| 2025-04-29 00:00:24 +0200 | <int-e> | I wonder if it has opinions on WorldCoin |
| 2025-04-29 00:01:16 +0200 | <davean> | I' |
| 2025-04-29 00:01:29 +0200 | <davean> | ve started to loath a new trend |
| 2025-04-29 00:01:44 +0200 | <davean> | In issues, people throwing the thing at ChatGPT or whatever, and " |
| 2025-04-29 00:01:50 +0200 | <davean> | pasting" its answer as a solution |
| 2025-04-29 00:02:01 +0200 | <davean> | It make me want to lock the issues and never fix it |
| 2025-04-29 00:02:04 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 00:02:14 +0200 | <davean> | Its so actively unhelpful I wonder if people are doing it to troll |
| 2025-04-29 00:02:28 +0200 | <davean> | esp when what it pastes is self-evidently non-helpful |
| 2025-04-29 00:02:35 +0200 | <davean> | Which, so far, is all I've seen |
| 2025-04-29 00:02:44 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> I wouldn't mind if it's something helpful |
| 2025-04-29 00:02:57 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> I think I posted one of those myself recently |
| 2025-04-29 00:02:59 +0200 | <davean> | Its litterly never been, and it mean it kinda obviously won't be? |
| 2025-04-29 00:03:05 +0200 | <davean> | ... yah, you are one of the people I was thinking of |
| 2025-04-29 00:03:24 +0200 | <davean> | Yours was a great example of self-evidently not helpful |
| 2025-04-29 00:03:33 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> yikes! where was that |
| 2025-04-29 00:03:38 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> called out on my first attempt 🤣 |
| 2025-04-29 00:03:39 +0200 | <davean> | The wiki one |
| 2025-04-29 00:04:14 +0200 | <davean> | Where it suggested A) uncommenting a commented out line (How do you think it got commented out in the first place? If yhou had a question, check the git history) and B) generated an invalid CSS statement |
| 2025-04-29 00:04:52 +0200 | j1n37 | (~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37 |
| 2025-04-29 00:05:16 +0200 | <int-e> | davean: I understand that it gets worse when there's a monetary incentive (bug bounties) |
| 2025-04-29 00:05:37 +0200 | <davean> | Oh god, I wouldn't be surprised if it did |
| 2025-04-29 00:05:46 +0200 | j1n37- | (~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 00:05:51 +0200 | <davean> | sm: on the plus side, your chatgpt response annyoed someone else enough to just fix it :) |
| 2025-04-29 00:05:54 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> https://github.com/haskell/haskell-wiki-configuration/issues/56#issuecomment-2822104811 |
| 2025-04-29 00:06:38 +0200 | <davean> | sorry, the "A" side was simplified out from you IRC posting, not the full length one. |
| 2025-04-29 00:07:18 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> I thought it gave some potentially useful context to my previous (human generated, terse) comment, to someone trying to fix this, and if not, would be easy to ignore. |
| 2025-04-29 00:08:31 +0200 | <davean> | It made it very evident it was splurting out some tutorial and nothing related to the actual config |
| 2025-04-29 00:08:52 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> to you. Obviously people like me trying to help don't have the same insight |
| 2025-04-29 00:09:12 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> I'll me more cautious on this tracker in future |
| 2025-04-29 00:09:16 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> be |
| 2025-04-29 00:09:44 +0200 | <davean> | The state at that comment was https://github.com/haskell/haskell-wiki-configuration/blob/beb924470357d8cc008a5c8118211066897a48e… |
| 2025-04-29 00:09:45 +0200 | LainIwakura | (~LainIwaku@user/LainIwakura) LainIwakura |
| 2025-04-29 00:09:57 +0200 | <davean> | You'll note a several line block of it commented out |
| 2025-04-29 00:10:31 +0200 | <davean> | Someone didn't write all that and comment it out by "accident" |
| 2025-04-29 00:11:27 +0200 | <davean> | Which is the sort of theory-of-mind ChatGPT seems to seriously lack |
| 2025-04-29 00:11:54 +0200 | paotsaq | (~paotsaq@127.209.37.188.rev.vodafone.pt) paotsaq |
| 2025-04-29 00:11:56 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> I pointed that out myself, but didn't know why (there was no explanation) |
| 2025-04-29 00:11:56 +0200 | <davean> | anyway, sm, you're hardly the worst person with this ever |
| 2025-04-29 00:12:33 +0200 | <davean> | Oh the CSS side I sohuld finish |
| 2025-04-29 00:12:49 +0200 | <davean> | it was a CSS directive that targeted displayed text, it clearly mixed up context between display and syntax |
| 2025-04-29 00:12:56 +0200 | <davean> | anyway, sm, you are HARDLY the worst |
| 2025-04-29 00:13:06 +0200 | <davean> | Its a real plauge lately though |
| 2025-04-29 00:13:15 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 00:14:03 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> I know that I'm not the worst. I was trying to be helpful. No need to beat up a volunteer for an unhelpful post, I've said I'll be more cautious |
| 2025-04-29 00:15:07 +0200 | <davean> | For an explanation of why it was commented out, it was commented out because the repo contains the code, but not in a runable state - it requires a specific build procedure to be run before it is a valid extension. As it was just a stylistic display issue I didn't feel like learning a PHP build sytem to get the wiki back online after the great wiki disaster and I hoped something obvious like that |
| 2025-04-29 00:15:09 +0200 | <davean> | would get anyone to step up and assist since I didn't want to end up owning the wiki just because I rescued it. |
| 2025-04-29 00:15:33 +0200 | <davean> | tolt happened to find a place they had actually already run the build system though, which made it easy to fix |
| 2025-04-29 00:16:53 +0200 | <davean> | Hopefully tolt having made a test vm setup thing for it other people might try working on it. |
| 2025-04-29 00:18:14 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 00:19:31 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> I became annoyed enough at the 6 month breakage to try to spend some more time helping. Without access or any insight / status reports I couldn't do more than blind research. I'm glad it helped remind people of the problem, even it if was annoying. It's just another github issue. |
