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2026-06-14 04:34:54 +0000fmlatghor(~lcoogan@user/fmlatghor) fmlatghor
2026-06-14 04:35:13 +0000 <fmlatghor> any of y'all using lean to discover new mathematics or is #lean used for that mainly these days?
2026-06-14 04:35:23 +0000 <fmlatghor> because I know there's a bunch of haskell proof helpers
2026-06-14 04:38:14 +0000merijn(~merijn@62.45.136.136) merijn
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2026-06-14 05:28:50 +0000Digit(~user@user/digit) Digit
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2026-06-14 06:06:22 +0000fmlatghor(~lcoogan@user/fmlatghor) (WeeChat 4.1.1)
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2026-06-14 08:58:09 +0000Lord_of_Life(~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915) (Excess Flood)
2026-06-14 09:00:42 +0000 <hc> This channel is not as lively as it used to be
2026-06-14 09:00:51 +0000 <hc> fmlatghor is gone already ;/
2026-06-14 09:01:17 +0000 <hc> I just read a blog post about lean and vibe coding
2026-06-14 09:02:34 +0000 <Rembane> hc: Was it a good blog post?
2026-06-14 09:03:00 +0000merijn(~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2026-06-14 09:03:55 +0000 <hc> Rembane: It was interesting: https://www.joachim-breitner.de/blog/819-Vibe-coding_a_debugger_for_a_DSL
2026-06-14 09:04:31 +0000 <hc> But I hadn't heard of lean before and must familiarize with it first. I've been absent from haskell for quite a while
2026-06-14 09:04:55 +0000 <Rembane> hc: Sounds like a fun thing to spend a sunday on!
2026-06-14 09:05:32 +0000 <hc> Indeed; right now I'm catching up on some type theory with the haskell unfolder video series :-)
2026-06-14 09:06:05 +0000 <hc> Must be really fun to work at a company like the one that builds lean
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2026-06-14 09:08:41 +0000wickedja`(~user@64.114.24.74)
2026-06-14 09:12:35 +0000 <Rembane> Exciting! :D
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2026-06-14 14:31:38 +0000leppard(~noOne@ipservice-092-208-182-236.092.208.pools.vodafone-ip.de) Inline
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2026-06-14 15:26:33 +0000rscastilho2024_(rscastilho@user/rscastilho2024-:23901) rscastilho2024_
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2026-06-14 15:50:25 +0000maerwald(~maerwald@mail.hasufell.de)
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2026-06-14 15:57:57 +0000chromoblob(~chromoblo@user/chromob1ot1c) chromoblob\0
2026-06-14 15:59:04 +0000maerwald(~maerwald@mail.hasufell.de) (Quit: gone)
2026-06-14 16:00:49 +0000maerwald(~maerwald@mail.hasufell.de)
2026-06-14 16:01:26 +0000karenw(~karenw@user/karenw) karenw
2026-06-14 16:01:26 +0000vms14(~vms14@user/vms14) vms14
2026-06-14 16:02:37 +0000 <vms14> is this a functor?
2026-06-14 16:02:43 +0000 <vms14> contaminate :: (a -> b) -> IO a -> IO b
2026-06-14 16:02:45 +0000 <vms14> contaminate f x = do value <- x; pure (f value)
2026-06-14 16:02:53 +0000vanishingideal(~vanishing@user/vanishingideal) vanishingideal
2026-06-14 16:03:39 +0000 <jaror> Yes, that's the standard way IO is a functor
2026-06-14 16:03:43 +0000 <jaror> aka `fmap`
2026-06-14 16:03:45 +0000 <c_wraith> terminology-wise... no. Types are functors, not values.
2026-06-14 16:03:50 +0000 <c_wraith> but yes, that's fmap for IO
2026-06-14 16:04:15 +0000merijn(~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2026-06-14 16:04:17 +0000 <jaror> Categorically a functor is an action on types and an action on morphisms (which must satisfy certain laws)
2026-06-14 16:04:43 +0000 <vms14> ok then i guess i'm starting to undestand them :D
2026-06-14 16:04:51 +0000 <vms14> ty <3
2026-06-14 16:05:09 +0000 <vms14> that's my first functor
2026-06-14 16:05:18 +0000 <vms14> i like the use of pure to return impurity
2026-06-14 16:05:35 +0000maerwald(~maerwald@mail.hasufell.de) (Client Quit)
2026-06-14 16:05:42 +0000 <jaror> Note that you're kind of making a circular definitions, since `do` notation depends on already having a Functor instance
2026-06-14 16:05:59 +0000 <vms14> i didn't know how to extract the value from IO
2026-06-14 16:06:01 +0000 <c_wraith> pure in this case means "this is the thing that is neutral - it has no effects in the context of this type"
2026-06-14 16:06:42 +0000maerwald(~maerwald@mail.hasufell.de)
2026-06-14 16:06:44 +0000 <jaror> IO is kind of a bad place to start because its `Functor` instance cannot be written in user code (without digging into GHC specifics)
2026-06-14 16:08:27 +0000 <c_wraith> It's technically not circular, fwiw. It's fully possible for a type to define fmap in terms of >>= and pure. Despite the Monad instance requiring that a Functor instance exist, they are not required to have any particular direction of dependency on each other.
2026-06-14 16:08:57 +0000 <c_wraith> That's why liftM isn't deprecated, despite the AMP success
2026-06-14 16:10:58 +0000merijn(~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2026-06-14 16:14:18 +0000maerwald(~maerwald@mail.hasufell.de) (Quit: gone)
2026-06-14 16:14:39 +0000maerwald(~maerwald@mail.hasufell.de)
2026-06-14 16:21:01 +0000 <monochrom> IMO a better name for pure is fromPureToImpure. But obviously that's too long. So 49% of the people picked out the "impure" part but 51% of the people picked out the "pure" part.
2026-06-14 16:21:28 +0000 <monochrom> well there is also toImpureFromPure. That divide is also divisive. >:)
2026-06-14 16:22:05 +0000 <jaror> Just lifting something into an applicative doesn't make it impure. It's not like it suddenly starts launching rockets.
2026-06-14 16:22:48 +0000merijn(~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2026-06-14 16:22:57 +0000tzh(~tzh@c-76-115-131-146.hsd1.or.comcast.net)
2026-06-14 16:24:32 +0000 <monochrom> Mathematicians would say "inject" or "embed". But mathematics is unpopular among programmers!
2026-06-14 16:24:53 +0000 <vms14> i dislike math and idk why i'm learning haskell which is based on math xd
2026-06-14 16:25:14 +0000 <vms14> but i like what i'm learning so far although category theory is being hard
2026-06-14 16:28:02 +0000merijn(~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
2026-06-14 16:28:12 +0000maerwald(~maerwald@mail.hasufell.de) (Quit: gone)
2026-06-14 16:28:25 +0000maerwald(~maerwald@mail.hasufell.de)
2026-06-14 16:31:01 +0000 <geekosaur> uh, you don't need categry theory to learn or use haskell
2026-06-14 16:31:18 +0000 <geekosaur> you need it is you want to help ekmett build stuff
2026-06-14 16:31:44 +0000maerwald(~maerwald@mail.hasufell.de) (Client Quit)
2026-06-14 16:31:50 +0000 <vms14> i think if i want to focus on haskell and haskell is based on it i should learn it
2026-06-14 16:32:02 +0000 <Rembane> Most of the words you can pick up by osmosis i.e. use the concepts and then when you've used enough variants of them the words will be good to name stuff with.