IRCBrowse

2023/04/25

2023-04-25 00:00:21 +0200Katarushisu(~Katarushi@cpc147790-finc20-2-0-cust502.4-2.cable.virginm.net) (Quit: The Lounge - https://thelounge.chat)
2023-04-25 00:00:51 +0200Katarushisu(~Katarushi@cpc147790-finc20-2-0-cust502.4-2.cable.virginm.net)
2023-04-25 00:02:45 +0200gurkenglas(~gurkengla@dynamic-089-204-139-194.89.204.139.pool.telefonica.de)
2023-04-25 00:03:58 +0200Katarushisu(~Katarushi@cpc147790-finc20-2-0-cust502.4-2.cable.virginm.net) (Client Quit)
2023-04-25 00:05:27 +0200czy(~user@50.30.140.25)
2023-04-25 00:06:41 +0200coot(~coot@213.134.170.228) (Quit: coot)
2023-04-25 00:08:10 +0200michalz(~michalz@185.246.207.221) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 00:08:21 +0200Katarushisu(~Katarushi@cpc147790-finc20-2-0-cust502.4-2.cable.virginm.net)
2023-04-25 00:18:18 +0200Tuplanolla(~Tuplanoll@91-159-68-236.elisa-laajakaista.fi) (Quit: Leaving.)
2023-04-25 00:18:34 +0200pyook(~puke@user/puke)
2023-04-25 00:19:39 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 00:19:50 +0200elevenkb(~elevenkb@105.225.53.253)
2023-04-25 00:19:56 +0200elevenkb(~elevenkb@105.225.53.253) (Write error: Broken pipe)
2023-04-25 00:20:22 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net)
2023-04-25 00:22:23 +0200azimut(~azimut@gateway/tor-sasl/azimut) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2023-04-25 00:32:24 +0200azimut(~azimut@gateway/tor-sasl/azimut)
2023-04-25 00:40:19 +0200bitdex(~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex)
2023-04-25 00:44:25 +0200gurkenglas(~gurkengla@dynamic-089-204-139-194.89.204.139.pool.telefonica.de) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2023-04-25 00:46:36 +0200gurkenglas(~gurkengla@dynamic-046-114-176-254.46.114.pool.telefonica.de)
2023-04-25 00:53:02 +0200eggplantade(~Eggplanta@104-55-37-220.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net)
2023-04-25 00:57:05 +0200eggplantade(~Eggplanta@104-55-37-220.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2023-04-25 00:57:24 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 00:58:07 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net)
2023-04-25 01:01:29 +0200Raito_Bezarius(~Raito@wireguard/tunneler/raito-bezarius)
2023-04-25 01:04:41 +0200azimut(~azimut@gateway/tor-sasl/azimut) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2023-04-25 01:04:47 +0200elevenkb87(~elevenkb@105.225.53.253)
2023-04-25 01:06:00 +0200elevenkb87(~elevenkb@105.225.53.253) (Client Quit)
2023-04-25 01:08:35 +0200jle`(~jle`@cpe-23-240-75-236.socal.res.rr.com) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2023-04-25 01:10:15 +0200jle`(~jle`@cpe-23-240-75-236.socal.res.rr.com)
2023-04-25 01:11:38 +0200elevenkb(~user@105.225.53.253)
2023-04-25 01:13:27 +0200elevenkb(~user@105.225.53.253) (Quit: ERC 5.4.1 (IRC client for GNU Emacs 30.0.50))
2023-04-25 01:13:41 +0200zeenk(~zeenk@2a02:2f04:a20f:5200::fba) (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
2023-04-25 01:13:45 +0200elevenkb(~user@105.225.53.253)
2023-04-25 01:14:35 +0200stiell_(~stiell@gateway/tor-sasl/stiell) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2023-04-25 01:15:30 +0200jmdaemon(~jmdaemon@user/jmdaemon)
2023-04-25 01:17:26 +0200unit73e(~emanuel@2001:818:e8dd:7c00:656:e5ff:fe72:9d36) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 01:17:42 +0200stiell_(~stiell@gateway/tor-sasl/stiell)
2023-04-25 01:17:46 +0200acidjnk(~acidjnk@p200300d6e715c4837c197c2288c4bb55.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-04-25 01:18:04 +0200tremon(~tremon@83.80.159.219) (Quit: getting boxed in)
2023-04-25 01:18:22 +0200slack1256(~slack1256@181.42.40.106)
2023-04-25 01:18:30 +0200jero98772(~jero98772@2800:484:1d84:9000::3) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-04-25 01:24:05 +0200hanabi_(~hanabi@dhcp-077-251-039-086.chello.nl) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2023-04-25 01:24:39 +0200Me-me(~Me-me@146.102.215.218.dyn.iprimus.net.au)
2023-04-25 01:24:42 +0200Me-me(~Me-me@146.102.215.218.dyn.iprimus.net.au) (Changing host)
2023-04-25 01:24:42 +0200Me-me(~Me-me@user/me-me)
2023-04-25 01:31:47 +0200jero98772(~jero98772@2800:484:1d84:9000::3)
2023-04-25 01:31:48 +0200gurkengl1s(~gurkengla@dynamic-046-114-176-254.46.114.pool.telefonica.de)
2023-04-25 01:32:05 +0200stiell_(~stiell@gateway/tor-sasl/stiell) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 01:32:27 +0200stiell_(~stiell@gateway/tor-sasl/stiell)
2023-04-25 01:34:02 +0200emmanuelux(~emmanuelu@user/emmanuelux)
2023-04-25 01:34:13 +0200gurkenglas(~gurkengla@dynamic-046-114-176-254.46.114.pool.telefonica.de) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2023-04-25 01:34:58 +0200jpds4jpds
2023-04-25 01:44:53 +0200mauke_(~mauke@user/mauke)
2023-04-25 01:46:25 +0200mauke(~mauke@user/mauke) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2023-04-25 01:46:25 +0200mauke_mauke
2023-04-25 01:47:07 +0200bitdex(~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 01:48:02 +0200bitdex(~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex)
2023-04-25 01:48:16 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 01:48:58 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net)
2023-04-25 01:54:59 +0200nate1(~nate@98.45.169.16)
2023-04-25 01:59:56 +0200nate1(~nate@98.45.169.16) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-04-25 02:02:40 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 02:03:19 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net)
2023-04-25 02:03:40 +0200milia(~milia@user/milia)
2023-04-25 02:04:57 +0200rf_(~rf@2605:59c8:1604:2210:5de6:62f6:20ef:34c8)
2023-04-25 02:06:10 +0200slac22722(~slack1256@186.11.7.168)
2023-04-25 02:06:42 +0200heraldo(~heraldo@user/heraldo)
2023-04-25 02:08:05 +0200slack1256(~slack1256@181.42.40.106) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2023-04-25 02:09:21 +0200Lord_of_Life_(~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915)
2023-04-25 02:10:10 +0200gmg(~user@user/gehmehgeh) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 02:10:24 +0200Lord_of_Life(~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2023-04-25 02:10:39 +0200Lord_of_Life_Lord_of_Life
2023-04-25 02:10:59 +0200gmg(~user@user/gehmehgeh)
2023-04-25 02:12:34 +0200elevenkb(~user@105.225.53.253) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2023-04-25 02:14:24 +0200waleee(~waleee@2001:9b0:21c:4000:5bf9:6515:c030:57b7) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2023-04-25 02:16:11 +0200waleee(~waleee@2001:9b0:21c:4000:5bf9:6515:c030:57b7)
2023-04-25 02:19:28 +0200accord(uid568320@id-568320.hampstead.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
2023-04-25 02:23:07 +0200perrierjouet(~perrier-j@modemcable048.127-56-74.mc.videotron.ca) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2023-04-25 02:23:54 +0200yurideabreu_(~yurideabr@189.6.27.58) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2023-04-25 02:26:09 +0200Square(~Square4@user/square) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2023-04-25 02:27:23 +0200rf(~rf@2605:59c8:1604:2210:5de6:62f6:20ef:34c8) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2023-04-25 02:27:44 +0200rf_(~rf@2605:59c8:1604:2210:5de6:62f6:20ef:34c8) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2023-04-25 02:27:55 +0200polykernel[m](~polykerne@user/polykernel)
2023-04-25 02:27:57 +0200slac22722(~slack1256@186.11.7.168) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2023-04-25 02:28:16 +0200jero98772(~jero98772@2800:484:1d84:9000::3) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2023-04-25 02:34:08 +0200segfaultfizzbuzz(~segfaultf@23-93-74-212.fiber.dynamic.sonic.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 02:34:51 +0200polykernel[m](~polykerne@user/polykernel) ()
2023-04-25 02:37:25 +0200rf(~rf@2605:59c8:1604:2210:7628:6b37:4071:a695)
2023-04-25 02:37:41 +0200rf_(~rf@2605:59c8:1604:2210:7628:6b37:4071:a695)
2023-04-25 02:39:13 +0200polykernel[m](~polykerne@user/polykernel)
2023-04-25 02:39:47 +0200wroathe(~wroathe@207-153-38-140.fttp.usinternet.com)
2023-04-25 02:39:47 +0200wroathe(~wroathe@207-153-38-140.fttp.usinternet.com) (Changing host)
2023-04-25 02:39:47 +0200wroathe(~wroathe@user/wroathe)
2023-04-25 02:40:12 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 02:40:54 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net)
2023-04-25 02:41:38 +0200jero98772(~jero98772@2800:484:1d84:9000::3)