| 2025-04-29 00:20:18 +0200 | <davean> | Hum? That is a full container config for the wiki in that repo |
| 2025-04-29 00:21:13 +0200 | <davean> | That is litterly the wiki, minutes its data |
| 2025-04-29 00:22:36 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> I'm irritated. Sorry, I'll drop this |
| 2025-04-29 00:28:00 +0200 | harveypwca | (~harveypwc@2601:246:d080:f6e0:27d6:8cc7:eca9:c46c) |
| 2025-04-29 00:28:59 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 00:31:41 +0200 | emmanuelux | (~emmanuelu@user/emmanuelux) emmanuelux |
| 2025-04-29 00:34:31 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 00:34:38 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <hellwolf> 🫠 tragedy of the gift economy... which needs more cheerleaders |
| 2025-04-29 00:35:12 +0200 | <int-e> | . o O ( it's spelled "grift" ) |
| 2025-04-29 00:35:16 +0200 | sprotte24 | (~sprotte24@p200300d16f1e9b00643a7ed1094ff735.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2025-04-29 00:38:04 +0200 | gmg | (~user@user/gehmehgeh) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2025-04-29 00:42:05 +0200 | justsomeguy | (~justsomeg@user/justsomeguy) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 00:44:40 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 00:44:57 +0200 | tolgo | (~Thunderbi@199.115.144.130) |
| 2025-04-29 00:45:22 +0200 | peterbecich | (~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) peterbecich |
| 2025-04-29 00:49:24 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 00:49:44 +0200 | justsomeguy | (~justsomeg@user/justsomeguy) justsomeguy |
| 2025-04-29 00:51:25 +0200 | Sgeo | (~Sgeo@user/sgeo) Sgeo |
| 2025-04-29 00:55:11 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 00:55:13 +0200 | califax_ | (~califax@user/califx) califx |
| 2025-04-29 00:56:00 +0200 | califax | (~califax@user/califx) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 00:56:26 +0200 | califax_ | califax |
| 2025-04-29 00:59:34 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 01:01:45 +0200 | Tuplanolla | (~Tuplanoll@91-159-69-59.elisa-laajakaista.fi) (Quit: Leaving.) |
| 2025-04-29 01:10:28 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 01:15:58 +0200 | Buliarous | (~gypsydang@46.232.210.139) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2025-04-29 01:16:26 +0200 | Buliarous | (~gypsydang@46.232.210.139) Buliarous |
| 2025-04-29 01:17:26 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 01:18:38 +0200 | LainIwakura | (~LainIwaku@user/LainIwakura) (Quit: Client closed) |
| 2025-04-29 01:19:25 +0200 | LainIwakura | (~LainIwaku@user/LainIwakura) LainIwakura |
| 2025-04-29 01:21:39 +0200 | <monochrom> | darkling: Actually our department chair has also received students' escalated tickets "I answered something but my prof gave me 0". >:) |
| 2025-04-29 01:22:28 +0200 | <monochrom> | There were 3 such cases and the profs were all different. It is becoming a meme across the board. |
| 2025-04-29 01:23:47 +0200 | <int-e> | . o O ( I asked ChatGPT and it said I should receive full marks. ) |
| 2025-04-29 01:27:19 +0200 | LainIwakura | (~LainIwaku@user/LainIwakura) (Quit: Client closed) |
| 2025-04-29 01:27:31 +0200 | jespada_ | (~jespada@r179-25-42-1.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy) (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
| 2025-04-29 01:28:28 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 01:30:25 +0200 | tolgo | (~Thunderbi@199.115.144.130) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 01:32:34 +0200 | <monochrom> | Oh yeah have you heard of this old joke: If you think you know everything, you can get a Bachelor's. When you find out you don't know anything, you can get a Master's. When you also find out that your thesis supervisor doesn't know anything either, you can get a PhD. |
| 2025-04-29 01:32:50 +0200 | <monochrom> | I have upgraded that to a modern version. |
| 2025-04-29 01:33:37 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 01:33:43 +0200 | <monochrom> | If you think LLMs know everything, you can get a Bachelor's. When you find out that LLMs don't know anything, you can get a Master's. When you find out that your thesis supervisor is also relying on LLMs, you can get a PhD. |
| 2025-04-29 01:33:46 +0200 | <darkling> | You learn more and more about less and less, until you know everything about nothing... |
| 2025-04-29 01:34:02 +0200 | <darkling> | (At which point, they give you a PhD to get rid of you). |
| 2025-04-29 01:35:52 +0200 | <darkling> | Somewhat glad I'm not in academia any more. Should have got out much earlier. Would have given me more time to get burned out and recover from industry... :/ |
| 2025-04-29 01:37:36 +0200 | acidjnk_new | (~acidjnk@p200300d6e71c4f61394430d048071491.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 01:44:15 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 01:45:51 +0200 | harveypwca | (~harveypwc@2601:246:d080:f6e0:27d6:8cc7:eca9:c46c) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2025-04-29 01:46:48 +0200 | <EvanR> | I would like my Master's now |
| 2025-04-29 01:47:20 +0200 | <EvanR> | 🫴 |
| 2025-04-29 01:47:45 +0200 | <darkling> | Don't bother. It's not worth it. :) |
| 2025-04-29 01:48:00 +0200 | Googulator47 | (~Googulato@2a01-036d-0106-093f-1dc7-297e-fae3-e794.pool6.digikabel.hu) (Quit: Client closed) |
| 2025-04-29 01:48:14 +0200 | Googulator47 | (~Googulato@2a01-036d-0106-093f-1dc7-297e-fae3-e794.pool6.digikabel.hu) |
| 2025-04-29 01:48:40 +0200 | <monochrom> | Nah, Master's is OK, just don't get sucked into PhD. :) |
| 2025-04-29 01:48:42 +0200 | <int-e> | EvanR: those aren't requirements, they're consequences |
| 2025-04-29 01:49:01 +0200 | <int-e> | (also it's a joke) |
| 2025-04-29 01:49:10 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 01:50:05 +0200 | <EvanR> | how do you I wasn't joking! |
| 2025-04-29 01:50:09 +0200 | <EvanR> | know |
| 2025-04-29 01:50:36 +0200 | <monochrom> | <poker face>Everyone is not joking</poker face> |
| 2025-04-29 01:50:39 +0200 | <int-e> | EvanR: I don't |
| 2025-04-29 01:51:17 +0200 | <EvanR> | this joke is serious |
| 2025-04-29 01:51:24 +0200 | <int-e> | EvanR: I mean, you were clearly joking. But I'm not sure what exactly you were joking about ;-) |
| 2025-04-29 01:54:15 +0200 | JuanDaugherty | (~juan@user/JuanDaugherty) (Quit: praxis.meansofproduction.biz (juan@acm.org)) |
