2024/09/08

2024-09-08 00:04:24 +0200 <dpren_> I'd like to extend a big thanks to this group. My pitch-extractor is back on it's game scraping the depths of youtube for weird musical samples to be performed by me next week.
2024-09-08 00:04:50 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
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2024-09-08 00:13:29 +0200 <haskellbridge> <sm> hurrah!
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2024-09-08 02:22:18 +0200lambdaRule(~lambdaRul@node-1w7jr9phpv011s6crr0owcb3v.ipv6.telus.net)
2024-09-08 02:24:14 +0200 <lambdaRule> how to understand this list comprehension?
2024-09-08 02:24:14 +0200 <lambdaRule> arbitrary :: Arbitrary a => Gen a
2024-09-08 02:24:15 +0200 <lambdaRule> vector :: Arbitrary a => Int -> Gen [a]
2024-09-08 02:24:15 +0200 <lambdaRule> vector n = sequence [ arbitrary | i <- [1..n] ]
2024-09-08 02:24:29 +0200 <lambdaRule> what's the purpose of i?
2024-09-08 02:26:44 +0200justsomeguy(~justsomeg@user/justsomeguy)
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2024-09-08 02:28:16 +0200 <dmj`> vector n = replicateM n arbitrary
2024-09-08 02:29:07 +0200 <monochrom> Yeah, i is "unused", but [1..n] causes the list to have length n.
2024-09-08 02:29:16 +0200 <monochrom> > [() | i <- [1..10]]
2024-09-08 02:29:18 +0200 <lambdabot> [(),(),(),(),(),(),(),(),(),()]
2024-09-08 02:30:22 +0200 <geekosaur> yeh, I'd've used replicateM instead of the list comprehension
2024-09-08 02:30:47 +0200 <geekosaur> > [() | _ <- [1..10]]
2024-09-08 02:30:49 +0200 <lambdabot> [(),(),(),(),(),(),(),(),(),()]
2024-09-08 02:30:51 +0200CiaoSen(~Jura@2a05:5800:459:6700:ca4b:d6ff:fec1:99da) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
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2024-09-08 02:31:39 +0200 <geekosaur> @index replicateM
2024-09-08 02:31:39 +0200 <lambdabot> Control.Monad, Data.Sequence
2024-09-08 02:32:07 +0200 <dmj`> @src replicateM
2024-09-08 02:32:07 +0200 <lambdabot> replicateM n x = sequence (replicate n x)
2024-09-08 02:32:37 +0200 <geekosaur> I guess the only reason to use the list comp is to avoid the import. it doesn't even avoid a dependency, since Control.Monad is in base
2024-09-08 02:34:05 +0200 <geekosaur> also note that these examples are a little too oversimplified, since replicate is sufficient for them. but arbitrary requires replicateM, I think
2024-09-08 02:35:06 +0200 <geekosaur> (or sequence, as in your given code)
2024-09-08 02:36:25 +0200 <geekosaur> for that matter, it doesn't even avoid an import since they have to use sequence instead
2024-09-08 02:36:43 +0200 <lambdaRule> thanks for all the info. I searched list comprehension syntax but I haven't found anything. What should I have searched?
2024-09-08 02:37:15 +0200 <lambdaRule> this is some very old code that I
2024-09-08 02:37:25 +0200 <lambdaRule> reading, from QuickCheck
2024-09-08 02:37:29 +0200 <geekosaur> "Haskell list comprehension" (if you don't specify the language, you probably get Python's)
2024-09-08 02:40:49 +0200 <geekosaur> if you got a lot of "x for i in …" then you got Python's list comprehensions, which aren't quite as elaborate as Haskell's but do roughly the same thing
2024-09-08 02:42:41 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
2024-09-08 02:43:24 +0200 <dmj`> :t enumFromTo
2024-09-08 02:43:25 +0200 <lambdabot> Enum a => a -> a -> [a]
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2024-09-08 03:06:42 +0200jrm(~jrm@user/jrm) (Quit: ciao)
2024-09-08 03:08:12 +0200jrm(~jrm@user/jrm)
2024-09-08 03:08:40 +0200 <justsomeguy> Is there some trick for getting used to point-free syntax? It's been a few years and it still throws me off.