2023-04-25 02:47:28 +0200slack1256(~slack1256@186.11.0.40)
2023-04-25 02:52:14 +0200ix(~ix@2a02:8012:281f:0:d65d:64ff:fe52:5efe) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 02:59:35 +0200ix(~ix@2a02:8012:281f:0:d65d:64ff:fe52:5efe)
2023-04-25 02:59:46 +0200rf_(~rf@2605:59c8:1604:2210:7628:6b37:4071:a695) (Quit: Leaving)
2023-04-25 03:00:57 +0200bitmapper(uid464869@id-464869.lymington.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
2023-04-25 03:06:33 +0200gehmehgeh(~user@user/gehmehgeh)
2023-04-25 03:07:48 +0200robobub(uid248673@2a03:5180:f:5::3:cb61)
2023-04-25 03:09:20 +0200gmg(~user@user/gehmehgeh) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2023-04-25 03:10:10 +0200slac15895(~slack1256@191.126.227.87)
2023-04-25 03:10:49 +0200mestre(~mestre@191.177.175.117)
2023-04-25 03:10:56 +0200albet70(~xxx@2400:8902::f03c:92ff:fe60:98d8) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 03:12:31 +0200slack1256(~slack1256@186.11.0.40) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2023-04-25 03:13:36 +0200jle`(~jle`@cpe-23-240-75-236.socal.res.rr.com) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2023-04-25 03:15:44 +0200jle`(~jle`@cpe-23-240-75-236.socal.res.rr.com)
2023-04-25 03:17:03 +0200albet70(~xxx@2400:8902::f03c:92ff:fe60:98d8)
2023-04-25 03:17:43 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 03:18:31 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net)
2023-04-25 03:22:19 +0200waleee(~waleee@2001:9b0:21c:4000:5bf9:6515:c030:57b7) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2023-04-25 03:26:17 +0200jwiegley(~jwiegley@76-234-69-149.lightspeed.frokca.sbcglobal.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 03:27:09 +0200jwiegley(~jwiegley@76-234-69-149.lightspeed.frokca.sbcglobal.net)
2023-04-25 03:37:28 +0200[itchyjunk](~itchyjunk@user/itchyjunk/x-7353470) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 03:38:07 +0200machinedgod(~machinedg@d198-53-218-113.abhsia.telus.net) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2023-04-25 03:39:25 +0200wroathe(~wroathe@user/wroathe) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2023-04-25 03:44:13 +0200slac15895slack1256
2023-04-25 03:46:04 +0200emmanuelux(~emmanuelu@user/emmanuelux) (Quit: au revoir)
2023-04-25 03:51:48 +0200xff0x(~xff0x@2405:6580:b080:900:9b3e:353e:43c8:742e) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
2023-04-25 03:53:27 +0200heraldo(~heraldo@user/heraldo) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2023-04-25 03:53:38 +0200waleee(~waleee@h-176-10-137-138.NA.cust.bahnhof.se)
2023-04-25 03:55:14 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 03:55:56 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net)
2023-04-25 04:02:31 +0200werneta(~werneta@70-142-214-115.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net)
2023-04-25 04:07:16 +0200bratwurst(~dfadsva@2604:3d09:207f:f650::708a)
2023-04-25 04:10:39 +0200mestre(~mestre@191.177.175.117) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
2023-04-25 04:13:24 +0200waleee(~waleee@h-176-10-137-138.NA.cust.bahnhof.se) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2023-04-25 04:19:01 +0200eggplantade(~Eggplanta@104-55-37-220.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net)
2023-04-25 04:21:38 +0200JScript(~JScript@cpe-172-193-181-254.qld.foxtel.net.au)
2023-04-25 04:26:46 +0200rf(~rf@2605:59c8:1604:2210:7628:6b37:4071:a695) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 04:32:49 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 04:32:58 +0200xff0x(~xff0x@125x103x176x34.ap125.ftth.ucom.ne.jp)
2023-04-25 04:33:31 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net)
2023-04-25 04:42:03 +0200bliminse(~bliminse@user/bliminse)
2023-04-25 04:57:16 +0200FinnElija(~finn_elij@user/finn-elija/x-0085643) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 04:58:43 +0200td_(~td@i53870912.versanet.de) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2023-04-25 04:59:48 +0200FinnElija(~finn_elij@user/finn-elija/x-0085643)
2023-04-25 05:00:39 +0200td_(~td@i53870921.versanet.de)
2023-04-25 05:05:27 +0200dh97(~tanmoydas@2405:201:d02b:48f3:b4d9:7afc:ebd0:3f47)
2023-04-25 05:06:33 +0200jero98772(~jero98772@2800:484:1d84:9000::3) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 05:06:50 +0200JScript(~JScript@cpe-172-193-181-254.qld.foxtel.net.au) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2023-04-25 05:09:43 +0200dh97(~tanmoydas@2405:201:d02b:48f3:b4d9:7afc:ebd0:3f47) (Client Quit)
2023-04-25 05:10:20 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 05:10:40 +0200bratwurst(~dfadsva@2604:3d09:207f:f650::708a) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2023-04-25 05:11:02 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net)
2023-04-25 05:12:29 +0200JScript(~JScript@cpe-172-193-181-254.qld.foxtel.net.au)
2023-04-25 05:12:31 +0200JScript(~JScript@cpe-172-193-181-254.qld.foxtel.net.au) (Max SendQ exceeded)
2023-04-25 05:13:53 +0200JScript(~JScript@cpe-172-193-181-254.qld.foxtel.net.au)
2023-04-25 05:20:01 +0200vglfr(~vglfr@46.96.188.24)
2023-04-25 05:20:18 +0200hugo(znc@verdigris.lysator.liu.se) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2023-04-25 05:23:15 +0200hugo(znc@verdigris.lysator.liu.se)
2023-04-25 05:47:56 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 05:49:06 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@198.244.205.143)
2023-04-25 05:49:33 +0200gurkengl1s(~gurkengla@dynamic-046-114-176-254.46.114.pool.telefonica.de) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2023-04-25 05:56:35 +0200nate1(~nate@98.45.169.16)
2023-04-25 06:01:15 +0200nate1(~nate@98.45.169.16) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2023-04-25 06:09:58 +0200wroathe(~wroathe@207-153-38-140.fttp.usinternet.com)
2023-04-25 06:09:58 +0200wroathe(~wroathe@207-153-38-140.fttp.usinternet.com) (Changing host)
2023-04-25 06:09:58 +0200wroathe(~wroathe@user/wroathe)
2023-04-25 06:10:03 +0200notzmv(~zmv@user/notzmv)
2023-04-25 06:10:20 +0200aeroplane(~user@user/aeroplane)
2023-04-25 06:11:56 +0200slac19118(~slack1256@191.126.227.64)
2023-04-25 06:13:20 +0200mjs2600(~mjs2600@c-24-91-3-49.hsd1.vt.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2023-04-25 06:14:18 +0200slack1256(~slack1256@191.126.227.87) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2023-04-25 06:14:28 +0200mjs2600(~mjs2600@c-24-91-3-49.hsd1.vt.comcast.net)
2023-04-25 06:25:32 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@198.244.205.143) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 06:26:13 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net)
2023-04-25 06:26:36 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net) (Client Quit)
2023-04-25 06:32:46 +0200gurkenglas(~gurkengla@dynamic-046-114-176-254.46.114.pool.telefonica.de)
2023-04-25 06:39:03 +0200harveypwca(~harveypwc@2601:246:c180:a570:3828:d8:e523:3f67)
2023-04-25 06:39:18 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net)
2023-04-25 06:39:20 +0200notzmv(~zmv@user/notzmv) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-04-25 06:47:52 +0200takuan(~takuan@178-116-218-225.access.telenet.be)
2023-04-25 06:48:33 +0200notzmv(~zmv@user/notzmv)
2023-04-25 06:59:45 +0200xff0x(~xff0x@125x103x176x34.ap125.ftth.ucom.ne.jp) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2023-04-25 06:59:47 +0200slac19118(~slack1256@191.126.227.64) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-04-25 07:01:48 +0200xff0x(~xff0x@125x103x176x34.ap125.ftth.ucom.ne.jp)
2023-04-25 07:02:31 +0200falafel(~falafel@2603-8000-d700-115c-edf5-9a9b-d729-cf34.res6.spectrum.com)
2023-04-25 07:03:02 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 07:03:44 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net)
2023-04-25 07:08:07 +0200riatre(~quassel@2001:310:6000:f::5198:1) (Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.)
2023-04-25 07:08:17 +0200riatre(~quassel@2001:310:6000:f::5198:1)
2023-04-25 07:09:48 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net) (Quit: )
2023-04-25 07:16:38 +0200alexherbo2(~alexherbo@2a02-842a-8180-4601-d11e-aa70-1ef3-2bb0.rev.sfr.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 07:16:58 +0200alexherbo2(~alexherbo@2a02-842a-8180-4601-d11e-aa70-1ef3-2bb0.rev.sfr.net)
2023-04-25 07:20:00 +0200 <jwiegley> why is logBase 0 1 = -0.0 rather than NaN?