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| 2025-04-29 03:05:27 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 03:05:52 +0200 | notdabs | (~Owner@2600:1700:69cf:9000:79ef:6a68:163c:c553) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2025-04-29 03:07:05 +0200 | <EvanR> | haskell is usually taken as using lazy evaluation while e.g. javascript is eager evaluation. If you were to specify "evaluation strategy is not specified", would that force you to write like haskell, or like javascript, or neither, if you didn't care about side effects, exceptions, and performance |
| 2025-04-29 03:08:22 +0200 | <EvanR> | (haskell isn't specified to be lazy, though I'm not sure how relevant it is to this) |
| 2025-04-29 03:10:31 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 03:11:46 +0200 | <c_wraith> | Haskell isn't specified to be lazy, but it is specified to terminate if any evaluation order will do so. It's hard to get that behavior without default laziness |
| 2025-04-29 03:12:29 +0200 | gorignak | (~gorignak@user/gorignak) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 03:13:18 +0200 | <monochrom> | If evaluation isn't specified, then I would need strictness to be specified. The Haskell Report specifies non-strict. |
| 2025-04-29 03:15:30 +0200 | <EvanR> | if neither are specified? |
| 2025-04-29 03:18:34 +0200 | <EvanR> | in some sense lazy evaluation subsumes eager evaluation, so does it mean with no other information you would default to eager? |
| 2025-04-29 03:18:47 +0200 | <monochrom> | If unspecified, then I cannot assume for example const () bottom = (), so pessimistically I will have to write like, well, I don't want to get js involved, but I can work with SML or Racket. |
| 2025-04-29 03:19:00 +0200 | <monochrom> | Yeah, that. |
| 2025-04-29 03:21:11 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 03:21:27 +0200 | <EvanR> | that sucks! |
| 2025-04-29 03:22:52 +0200 | peterbecich | (~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 03:23:46 +0200 | gorignak | (~gorignak@user/gorignak) gorignak |
| 2025-04-29 03:24:56 +0200 | <monochrom> | But I haven't really needed to resort to that. Most languages are sufficiently specified or at least suffciently de-facto'ed. |
| 2025-04-29 03:25:32 +0200 | <EvanR> | they are, though I was wondering to what extent that was necessary |
| 2025-04-29 03:25:58 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 03:26:58 +0200 | <EvanR> | predicting performance aside, the main issue is going into an infinite loop because of insufficient laziness |
| 2025-04-29 03:27:01 +0200 | weary-traveler | (~user@user/user363627) user363627 |
| 2025-04-29 03:30:22 +0200 | <EvanR> | which is where haskell's guarantee comes in |
| 2025-04-29 03:30:43 +0200 | sayurc | (~sayurc@169.150.203.34) sayurc |
| 2025-04-29 03:32:12 +0200 | gorignak | (~gorignak@user/gorignak) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 03:36:59 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
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| 2025-04-29 03:52:47 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 03:56:14 +0200 | xff0x | (~xff0x@2409:251:9040:2c00:42ff:c32a:d7a0:a5f4) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 03:56:58 +0200 | Raito_Bezarius | (~Raito@wireguard/tunneler/raito-bezarius) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
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| 2025-04-29 04:00:13 +0200 | Raito_Bezarius | (~Raito@wireguard/tunneler/raito-bezarius) Raito_Bezarius |
| 2025-04-29 04:08:33 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 04:13:38 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 04:16:39 +0200 | tavare | (~tavare@150.129.88.189) tavare |
| 2025-04-29 04:16:40 +0200 | tavare | (~tavare@150.129.88.189) (Changing host) |
| 2025-04-29 04:16:40 +0200 | tavare | (~tavare@user/tavare) tavare |
| 2025-04-29 04:17:19 +0200 | tavare | (~tavare@user/tavare) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2025-04-29 04:20:14 +0200 | td_ | (~td@i53870908.versanet.de) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 04:21:59 +0200 | td_ | (~td@i53870912.versanet.de) |
| 2025-04-29 04:24:22 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 04:25:20 +0200 | Typedfern | (~Typedfern@135.red-83-37-43.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) |
| 2025-04-29 04:30:53 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 04:31:35 +0200 | Sgeo_ | (~Sgeo@user/sgeo) Sgeo |
| 2025-04-29 04:34:10 +0200 | Sgeo | (~Sgeo@user/sgeo) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 04:38:09 +0200 | Feuermagier | (~Feuermagi@user/feuermagier) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 04:39:50 +0200 | prdak | (~Thunderbi@user/prdak) prdak |
| 2025-04-29 04:41:56 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 04:44:04 +0200 | prdak | (~Thunderbi@user/prdak) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 04:46:01 +0200 | Feuermagier | (~Feuermagi@user/feuermagier) Feuermagier |
| 2025-04-29 04:46:09 +0200 | Feuermagier | (~Feuermagi@user/feuermagier) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2025-04-29 04:46:41 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 04:57:41 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 04:58:32 +0200 | bitdex | (~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) bitdex |
| 2025-04-29 04:59:18 +0200 | Unicorn_Princess | (~Unicorn_P@user/Unicorn-Princess/x-3540542) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2025-04-29 05:02:41 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 05:13:29 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 05:18:13 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 05:28:26 +0200 | Square2 | (~Square4@user/square) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 05:28:57 +0200 | j1n37 | (~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2025-04-29 05:29:16 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 05:35:22 +0200 | peterbecich | (~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) peterbecich |
| 2025-04-29 05:35:43 +0200 | j1n37 | (~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37 |
| 2025-04-29 05:35:59 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 05:36:34 +0200 | j1n37 | (~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2025-04-29 05:40:18 +0200 | j1n37 | (~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37 |
