IRCBrowse

2023/07/14

2023-07-14 00:02:47 +0200YuutaW(~YuutaW@2404:f4c0:f9c3:502::100:17b7) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2023-07-14 00:02:47 +0200gmg(~user@user/gehmehgeh) (Quit: Leaving)
2023-07-14 00:03:08 +0200jpds(~jpds@gateway/tor-sasl/jpds) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 00:04:37 +0200YuutaW(~YuutaW@2404:f4c0:f9c3:502::100:17b7)
2023-07-14 00:06:40 +0200dcoutts(~duncan@195.80.64.243) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 00:09:35 +0200Noinia(~Frank@77-162-168-71.fixed.kpn.net) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-07-14 00:09:35 +0200wroathe(~wroathe@user/wroathe) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-07-14 00:09:35 +0200ddellacosta(~ddellacos@146.70.165.140) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-07-14 00:14:11 +0200nick4(~nick@2600:8807:9144:2e00:1de:2bc9:a973:53c9) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 00:14:11 +0200dcoutts_(~duncan@195.80.64.243)
2023-07-14 00:14:11 +0200wagle_wagle
2023-07-14 00:14:11 +0200arahael_(~arahael@124-149-31-4.dyn.iinet.net.au)
2023-07-14 00:14:11 +0200Noinia(~Frank@77-162-168-71.fixed.kpn.net)
2023-07-14 00:14:12 +0200wroathe(~wroathe@user/wroathe)
2023-07-14 00:14:12 +0200ddellacosta(~ddellacos@146.70.165.140)
2023-07-14 00:14:12 +0200 <yin> welp guess i'll pass on void for now
2023-07-14 00:14:12 +0200arahael_(~arahael@124-149-31-4.dyn.iinet.net.au) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 00:16:04 +0200thegeekinside(~thegeekin@189.217.90.138)
2023-07-14 00:22:10 +0200Aleksejs(~Aleksejs@107.170.21.106) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-07-14 00:22:16 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl)
2023-07-14 00:22:51 +0200Aleksejs(~Aleksejs@107.170.21.106)
2023-07-14 00:23:44 +0200merijn(~merijn@088-129-128-083.dynamic.caiway.nl)
2023-07-14 00:23:54 +0200CiaoSen(~Jura@2a05:5800:295:7d00:664b:f0ff:fe37:9ef)
2023-07-14 00:25:22 +0200acidjnk(~acidjnk@p200300d6e7072f18d1756600c61e2eb6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 00:28:46 +0200merijn(~merijn@088-129-128-083.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-07-14 00:30:40 +0200arahael_(~arahael@124-149-31-4.dyn.iinet.net.au)
2023-07-14 00:31:10 +0200nick4(~nick@2600:100d:b14c:edbb:4cc2:d98d:24ee:66dd)
2023-07-14 00:34:45 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2023-07-14 00:36:56 +0200arahael_(~arahael@124-149-31-4.dyn.iinet.net.au) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 00:37:24 +0200dmgk(~dmgk@user/dmgk)
2023-07-14 00:39:12 +0200nick4(~nick@2600:100d:b14c:edbb:4cc2:d98d:24ee:66dd) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 00:39:13 +0200arahael_(~arahael@124-149-31-4.dyn.iinet.net.au)
2023-07-14 00:44:16 +0200arahael_(~arahael@124-149-31-4.dyn.iinet.net.au) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 00:49:14 +0200wroathe(~wroathe@user/wroathe) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2023-07-14 00:49:15 +0200ft(~ft@p3e9bc835.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 00:50:46 +0200ft(~ft@p3e9bc835.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
2023-07-14 00:51:55 +0200Inst_(~Inst@2601:6c4:4081:2fc0:dd33:627c:a196:edc4) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2023-07-14 00:53:48 +0200[itchyjunk](~itchyjunk@user/itchyjunk/x-7353470)
2023-07-14 00:54:55 +0200jmdaemon(~jmdaemon@user/jmdaemon) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2023-07-14 00:55:13 +0200nick4(~nick@50.86.118.19)
2023-07-14 00:55:46 +0200kimjetwav(~user@2607:fea8:235e:b600:e655:bdac:14d2:fa34)
2023-07-14 00:56:13 +0200sm[i](~sm@024-165-041-186.res.spectrum.com) (Quit: sm[i])
2023-07-14 01:02:59 +0200bontaq(~user@ool-45779b84.dyn.optonline.net)
2023-07-14 01:04:45 +0200arahael_(~arahael@124-149-31-4.dyn.iinet.net.au)
2023-07-14 01:04:57 +0200nick2(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3)
2023-07-14 01:07:04 +0200nick4(~nick@50.86.118.19) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 01:09:50 +0200arahael_(~arahael@124-149-31-4.dyn.iinet.net.au) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-07-14 01:12:12 +0200mei(~mei@user/mei) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 01:13:48 +0200off^(~cd@24.125.210.85) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 01:17:25 +0200mei(~mei@user/mei)
2023-07-14 01:20:18 +0200Tuplanolla(~Tuplanoll@91-159-68-236.elisa-laajakaista.fi) (Quit: Leaving.)
2023-07-14 01:21:00 +0200nick2(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 01:21:41 +0200Claro(~claro@user/Claro) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 01:24:11 +0200CiaoSen(~Jura@2a05:5800:295:7d00:664b:f0ff:fe37:9ef) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 01:24:34 +0200oo_miguel(~Thunderbi@78-11-179-96.static.ip.netia.com.pl) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2023-07-14 01:26:57 +0200buckwheat(~buckwheat@209.122.211.192)
2023-07-14 01:30:03 +0200Claro(~claro@45.84.139.156)
2023-07-14 01:30:06 +0200Claro(~claro@45.84.139.156) (Changing host)
2023-07-14 01:30:06 +0200Claro(~claro@user/Claro)
2023-07-14 01:30:07 +0200zeenk(~zeenk@2a02:2f04:a00b:1800::7fe) (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
2023-07-14 01:30:10 +0200Claro(~claro@user/Claro) (Client Quit)
2023-07-14 01:30:27 +0200fweht(uid404746@id-404746.lymington.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
2023-07-14 01:30:45 +0200Claro(~claro@45.84.139.156)
2023-07-14 01:30:45 +0200Claro(~claro@45.84.139.156) (Changing host)
2023-07-14 01:30:45 +0200Claro(~claro@user/Claro)
2023-07-14 01:34:25 +0200mechap(~mechap@user/mechap) (Quit: WeeChat 4.0.2)
2023-07-14 01:38:55 +0200oo_miguel(~Thunderbi@78-11-179-96.static.ip.netia.com.pl)
2023-07-14 01:39:10 +0200arahael_(~arahael@124-149-31-4.dyn.iinet.net.au)
2023-07-14 01:40:28 +0200dsrt^(~cd@24.125.210.85)
2023-07-14 01:43:45 +0200mauke_(~mauke@user/mauke)
2023-07-14 01:43:56 +0200arahael_(~arahael@124-149-31-4.dyn.iinet.net.au) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-07-14 01:44:55 +0200jmd_(~jmdaemon@user/jmdaemon)
2023-07-14 01:45:24 +0200mauke(~mauke@user/mauke) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-07-14 01:45:24 +0200mauke_mauke
2023-07-14 01:46:40 +0200nick2(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3)
2023-07-14 01:47:51 +0200mechap(~mechap@user/mechap)
2023-07-14 01:51:08 +0200nick2(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 01:51:12 +0200tcard_(~tcard@2400:4051:5801:7500:cf17:befc:ff82:5303) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 01:51:29 +0200tcard_(~tcard@2400:4051:5801:7500:cf17:befc:ff82:5303)
2023-07-14 01:54:01 +0200oo_miguel(~Thunderbi@78-11-179-96.static.ip.netia.com.pl) (Quit: oo_miguel)
2023-07-14 01:57:47 +0200sm[i](~sm@024-165-041-186.res.spectrum.com)
2023-07-14 02:09:35 +0200boxscape_(~boxscape_@81.191.27.107) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2023-07-14 02:10:12 +0200tzh_(~tzh@c-24-21-73-154.hsd1.or.comcast.net)
2023-07-14 02:12:35 +0200tzh(~tzh@c-24-21-73-154.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2023-07-14 02:13:03 +0200arahael_(~arahael@124-149-31-4.dyn.iinet.net.au)
2023-07-14 02:14:43 +0200dsrt^(~cd@24.125.210.85) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 02:16:02 +0200wroathe(~wroathe@207-153-38-140.fttp.usinternet.com)
2023-07-14 02:16:02 +0200wroathe(~wroathe@207-153-38-140.fttp.usinternet.com) (Changing host)
2023-07-14 02:16:02 +0200wroathe(~wroathe@user/wroathe)
2023-07-14 02:16:50 +0200wagle(~wagle@quassel.wagle.io) (Quit: http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.)
2023-07-14 02:16:50 +0200ryanbooker(uid4340@id-4340.hampstead.irccloud.com)
2023-07-14 02:17:41 +0200wagle(~wagle@quassel.wagle.io)
2023-07-14 02:18:38 +0200arahael_(~arahael@124-149-31-4.dyn.iinet.net.au) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 02:19:52 +0200nick2(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3)
2023-07-14 02:20:11 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 02:20:30 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 02:21:35 +0200falafel(~falafel@2603-7000-a700-8710-f0a4-a73f-8e9b-67cd.res6.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2023-07-14 02:21:48 +0200phma_phma
2023-07-14 02:24:07 +0200nick2(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 02:26:22 +0200arahael_(~arahael@124-149-31-4.dyn.iinet.net.au)
2023-07-14 02:35:12 +0200arahael_(~arahael@124-149-31-4.dyn.iinet.net.au) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2023-07-14 02:40:08 +0200machinedgod(~machinedg@d198-53-218-113.abhsia.telus.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 02:40:26 +0200bramhaag(~bramhaag@134.195.121.39) (Quit: The Lounge - https://thelounge.chat)
2023-07-14 02:42:25 +0200bramhaag(~bramhaag@134.195.121.39)
2023-07-14 02:43:40 +0200thegeekinside(~thegeekin@189.217.90.138) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-07-14 02:48:20 +0200eggplantade(~Eggplanta@2600:1700:38c5:d800:6cd6:b2b2:8eef:d429)
2023-07-14 02:48:21 +0200thegeekinside(~thegeekin@189.217.90.138)
2023-07-14 02:48:24 +0200nick2(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3)
2023-07-14 02:52:08 +0200jmd_(~jmdaemon@user/jmdaemon) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-07-14 02:52:27 +0200eggplantade(~Eggplanta@2600:1700:38c5:d800:6cd6:b2b2:8eef:d429) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 02:53:28 +0200nick2(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 02:55:25 +0200wagle(~wagle@quassel.wagle.io) (Quit: http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.)