2023-04-25 07:23:57 +0200smallville7123_(~JScript@103.137.12.165)
2023-04-25 07:24:00 +0200smallville7123_(~JScript@103.137.12.165) (Max SendQ exceeded)
2023-04-25 07:25:37 +0200JScript(~JScript@cpe-172-193-181-254.qld.foxtel.net.au) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2023-04-25 07:27:10 +0200wroathe(~wroathe@user/wroathe) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2023-04-25 07:27:59 +0200trev(~trev@user/trev)
2023-04-25 07:32:00 +0200michalz(~michalz@185.246.207.200)
2023-04-25 07:40:10 +0200tosyl(~user@103.206.114.114) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2023-04-25 07:42:45 +0200JScript(~JScript@103.137.12.165)
2023-04-25 07:43:04 +0200 <mikko> jwiegley: because it's definition is "logBase x y = log y / log x" (not that it makes it correct but it seems most software makes the same "mistake")
2023-04-25 07:54:31 +0200falafel(~falafel@2603-8000-d700-115c-edf5-9a9b-d729-cf34.res6.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2023-04-25 07:55:04 +0200euandreh(~Thunderbi@189.6.18.7) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 07:55:47 +0200euandreh(~Thunderbi@189.6.18.7)
2023-04-25 08:08:06 +0200 <mikko> jwiegley: https://bpa.st/YN5IY looks like it's not NaN in any language, and in all languages where it's not a runtime error it's 0
2023-04-25 08:09:07 +0200euandreh(~Thunderbi@189.6.18.7) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2023-04-25 08:31:18 +0200luffy[m]1(~luffyinte@2001:470:69fc:105::3:4cd5)
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2023-04-25 08:47:07 +0200kenran(~user@user/kenran)
2023-04-25 08:48:28 +0200MajorBiscuit(~MajorBisc@2001:1c00:2408:a400:7f99:b6d8:c8b8:dc05)
2023-04-25 08:50:25 +0200werneta(~werneta@70-142-214-115.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2023-04-25 08:52:28 +0200werneta(~werneta@70-142-214-115.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net)
2023-04-25 08:57:15 +0200tok(~user@user/tok)
2023-04-25 08:59:30 +0200MajorBiscuit(~MajorBisc@2001:1c00:2408:a400:7f99:b6d8:c8b8:dc05) (Quit: WeeChat 3.6)
2023-04-25 09:00:54 +0200lortabac(~lortabac@2a01:e0a:541:b8f0:3fc0:9f49:a9fd:db74)
2023-04-25 09:03:07 +0200chele(~chele@user/chele)
2023-04-25 09:03:32 +0200harveypwca(~harveypwc@2601:246:c180:a570:3828:d8:e523:3f67) (Quit: Leaving)
2023-04-25 09:11:30 +0200 <jwiegley> well, log 0 = -Infinity, so I wouldn't expect that definition of logBase to yield -0.0
2023-04-25 09:12:02 +0200 <jwiegley> the spec I'm looking at is https://speleotrove.com/decimal/, which disagrees with Haskell for both ^ and logBase on a few inputs; just wondering
2023-04-25 09:13:48 +0200 <mikko> 0.0 / -Infinity is -0.0, that's where it comes from
2023-04-25 09:14:37 +0200 <jwiegley> oh, sorry, I flipped the arguments in my head again
2023-04-25 09:15:48 +0200MajorBiscuit(~MajorBisc@c-001-025-011.client.tudelft.eduvpn.nl)
2023-04-25 09:17:11 +0200acidjnk(~acidjnk@p200300d6e715c48334884ea8abdf0cea.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
2023-04-25 09:18:45 +0200Goodbye_Vincent(cyvahl@freakshells.net)
2023-04-25 09:23:19 +0200vglfr(~vglfr@46.96.188.24) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2023-04-25 09:23:23 +0200titibandit(~titibandi@user/titibandit)
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2023-04-25 09:28:00 +0200shriekingnoise(~shrieking@186.137.175.87) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2023-04-25 09:29:59 +0200mc47(~mc47@xmonad/TheMC47)
2023-04-25 09:33:45 +0200tzh(~tzh@c-24-21-73-154.hsd1.or.comcast.net) (Quit: zzz)
2023-04-25 09:39:03 +0200_ht(~Thunderbi@82.174.52.28)
2023-04-25 09:39:57 +0200gurkenglas(~gurkengla@dynamic-046-114-176-254.46.114.pool.telefonica.de) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2023-04-25 09:40:27 +0200 <dminuoso> geekosaur: I wish () would cancel `` out.
2023-04-25 09:40:43 +0200 <dminuoso> (`foo`) ought to be syntactically equivalent to foo.
2023-04-25 09:40:51 +0200 <dminuoso> syntax isomorphism.
2023-04-25 09:41:06 +0200 <geekosaur> if you can come up with a syntactic replacement for the closing ` then it'd be possible
2023-04-25 09:42:06 +0200 <dminuoso> How do you mean?
2023-04-25 09:42:25 +0200 <dminuoso> And similarly, I would want `(+)` to work as in infix position.
2023-04-25 09:43:20 +0200 <[exa]> dminuoso: if you don't use some kind of reverse ` for "closing", it doesn't have unique parses
2023-04-25 09:43:29 +0200 <[exa]> say e.g. `+`+`+`
2023-04-25 09:43:37 +0200 <geekosaur> if opening and closing chars are the same then you need some kind of escape syntax to handle the case of multiple nestings (compare strings, and for that matter why shells switched from `` to $())
2023-04-25 09:44:11 +0200 <geekosaur> because once you allow (`foo`) you have the possibility of further nestings
2023-04-25 09:44:49 +0200 <geekosaur> well, thta's not entirely true because (`foo`) is almost valid as is because of sections
2023-04-25 09:47:42 +0200azimut(~azimut@gateway/tor-sasl/azimut)
2023-04-25 09:47:53 +0200vglfr(~vglfr@88.155.107.22)
2023-04-25 09:50:22 +0200notzmv(~zmv@user/notzmv) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-04-25 09:52:06 +0200vglfr(~vglfr@88.155.107.22) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2023-04-25 09:54:20 +0200tomsmeding. o O ( `(`foo`)` )
2023-04-25 09:55:37 +0200machinedgod(~machinedg@d198-53-218-113.abhsia.telus.net)
2023-04-25 09:57:07 +0200Sgeo(~Sgeo@user/sgeo) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-04-25 09:58:00 +0200 <dminuoso> tomsmeding: Interesting idea, for better visual readability, line comments should start with . o O
2023-04-25 09:58:05 +0200nate1(~nate@98.45.169.16)
2023-04-25 09:58:05 +0200 <dminuoso> And be enclosed in parens.
2023-04-25 09:59:00 +0200 <geekosaur> probably exists somewhere. isn't there a "cat macro" (eso)language?
2023-04-25 09:59:12 +0200zeenk(~zeenk@2a02:2f04:a20f:5200::fba)
2023-04-25 10:02:08 +0200ubert(~Thunderbi@p548c9793.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Quit: ubert)
2023-04-25 10:03:00 +0200JScript(~JScript@103.137.12.165) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
2023-04-25 10:03:10 +0200nate1(~nate@98.45.169.16) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2023-04-25 10:03:54 +0200 <probie> The J language has comments start with `NB.` which I enjoy
2023-04-25 10:03:59 +0200merijn(~merijn@c-001-001-006.client.esciencecenter.eduvpn.nl)
2023-04-25 10:05:41 +0200gurkenglas(~gurkengla@dynamic-046-114-176-254.46.114.pool.telefonica.de)
2023-04-25 10:07:43 +0200 <dminuoso> probie: that dot would trigger me heavily.
2023-04-25 10:07:48 +0200 <geekosaur> I kinda liked APL's "lamp" (raised small circle overprinted with cap)
2023-04-25 10:07:56 +0200 <dminuoso> Either it should be NB or N.B.
2023-04-25 10:09:07 +0200 <jade[m]> geekosaur: yesh that one's fun
2023-04-25 10:09:12 +0200 <jade[m]> * yeah that one's fun
2023-04-25 10:10:40 +0200tomboy64(~tomboy64@user/tomboy64)
2023-04-25 10:11:52 +0200 <dminuoso> Is there any value of using a `TVar (M.Map K V)` when there is no other STM references in any STM transaction over using an MVar () as a mutex around an `IORef (Map K V)`?
2023-04-25 10:14:08 +0200 <geekosaur> I'm gonna let someone else answer that one, I've had exactly three hours of sleep and don't quite trust my reasoning to that level
2023-04-25 10:15:27 +0200 <mikko> [exa]: mhm, i kinda like the look of Ì+Í+Ì+Í...
2023-04-25 10:16:18 +0200JScript(~JScript@103.137.12.165)
2023-04-25 10:16:18 +0200 <mikko> plus we could call them ìnfíx i's
2023-04-25 10:16:21 +0200 <jade[m]> that looks like a gate
2023-04-25 10:16:28 +0200JScript(~JScript@103.137.12.165) (Max SendQ exceeded)
2023-04-25 10:17:00 +0200JScript(~JScript@103.137.12.165)
2023-04-25 10:17:17 +0200 <jade[m]> Í=Î=Î=Ì
2023-04-25 10:18:44 +0200remexre_(~remexre@mail.sift.net)
2023-04-25 10:19:02 +0200remexre(~remexre@user/remexre) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-04-25 10:19:19 +0200remexre_remexre
2023-04-25 10:23:39 +0200 <dminuoso> Mmm, in fact it might be even cuter to use `MVar (IORef (Map K V))` as a way to guarantee you cant misuse this.