| 2025-04-29 05:41:55 +0200 | j1n37 | (~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2025-04-29 05:45:40 +0200 | j1n37 | (~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37 |
| 2025-04-29 05:46:42 +0200 | j1n37 | (~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2025-04-29 05:47:19 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 05:48:05 +0200 | michalz | (~michalz@185.246.207.205) |
| 2025-04-29 05:51:20 +0200 | j1n37 | (~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37 |
| 2025-04-29 05:52:28 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 06:03:08 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 06:04:39 +0200 | OftenFaded | (~OftenFade@user/tisktisk) OftenFaded |
| 2025-04-29 06:04:41 +0200 | fp | (~Thunderbi@87-94-239-173.bb.dnainternet.fi) fp |
| 2025-04-29 06:10:42 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 06:15:04 +0200 | Fijxu | (~Fijxu@user/fijxu) (Quit: XD!!) |
| 2025-04-29 06:17:41 +0200 | Digitteknohippie | (~user@user/digit) Digit |
| 2025-04-29 06:17:54 +0200 | Fijxu | (~Fijxu@user/fijxu) fijxu |
| 2025-04-29 06:18:40 +0200 | Digit | (~user@user/digit) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 06:21:01 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 06:21:23 +0200 | Fijxu | (~Fijxu@user/fijxu) (Quit: XD!!) |
| 2025-04-29 06:22:19 +0200 | gabiruh_ | (~gabiruh@vps19177.publiccloud.com.br) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 06:26:04 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 06:27:25 +0200 | OftenFaded | (~OftenFade@user/tisktisk) (Quit: Client closed) |
| 2025-04-29 06:30:06 +0200 | gabiruh | (~gabiruh@vps19177.publiccloud.com.br) gabiruh |
| 2025-04-29 06:31:05 +0200 | j1n37- | (~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37 |
| 2025-04-29 06:32:14 +0200 | Fijxu | (~Fijxu@user/fijxu) fijxu |
| 2025-04-29 06:32:14 +0200 | j1n37 | (~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 06:36:48 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 06:42:25 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 06:47:51 +0200 | zlqrvx | (~zlqrvx@2001:8003:8c8b:e00:374a:bdcb:457c:d1e3) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2025-04-29 06:48:22 +0200 | zlqrvx | (~zlqrvx@101.175.150.247) |
| 2025-04-29 06:50:13 +0200 | peterbecich | (~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 06:52:36 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 06:53:19 +0200 | Digitteknohippie | Digit |
| 2025-04-29 06:57:21 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 07:01:27 +0200 | elnegro | (elnegro@r186-50-156-231.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy) elnegro |
| 2025-04-29 07:05:54 +0200 | j1n37- | (~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2025-04-29 07:08:23 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 07:08:59 +0200 | j1n37 | (~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37 |
| 2025-04-29 07:10:42 +0200 | elnegro | (elnegro@r186-50-156-231.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy) () |
| 2025-04-29 07:15:30 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 07:22:14 +0200 | j1n37 | (~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2025-04-29 07:22:33 +0200 | takuan | (~takuan@d8D86B601.access.telenet.be) |
| 2025-04-29 07:23:22 +0200 | werneta | (~werneta@syn-071-083-160-242.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 07:25:46 +0200 | fp | (~Thunderbi@87-94-239-173.bb.dnainternet.fi) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 07:25:52 +0200 | j1n37 | (~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37 |
| 2025-04-29 07:26:27 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 07:27:40 +0200 | peterbecich | (~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) peterbecich |
| 2025-04-29 07:29:16 +0200 | j1n37 | (~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2025-04-29 07:31:10 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 07:32:19 +0200 | j1n37 | (~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37 |
| 2025-04-29 07:34:27 +0200 | akegalj | (~akegalj@83-131-244-60.adsl.net.t-com.hr) akegalj |
| 2025-04-29 07:41:48 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 07:47:01 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 07:52:10 +0200 | acidjnk_new | (~acidjnk@p200300d6e71c4f61394430d048071491.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 2025-04-29 07:55:48 +0200 | Sgeo_ | (~Sgeo@user/sgeo) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2025-04-29 07:57:36 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 08:00:31 +0200 | dutchie | (~dutchie@user/dutchie) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2025-04-29 08:01:41 +0200 | mikess | (~sam@user/mikess) mikess |
| 2025-04-29 08:02:22 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 08:06:17 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 08:10:14 +0200 | euphores | (~SASL_euph@user/euphores) (Quit: Leaving.) |
| 2025-04-29 08:10:29 +0200 | peterbecich | (~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 08:11:29 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 08:16:21 +0200 | euphores | (~SASL_euph@user/euphores) euphores |
| 2025-04-29 08:22:52 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 08:24:00 +0200 | haritz | (~hrtz@user/haritz) (Quit: ZNC 1.8.2+deb3.1+deb12u1 - https://znc.in) |
| 2025-04-29 08:27:39 +0200 | fp | (~Thunderbi@2001:708:20:1406::1370) fp |
| 2025-04-29 08:27:43 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 08:28:22 +0200 | acidjnk_new | (~acidjnk@p200300d6e71c4f61394430d048071491.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 08:38:16 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 08:42:54 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 08:45:47 +0200 | acidjnk_new | (~acidjnk@p54ad5829.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 2025-04-29 08:54:02 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 08:56:14 +0200 | tzh | (~tzh@c-76-115-131-146.hsd1.or.comcast.net) (Quit: zzz) |
| 2025-04-29 09:00:04 +0200 | akegalj | (~akegalj@83-131-244-60.adsl.net.t-com.hr) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 09:00:05 +0200 | caconym7 | (~caconym@user/caconym) (Quit: bye) |
| 2025-04-29 09:00:43 +0200 | caconym7 | (~caconym@user/caconym) caconym |
| 2025-04-29 09:01:14 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 09:05:27 +0200 | dutchie | (~dutchie@user/dutchie) dutchie |