2024-09-08 03:09:09 +0200 <EvanR> if it makes no sense just don't do it
2024-09-08 03:09:21 +0200 <justsomeguy> I'm reading it in other peoples code.
2024-09-08 03:09:30 +0200 <EvanR> if it's more complicated than f 0 x . g "ok" . h, I'm out
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2024-09-08 03:10:06 +0200 <justsomeguy> Yeah, there are things like (sequence .) . fmap in this book I'm reading.
2024-09-08 03:10:11 +0200 <EvanR> gross
2024-09-08 03:10:22 +0200 <geekosaur> that's past the point where I throw in the towel, yeh
2024-09-08 03:10:30 +0200 <EvanR> @unpl (f .) . g
2024-09-08 03:10:30 +0200abrar(~abrar@pool-72-78-199-167.phlapa.fios.verizon.net)
2024-09-08 03:10:30 +0200 <lambdabot> (\ x x0 -> f (g x x0))
2024-09-08 03:10:33 +0200 <geekosaur> "too dotty"
2024-09-08 03:10:59 +0200 <EvanR> \x y -> sequence (fmap x y)
2024-09-08 03:11:04 +0200 <justsomeguy> I wonder if I can get that unpointfree in my IDE somehow. It's probably possible with the LSP.
2024-09-08 03:11:35 +0200 <justsomeguy> Hey, that rhymed!
2024-09-08 03:11:38 +0200 <geekosaur> someone would have to contribute a plugin based on the pointfree package
2024-09-08 03:12:10 +0200 <geekosaur> the main work is already done, just need to hook it in to HLS
2024-09-08 03:14:15 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
2024-09-08 03:15:38 +0200 <justsomeguy> I'd like to look into writing that once I get out of the "can't code himself out of a wet paper bag" phase.
2024-09-08 03:19:12 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2024-09-08 03:23:58 +0200emmanuelux(~emmanuelu@user/emmanuelux) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2024-09-08 03:27:19 +0200 <EvanR> :t (.).(.)
2024-09-08 03:27:19 +0200 <lambdabot> (b -> c) -> (a1 -> a2 -> b) -> a1 -> a2 -> c
2024-09-08 03:27:46 +0200 <EvanR> :t \f g x y -> (f .) . g
2024-09-08 03:27:46 +0200 <lambdabot> (b -> c) -> (a1 -> a2 -> b) -> p1 -> p2 -> a1 -> a2 -> c
2024-09-08 03:28:06 +0200 <EvanR> :t \x y f g -> (f .) . g
2024-09-08 03:28:06 +0200 <lambdabot> p1 -> p2 -> (b -> c) -> (a1 -> a2 -> b) -> a1 -> a2 -> c
2024-09-08 03:28:12 +0200tzh(~tzh@c-76-115-131-146.hsd1.or.comcast.net)
2024-09-08 03:28:21 +0200 <EvanR> brain broke
2024-09-08 03:29:04 +0200 <EvanR> ok it's the same thing
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2024-09-08 03:45:14 +0200 <morb> hello
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2024-09-08 03:49:24 +0200 <geekosaur> hello
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2024-09-08 06:57:33 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2024-09-08 07:03:14 +0200peterbecich(~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2024-09-08 07:08:42 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
2024-09-08 07:12:53 +0200youthlic(~Thunderbi@user/youthlic) (Quit: youthlic)
2024-09-08 07:13:59 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2024-09-08 07:17:51 +0200raehik(~raehik@rdng-25-b2-v4wan-169990-cust1344.vm39.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2024-09-08 07:20:00 +0200morb(~morb@pool-108-41-100-120.nycmny.fios.verizon.net)
2024-09-08 07:21:58 +0200harveypwca(~harveypwc@2601:246:d080:b40:1889:d9bf:2dd8:b288) (Quit: Leaving)
2024-09-08 07:24:30 +0200morb(~morb@pool-108-41-100-120.nycmny.fios.verizon.net) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2024-09-08 07:24:31 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
2024-09-08 07:31:42 +0200 <probie> I wouldn't use it outside of code golf, but `(f .) . g` isn't particularly scary. `(f .) . g` --> `\x -> (f .) (g x)` --> `\x -> f . g x` --> `\x y -> f (g x y)`.