2023-04-25 10:23:43 +0200 <dminuoso> That's not too bad indeed.
2023-04-25 10:33:30 +0200 <merijn> dminuoso: What's the point of that?
2023-04-25 10:33:43 +0200 <merijn> dminuoso: Isn't that just "MVar (Map K V)" with extra steps?
2023-04-25 10:33:59 +0200 <dminuoso> I guess it is.
2023-04-25 10:35:07 +0200 <geekosaur> I was thinking that too, but as I said I don't quite trust myself currently
2023-04-25 10:38:57 +0200eggplantade(~Eggplanta@104-55-37-220.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 10:50:27 +0200jonathan_(~jonathan@h-176-10-144-60.NA.cust.bahnhof.se)
2023-04-25 10:51:58 +0200Katarushisu(~Katarushi@cpc147790-finc20-2-0-cust502.4-2.cable.virginm.net) (Quit: The Lounge - https://thelounge.chat)
2023-04-25 10:52:35 +0200 <jonathan_> I remember reading somewhere that it's bad practice to have a sum type with record syntax for the constructors. I can't remember any details, does anyone know the reasoning?
2023-04-25 10:53:20 +0200 <geekosaur> what's bad practice is data Foo = A { record here} | B { record here }
2023-04-25 10:53:53 +0200 <geekosaur> because all fields need to be present in all alternatives or the selector functions will be partial
2023-04-25 10:54:10 +0200ubert(~Thunderbi@2a02:8109:abc0:6434:a400:eee7:e7eb:3518)
2023-04-25 10:54:38 +0200azimut(~azimut@gateway/tor-sasl/azimut) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2023-04-25 10:55:05 +0200 <geekosaur> @let data Foo = FooA { fName :: String, fInt :: Int } | FooB { fName :: String, fStr :: String }
2023-04-25 10:55:06 +0200 <lambdabot> Defined.
2023-04-25 10:55:42 +0200 <geekosaur> @let anA = FooA "bleh" 1
2023-04-25 10:55:43 +0200Katarushisu(~Katarushi@cpc147790-finc20-2-0-cust502.4-2.cable.virginm.net)
2023-04-25 10:55:43 +0200 <lambdabot> Defined.
2023-04-25 10:55:57 +0200 <geekosaur> > fStr anA -- boom
2023-04-25 10:55:58 +0200 <lambdabot> "*Exception: No match in record selector fStr
2023-04-25 10:57:17 +0200 <merijn> geekosaur: That's fine practice, just enable (disable? :p) -XNoFieldSelectors
2023-04-25 10:58:03 +0200 <merijn> Hot take: Selector functions were a mistake
2023-04-25 11:03:09 +0200alexherbo2(~alexherbo@2a02-842a-8180-4601-d11e-aa70-1ef3-2bb0.rev.sfr.net) (*.net *.split)
2023-04-25 11:04:23 +0200coot(~coot@2a02:a310:e241:1b00:ec1a:e9df:79ac:66ba) (Quit: coot)
2023-04-25 11:04:27 +0200econo(uid147250@user/econo) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
2023-04-25 11:04:51 +0200FinnElija(~finn_elij@user/finn-elija/x-0085643) (*.net *.split)
2023-04-25 11:04:51 +0200gehmehgeh(~user@user/gehmehgeh) (*.net *.split)
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2023-04-25 11:04:51 +0200jpds(~jpds@gateway/tor-sasl/jpds) (*.net *.split)
2023-04-25 11:04:51 +0200chiselfuse(~chiselfus@user/chiselfuse) (*.net *.split)
2023-04-25 11:04:51 +0200califax(~califax@user/califx) (*.net *.split)
2023-04-25 11:04:51 +0200pharonix71(~pharonix7@user/pharonix71) (*.net *.split)
2023-04-25 11:04:52 +0200chexum(~quassel@gateway/tor-sasl/chexum) (*.net *.split)
2023-04-25 11:05:23 +0200pavonia(~user@user/siracusa) (Quit: Bye!)
2023-04-25 11:16:43 +0200 <lyxia> record updates too
2023-04-25 11:18:40 +0200 <merijn> Record updates are fine
2023-04-25 11:19:04 +0200 <dminuoso> lens provides a pretty ergonomic way to talk about nested access patterns, even updates.
2023-04-25 11:19:04 +0200 <merijn> In what way are they a mistake?
2023-04-25 11:19:18 +0200 <dminuoso> So I think record updates are fine, even though they are fairly useless in a nested scenario
2023-04-25 11:19:44 +0200 <merijn> lyxia: Selector functions are a mistake because a desirable usecase (multiple constructors with named fields) becomes 'bad' due to generating loads of partial functions
2023-04-25 11:19:57 +0200 <merijn> lyxia: afaict there's no negative interaction from record updates
2023-04-25 11:23:14 +0200 <dminuoso> I dont think selector functions are really important anyway, since you can just use pattern matching `f Foo{field = x} = ...`
2023-04-25 11:23:33 +0200 <dminuoso> Which at the same is fully robust
2023-04-25 11:27:10 +0200 <nshepperd2> with -XNoFieldSelectors you can also write your own field selectors when they happen to be total, without having to call the fields themselves "getFoo" which is gross
2023-04-25 11:27:45 +0200jzerebecki(~jzerebeck@2001:470:69fc:105::f90)
2023-04-25 11:27:46 +0200ft(~ft@p4fc2a88b.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Quit: leaving)
2023-04-25 11:33:41 +0200 <jzerebecki> trying to file a ghc bug report, login after account creation getting, "Your account is pending approval from your GitLab administrator and hence blocked. Please contact your GitLab administrator if you think this is an error. ", any advice how to proceed?
2023-04-25 11:34:22 +0200 <geekosaur> ask in #ghc, you generally have to be a bit of a squeaky wheel to push the process along
2023-04-25 11:35:02 +0200 <geekosaur> (approval stuff is because there was a shitload of spam on gitlab before they instituted it)
2023-04-25 11:36:17 +0200zeenk(~zeenk@2a02:2f04:a20f:5200::fba) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 11:37:01 +0200 <jzerebecki> thx
2023-04-25 11:37:02 +0200zeenk(~zeenk@2a02:2f04:a20f:5200::7fe)
2023-04-25 11:39:28 +0200eggplantade(~Eggplanta@104-55-37-220.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net)
2023-04-25 11:39:46 +0200 <merijn> In my experience #ghc or ghc-devs mailing list gets pretty fast response
2023-04-25 11:40:06 +0200 <merijn> I think you can just authenticate via github too?
2023-04-25 11:44:09 +0200eggplantade(~Eggplanta@104-55-37-220.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2023-04-25 11:44:51 +0200 <lyxia> merijn: is it not a problem to update a field that doesn't exist?
2023-04-25 11:46:17 +0200 <merijn> lyxia: Update is disabled for types with no selectors
2023-04-25 11:46:28 +0200 <lyxia> I see.
2023-04-25 11:46:41 +0200 <merijn> ah, wait, no I misread these docs, lemme check :p
2023-04-25 11:49:06 +0200 <merijn> hmm, guess I need a no -XNoUpdates too :p
2023-04-25 11:55:10 +0200barcisz(~barcisz@79.191.75.215.ipv4.supernova.orange.pl)
2023-04-25 11:59:27 +0200cods(~fred@82-65-232-44.subs.proxad.net) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2023-04-25 11:59:40 +0200cods(~fred@82-65-232-44.subs.proxad.net)
2023-04-25 12:00:58 +0200notzmv(~zmv@user/notzmv)
2023-04-25 12:01:52 +0200jmdaemon(~jmdaemon@user/jmdaemon) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-04-25 12:05:24 +0200 <fbytez> Is `Data.Function.&` the closest thing to the "opposite" of `$`? -- `string & (words >>> unwords)`
2023-04-25 12:05:46 +0200vglfr(~vglfr@88.155.25.253)
2023-04-25 12:06:58 +0200 <dminuoso> fbytez: what does "opposite" mean to you?
2023-04-25 12:08:36 +0200 <fbytez> Like, apply following functions to preceding data instead of apply functions to following data.
2023-04-25 12:08:40 +0200 <dminuoso> I mean it has flipped arguments, but one notable difference is that (&) is infixl 1, not infixl 0
2023-04-25 12:09:19 +0200 <fbytez> Sorry, I don't understand the terminology (infixl 1, not infixl 0)
2023-04-25 12:09:21 +0200 <dminuoso> The core of ($) isnt as much function application, as it is `infixr 0`
2023-04-25 12:09:49 +0200 <dminuoso> fbytez: So in Haskell we can control whether an operator is left or right associative, and also how strong its associativity is
2023-04-25 12:11:10 +0200xff0x(~xff0x@125x103x176x34.ap125.ftth.ucom.ne.jp) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-04-25 12:11:38 +0200 <fbytez> What do the "1" and "0" represent?