| 2025-04-29 09:07:14 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 09:12:06 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 09:12:25 +0200 | akegalj | (~akegalj@144-188.dsl.iskon.hr) |
| 2025-04-29 09:18:25 +0200 | akegalj | (~akegalj@144-188.dsl.iskon.hr) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 09:20:58 +0200 | ljdarj | (~Thunderbi@user/ljdarj) ljdarj |
| 2025-04-29 09:21:47 +0200 | Lord_of_Life_ | (~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915) Lord_of_Life |
| 2025-04-29 09:22:36 +0200 | Lord_of_Life | (~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 09:23:08 +0200 | Lord_of_Life_ | Lord_of_Life |
| 2025-04-29 09:30:04 +0200 | econo_ | (uid147250@id-147250.tinside.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) |
| 2025-04-29 09:30:30 +0200 | dutchie_ | (~dutchie@user/dutchie) dutchie |
| 2025-04-29 09:32:48 +0200 | dutchie | (~dutchie@user/dutchie) (Killed (NickServ (GHOST command used by dutchie_))) |
| 2025-04-29 09:32:51 +0200 | dutchie_ | dutchie |
| 2025-04-29 09:33:38 +0200 | j1n37- | (~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37 |
| 2025-04-29 09:34:39 +0200 | j1n37 | (~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 09:43:29 +0200 | emmanuelux | (~emmanuelu@user/emmanuelux) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2025-04-29 09:43:46 +0200 | ljdarj | (~Thunderbi@user/ljdarj) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 09:48:15 +0200 | mari-estel | (~mari-este@user/mari-estel) mari-estel |
| 2025-04-29 09:51:44 +0200 | Guest17 | (~Guest17@2a01:4b00:84f0:ef00:382c:2ec8:780c:c40) |
| 2025-04-29 09:52:02 +0200 | Guest17 | (~Guest17@2a01:4b00:84f0:ef00:382c:2ec8:780c:c40) (Client Quit) |
| 2025-04-29 09:52:09 +0200 | gmg | (~user@user/gehmehgeh) gehmehgeh |
| 2025-04-29 09:55:37 +0200 | aku | (aku@65.108.245.241) (Quit: Lost terminal) |
| 2025-04-29 09:56:22 +0200 | Guest17 | (~Guest17@2a01:4b00:84f0:ef00:382c:2ec8:780c:c40) |
| 2025-04-29 09:56:46 +0200 | aku | (aku@65.108.245.241) eagleflo |
| 2025-04-29 09:57:03 +0200 | Guest17 | (~Guest17@2a01:4b00:84f0:ef00:382c:2ec8:780c:c40) (Client Quit) |
| 2025-04-29 09:58:54 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@77.242.116.146) merijn |
| 2025-04-29 10:02:54 +0200 | nernst | (~nernst@188.214.9.73) |
| 2025-04-29 10:04:20 +0200 | ljdarj | (~Thunderbi@user/ljdarj) ljdarj |
| 2025-04-29 10:07:14 +0200 | machinedgod | (~machinedg@d108-173-18-100.abhsia.telus.net) machinedgod |
| 2025-04-29 10:14:11 +0200 | akegalj | (~akegalj@95.168.121.7) |
| 2025-04-29 10:19:36 +0200 | __monty__ | (~toonn@user/toonn) toonn |
| 2025-04-29 10:21:50 +0200 | ft | (~ft@p4fc2a6e6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Quit: leaving) |
| 2025-04-29 10:27:33 +0200 | mikess | (~sam@user/mikess) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 10:32:36 +0200 | xff0x | (~xff0x@2409:251:9040:2c00:cf62:b619:dd0:f1a5) |
| 2025-04-29 10:37:22 +0200 | weary-traveler | (~user@user/user363627) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2025-04-29 10:38:22 +0200 | xff0x | (~xff0x@2409:251:9040:2c00:cf62:b619:dd0:f1a5) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 10:39:01 +0200 | fp | (~Thunderbi@2001:708:20:1406::1370) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 10:44:06 +0200 | fp | (~Thunderbi@wireless-86-50-140-117.open.aalto.fi) fp |
| 2025-04-29 10:51:14 +0200 | Googulator71 | (~Googulato@94-21-139-144.pool.digikabel.hu) |
| 2025-04-29 10:54:06 +0200 | Googulator47 | (~Googulato@2a01-036d-0106-093f-1dc7-297e-fae3-e794.pool6.digikabel.hu) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 11:01:00 +0200 | ljdarj | (~Thunderbi@user/ljdarj) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 11:03:16 +0200 | j1n37 | (~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37 |
| 2025-04-29 11:03:44 +0200 | j1n37- | (~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 11:06:49 +0200 | dhil | (~dhil@5.151.29.137) dhil |
| 2025-04-29 11:19:58 +0200 | dhil | (~dhil@5.151.29.137) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 11:23:56 +0200 | chele | (~chele@user/chele) chele |
| 2025-04-29 11:32:36 +0200 | dhil | (~dhil@openvpn-125-1069.inf.ed.ac.uk) dhil |
| 2025-04-29 11:37:58 +0200 | dhil | (~dhil@openvpn-125-1069.inf.ed.ac.uk) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 11:40:17 +0200 | amadaluzia | (~amadaluzi@user/amadaluzia) amadaluzia |
| 2025-04-29 11:43:44 +0200 | kindlyremote79 | (~ernie@188-115-167-65.broadband.tenet.odessa.ua) |
| 2025-04-29 11:47:51 +0200 | kindlyremote79 | (~ernie@188-115-167-65.broadband.tenet.odessa.ua) () |
| 2025-04-29 11:50:20 +0200 | dhil | (~dhil@5.151.29.139) dhil |
| 2025-04-29 11:55:08 +0200 | j1n37- | (~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37 |
| 2025-04-29 11:55:39 +0200 | j1n37 | (~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 11:58:09 +0200 | wootehfoot | (~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot) wootehfoot |
| 2025-04-29 12:01:04 +0200 | califax | (~califax@user/califx) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2025-04-29 12:02:34 +0200 | califax | (~califax@user/califx) califx |
| 2025-04-29 12:11:04 +0200 | xff0x | (~xff0x@2409:251:9040:2c00:709f:303f:f5cb:a092) |
| 2025-04-29 12:18:05 +0200 | fp | (~Thunderbi@wireless-86-50-140-117.open.aalto.fi) (Quit: fp) |
| 2025-04-29 12:18:14 +0200 | fp2 | (~Thunderbi@wireless-86-50-140-117.open.aalto.fi) fp |
| 2025-04-29 12:20:40 +0200 | fp2 | fp |
| 2025-04-29 12:21:12 +0200 | talismanick | (~user@2601:644:937c:ed10::ae5) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 12:23:37 +0200 | tromp | (~textual@2001:1c00:3487:1b00:81f6:6a75:5fad:c9b4) |
| 2025-04-29 12:38:55 +0200 | wlhn | (~wlhn@130.41.101.92) wlhn |
| 2025-04-29 12:39:17 +0200 | xff0x | (~xff0x@2409:251:9040:2c00:709f:303f:f5cb:a092) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 12:39:48 +0200 | ljdarj | (~Thunderbi@user/ljdarj) ljdarj |
| 2025-04-29 12:45:07 +0200 | fp | (~Thunderbi@wireless-86-50-140-117.open.aalto.fi) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 12:49:10 +0200 | nernst | (~nernst@188.214.9.73) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2025-04-29 12:49:26 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> the Maybe type is a horrible mistake |
| 2025-04-29 12:49:34 +0200 | nernst | (~nernst@188.214.9.73) |
