2025/01/12

2025-01-12 00:00:21 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn
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2025-01-12 00:11:02 +0100troydm(~troydm@user/troydm) (Quit: What is Hope? That all of your wishes and all of your dreams come true? To turn back time because things were not supposed to happen like that (C) Rau Le Creuset)
2025-01-12 00:13:54 +0100mhatta(~mhatta@www21123ui.sakura.ne.jp) (Quit: ZNC 1.9.1+deb2+b1 - https://znc.in)
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2025-01-12 01:22:28 +0100 <monochrom> Clearly, design patterns and anti-patterns depend on the language.
2025-01-12 01:23:14 +0100 <monochrom> I had a student who tried to write Haskell in Python. I gave them a very low mark. If you use Python, you play to the strength of Python. If you use Haskell, you play to the strength of Haskell.
2025-01-12 01:24:55 +0100 <monochrom> In that student's case, the assignment was to first use algebraic data types in Haskell to define a type for boolean expressions and functions for evaluations. Then the next question is "how would you code this up in Python?"
2025-01-12 01:26:02 +0100 <monochrom> Clearly, in Python you would not make an algebraic type, you would make a Not class, And class, Or class; and the evaluation function would be a common method.
2025-01-12 01:26:07 +0100dtman34(~dtman34@2601:447:d080:1a3c:198e:8888:ba04:6650) dtman34
2025-01-12 01:26:23 +0100 <c_wraith> but then you've turned the expression problem sideways!
2025-01-12 01:26:48 +0100 <c_wraith> the python should be using the visitor pattern. :P
2025-01-12 01:27:01 +0100 <monochrom> But the student was too excited by Haskell, so they went overboard and translate Haskell pattern matching to Python. "if instanceof(e, Or) ... elif instanceof(e, And) .. elif ..."
2025-01-12 01:27:23 +0100 <c_wraith> so... they should have used the visitor pattern.
2025-01-12 01:27:55 +0100 <monochrom> I would be very impressed if they used the visitor pattern.
2025-01-12 01:28:23 +0100 <c_wraith> Huh. I guess the visitor pattern is sort of a catamorphism that uses algebras encoded as an object.
2025-01-12 01:28:35 +0100 <monochrom> For mere mortals, the composite pattern would be good enough and pretty easy to understand actually.
2025-01-12 01:29:17 +0100 <monochrom> But the whole point of Python and Java is if you write "instanceof" you're commiting a crime.
2025-01-12 01:30:42 +0100 <c_wraith> crimes against parametricity
2025-01-12 01:30:52 +0100 <monochrom> haha
2025-01-12 01:31:45 +0100 <c_wraith> Lots of python code commits crimes against parametricity
2025-01-12 01:32:02 +0100 <c_wraith> It tries to be "friendly" instead of "type safe"
2025-01-12 01:32:47 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn
2025-01-12 01:33:09 +0100 <c_wraith> that's less common in java, but not absent. (Same root cause...)
2025-01-12 01:37:40 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2025-01-12 01:46:23 +0100 <haskellbridge> <Bowuigi> c_wraith re:catamorphism https://www.haskellforall.com/2021/01/the-visitor-pattern-is-essentially-same.html this is relevant I guess
2025-01-12 01:48:09 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn
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2025-01-12 02:11:44 +0100TheCoffeMaker(~TheCoffeM@user/thecoffemaker) (Quit: So long and thanks for all the fish)
2025-01-12 02:12:07 +0100TheCoffeMaker(~TheCoffeM@user/thecoffemaker) TheCoffeMaker
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2025-01-12 04:25:46 +0100 <Square> How would I write a performance test for a "value". I want to compute it N times and see how long it takes
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2025-01-12 04:30:25 +0100img(~img@user/img) (Quit: ZNC 1.8.2 - https://znc.in)
2025-01-12 04:32:11 +0100img(~img@user/img) img
2025-01-12 04:37:21 +0100vanishingideal(~vanishing@user/vanishingideal) vanishingideal
2025-01-12 04:39:34 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn
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2025-01-12 04:44:24 +0100terrorjack45(~terrorjac@2a01:4f8:c17:a66e::) (Quit: The Lounge - https://thelounge.chat)
2025-01-12 04:45:38 +0100bitdex(~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) bitdex
2025-01-12 04:46:03 +0100terrorjack45(~terrorjac@2a01:4f8:c17:a66e::) terrorjack
2025-01-12 04:46:30 +0100 <Square> I guess my question is, how do I make sure a value isn't cached, but instead recalculated
2025-01-12 04:47:18 +0100 <c_wraith> write the thing that calculates it as a function. use criterion to pass the function its input.
