| 2022-04-03 00:01:05 +0200 | cosimone | (~user@93-47-228-79.ip115.fastwebnet.it) (Quit: ERC (IRC client for Emacs 27.1)) |
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| 2022-04-03 01:25:14 +0200 | <geekosaur> | frostbyte_, https://gitlab.haskell.org/ghc/ghc/-/issues/21336 |
| 2022-04-03 01:26:29 +0200 | Psybur | (~Psybur@2601:5c9:4201:3220:19c2:a1cd:6600:38ba) |
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| 2022-04-03 01:32:04 +0200 | joo-_ | (~joo-_@80-62-116-70-mobile.dk.customer.tdc.net) (Changing host) |
| 2022-04-03 01:32:04 +0200 | joo-_ | (~joo-_@fsf/member/joo--) |
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| 2022-04-03 01:46:06 +0200 | zeenk | (~zeenk@2a02:2f04:a313:d600:8d26:ec9f:3ff6:fc94) (Quit: Konversation terminated!) |
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| 2022-04-03 01:47:20 +0200 | stevenxl | (~stevenxl@c-73-72-2-81.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
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| 2022-04-03 01:51:42 +0200 | chenqisu1 | (~chenqisu1@183.217.200.168) |
| 2022-04-03 01:53:12 +0200 | stevenxl | (~stevenxl@c-73-72-2-81.hsd1.il.comcast.net) (Quit: leaving) |
| 2022-04-03 01:53:44 +0200 | jgeerds | (~jgeerds@d5364b87.access.ecotel.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 01:54:50 +0200 | <geekosaur> | btw, about your earlier question about `filterM`: iirc IO's >>= is strict so `filterM` is also strict. I may be misremembering the exact place where strictness sneaks in, though |
| 2022-04-03 01:55:03 +0200 | <geekosaur> | @src filterM |
| 2022-04-03 01:55:03 +0200 | <lambdabot> | Source not found. Are you on drugs? |
| 2022-04-03 01:55:09 +0200 | <geekosaur> | bleargh |
| 2022-04-03 01:56:19 +0200 | <geekosaur> | filterM p = foldr (\ x -> liftA2 (\ flg -> if flg then (x:) else id) (p x)) (pure []) |
| 2022-04-03 01:56:28 +0200 | <geekosaur> | it's Applicative not Monad these days, whoops |
| 2022-04-03 01:57:01 +0200 | <geekosaur> | anyway yes, I am pretty sure that's strict |
| 2022-04-03 01:57:07 +0200 | <geekosaur> | at least in IO |
| 2022-04-03 01:59:13 +0200 | Pickchea | (~private@user/pickchea) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2022-04-03 01:59:28 +0200 | sammelweis | (~quassel@2601:401:8200:2d4c:bd9:d04c:7f69:eb10) |
| 2022-04-03 02:07:03 +0200 | bitmapper | (uid464869@id-464869.lymington.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) |
| 2022-04-03 02:07:11 +0200 | zyklotomic | (~ethan@res380d-128-61-87-190.res.gatech.edu) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
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| 2022-04-03 02:27:28 +0200 | deadmarshal_ | (~deadmarsh@95.38.113.202) |
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| 2022-04-03 02:33:16 +0200 | unit73e | (~emanuel@2001:818:e8dd:7c00:32b5:c2ff:fe6b:5291) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
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| 2022-04-03 02:35:58 +0200 | benin | (~benin@183.82.204.110) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 02:43:00 +0200 | <monochrom> | liftA2 for a lot of applicatives kill short circuiting. |
| 2022-04-03 02:43:23 +0200 | <monochrom> | Example: Maybe: |
| 2022-04-03 02:43:35 +0200 | gingeh | (~gingeh@2001:8003:1c2a:b600:79c4:94cc:218e:5ea5) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2022-04-03 02:43:37 +0200 | <monochrom> | > liftA2 (&&) Nothing undefined |
| 2022-04-03 02:43:38 +0200 | <lambdabot> | Nothing |
| 2022-04-03 02:43:46 +0200 | <monochrom> | Err oops wrong inputs. |
| 2022-04-03 02:43:54 +0200 | <monochrom> | > liftA2 (&&) (Just False) undefined |
| 2022-04-03 02:43:55 +0200 | <lambdabot> | *Exception: Prelude.undefined |
| 2022-04-03 02:44:14 +0200 | <monochrom> | does not give && a chance to short-circuit. |
| 2022-04-03 02:46:23 +0200 | <hpc> | > liftA2 (&&) (Just False) (Just undefined) |
| 2022-04-03 02:46:24 +0200 | <lambdabot> | Just False |
| 2022-04-03 02:46:36 +0200 | <monochrom> | Likewise, for IO, liftA2 op foo bar executes both foo and bar unconditionally. op does not have a say on this. |
| 2022-04-03 02:46:38 +0200 | <hpc> | it's strict in the effect, and inherits the function's strictness on the type variable |
| 2022-04-03 02:46:45 +0200 | <monochrom> | Yeah. |
| 2022-04-03 02:47:16 +0200 | <monochrom> | But perhaps you can mitigate by liftA2 op (unsafeInterleaveIO foo) (unsafeInterleaveIO bar) >:) |
| 2022-04-03 02:47:18 +0200 | <hpc> | (characterizing laziness can be a wild ride sometimes) |
| 2022-04-03 02:48:54 +0200 | <abastro[m]> | > (&&) <$> pure False <*> pure undefined :: IO () |
| 2022-04-03 02:48:55 +0200 | <lambdabot> | error: |
| 2022-04-03 02:48:55 +0200 | <lambdabot> | • Couldn't match type ‘Bool’ with ‘()’ |
| 2022-04-03 02:48:56 +0200 | <lambdabot> | Expected type: IO () |
| 2022-04-03 02:49:27 +0200 | <abastro[m]> | > (&&) <$> pure @IO False <*> pure undefined |
| 2022-04-03 02:49:28 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@c-001-001-001.client.esciencecenter.eduvpn.nl) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 02:49:29 +0200 | <lambdabot> | error: |
| 2022-04-03 02:49:29 +0200 | <lambdabot> | Pattern syntax in expression context: pure@IO |
| 2022-04-03 02:49:29 +0200 | <lambdabot> | Did you mean to enable TypeApplications? |
| 2022-04-03 02:49:42 +0200 | <monochrom> | liftA2 op foo bar is required to be equiv to foo >>= \f -> bar >>= \b -> pure (op f b). |
| 2022-04-03 02:49:56 +0200 | <abastro[m]> | Oh duh I thought TypeApplications was enabled |
| 2022-04-03 02:49:57 +0200 | <monochrom> | Right there you see how op doesn't matter until it's too late. |
| 2022-04-03 02:50:30 +0200 | <abastro[m]> | > (&&) <$> pure False <*> pure undefined :: IO Bool |
| 2022-04-03 02:50:31 +0200 | <lambdabot> | <IO Bool> |
| 2022-04-03 02:50:43 +0200 | <monochrom> | Unless the monad is like State.Lazy or Tardis. |
| 2022-04-03 02:50:50 +0200 | <abastro[m]> | So it is lazy :> |
| 2022-04-03 02:50:55 +0200 | notzmv | (~zmv@user/notzmv) |
| 2022-04-03 03:09:31 +0200 | img | (~img@user/img) (Quit: ZNC 1.8.2 - https://znc.in) |
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| 2022-04-03 03:18:30 +0200 | neurocyte86141 | (~neurocyte@user/neurocyte) |
| 2022-04-03 03:18:46 +0200 | alMalsamo | (~alMalsamo@gateway/tor-sasl/almalsamo) |
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| 2022-04-03 03:21:25 +0200 | alMalsamo | littlebobeep |