| 2025-04-29 12:49:55 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> or more correctly, Stream s => Maybe s |
| 2025-04-29 12:50:40 +0200 | akegalj | (~akegalj@95.168.121.7) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2025-04-29 12:51:02 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> See, I'm hand-building a parser from Text.Strict.Text to Maybe ByteString.Strict on the assumption that the input data is chars between '0' and 'f' inclusive |
| 2025-04-29 12:51:56 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> and, the number of chars is even |
| 2025-04-29 12:51:58 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> if these conditions aren't met, it'll return a Nothing |
| 2025-04-29 12:52:04 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> HOWEVER, it breaks composition, doesn't it? |
| 2025-04-29 12:52:26 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> because either the function composition or the <$> operator will be checking for the Nothing type, causing the entire stream to be actualized |
| 2025-04-29 12:52:32 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> erm, Nothing value |
| 2025-04-29 12:52:39 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> any ideas? |
| 2025-04-29 12:53:31 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> The problem is that I'm depending on ByteString.Strict.pack, so I'm out of luck; it's breaking function composition, otherwise I could do it with a foldr |
| 2025-04-29 12:56:52 +0200 | Digitteknohippie | (~user@user/digit) Digit |
| 2025-04-29 12:58:15 +0200 | Digit | (~user@user/digit) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 12:59:55 +0200 | mari72280 | (~mari-este@user/mari-estel) mari-estel |
| 2025-04-29 13:00:05 +0200 | nernst | (~nernst@188.214.9.73) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2025-04-29 13:00:59 +0200 | mari-estel | (~mari-este@user/mari-estel) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2025-04-29 13:01:47 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | Liamzee: yes, producing a 'Maybe a' means that you have to tell whether you will return _anything_ before you get to return something |
| 2025-04-29 13:02:08 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | in return, a consumer gets to know whether there is info here before starting to process said info |
| 2025-04-29 13:02:41 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | a stream type that can raise an error later during processing allows a producer to start producing data already before it knows whether the whole process will be successful |
| 2025-04-29 13:02:49 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> is there a way around it? I'm working with Hasql and I'm trying to replicate its explicit exception philosophy |
| 2025-04-29 13:03:04 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | in return, a consumer is forced to already start consuming data before knowing whether there is even supposed to be data in the first place |
| 2025-04-29 13:03:06 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> i'm also learning "hey, force / ! on inputs when you're going into IO is a good idea!" |
| 2025-04-29 13:03:19 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | neither is always better than the other |
| 2025-04-29 13:03:39 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> i mean the target is a strict bytestring |
| 2025-04-29 13:03:48 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> so it's known that the data will be extant on use |
| 2025-04-29 13:03:56 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> source: strict text, target, strict bytestring |
| 2025-04-29 13:04:03 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | "target" of the producer or the consumer? |
| 2025-04-29 13:04:14 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> also, Bytestring.pack points to packBytes, which on strict uses List.length |
| 2025-04-29 13:04:15 +0200 | haskellbridge | Liamzee giggles |
| 2025-04-29 13:04:33 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | there's little else it can do, is there? |
| 2025-04-29 13:04:51 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> the output of the strict bytestring |
| 2025-04-29 13:05:28 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | so you want to transform a strict text to a strict bytestring, and be able to bail out halfway through if it turns out the Text wasn't valid somehow? |
| 2025-04-29 13:05:44 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> https://paste.tomsmeding.com/mFWq0v2a |
| 2025-04-29 13:05:46 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> yeah |
| 2025-04-29 13:05:49 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | without having to check the whole Text before starting to write the ByteString |
| 2025-04-29 13:06:03 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> also the massive if is because i'm not going to import data.map for this |
| 2025-04-29 13:06:59 +0200 | fp | (~Thunderbi@wireless-86-50-140-117.open.aalto.fi) fp |
| 2025-04-29 13:07:01 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | uh, what about `\c -> if '0' <= c && c <= '9' then ord c - ord '0' else 10 + ord c - ord 'a'`? |
| 2025-04-29 13:07:02 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <loonycyborg> wouldn't it stop processing automatically once it determines that input is invalid? |
| 2025-04-29 13:07:09 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | less code, clearer, and faster |
| 2025-04-29 13:08:23 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | Liamzee: for completeness, you can write what I think you want manually using ST: allocate a mutable array in ST, and write stuff into it monadically; if you succeed, freeze the array to a bytestring with some of their unsafe functions, and if not, just bail out and leave the array to be picked up by GC |
| 2025-04-29 13:08:29 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> you're right, the both of you |
| 2025-04-29 13:08:37 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | it's not particularly compositional, but it does work |
| 2025-04-29 13:08:44 +0200 | Chai-T-Rex | (~ChaiTRex@user/chaitrex) ChaiTRex |
| 2025-04-29 13:09:05 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | streaming libraries probably abstract over this pattern |
