:31 +0200 | <Inst> | probie: so, what languages are you shopping for then? |
2023-08-11 21:57:55 +0200 | <Inst> | probie: if the start-up goes belly up (60-80% odds), please write a postmortem for us on a blog somewhere! |
2023-08-11 21:58:11 +0200 | <Inst> | if you opt for Haskell |
2023-08-11 21:58:21 +0200 | <monochrom> | I don't think any startup can afford to change language later. Therefore, it is not an iterative process, it is a "the other pasture is always greener" process. :) |
2023-08-11 21:58:40 +0200 | <Inst> | they can after they've been bought out :) |
2023-08-11 21:58:41 +0200 | codaraxis | (~codaraxis@user/codaraxis) |
2023-08-11 21:59:04 +0200 | <Inst> | eric Normand is also sort of weird, backtracking to that subject |
2023-08-11 21:59:11 +0200 | <Inst> | because he was working on Haskell and JS on Scrive in 2012 |
2023-08-11 21:59:24 +0200 | <juri_> | at the startup i'm working at, we've switched languages for the client teams at least three times. |
2023-08-11 21:59:32 +0200 | <Rembane> | Inst: Is he going to Rust too? |
2023-08-11 21:59:35 +0200 | <juri_> | the backend? haskell. |
2023-08-11 21:59:36 +0200 | <Inst> | a major figure in Haskell community is now in Scrive |
2023-08-11 21:59:41 +0200 | <Rembane> | juri_: Which languages did you try in the frontend? |
2023-08-11 21:59:45 +0200 | <Inst> | Rembnae: unlikely, because Clojurians hate static typing |
2023-08-11 22:00:03 +0200 | <juri_> | Rembane: the only one i know what we moved from is when we moved away from scala. |
2023-08-11 22:00:03 +0200 | <edwardk> | FWIW- I don't work with Tikhon. He's a friend, I've known him a long time, but we're off doing our own respective things. |
2023-08-11 22:00:48 +0200 | <edwardk> | Eric Normand dipped a toe in Haskell, but he was pretty much always a Clojure guy. |
2023-08-11 22:00:56 +0200 | <Rembane> | juri_: Cool. |
2023-08-11 22:01:30 +0200 | <Inst> | oh, I got confused |
2023-08-11 22:01:34 +0200 | <Inst> | Positron, stealth start-up |
2023-08-11 22:01:39 +0200 | <Inst> | he's doing CX Score |
2023-08-11 22:01:42 +0200 | manmshuk | (~manmshuk@2401:4900:803f:3acd:e89b:2576:7144:958f) |
2023-08-11 22:02:01 +0200 | manmshuk | (~manmshuk@2401:4900:803f:3acd:e89b:2576:7144:958f) (Remote host closed the connection) |
2023-08-11 22:02:12 +0200 | manmshuk | (~manmshuk@2401:4900:803f:3acd:e89b:2576:7144:958f) |
2023-08-11 22:02:34 +0200 | <probie> | Inst: Haskell is a language you can iterate very quickly in, and that's of value to a start-up, but it's a lot more work to onboard people. You can't exactly restrict yourself to a simple subset, because the ecosystem doesn't restrict itself to a simple subset |
2023-08-11 22:02:35 +0200 | manmshuk | (~manmshuk@2401:4900:803f:3acd:e89b:2576:7144:958f) (Remote host closed the connection) |
2023-08-11 22:02:38 +0200 | <Inst> | i'm just more confused that Normand worked at Scrive for like 2 years on JS and Haskell and could still get the namespacing wrong |
2023-08-11 22:04:25 +0200 | <probie> | When a startup fails, I doubt the choice of language was a significant factor |
2023-08-11 22:04:33 +0200 | <EvanR> | Inst is your startup using haskell? |
2023-08-11 22:04:39 +0200 | <Inst> | no startup :( |
2023-08-11 22:04:47 +0200 | <Inst> | i'm interested in the field |
2023-08-11 22:05:33 +0200 | <EvanR> | do you have a blog where this tutorial series is going to be posted |
2023-08-11 22:05:50 +0200 | <Inst> | nope, not yet, but tbh, we can just collate all the tutorials others are doing so far |
2023-08-11 22:05:55 +0200 | <Inst> | was going to post that on discourse |
2023-08-11 22:06:14 +0200 | <Inst> | my stuff is also going to suck :( |
2023-08-11 22:07:16 +0200 | Pickchea | (~private@user/pickchea) |
2023-08-11 22:09:31 +0200 | tromp | (~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
2023-08-11 22:10:11 +0200 | <juri_> | Inst: I've been sucking at haskell for 8 years now. |
2023-08-11 22:10:30 +0200 | <EvanR> | hear hear |