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| 2022-04-03 06:15:47 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 06:15:55 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 06:16:10 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 06:16:17 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 06:16:31 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 06:16:38 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 06:16:52 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 06:17:00 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 06:17:14 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 06:17:22 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 06:17:38 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 06:17:44 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 06:17:58 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 06:18:06 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 06:18:17 +0200 | cdman | (~dcm@27.2.218.12) |
| 2022-04-03 06:18:17 +0200 | cdman | (~dcm@27.2.218.12) (Changing host) |
| 2022-04-03 06:18:17 +0200 | cdman | (~dcm@user/dmc/x-4369397) |
| 2022-04-03 06:18:22 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 06:18:28 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 06:18:43 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 06:18:50 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 06:18:58 +0200 | ChanServ | +o monochrom |
| 2022-04-03 06:19:06 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 06:19:12 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 06:19:22 +0200 | monochrom | +b *!*@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net |
| 2022-04-03 06:31:00 +0200 | jao | (~jao@cpc103048-sgyl39-2-0-cust502.18-2.cable.virginm.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 06:42:37 +0200 | ss- | (~ss-@187.83.249.216.dyn.smithville.net) (Quit: Client closed) |
| 2022-04-03 06:42:59 +0200 | motherfsck | (~motherfsc@user/motherfsck) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 06:43:18 +0200 | jao | (~jao@cpc103048-sgyl39-2-0-cust502.18-2.cable.virginm.net) |
| 2022-04-03 06:49:52 +0200 | ChanServ | +o litharge |
| 2022-04-03 06:49:53 +0200 | litharge | -bo *!*@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net litharge |
| 2022-04-03 06:50:51 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 06:53:21 +0200 | jao | (~jao@cpc103048-sgyl39-2-0-cust502.18-2.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 07:01:00 +0200 | motherfsck | (~motherfsc@user/motherfsck) |
| 2022-04-03 07:04:27 +0200 | deadmarshal_ | (~deadmarsh@95.38.113.202) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 07:07:28 +0200 | zmt00 | (~zmt00@user/zmt00) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 07:10:28 +0200 | mbuf | (~Shakthi@110.225.242.87) |
| 2022-04-03 07:12:54 +0200 | zmt00 | (~zmt00@user/zmt00) |
| 2022-04-03 07:13:38 +0200 | benin | (~benin@183.82.204.110) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 07:15:54 +0200 | chenqisu1 | (~chenqisu1@183.217.200.168) |
| 2022-04-03 07:16:14 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@c-001-001-001.client.esciencecenter.eduvpn.nl) |
| 2022-04-03 07:17:05 +0200 | frost | (~frost@user/frost) |
| 2022-04-03 07:17:43 +0200 | motherfsck | (~motherfsc@user/motherfsck) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 07:18:08 +0200 | motherfsck | (~motherfsc@user/motherfsck) |
| 2022-04-03 07:24:09 +0200 | YoungFrog | (~youngfrog@2a02:a03f:c21b:f900:84e3:4a12:bce1:8082) (Quit: ZNC 1.7.x-git-3-96481995 - https://znc.in) |
| 2022-04-03 07:24:28 +0200 | YoungFrog | (~youngfrog@2a02:a03f:c21b:f900:eb96:d26f:93a3:4c34) |
| 2022-04-03 07:26:14 +0200 | benin | (~benin@183.82.204.110) |
| 2022-04-03 07:28:46 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 07:31:00 +0200 | mvk | (~mvk@2607:fea8:5ce3:8500::3800) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 07:41:19 +0200 | pretty_dumm_guy | (trottel@gateway/vpn/protonvpn/prettydummguy/x-88029655) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 07:42:30 +0200 | pretty_dumm_guy | (trottel@gateway/vpn/protonvpn/prettydummguy/x-88029655) |
| 2022-04-03 07:50:23 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@c-001-001-001.client.esciencecenter.eduvpn.nl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 07:54:56 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@user/wroathe) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 07:57:36 +0200 | acidjnk | (~acidjnk@p200300d0c7049f701951913ce7bf0925.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 2022-04-03 07:59:09 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 08:02:25 +0200 | takuan | (~takuan@178-116-218-225.access.telenet.be) |
| 2022-04-03 08:21:05 +0200 | Graham31415 | (~Graham@user/Graham31415) |
| 2022-04-03 08:30:38 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 08:31:32 +0200 | xkuru | (~xkuru@user/xkuru) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 08:36:28 +0200 | notzmv | (~zmv@user/notzmv) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 08:42:03 +0200 | kmein | (~weechat@user/kmein) (Quit: ciao kakao) |
| 2022-04-03 08:42:45 +0200 | notzmv | (~zmv@user/notzmv) |
| 2022-04-03 08:44:05 +0200 | kmein | (~weechat@user/kmein) |
| 2022-04-03 08:46:44 +0200 | zachel | (~zachel@user/zachel) (Quit: DIsconnected: v7+nano) |
| 2022-04-03 08:48:49 +0200 | zachel | (~zachel@user/zachel) |
| 2022-04-03 08:49:03 +0200 | Graham31415 | (~Graham@user/Graham31415) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 08:50:20 +0200 | Graham31415 | (~Graham@user/Graham31415) |
| 2022-04-03 09:03:55 +0200 | acidjnk | (~acidjnk@p200300d0c7049f701951913ce7bf0925.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 09:26:22 +0200 | eggplantade | (~Eggplanta@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 09:27:16 +0200 | [_] | (~itchyjunk@user/itchyjunk/x-7353470) |
| 2022-04-03 09:30:22 +0200 | [itchyjunk] | (~itchyjunk@user/itchyjunk/x-7353470) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 09:30:26 +0200 | fizbin | (~fizbin@c-73-33-197-160.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 09:32:02 +0200 | gehmehgeh | (~user@user/gehmehgeh) |
| 2022-04-03 09:35:26 +0200 | fizbin | (~fizbin@c-73-33-197-160.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 09:43:31 +0200 | img | (~img@user/img) (Quit: ZNC 1.8.2 - https://znc.in) |
| 2022-04-03 09:45:50 +0200 | _ht | (~quassel@231-169-21-31.ftth.glasoperator.nl) |
| 2022-04-03 09:46:48 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@c-001-001-001.client.esciencecenter.eduvpn.nl) |
| 2022-04-03 09:47:50 +0200 | img | (~img@user/img) |
| 2022-04-03 09:55:22 +0200 | x88x88x | (~x88x88x@149.28.53.172) (Quit: ZNC - https://znc.in) |
| 2022-04-03 09:57:04 +0200 | chenqisu1 | (~chenqisu1@183.217.200.168) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2022-04-03 10:00:51 +0200 | arjun | (~arjun@user/arjun) |
| 2022-04-03 10:03:01 +0200 | bahamas | (~lucian@84.232.140.158) |