2023-07-14 02:55:44 +0200Sgeo(~Sgeo@user/sgeo) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-07-14 02:57:31 +0200buckwheat(~buckwheat@209.122.211.192) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 02:57:39 +0200dsrt^(~cd@24.125.210.85)
2023-07-14 02:58:20 +0200son0p(~ff@181.136.122.143) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 02:59:44 +0200sweater(~sweater@206.81.18.26) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 03:00:05 +0200user___(~user@162.255.84.96) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 03:00:06 +0200shryke(~shryke@2a00:4b00:13c:cc:b27b:25ff:fe18:efd) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 03:00:06 +0200robbert-vdh(~robbert@robbertvanderhelm.nl) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 03:01:08 +0200user___(~user@162.255.84.96)
2023-07-14 03:01:35 +0200shryke(~shryke@2a00:4b00:13c:cc:b27b:25ff:fe18:efd)
2023-07-14 03:03:07 +0200nick2(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3)
2023-07-14 03:04:45 +0200econo_(uid147250@id-147250.tinside.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
2023-07-14 03:05:15 +0200Sgeo(~Sgeo@user/sgeo)
2023-07-14 03:05:54 +0200Sgeo(~Sgeo@user/sgeo) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-07-14 03:06:03 +0200wagle(~wagle@quassel.wagle.io)
2023-07-14 03:06:42 +0200sweater(~sweater@206.81.18.26)
2023-07-14 03:06:43 +0200asivitz(uid178348@id-178348.tinside.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
2023-07-14 03:06:58 +0200gnalzo(~gnalzo@2a01:e0a:498:fd50:fcc6:bb5d:489a:ce8c) (Quit: WeeChat 4.0.1)
2023-07-14 03:07:43 +0200robbert-vdh(~robbert@robbertvanderhelm.nl)
2023-07-14 03:09:50 +0200razetime(~quassel@117.193.5.125)
2023-07-14 03:10:49 +0200albet70(~xxx@2400:8902::f03c:92ff:fe60:98d8) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 03:13:05 +0200rselim(ce261f06ff@2604:bf00:561:2000::257) (Changing host)
2023-07-14 03:13:05 +0200rselim(ce261f06ff@user/milesrout)
2023-07-14 03:13:36 +0200jmdaemon(~jmdaemon@user/jmdaemon)
2023-07-14 03:16:57 +0200albet70(~xxx@2400:8902::f03c:92ff:fe60:98d8)
2023-07-14 03:17:08 +0200jespada(~jespada@cpc121308-nmal25-2-0-cust15.19-2.cable.virginm.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 03:20:20 +0200phma(phma@2001:5b0:211f:7128:594e:98f8:7c9e:d433) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-07-14 03:20:49 +0200phma(~phma@host-67-44-208-125.hnremote.net)
2023-07-14 03:26:34 +0200bilegeek(~bilegeek@2600:1008:b047:918a:b8d8:907:6be9:390e)
2023-07-14 03:38:22 +0200buckwheat(~buckwheat@209.122.211.192)
2023-07-14 03:41:48 +0200sm[i](~sm@024-165-041-186.res.spectrum.com) (Quit: sm[i])
2023-07-14 03:42:48 +0200buckwheat(~buckwheat@209.122.211.192) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2023-07-14 03:47:56 +0200razetime(~quassel@117.193.5.125) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 03:47:58 +0200razetime_(~quassel@117.193.5.223)
2023-07-14 03:50:47 +0200xff0x_(~xff0x@ai086045.d.east.v6connect.net) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 03:52:29 +0200machinedgod(~machinedg@d198-53-218-113.abhsia.telus.net)
2023-07-14 03:52:52 +0200xff0x_(~xff0x@178.255.149.135)
2023-07-14 03:54:32 +0200falafel(~falafel@2603-7000-a700-8710-99ea-6875-913a-634e.res6.spectrum.com)
2023-07-14 03:56:30 +0200phma(~phma@host-67-44-208-125.hnremote.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-07-14 03:56:58 +0200phma(phma@2001:5b0:211f:7128:594e:98f8:7c9e:d433)
2023-07-14 03:59:26 +0200doyougnu(~doyougnu@45.46.170.68) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 04:00:07 +0200merijn(~merijn@088-129-128-083.dynamic.caiway.nl)
2023-07-14 04:01:53 +0200hdggxin(~hdggxin@122.175.41.19) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 04:04:50 +0200merijn(~merijn@088-129-128-083.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 04:08:50 +0200xff0x_(~xff0x@178.255.149.135) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 04:09:32 +0200td_(~td@i5387091F.versanet.de) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 04:10:16 +0200xff0x_(~xff0x@2405:6580:b080:900:4b46:1f06:e600:57cc)
2023-07-14 04:11:40 +0200td_(~td@i5387091B.versanet.de)
2023-07-14 04:12:11 +0200nick2(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 04:16:27 +0200ezzieyguywuf(~Unknown@user/ezzieyguywuf) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 04:16:34 +0200nate2(~nate@c-98-45-169-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
2023-07-14 04:16:51 +0200nick2(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3)
2023-07-14 04:17:24 +0200hdggxin(~hdggxin@122.175.41.19)
2023-07-14 04:27:57 +0200 <jackdk> A colleague just asked me if there's a connection between `parse . print = Just` roundtripping and adjunctions, and I don't know enough CT to answer. It smells like it should, and the `unit :: a -> u (f a)` from package `adjunctions` looks like a thing, but can anyone here say something more solid about it?
2023-07-14 04:28:59 +0200razetime_(~quassel@117.193.5.223) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 04:29:14 +0200razetime(~quassel@117.193.1.250)
2023-07-14 04:37:58 +0200razetime(~quassel@117.193.1.250) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 04:38:22 +0200razetime(~quassel@117.193.7.148)
2023-07-14 04:40:43 +0200thegeekinside(~thegeekin@189.217.90.138) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-07-14 04:44:46 +0200razetime(~quassel@117.193.7.148) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2023-07-14 04:45:37 +0200thegeekinside(~thegeekin@189.217.90.138)
2023-07-14 04:46:28 +0200razetime(~quassel@117.193.5.248)
2023-07-14 04:52:24 +0200wroathe(~wroathe@user/wroathe) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-07-14 04:52:32 +0200machinedgod(~machinedg@d198-53-218-113.abhsia.telus.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 04:57:24 +0200finn_elija(~finn_elij@user/finn-elija/x-0085643)
2023-07-14 04:57:25 +0200FinnElija(~finn_elij@user/finn-elija/x-0085643) (Killed (NickServ (Forcing logout FinnElija -> finn_elija)))
2023-07-14 04:57:25 +0200finn_elijaFinnElija
2023-07-14 05:00:04 +0200merijn(~merijn@088-129-128-083.dynamic.caiway.nl)
2023-07-14 05:00:19 +0200eggplantade(~Eggplanta@2600:1700:38c5:d800:6cd6:b2b2:8eef:d429)
2023-07-14 05:05:14 +0200merijn(~merijn@088-129-128-083.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-07-14 05:07:18 +0200son0p(~ff@181.136.122.143)
2023-07-14 05:11:02 +0200ddellacosta(~ddellacos@146.70.165.140) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2023-07-14 05:16:56 +0200[itchyjunk](~itchyjunk@user/itchyjunk/x-7353470) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 05:18:41 +0200nate2(~nate@c-98-45-169-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 05:20:47 +0200razetime(~quassel@117.193.5.248) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 05:21:44 +0200razetime(~quassel@117.193.0.225)
2023-07-14 05:23:23 +0200ddellacosta(~ddellacos@146.70.166.140)
2023-07-14 05:25:28 +0200nick2(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 05:26:37 +0200ryanbooker(uid4340@id-4340.hampstead.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
2023-07-14 05:26:44 +0200thegeekinside(~thegeekin@189.217.90.138) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-07-14 05:27:02 +0200xff0x_(~xff0x@2405:6580:b080:900:4b46:1f06:e600:57cc) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 05:27:25 +0200xff0x_(~xff0x@ai086045.d.east.v6connect.net)
2023-07-14 05:29:23 +0200mxs(~mxs@user/mxs) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2023-07-14 05:29:45 +0200Inst_(~Inst@2601:6c4:4081:2fc0:25dd:4a6c:9344:e183)
2023-07-14 05:32:02 +0200razetime(~quassel@117.193.0.225) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 05:32:37 +0200razetime(~quassel@117.193.0.119)
2023-07-14 05:34:55 +0200Psybur(~Psybur@c-76-123-45-25.hsd1.va.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2023-07-14 05:36:33 +0200aforemny_(~aforemny@2001:9e8:6cd3:fb00:3e3b:718b:2209:2cf8)
2023-07-14 05:37:27 +0200aforemny(~aforemny@i59F516E4.versanet.de) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 05:38:06 +0200nick2(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3)
2023-07-14 05:42:34 +0200nick2(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 05:45:22 +0200wroathe(~wroathe@207-153-38-140.fttp.usinternet.com)
2023-07-14 05:45:23 +0200wroathe(~wroathe@207-153-38-140.fttp.usinternet.com) (Changing host)
2023-07-14 05:45:23 +0200wroathe(~wroathe@user/wroathe)
2023-07-14 05:50:26 +0200razetime(~quassel@117.193.0.119) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 05:52:11 +0200mxs(~mxs@user/mxs)
2023-07-14 05:52:19 +0200razetime(~quassel@117.193.7.234)
2023-07-14 05:54:32 +0200sm[i](~sm@024-165-041-186.res.spectrum.com)
2023-07-14 05:55:03 +0200ezzieyguywuf(~Unknown@user/ezzieyguywuf)
2023-07-14 05:55:16 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3)
2023-07-14 05:58:38 +0200Inst_(~Inst@2601:6c4:4081:2fc0:25dd:4a6c:9344:e183) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 05:58:59 +0200Inst_(~Inst@2601:6c4:4081:2fc0:25dd:4a6c:9344:e183)
2023-07-14 06:00:22 +0200ezzieyguywuf(~Unknown@user/ezzieyguywuf) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 06:04:28 +0200ezzieygu1wuf(~Unknown@user/ezzieyguywuf)
2023-07-14 06:07:54 +0200bontaq(~user@ool-45779b84.dyn.optonline.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 06:09:43 +0200buckwheat(~buckwheat@209.122.211.192)
2023-07-14 06:09:50 +0200_ht(~Thunderbi@28-52-174-82.ftth.glasoperator.nl)
2023-07-14 06:13:17 +0200razetime(~quassel@117.193.7.234) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 06:15:26 +0200bitdex(~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex)
2023-07-14 06:15:30 +0200buckwheat(~buckwheat@209.122.211.192) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 06:17:28 +0200ezzieygu1wuf(~Unknown@user/ezzieyguywuf) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 06:21:03 +0200monochrom(trebla@216.138.220.146) (Quit: NO CARRIER)
2023-07-14 06:21:17 +0200ezzieygu1wuf(~Unknown@user/ezzieyguywuf)
2023-07-14 06:22:36 +0200foul_owl(~kerry@193.29.61.81) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-07-14 06:25:11 +0200shapr(~user@2600:1700:c640:3100:8173:1c9d:ab8d:9a27) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2023-07-14 06:27:20 +0200thegeekinside(~thegeekin@189.217.90.138)
2023-07-14 06:28:08 +0200monochrom(trebla@216.138.220.146)
2023-07-14 06:30:14 +0200 <Clinton[m]> If I've got the function:... (full message at <https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/99909fa3ec60c42419365daa10d875c9dc4a…>)
2023-07-14 06:30:37 +0200ezzieygu1wuf(~Unknown@user/ezzieyguywuf) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-07-14 06:34:38 +0200 <probie> Clinton[m]: No. Using `bmap` you can only get as far as `(forall a. f a -> m (g a)) -> b f -> (b (Compose m g))`. If you're using barbies (which I'm guessing from `bmap`), look at `btraverse` and `TraversableB`
2023-07-14 06:34:38 +0200wroathe(~wroathe@user/wroathe) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 06:35:26 +0200foul_owl(~kerry@71.212.137.212)
2023-07-14 06:35:45 +0200notzmv(~zmv@user/notzmv) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 06:37:11 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 06:38:49 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 06:43:08 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 06:43:22 +0200ezzieygu1wuf(~Unknown@user/ezzieyguywuf)
2023-07-14 06:44:09 +0200ezzieygu1wufezzieyguywuf
2023-07-14 06:44:28 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 06:49:05 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 06:50:37 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 06:51:35 +0200notzmv(~zmv@user/notzmv)
2023-07-14 06:51:36 +0200falafel(~falafel@2603-7000-a700-8710-99ea-6875-913a-634e.res6.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 06:52:12 +0200razetime(~quassel@117.193.7.234)
2023-07-14 06:54:41 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 06:56:41 +0200hgolden(~hgolden@2603-8000-9d00-3ed1-7b72-5998-97ad-985d.res6.spectrum.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 06:58:45 +0200phma(phma@2001:5b0:211f:7128:594e:98f8:7c9e:d433) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-07-14 06:59:12 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 06:59:38 +0200phma(phma@2001:5b0:210d:3298:dd2c:b032:4dd7:14f9)
2023-07-14 07:00:13 +0200 <jackdk> "If I've got the function... na na na na na na na na na na na na na na ..." (apologies to Fiddler on the Roof)
2023-07-14 07:00:37 +0200hgolden(~hgolden@2603-8000-9d00-3ed1-7b72-5998-97ad-985d.res6.spectrum.com)
2023-07-14 07:06:19 +0200 <probie> You may ask, how did this tradition get started? I'll tell you... I don't know.
2023-07-14 07:07:23 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 07:10:45 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3)
2023-07-14 07:11:29 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 07:11:39 +0200misterfish(~misterfis@84-53-85-146.bbserv.nl)
2023-07-14 07:12:18 +0200califax(~califax@user/califx) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2023-07-14 07:12:59 +0200trev(~trev@user/trev)
2023-07-14 07:13:29 +0200califax(~califax@user/califx)
2023-07-14 07:15:35 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2023-07-14 07:15:46 +0200lambdabot(~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-07-14 07:17:20 +0200lambdabot(~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu)
2023-07-14 07:17:20 +0200lambdabot(~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu) (Changing host)
2023-07-14 07:17:20 +0200lambdabot(~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot)
2023-07-14 07:18:39 +0200bilegeek(~bilegeek@2600:1008:b047:918a:b8d8:907:6be9:390e) (Quit: Leaving)
2023-07-14 07:20:19 +0200Sgeo(~Sgeo@user/sgeo)
2023-07-14 07:23:17 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 07:23:27 +0200cheater(~Username@user/cheater) (Quit: Going offline, see ya! (www.adiirc.com))
2023-07-14 07:25:13 +0200frase(~Fraser@159.196.13.236)
2023-07-14 07:25:42 +0200 <frase> o/ Is there a machine-readable list or index of GHC release versions somewhere?
2023-07-14 07:25:53 +0200 <frase> Asking for a Security Response Team :)
2023-07-14 07:27:35 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 07:30:35 +0200 <probie> I don't know, but if all else fails (and you only need versions >= 7.2.1), you could always pull the latest version of ghc's repo and run `git tag -l | grep -E 'release$'`
2023-07-14 07:32:23 +0200razetime(~quassel@117.193.7.234) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 07:32:53 +0200razetime(~quassel@117.193.1.196)
2023-07-14 07:33:06 +0200 <frase> probie: that will probably be OK, if I can get the tag list via the GitLab API.