2023-04-25 12:11:41 +0200 <mauke> those are infix declarations. they're the reason why a + b * c parses as a + (b * c) and not vice versa
2023-04-25 12:11:50 +0200 <mauke> the numbers are the operator precedence
2023-04-25 12:12:10 +0200crvs(~crvs@212.37.18.202)
2023-04-25 12:12:11 +0200 <mauke> s/vice versa/as (a + b) * c/
2023-04-25 12:12:22 +0200 <fbytez> Ah... I understand. Thankyou, both.
2023-04-25 12:14:08 +0200 <dminuoso> fbytez: Anyway. Now I should note that for ($) it doesnt really matter whether its right or left associative (there's general consensus that it would have been better if it was written as left-associative/infixl), whats really important is that `0`
2023-04-25 12:14:13 +0200 <dminuoso> which means it binds stronger than almost anything.
2023-04-25 12:14:19 +0200 <fbytez> When it comes to compilation, is there any difference between `string & (words >>> unwords)` and `string & words & unwords`?
2023-04-25 12:14:32 +0200 <dminuoso> The only other operator that binds even stronger is the empty space (which you can think of a function application operator, semnatically)
2023-04-25 12:14:46 +0200 <fbytez> Right.
2023-04-25 12:15:13 +0200 <dminuoso> fbytez: Mmm okay so there might not be a difference. If there is, then (>>>) has the bigger potential to lead to worse code.
2023-04-25 12:15:21 +0200 <dminuoso> It depends a bit on some factors.
2023-04-25 12:15:40 +0200 <dminuoso> The reason is that (>>>) is polymorphic over a typeclass, (&) is monomorphic.
2023-04-25 12:16:13 +0200 <dminuoso> Another is that RULES might not fire depending on inlining, or fire later
2023-04-25 12:16:31 +0200 <dminuoso> But neither of these things is something I would worry about.
2023-04-25 12:16:38 +0200 <fbytez> Right.
2023-04-25 12:16:39 +0200 <dminuoso> If performance issues arise, they can be addressed.
2023-04-25 12:17:15 +0200 <fbytez> And how about compared to the "usual" ordering, like: `unwords $ words $ string`?
2023-04-25 12:17:30 +0200 <dminuoso> I dont consider that usual at all.
2023-04-25 12:17:36 +0200 <fbytez> Oh.
2023-04-25 12:17:42 +0200 <dminuoso> There's a broad range of Haskellers that consider ($) a bad idea.
2023-04-25 12:18:03 +0200 <fbytez> I wasn't expecting that.
2023-04-25 12:18:11 +0200 <dminuoso> Most of the "acceptable uses" have been subsumed by the BlockArguments extension
2023-04-25 12:18:31 +0200 <dminuoso> But note, this will depend on who you ask. There's obviously people that like ($) in their code a lot.
2023-04-25 12:19:26 +0200 <fbytez> I tend to view it as a shorthand for `()` on all following functions / data.
2023-04-25 12:19:59 +0200 <fbytez> How would you expect it to be written?
2023-04-25 12:20:11 +0200 <fbytez> `unwords (words string)`?
2023-04-25 12:20:48 +0200 <dminuoso> Yes.
2023-04-25 12:21:23 +0200 <fbytez> OK. Thanks for all the info.
2023-04-25 12:21:28 +0200 <dminuoso> Parenthesis make for easier refactoring and generally a better editor experience.
2023-04-25 12:21:44 +0200 <dminuoso> And if the number of parenthesis become too much, you're probably better off using surrogate bindings in a where clause
2023-04-25 12:21:52 +0200 <dminuoso> (Or other top level bindings)
2023-04-25 12:22:31 +0200 <dminuoso> fbytez: But anyway, I want to emphasize that whether or not to use ($) is still very subjective.
2023-04-25 12:22:56 +0200 <dminuoso> Given how frequently I see what I perceive as "an overuse of ($)", there's clearly a broad audience that enjoys it.
2023-04-25 12:24:17 +0200 <fbytez> Right. As I say, I viewed like a way to reduce use of '()' in a chain.
2023-04-25 12:24:30 +0200 <dminuoso> I dont think of parenthesis as being bad in any way.
2023-04-25 12:24:46 +0200 <dminuoso> You dont really end up saving anything if you replace one grammatical distinguisher with another.
2023-04-25 12:24:54 +0200 <dminuoso> It changes the style.
2023-04-25 12:25:07 +0200 <dminuoso> One clear and objective benefit of parenthesis is that you can easily refacftor something
2023-04-25 12:26:14 +0200 <fbytez> Same, really -- I rather like lisp -- just lazier to write.
2023-04-25 12:27:46 +0200 <fbytez> Does it potentially compile better as it's just stating precedence rather than applying a function?
2023-04-25 12:32:17 +0200 <mauke> unwords . words $ string
2023-04-25 12:33:49 +0200gnalzo(~gnalzo@2a01:e0a:498:fd50:fcc6:bb5d:489a:ce8c)
2023-04-25 12:34:17 +0200 <fbytez> mauke, that'd probably be my default.
2023-04-25 12:41:05 +0200 <fbytez> Well, the first method that comes to mind; I'm too new to have a default.
2023-04-25 12:41:47 +0200__monty__(~toonn@user/toonn)
2023-04-25 12:44:57 +0200coot(~coot@2a02:a310:e241:1b00:ec1a:e9df:79ac:66ba)
2023-04-25 12:47:15 +0200tlaxkit(~hexchat@170.253.47.137)
2023-04-25 12:54:46 +0200pyook(~puke@user/puke) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2023-04-25 12:56:44 +0200 <jackdk> I tend to go with `unwords $ words string` because I like minimising punctuation
2023-04-25 12:57:44 +0200xff0x(~xff0x@ai098135.d.east.v6connect.net)
2023-04-25 12:58:49 +0200pyook(~puke@user/puke)
2023-04-25 12:59:54 +0200 <fbytez> Yeah, it does read well, I think.
2023-04-25 13:00:22 +0200mc47(~mc47@xmonad/TheMC47) (Remote host closed the connection)
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2023-04-25 13:09:36 +0200 <eldritchcookie[m> hello i would like for stackage to use gi-gtk 4.. which packages are the reason to use gi-gtk 3..?
2023-04-25 13:12:56 +0200 <tomsmeding> merijn: if updates are not a problem if you disable them completely, then the updates _were_ a problem :p
2023-04-25 13:12:57 +0200eggplantade(~Eggplanta@104-55-37-220.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net)
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2023-04-25 13:26:47 +0200 <merijn> tomsmeding: I was just misremembering the details of what NoFieldSelectors did
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2023-04-25 14:52:57 +0200 <eldritchcookie[m> say does cabal always build all libraries in a package?
2023-04-25 14:53:46 +0200 <eldritchcookie[m> ie say i depend in library:x in package y will cabal build all libraries in that package or will it only build x?
2023-04-25 14:55:29 +0200sammelweis(~quassel@2601:401:8200:2d4c:bd9:d04c:7f69:eb10)
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2023-04-25 15:23:32 +0200 <fryguybob> dminuoso: The MVar version imposes fairness, but at a cost. The TVar version does not. Performance would probably depend on both the workload and the hardware.
2023-04-25 15:27:37 +0200euandreh(~Thunderbi@189.6.18.7)
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2023-04-25 15:30:25 +0200 <merijn> eldritchcookie[m: As in when using multi-library packages?
2023-04-25 15:30:25 +0200chiselfuse(~chiselfus@user/chiselfuse)
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2023-04-25 15:31:24 +0200 <merijn> eldritchcookie[m: It should only built the necessary ones, but that's also fairly new-ish and untested, since hackage only very recently introduced (experimental) multi-library support, iirc
2023-04-25 15:31:42 +0200jpds(~jpds@gateway/tor-sasl/jpds)
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2023-04-25 15:47:07 +0200 <dminuoso> fryguybob: Right. So very roughly Im just accepting UDP packets and forkIO their processing. It's just that for packets associated with a particular identifier, I want to process them in order.
2023-04-25 15:48:40 +0200JScript(~JScript@103.137.12.166)
2023-04-25 15:48:42 +0200 <dminuoso> So part of the idea is to have some kind of `MVar (IntMap [OutstandingRequest])` that has N keys (say 4096 or some such), hash the identifier `mod` N, and use that for some simple and naive scheduling
2023-04-25 15:50:37 +0200 <dminuoso> Or well, it would have to be a bit more elaborate than that
2023-04-25 15:51:07 +0200raehik(~raehik@cpc95906-rdng25-2-0-cust156.15-3.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2023-04-25 15:51:19 +0200 <dminuoso> Something `MVar (IntMap Bucket)` with `data Bucket = Running { backlog :: [OutstandingRequest] } | Free` maybe
2023-04-25 15:52:09 +0200stiell_(~stiell@gateway/tor-sasl/stiell)
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2023-04-25 15:59:14 +0200__monty__(~toonn@user/toonn) (Quit: leaving)
2023-04-25 15:59:48 +0200rf(~rf@2605:59c8:1604:2210:c2e5:3ae3:a4b2:98b0)
2023-04-25 16:00:00 +0200 <tomsmeding> dminuoso: what's the difference between Runniong [] and Free
2023-04-25 16:01:12 +0200 <tomsmeding> this sounds like an mvar that's going to be heavily contended
2023-04-25 16:01:59 +0200 <tomsmeding> dminuoso: are the packets received and put into the map sequentially? If not, it sounds hard to ensure that they're going to be handled in order
2023-04-25 16:02:08 +0200 <tomsmeding> (also, what does order even mean with UDP)
2023-04-25 16:05:21 +0200nschoe(~q@2a01:e0a:8e:a190:6a21:885a:4a6b:967e)
2023-04-25 16:11:59 +0200 <jean-paul[m]> I copied `MainWidget` from reflex-dom (where it is in "other-modules", not exposed) into my project. I copied the .c, .hsc, and .h files for it. I added it to my project's"other-modules" and added an "include-dirs" so the header file can be found. At runtime, I get a link error - Reflex_Dom_Android_MainWidget_runJS is not found. It seems like I got linked against the reflex-dom version of the library instead of mine?