| 2022-04-03 10:04:30 +0200 | [_] | (~itchyjunk@user/itchyjunk/x-7353470) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 10:15:30 +0200 | odnes | (~odnes@5-203-146-18.pat.nym.cosmote.net) |
| 2022-04-03 10:18:05 +0200 | motherfsck | (~motherfsc@user/motherfsck) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 10:19:07 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 10:21:14 +0200 | BlackboardN | (~nathan@user/BlackboardN) |
| 2022-04-03 10:23:02 +0200 | MajorBiscuit | (~MajorBisc@2a02:a461:129d:1:6d4c:38a4:18b7:4b48) |
| 2022-04-03 10:27:22 +0200 | eggplantade | (~Eggplanta@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) |
| 2022-04-03 10:28:39 +0200 | yauhsien | (~yauhsien@61-231-37-33.dynamic-ip.hinet.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 10:29:13 +0200 | yauhsien | (~yauhsien@61-231-37-33.dynamic-ip.hinet.net) |
| 2022-04-03 10:31:22 +0200 | arjun | (~arjun@user/arjun) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2022-04-03 10:32:07 +0200 | eggplantade | (~Eggplanta@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 10:33:19 +0200 | motherfsck | (~motherfsc@user/motherfsck) |
| 2022-04-03 10:34:27 +0200 | yauhsien | (~yauhsien@61-231-37-33.dynamic-ip.hinet.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 10:38:17 +0200 | gurkenglas | (~gurkengla@dslb-178-012-018-212.178.012.pools.vodafone-ip.de) |
| 2022-04-03 10:39:33 +0200 | bahamas | (~lucian@84.232.140.158) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 10:45:46 +0200 | yauhsien | (~yauhsien@61-231-37-33.dynamic-ip.hinet.net) |
| 2022-04-03 10:49:14 +0200 | cosimone | (~user@93-47-228-79.ip115.fastwebnet.it) |
| 2022-04-03 10:52:30 +0200 | mikoto-chan | (~mikoto-ch@213.177.151.239) |
| 2022-04-03 10:54:25 +0200 | kaph_ | (~kaph@net-93-67-57-97.cust.vodafonedsl.it) |
| 2022-04-03 10:57:03 +0200 | kaph | (~kaph@net-93-67-57-97.cust.vodafonedsl.it) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 10:58:17 +0200 | kaph__ | (~kaph@151.47.143.243) |
| 2022-04-03 11:00:07 +0200 | wildsebastian | (~wildsebas@2001:470:69fc:105::1:14b1) (Quit: You have been kicked for being idle) |
| 2022-04-03 11:00:45 +0200 | x88x88x | (~x88x88x@2001:19f0:5:39a8:5400:3ff:feb6:73cb) |
| 2022-04-03 11:00:54 +0200 | mbuf | (~Shakthi@110.225.242.87) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2022-04-03 11:01:08 +0200 | kaph_ | (~kaph@net-93-67-57-97.cust.vodafonedsl.it) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 11:01:34 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 11:03:35 +0200 | tzh | (~tzh@c-24-21-73-154.hsd1.or.comcast.net) (Quit: zzz) |
| 2022-04-03 11:03:43 +0200 | deadmarshal_ | (~deadmarsh@95.38.113.202) |
| 2022-04-03 11:06:39 +0200 | MajorBiscuit | (~MajorBisc@2a02:a461:129d:1:6d4c:38a4:18b7:4b48) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 11:09:00 +0200 | CiaoSen | (~Jura@p200300c95735b0002a3a4dfffe84dbd5.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 2022-04-03 11:14:39 +0200 | gehmehgeh | (~user@user/gehmehgeh) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2022-04-03 11:14:47 +0200 | wootehfoot | (~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot) |
| 2022-04-03 11:17:51 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@c-001-001-001.client.esciencecenter.eduvpn.nl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 11:19:03 +0200 | img | (~img@user/img) (Quit: ZNC 1.8.2 - https://znc.in) |
| 2022-04-03 11:20:36 +0200 | BlackboardN | (~nathan@user/BlackboardN) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 11:25:49 +0200 | kaph__ | (~kaph@151.47.143.243) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 11:25:57 +0200 | Sgeo | (~Sgeo@user/sgeo) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 11:27:17 +0200 | kaph__ | (~kaph@net-93-67-57-97.cust.vodafonedsl.it) |
| 2022-04-03 11:28:27 +0200 | img | (~img@user/img) |
| 2022-04-03 11:28:41 +0200 | yauhsien | (~yauhsien@61-231-37-33.dynamic-ip.hinet.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 11:30:00 +0200 | yauhsien | (~yauhsien@61-231-37-33.dynamic-ip.hinet.net) |
| 2022-04-03 11:30:55 +0200 | alp | (~alp@user/alp) |
| 2022-04-03 11:31:10 +0200 | coot | (~coot@213.134.190.95) |
| 2022-04-03 11:34:39 +0200 | yauhsien | (~yauhsien@61-231-37-33.dynamic-ip.hinet.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 11:36:03 +0200 | deadmarshal_ | (~deadmarsh@95.38.113.202) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 11:37:46 +0200 | ss4 | (~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot) |
| 2022-04-03 11:38:50 +0200 | zeenk | (~zeenk@2a02:2f04:a313:d600:8d26:ec9f:3ff6:fc94) |
| 2022-04-03 11:41:11 +0200 | wootehfoot | (~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 11:46:41 +0200 | liz | (~liz@cpc84585-newc17-2-0-cust60.16-2.cable.virginm.net) |
| 2022-04-03 11:48:39 +0200 | kaph__ | (~kaph@net-93-67-57-97.cust.vodafonedsl.it) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 11:52:16 +0200 | wootehfoot | (~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot) |
| 2022-04-03 11:53:47 +0200 | ss4 | (~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 11:53:58 +0200 | kaph | (~kaph@net-93-67-57-97.cust.vodafonedsl.it) |
| 2022-04-03 11:55:25 +0200 | jollygood2 | (~bc8147f2@cerf.good1.com) |
| 2022-04-03 11:57:54 +0200 | kaph | (~kaph@net-93-67-57-97.cust.vodafonedsl.it) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 11:58:32 +0200 | kaph | (~kaph@net-93-67-57-97.cust.vodafonedsl.it) |
| 2022-04-03 12:03:13 +0200 | Natch | (~natch@c-67bae255.014-297-73746f25.bbcust.telenor.se) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 12:06:33 +0200 | abastro | (~abab9579@192.249.26.132) |
| 2022-04-03 12:07:08 +0200 | jakalx | (~jakalx@base.jakalx.net) () |
| 2022-04-03 12:08:36 +0200 | Natch | (~natch@c-67bae255.014-297-73746f25.bbcust.telenor.se) |
| 2022-04-03 12:08:58 +0200 | jakalx | (~jakalx@base.jakalx.net) |
| 2022-04-03 12:12:34 +0200 | CiaoSen | (~Jura@p200300c95735b0002a3a4dfffe84dbd5.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 12:16:10 +0200 | mzan | (~quassel@mail.asterisell.com) |
| 2022-04-03 12:16:37 +0200 | kaph_ | (~kaph@net-93-67-57-97.cust.vodafonedsl.it) |
| 2022-04-03 12:17:29 +0200 | econo | (uid147250@user/econo) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) |
| 2022-04-03 12:17:45 +0200 | abastro | (~abab9579@192.249.26.132) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 12:17:47 +0200 | kaph | (~kaph@net-93-67-57-97.cust.vodafonedsl.it) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 12:17:59 +0200 | abastro | (~abab9579@192.249.26.132) |
| 2022-04-03 12:18:31 +0200 | motherfsck | (~motherfsc@user/motherfsck) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 12:19:23 +0200 | motherfsck | (~motherfsc@user/motherfsck) |