2023-07-14 07:33:09 +0200 <frase> thanks for the tip
2023-07-14 07:34:54 +0200hugo(znc@verdigris.lysator.liu.se) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 07:35:06 +0200harveypwca(~harveypwc@2601:246:c180:a570:3828:d8:e523:3f67)
2023-07-14 07:36:40 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl)
2023-07-14 07:39:52 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 07:42:56 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3)
2023-07-14 07:44:23 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 07:46:58 +0200bitdex(~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2023-07-14 07:48:02 +0200dibblego(~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-07-14 07:48:12 +0200_ht(~Thunderbi@28-52-174-82.ftth.glasoperator.nl) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 07:48:38 +0200mncheck(~mncheck@193.224.205.254)
2023-07-14 07:50:09 +0200bitdex(~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex)
2023-07-14 07:50:20 +0200dibblego(~dibblego@116-255-1-157.ip4.superloop.au)
2023-07-14 07:50:20 +0200dibblego(~dibblego@116-255-1-157.ip4.superloop.au) (Changing host)
2023-07-14 07:50:20 +0200dibblego(~dibblego@haskell/developer/dibblego)
2023-07-14 07:50:25 +0200actioninja6(~actioninj@user/actioninja) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2023-07-14 07:51:40 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2023-07-14 07:52:54 +0200califax(~califax@user/califx) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 07:53:07 +0200califax(~califax@user/califx)
2023-07-14 07:57:48 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 08:00:13 +0200CiaoSen(~Jura@2a05:5800:2dc:9500:664b:f0ff:fe37:9ef)
2023-07-14 08:01:53 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 08:04:20 +0200hugo(znc@verdigris.lysator.liu.se)
2023-07-14 08:06:46 +0200hgolden(~hgolden@2603-8000-9d00-3ed1-7b72-5998-97ad-985d.res6.spectrum.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 08:12:15 +0200arahael_(~arahael@124-149-31-4.dyn.iinet.net.au)
2023-07-14 08:12:36 +0200hgolden(~hgolden@2603-8000-9d00-3ed1-7b72-5998-97ad-985d.res6.spectrum.com)
2023-07-14 08:14:12 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 08:17:15 +0200titibandit(~titibandi@user/titibandit)
2023-07-14 08:18:20 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 08:24:38 +0200takuan(~takuan@178-116-218-225.access.telenet.be)
2023-07-14 08:24:53 +0200michalz(~michalz@185.246.207.200)
2023-07-14 08:30:45 +0200 <jackdk> frase: surely ghcup queries for such a list?
2023-07-14 08:31:01 +0200 <jackdk> Clinton[m]: did probie's suggestion get you unstuck?
2023-07-14 08:31:18 +0200neuroevolutus(~neuroevol@2001:ac8:9a:76::1e)
2023-07-14 08:31:43 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 08:32:53 +0200 <frase> jackdk: as I understand it, ghcup gets explicitly told about particular "supported" releases, rather than querying and making anything available
2023-07-14 08:33:10 +0200 <frase> i.e. after a new GHC release, GHCUp will then have to be updated to learn about it. Maybe I'm wrong, that's just the feeling I get :)
2023-07-14 08:36:32 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 08:38:27 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl)
2023-07-14 08:39:09 +0200hgolden(~hgolden@2603-8000-9d00-3ed1-7b72-5998-97ad-985d.res6.spectrum.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 08:39:57 +0200shriekingnoise(~shrieking@186.137.175.87) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 08:40:43 +0200acidjnk(~acidjnk@p200300d6e7072f84d1756600c61e2eb6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
2023-07-14 08:41:24 +0200catch22(~catch22@204.40.96.58.static.exetel.com.au)
2023-07-14 08:42:09 +0200Guest9190(~finn@rul16-h01-176-151-21-224.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr)
2023-07-14 08:47:08 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 08:47:57 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 08:48:55 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:c964:29bb:a87f:706d:368f)
2023-07-14 08:52:02 +0200 <frase> jackdk: yeah, GHCUp uses curated metadata from the haskell/ghcup-metadata repo: https://github.com/haskell/ghcup-metadata/blob/develop/ghcup-0.0.7.yaml
2023-07-14 08:52:17 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 08:55:24 +0200hgolden(~hgolden@2603-8000-9d00-3ed1-7b72-5998-97ad-985d.res6.spectrum.com)
2023-07-14 08:56:22 +0200misterfish(~misterfis@84-53-85-146.bbserv.nl) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 08:57:29 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:c964:29bb:a87f:706d:368f) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 08:58:00 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 08:58:36 +0200neuroevolutus(~neuroevol@2001:ac8:9a:76::1e) (Quit: Client closed)
2023-07-14 08:59:18 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3)
2023-07-14 08:59:36 +0200waleee(~waleee@2001:9b0:21c:4000:5bf9:6515:c030:57b7) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 09:00:01 +0200waleee(~waleee@h-176-10-137-138.NA.cust.bahnhof.se)
2023-07-14 09:02:42 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 09:03:44 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 09:05:06 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 09:05:59 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@ip4d14fda4.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de)
2023-07-14 09:08:07 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@ip4d14fda4.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 09:08:25 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 09:09:26 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 09:10:23 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3)
2023-07-14 09:11:12 +0200Unicorn_Princess(~Unicorn_P@user/Unicorn-Princess/x-3540542) (Quit: Leaving)
2023-07-14 09:11:48 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 09:12:51 +0200sagax(~sagax_nb@user/sagax)
2023-07-14 09:13:15 +0200 <arahael_> I'm re-reading about monads. (Some much, much needed "revision", really). And the haskell wiki mentions this about Monads:
2023-07-14 09:13:20 +0200 <arahael_> The sequence function takes a list of monadic computations, executes each one in turn and returns a list of the results. If any of the computations fail, then the whole function fails:
2023-07-14 09:13:25 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 09:13:54 +0200 <arahael_> My question is: Are monads really inherently a "computation"? What's the "computation" involved with say, a single Maybe monad?
2023-07-14 09:15:28 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 09:15:30 +0200 <eggplantade> It decides whether the monad has zero or one values and what the one value is
2023-07-14 09:15:55 +0200 <arahael_> So it only works for MonadPlsu?
2023-07-14 09:15:58 +0200 <arahael_> *MonadPlus?
2023-07-14 09:16:03 +0200nate2(~nate@c-98-45-169-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
2023-07-14 09:16:58 +0200 <eggplantade> Not necessarily
2023-07-14 09:17:33 +0200 <arahael_> I mean, I can mechanically figure out what is happening with the sequence function it gives as an advantage, what I'm strugglign with is the language: Why does it describe it as applying a list of *computations*?
2023-07-14 09:17:53 +0200 <eggplantade> Saying that monads are computations is an analogy. There's always an interpretation of "monad" that makes it true, but that interpretation isn't always useful.
2023-07-14 09:18:43 +0200 <arahael_> Ah, so it could be a list of computations, if the monad you're using just happens to be a computation, and it was trying to describe it like that to make it easier to think of? So eg, if it was an IO monad that makes sense I guess.
2023-07-14 09:18:47 +0200hgolden(~hgolden@2603-8000-9d00-3ed1-7b72-5998-97ad-985d.res6.spectrum.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 09:18:58 +0200 <Hecate> arahael_: the thing with monads (a vast majority of them) is sequentiality
2023-07-14 09:19:33 +0200 <Hecate> that's a way to make two things depend on one another, and more specifically on the value they produce
2023-07-14 09:19:46 +0200 <Hecate> and what produces values? a computation :)
2023-07-14 09:19:47 +0200 <arahael_> Hecate: But they aren't inherently a computation of their own?
2023-07-14 09:20:01 +0200 <Rembane> It becomes syntactically obvious if written out with many bind (>>=) operators.
2023-07-14 09:20:27 +0200 <arahael_> Oooh, I see. So you can think of them as "This monad produces a value depending on the value that's put into it"?
2023-07-14 09:20:28 +0200 <Hecate> arahael_: they are by virtue of producing something that the next function has to wait on
2023-07-14 09:20:48 +0200nate2(~nate@c-98-45-169-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2023-07-14 09:20:56 +0200 <arahael_> Hecate: I was trying to figure out what the stored computation of the following list of computations were: [Just 42]
2023-07-14 09:21:37 +0200 <Hecate> arahael_: there is no bind / >>= involved :p
2023-07-14 09:21:42 +0200 <Hecate> so, no monad
2023-07-14 09:21:51 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 09:21:59 +0200 <eggplantade> It's still a monad when it just has return, like in this case
2023-07-14 09:22:12 +0200 <arahael_> Hecate: Pretty sure :t will state that there is categorically a monad there.
2023-07-14 09:22:17 +0200 <Rembane> A boring monad. :D
2023-07-14 09:22:18 +0200 <Maxdamantus> I think the use of the term "computation" is to avoid calling the `m a` value a "monad", since that's inaccurate.
2023-07-14 09:22:47 +0200 <arahael_> Maxdamantus: Oooh, why is that incorrect if 'm' has been defined to be a Monad type?
2023-07-14 09:22:57 +0200 <eggplantade> And it's still a computation, just a trivial one. The computation provides the value that was put into it.
2023-07-14 09:23:05 +0200 <Maxdamantus> they just need some term to generically describe the `m a` values, eg, `IO String` or `Maybe Int`
2023-07-14 09:23:11 +0200 <Hecate> arahael_: the interface necessary for calling bind has been implemented (that's what :t would tell you) but you don't make use of it :'D
2023-07-14 09:23:33 +0200 <Maxdamantus> arahael_: because the monad is really the implementation of the `Monad m` interface.
2023-07-14 09:23:33 +0200 <arahael_> eggplantade: Makes sense. :D
2023-07-14 09:24:19 +0200 <eggplantade> May be more helpful to look at the difference when you put `undefined` in place of part of it
2023-07-14 09:24:28 +0200 <Maxdamantus> arahael_: `Just 4` is not a monad. The relevant monad is the one defined using `instance Monad Maybe ...`
2023-07-14 09:24:55 +0200 <eggplantade> It's a value of that monadic type, to be precise
2023-07-14 09:25:05 +0200 <arahael_> Maxdamantus: This is the type definition of the 'sequence' function that the original statement I'm asking about is applied against: sequence :: Monad m => [m a] -> m [a]
2023-07-14 09:25:14 +0200 <arahael_> That list could be empty, have only one item, or have many items.
2023-07-14 09:25:15 +0200 <Hecate> yeah, let's use some terminology here: values are, computations do
2023-07-14 09:25:26 +0200Sgeo(~Sgeo@user/sgeo) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-07-14 09:25:26 +0200 <Hecate> Just 4 is a monadic value, it doesn't do much
2023-07-14 09:25:48 +0200 <Maxdamantus> Well, I think that's what is meant by "computation" in the Haskell wiki.
2023-07-14 09:25:53 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 09:25:59 +0200 <Hecate> when you use bind / >>= / do-notation, several computations are waiting on each-other in order to execute
2023-07-14 09:25:59 +0200 <Maxdamantus> "monadic value" = "computation"
2023-07-14 09:26:10 +0200 <arahael_> Hecate: That makes sense, so these would be a a list of monad values, and `sequence` applies the monadic computations for those values, in sequence?
2023-07-14 09:26:49 +0200 <Hecate> let me see the definition of sequence again
2023-07-14 09:27:04 +0200 <arahael_> > The sequence function takes a list of monadic computations, executes each one in turn and returns a list of the results. If any of the computations fail, then the whole function fails:
2023-07-14 09:27:05 +0200 <lambdabot> <hint>:1:36: error: parse error on input ‘of’
2023-07-14 09:27:30 +0200 <Hecate> yeah it's a foldr for lists
2023-07-14 09:27:45 +0200 <arahael_> https://wiki.haskell.org/All_About_Monads#The_sequencing_functions
2023-07-14 09:28:04 +0200 <Maxdamantus> imo calling them "computations" is more precise, since "monadic value" is also a potentially misleading term.
2023-07-14 09:28:05 +0200hgolden(~hgolden@2603-8000-9d00-3ed1-7b72-5998-97ad-985d.res6.spectrum.com)
2023-07-14 09:28:21 +0200 <arahael_> Maxdamantus: That's precisely the insight I'm trying to understand.
2023-07-14 09:28:29 +0200 <Maxdamantus> although it doesn't really work in Haskell, the values could be independent of any particular monad.
2023-07-14 09:28:46 +0200 <arahael_> Ah, and I'm only concerned about Haskell in this case...
2023-07-14 09:29:04 +0200 <Maxdamantus> eg, you could conceptually have an "identity" monad, where every value is already a computation.
2023-07-14 09:29:55 +0200 <Maxdamantus> (again, this doesn't really work in Haskell due to the way type classes work .. or at least, it doesn't work when thinking about the standard `Monad` type class)
2023-07-14 09:30:22 +0200 <arahael_> So where are they getting that concept from? Category theory?
2023-07-14 09:33:02 +0200hgolden(~hgolden@2603-8000-9d00-3ed1-7b72-5998-97ad-985d.res6.spectrum.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 09:33:29 +0200 <eggplantade> So to think of the list monad as a computation, consider `primes :: [Integer]` that computes the prime numbers in order
2023-07-14 09:33:29 +0200 <Maxdamantus> possibly. I've never quite understood how things fit together in category theory, but you can always take the Haskell `Monad` type class and imagine it as an interface in basically any programming language (though depending on the language, you might have to break some rules).