2023-04-25 16:13:12 +0200 <jean-paul[m]> I'm surprised I'm even allowed to link against a non-exposed module from reflex-dom ...
2023-04-25 16:13:13 +0200Guest11(~Guest11@85.21.115.34)
2023-04-25 16:13:36 +0200raehik(~raehik@cpc95906-rdng25-2-0-cust156.15-3.cable.virginm.net)
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2023-04-25 16:18:41 +0200 <jean-paul[m]> Oh, dang. That's just a literal string in MainWidget.hsc. Nevermind.
2023-04-25 16:22:07 +0200justsomeguy(~justsomeg@user/justsomeguy) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2023-04-25 16:22:07 +0200Digitteknohippie(~user@user/digit)
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2023-04-25 16:29:09 +0200waleee(~waleee@2001:9b0:21c:4000:5bf9:6515:c030:57b7)
2023-04-25 16:29:48 +0200 <jean-paul[m]> I also didn't tell cabal that it needs the hsc2hs build-tool ... but now everything works. I wonder why (or what's broken that I didn't notice).
2023-04-25 16:29:54 +0200gnalzo(~gnalzo@2a01:e0a:498:fd50:fcc6:bb5d:489a:ce8c)
2023-04-25 16:29:56 +0200Sgeo(~Sgeo@user/sgeo)
2023-04-25 16:30:43 +0200 <jean-paul[m]> was I supposed to let cabal run hsc2hs on MainWidget.hsc to generate MainWidget.c and MainWidget.h?
2023-04-25 16:33:18 +0200 <c_wraith> jean-paul[m]: yeah, cabal should handle it.
2023-04-25 16:34:20 +0200ubert(~Thunderbi@2a02:8109:abc0:6434:a400:eee7:e7eb:3518) (Remote host closed the connection)
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2023-04-25 16:35:50 +0200 <c_wraith> jean-paul[m]: also... .hsc feels very weird when compiling to javascript. The whole point of .hsc files is to capture your C compiler's generated definitions and then make a haskell file from them.
2023-04-25 16:37:10 +0200 <c_wraith> I don't see how that fits into compiling to js
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2023-04-25 16:41:50 +0200lortabac(~lortabac@2a01:e0a:541:b8f0:4fdc:365f:53fd:753d)
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2023-04-25 16:45:28 +0200geekosaur(~geekosaur@xmonad/geekosaur)
2023-04-25 16:47:29 +0200 <probie> c_wraith: Doesn't reflex have a non-js mode which uses whatever GTK's webview is?
2023-04-25 16:47:47 +0200 <jean-paul[m]> I don't think it ever goes to JavaScript. Instead, it goes to C to do stuff with JNI to invoke Java Android SDK stuff. It's in reflex-dom, I guess, because ... what probie said
2023-04-25 16:48:31 +0200 <c_wraith> oh, I was assuming it was in the JS portion because of your mention of a runJS module. But yeah, it does have native parts.
2023-04-25 16:48:32 +0200dumptruckman(~dumptruck@143-42-239-71.ip.linodeusercontent.com) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2023-04-25 16:49:16 +0200dumptruckman(~dumptruck@143-42-239-71.ip.linodeusercontent.com)
2023-04-25 16:50:02 +0200 <jean-paul[m]> MainWidget.h and MainWidget.c look pretty hand-crafted though, not generated... 😕
2023-04-25 16:50:05 +0200 <c_wraith> So when you have an .hsc file, cabal will run the hsc2hs tool automatically, as long as it's installed. (and it should be packaged with ghc in most cases, iirc). Any .c, .h, and .hs files generated in the process are build artifacts and should be ignored unless you need them for debugging.
2023-04-25 16:51:16 +0200 <c_wraith> Hmm. just a naming coincidence then?
2023-04-25 16:54:29 +0200 <jean-paul[m]> Seems likely ... I'm not exactly sure how to check. Since it's for Android, I can only build with a cross-compiler, and the cross-compiler setup inserts a bunch of layers between me and any actual hsc2c invocation that's happening.
2023-04-25 16:54:41 +0200 <jean-paul[m]> er, hsc2hs
2023-04-25 16:56:27 +0200 <jean-paul[m]> Okay, there's hand-written comments in the files that don't match, gonna take that as conclusive.
2023-04-25 16:57:16 +0200 <jean-paul[m]> I guess some other part of the cross-compile setup could be bringing hsc2hs along, covering up my mistake in not telling cabal about it ...? I really don't know how all these pieces fit together.
2023-04-25 16:59:10 +0200 <c_wraith> well, cross-compiling is also a weird thought with hsc2hs
2023-04-25 16:59:28 +0200 <c_wraith> it needs to run the generated .c file on the target platform to work correctly
2023-04-25 17:01:07 +0200eggplantade(~Eggplanta@2600:1700:38c5:d800:995:b0a8:9c27:4ecf)
2023-04-25 17:01:08 +0200 <c_wraith> It's roughly like template haskell, in that sense
2023-04-25 17:01:11 +0200 <jean-paul[m]> I'm pretty sure there are no arm emulators in this build tool chain.. so I dunno.
2023-04-25 17:02:01 +0200 <c_wraith> I guess it doesn't need to run on arm, it just needs the C compiler to set constants the way it would on arm.
2023-04-25 17:02:11 +0200 <c_wraith> It's possible there are build flags for that.
2023-04-25 17:02:39 +0200 <merijn> jean-paul[m]: Basically, the problem is that hsc2hs is used to generate stuff like "accessors for C structs", but C structs aren't portable
2023-04-25 17:02:41 +0200 <jean-paul[m]> Okay, that part I could see working. There's a lot of effort put in to getting the C toolchain set up for cross-compilation.
2023-04-25 17:03:06 +0200 <merijn> jean-paul[m]: So the only "real" way to get the right offsets, etc. is to use a C compiler to compile C code and have it report the correct offsets/padding/etc. for your specific code
2023-04-25 17:04:28 +0200 <merijn> But hsc2hs doesn't just compile the C code, but also runs the resulting binary, so I think any form of cross-compilation using hsc2hs is just "lol, I'm happy I'm not you" :p
2023-04-25 17:05:24 +0200 <jean-paul[m]> heh
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2023-04-25 18:19:09 +0200DigitteknohippieDigit
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2023-04-25 18:34:21 +0200t0ngub1n(~t0ngub1n@85.249.45.137)
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2023-04-25 19:02:53 +0200L29Ah(~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah) ()
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2023-04-25 19:15:38 +0200 <t0ngub1n> hey
2023-04-25 19:15:54 +0200 <t0ngub1n> does anyone know why this gives a parse error?
2023-04-25 19:16:12 +0200 <t0ngub1n> (_:t) @ (x:y:_)
2023-04-25 19:16:26 +0200 <t0ngub1n> error:
2023-04-25 19:16:27 +0200 <t0ngub1n> [1 of 1] Compiling Main ( main.hs, main.o )
2023-04-25 19:16:27 +0200 <t0ngub1n> main.hs:17:23: error: parse error on input ‘@’
2023-04-25 19:16:27 +0200 <t0ngub1n> |
2023-04-25 19:16:27 +0200 <t0ngub1n> 17 | xorEncodeWorker (_:t) @ (x:y:_) = x `xor` y : xorEncodeWorker t
2023-04-25 19:16:27 +0200 <t0ngub1n> | ^
2023-04-25 19:18:32 +0200 <mauke> the thing before @ in a pattern must be an identifier IIRC
2023-04-25 19:19:27 +0200 <t0ngub1n> so I have to use list @ (x:y:_) and then in function body (tail list) instead of t?
2023-04-25 19:22:05 +0200 <xerox> > let f (x:xs@(y:_)) = (x + y)*length xs in f [1..3]
2023-04-25 19:22:07 +0200 <lambdabot> 6
2023-04-25 19:25:29 +0200nschoe(~q@2a01:e0a:8e:a190:f0e4:3ef9:e1cd:8332)
2023-04-25 19:25:43 +0200segfaultfizzbuzz(~segfaultf@23-93-74-212.fiber.dynamic.sonic.net)
2023-04-25 19:26:38 +0200segfaultfizzbuzz(~segfaultf@23-93-74-212.fiber.dynamic.sonic.net) (Client Quit)
2023-04-25 19:27:29 +0200 <t0ngub1n> > do { let func (_:t @ (x:y:_)) = x+y : t; putStrLn func [1:2:3] }
2023-04-25 19:27:30 +0200 <lambdabot> <hint>:1:64: error: parse error on input ‘}’
2023-04-25 19:28:02 +0200 <t0ngub1n> let func (_:t @ (x:y:_)) = x+y : t in func [1,2,3]
2023-04-25 19:28:11 +0200 <t0ngub1n> >let func (_:t @ (x:y:_)) = x+y : t in func [1,2,3]
2023-04-25 19:28:18 +0200 <t0ngub1n> > let func (_:t @ (x:y:_)) = x+y : t in func [1,2,3]
2023-04-25 19:28:19 +0200 <lambdabot> [5,2,3]
2023-04-25 19:28:34 +0200 <t0ngub1n> > let func ((_:t) @ (x:y:_)) = x+y : t in func [1,2,3]
2023-04-25 19:28:35 +0200 <lambdabot> <hint>:1:17: error: parse error on input ‘@’
2023-04-25 19:30:17 +0200 <tomsmeding> t0ngub1n: what about 'func (x : t@(y : _))' ?