| 2022-04-03 12:24:09 +0200 | MajorBiscuit | (~MajorBisc@2a02:a461:129d:1:6d4c:38a4:18b7:4b48) |
| 2022-04-03 12:25:08 +0200 | kaph_ | (~kaph@net-93-67-57-97.cust.vodafonedsl.it) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 12:38:47 +0200 | MajorBiscuit | (~MajorBisc@2a02:a461:129d:1:6d4c:38a4:18b7:4b48) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 12:39:20 +0200 | <Andrew> | test |
| 2022-04-03 12:43:01 +0200 | Psybur | (~Psybur@2601:5c9:4201:3220:19c2:a1cd:6600:38ba) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 12:43:15 +0200 | toulene | (~toulene@user/toulene) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 12:43:17 +0200 | Psybur | (~Psybur@2600:1003:b108:f292:c2b:a76d:9518:b609) |
| 2022-04-03 12:45:40 +0200 | kaph | (~kaph@net-93-67-57-97.cust.vodafonedsl.it) |
| 2022-04-03 12:54:25 +0200 | frost | (~frost@user/frost) (Quit: Client closed) |
| 2022-04-03 12:54:27 +0200 | alp | (~alp@user/alp) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 12:56:09 +0200 | FragByte | (~christian@user/fragbyte) (Quit: Quit) |
| 2022-04-03 12:58:07 +0200 | FragByte | (~christian@user/fragbyte) |
| 2022-04-03 12:59:02 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 13:03:20 +0200 | toulene | (~toulene@user/toulene) |
| 2022-04-03 13:03:53 +0200 | toulene | (~toulene@user/toulene) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 13:07:00 +0200 | toulene | (~toulene@user/toulene) |
| 2022-04-03 13:08:21 +0200 | chexum | (~quassel@gateway/tor-sasl/chexum) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 13:09:07 +0200 | chexum | (~quassel@gateway/tor-sasl/chexum) |
| 2022-04-03 13:10:50 +0200 | Pickchea | (~private@user/pickchea) |
| 2022-04-03 13:11:13 +0200 | mikoto-chan | (~mikoto-ch@213.177.151.239) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 13:12:46 +0200 | mikoto-chan | (~mikoto-ch@213.177.151.239) |
| 2022-04-03 13:14:43 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@c-001-001-001.client.esciencecenter.eduvpn.nl) |
| 2022-04-03 13:18:13 +0200 | gustik | (~gustik@2a01:c844:240e:4d20:38e8:ab4e:3fd6:2e3a) |
| 2022-04-03 13:21:18 +0200 | zeenk | (~zeenk@2a02:2f04:a313:d600:8d26:ec9f:3ff6:fc94) (Quit: Konversation terminated!) |
| 2022-04-03 13:26:23 +0200 | Vajb | (~Vajb@hag-jnsbng11-58c3a8-176.dhcp.inet.fi) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 13:28:24 +0200 | gehmehgeh | (~user@user/gehmehgeh) |
| 2022-04-03 13:30:05 +0200 | eggplantade | (~Eggplanta@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) |
| 2022-04-03 13:30:59 +0200 | alp | (~alp@user/alp) |
| 2022-04-03 13:32:55 +0200 | Vajb | (~Vajb@85-76-32-121-nat.elisa-mobile.fi) |
| 2022-04-03 13:34:05 +0200 | yauhsien | (~yauhsien@61-231-37-33.dynamic-ip.hinet.net) |
| 2022-04-03 13:34:50 +0200 | eggplantade | (~Eggplanta@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 13:37:24 +0200 | alp | (~alp@user/alp) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 13:38:51 +0200 | bahamas | (~lucian@84.232.140.158) |
| 2022-04-03 13:39:13 +0200 | yauhsien | (~yauhsien@61-231-37-33.dynamic-ip.hinet.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 13:40:15 +0200 | <abastro> | I wish there were `Either e Void -> e` or `Either a a -> a` |
| 2022-04-03 13:40:28 +0200 | <abastro> | That or `ExceptT e m Void -> m e` |
| 2022-04-03 13:40:58 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 13:44:13 +0200 | DNH | (~DNH@2a02:8109:b740:2c4:b89d:8c20:3683:54c9) |
| 2022-04-03 13:45:36 +0200 | abastro | (~abab9579@192.249.26.132) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 13:49:24 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@c-001-001-001.client.esciencecenter.eduvpn.nl) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 13:50:15 +0200 | abastro | (~abab9579@192.249.26.132) |
| 2022-04-03 13:51:00 +0200 | abastro | (~abab9579@192.249.26.132) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 13:51:15 +0200 | abastro | (~abab9579@192.249.26.132) |
| 2022-04-03 13:51:31 +0200 | deadmarshal_ | (~deadmarsh@95.38.113.202) |
| 2022-04-03 13:52:41 +0200 | bahamas | (~lucian@84.232.140.158) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 13:54:22 +0200 | <liz> | writing an `Either a a -> a` wouldn't be too hard |
| 2022-04-03 13:54:43 +0200 | <liz> | `fromHomoEither (Left x) = x`; `fromHomoEither (Right y) = y` |
| 2022-04-03 13:55:47 +0200 | deadmarshal_ | (~deadmarsh@95.38.113.202) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 13:56:59 +0200 | dcoutts | (~duncan@host213-122-143-81.range213-122.btcentralplus.com) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 14:00:11 +0200 | <jackdk> | abastro: `either id absurd`, `either id id` respectively; see also "Fairbairn Threshold" |
| 2022-04-03 14:00:35 +0200 | machinedgod | (~machinedg@24.105.81.50) |
| 2022-04-03 14:03:09 +0200 | stevenxl | (~stevenxl@c-73-72-2-81.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 14:18:51 +0200 | kaph | (~kaph@net-93-67-57-97.cust.vodafonedsl.it) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 14:18:59 +0200 | ss4 | (~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot) |
| 2022-04-03 14:20:14 +0200 | metabulation | (~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot) |
| 2022-04-03 14:20:26 +0200 | wootehfoot | (~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 14:20:44 +0200 | kaph | (~kaph@net-93-67-57-97.cust.vodafonedsl.it) |
| 2022-04-03 14:21:36 +0200 | <abastro> | Oh, so it did not make it because of fairbairn threshold? |
| 2022-04-03 14:22:08 +0200 | <abastro> | Hmm, so what would be the best way to write: |
| 2022-04-03 14:22:25 +0200 | <abastro> | `ExceptT e m Void -> m e` |
| 2022-04-03 14:22:47 +0200 | <abastro> | `fmap (either id absurd) . runExceptT` is quite long to me |
| 2022-04-03 14:24:03 +0200 | ss4 | (~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 14:25:17 +0200 | raehik | (~raehik@cpc95906-rdng25-2-0-cust156.15-3.cable.virginm.net) |
| 2022-04-03 14:31:50 +0200 | Vajb | (~Vajb@85-76-32-121-nat.elisa-mobile.fi) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 14:31:59 +0200 | Vajb | (~Vajb@hag-jnsbng11-58c3a8-176.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 2022-04-03 14:33:17 +0200 | <abastro> | I need to do study but my brain don't want to and resorts to: https://paste.tomsmeding.com/SOth1C3N |
| 2022-04-03 14:33:53 +0200 | frost | (~frost@user/frost) |
| 2022-04-03 14:36:53 +0200 | alp | (~alp@user/alp) |
| 2022-04-03 14:37:48 +0200 | Psybur | (~Psybur@2600:1003:b108:f292:c2b:a76d:9518:b609) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 14:38:29 +0200 | Psybur | (~Psybur@2601:5c9:4201:3220:19c2:a1cd:6600:38ba) |
| 2022-04-03 14:40:39 +0200 | odnes | (~odnes@5-203-146-18.pat.nym.cosmote.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 14:41:01 +0200 | odnes | (~odnes@5-203-146-18.pat.nym.cosmote.net) |