2023-07-14 09:34:01 +0200 <eggplantade> Given a reasonable implementation of `primes, you can take values from the list as much as you want until the computer runs out of memory
2023-07-14 09:34:26 +0200 <eggplantade> as you take more values, you're making it work with bigger numbers and it will slow down
2023-07-14 09:34:44 +0200 <eggplantade> But you don't have to take all the values. You can take just a few. And it will only compute those few numbers.
2023-07-14 09:35:08 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 09:37:19 +0200titiband1t(~titibandi@user/titibandit)
2023-07-14 09:37:24 +0200 <Maxdamantus> eg, here's the interface expressed in Java: interface Monad<M> { <A> M<A> unit(A v); <A, B> M<B> bind(M<A> a, Function<A, B> fn); }
2023-07-14 09:37:47 +0200 <Maxdamantus> then if you provide an implementation of `Monad<List>`, that would be a `List` monad.
2023-07-14 09:37:48 +0200 <arahael_> I think the trouble I had was both in thinking that the list contained *distinct* computations - I think it's probably more correct for me to say that the whole list defines a computation, it's only going to be using the one monad instance to run it anyway.
2023-07-14 09:38:13 +0200 <arahael_> Effectively 'sequence' runs a program.
2023-07-14 09:38:25 +0200phma_(~phma@host-67-44-208-224.hnremote.net)
2023-07-14 09:39:04 +0200 <eggplantade> Ah, `sequence` does some specific kind of computation using the monad operations. It doesn't "run" a monad.
2023-07-14 09:39:14 +0200 <Maxdamantus> (the Java interface is not quite valid Java, since `M` is meant to be a type-level function rather than a type, and Java only allows types as type parameters)
2023-07-14 09:39:47 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2023-07-14 09:40:41 +0200phma(phma@2001:5b0:210d:3298:dd2c:b032:4dd7:14f9) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 09:40:54 +0200 <Maxdamantus> arahael_: no, they are distinct computations.
2023-07-14 09:41:18 +0200 <Maxdamantus> arahael_: an `m a` value is a computation. "computation" is just a generic term that is used for all monads.
2023-07-14 09:41:36 +0200 <Maxdamantus> arahael_: eg, `Just 4` is considered to be a computation that would yield the value `4`
2023-07-14 09:41:41 +0200titiband1t(~titibandi@user/titibandit) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 09:43:05 +0200 <Maxdamantus> arahael_: there isn't a universal way to actually run a computation, but the monad provides the bind operation which allows you to derive one "computation" into another "computation".
2023-07-14 09:43:35 +0200 <Maxdamantus> arahael_: `sequence` makes use of that to derive multiple "computations" into another "computation".
2023-07-14 09:44:11 +0200cheater(~Username@user/cheater)
2023-07-14 09:45:25 +0200 <Maxdamantus> arahael_: eg, `[Just 4, Just 3, Just 9]` is a list of computations (3 computations, yielding 3 values). `sequence` will turn that into a single computation, particularly `Just [4, 3, 9]` (one computation, yielding one value).
2023-07-14 09:46:19 +0200 <probie> Is `3` a computation yielding `3`?
2023-07-14 09:47:15 +0200 <Maxdamantus> probie: it could be thought of that way in an identity monad, yes.
2023-07-14 09:47:33 +0200 <Maxdamantus> probie: though it doesn't really work that way in Haskell.
2023-07-14 09:48:03 +0200 <Maxdamantus> probie: Haskell's `Monad` type class always requires a distinct type constructor for each monad.
2023-07-14 09:48:48 +0200 <probie> so the only things that are computations are those which involve "monads"?
2023-07-14 09:49:16 +0200 <arahael_> Maxdamantus: I think that makes sense when I think about it more.
2023-07-14 09:49:29 +0200 <Maxdamantus> probie: yes. The things that are acceptable as the first argument to the `(>>=)` function.
2023-07-14 09:49:37 +0200 <eggplantade> probie: In this context, we are only talking about how monads are used for representing computations
2023-07-14 09:50:34 +0200thegeekinside(~thegeekin@189.217.90.138) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-07-14 09:50:35 +0200 <eggplantade> Computation can also happen without monads, but that isn't what the question was about
2023-07-14 09:50:53 +0200machinedgod(~machinedg@d198-53-218-113.abhsia.telus.net)
2023-07-14 09:51:22 +0200 <arahael_> Yeah, the question was pretty specific - just about monads being referred to as a computation.
2023-07-14 09:51:33 +0200catch22(~catch22@204.40.96.58.static.exetel.com.au) (Quit: Leaving)
2023-07-14 09:52:43 +0200zeenk(~zeenk@2a02:2f04:a00b:1800::7fe)
2023-07-14 09:53:04 +0200 <Maxdamantus> probie: in a constructor-less identity monad, you could have `return = id` and `(>>=) = map`
2023-07-14 09:53:09 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 09:53:23 +0200 <Maxdamantus> er, `(>>=) = flip map`
2023-07-14 09:53:41 +0200 <Maxdamantus> er, wait, no, that's not right.
2023-07-14 09:53:44 +0200 <probie> :t flip ($)
2023-07-14 09:53:45 +0200 <lambdabot> a -> (a -> c) -> c
2023-07-14 09:54:35 +0200 <Maxdamantus> Yeah, it should be `(>>=) = flip ($)` (or `(>>=) = flip id)`
2023-07-14 09:54:37 +0200 <Maxdamantus> )
2023-07-14 09:54:51 +0200 <Maxdamantus> :t flip id
2023-07-14 09:54:52 +0200 <lambdabot> b -> (b -> c) -> c
2023-07-14 09:57:09 +0200 <Maxdamantus> anyway, in such a monad, every value would be allowed as the first argument to `(>>=)`. do{ a <- 4; b <- 5; return (a + b) }
2023-07-14 09:57:27 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 09:57:32 +0200 <Maxdamantus> 4 >>= \a -> 5 >>= \b -> return (a + b)
2023-07-14 10:01:12 +0200adanwan(~adanwan@gateway/tor-sasl/adanwan) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 10:02:41 +0200adanwan(~adanwan@gateway/tor-sasl/adanwan)
2023-07-14 10:05:15 +0200merijn(~merijn@088-129-128-083.dynamic.caiway.nl)
2023-07-14 10:10:55 +0200misterfish(~misterfis@92-66-207-29.biz.kpn.net)
2023-07-14 10:12:56 +0200ft(~ft@p3e9bc835.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Quit: leaving)
2023-07-14 10:13:36 +0200arahael_(~arahael@124-149-31-4.dyn.iinet.net.au) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-07-14 10:13:44 +0200xff0x_(~xff0x@ai086045.d.east.v6connect.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 10:14:27 +0200Luj(~Luj@2a01:e0a:5f9:9681:3e8f:d5c0:40b7:2d50) (Quit: Ping timeout (120 seconds))
2023-07-14 10:14:33 +0200 <Profpatsch> Is there any way to write an instance without having to import the instance functions I’m defining
2023-07-14 10:14:43 +0200 <Profpatsch> import Control.Category((.)) is a bit annoying
2023-07-14 10:14:45 +0200zeenk(~zeenk@2a02:2f04:a00b:1800::7fe) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 10:14:46 +0200Luj(~Luj@2a01:e0a:5f9:9681:7c72:c188:aac9:48ed)
2023-07-14 10:15:07 +0200zeenk(~zeenk@2a02:2f04:a00b:1800::fba)
2023-07-14 10:15:25 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2023-07-14 10:16:24 +0200sm[i](~sm@024-165-041-186.res.spectrum.com) (Quit: sm[i])
2023-07-14 10:21:27 +0200 <Profpatsch> Oh, looks like I can import Control.Category qualified and it still registers
2023-07-14 10:22:34 +0200 <jackdk> Profpatsch https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/uR9oDyF3/QualifiedCategory.hs
2023-07-14 10:22:38 +0200 <jackdk> Oh, you got it
2023-07-14 10:24:31 +0200tzh_(~tzh@c-24-21-73-154.hsd1.or.comcast.net) (Quit: zzz)
2023-07-14 10:27:20 +0200Tuplanolla(~Tuplanoll@91-159-68-236.elisa-laajakaista.fi)
2023-07-14 10:27:41 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3)
2023-07-14 10:29:55 +0200razetime(~quassel@117.193.1.196) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2023-07-14 10:32:00 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 10:34:54 +0200dcoutts_(~duncan@195.80.64.243) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2023-07-14 10:36:07 +0200mixfix41(~sdeny9ee@user/mixfix41)
2023-07-14 10:36:42 +0200mrmr(~mrmr@user/mrmr) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-07-14 10:37:08 +0200mixfix41(~sdeny9ee@user/mixfix41) ()
2023-07-14 10:37:43 +0200mrmr(~mrmr@user/mrmr)
2023-07-14 10:38:56 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3)
2023-07-14 10:41:53 +0200harveypwca(~harveypwc@2601:246:c180:a570:3828:d8:e523:3f67) (Quit: Leaving)
2023-07-14 10:44:47 +0200dhil(~dhil@78.45.150.83.ewm.ftth.as8758.net)
2023-07-14 10:45:03 +0200danse-nr3(~francesco@151.37.248.218)
2023-07-14 10:45:37 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 10:45:51 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 10:46:24 +0200mei(~mei@user/mei) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 10:46:24 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 10:48:49 +0200mei(~mei@user/mei)
2023-07-14 10:48:50 +0200razetime(~quassel@117.193.1.196)
2023-07-14 10:54:44 +0200danse-nr3_(~francesco@151.37.251.36)
2023-07-14 10:56:31 +0200jespada(~jespada@cpc121308-nmal25-2-0-cust15.19-2.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 10:57:58 +0200danse-nr3(~francesco@151.37.248.218) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 10:58:17 +0200 <Profpatsch> yeah :)
2023-07-14 10:58:19 +0200 <Profpatsch> it’s a bit confusing
2023-07-14 10:58:35 +0200 <Profpatsch> I usually get it right, but when I don’t I’ve forgotten about the edge case
2023-07-14 10:59:02 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 10:59:19 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 11:02:23 +0200chele(~chele@user/chele)
2023-07-14 11:06:46 +0200lilpotent_jlemen(~lilpotent@2001:470:69fc:105::3:6eb6) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 11:07:11 +0200johnw_(~johnw@69.62.242.138) (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in)
2023-07-14 11:11:28 +0200eggplantade(~Eggplanta@2600:1700:38c5:d800:6cd6:b2b2:8eef:d429) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 11:14:27 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 11:14:58 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 11:15:14 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 11:15:45 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 11:16:30 +0200 <jade[m]> I wonder whether we could get some sort of first-class module system in the future
2023-07-14 11:16:35 +0200buckwheat(~buckwheat@209.122.211.192)
2023-07-14 11:18:08 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 11:20:39 +0200buckwheat(~buckwheat@209.122.211.192) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 11:21:15 +0200thblt(~thblt@user/thblt) (ERC 5.5.0.29.1 (IRC client for GNU Emacs 29.0.92))
2023-07-14 11:23:16 +0200califax(~califax@user/califx) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 11:24:10 +0200 <merijn> jade[m]: have you looked at backpack?