2023-08-11 22:10:47 +0200 | <EvanR> | haskell suckers represent |
2023-08-11 22:10:48 +0200 | <juri_> | chatgpt seems to think i'm some amazing haskeller, but i .. think i recognize edwardk, maybe? |
2023-08-11 22:11:05 +0200 | <juri_> | tl;dr: i suck, in obscurity. |
2023-08-11 22:13:51 +0200 | <Inst> | the great part of say, monomer, is that outside of enabling monad comprehensions (should we represent the tic tac toe board with nested lists or a bytestring?), you literally do not need monads for this |
2023-08-11 22:14:53 +0200 | <Rembane> | What's monomer in this context? |
2023-08-11 22:15:51 +0200 | <Inst> | some GUI lib, which incidentally works on Windows |
2023-08-11 22:15:54 +0200 | <Inst> | Elm architecture based |
2023-08-11 22:16:08 +0200 | <probie> | Rembane: https://github.com/fjvallarino/monomer#readme |
2023-08-11 22:16:43 +0200 | <Rembane> | Inst, probie: Thank you. Looks fun! |
2023-08-11 22:16:59 +0200 | <Inst> | does not work on 9.6.2 the last I checked |
2023-08-11 22:18:10 +0200 | Tuplanolla | (~Tuplanoll@91-159-68-236.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
2023-08-11 22:19:24 +0200 | ulysses4ever | (~artem@38.42.227.237) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
2023-08-11 22:19:25 +0200 | <Inst> | you almost certainly aren't on windows, Haskell on Windows is so bad I'm installing Nix |
2023-08-11 22:19:33 +0200 | <Inst> | but: |
2023-08-11 22:19:33 +0200 | <Inst> | https://github.com/fjvallarino/monomer/issues/258 |
2023-08-11 22:21:24 +0200 | <Rembane> | Seems painful |
2023-08-11 22:22:00 +0200 | <Inst> | i got used to it, unfortunately |
2023-08-11 22:22:06 +0200 | <EvanR> | I installed haskell on windows, worked |
2023-08-11 22:22:14 +0200 | <EvanR> | which part is so bad? |
2023-08-11 22:22:27 +0200 | <Inst> | well, i have to use an older SDL if I want to get it to work with that library |
2023-08-11 22:22:37 +0200 | <Inst> | and a lot of GHCI stuff, I think the C FFI is broken? |
2023-08-11 22:22:47 +0200 | <Inst> | if I try to play around with HMatrix, segfault |
2023-08-11 22:22:53 +0200 | <EvanR> | SDL is a rapidly moving target right now |
2023-08-11 22:23:07 +0200 | dcoutts | (~duncan@cpc69402-oxfd27-2-0-cust903.4-3.cable.virginm.net) |
2023-08-11 22:23:51 +0200 | <EvanR> | it's major version number is a superposition of 2 and 3, reminiscent of the update from 1.3 to 2 |
2023-08-11 22:24:19 +0200 | <EvanR> | does C FFI normally work from ghci? |
2023-08-11 22:24:37 +0200 | <Inst> | https://gitlab.haskell.org/ghc/ghc/-/issues/22999 |
2023-08-11 22:24:40 +0200 | <Inst> | older C FFI works |
2023-08-11 22:24:58 +0200 | <probie> | I would like to be able to write a boring desktop application in Haskell, compile with some magical incantation and get a Windows exe I can send to the end user out the other end. I did that once in Golang and was amazed that it "just worked" |
2023-08-11 22:25:57 +0200 | <Inst> | i hear that there are GHC developers working on multi-backend stuff for Haskell, including cross-platform development |
2023-08-11 22:27:33 +0200 | <Inst> | https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/968989726633779215/1139656320618864720/image.png?width=28… |
2023-08-11 22:27:41 +0200 | <Inst> | https://hackage.haskell.org/package/tinyfiledialogs-0.2.1.0/docs/Graphics-UI-TinyFileDialogs.html |
2023-08-11 22:27:58 +0200 | <Inst> | here, the C FFI is painfree |
2023-08-11 22:31:18 +0200 | <EvanR> | VisualHaskell Studio |
2023-08-11 22:33:39 +0200 | <Inst> | whoa |
2023-08-11 22:34:11 +0200 | <Inst> | i think this is 9.4.6 talking? |
2023-08-11 22:34:40 +0200 | _ht | (~Thunderbi@28-52-174-82.ftth.glasoperator.nl) (Remote host closed the connection) |
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2023-08-11 22:39:32 +0200 | <Inst> | hmmm, hmatrix seems to be working on 9.4.6 |
2023-08-11 22:40:24 +0200 | waleee | (~waleee@2001:9b0:21c:4000:5bf9:6515:c030:57b7) |