2023-04-25 19:30:33 +0200 <t0ngub1n> maybe
2023-04-25 19:31:22 +0200L29Ah(~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah)
2023-04-25 19:31:45 +0200 <t0ngub1n> @tomsmeding thank you! it worked
2023-04-25 19:31:46 +0200 <lambdabot> Unknown command, try @list
2023-04-25 19:37:11 +0200joshthewall(~manjaro-i@2a00:23c7:9386:7801:7dfc:aab:5abc:5104)
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2023-04-25 20:14:40 +0200nick2(~nick@wsip-174-78-110-18.pn.at.cox.net)
2023-04-25 20:16:46 +0200 <nick2> I'm trying to install the PBKDF2 package in cabal, but it says: (conflict: PBKDF2 => base>=4.3 && <4.9). However, the newest base (according to Hackage) looks like 4.18.0.0. What am I doing wrong here?
2023-04-25 20:17:49 +0200 <[exa]> nick2: it's deprecated, see the notice here https://hackage.haskell.org/package/PBKDF2
2023-04-25 20:18:33 +0200 <[exa]> nick2: this one should do the same while being compatible with recent compilers https://hackage.haskell.org/package/pbkdf
2023-04-25 20:19:19 +0200 <nick2> That's a different package: i.e. Crypto.PBKDF2. I'm looking for Data.Password.PBKDF2 https://hackage.haskell.org/package/password-3.0.2.1
2023-04-25 20:20:09 +0200 <nick2> Maybe I'm selecting the wrong one from cabal list?
2023-04-25 20:21:17 +0200 <[exa]> ah that's package `password`, not PBKDF2
2023-04-25 20:21:22 +0200 <nick2> ah ok
2023-04-25 20:21:28 +0200 <nick2> I see my issue now
2023-04-25 20:21:59 +0200 <[exa]> module names vs pkg names get confusing sometimes, best just hoogle it to be sure :]
2023-04-25 20:22:24 +0200 <[exa]> e.g. https://hoogle.haskell.org/?hoogle=Data.Password.PBKDF2%20is%3Amodule
2023-04-25 20:24:35 +0200ircbrowse_tom(~ircbrowse@static.162.49.55.162.clients.your-server.de)
2023-04-25 20:24:41 +0200Server+Cnt
2023-04-25 20:24:50 +0200 <nick2> Hoogle is how I found it, but its a little confusing navigating around the actual package. password still says: base (>=4.9 && <5) for that package, that doesn't make sense to me
2023-04-25 20:25:47 +0200 <nick2> further cabal says it contains no executables so do I have to just compile this from source?
2023-04-25 20:26:15 +0200 <sclv> well "install" is designed for executables
2023-04-25 20:26:37 +0200 <sclv> to use it, you typically just add it as a dependency to the package that needs it and cabal handles using it behind the scenes
2023-04-25 20:27:14 +0200 <sclv> there _is_ a local install of pckages, via "cabal install --lib" but its UI is still a work in progress -- it manages a "ghc environment file" so you need to know about those to use it sanely
2023-04-25 20:28:58 +0200yahb2(~yahb2@2a01:4f8:c0c:5c7b::2) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 20:29:24 +0200yahb2(~yahb2@2a01:4f8:c0c:5c7b::2)
2023-04-25 20:39:26 +0200 <[exa]> nick2: here hackage clearly says <4.9 right? https://hackage.haskell.org/package/PBKDF2
2023-04-25 20:40:04 +0200seeg83(~seeg@212.180.148.196)
2023-04-25 20:40:16 +0200 <nick2> it does, but it also says >=4.3
2023-04-25 20:40:44 +0200 <[exa]> yeah that's the other half of the supported interval :D
2023-04-25 20:40:48 +0200 <nick2> am I wrong in assuming that means any version of base from 4.3 up to but not including 4.9?
2023-04-25 20:41:26 +0200 <[exa]> yes literally as the inequalities say there
2023-04-25 20:41:34 +0200 <nick2> what I don't understand is how can the dependency be greater than the current version of base i.e. 4.18.0.0
2023-04-25 20:41:39 +0200 <[exa]> (version >= 4.3 && version < 4.9)
2023-04-25 20:41:58 +0200 <[exa]> and 4.18 is bigger than 4.9
2023-04-25 20:42:32 +0200 <nick2> ah I see I'm dumb. I'm being dyslexic.
2023-04-25 20:43:01 +0200slack1256(~slack1256@181.42.41.193)
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2023-04-25 21:03:41 +0200 <eldritchcookie[m> hello does anyone have experience designing the overall architecture of an application? i am planning a somewhat big project(for one person) and would really like some advice
2023-04-25 21:04:46 +0200stiell_(~stiell@gateway/tor-sasl/stiell)
2023-04-25 21:16:44 +0200 <[exa]> eldritchcookie[m: well like, what kind of application
2023-04-25 21:17:05 +0200 <eldritchcookie[m> a Virtual tabletop
2023-04-25 21:17:25 +0200waleee(~waleee@2001:9b0:21c:4000:5bf9:6515:c030:57b7)
2023-04-25 21:17:33 +0200 <[exa]> nick2: I'm having problems with the same tbh, last time something like 0.1.10.1 vs 0.1.9.8 optically muuuuuuuuuch bigger right?
2023-04-25 21:18:01 +0200statusbot7(~statusbot@ec2-34-198-122-184.compute-1.amazonaws.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 21:18:15 +0200 <[exa]> eldritchcookie[m: like e.g. for playing card games?
2023-04-25 21:18:42 +0200statusbot(~statusbot@ec2-34-198-122-184.compute-1.amazonaws.com)
2023-04-25 21:19:18 +0200 <eldritchcookie[m> kind of, the idea is to use for TTRPG so something similar to maptool
2023-04-25 21:19:34 +0200 <eldritchcookie[m> https://github.com/RPTools/maptool
2023-04-25 21:20:05 +0200 <yushyin> so more like foundryvtt
2023-04-25 21:20:07 +0200jmdaemon(~jmdaemon@user/jmdaemon)
2023-04-25 21:20:24 +0200 <eldritchcookie[m> yes exactly
2023-04-25 21:21:21 +0200 <[exa]> well, studying the existing stuff helps a lot
2023-04-25 21:21:28 +0200 <yushyin> i like foundryvtt :)
2023-04-25 21:21:34 +0200eggplantade(~Eggplanta@2600:1700:38c5:d800:995:b0a8:9c27:4ecf) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 21:23:30 +0200vglfr(~vglfr@88.155.25.253)
2023-04-25 21:24:13 +0200 <eldritchcookie[m> most are closed source and the only open source one is the one i sent
2023-04-25 21:24:59 +0200eggplantade(~Eggplanta@104-55-37-220.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net)
2023-04-25 21:25:13 +0200 <eldritchcookie[m> and what i want isn't how to make a VTT and more things like how to persist application state assuming i will have multiple versions
2023-04-25 21:25:45 +0200 <eldritchcookie[m> or what are the trade offs of using a custom monad versus a DSL
2023-04-25 21:27:19 +0200polyphem(~polyphem@ip-109-43-48-228.web.vodafone.de)
2023-04-25 21:29:15 +0200namiroff(~namiroff@31.223.145.73)
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2023-04-25 21:32:45 +0200L29Ah(~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah) ()
2023-04-25 21:32:59 +0200 <sm> existing apps you want to mimic at least gives an idea of the functionality and concepts, and from this maybe you can sketch the data model
2023-04-25 21:33:27 +0200 <sm> I would build a series of progressively more capable prototypes using the simplest haskell that works at each stage
2023-04-25 21:34:36 +0200eggplantade(~Eggplanta@104-55-37-220.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 21:37:07 +0200 <eldritchcookie[m> i fear local maxima like the bubonic plague and while your suggestion is reasonable and we should take care to not over engineer there is the equally dangerous scenerio of under engineering
2023-04-25 21:37:16 +0200 <eldritchcookie[m> i do not what to rewrite code
2023-04-25 21:37:39 +0200 <eldritchcookie[m> *i do not want to rewrite code as much as possible
2023-04-25 21:38:01 +0200 <sm> yes, you should plan to rewrite at least some code unless you have perfect knowledge of the tools and the domain
2023-04-25 21:39:00 +0200 <sm> you'll never get stuck; haskell is always refactorable
2023-04-25 21:40:09 +0200 <sm> but certainly get as clear as you about the spec, data model, architecture, as you can before each coding phase. Usually there's some back and forth
2023-04-25 21:41:31 +0200 <geekosaur> I used to do this for a living. Turns out people are lousy about specs
2023-04-25 21:43:33 +0200 <eldritchcookie[m> do you guys think i can get away with something like freeciv's rulesets(only data) or will i need scripting?