| 2025-04-29 13:09:06 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <loonycyborg> or you want to load bytestring itself in chunks? |
| 2025-04-29 13:09:44 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | Liamzee: worth noting here is that if you're starting from a strict Text, then you won't stream that -- it's strict, after all |
| 2025-04-29 13:09:48 +0200 | ChaiTRex | (~ChaiTRex@user/chaitrex) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 13:09:59 +0200 | Digitteknohippie | Digit |
| 2025-04-29 13:10:07 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> ? |
| 2025-04-29 13:10:21 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | so the only upside of traversing it once (and writing the ByteString along the way) -- as opposed to doing a checking pass and then an always-successful writing pass -- is that you don't read the input twice |
| 2025-04-29 13:10:27 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> If I have a streaming function operating on the strict text, the text is discrete, but the work being done on the text should be streamable |
| 2025-04-29 13:10:41 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | there is no such thing as "streaming work" |
| 2025-04-29 13:10:50 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | there _is_ such a thing as streaming data |
| 2025-04-29 13:11:12 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | or actually, I guess "streaming work" could be a different way to say "loop fusion" |
| 2025-04-29 13:11:23 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> ya |
| 2025-04-29 13:11:32 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> the code is disgusting, but i should go finish the library first |
| 2025-04-29 13:11:40 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> i wonder if anyone would help fix it, but someone already pointed out it's a bad idea |
| 2025-04-29 13:11:58 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | but if you're talking about "streaming work", then there should be work to stream -- if you're going from strict text to strict bytestring, then there is no other work to fuse with this |
| 2025-04-29 13:12:23 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> in the sense that the code is obviously doing multiple streams |
| 2025-04-29 13:12:32 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | GHC is not going to magically eliminate e.g. the intermediate strict bytestring if you process the bytestring immediately after creating it |
| 2025-04-29 13:12:36 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | mostly because it's strict |
| 2025-04-29 13:12:49 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> chunksOfTwo does a full allocation of the list first |
| 2025-04-29 13:12:57 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | if you use a _lazy_ bytestring, you can stream the data, and hence laziness will produce in some kind of "work streaming" too |
| 2025-04-29 13:13:26 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | oh I see |
| 2025-04-29 13:13:33 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | so you already have two passes here |
| 2025-04-29 13:14:03 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> fmap ByteString.pack |
| 2025-04-29 13:14:14 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> so it'd need to know whether the output of the intermediate types is Nothing or Just |
| 2025-04-29 13:14:14 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> which is fine |
| 2025-04-29 13:14:27 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | I've never worked with streaming libraries personally, but I would look into prior art here, even if you don't decide to use such a library as-is but build your own thing |
| 2025-04-29 13:14:46 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> thanks for the suggestion |
| 2025-04-29 13:15:01 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | the ST thing I described is what you want to happen operationally |
| 2025-04-29 13:15:05 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> the setup is that I'm trying to build something at least 3 people have said is a bad idea, but when has that ever stopped me? |
| 2025-04-29 13:15:09 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | everything else is, somehow, an abstraction over that |
| 2025-04-29 13:15:16 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> ya, of course |
| 2025-04-29 13:15:17 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | heh |
| 2025-04-29 13:15:33 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> trying to build sane safe defaults for a login library |
| 2025-04-29 13:15:47 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | Liamzee: https://github.com/Bodigrim/linear-builder is an interesting bit of prior art perhaps |
| 2025-04-29 13:15:50 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> so, you have functions that call into postgresql for you without needing you to write any code |
| 2025-04-29 13:16:12 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | it's not a full streaming library, doesn't model "bailing out" |
| 2025-04-29 13:16:17 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> and let you have a simple way to set up a login / registration system |
| 2025-04-29 13:16:21 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> ah |
| 2025-04-29 13:16:29 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | but maybe it gives inspiration |
| 2025-04-29 13:16:50 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> this is just part of my library since I generate a random bytestring (512 bytes) as an authcode for validation |
| 2025-04-29 13:17:05 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | re login library: that sounds like a thing that looks good to people who've written 2 crud applications, and is a bad idea to people who've written 10 |
| 2025-04-29 13:17:11 +0200 | tomsmeding | has written <=2 |
| 2025-04-29 13:17:48 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | personally I'd separate the application-level logic from the database interaction logic |
| 2025-04-29 13:18:02 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | i.e. have your library take user hooks for actually writing to and reading from the database |
| 2025-04-29 13:18:06 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> yeah of course |
| 2025-04-29 13:18:06 +0200 | <shapr> | GOOD MORNING HASKELL LAND! |