2024-09-08 07:32:07 +0200youthlic(~Thunderbi@user/youthlic)
2024-09-08 07:33:40 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2024-09-08 07:39:56 +0200peterbecich(~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com)
2024-09-08 07:45:18 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
2024-09-08 07:50:03 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2024-09-08 07:56:23 +0200morb(~morb@pool-108-41-100-120.nycmny.fios.verizon.net)
2024-09-08 07:57:05 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
2024-09-08 08:01:57 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2024-09-08 08:02:25 +0200sp1ff(~user@c-73-11-70-111.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2024-09-08 08:02:40 +0200sp1ff(~user@c-73-11-70-111.hsd1.wa.comcast.net)
2024-09-08 08:05:27 +0200morb(~morb@pool-108-41-100-120.nycmny.fios.verizon.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2024-09-08 08:11:49 +0200misterfish(~misterfis@84.53.85.146)
2024-09-08 08:12:38 +0200takuan(~takuan@178-116-218-225.access.telenet.be)
2024-09-08 08:12:52 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
2024-09-08 08:17:40 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2024-09-08 08:19:00 +0200pharaoh(~Guest68@118-168-3-32.dynamic-ip.hinet.net)
2024-09-08 08:19:21 +0200 <pharaoh> Hello world
2024-09-08 08:19:49 +0200morb(~morb@pool-108-41-100-120.nycmny.fios.verizon.net)
2024-09-08 08:21:06 +0200 <pharaoh> morb
2024-09-08 08:21:13 +0200 <pharaoh> you’re pinned down
2024-09-08 08:23:50 +0200 <pharaoh> morb
2024-09-08 08:23:58 +0200 <pharaoh> make you’re activatef
2024-09-08 08:24:08 +0200 <pharaoh>  Activated
2024-09-08 08:27:56 +0200morb(~morb@pool-108-41-100-120.nycmny.fios.verizon.net) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2024-09-08 08:28:39 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
2024-09-08 08:30:39 +0200misterfish(~misterfis@84.53.85.146) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2024-09-08 08:30:40 +0200morb(~morb@pool-108-41-100-120.nycmny.fios.verizon.net)
2024-09-08 08:35:12 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2024-09-08 08:35:21 +0200athan(~athan@syn-098-153-145-140.biz.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2024-09-08 08:39:38 +0200 <pharaoh> RMSBach
2024-09-08 08:39:42 +0200 <pharaoh> report you first
2024-09-08 08:39:45 +0200 <pharaoh> bsima-
2024-09-08 08:39:49 +0200 <pharaoh> report you the second
2024-09-08 08:39:52 +0200 <pharaoh> Batzy
2024-09-08 08:39:58 +0200 <pharaoh> you’re the third
2024-09-08 08:39:59 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl)
2024-09-08 08:40:09 +0200 <pharaoh> you guys are blacklisted tromp
2024-09-08 08:40:23 +0200 <pharaoh> you are the fellow of Trump, aren’t you
2024-09-08 08:40:26 +0200 <pharaoh> tromp
2024-09-08 08:40:52 +0200 <mauke> @where ops
2024-09-08 08:40:52 +0200 <lambdabot> byorgey Cale conal copumpkin dcoutts dibblego dolio edwardk geekosaur glguy jmcarthur johnw mniip monochrom quicksilver shachaf shapr ski
2024-09-08 08:41:11 +0200 <tromp> Trump sucks
2024-09-08 08:41:21 +0200 <pharaoh> Then change your name
2024-09-08 08:41:32 +0200 <pharaoh> that’s not my or
2024-09-08 08:41:36 +0200 <pharaoh> problem
2024-09-08 08:41:49 +0200 <pharaoh> tromp response when received
2024-09-08 08:41:51 +0200morb(~morb@pool-108-41-100-120.nycmny.fios.verizon.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2024-09-08 08:45:56 +0200 <pharaoh> tromp
2024-09-08 08:46:07 +0200 <pharaoh> She is against our ritual
2024-09-08 08:46:16 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
2024-09-08 08:46:22 +0200 <pharaoh> face the consequences, poor merijn
2024-09-08 08:46:31 +0200 <pharaoh> you’re Japanese, ha?