2023-07-14 11:25:14 +0200califax(~califax@user/califx)
2023-07-14 11:27:26 +0200misterfish(~misterfis@92-66-207-29.biz.kpn.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 11:28:43 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@ip4d14fda4.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de)
2023-07-14 11:32:18 +0200tcard_(~tcard@2400:4051:5801:7500:cf17:befc:ff82:5303) (Quit: Leaving)
2023-07-14 11:32:56 +0200Lord_of_Life(~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 11:34:46 +0200tcard(~tcard@2400:4051:5801:7500:cf17:befc:ff82:5303)
2023-07-14 11:35:01 +0200Lord_of_Life(~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915)
2023-07-14 11:35:26 +0200foul_owl(~kerry@71.212.137.212) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 11:35:38 +0200frase(~Fraser@159.196.13.236) ()
2023-07-14 11:39:28 +0200erisco_(~erisco@d24-141-66-165.home.cgocable.net)
2023-07-14 11:40:52 +0200erisco(~erisco@d24-141-66-165.home.cgocable.net) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 11:40:52 +0200erisco_erisco
2023-07-14 11:41:54 +0200Kaladin(~Kaladin@157-131-203-194.fiber.dynamic.sonic.net)
2023-07-14 11:42:39 +0200Kaladin(~Kaladin@157-131-203-194.fiber.dynamic.sonic.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 11:44:29 +0200dsrt^(~cd@24.125.210.85) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 11:44:55 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2023-07-14 11:46:28 +0200hellwolf(~user@5b3d-5cac-bb28-d008-0f00-4d40-07d0-2001.sta.estpak.ee)
2023-07-14 11:48:12 +0200foul_owl(~kerry@157.97.134.168)
2023-07-14 11:51:12 +0200misterfish(~misterfis@87.215.131.102)
2023-07-14 11:54:14 +0200driib(~driib@vmi931078.contaboserver.net) (Quit: The Lounge - https://thelounge.chat)
2023-07-14 11:54:48 +0200driib(~driib@vmi931078.contaboserver.net)
2023-07-14 11:57:19 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3)
2023-07-14 11:57:40 +0200wootehfoot(~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot)
2023-07-14 11:59:16 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@ip4d14fda4.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 12:00:44 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 12:02:52 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 12:08:54 +0200Guest9190(~finn@rul16-h01-176-151-21-224.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 12:09:21 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 12:09:34 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 12:10:06 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 12:11:59 +0200eggplantade(~Eggplanta@104-55-37-220.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net)
2023-07-14 12:12:40 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 12:13:12 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 12:16:25 +0200eggplantade(~Eggplanta@104-55-37-220.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2023-07-14 12:18:53 +0200mechap(~mechap@user/mechap) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 12:20:10 +0200mechap(~mechap@user/mechap)
2023-07-14 12:24:02 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 12:31:21 +0200mechap(~mechap@user/mechap) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 12:31:36 +0200ubert(~Thunderbi@178.115.54.100.wireless.dyn.drei.com)
2023-07-14 12:32:29 +0200mechap(~mechap@user/mechap)
2023-07-14 12:35:42 +0200L29Ah(~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah) ()
2023-07-14 12:36:00 +0200L29Ah(~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah)
2023-07-14 12:36:26 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 12:37:56 +0200ss4(~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot)
2023-07-14 12:38:42 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 12:40:29 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 12:41:00 +0200wootehfoot(~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2023-07-14 12:42:36 +0200buckwheat(~buckwheat@209.122.211.192)
2023-07-14 12:47:55 +0200mrmr(~mrmr@user/mrmr) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2023-07-14 12:48:10 +0200CiaoSen(~Jura@2a05:5800:2dc:9500:664b:f0ff:fe37:9ef) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 12:51:40 +0200__monty__(~toonn@user/toonn)
2023-07-14 12:53:27 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 12:55:26 +0200danse-nr3_(~francesco@151.37.251.36) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 12:57:26 +0200gnalzo(~gnalzo@2a01:e0a:498:fd50:fcc6:bb5d:489a:ce8c)
2023-07-14 12:57:59 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 13:00:48 +0200Tlsx(~rscastilh@187.40.124.54)
2023-07-14 13:03:51 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 13:06:10 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 13:06:25 +0200ss4(~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-07-14 13:06:44 +0200Clarom4
2023-07-14 13:07:49 +0200m4Claro
2023-07-14 13:11:14 +0200danse-nr3_(~francesco@151.37.251.36)
2023-07-14 13:11:59 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 13:14:11 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 13:17:43 +0200nate2(~nate@c-98-45-169-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
2023-07-14 13:18:59 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 13:21:11 +0200oo_miguel(~Thunderbi@78-11-179-96.static.ip.netia.com.pl)
2023-07-14 13:22:24 +0200nate2(~nate@c-98-45-169-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 13:23:17 +0200cyphase_eviltwin(~cyphase@user/cyphase) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 13:25:40 +0200Clarom4
2023-07-14 13:28:24 +0200Tlsx(~rscastilh@187.40.124.54) ()
2023-07-14 13:29:49 +0200m4claro
2023-07-14 13:30:11 +0200shapr(~user@2600:1700:c640:3100:cde4:ca2f:725:21b4)
2023-07-14 13:30:13 +0200claroclaro_
2023-07-14 13:30:19 +0200claro_claro
2023-07-14 13:30:45 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 13:33:34 +0200danse-nr3_(~francesco@151.37.251.36) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 13:33:57 +0200danse-nr3_(~francesco@151.37.251.36)
2023-07-14 13:35:05 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 13:39:36 +0200cyphase(~cyphase@user/cyphase)
2023-07-14 13:40:47 +0200segfaultfizzbuzz(~segfaultf@23-93-74-212.fiber.dynamic.sonic.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 13:41:30 +0200segfaultfizzbuzz(~segfaultf@23-93-74-212.fiber.dynamic.sonic.net)
2023-07-14 13:43:21 +0200foul_owl(~kerry@157.97.134.168) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 13:43:46 +0200foul_owl(~kerry@157.97.134.168)
2023-07-14 13:44:05 +0200mei(~mei@user/mei) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 13:45:35 +0200Buggys(Buggys@shelltalk.net) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2023-07-14 13:46:46 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 13:50:17 +0200danse-nr3_(~francesco@151.37.251.36) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 13:50:43 +0200danse-nr3(~francesco@151.37.251.36)
2023-07-14 13:50:50 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 13:55:58 +0200ubert(~Thunderbi@178.115.54.100.wireless.dyn.drei.com) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-07-14 13:56:16 +0200ubert(~Thunderbi@178.115.54.100.wireless.dyn.drei.com)
2023-07-14 13:57:15 +0200gurkenglas(~gurkengla@dynamic-046-114-181-072.46.114.pool.telefonica.de)
2023-07-14 13:58:00 +0200titibandit(~titibandi@user/titibandit) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-07-14 13:58:50 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 14:02:21 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 14:03:05 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 14:03:41 +0200titibandit(~titibandi@user/titibandit)
2023-07-14 14:04:43 +0200Tlsx(~rscastilh@187.40.124.54)
2023-07-14 14:06:50 +0200xff0x_(~xff0x@ai086045.d.east.v6connect.net)
2023-07-14 14:10:44 +0200titiband1t(~titibandi@user/titibandit)
2023-07-14 14:13:25 +0200doyougnu(~doyougnu@45.46.170.68)
2023-07-14 14:14:28 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3)
2023-07-14 14:15:41 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 14:16:05 +0200Buggys(Buggys@shelltalk.net)
2023-07-14 14:16:12 +0200titiband1t(~titibandi@user/titibandit) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 14:16:31 +0200doyougnu(~doyougnu@45.46.170.68) (Client Quit)
2023-07-14 14:18:48 +0200doyougnu(~doyougnu@45.46.170.68)
2023-07-14 14:19:11 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2023-07-14 14:19:45 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3)
2023-07-14 14:20:14 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 14:21:51 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 14:22:26 +0200razetime_(~quassel@117.193.6.88)
2023-07-14 14:22:32 +0200razetime(~quassel@117.193.1.196) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 14:24:35 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2023-07-14 14:26:11 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 14:27:30 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 14:27:36 +0200acidjnk(~acidjnk@p200300d6e7072f84d1756600c61e2eb6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 14:31:08 +0200pavonia(~user@user/siracusa) (Quit: Bye!)
2023-07-14 14:31:32 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3)
2023-07-14 14:31:47 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 14:33:09 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 14:35:44 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 14:36:38 +0200bitdex(~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) (Quit: = "")
2023-07-14 14:37:23 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 14:38:48 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 14:41:01 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3)
2023-07-14 14:42:59 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 14:44:26 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 14:44:30 +0200euandreh(~Thunderbi@189.6.18.7) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2023-07-14 14:46:49 +0200euandreh(~Thunderbi@189.6.18.7)
2023-07-14 14:48:56 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 14:49:54 +0200Guest9190(~finn@176-151-21-224.abo.bbox.fr)
2023-07-14 14:50:01 +0200razetime_(~quassel@117.193.6.88) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 14:50:35 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 14:51:11 +0200zeenk(~zeenk@2a02:2f04:a00b:1800::fba) (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
2023-07-14 14:54:53 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 14:54:54 +0200danse-nr3_(~francesco@151.37.253.148)
2023-07-14 14:56:14 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 14:58:00 +0200danse-nr3(~francesco@151.37.251.36) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 15:00:28 +0200jappiejappie(~jappiejap@181-41-6-201.setardsl.aw)
2023-07-14 15:00:50 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 15:02:22 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net)
2023-07-14 15:03:31 +0200Lycurgus(~juan@98.4.112.204)
2023-07-14 15:03:31 +0200Lycurgus(~juan@98.4.112.204) (Changing host)
2023-07-14 15:03:31 +0200Lycurgus(~juan@user/Lycurgus)
2023-07-14 15:06:26 +0200anon24339985(~anon24339@cpc142034-slou6-2-0-cust488.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 15:07:56 +0200 <albet70> if call g inside f and call z inside g, now how to pass a new parameter to z in where f is calling? add a new parameter in all of they definition?
2023-07-14 15:08:14 +0200 <albet70> their
2023-07-14 15:08:30 +0200 <geekosaur> there is an evil hack (imo) called implicit parameters
2023-07-14 15:09:11 +0200 <albet70> example?
2023-07-14 15:09:11 +0200titibandit(~titibandi@user/titibandit) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-07-14 15:10:06 +0200bontaq(~user@ool-45779b84.dyn.optonline.net)
2023-07-14 15:11:36 +0200 <albet70> like def f(a, b=1) in python?
2023-07-14 15:11:53 +0200 <geekosaur> no
2023-07-14 15:11:56 +0200 <lyxia> https://downloads.haskell.org/ghc/latest/docs/users_guide/exts/implicit_parameters.html
2023-07-14 15:12:12 +0200 <geekosaur> it hides values in the context instead of as parameters
2023-07-14 15:12:42 +0200 <merijn> alternatively, if you're using ReaderT with an environment, you can pass stuff that way
2023-07-14 15:13:05 +0200 <merijn> This is why I often like ReaderT for exploring what kinda API I want, easy to thread stuff through the application
2023-07-14 15:13:06 +0200 <lyxia> though you should just try adding the parameters normally first and see what pain point you run into specifically
2023-07-14 15:14:03 +0200 <Rembane> Another way is to put everything into a record and pass that along.
2023-07-14 15:14:22 +0200 <int-e> or maybe define functions locally (if g and z are locally defined inside f, then they get access to f's parameters without syntactic noise)
2023-07-14 15:14:36 +0200titibandit(~titibandi@user/titibandit)
2023-07-14 15:15:02 +0200 <albet70> into a record is very OOP
2023-07-14 15:15:45 +0200 <geekosaur> not really
2023-07-14 15:15:58 +0200 <lyxia> even if it were, OOP doesn't mean bad
2023-07-14 15:15:59 +0200califax(~califax@user/califx) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 15:16:01 +0200 <albet70> inside f would make f very big, not good for composing
2023-07-14 15:16:18 +0200califax(~califax@user/califx)
2023-07-14 15:17:20 +0200 <danse-nr3_> implicit parameters looks like an evil hack indeed
2023-07-14 15:18:09 +0200trev(~trev@user/trev) (Quit: trev)
2023-07-14 15:18:17 +0200sagax(~sagax_nb@user/sagax) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 15:18:42 +0200bontaq(~user@ool-45779b84.dyn.optonline.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 15:19:05 +0200 <dminuoso> https://chrisdone.com/posts/whats-wrong-with-implicitparams/
2023-07-14 15:19:06 +0200ft(~ft@p3e9bc835.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
2023-07-14 15:19:27 +0200 <dminuoso> Also see https://old.reddit.com/r/haskell/comments/m8o88a/who_still_uses_readert/grkh17q/
2023-07-14 15:19:43 +0200bontaq(~user@ool-45779b84.dyn.optonline.net)
2023-07-14 15:20:14 +0200ezzieyguywuf(~Unknown@user/ezzieyguywuf) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 15:20:55 +0200 <Rembane> I think this talk has some really good points about FP vs OOP: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QyJZzq0v7Z4
2023-07-14 15:21:03 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 15:21:27 +0200 <danse-nr3_> i find that when cases like these occur, it is an hint that those functions could be composed instead of being called inside each other. In this case, consider passing z to g (or having a gWith where z is an argument)
2023-07-14 15:22:28 +0200 <albet70> is that cps?
2023-07-14 15:23:09 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 15:25:03 +0200ezzieyguywuf(~Unknown@user/ezzieyguywuf)
2023-07-14 15:25:20 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 15:26:14 +0200 <danse-nr3_> not as far as i understand
2023-07-14 15:26:54 +0200 <Rembane> Higher order function perhaps?
2023-07-14 15:26:57 +0200 <geekosaur> just higher order, I think
2023-07-14 15:27:37 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@ip4d14fda4.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de)
2023-07-14 15:27:55 +0200troydm(~troydm@user/troydm) (Quit: What is Hope? That all of your wishes and all of your dreams come true? To turn back time because things were not supposed to happen like that (C) Rau Le Creuset)
2023-07-14 15:28:12 +0200troydm(~troydm@user/troydm)
2023-07-14 15:28:23 +0200troydm(~troydm@user/troydm) (Client Quit)
2023-07-14 15:29:51 +0200troydm(~troydm@user/troydm)
2023-07-14 15:31:27 +0200troydm(~troydm@user/troydm) (Client Quit)
2023-07-14 15:31:44 +0200troydm(~troydm@user/troydm)
2023-07-14 15:33:04 +0200[itchyjunk](~itchyjunk@user/itchyjunk/x-7353470)
2023-07-14 15:33:41 +0200waleee(~waleee@h-176-10-137-138.NA.cust.bahnhof.se) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
2023-07-14 15:34:50 +0200 <albet70> how about trans that into cps? possible?