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2023-08-11 22:44:40 +0200 | titibandit | (~titibandi@user/titibandit) (Remote host closed the connection) |
2023-08-11 22:46:02 +0200 | <Inst> | also, if you guys are interested in mercury: |
2023-08-11 22:46:03 +0200 | <Inst> | https://growjo.com/company/Mercury_-_Banking_for_Startups |
2023-08-11 22:46:19 +0200 | <Inst> | 1/10th the revenue of Stripe, which is pretty awesome |
2023-08-11 22:46:35 +0200 | cbarrett | (sid192934@id-192934.helmsley.irccloud.com) |
2023-08-11 22:46:47 +0200 | Guest3051 | (sid1055@id-1055.tinside.irccloud.com) |
2023-08-11 22:47:07 +0200 | rubin55 | (sid175221@id-175221.hampstead.irccloud.com) |
2023-08-11 22:47:16 +0200 | <[exa]> | Inst: that's very offtopic |
2023-08-11 22:48:42 +0200 | <Inst> | i mean Mercury is a Haskell shop |
2023-08-11 22:48:57 +0200 | <Inst> | https://serokell.io/blog/haskell-in-production-mercury |
2023-08-11 22:49:31 +0200 | <Inst> | oh, and more importantly, Matt Parsons is at Mercury |
2023-08-11 22:53:29 +0200 | mc47 | (~mc47@xmonad/TheMC47) (Remote host closed the connection) |
2023-08-11 22:54:38 +0200 | stef204 | (~stef204@user/stef204) |
2023-08-11 22:55:25 +0200 | <Inst> | hmatrix still crashes on 9.4.6 |
2023-08-11 22:55:49 +0200 | <Inst> | https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/968989726633779215/1139663457923371038/image.png?width=22… |
2023-08-11 22:57:04 +0200 | Guest4879 | (~finn@81-67-22-3.rev.numericable.fr) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
2023-08-11 22:58:27 +0200 | oo_miguel | (~Thunderbi@78-11-179-96.static.ip.netia.com.pl) |
2023-08-11 22:58:43 +0200 | LispTyro | (~pepsi@iron.vengarl.com) |
2023-08-11 23:00:42 +0200 | <EvanR> | the functional-logic language Mercury looks pretty cool, also off topic |
2023-08-11 23:03:01 +0200 | <Inst> | hey Mercury is a Haskell banner carrier |
2023-08-11 23:03:22 +0200 | <Inst> | and an applicative-tier donor to Haskell Foundation |
2023-08-11 23:03:36 +0200 | oo_miguel | (~Thunderbi@78-11-179-96.static.ip.netia.com.pl) (Quit: oo_miguel) |
2023-08-11 23:03:55 +0200 | kimiamania60 | (~65804703@user/kimiamania) (Quit: PegeLinux) |
2023-08-11 23:04:24 +0200 | kimiamania60 | (~65804703@user/kimiamania) |
2023-08-11 23:05:54 +0200 | <Inst> | okay, but HMatrix works on WSL2 Debian (Win10), thank god |
2023-08-11 23:07:46 +0200 | neuroevolutus | (~neuroevol@2606:2e00:8007:1::a31e) (Quit: Client closed) |
2023-08-11 23:08:15 +0200 | mango | (~finn@81-67-22-3.rev.numericable.fr) |
2023-08-11 23:15:25 +0200 | <EvanR> | what are you using hmatrix for |
2023-08-11 23:15:26 +0200 | anselmschueler | (~anselmsch@user/schuelermine) |
2023-08-11 23:15:44 +0200 | <anselmschueler> | Are there some tools that allow me to generate a man page with my Cabal build? Can cabal install a man page? |
2023-08-11 23:16:07 +0200 | <Inst> | nothing, it's just a key library and i'm just griping about crappy windows support |
2023-08-11 23:17:48 +0200 | <EvanR> | ah, in the sense that python is really a conduit for people to use numpy xD |
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2023-08-11 23:37:10 +0200 | hugo | (znc@verdigris.lysator.liu.se) |
2023-08-11 23:38:18 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
2023-08-11 23:38:28 +0200 | sm | (~sm@plaintextaccounting/sm) (Client Quit) |
2023-08-11 23:40:05 +0200 | machinedgod | (~machinedg@d198-53-218-113.abhsia.telus.net) |
2023-08-11 23:40:20 +0200 | puke | (~puke@user/puke) (Remote host closed the connection) |
2023-08-11 23:41:15 +0200 | puke | (~puke@user/puke) |
2023-08-11 23:43:22 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) |
2023-08-11 23:43:22 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) (Changing host) |
2023-08-11 23:43:22 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) |
2023-08-11 23:43:33 +0200 | tv | (~tv@user/tv) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
2023-08-11 23:45:05 +0200 | justsomeguy | (~justsomeg@user/justsomeguy) |