2024-09-08 08:47:08 +0200 <pharaoh> merijn
2024-09-08 08:47:12 +0200 <pharaoh> are you literate?
2024-09-08 08:47:21 +0200pharaoh(~Guest68@118-168-3-32.dynamic-ip.hinet.net) (Quit: Client closed)
2024-09-08 08:47:37 +0200Guest68(~Guest68@118-168-3-32.dynamic-ip.hinet.net)
2024-09-08 08:47:58 +0200 <Guest68> Ban you merijn
2024-09-08 08:48:03 +0200 <Guest68> bliminse
2024-09-08 08:48:05 +0200 <Guest68> bliminse
2024-09-08 08:48:08 +0200 <Guest68> Batzy
2024-09-08 08:48:13 +0200 <Guest68> bjs
2024-09-08 08:48:52 +0200Guest68(~Guest68@118-168-3-32.dynamic-ip.hinet.net) (Client Quit)
2024-09-08 08:50:57 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2024-09-08 08:52:08 +0200sp1ff(~user@c-73-11-70-111.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
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2024-09-08 08:56:52 +0200morb(~morb@pool-108-41-100-120.nycmny.fios.verizon.net)
2024-09-08 09:00:01 +0200tt123109783243(~tt1231@2603:6010:8700:4a81:219f:50d3:618a:a6ee) (Quit: The Lounge - https://thelounge.chat)
2024-09-08 09:02:04 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
2024-09-08 09:02:13 +0200morb(~morb@pool-108-41-100-120.nycmny.fios.verizon.net) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2024-09-08 09:03:12 +0200sawilagar(~sawilagar@user/sawilagar)
2024-09-08 09:03:18 +0200tt123109783243(~tt1231@2603:6010:8700:4a81:219f:50d3:618a:a6ee)
2024-09-08 09:06:48 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2024-09-08 09:16:02 +0200mreh(~matthew@host86-160-168-12.range86-160.btcentralplus.com)
2024-09-08 09:17:51 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
2024-09-08 09:18:36 +0200target_i(~target_i@user/target-i/x-6023099)
2024-09-08 09:22:56 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
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2024-09-08 09:27:39 +0200aljustiet(aljustiet@here.and.ready-to.party) (Changing host)
2024-09-08 09:27:39 +0200aljustiet(aljustiet@user/meow/aljustiet)
2024-09-08 09:31:27 +0200morb(~morb@pool-108-41-100-120.nycmny.fios.verizon.net)
2024-09-08 09:31:30 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
2024-09-08 09:36:30 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
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2024-09-08 10:01:01 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2024-09-08 10:03:05 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
2024-09-08 10:06:12 +0200peterbecich(~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
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2024-09-08 10:11:35 +0200aljustiet(aljustiet@user/meow/aljustiet) (Quit: fBNC - https://bnc4free.com)
2024-09-08 10:15:08 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl)
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2024-09-08 10:25:37 +0200acidjnk_new(~acidjnk@p200300d6e72cfb75c990977c7caf1962.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
2024-09-08 10:27:38 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
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2024-09-08 10:32:30 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
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2024-09-08 10:46:42 +0200euleritian(~euleritia@dynamic-176-006-133-246.176.6.pool.telefonica.de)
2024-09-08 10:47:41 +0200tzh(~tzh@c-76-115-131-146.hsd1.or.comcast.net) (Quit: zzz)
2024-09-08 10:48:16 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
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2024-09-08 10:58:45 +0200alexherbo2(~alexherbo@2a02-8440-320a-9266-8566-4481-a134-9ff2.rev.sfr.net)
2024-09-08 11:00:46 +0200kitalethalethkit
2024-09-08 11:04:04 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