| 2022-04-03 14:44:55 +0200 | littlebobeep | (~alMalsamo@gateway/tor-sasl/almalsamo) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 14:49:07 +0200 | pavonia | (~user@user/siracusa) (Quit: Bye!) |
| 2022-04-03 14:50:43 +0200 | yauhsien | (~yauhsien@61-231-37-33.dynamic-ip.hinet.net) |
| 2022-04-03 14:52:49 +0200 | littlebobeep | (~alMalsamo@gateway/tor-sasl/almalsamo) |
| 2022-04-03 14:55:07 +0200 | ccntrq | (~Thunderbi@dynamic-046-114-142-228.46.114.pool.telefonica.de) |
| 2022-04-03 14:55:16 +0200 | gustik | (~gustik@2a01:c844:240e:4d20:38e8:ab4e:3fd6:2e3a) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2022-04-03 14:59:39 +0200 | ccntrq | (~Thunderbi@dynamic-046-114-142-228.46.114.pool.telefonica.de) (Client Quit) |
| 2022-04-03 15:00:03 +0200 | wyrd | (~wyrd@gateway/tor-sasl/wyrd) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 15:00:18 +0200 | wyrd | (~wyrd@gateway/tor-sasl/wyrd) |
| 2022-04-03 15:00:36 +0200 | alp | (~alp@user/alp) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 15:02:03 +0200 | <kuribas> | I often hear "the types are so complicated in haskell". However I find that more complicated types give rise to easier function definitions. |
| 2022-04-03 15:02:15 +0200 | <kuribas> | Isn't it then just not about pushing complexity into types? |
| 2022-04-03 15:02:28 +0200 | <kuribas> | As in, it's not more complicated, it's just complicated in a different place. |
| 2022-04-03 15:02:47 +0200 | notzmv | (~zmv@user/notzmv) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 15:03:08 +0200 | <kuribas> | And if done well, it means that this complication is just in one place, rather than popping up all over the codebase. |
| 2022-04-03 15:03:09 +0200 | <hpc> | in my experience, people who say that have just never used algebraic types before |
| 2022-04-03 15:03:26 +0200 | <kuribas> | hpc: well, and that :) |
| 2022-04-03 15:03:32 +0200 | <hpc> | or they look at them in haskell and think "this is foreign and unknowable" |
| 2022-04-03 15:03:47 +0200 | <hpc> | but as soon as you show it to them in say, typescript, it's immediately obvious to them :/ |
| 2022-04-03 15:04:20 +0200 | <hpc> | but yeah, a good type is like a good api |
| 2022-04-03 15:04:26 +0200 | <hpc> | all your code invisibly becomes much simpler |
| 2022-04-03 15:04:37 +0200 | <hpc> | well, a good type /is/ a good api |
| 2022-04-03 15:05:26 +0200 | <kuribas> | some things are easier when you don't try to statically proof them correct. |
| 2022-04-03 15:06:15 +0200 | deadmarshal_ | (~deadmarsh@95.38.113.202) |
| 2022-04-03 15:06:26 +0200 | <hpc> | in a turing-complete language you're dealing with the halting problem anyway |
| 2022-04-03 15:06:31 +0200 | <hpc> | so it's about how close you can usefully get |
| 2022-04-03 15:06:33 +0200 | <kuribas> | Even though people erronuously will say, "they are complicated in haskell". |
| 2022-04-03 15:06:55 +0200 | <hpc> | and with things like purity and laziness, it's easy to get a lot closer |
| 2022-04-03 15:07:08 +0200 | <kuribas> | hpc: clojure has purity and laziness. |
| 2022-04-03 15:07:29 +0200 | <kuribas> | hpc: still, I find it nearly impossible to reason about code, without being able to run it in a repl with real examples. |
| 2022-04-03 15:07:35 +0200 | <kuribas> | (in clojure) |
| 2022-04-03 15:09:06 +0200 | <hpc> | that's probably all the other lisp stuff, like macros and dynamic types |
| 2022-04-03 15:10:01 +0200 | <kuribas> | For me it's mostly about using hashmaps for everything. |
| 2022-04-03 15:10:18 +0200 | <kuribas> | It's the same as Objects in python/javascript. |
| 2022-04-03 15:10:44 +0200 | <kuribas> | it's just easier in the sense that you don't see when you break anything. |
| 2022-04-03 15:10:52 +0200 | <kuribas> | Where a typesystem makes it immediately obvious. |
| 2022-04-03 15:13:06 +0200 | liqidmetalman | (~admin@c-98-234-46-210.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 15:14:30 +0200 | <abastro> | There is also this thing that many ppl don't understand abstraction |
| 2022-04-03 15:14:36 +0200 | <abastro> | They usually think in concrete cases |
| 2022-04-03 15:14:59 +0200 | <abastro> | So I found ppl against property-based testing for this reason. |
| 2022-04-03 15:15:21 +0200 | <kuribas> | right, and in clojure/lisp, you just code against concrete cases. |
| 2022-04-03 15:16:05 +0200 | <kuribas> | but to me, it's the opposite of "reasoning about code", hence "functional programming". |
| 2022-04-03 15:16:39 +0200 | <kuribas> | clojure isn't really function programming IMO, not more than doing java or javascript with pure objects. |
| 2022-04-03 15:17:14 +0200 | <kuribas> | The spirit of "functional programming", is to be able to understand code by just looking at it. |
| 2022-04-03 15:18:15 +0200 | BlackboardN | (~nathan@user/BlackboardN) |
| 2022-04-03 15:18:54 +0200 | <nomagno> | The spirit of functional programming is really just recursion. The 'algorithms write themselves' part is sprinkled on top |
| 2022-04-03 15:19:36 +0200 | <kuribas> | not recursion, induction. |
| 2022-04-03 15:21:45 +0200 | n8chan | (~nate@98.45.152.91) |
| 2022-04-03 15:21:45 +0200 | <liz> | i find it hard to judge how "difficult" haskell is to the average programmer because i've approached it from a mathematical background |
| 2022-04-03 15:22:02 +0200 | <kuribas> | liz: did that make it easier, or harder? |
| 2022-04-03 15:22:15 +0200 | <liz> | abstraction is my bread and butter, so i believe it made it easier |
| 2022-04-03 15:23:13 +0200 | <liz> | i specialised in algebra so things like Semigroup and Monoid were pre-existing knowledge, rather than concepts to learn in order to learn haskell |
| 2022-04-03 15:23:38 +0200 | neightchan | (~nate@98.45.152.91) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 15:23:51 +0200 | <liz> | and i think that in general the ability to think in abstract terms made learning haskell easier |
| 2022-04-03 15:23:58 +0200 | <liz> | that said though, i'm still very much a haskell novice! |
| 2022-04-03 15:24:08 +0200 | <hpc> | i went the immersion route - a solid month between semesters to properly change how i thought about programming |
| 2022-04-03 15:24:32 +0200 | <kuribas> | But I cannot imagine a good programmer would find Semigroup or Monoid difficult. |
| 2022-04-03 15:24:42 +0200 | <kuribas> | They are pretty much the easiest abstractions out there. |
| 2022-04-03 15:24:59 +0200 | <liz> | that's true, they're conceptually simple structures |
| 2022-04-03 15:25:04 +0200 | <hpc> | they teach the algebraic properties in elementary school even |
| 2022-04-03 15:25:14 +0200 | <hpc> | 10 year olds can learn monoid |