2023-08-11 23:45:44 +0200 | Pickchea | (~private@user/pickchea) (Quit: Leaving) |
2023-08-11 23:46:24 +0200 | <justsomeguy> | I'm writing out the reduction steps for foldr/scanr and foldl/scanl for practice. What's a good definition of scanl? I don't see one that's written in terms of foldl. |
2023-08-11 23:47:35 +0200 | <int-e> | > scanl (+) 0 [1..] -- this is lazy, so it can't be a foldl. you /can/ write it with foldr |
2023-08-11 23:47:37 +0200 | <lambdabot> | [0,1,3,6,10,15,21,28,36,45,55,66,78,91,105,120,136,153,171,190,210,231,253,2... |
2023-08-11 23:49:08 +0200 | <justsomeguy> | I found this definition of scanl, but it seems really weird: https://hackage.haskell.org/package/base-4.18.0.0/docs/src/GHC.List.html#scanl |
2023-08-11 23:49:38 +0200 | <justsomeguy> | I guess I just expected scanl to be implemented in terms of foldl. |
2023-08-11 23:49:38 +0200 | <int-e> | > foldr (\x xs a -> a : xs (x + a)) (:[]) [1..] 0 |
2023-08-11 23:49:40 +0200 | <lambdabot> | [0,1,3,6,10,15,21,28,36,45,55,66,78,91,105,120,136,153,171,190,210,231,253,2... |
2023-08-11 23:51:55 +0200 | <monochrom> | scanl is not in terms of foldl |
2023-08-11 23:52:14 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
2023-08-11 23:53:02 +0200 | <int-e> | > let scanl f a0 xs = foldr (\x xs a -> a : xs (f a x)) (:[]) xs a0 in scanl (+) 0 [1..] |
2023-08-11 23:53:04 +0200 | <lambdabot> | [0,1,3,6,10,15,21,28,36,45,55,66,78,91,105,120,136,153,171,190,210,231,253,2... |
2023-08-11 23:53:11 +0200 | <int-e> | (always a fun exercise) |
2023-08-11 23:53:18 +0200 | img | (~img@user/img) (Quit: ZNC 1.8.2 - https://znc.in) |
2023-08-11 23:53:40 +0200 | codaraxis__ | (~codaraxis@user/codaraxis) |
2023-08-11 23:53:51 +0200 | <int-e> | justsomeguy: you could just pretend that `scanlGo` is the actual definition of `scanl`. |
2023-08-11 23:54:18 +0200 | img | (~img@user/img) |
2023-08-11 23:54:38 +0200 | <int-e> | The indirection is for internal GHC reasons, having to do with how list fusion works. |
2023-08-11 23:54:41 +0200 | <int-e> | @src scanl |
2023-08-11 23:54:41 +0200 | <lambdabot> | scanl f q ls = q : case ls of |
2023-08-11 23:54:42 +0200 | <lambdabot> | [] -> [] |
2023-08-11 23:54:42 +0200 | <lambdabot> | x:xs -> scanl f (f q x) xs |
2023-08-11 23:55:39 +0200 | sm | (~sm@plaintextaccounting/sm) |
2023-08-11 23:55:57 +0200 | codaraxis | (~codaraxis@user/codaraxis) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
2023-08-11 23:56:16 +0200 | <justsomeguy> | That does look easier to write on paper :D |
2023-08-11 23:56:27 +0200 | <EvanR> | justsomeguy, your thing about scanl being implemented with foldl is a great excuse to do an investigation into what foldl and foldr "really do" |
2023-08-11 23:57:23 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) |
2023-08-11 23:57:24 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@116-255-1-151.ip4.superloop.au) (Changing host) |
2023-08-11 23:57:24 +0200 | dibblego | (~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) |
2023-08-11 23:57:28 +0200 | <EvanR> | with the intended goal to see why that can't be done and makes no sense |
2023-08-11 23:58:03 +0200 | <justsomeguy> | That's a good point, EvanR. Thank you for bringing that up. |
2023-08-11 23:58:07 +0200 | <EvanR> | bonus points for figuring out a plausible story for why they're named the way they are |
2023-08-11 23:58:29 +0200 | tromp | (~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) |
2023-08-11 23:58:47 +0200 | <monochrom> | That one would be historical reasons and back when people had only thought of lists. |
2023-08-11 23:59:40 +0200 | <EvanR> | @src scanr |
2023-08-11 23:59:40 +0200 | <lambdabot> | scanr _ q0 [] = [q0] |
2023-08-11 23:59:40 +0200 | <lambdabot> | scanr f q0 (x:xs) = f x q : qs |
2023-08-11 23:59:40 +0200 | <lambdabot> | where qs@(q:_) = scanr f q0 xs |
2023-08-11 23:59:54 +0200 | <int-e> | monochrom: it still makes sense for foldables |