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2024-09-08 11:33:30 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
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2024-09-08 11:37:23 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl)
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2024-09-08 11:41:53 +0200morb(~morb@pool-108-41-100-120.nycmny.fios.verizon.net)
2024-09-08 11:44:07 +0200Tuplanolla(~Tuplanoll@91-159-69-59.elisa-laajakaista.fi)
2024-09-08 11:46:24 +0200morb(~morb@pool-108-41-100-120.nycmny.fios.verizon.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2024-09-08 11:48:31 +0200Sgeo(~Sgeo@user/sgeo) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2024-09-08 11:49:16 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
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2024-09-08 12:06:37 +0200euleritian(~euleritia@dynamic-176-006-133-246.176.6.pool.telefonica.de) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2024-09-08 12:06:55 +0200euleritian(~euleritia@ip4d16fc38.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de)
2024-09-08 12:10:07 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2024-09-08 12:13:08 +0200CiaoSen(~Jura@2a05:5800:459:c200:ca4b:d6ff:fec1:99da)
2024-09-08 12:15:28 +0200petrichor(~znc-user@user/petrichor)
2024-09-08 12:15:42 +0200petrichor(~znc-user@user/petrichor) (Remote host closed the connection)
2024-09-08 12:17:27 +0200CiaoSen(~Jura@2a05:5800:459:c200:ca4b:d6ff:fec1:99da) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2024-09-08 12:20:52 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
2024-09-08 12:21:12 +0200morb(~morb@pool-108-41-100-120.nycmny.fios.verizon.net)
2024-09-08 12:23:29 +0200 <haskellbridge> <thirdofmay18081814goya> what ordering can be given to the logics corresponding to the calculi in the lambda cube?
2024-09-08 12:25:32 +0200morb(~morb@pool-108-41-100-120.nycmny.fios.verizon.net) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2024-09-08 12:26:04 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2024-09-08 12:31:58 +0200youthlic(~Thunderbi@user/youthlic)
2024-09-08 12:35:44 +0200m1dnight(~christoph@d8D861908.access.telenet.be) (Quit: WeeChat 4.4.1)
2024-09-08 12:36:00 +0200m1dnight(~christoph@d8D861908.access.telenet.be)
2024-09-08 12:36:39 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
2024-09-08 12:41:22 +0200morb(~morb@pool-108-41-100-120.nycmny.fios.verizon.net)
2024-09-08 12:41:36 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2024-09-08 12:45:53 +0200morb(~morb@pool-108-41-100-120.nycmny.fios.verizon.net) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2024-09-08 12:52:26 +0200mechap(~mechap@user/mechap)
2024-09-08 12:52:26 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
2024-09-08 12:54:26 +0200 <mechap> I have just installed stack and all commands seem to run into that connection error http://0x0.st/XwnK.log
2024-09-08 12:55:07 +0200ash3en(~Thunderbi@2a01:c23:8d79:ee00:30a3:7625:9892:e350)
2024-09-08 12:55:33 +0200morb(~morb@pool-108-41-100-120.nycmny.fios.verizon.net)
2024-09-08 12:57:21 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2024-09-08 13:01:19 +0200morb(~morb@pool-108-41-100-120.nycmny.fios.verizon.net) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2024-09-08 13:04:05 +0200sourcetarius(~sourcetar@user/sourcetarius)
2024-09-08 13:07:05 +0200mechap(~mechap@user/mechap) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
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2024-09-08 13:09:36 +0200youthlic(~Thunderbi@user/youthlic) (Quit: youthlic)
2024-09-08 13:12:02 +0200youthlic(~Thunderbi@user/youthlic)