2025-01-12 04:49:40 +0100 <c_wraith> criterion uses module boundaries to prevent inlining so that GHC doesn't notice it's passing the same argument to the same function over and over.
2025-01-12 04:50:01 +0100 <c_wraith> it also does the benchmarking. Kind of like that's what it was designed to do
2025-01-12 04:54:57 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn
2025-01-12 04:58:19 +0100 <Square> c_wraith, thanks. Yeah, got criterion up and running
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2025-01-12 05:10:19 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn
2025-01-12 05:12:08 +0100sayurc(~sayurc@169.150.203.34) sayurc
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2025-01-12 05:45:26 +0100 <Leary> tomsmeding: `null . drop 1 . nub`
2025-01-12 05:47:46 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
2025-01-12 05:50:07 +0100peterbecich(~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) peterbecich
2025-01-12 05:54:38 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn
2025-01-12 05:55:27 +0100 <Leary> (you can also replace `nub` with `group` if you want the performance to be more obvious, but they should be pretty similar)
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2025-01-12 09:35:36 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn
2025-01-12 09:38:54 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37
2025-01-12 09:40:30 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2025-01-12 09:41:35 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-01-12 09:45:18 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37
2025-01-12 09:46:39 +0100tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2025-01-12 09:48:04 +0100__monty__(~toonn@user/toonn) toonn
2025-01-12 09:49:36 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-01-12 09:50:59 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn
2025-01-12 09:52:39 +0100peterbecich(~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) (Quit: peterbecich)
2025-01-12 09:53:44 +0100peterbecich(~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) peterbecich
2025-01-12 09:55:07 +0100__monty__(~toonn@user/toonn) (Quit: leaving)
2025-01-12 09:55:50 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2025-01-12 09:56:04 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37
2025-01-12 09:56:28 +0100ash3en(~Thunderbi@2a03:7846:b6eb:101:93ac:a90a:da67:f207) ash3en
2025-01-12 09:57:41 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn
2025-01-12 09:58:22 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-01-12 09:58:46 +0100tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl)
2025-01-12 10:01:37 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37
2025-01-12 10:02:15 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2025-01-12 10:03:26 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-01-12 10:03:57 +0100eL_Bart0(eL_Bart0@dietunichtguten.org) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2025-01-12 10:06:37 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37
2025-01-12 10:10:07 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-01-12 10:10:58 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37
2025-01-12 10:14:03 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn
2025-01-12 10:16:31 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-01-12 10:18:00 +0100raym(~ray@user/raym) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2025-01-12 10:18:35 +0100raym(~ray@user/raym) raym
2025-01-12 10:18:39 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2025-01-12 10:19:34 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37
2025-01-12 10:22:06 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-01-12 10:22:38 +0100peterbecich(~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
2025-01-12 10:22:48 +0100target_i(~target_i@user/target-i/x-6023099) target_i
2025-01-12 10:25:35 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37
2025-01-12 10:28:08 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-01-12 10:29:24 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn
2025-01-12 10:31:41 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37
2025-01-12 10:32:55 +0100acidjnk_new(~acidjnk@p200300d6e7283f06145d2259bf66d21b.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) acidjnk
2025-01-12 10:33:10 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-01-12 10:33:42 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2025-01-12 10:36:12 +0100tzh(~tzh@c-76-115-131-146.hsd1.or.comcast.net) (Quit: zzz)
2025-01-12 10:37:23 +0100Feuermagier(~Feuermagi@user/feuermagier) (Quit: Leaving)
2025-01-12 10:37:30 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37
2025-01-12 10:43:26 +0100mreh(~matthew@host86-146-25-121.range86-146.btcentralplus.com)
2025-01-12 10:44:15 +0100CiaoSen(~Jura@2a05:5800:2c9:5b00:ca4b:d6ff:fec1:99da) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2025-01-12 10:48:18 +0100vanishingideal(~vanishing@user/vanishingideal) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
2025-01-12 10:50:11 +0100vanishingideal(~vanishing@user/vanishingideal) vanishingideal
2025-01-12 10:50:34 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn
2025-01-12 10:55:03 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2025-01-12 10:58:39 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn
2025-01-12 10:59:24 +0100takuan(~takuan@178-116-218-225.access.telenet.be) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-01-12 11:06:08 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2025-01-12 11:06:09 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-01-12 11:07:35 +0100 <tomsmeding> Leary: cute!