2023-07-14 15:35:58 +0200 <geekosaur> …why
2023-07-14 15:39:32 +0200jappiejappie(~jappiejap@181-41-6-201.setardsl.aw) (Quit: Client closed)
2023-07-14 15:41:39 +0200 <albet70> curious
2023-07-14 15:42:01 +0200troydm(~troydm@user/troydm) (Quit: What is Hope? That all of your wishes and all of your dreams come true? To turn back time because things were not supposed to happen like that (C) Rau Le Creuset)
2023-07-14 15:42:18 +0200troydm(~troydm@user/troydm)
2023-07-14 15:44:21 +0200Tlsx(~rscastilh@187.40.124.54) ()
2023-07-14 15:45:55 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@ip4d14fda4.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 15:48:35 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:b0ad:2249:4f5f:92e3) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2023-07-14 15:50:51 +0200razetime(~quassel@117.193.6.228)
2023-07-14 15:51:33 +0200razetime(~quassel@117.193.6.228) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 15:53:08 +0200ezzieyguywuf(~Unknown@user/ezzieyguywuf) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 15:54:33 +0200dcoutts(~duncan@195.80.64.243)
2023-07-14 15:55:08 +0200mncheck(~mncheck@193.224.205.254) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2023-07-14 15:56:56 +0200ezzieyguywuf(~Unknown@user/ezzieyguywuf)
2023-07-14 15:59:25 +0200sm[i](~sm@024-165-041-186.res.spectrum.com)
2023-07-14 16:00:04 +0200sm[i](~sm@024-165-041-186.res.spectrum.com) (Client Quit)
2023-07-14 16:04:18 +0200nick3(~nick@50.86.118.19)
2023-07-14 16:07:21 +0200gurkenglas(~gurkengla@dynamic-046-114-181-072.46.114.pool.telefonica.de) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-07-14 16:07:25 +0200 <danse-nr3_> does anyone have opinions about serokell's haskell certification program? I would not mind spending some money to learn haskell better, but the way they organised topics by level did not convince me
2023-07-14 16:09:32 +0200thegeekinside(~thegeekin@189.217.90.138)
2023-07-14 16:11:28 +0200dcoutts(~duncan@195.80.64.243) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 16:11:30 +0200mechap(~mechap@user/mechap) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 16:11:31 +0200shriekingnoise(~shrieking@186.137.175.87)
2023-07-14 16:13:15 +0200 <jade[m]> never heard of that myself and neither heard it reccomended here
2023-07-14 16:13:15 +0200 <ddellacosta> danse-nr3_: in case you haven't seen it yet, here's a discourse post where folks discuss it, and among others SPJ and the Serokell CEO both make a comment https://discourse.haskell.org/t/has-anyone-done-the-serokell-certification-yet-should-i/6685/34
2023-07-14 16:13:33 +0200 <maerwald> if that allows you to skip annoying coding interviews yes... otherwise, what for?
2023-07-14 16:13:33 +0200 <ddellacosta> I don't have any opinion on it myself, but I generally stay away from certifications
2023-07-14 16:14:21 +0200 <jade[m]> if you want to learn haskell better there's a bunch of books that the money would be better spent on, imo :)
2023-07-14 16:14:24 +0200ezzieyguywuf(~Unknown@user/ezzieyguywuf) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 16:14:38 +0200buckwheat(~buckwheat@209.122.211.192) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 16:14:42 +0200 <ddellacosta> about my feeling...as someone else in a position of hiring commented in that thread, they would see it as just another data point. Given that, I'd rather learn more or work on open source stuff
2023-07-14 16:14:49 +0200 <ddellacosta> and exactly jade[m]
2023-07-14 16:15:04 +0200 <ddellacosta> but hey, it may be helpful for some folks!
2023-07-14 16:15:40 +0200ezzieyguywuf(~Unknown@user/ezzieyguywuf)
2023-07-14 16:19:54 +0200 <danse-nr3_> i do not like the idea of certifications, reading a book or learning while contributing to a communities sounds much better to me, but i had mixed experience with haskell interviews. Different companies would care about rather different aspects, so i thought that could help. Probably there is a pool of companies that get in touch with who passes those exams
2023-07-14 16:21:19 +0200 <danse-nr3_> thanks ddellacosta for the pointer, i do not hang out on discourse
2023-07-14 16:21:19 +0200titibandit(~titibandi@user/titibandit) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-07-14 16:22:09 +0200 <ddellacosta> np, and good point about the post-certification company connection, that could be helpful just as a way to get hired
2023-07-14 16:22:22 +0200 <ddellacosta> worth confirming that exists
2023-07-14 16:26:34 +0200titibandit(~titibandi@user/titibandit)
2023-07-14 16:26:48 +0200 <danse-nr3_> i would not take a certification because of that anyways ... so yeah i guess certifications are not for me
2023-07-14 16:27:54 +0200 <maerwald> certifications for standards are useful
2023-07-14 16:27:58 +0200 <maerwald> and needed in some industries
2023-07-14 16:28:43 +0200titibandit(~titibandi@user/titibandit) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 16:30:50 +0200 <danse-nr3_> probably i am biased because i have mainly been exposed to certifications about private systems granted by the same tool producers (cisco, microsoft...). Anyways, a language like haskell is probably to be handled differently than a standard
2023-07-14 16:31:27 +0200 <maerwald> Haskell is not a standard
2023-07-14 16:32:13 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 16:32:26 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 16:32:28 +0200noscript(~james@user/earldouglas) ()
2023-07-14 16:32:59 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 16:33:02 +0200trev(~trev@user/trev)
2023-07-14 16:35:28 +0200 <Inst_> when did accelerate come back online?
2023-07-14 16:35:29 +0200Lycurgus(~juan@user/Lycurgus) (Quit: Exeunt: personae.ai-integration.biz)
2023-07-14 16:35:31 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 16:36:25 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 16:37:32 +0200Cale(~cale@cpe80d04ade0a03-cm80d04ade0a01.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 16:38:17 +0200notzmv(~zmv@user/notzmv) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 16:39:05 +0200 <danse-nr3_> maerwald, that is why i wrote i could be biased
2023-07-14 16:40:05 +0200 <danse-nr3_> ops nevermind i have read your message wrong. Well haskell is based on the report ... in theory someone could do certifications on that =D
2023-07-14 16:40:22 +0200 <maerwald> in what way?
2023-07-14 16:40:38 +0200misterfish(~misterfis@87.215.131.102) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2023-07-14 16:40:55 +0200 <maerwald> also, a report is not a standard
2023-07-14 16:41:04 +0200 <maerwald> neither is a spec
2023-07-14 16:42:02 +0200 <danse-nr3_> alright, i do not mean to take the certification anyways
2023-07-14 16:44:37 +0200 <Inst_> danse-nr3: serokell's haskell certification program is a t-shirt
2023-07-14 16:45:55 +0200 <danse-nr3_> unfortunately it is a t-shirt that can get someone a job
2023-07-14 16:46:44 +0200 <Inst_> do employers actually care about serokell haskell certifications yet?
2023-07-14 16:47:25 +0200 <Inst_> the t-shirt comparison is that even if it's useless, it's something you can wear
2023-07-14 16:47:32 +0200 <Inst_> fun to have around
2023-07-14 16:47:43 +0200 <Inst_> whoa, let's see if this works
2023-07-14 16:48:01 +0200 <danse-nr3_> do employers care about how you look like in your linkedin picture?
2023-07-14 16:48:18 +0200 <maerwald> some might
2023-07-14 16:49:12 +0200 <danse-nr3_> Inst_, you have got your answer
2023-07-14 16:49:39 +0200 <Inst_> yeah, i mean, i'd imagine main use case for serokell certification would be non-haskell jobs
2023-07-14 16:51:27 +0200 <juri_> is anyone aware of security trainings specifically targeted toward haskellers?
2023-07-14 16:55:35 +0200Midjak(~Midjak@82.66.147.146)
2023-07-14 16:57:40 +0200dcoutts(~duncan@195.80.64.243)
2023-07-14 16:58:35 +0200 <danse-nr3_> juri_ (are you tomsmending?) i just read that there is a security task force in the haskell foundation, might check what they are doing if you are interested in that area
2023-07-14 16:59:10 +0200Lycurgus(~juan@98.4.112.204)
2023-07-14 16:59:10 +0200Lycurgus(~juan@98.4.112.204) (Changing host)
2023-07-14 16:59:10 +0200Lycurgus(~juan@user/Lycurgus)
2023-07-14 17:01:53 +0200 <juri_> danse-nr3_: i'm not, and i've already asked there.
2023-07-14 17:02:16 +0200 <juri_> (i'm Julia Longtin, the "crazy haskell 3d printer nerd", FWIW)
2023-07-14 17:02:39 +0200 <danse-nr3_> haha nice to meet you. Sorry tomsmending also had a similar nick
2023-07-14 17:02:42 +0200 <merijn> juri_: What kinda security training are you thinking of?
2023-07-14 17:03:46 +0200 <merijn> because just 'security' is broad to the point of meaninglessness :)
2023-07-14 17:03:52 +0200Lycurgus(~juan@user/Lycurgus) (Client Quit)
2023-07-14 17:03:56 +0200 <juri_> honestly, i don't know. we're getting security trainings for the other platform teams (do not dereference null pointers, do not trust client input...), but.. we're a haskell team. i'm not even sure what to advise, other than "be a haskeller"
2023-07-14 17:04:08 +0200mechap(~mechap@user/mechap)
2023-07-14 17:04:28 +0200dcoutts(~duncan@195.80.64.243) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2023-07-14 17:04:38 +0200jmdaemon(~jmdaemon@user/jmdaemon) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 17:04:59 +0200 <merijn> juri_: I mean, a bunch of the same stuff applies (not trusting user input, pointer validity, etc.) and then there's the whole topic of side-channel attacks
2023-07-14 17:05:00 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 17:05:17 +0200 <juri_> yep.
2023-07-14 17:05:32 +0200 <merijn> but I don't think specific trainings exist for Haskell
2023-07-14 17:06:41 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 17:06:45 +0200Tlsx(~rscastilh@187.40.124.54)
2023-07-14 17:07:12 +0200Lycurgus(~juan@user/Lycurgus)
2023-07-14 17:09:49 +0200 <maerwald> people think too much of cryptography when they hear 'security'
2023-07-14 17:09:57 +0200 <maerwald> it's a niche area
2023-07-14 17:10:12 +0200 <mauke> do not trust input, be careful when assembling structured data as strings (and avoid assembling raw strings whenever possible)
2023-07-14 17:10:50 +0200 <maerwald> attacking crypto algorithms isn't something your regular attacker does... it needs insane amount of resources
2023-07-14 17:11:21 +0200 <mauke> like "https://example.com/stuff?token=" <> apiToken <> "&size=42" is not how you build a URL
2023-07-14 17:11:36 +0200 <maerwald> https://langsec.org/ is a good introduction into the security problem
2023-07-14 17:13:03 +0200pieguy128(~pieguy128@bras-base-mtrlpq5031w-grc-54-65-92-160-21.dsl.bell.ca)
2023-07-14 17:13:46 +0200 <maerwald> then there are a couple of approaches on how to formalize security and measure it
2023-07-14 17:14:16 +0200Sgeo(~Sgeo@user/sgeo)
2023-07-14 17:14:25 +0200 <maerwald> the main two I think are: your system as an IO automaton (number of syscalls user input can trigger) and a purely economic measure (which I like more)
2023-07-14 17:14:26 +0200 <mauke> oh, and haskell does nothing to protect you from race conditions
2023-07-14 17:14:28 +0200L29Ah(~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah) ()
2023-07-14 17:14:42 +0200 <merijn> mauke: well, arguably STM does a bit
2023-07-14 17:15:07 +0200ubert1(~Thunderbi@178.165.175.35.wireless.dyn.drei.com)
2023-07-14 17:15:11 +0200 <maerwald> so a secure system is basically just a system that is expensive to crack... and there are ways to calculate it
2023-07-14 17:15:34 +0200 <mauke> merijn: that's all internal, so mostly boring :-)
2023-07-14 17:15:43 +0200 <maerwald> can't find the thesis, my file server has certificate issues again (lol)
2023-07-14 17:15:44 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl)
2023-07-14 17:15:47 +0200 <Hecate> unsure what you'd like to see, mauke
2023-07-14 17:16:23 +0200eggplantade(~Eggplanta@2600:1700:38c5:d800:6cd6:b2b2:8eef:d429)
2023-07-14 17:16:36 +0200 <mauke> I'm not calling for changes. just saying that security trainings aren't pointless just because you're using haskell
2023-07-14 17:17:02 +0200Square(~Square@user/square)
2023-07-14 17:17:20 +0200ubert(~Thunderbi@178.115.54.100.wireless.dyn.drei.com) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 17:17:21 +0200ubert1ubert
2023-07-14 17:17:46 +0200thegeekinside(~thegeekin@189.217.90.138) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-07-14 17:18:15 +0200zeenk(~zeenk@2a02:2f04:a00b:1800::fba)
2023-07-14 17:19:13 +0200nate2(~nate@c-98-45-169-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
2023-07-14 17:20:35 +0200eggplantade(~Eggplanta@2600:1700:38c5:d800:6cd6:b2b2:8eef:d429) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 17:20:38 +0200 <Inst_> tomsmeding: quick question, is accelerate still working on any newer versions of GHC?