2024-09-08 13:12:15 +0200cheater(~Username@user/cheater) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2024-09-08 13:13:12 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2024-09-08 13:16:15 +0200ash3en(~Thunderbi@2a01:c23:8d79:ee00:30a3:7625:9892:e350) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2024-09-08 13:16:27 +0200ZharMeny(~ZharMeny@user/ZharMeny)
2024-09-08 13:24:01 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
2024-09-08 13:28:32 +0200morb(~morb@pool-108-41-100-120.nycmny.fios.verizon.net)
2024-09-08 13:29:09 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2024-09-08 13:33:13 +0200Smiles(uid551636@id-551636.lymington.irccloud.com)
2024-09-08 13:33:54 +0200 <haskellbridge> <sm> Maybe report on #haskell-stack:matrix.org or check the issue tracker, I think there are some workarounds
2024-09-08 13:34:11 +0200crvs(~crvs@c-a03ae555.016-99-73746f5.bbcust.telenor.se) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2024-09-08 13:37:21 +0200JuanDaugherty(~juan@user/JuanDaugherty)
2024-09-08 13:39:53 +0200morb(~morb@pool-108-41-100-120.nycmny.fios.verizon.net) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
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2024-09-08 13:55:19 +0200EvanR(~EvanR@user/evanr) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2024-09-08 13:55:34 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
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2024-09-08 14:11:22 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
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2024-09-08 14:23:15 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2024-09-08 14:25:13 +0200morb(~morb@pool-108-41-100-120.nycmny.fios.verizon.net)
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2024-09-08 15:19:40 +0200 <haskellbridge> <eldritchcookie> hello does anyone one know how pattern synonyms interacts with required type arguments?
2024-09-08 15:19:51 +0200ZharMeny(~ZharMeny@user/ZharMeny) (Remote host closed the connection)
2024-09-08 15:20:07 +0200 <haskellbridge> <eldritchcookie> i was unable to declare a pattern for proxy which requires a type argument
2024-09-08 15:24:27 +0200ZharMeny(~ZharMeny@user/ZharMeny)
2024-09-08 15:26:20 +0200 <tomsmeding> eldritchcookie: this seems to compile https://play.haskell.org/saved/4B5qc7k8
2024-09-08 15:26:34 +0200 <tomsmeding> the bang pattern is of course unsatisfactory, but for Proxy it happens to be sufficient I think :p
2024-09-08 15:28:50 +0200 <tomsmeding> or I'm actually not sure -- the thing it's matching looks like a function
2024-09-08 15:28:55 +0200 <tomsmeding> anyway have to go, sorry
2024-09-08 15:30:18 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
2024-09-08 15:31:19 +0200 <haskellbridge> <eldritchcookie> why does it accept if we have _ but not a constructor?
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2024-09-08 16:21:54 +0200EvanR(~EvanR@user/evanr)
2024-09-08 16:24:39 +0200 <Leary> eldritchcookie: GHC won't accept `data Req a where Req :: forall a -> Req a` either, so I rather doubt the pattern synonym equivalent is possible.
2024-09-08 16:24:49 +0200 <Leary> You may have to settle for `req :: forall k r. (forall (t :: k) -> r) -> (forall (t :: k). Proxy t -> r)`.
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2024-09-08 19:11:09 +0200 <haskellbridge> <Bowuigi> thirdofmay18081814goya STLC is propositional logic, system F is second-order intuitionistic logic, everything more powerful is higher order and above and the other ones are subsets
2024-09-08 19:12:10 +0200 <dolio> It's a sort of second order propositional logic which is not really widely studied.
2024-09-08 19:13:37 +0200 <haskellbridge> <Bowuigi> Yeah, I guess System Fω is somewhat similar to higher order logic given a similar kinding system
2024-09-08 19:13:52 +0200 <haskellbridge> <thirdofmay18081814goya> ty!