| 2025-04-29 13:18:07 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> it's just functions |
| 2025-04-29 13:18:10 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | that separates it from a particular DB implementation |
| 2025-04-29 13:18:12 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> i spent 2 weeks learning enough |
| 2025-04-29 13:18:16 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> GOOD MORNING SHAPR |
| 2025-04-29 13:18:19 +0200 | <shapr> | w00! |
| 2025-04-29 13:18:20 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | shapr: hello! |
| 2025-04-29 13:18:26 +0200 | <shapr> | Hiya tomsmeding ! |
| 2025-04-29 13:18:28 +0200 | <shapr> | Hello Liamzee! |
| 2025-04-29 13:18:35 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | not morning any more here though :) |
| 2025-04-29 13:18:51 +0200 | <shapr> | It's true, morning is a temporary thing |
| 2025-04-29 13:18:56 +0200 | <shapr> | It's a beautiful day for code! |
| 2025-04-29 13:18:59 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> I spent 2 weeks learning enough postgreSQL-simple, lucid, and twain to build half a login and authentication system |
| 2025-04-29 13:19:01 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | so it is |
| 2025-04-29 13:19:14 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | sounds like a fun way to learn these things |
| 2025-04-29 13:19:15 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> time has no meaning for me, there is only the eternal now (and not now) |
| 2025-04-29 13:19:26 +0200 | <shapr> | Hm, that does sound familiar |
| 2025-04-29 13:19:34 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | "not now" is an important one |
| 2025-04-29 13:19:46 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> so i just want to abstract it so that people need less knowledge in order to slap together a basic Haskell web application |
| 2025-04-29 13:19:54 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> (not now implies death) |
| 2025-04-29 13:20:06 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | it doesn't, there are many things I will not do now |
| 2025-04-29 13:20:14 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | such as graduate |
| 2025-04-29 13:20:23 +0200 | <shapr> | are you on the path towards graduation? |
| 2025-04-29 13:20:33 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | <1 year to phd graduation, if everything goes according to plan |
| 2025-04-29 13:20:38 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> welp, not going to get into a complicated philosophy discussion |
| 2025-04-29 13:20:39 +0200 | <shapr> | w00t! |
| 2025-04-29 13:20:43 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | at least, my contract runs out in <1 year :p |
| 2025-04-29 13:20:54 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> that is to say, our certainty of "now" is greater than our certainty of the past or the future |
| 2025-04-29 13:21:01 +0200 | <shapr> | Ah, Utrecht? |
| 2025-04-29 13:21:03 +0200 | tomsmeding | has no clue about philosophy |
| 2025-04-29 13:21:06 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | yep |
| 2025-04-29 13:21:12 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> we have direct experiential knowledge of what happens now, but what happened before is only something we know from memory |
| 2025-04-29 13:21:35 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | (Liamzee saying "not going to do X" before proceeding to do X) |
| 2025-04-29 13:21:41 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> consequently we live in an eternal now, at any time we are alive, we constantly experience the now as privileged toward the past |
| 2025-04-29 13:21:47 +0200 | <shapr> | CHAD looks like fun |
| 2025-04-29 13:21:48 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> i do this too often :( |
| 2025-04-29 13:21:57 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | hacking on chad right now, actually! |
| 2025-04-29 13:22:39 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | debugging the simplifier of my toy language, it does incorrect simplifications sometimes |
| 2025-04-29 13:24:01 +0200 | jacopovalanzano | (~jacopoval@86.24.252.106) |
| 2025-04-29 13:24:27 +0200 | jacopovalanzano | (~jacopoval@86.24.252.106) (Client Quit) |
| 2025-04-29 13:24:47 +0200 | statusbot12 | (~statusbot@ec2-34-198-122-184.compute-1.amazonaws.com) statusbot |
| 2025-04-29 13:25:30 +0200 | statusbot | (~statusbot@ec2-34-198-122-184.compute-1.amazonaws.com) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2025-04-29 13:26:45 +0200 | rvalue | (~rvalue@user/rvalue) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2025-04-29 13:27:17 +0200 | rvalue | (~rvalue@user/rvalue) rvalue |
| 2025-04-29 13:27:49 +0200 | akegalj | (~akegalj@144-188.dsl.iskon.hr) |
| 2025-04-29 13:28:11 +0200 | __monty__ | (~toonn@user/toonn) (Quit: leaving) |
| 2025-04-29 13:32:34 +0200 | fp | (~Thunderbi@wireless-86-50-140-117.open.aalto.fi) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 13:39:29 +0200 | euphores | (~SASL_euph@user/euphores) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 13:46:07 +0200 | euphores | (~SASL_euph@user/euphores) euphores |
| 2025-04-29 13:46:14 +0200 | <shapr> | @quote |
| 2025-04-29 13:46:14 +0200 | <lambdabot> | jonrafkind says: every time you use a list as an ad-hoc datastructure, a kitten dies |
| 2025-04-29 13:46:29 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | I'm currently using a list as an ad-hoc data structure |
| 2025-04-29 13:46:38 +0200 | <shapr> | they're virtual kittens, it's okay |
| 2025-04-29 13:46:48 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | phew |
| 2025-04-29 13:52:40 +0200 | fp | (~Thunderbi@2001:708:20:1406::1370) fp |
| 2025-04-29 13:52:43 +0200 | internatetional | (~nate@2404:c0:2020::118:9ffb) internatetional |
| 2025-04-29 13:52:55 +0200 | tromp | (~textual@2001:1c00:3487:1b00:81f6:6a75:5fad:c9b4) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
| 2025-04-29 13:53:54 +0200 | Typedfern | (~Typedfern@135.red-83-37-43.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 2025-04-29 13:54:15 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <Liamzee> some people use kitten emojis as substitutes for the >>= operator. Reducing bind traversals improves performance, so killing 🐱 operators is fine. |