2023-07-14 17:24:07 +0200nate2(~nate@c-98-45-169-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 17:26:36 +0200gurkenglas(~gurkengla@dynamic-046-114-181-072.46.114.pool.telefonica.de)
2023-07-14 17:26:49 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(~Goodbye_V@freakshells.net)
2023-07-14 17:30:20 +0200 <ddellacosta> juri_: neat, I did not know https://github.com/Haskell-Things/ImplicitCAD existed, glad you mentioned you were the "crazy Haskell 3d printing nerd" lol. Been wanting to dip my toes in the 3d printing waters so this is timely
2023-07-14 17:30:30 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(~Goodbye_V@freakshells.net) (Client Quit)
2023-07-14 17:32:17 +0200 <danse-nr3_> Inst_, i think they have a badge on github, was red last time i checked
2023-07-14 17:32:28 +0200 <Inst_> yeah, i know
2023-07-14 17:32:48 +0200thegeekinside(~thegeekin@189.217.90.138)
2023-07-14 17:32:52 +0200 <Inst_> just saw it got updated, saw some signs it might still be working
2023-07-14 17:32:57 +0200 <Inst_> the last i heard it was stuck on 9.0.x
2023-07-14 17:33:01 +0200 <Inst_> which is buggy and no one uses
2023-07-14 17:33:51 +0200 <Inst_> i really should just join stack club
2023-07-14 17:34:24 +0200eggplantade(~Eggplanta@2600:1700:38c5:d800:6cd6:b2b2:8eef:d429)
2023-07-14 17:37:49 +0200econo_(uid147250@id-147250.tinside.irccloud.com)
2023-07-14 17:41:02 +0200mei(~mei@user/mei)
2023-07-14 17:41:57 +0200Lycurgus(~juan@user/Lycurgus) (Quit: Exeunt: personae.ai-integration.biz)
2023-07-14 17:44:05 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 17:44:29 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 17:45:42 +0200hugo(znc@verdigris.lysator.liu.se) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-07-14 17:48:31 +0200 <juri_> ddellacosta: It's worse than that. i also have a slicer i'm working ot. :)
2023-07-14 17:50:06 +0200ripspin(~chatzilla@1.145.240.82)
2023-07-14 17:51:36 +0200thegeekinside(~thegeekin@189.217.90.138) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-07-14 17:54:49 +0200 <jade[m]> what's the plan for return in monad? I've heard that it'll be deprecated in the near future but I haven't seen any specifics about it
2023-07-14 17:55:38 +0200hugo(znc@verdigris.lysator.liu.se)
2023-07-14 17:56:35 +0200neuroevolutus(~neuroevol@2001:ac8:9a:76::1e)
2023-07-14 17:57:04 +0200 <ddellacosta> juri_: are you talking about https://github.com/Slicer/Slicer? I didn't know this existed either
2023-07-14 17:57:28 +0200chele(~chele@user/chele) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 17:59:04 +0200 <juri_> ddellacosta: nope! https://github.com/Haskell-Things/HSlice
2023-07-14 17:59:06 +0200picklejuice(~root@c-73-196-164-60.hsd1.nj.comcast.net)
2023-07-14 17:59:28 +0200 <picklejuice> join #archlinux
2023-07-14 17:59:30 +0200elkcl(~elkcl@broadband-95-84-180-37.ip.moscow.rt.ru) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2023-07-14 17:59:45 +0200picklejuice(~root@c-73-196-164-60.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) (Client Quit)
2023-07-14 17:59:50 +0200 <juri_> ddellacosta: we talk about all of this stuff in #implicitcad .
2023-07-14 17:59:53 +0200 <ddellacosta> "Wait but...why? Haskell all of the things." haha
2023-07-14 18:00:08 +0200picklejuice(~root@c-73-196-164-60.hsd1.nj.comcast.net)
2023-07-14 18:00:24 +0200 <ddellacosta> thanks, I'll check both of these out in more depth
2023-07-14 18:00:58 +0200 <juri_> the slicer is still a work in progress. i give a talk on it in a month at the Chaos Communication Camp.
2023-07-14 18:01:18 +0200 <ddellacosta> nice!
2023-07-14 18:02:02 +0200 <ddellacosta> haven't thought about CCC in a while, that brings me back
2023-07-14 18:03:57 +0200hugo(znc@verdigris.lysator.liu.se) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
2023-07-14 18:04:58 +0200Daniel[m]1(~danieltan@2001:470:69fc:105::3:6e5e) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 18:05:58 +0200m1-s[m](~m1-smatri@2001:470:69fc:105::2:39da) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 18:07:04 +0200tzh(~tzh@c-24-21-73-154.hsd1.wa.comcast.net)
2023-07-14 18:07:11 +0200_ht(~Thunderbi@28-52-174-82.ftth.glasoperator.nl)
2023-07-14 18:09:07 +0200sm[i](~sm@024-165-041-186.res.spectrum.com)
2023-07-14 18:10:21 +0200sm[i](~sm@024-165-041-186.res.spectrum.com) (Client Quit)
2023-07-14 18:11:50 +0200machinedgod(~machinedg@d198-53-218-113.abhsia.telus.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 18:11:57 +0200sm[i](~sm@024-165-041-186.res.spectrum.com)
2023-07-14 18:13:14 +0200Psybur(~Psybur@c-76-123-45-25.hsd1.va.comcast.net)
2023-07-14 18:13:22 +0200 <yin> there is a way of asking for a specialized type in ghcior lambdabot, i dont recall. something like `:t join @(->)` ?
2023-07-14 18:13:29 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 18:13:40 +0200 <yin> what is it?
2023-07-14 18:14:01 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 18:18:37 +0200dcoutts(~duncan@195.80.64.243)
2023-07-14 18:18:46 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 18:19:43 +0200 <geekosaur> lambdabot doesn't support that, but yahb2 and ghci do (enable TypeApplications)
2023-07-14 18:19:56 +0200 <geekosaur> % :t join @(->)
2023-07-14 18:19:56 +0200 <yahb2> <interactive>:1:1: error: Variable not in scope: join
2023-07-14 18:20:05 +0200 <geekosaur> o.O
2023-07-14 18:20:12 +0200justsomeguy(~justsomeg@user/justsomeguy)
2023-07-14 18:20:12 +0200 <geekosaur> % import Control.Monad
2023-07-14 18:20:12 +0200 <yahb2> <no output>
2023-07-14 18:20:14 +0200hugo(znc@verdigris.lysator.liu.se)
2023-07-14 18:20:15 +0200 <geekosaur> % :t join @(->)
2023-07-14 18:20:16 +0200 <yahb2> <interactive>:1:7: error: ; • Expecting one more argument to ‘(->)’ ; Expected kind ‘* -> *’, but ‘(->)’ has kind ‘* -> * -> *’ ; • In the type ‘(->)’ ; In the expression: join ...
2023-07-14 18:20:31 +0200 <geekosaur> % :t join @((->) _)
2023-07-14 18:20:31 +0200 <yahb2> join @((->) _) :: Monad ((->) w) => (w -> (w -> a)) -> w -> a
2023-07-14 18:21:29 +0200 <yin> oh that was it! thanks
2023-07-14 18:22:39 +0200 <yin> funny how it writes (w -> (w -> a))
2023-07-14 18:27:18 +0200sm[i](~sm@024-165-041-186.res.spectrum.com) (Quit: sm[i])
2023-07-14 18:32:42 +0200dcoutts(~duncan@195.80.64.243) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 18:34:11 +0200picklejuice(~root@c-73-196-164-60.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 18:35:25 +0200picklejuice(~root@172.56.219.136)
2023-07-14 18:35:47 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2023-07-14 18:35:53 +0200L29Ah(~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah)
2023-07-14 18:41:50 +0200fweht(uid404746@id-404746.lymington.irccloud.com)
2023-07-14 18:47:40 +0200kimiamania6(~681cf57f@user/kimiamania) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-07-14 18:48:58 +0200azimut(~azimut@gateway/tor-sasl/azimut) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2023-07-14 18:50:30 +0200mechap(~mechap@user/mechap) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2023-07-14 18:50:38 +0200gmg(~user@user/gehmehgeh)
2023-07-14 18:51:30 +0200mechap(~mechap@user/mechap)
2023-07-14 18:54:18 +0200nonzen(~nonzen@user/nonzen) (Quit: Gone)
2023-07-14 18:54:18 +0200sajith(~sajith@user/sajith) (Quit: Gone)
2023-07-14 18:54:35 +0200nonzen(~nonzen@user/nonzen)
2023-07-14 18:54:55 +0200danse-nr3__(~francesco@151.47.251.156)
2023-07-14 18:55:07 +0200sajith(~sajith@user/sajith)
2023-07-14 18:55:53 +0200danse-nr3_(~francesco@151.37.253.148) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-07-14 18:55:57 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 18:56:02 +0200mrmr(~mrmr@user/mrmr)
2023-07-14 18:56:20 +0200kimiamania6(~681cf57f@user/kimiamania)
2023-07-14 18:56:22 +0200sm[i](~sm@024-165-041-186.res.spectrum.com)
2023-07-14 18:56:50 +0200zeenk(~zeenk@2a02:2f04:a00b:1800::fba) (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
2023-07-14 18:57:20 +0200acidjnk(~acidjnk@p200300d6e7072f846d698869e9f24b6e.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
2023-07-14 18:59:59 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl)
2023-07-14 19:00:25 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2023-07-14 19:00:39 +0200jmdaemon(~jmdaemon@user/jmdaemon)
2023-07-14 19:02:28 +0200danse-nr3__(~francesco@151.47.251.156) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 19:08:48 +0200nick3(~nick@50.86.118.19) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 19:11:10 +0200danse-nr3__(~francesco@151.47.251.156)
2023-07-14 19:14:51 +0200segfaultfizzbuzz(~segfaultf@23-93-74-212.fiber.dynamic.sonic.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 19:18:45 +0200AkechiShiro(~licht@user/akechishiro)
2023-07-14 19:23:51 +0200Tlsx(~rscastilh@187.40.124.54) ()
2023-07-14 19:24:54 +0200wootehfoot(~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot)
2023-07-14 19:27:24 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 19:27:25 +0200Guest9190(~finn@176-151-21-224.abo.bbox.fr) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2023-07-14 19:34:05 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 19:34:54 +0200thegeekinside(~thegeekin@189.217.90.138)
2023-07-14 19:36:04 +0200danse-nr3__(~francesco@151.47.251.156) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-07-14 19:37:55 +0200justsomeguy(~justsomeg@user/justsomeguy) (Quit: WeeChat 3.6)
2023-07-14 19:39:09 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 19:39:47 +0200dcoutts(~duncan@195.80.64.243)
2023-07-14 19:43:42 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2023-07-14 19:45:38 +0200mei(~mei@user/mei) (Quit: mei)
2023-07-14 19:46:10 +0200Inst_(~Inst@2601:6c4:4081:2fc0:25dd:4a6c:9344:e183) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 19:47:19 +0200mei(~mei@user/mei)
2023-07-14 19:49:18 +0200hgolden(~hgolden@2603-8000-9d00-3ed1-7b72-5998-97ad-985d.res6.spectrum.com)
2023-07-14 19:49:34 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:8973:eff0:2771:c97b)
2023-07-14 19:50:11 +0200 <tomsmeding> @tell Inst_ being worked on, I believe the intent was to make a release that works on some newer ghcs (though not the newest yet) soon
2023-07-14 19:50:12 +0200 <lambdabot> Consider it noted.
2023-07-14 19:51:01 +0200ripspin(~chatzilla@1.145.240.82) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 19:52:19 +0200 <tomsmeding> @tell danse-nr3_ my nick is in the pastebin and logs urls in the channel topic ;)
2023-07-14 19:52:19 +0200 <lambdabot> Consider it noted.