2024-09-08 19:14:13 +0200 <haskellbridge> <thirdofmay18081814goya> i do wonder why they call it second order propositional logic since it has no first order terms
2024-09-08 19:14:15 +0200 <dolio> Even Fω is not something that would be typically studied in logic.
2024-09-08 19:14:26 +0200 <haskellbridge> <thirdofmay18081814goya> first order quantification*
2024-09-08 19:15:11 +0200 <Franciman> becase you can quantify over subsets
2024-09-08 19:15:18 +0200 <Franciman> so you skip first order and directly go to second order
2024-09-08 19:15:25 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
2024-09-08 19:15:30 +0200 <Franciman> but only have part of its power
2024-09-08 19:15:34 +0200 <haskellbridge> <Bowuigi> But the standard logics are Hilbert-style (axiomatic) proof systems. Everything lambda calculus related is Martin-Löf style (intuitionistic), everything lambda-mu calculus related is Gentzen-style (sequent)
2024-09-08 19:15:52 +0200 <Franciman> lambda-mu you mean fixpoints?
2024-09-08 19:15:59 +0200 <Franciman> and strategy logics?
2024-09-08 19:16:09 +0200 <haskellbridge> <Bowuigi> No, I mean the one with commands
2024-09-08 19:16:32 +0200 <haskellbridge> <thirdofmay18081814goya> Bowuigi: i think \lambda D is strictly more expressive than FOL from what i've read
2024-09-08 19:16:42 +0200 <haskellbridge> <thirdofmay18081814goya> I mean \lambda P
2024-09-08 19:17:00 +0200 <haskellbridge> <Bowuigi> Lambda-mu-mu tilde (λμμ̃) is slightly more popular I guess
2024-09-08 19:17:32 +0200 <haskellbridge> <thirdofmay18081814goya> Franciman: i.e. on a set-theoretic semantics?
2024-09-08 19:17:48 +0200 <EvanR> nice use of unicode there
2024-09-08 19:18:00 +0200 <EvanR> unicode is now vindicated
2024-09-08 19:18:04 +0200 <haskellbridge> <Bowuigi> https://www.pls-lab.org/en/Lambda_mu_calculus
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2024-09-08 19:19:14 +0200 <Franciman> ah okok nice
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2024-09-08 19:21:00 +0200 <dolio> If you think about them as logics, then about the only interesting thing about System F is that you can define all the connectives properly in an intuitionistic logic from just implication and ∀.
2024-09-08 19:21:55 +0200 <dolio> Because you don't actually care about distinguishing all the distinct terms of each type, you only care about whether there is a term, more or less.
2024-09-08 19:23:24 +0200 <dolio> And if you're thinking classical logic, even that isn't interesting.
2024-09-08 19:23:36 +0200 <haskellbridge> <thirdofmay18081814goya> oh you can quantify over subsets, I get it now (semantics for \forall P where P is a relation symbol and a relation is a set of n-tuples)
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2024-09-08 19:31:00 +0200 <monochrom> Bowuigi: That is very interesting, thanks. (I once coded up lambda + callcc, but I conflated terms with commands, cont vars with lambda vars, i.e., I merely wrote a mini typed Scheme.)
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2024-09-08 20:23:21 +0200 <dolio> monochrom: You should read Compiling with Classical Connectives.
2024-09-08 20:24:47 +0200 <monochrom> I think I saw some Wadler talk doing that.
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2024-09-08 20:42:18 +0200 <haskellbridge> <thirdofmay18081814goya> https://kf8nh.com/_matrix/media/v3/download/matrix.org/QqQlQcBiTFxtPOXlThhqDrBp/image.png
2024-09-08 20:42:35 +0200 <haskellbridge> <thirdofmay18081814goya> do haskell type families satisfy this same definition from Martin-Lof dependent type theory?
2024-09-08 20:43:05 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2024-09-08 20:44:48 +0200 <mauke> doesn't this definition apply to all type constructors :: * -> *?