2025-01-12 11:09:10 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37
2025-01-12 11:10:09 +0100econo_(uid147250@id-147250.tinside.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
2025-01-12 11:15:42 +0100olivial(~benjaminl@user/benjaminl) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-01-12 11:15:57 +0100olivial(~benjaminl@user/benjaminl) benjaminl
2025-01-12 11:17:03 +0100Tuplanolla(~Tuplanoll@91-159-69-59.elisa-laajakaista.fi) Tuplanolla
2025-01-12 11:21:41 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn
2025-01-12 11:22:29 +0100anpad(~pandeyan@user/anpad) (Quit: ZNC 1.8.2 - https://znc.in)
2025-01-12 11:24:18 +0100anpad(~pandeyan@user/anpad) anpad
2025-01-12 11:26:39 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2025-01-12 11:27:54 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-01-12 11:32:07 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37
2025-01-12 11:34:41 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-01-12 11:36:01 +0100raym(~ray@user/raym) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2025-01-12 11:36:34 +0100sprotte24(~sprotte24@p200300d16f1ab700b95fa6f61d41c09f.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
2025-01-12 11:37:04 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn
2025-01-12 11:38:14 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37
2025-01-12 11:41:31 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2025-01-12 11:42:43 +0100Raito_Bezarius(~Raito@wireguard/tunneler/raito-bezarius) Raito_Bezarius
2025-01-12 11:44:55 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn
2025-01-12 11:49:42 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2025-01-12 11:49:58 +0100tnt2(~Thunderbi@user/tnt1) tnt1
2025-01-12 11:50:42 +0100tnt1(~Thunderbi@user/tnt1) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2025-01-12 11:50:42 +0100tnt2tnt1
2025-01-12 11:51:50 +0100raym(~ray@user/raym) raym
2025-01-12 11:53:29 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-01-12 11:58:40 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37
2025-01-12 11:59:37 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn
2025-01-12 12:04:11 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
2025-01-12 12:07:58 +0100supercode(~supercode@user/supercode) supercode
2025-01-12 12:08:57 +0100acidjnk_new(~acidjnk@p200300d6e7283f06145d2259bf66d21b.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2025-01-12 12:15:00 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn
2025-01-12 12:18:13 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-01-12 12:19:18 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2025-01-12 12:21:39 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37
2025-01-12 12:25:09 +0100paul_j(~user@8.190.187.81.in-addr.arpa) paul_j
2025-01-12 12:27:11 +0100lxsameer(~lxsameer@Serene/lxsameer) lxsameer
2025-01-12 12:27:27 +0100tnt2(~Thunderbi@user/tnt1) tnt1
2025-01-12 12:28:06 +0100tnt1(~Thunderbi@user/tnt1) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2025-01-12 12:28:06 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-01-12 12:30:17 +0100tnt1(~Thunderbi@user/tnt1) tnt1
2025-01-12 12:30:24 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn
2025-01-12 12:32:01 +0100tnt2(~Thunderbi@user/tnt1) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2025-01-12 12:32:54 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37
2025-01-12 12:35:03 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2025-01-12 12:36:28 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-01-12 12:38:55 +0100tnt2(~Thunderbi@user/tnt1) tnt1
2025-01-12 12:39:06 +0100tnt1(~Thunderbi@user/tnt1) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2025-01-12 12:39:06 +0100tnt2tnt1
2025-01-12 12:39:42 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37
2025-01-12 12:42:19 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-01-12 12:43:36 +0100tnt1(~Thunderbi@user/tnt1) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2025-01-12 12:43:43 +0100tnt2(~Thunderbi@user/tnt1) tnt1
2025-01-12 12:45:47 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn
2025-01-12 12:46:16 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37
2025-01-12 12:48:39 +0100tnt1(~Thunderbi@user/tnt1) tnt1
2025-01-12 12:50:03 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-01-12 12:50:12 +0100tnt2(~Thunderbi@user/tnt1) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2025-01-12 12:50:36 +0100agent314(~quassel@c-24-17-1-67.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) agent314
2025-01-12 12:52:29 +0100merijn(~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2025-01-12 12:53:09 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37
2025-01-12 12:55:11 +0100j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)