2023-04-25 21:43:40 +0200L29Ah(~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah)
2023-04-25 21:44:16 +0200 <geekosaur> that depends a lot on what exactly you need to do
2023-04-25 21:44:46 +0200 <namiroff> What would I need to do in order to build a compiler in Haskell
2023-04-25 21:45:41 +0200 <sm> study an existing one, do what they did :)
2023-04-25 21:45:45 +0200 <geekosaur> that's almost as open-ended a question as eldritchcookie[m's
2023-04-25 21:46:09 +0200 <namiroff> What are the exaples of compilers build in Haskell?
2023-04-25 21:46:31 +0200 <jade[m]> haskell
2023-04-25 21:46:39 +0200 <geekosaur> agda
2023-04-25 21:47:40 +0200 <sm> idris
2023-04-25 21:47:42 +0200Tuplanolla(~Tuplanoll@91-159-68-236.elisa-laajakaista.fi)
2023-04-25 21:47:49 +0200 <geekosaur> there's an IRC bot which implements a (somewhat out of date by now, I think) C++ interpreter: https://github.com/Eelis/geordi
2023-04-25 21:47:55 +0200 <yushyin> purescript?
2023-04-25 21:48:11 +0200 <sm> yup. elm ? I googled but couldn't tell
2023-04-25 21:48:25 +0200 <c_wraith> elm was originally. I think they made it self-hosting
2023-04-25 21:48:30 +0200 <sm> many DSL/compiler-y things in the blockchain space
2023-04-25 21:49:21 +0200 <sm> @where scheme
2023-04-25 21:49:22 +0200 <c_wraith> The version of Elm on github is still in Haskell
2023-04-25 21:49:34 +0200 <[exa]> namiroff: you write a datatype representation of the output language and a function that writes it to a file, then you make an IR datatype and a function that converts it to the output representation, and finally a parser that converts strings to the IR. (SW engineering spoiler: do it in this order, for the first compiler it's extremely easy to get carried away on parser and end up with unfinishable
2023-04-25 21:49:40 +0200 <[exa]> project)
2023-04-25 21:49:56 +0200 <c_wraith> So I guess Elm is still in Haskell. That looks current
2023-04-25 21:51:02 +0200 <sm> [exa]++ 👀
2023-04-25 21:51:27 +0200MRN(~MRN18159@79.161.254.60)
2023-04-25 21:51:34 +0200 <[exa]> as in, it's actually trivial and the spoiler is hard-learned.
2023-04-25 21:51:38 +0200MRN(~MRN18159@79.161.254.60) ()
2023-04-25 21:52:08 +0200 <sm> [exa]: is that a transpiler in general ? and a compiler is a special case of that ?
2023-04-25 21:52:35 +0200 <geekosaur> a compiler transpiles to assembly language
2023-04-25 21:52:47 +0200 <sm> right
2023-04-25 21:53:09 +0200 <[exa]> (now let's discuss if javascript is a good assembly :D )
2023-04-25 21:53:19 +0200[exa]hides
2023-04-25 21:53:31 +0200 <geekosaur> I thought wasm was the practical answer to that question
2023-04-25 21:53:37 +0200Hecatefalls on the ground, foaming at the mouth
2023-04-25 21:53:41 +0200 <sm> nowadays that would be llvm or wasm wouldn't it
2023-04-25 21:54:39 +0200 <[exa]> I can't say if compilers and transpilers are distinguishable, except with transpiler you kinda expect to use another (com/trans)piler after it
2023-04-25 21:55:02 +0200 <geekosaur> I'm not sure they are any more
2023-04-25 21:55:29 +0200 <geekosaur> I mean, ghc actually compiles to cmm, then compiles that to asm. is it a compiler or a transpiler?
2023-04-25 21:55:57 +0200 <jade[m]> it's wrapped up in one thing, so I'd call it a compiler
2023-04-25 21:56:01 +0200 <geekosaur> clang compiles to llvm IR. is it a compiler or a transpiler?
2023-04-25 21:56:11 +0200 <jade[m]> if you had to invoke both seperately it'd be a compiler
2023-04-25 21:56:15 +0200 <[exa]> a compilation of transpilers
2023-04-25 21:56:22 +0200 <jade[m]> haha
2023-04-25 21:57:45 +0200 <[exa]> ok now let's try to distinguish a compiler from an interpreter... what if the input language are just complex code-emmiting commands for the compiler?
2023-04-25 21:58:30 +0200rf(~rf@2605:59c8:1604:2210:c2e5:3ae3:a4b2:98b0) (Remote host closed the connection)
2023-04-25 21:58:55 +0200 <geekosaur> java muddied that question years ago
2023-04-25 21:59:04 +0200shriekingnoise(~shrieking@186.137.175.87) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2023-04-25 21:59:29 +0200 <sm> interpreter doesn't save its work, it always starts anew. Compilers save (cache) artifacts which can be reused next time
2023-04-25 21:59:45 +0200 <jade[m]> I think my definitions go as follows:
2023-04-25 21:59:45 +0200 <jade[m]> - Compiler: one command from input -> machine code
2023-04-25 21:59:45 +0200 <jade[m]> - Transpiler: one command from input -> other input that can be used by another compiler
2023-04-25 21:59:45 +0200 <jade[m]> - Interpreter: one command from input -> output
2023-04-25 21:59:47 +0200shriekingnoise(~shrieking@186.137.175.87)
2023-04-25 21:59:58 +0200 <jade[m]> (feel free to disagree)
2023-04-25 22:00:00 +0200 <c_wraith> sm: so cpython is a compiler, leaving all those .pyc files behind?
2023-04-25 22:00:18 +0200 <sm> a little bit.. c for compiled!
2023-04-25 22:00:26 +0200 <ncf> topical tweet https://twitter.com/rob_rix/status/1277770572123058176
2023-04-25 22:01:35 +0200 <ncf> "*whispers* there’s no such thing as marshalling, unmarshalling, encoding, decoding, compilation, transpilation, or optimization, it’s all just interpretation under 0 or more futamura projections"
2023-04-25 22:02:38 +0200 <geekosaur> if you really want to muddy the waters, remember that x86_64 asm is itself interpreted(? or is it JIT, or ???) into microcode
2023-04-25 22:02:40 +0200nate1(~nate@98.45.169.16)
2023-04-25 22:02:54 +0200 <[exa]> geekosaur++
2023-04-25 22:03:05 +0200 <geekosaur> we're imo well past the point where "it's what I point at when I say it"
2023-04-25 22:04:11 +0200 <jade[m]> machine code is also interpreted by the cpu
2023-04-25 22:04:12 +0200 <jade[m]> so nothing is truly compiled
2023-04-25 22:05:06 +0200 <geekosaur> and it's not clear that you can even say "compiled means it runs directly on hardware": see the reduceron
2023-04-25 22:05:25 +0200 <[exa]> in other news, irssi is an interactive message-to-tcp compiler
2023-04-25 22:05:37 +0200 <geekosaur> or in the other direction, transmeta
2023-04-25 22:06:23 +0200gnalzo(~gnalzo@2a01:e0a:498:fd50:fcc6:bb5d:489a:ce8c)
2023-04-25 22:06:50 +0200 <sm> of course our perception of input, output and what is even going on here is running in the quantum consciousness field
2023-04-25 22:07:22 +0200 <jade[m]> right, in the end it's all interpreted by the simulation anyway
2023-04-25 22:07:23 +0200 <geekosaur> or in the other other direction, rosetta
2023-04-25 22:07:24 +0200nate1(~nate@98.45.169.16) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2023-04-25 22:07:44 +0200t0ngub1n(~t0ngub1n@85.249.45.137) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2023-04-25 22:11:59 +0200 <[exa]> nice how it rhymes
2023-04-25 22:13:02 +0200 <sm> indeed.. more rhyming would make our lives a lot more manageable
2023-04-25 22:15:01 +0200 <sm> rhyming and/or more logical technical vocabulary generally. Maybe a sanskrit for computing
2023-04-25 22:16:45 +0200 <sm> you learn it, you think in it, you get insight, you become enlightened.. I guess expressive strongly-typed succinct languages like Haskell can work like that in a codebase
2023-04-25 22:16:47 +0200machinedgod(~machinedg@d198-53-218-113.abhsia.telus.net)
2023-04-25 22:19:38 +0200 <[exa]> and it certainly sounds better to go study the vedas than to go try to find that bug again
2023-04-25 22:20:00 +0200 <sm> heck yes you're right about that
2023-04-25 22:20:57 +0200 <sm> I'm avoiding a php bug right now, perfect time to evolve consciousness
2023-04-25 22:21:32 +0200 <[exa]> php is good, if you don't <?php you can just write the vedas as you need and the code will compile
2023-04-25 22:21:45 +0200 <[exa]> OH I mean interpret
2023-04-25 22:22:18 +0200 <sm> well something may happen
2023-04-25 22:22:31 +0200 <[exa]> ok nvm I'm off for today, enjoy here :]
2023-04-25 22:22:43 +0200 <sm> o/
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