2024-09-08 20:45:20 +0200 <mauke> ah, no
2024-09-08 20:46:50 +0200JuanDaugherty(~juan@user/JuanDaugherty)
2024-09-08 20:47:17 +0200 <mauke> this is more like B :: exists a. a -> *
2024-09-08 20:49:15 +0200morb(~morb@pool-108-41-100-120.nycmny.fios.verizon.net)
2024-09-08 20:53:50 +0200 <monochrom> Haskell type families can do x::Type but not, for example, x::Int.
2024-09-08 20:53:58 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
2024-09-08 20:55:03 +0200 <monochrom> OK people then start making "type-level Int", but that's just not the same. In dependent typing, the point is that x is a term-level Int.
2024-09-08 20:55:08 +0200troojg(~troojg@user/troojg)
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2024-09-08 21:12:57 +0200oo_miguel(~Thunderbi@78.10.207.45) (Quit: oo_miguel)
2024-09-08 21:15:32 +0200Sgeo(~Sgeo@user/sgeo)
2024-09-08 21:17:47 +0200 <haskellbridge> <Bowuigi> monochrom yeah the idea is similar but lambda-mu is more classical logic oriented
2024-09-08 21:19:41 +0200 <haskellbridge> <Bowuigi> thirdofmay18081814goya only at the kind level (which is sort of dependent). At a type/value level that is dependent term abstraction (which haskell doesn't have, tho you can get close with singletons)
2024-09-08 21:20:13 +0200 <haskellbridge> <thirdofmay18081814goya> Bowuigi: ah I see! ty
2024-09-08 21:20:41 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2024-09-08 21:24:26 +0200 <haskellbridge> <Bowuigi> If A = Type then this corresponds to a type constructor, if A = Kind it corresponds to a kind abstraction (capital lambda at the type level). Dependent types just lift both of those restrictions (possibly adding an upper bound, eg. not allowing A to be larger than Kind)
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2024-09-08 23:28:38 +0200mechap(~mechap@user/mechap)
2024-09-08 23:29:28 +0200 <mechap> could you please help me with stack ? http://0x0.st/XwFs.log
2024-09-08 23:31:33 +0200CiaoSen(~Jura@2a05:5800:459:c200:ca4b:d6ff:fec1:99da) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2024-09-08 23:32:11 +0200 <justsomeguy> mechap: What stack resolver are you using? Maybe the snapshot no longer exists.
2024-09-08 23:32:47 +0200 <justsomeguy> (Since you're gettting a NoSuchBucket error.)
2024-09-08 23:34:09 +0200 <mechap> I deleted .stack and it seems to work now
2024-09-08 23:34:40 +0200 <justsomeguy> I think it was using a nightly snapshot, or some other snapshot that no longer exists.
2024-09-08 23:34:53 +0200 <mechap> that's possible
2024-09-08 23:38:28 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
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2024-09-08 23:43:57 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2024-09-08 23:45:24 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl)
2024-09-08 23:46:27 +0200JuanDaugherty(~juan@user/JuanDaugherty) (Quit: JuanDaugherty)
2024-09-08 23:46:28 +0200morb(~morb@pool-108-41-100-120.nycmny.fios.verizon.net)
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2024-09-08 23:54:15 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl)
2024-09-08 23:56:30 +0200 <juri_> is anyone actually using termonad?
2024-09-08 23:58:11 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2024-09-08 23:58:26 +0200 <geekosaur> I've heard of several people at least trying it out, but I personally never saw the point
2024-09-08 23:58:58 +0200 <geekosaur> there's already lots of VTE-based terminals out there, configuring one in Haskell doesn't seem to bring anything to the table IMO
2024-09-08 23:59:15 +0200merijn(~merijn@204-220-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2024-09-08 23:59:35 +0200 <justsomeguy> alacritty is the best terminal emulator
2024-09-08 23:59:49 +0200 <EvanR> fight fight fight