2023-07-14 19:53:42 +0200misterfish(~misterfis@84-53-85-146.bbserv.nl)
2023-07-14 19:54:24 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:8973:eff0:2771:c97b) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 19:55:03 +0200nonzen(~nonzen@user/nonzen) (Quit: Gone)
2023-07-14 19:55:03 +0200sajith(~sajith@user/sajith) (Quit: Gone)
2023-07-14 19:55:20 +0200nonzen(~nonzen@user/nonzen)
2023-07-14 19:55:46 +0200thegeekinside(~thegeekin@189.217.90.138) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-07-14 19:55:52 +0200sajith(~sajith@user/sajith)
2023-07-14 19:56:19 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 19:56:56 +0200Square(~Square@user/square) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 19:58:47 +0200trev(~trev@user/trev) (Quit: trev)
2023-07-14 19:59:42 +0200sajith(~sajith@user/sajith) (Client Quit)
2023-07-14 19:59:42 +0200nonzen(~nonzen@user/nonzen) (Client Quit)
2023-07-14 20:00:00 +0200nonzen(~nonzen@user/nonzen)
2023-07-14 20:00:31 +0200sajith(~sajith@user/sajith)
2023-07-14 20:01:12 +0200dcoutts(~duncan@195.80.64.243) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 20:02:09 +0200nonzen(~nonzen@user/nonzen) (Client Quit)
2023-07-14 20:02:09 +0200sajith(~sajith@user/sajith) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 20:02:44 +0200nonzen(~nonzen@user/nonzen)
2023-07-14 20:03:16 +0200sajith(~sajith@user/sajith)
2023-07-14 20:08:41 +0200thegeekinside(~thegeekin@189.217.90.138)
2023-07-14 20:11:34 +0200sajith(~sajith@user/sajith) (Quit: Gone)
2023-07-14 20:11:34 +0200nonzen(~nonzen@user/nonzen) (Quit: Gone)
2023-07-14 20:11:52 +0200nonzen(~nonzen@user/nonzen)
2023-07-14 20:12:24 +0200sajith(~sajith@user/sajith)
2023-07-14 20:12:25 +0200elkcl(~elkcl@broadband-95-84-180-37.ip.moscow.rt.ru)
2023-07-14 20:13:49 +0200Unicorn_Princess(~Unicorn_P@user/Unicorn-Princess/x-3540542)
2023-07-14 20:21:52 +0200sm[i](~sm@024-165-041-186.res.spectrum.com) (Quit: sm[i])
2023-07-14 20:24:14 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 20:24:47 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@ip4d14fda4.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de)
2023-07-14 20:25:13 +0200sm[i](~sm@024-165-041-186.res.spectrum.com)
2023-07-14 20:29:06 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@ip4d14fda4.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 20:30:41 +0200neuroevolutus(~neuroevol@2001:ac8:9a:76::1e) (Quit: Client closed)
2023-07-14 20:33:14 +0200Tlsx(~rscastilh@187.40.124.54)
2023-07-14 20:34:45 +0200phma_phma
2023-07-14 20:37:38 +0200kimjetwav(~user@2607:fea8:235e:b600:e655:bdac:14d2:fa34) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 20:42:03 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 20:44:07 +0200hugo(znc@verdigris.lysator.liu.se) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 20:46:11 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 20:56:59 +0200zero(~z@user/zero)
2023-07-14 20:59:55 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 21:00:20 +0200yin(~z@user/zero) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2023-07-14 21:01:34 +0200zzz(~z@user/zero)
2023-07-14 21:02:06 +0200hackyhacker(~hackyhack@2a05:f480:1400:24b2:5400:4ff:fe76:a8f3) (Quit: The Lounge - https://thelounge.chat)
2023-07-14 21:03:22 +0200ncfrecently went on a hike through the Cairngorms and just learned that the range used to be called Am Monadh Ruadh :)
2023-07-14 21:04:01 +0200 <jade[m]> epic category theory reference
2023-07-14 21:04:42 +0200zero(~z@user/zero) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 21:04:42 +0200zzzzero
2023-07-14 21:05:22 +0200 <ncf> monic, rather
2023-07-14 21:05:22 +0200photoreception(~hilario@103.166.10.159)
2023-07-14 21:07:11 +0200 <mauke> CCC? epic category theory reference
2023-07-14 21:10:19 +0200 <jade[m]> whenever I hear CCC, I think of jan misalis video
2023-07-14 21:11:35 +0200fweht(uid404746@id-404746.lymington.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
2023-07-14 21:11:42 +0200hugo(znc@verdigris.lysator.liu.se)
2023-07-14 21:14:54 +0200thegeekinside(~thegeekin@189.217.90.138) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-07-14 21:18:38 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 21:20:46 +0200nate2(~nate@c-98-45-169-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
2023-07-14 21:25:20 +0200nate2(~nate@c-98-45-169-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2023-07-14 21:25:42 +0200thegeekinside(~thegeekin@189.217.90.138)
2023-07-14 21:29:54 +0200Maeda(~Maeda@91-161-10-149.subs.proxad.net)
2023-07-14 21:50:09 +0200bollu(~bollu@159.65.151.13) (Quit: Ping timeout (120 seconds))
2023-07-14 21:50:34 +0200bollu(~bollu@159.65.151.13)
2023-07-14 21:53:30 +0200ft(~ft@p3e9bc835.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2023-07-14 21:54:04 +0200jonathan(~jonathan@c-5eea70ba-74736162.cust.telenor.se)
2023-07-14 21:54:26 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 21:55:13 +0200ft(~ft@p4fc2a494.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
2023-07-14 22:00:11 +0200oac(~oac@72-50-214-210.fttp.usinternet.com)
2023-07-14 22:00:47 +0200jonathan(~jonathan@c-5eea70ba-74736162.cust.telenor.se) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 22:02:58 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 22:12:02 +0200neuroevolutus(~neuroevol@2001:ac8:9a:76::1e)
2023-07-14 22:17:46 +0200Maeda(~Maeda@91-161-10-149.subs.proxad.net) (Quit: yup)
2023-07-14 22:24:00 +0200titibandit(~titibandi@user/titibandit)
2023-07-14 22:27:11 +0200hgolden(~hgolden@2603-8000-9d00-3ed1-7b72-5998-97ad-985d.res6.spectrum.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 22:27:13 +0200nonzen(~nonzen@user/nonzen) (Quit: Gone)
2023-07-14 22:27:13 +0200sajith(~sajith@user/sajith) (Quit: Gone)
2023-07-14 22:27:54 +0200nonzen(~nonzen@user/nonzen)
2023-07-14 22:28:26 +0200sajith(~sajith@user/sajith)
2023-07-14 22:29:43 +0200hgolden(~hgolden@2603-8000-9d00-3ed1-7b72-5998-97ad-985d.res6.spectrum.com)
2023-07-14 22:32:06 +0200ft(~ft@p4fc2a494.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 22:32:39 +0200_ht(~Thunderbi@28-52-174-82.ftth.glasoperator.nl) (Quit: _ht)
2023-07-14 22:33:28 +0200ft(~ft@p508db7ce.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
2023-07-14 22:33:38 +0200misterfish(~misterfis@84-53-85-146.bbserv.nl) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 22:36:55 +0200perrierjouet(~perrierjo@modemcable048.127-56-74.mc.videotron.ca) (Quit: WeeChat 4.0.1)
2023-07-14 22:38:18 +0200califax(~califax@user/califx) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 22:40:04 +0200machinedgod(~machinedg@d198-53-218-113.abhsia.telus.net)
2023-07-14 22:40:53 +0200neuroevolutus(~neuroevol@2001:ac8:9a:76::1e) (Quit: Client closed)
2023-07-14 22:50:48 +0200waleee(~waleee@2001:9b0:21c:4000:5bf9:6515:c030:57b7)
2023-07-14 22:51:23 +0200califax(~califax@user/califx)
2023-07-14 22:51:57 +0200azimut(~azimut@gateway/tor-sasl/azimut)
2023-07-14 22:53:29 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 22:56:28 +0200phma(~phma@host-67-44-208-224.hnremote.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-07-14 22:56:54 +0200phma(phma@2001:5b0:2144:7e18:347d:b9fd:6656:c5a6)
2023-07-14 22:57:52 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 22:58:15 +0200Tlsx(~rscastilh@187.40.124.54) ()
2023-07-14 23:01:23 +0200kimiamania6(~681cf57f@user/kimiamania) (Quit: PegeLinux)
2023-07-14 23:01:51 +0200kimiamania6(~681cf57f@user/kimiamania)
2023-07-14 23:07:00 +0200nick3(~nick@2600:8807:9084:7800:8973:eff0:2771:c97b)
2023-07-14 23:07:19 +0200wootehfoot(~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-07-14 23:10:32 +0200mechap(~mechap@user/mechap) (Quit: WeeChat 4.0.2)
2023-07-14 23:11:08 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 23:15:17 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 23:15:48 +0200michalz(~michalz@185.246.207.200) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2023-07-14 23:18:45 +0200ezzieyguywuf(~Unknown@user/ezzieyguywuf) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 23:20:51 +0200ezzieyguywuf(~Unknown@user/ezzieyguywuf)
2023-07-14 23:21:07 +0200ezzieyguywuf(~Unknown@user/ezzieyguywuf) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 23:21:33 +0200arahael_(~arahael@124-149-31-4.dyn.iinet.net.au)
2023-07-14 23:23:05 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 23:23:28 +0200ezzieyguywuf(~Unknown@user/ezzieyguywuf)
2023-07-14 23:26:29 +0200arahael_(~arahael@124-149-31-4.dyn.iinet.net.au) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2023-07-14 23:27:27 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2023-07-14 23:30:17 +0200mechap(~mechap@user/mechap)
2023-07-14 23:34:00 +0200ezzieyguywuf(~Unknown@user/ezzieyguywuf) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 23:35:21 +0200pavonia(~user@user/siracusa)
2023-07-14 23:38:11 +0200segfaultfizzbuzz(~segfaultf@23-93-74-212.fiber.dynamic.sonic.net)
2023-07-14 23:39:36 +0200 <segfaultfizzbuzz> in haskell binaries (e.g. compiled by ghc) are the types set rigidly at compile time or can they change at runtime? (presumably this would be entangled with the question of whether the program can change at runtime..?)
2023-07-14 23:40:09 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 23:40:44 +0200 <geekosaur> types don't even exist at runtime
2023-07-14 23:40:55 +0200 <segfaultfizzbuzz> oh wow ok
2023-07-14 23:41:19 +0200oac(~oac@72-50-214-210.fttp.usinternet.com) (Quit: WeeChat 3.8)
2023-07-14 23:41:43 +0200 <segfaultfizzbuzz> ... so the runtime doesn't know what types it is working with (unless that becomes specifically included in the binary, like a printType function or something)
2023-07-14 23:41:48 +0200 <segfaultfizzbuzz> ?
2023-07-14 23:42:04 +0200 <Hecate> segfaultfizzbuzz: that's called "type erasure" if you want to look this up
2023-07-14 23:42:21 +0200 <segfaultfizzbuzz> is the type erasure a property of the haskell language or of ghc?
2023-07-14 23:42:44 +0200 <geekosaur> correct. there's limited RTTI via Data.Typeable, and the garbage collector knows the "shape" of values (specifically, which words in a value represent pointers it must follow)
2023-07-14 23:42:50 +0200 <Hecate> you know what, I have no idea if it's in the report, but usually except for debugging purposes, types don't make it to binary code
2023-07-14 23:43:31 +0200 <geekosaur> this is generally true of compiled code, you only get type information at runtime if there is an RTTI mechanism
2023-07-14 23:43:32 +0200ardavast(~ardavast@62-73-72-214.ip.btc-net.bg) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 23:43:33 +0200 <segfaultfizzbuzz> so memory addresses are tagged in some way, basically?
2023-07-14 23:43:39 +0200 <Hecate> yup
2023-07-14 23:44:30 +0200myxokephale(~myxos@cpe-65-28-251-121.cinci.res.rr.com) (Quit: myxokephale)
2023-07-14 23:44:44 +0200myxos(~myxos@cpe-65-28-251-121.cinci.res.rr.com)
2023-07-14 23:44:49 +0200 <segfaultfizzbuzz> interesting,... is there a simple reason for the type information to be discarded?
2023-07-14 23:44:58 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2023-07-14 23:44:59 +0200 <segfaultfizzbuzz> seems like it would be incredibly important for testing, profiling, etc
2023-07-14 23:45:22 +0200 <geekosaur> it's usually not needed. and no, profiling doesn't need it either, the tag is enough
2023-07-14 23:45:50 +0200 <geekosaur> testing code has the types during typechecking when it needs it
2023-07-14 23:46:01 +0200 <Hecate> usually you can get away with much more targeted information in terms of memory representation
2023-07-14 23:46:09 +0200 <Hecate> no need for the whole user-defined type
2023-07-14 23:46:39 +0200ezzieyguywuf(~Unknown@user/ezzieyguywuf)
2023-07-14 23:46:49 +0200 <geekosaur> note that libraries *do* have type information, which for ghc is in .hi files; it just doesn't make it into the final binary
2023-07-14 23:47:37 +0200 <darkling> For compiled languages, by the time the compiler's produced machine instructions to push the bits around, the type is largely irrelevant.
2023-07-14 23:48:42 +0200falafel(~falafel@2603-7000-a700-8710-e3d6-964f-e7e9-177a.res6.spectrum.com)
2023-07-14 23:50:15 +0200ezzieyguywuf(~Unknown@user/ezzieyguywuf) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-07-14 23:51:10 +0200ezzieyguywuf(~Unknown@user/ezzieyguywuf)
2023-07-14 23:52:55 +0200 <ski> segfaultfizzbuzz : "is the type erasure a property of the haskell language or of ghc?" -- a property of the implementation, but the language is designed in such a way so as to mostly painlessly support such implementations that want to do type erasure (although, i think you'd say the GC still knows some low-level type aspects (most specifically whether something's an address or not))
2023-07-14 23:54:37 +0200 <ski> (also note that this is related to why we don't consider whether a value is a `Just' or a `Nothing', or a `Left' or a `Right', &c. a "type" (while some dynamically typed languages definitely would consider those "types"))
2023-07-14 23:55:58 +0200 <segfaultfizzbuzz> doesn't make sense, i can pattern match on Just a | Nothing,...
2023-07-14 23:56:33 +0200 <ski> (e.g. if you were making a tree data srtucture in say Scheme, with a few different kind of nodes, you'd probably declare a record type for each kind of node, and "check runtime type" to determine which kind of node you're holding in your hand)
2023-07-14 23:56:51 +0200 <ski> segfaultfizzbuzz : exactly. so those are not types (`Maybe' is a type)
2023-07-14 23:57:28 +0200alexbiehl(~alexbiehl@2a02:8108:323f:ca14:adeb:5d31:3c95:b332)
2023-07-14 23:59:05 +0200 <ski> types being erasable means that we get the property of parametricity, where if an operation is polymorphic in some type variable, then it can't know at run-time which actual type was used in place of that type variable, and so it can't inspect values having that type variable as its type, it can only pass (references/addresses/pointers to, generally speaking) such values around (dropping the value,
2023-07-14 23:59:11 +0200 <ski> duplicating it, passing it to some particular destination, like result value, or as argument in a call, or inside a data structure)