| 2022-04-03 15:25:16 +0200 | <kuribas> | Frankly, only Monad and Applicative are somewhat complicated, from all haskells base abstractions. |
| 2022-04-03 15:25:21 +0200 | <kuribas> | hpc: yeah |
| 2022-04-03 15:26:19 +0200 | <kuribas> | liz: I find idris to be more math oriented. |
| 2022-04-03 15:27:20 +0200 | <kuribas> | IMO OOP is harder than most of haskells abstractions. |
| 2022-04-03 15:28:12 +0200 | <liz> | i think a key difference between OOP and haskell's abstractions comes from the different ways of thinking within the paradigms |
| 2022-04-03 15:28:22 +0200 | <liz> | how to "align" one's brain to solving a problem, if that makes sense |
| 2022-04-03 15:29:26 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | any hackers in here... |
| 2022-04-03 15:29:30 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | .... |
| 2022-04-03 15:29:38 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | got some questions... |
| 2022-04-03 15:30:25 +0200 | <kuribas> | most of haskell "abstractions" are very concrete. OOP design patterns are mostly fuzzy and leave a lot of room for interpretation. |
| 2022-04-03 15:31:04 +0200 | <hpc> | liqidmetalman: in the classical "i hacked out a microkernel over the weekend" or the modern "i hacked google" meaning? :P |
| 2022-04-03 15:31:21 +0200 | <hpc> | also, don't ask to ask, just ask |
| 2022-04-03 15:32:25 +0200 | <kuribas> | or I did an amazing type system hack. |
| 2022-04-03 15:32:35 +0200 | Alleria | (~textual@user/alleria) |
| 2022-04-03 15:32:49 +0200 | <hpc> | ask in the channel, don't pm people |
| 2022-04-03 15:33:06 +0200 | <hpc> | we prefer open discussion |
| 2022-04-03 15:33:11 +0200 | fizbin | (~fizbin@c-73-33-197-160.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 15:33:22 +0200 | <abastro> | Ppl love fuzzy and room for interpretation things when it looks more cozzy I guess |
| 2022-04-03 15:33:38 +0200 | <abastro> | Like, using Pets, Dogs, and Cat.s in the example |
| 2022-04-03 15:33:38 +0200 | <kuribas> | hpc: unless you don't want the teaching assistant to know? |
| 2022-04-03 15:33:49 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | i was trying to install venom with metasploit via linux but some of the gems wernt downloading... |
| 2022-04-03 15:33:55 +0200 | <hpc> | ah, you're in the wrong channel |
| 2022-04-03 15:34:04 +0200 | <hpc> | see the topic for what we're about |
| 2022-04-03 15:34:07 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | tried "install bundle" still doesnt install... |
| 2022-04-03 15:34:07 +0200 | <abastro> | Very wrong channel |
| 2022-04-03 15:34:39 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | so i cant get help?.. |
| 2022-04-03 15:34:41 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | .. |
| 2022-04-03 15:34:42 +0200 | <hpc> | not here |
| 2022-04-03 15:34:49 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | recommendations... |
| 2022-04-03 15:34:49 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | .. |
| 2022-04-03 15:34:52 +0200 | <hpc> | no clue |
| 2022-04-03 15:34:59 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | #hack has like 5 people in it |
| 2022-04-03 15:35:00 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | .. |
| 2022-04-03 15:35:19 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | been like goin 2 weeks |
| 2022-04-03 15:35:29 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | still cant get the damn thing to work..lol |
| 2022-04-03 15:35:31 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | ... |
| 2022-04-03 15:35:37 +0200 | <geekosaur> | the notion that IRC is inhabited mostly by so-called "hackers" is some 15 years out of date, as I understand it |
| 2022-04-03 15:35:47 +0200 | <liz> | a channel for your specific distro may help, or a ruby channel if you're having issues with gems |
| 2022-04-03 15:37:15 +0200 | <[exa]> | liqidmetalman: there's no channel for metasploit or venom? |
| 2022-04-03 15:37:25 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | no |
| 2022-04-03 15:37:35 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | "venom" is a trojan program |
| 2022-04-03 15:37:38 +0200 | fizbin | (~fizbin@c-73-33-197-160.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 15:37:41 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | like a trojan horse... |
| 2022-04-03 15:37:46 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | drops a payload |
| 2022-04-03 15:37:56 +0200 | MajorBiscuit | (~MajorBisc@2a02:a461:129d:1:6d4c:38a4:18b7:4b48) |
| 2022-04-03 15:38:03 +0200 | <[exa]> | it is a compiler |
| 2022-04-03 15:38:04 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | i can set up the payload ...but can get the main app "venom" to work.. |
| 2022-04-03 15:38:10 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | you know with the lisener... |
| 2022-04-03 15:38:21 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 15:38:30 +0200 | <[exa]> | anyway it's highly offtopic here and you'll probably get 0 help |
| 2022-04-03 15:38:33 +0200 | <[exa]> | try #metasploit |
| 2022-04-03 15:39:50 +0200 | <[exa]> | btw it's useful to prepare a pastebin with what doesn't work, like error messages and so |
| 2022-04-03 15:40:57 +0200 | nate1 | (~nate@98.45.152.91) |
| 2022-04-03 15:42:14 +0200 | fendor | (~fendor@178.115.59.46.wireless.dyn.drei.com) |
| 2022-04-03 15:45:20 +0200 | nate1 | (~nate@98.45.152.91) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 15:46:51 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@c-001-001-001.client.esciencecenter.eduvpn.nl) |
| 2022-04-03 15:54:43 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | k |
| 2022-04-03 15:55:07 +0200 | littlebobeep | (~alMalsamo@gateway/tor-sasl/almalsamo) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 15:55:24 +0200 | littlebobeep | (~alMalsamo@gateway/tor-sasl/almalsamo) |
| 2022-04-03 15:58:06 +0200 | zincy | (~zincy@2a00:23c8:970c:4801:9dee:240c:5988:ddb8) |
| 2022-04-03 16:00:11 +0200 | BlackboardN | (~nathan@user/BlackboardN) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 16:00:39 +0200 | zer0bitz | (~zer0bitz@2001:2003:f750:a200:d90e:8b62:fe9d:3118) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 16:00:54 +0200 | ski | (~ski@remote12.chalmers.se) (Quit: Lost terminal) |
| 2022-04-03 16:03:56 +0200 | zer0bitz | (~zer0bitz@2001:2003:f750:a200:d960:d98a:f624:8ef) |
| 2022-04-03 16:05:49 +0200 | dcoutts | (~duncan@host213-122-143-81.range213-122.btcentralplus.com) |
| 2022-04-03 16:06:14 +0200 | jao | (~jao@cpc103048-sgyl39-2-0-cust502.18-2.cable.virginm.net) |
| 2022-04-03 16:19:03 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@c-001-001-001.client.esciencecenter.eduvpn.nl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 16:20:48 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 16:21:02 +0200 | abastro | (~abab9579@192.249.26.132) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 16:28:35 +0200 | Guest38 | (~Guest38@188.147.98.147.nat.umts.dynamic.t-mobile.pl) |
| 2022-04-03 16:31:35 +0200 | kuribas | (~user@ptr-25vy0i7mej08atpseum.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be) (Quit: ERC (IRC client for Emacs 26.3)) |
| 2022-04-03 16:31:46 +0200 | <abastro[m]> | I wonder how ppl who lack matematical imaginative skills are doing programming work tbh |
| 2022-04-03 16:32:14 +0200 | <abastro[m]> | Like, doesn't it mean SW boom is going too much |
| 2022-04-03 16:34:54 +0200 | <[exa]> | not sure if actual math-specific imagination skills help much with programming |
| 2022-04-03 16:35:52 +0200 | <[exa]> | toddler-like "moving stuff very carefully around to the other heap" and "virtual rubber duck" is on top of my list tbh :D |
| 2022-04-03 16:39:45 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | metasploit is the client... |
| 2022-04-03 16:40:07 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | im learning but.. still cant get it to install because of some dependancy issues... |
| 2022-04-03 16:40:11 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | any thoughs... |
| 2022-04-03 16:40:13 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | .. |
| 2022-04-03 16:40:21 +0200 | <liqidmetalman> | *thoughts.. |
| 2022-04-03 16:40:38 +0200 | AdityaAlok[m] | (~mradityaa@2001:470:69fc:105::1:ee36) |
| 2022-04-03 16:40:44 +0200 | jushur | (~human@user/jushur) |
| 2022-04-03 16:41:03 +0200 | mc47 | (~mc47@xmonad/TheMC47) |
| 2022-04-03 16:41:12 +0200 | <[exa]> | liqidmetalman: as posted above, find actual community of people who use metasploit and show them whatever error message you have; probability of someone knowing stuff about whatever random metasploit extension is negligible |
| 2022-04-03 16:41:31 +0200 | <[exa]> | *someone here |
| 2022-04-03 16:42:38 +0200 | notzmv | (~zmv@user/notzmv) |
| 2022-04-03 16:43:36 +0200 | <[exa]> | also it looks like they're a bit more active on slack than on the IRC |
| 2022-04-03 16:43:41 +0200 | <abastro[m]> | [exa]: Well does that help haskell programming |
| 2022-04-03 16:43:58 +0200 | DNH | (~DNH@2a02:8109:b740:2c4:b89d:8c20:3683:54c9) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
| 2022-04-03 16:44:08 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@206-55-188-8.fttp.usinternet.com) |
| 2022-04-03 16:44:08 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@206-55-188-8.fttp.usinternet.com) (Changing host) |
| 2022-04-03 16:44:08 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@user/wroathe) |
| 2022-04-03 16:44:11 +0200 | <[exa]> | abastro[m]: yeah, folding my foldy structures :D |
| 2022-04-03 16:44:29 +0200 | <[exa]> | putting stuff in boxes |
| 2022-04-03 16:44:53 +0200 | <[exa]> | checking if stuff fits in a weirdly shaped box |
| 2022-04-03 16:45:34 +0200 | <liz> | sounds like those skills would be useful in a packing facility too :P |
| 2022-04-03 16:46:00 +0200 | <[exa]> | oh yes, all these packages |
| 2022-04-03 16:46:12 +0200 | <[exa]> | :D |
| 2022-04-03 16:49:09 +0200 | Guest38 | (~Guest38@188.147.98.147.nat.umts.dynamic.t-mobile.pl) (Quit: Client closed) |
| 2022-04-03 16:50:21 +0200 | xkuru | (~xkuru@user/xkuru) |
| 2022-04-03 16:51:59 +0200 | cyphase | (~cyphase@user/cyphase) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 16:53:04 +0200 | <abastro[m]> | ~~Packaging, sounds like geometric skills to me~~ |
| 2022-04-03 16:53:21 +0200 | <abastro[m]> | Hmm don't you apply equational reasoning |
| 2022-04-03 16:53:57 +0200 | gehmehgeh | (~user@user/gehmehgeh) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2022-04-03 16:54:03 +0200 | yauhsien | (~yauhsien@61-231-37-33.dynamic-ip.hinet.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 16:55:27 +0200 | jollygood2 | (~bc8147f2@cerf.good1.com) (Quit: CGI:IRC (Session timeout)) |
| 2022-04-03 16:56:30 +0200 | <AdityaAlok[m]> | Hello! everyone. (I'm new to haskell as well as functional programming) I wanted to ask how `currying` is implemented for position dependent arguments. For eg. How does this work? How haskell knowns which argument is for which side..?... (full message at https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/libera.chat/d174dd238ef62939d268cd5673890b37aba0…) |
| 2022-04-03 16:56:43 +0200 | cyphase | (~cyphase@user/cyphase) |
| 2022-04-03 16:57:06 +0200 | yauhsien | (~yauhsien@61-231-37-33.dynamic-ip.hinet.net) |
| 2022-04-03 16:58:52 +0200 | <abastro[m]> | Hm wdym by position dependent argument exactly in this example? |
| 2022-04-03 16:59:02 +0200 | <[exa]> | AdityaAlok[m]: if you mean the operator "section" shortcuts, the symmetric variants are (< 8) and (8 <) |
| 2022-04-03 16:59:07 +0200 | <[exa]> | ie you can choose |
| 2022-04-03 16:59:34 +0200 | <[exa]> | finally, your function is `id` :] |
| 2022-04-03 16:59:37 +0200 | Pickchea | (~private@user/pickchea) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2022-04-03 16:59:50 +0200 | <[exa]> | > id (<10) 5 |
| 2022-04-03 16:59:52 +0200 | <lambdabot> | True |
| 2022-04-03 16:59:58 +0200 | <[exa]> | > (<10) 5 |
| 2022-04-03 17:00:00 +0200 | <lambdabot> | True |
| 2022-04-03 17:00:03 +0200 | <[exa]> | > (<10) 15 |
| 2022-04-03 17:00:06 +0200 | <lambdabot> | False |
| 2022-04-03 17:00:15 +0200 | <[exa]> | > (10<) 15 |
| 2022-04-03 17:00:17 +0200 | <abastro[m]> | > ($) (<10) 5 |
| 2022-04-03 17:00:17 +0200 | <lambdabot> | True |
| 2022-04-03 17:00:19 +0200 | <lambdabot> | True |
| 2022-04-03 17:00:25 +0200 | <abastro[m]> | Closer analogue |
| 2022-04-03 17:02:15 +0200 | yauhsien | (~yauhsien@61-231-37-33.dynamic-ip.hinet.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 17:02:26 +0200 | liqidmetalman | (~admin@c-98-234-46-210.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) () |
| 2022-04-03 17:03:53 +0200 | gehmehgeh | (~user@user/gehmehgeh) |
| 2022-04-03 17:04:38 +0200 | frost | (~frost@user/frost) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 17:05:50 +0200 | yauhsien | (~yauhsien@61-231-37-33.dynamic-ip.hinet.net) |
| 2022-04-03 17:14:01 +0200 | califax | (~califax@user/califx) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 17:15:03 +0200 | califax | (~califax@user/califx) |
| 2022-04-03 17:17:15 +0200 | FinnElija | (~finn_elij@user/finn-elija/x-0085643) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 17:18:34 +0200 | FinnElija | (~finn_elij@user/finn-elija/x-0085643) |
| 2022-04-03 17:19:59 +0200 | <dminuoso> | AdityaAlok[m]: It's quite simple: The semantics are baked into the haskell report https://www.haskell.org/onlinereport/haskell2010/haskellch3.html#x8-300003.5 |
| 2022-04-03 17:20:06 +0200 | <dminuoso> | Translation: The following identities hold: |
| 2022-04-03 17:20:12 +0200 | <dminuoso> | (op e) = \ x -> x op e |
| 2022-04-03 17:20:19 +0200 | <dminuoso> | (e op) = \ x -> e op x |
| 2022-04-03 17:23:24 +0200 | Psybur | (~Psybur@2601:5c9:4201:3220:19c2:a1cd:6600:38ba) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 17:26:36 +0200 | Psybur | (~Psybur@2600:1003:b12f:917d:51b:ed39:8828:ea95) |
| 2022-04-03 17:37:19 +0200 | Midjak | (~Midjak@82.66.147.146) |
| 2022-04-03 17:42:36 +0200 | Psybur | (~Psybur@2600:1003:b12f:917d:51b:ed39:8828:ea95) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 17:47:15 +0200 | eggplantade | (~Eggplanta@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) |
| 2022-04-03 17:48:12 +0200 | bahamas | (~lucian@84.232.140.158) |
| 2022-04-03 17:50:44 +0200 | metabulation | (~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2022-04-03 17:56:58 +0200 | shapr | (~user@pool-173-73-44-186.washdc.fios.verizon.net) |
| 2022-04-03 18:01:20 +0200 | Psybur | (~Psybur@c-76-123-45-25.hsd1.va.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 18:01:59 +0200 | raehik | (~raehik@cpc95906-rdng25-2-0-cust156.15-3.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 18:03:16 +0200 | gehmehgeh | (~user@user/gehmehgeh) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2022-04-03 18:05:18 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@c-001-001-001.client.esciencecenter.eduvpn.nl) |
| 2022-04-03 18:09:53 +0200 | machinedgod | (~machinedg@24.105.81.50) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 18:09:53 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@c-001-001-001.client.esciencecenter.eduvpn.nl) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 18:10:42 +0200 | BlackboardN | (~nathan@user/BlackboardN) |
| 2022-04-03 18:17:18 +0200 | Psybur | (~Psybur@c-76-123-45-25.hsd1.va.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 18:18:47 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 18:19:17 +0200 | MajorBiscuit | (~MajorBisc@2a02:a461:129d:1:6d4c:38a4:18b7:4b48) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 18:20:28 +0200 | stevenxl | (~stevenxl@c-73-72-2-81.hsd1.il.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 18:23:09 +0200 | MajorBiscuit | (~MajorBisc@86-88-79-148.fixed.kpn.net) |
| 2022-04-03 18:23:29 +0200 | spacenautx | (~spacenaut@user/spacenautx) |
| 2022-04-03 18:25:40 +0200 | alp | (~alp@user/alp) |
| 2022-04-03 18:27:22 +0200 | <shapr> | I suddenly wish for hoogle.haskell.org to return number of total uses for a thing, and number of uses in the past year. |
| 2022-04-03 18:27:47 +0200 | <shapr> | I searched for URL and many things are returned, but I don't know if there's a *popular* URL type |
| 2022-04-03 18:29:12 +0200 | <liz> | hackage states the number of downloads a package has, if that helps |
| 2022-04-03 18:29:39 +0200 | <shapr> | good point, but I think I want "packages uploaded in the last year that use this thing" |
| 2022-04-03 18:30:36 +0200 | jao | (~jao@cpc103048-sgyl39-2-0-cust502.18-2.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 18:33:43 +0200 | <shapr> | liz: I guess number of downloads in the past year would work too |
| 2022-04-03 18:35:17 +0200 | <abastro[m]> | Oh, Number of uses for a specific functions? |
| 2022-04-03 18:35:18 +0200 | <abastro[m]> | That would be wonderful |
| 2022-04-03 18:36:24 +0200 | <liz> | there would be a lot of interesting metrics to have on hoogle/hackage |
| 2022-04-03 18:36:35 +0200 | <liz> | occurrences of functions in packages would be neat |
| 2022-04-03 18:37:00 +0200 | <shapr> | aha, rust's lib.rs has this feature: https://lib.rs/crates/serde |
| 2022-04-03 18:37:12 +0200 | <shapr> | let's copy that like ghcup copied rustup! |
| 2022-04-03 18:37:13 +0200 | DNH | (~DNH@2a02:8109:b740:2c4:b89d:8c20:3683:54c9) |
| 2022-04-03 18:38:15 +0200 | wyrd | (~wyrd@gateway/tor-sasl/wyrd) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 18:40:25 +0200 | wyrd | (~wyrd@gateway/tor-sasl/wyrd) |
| 2022-04-03 18:41:07 +0200 | <abastro[m]> | TIL ghcup copied rustup |
| 2022-04-03 18:41:08 +0200 | <abastro[m]> | I thought they were independently developed and somehow got the same name |
| 2022-04-03 18:41:58 +0200 | <shapr> | oh hey, hoogle DOES have this feature! |
| 2022-04-03 18:42:44 +0200 | <shapr> | when I search https://hoogle.haskell.org/?hoogle=url&scope=set%3Astackage the second result is the package "url" and there's a "Uses" link on the right |
| 2022-04-03 18:43:22 +0200 | acidjnk | (~acidjnk@p200300d0c7049f70e9fe474f3be10533.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 2022-04-03 18:43:32 +0200 | <Rembane> | That's really cool |
| 2022-04-03 18:43:50 +0200 | <liz> | does the "up" in ghcup stand for anything? i always read it as G-H-Cup |
| 2022-04-03 18:44:32 +0200 | <shapr> | I assumed it was "update" for both ghcup and rustup, but I never thought about it? |
| 2022-04-03 18:44:54 +0200 | <shapr> | check it out! when I click the "Uses" link I get reverse dependencies! https://packdeps.haskellers.com/reverse/url |
| 2022-04-03 18:45:07 +0200 | <liz> | oh wow that's cool :o |
| 2022-04-03 18:45:07 +0200 | <Rembane> | I read it as the up in `ip link eno1 up` |
| 2022-04-03 18:47:15 +0200 | vysn | (~vysn@user/vysn) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 18:48:55 +0200 | econo | (uid147250@user/econo) |
| 2022-04-03 18:50:54 +0200 | stevenxl | (~stevenxl@c-73-72-2-81.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 18:53:10 +0200 | <monochrom> | I think of "suit up" and "level up". |
| 2022-04-03 18:54:42 +0200 | machinedgod | (~machinedg@24.105.81.50) |
| 2022-04-03 18:55:56 +0200 | stevenxl | (~stevenxl@c-73-72-2-81.hsd1.il.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 18:57:14 +0200 | <Hecate> | shapr: oh yeah that's a redirect to packdeps :) |
| 2022-04-03 18:57:24 +0200 | simendsjo | (~user@84.211.91.241) |
| 2022-04-03 18:57:29 +0200 | <shapr> | yah, it's cool! I wish I knew about this before. |
| 2022-04-03 18:57:50 +0200 | <shapr> | I also wish I had "uses in the last year" and that this link showed up for everything, not just packages |
| 2022-04-03 18:57:56 +0200 | <shapr> | salut Hecate, ca va? |
| 2022-04-03 19:01:00 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 19:01:05 +0200 | eggplantade | (~Eggplanta@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 19:01:54 +0200 | zebrag | (~chris@user/zebrag) |
| 2022-04-03 19:02:00 +0200 | lbseale | (~ep1ctetus@user/ep1ctetus) |
| 2022-04-03 19:03:02 +0200 | <Hecate> | shapr: ça va. :) |
| 2022-04-03 19:03:09 +0200 | <shapr> | :-) |
| 2022-04-03 19:03:28 +0200 | <Hecate> | I'm having some trouble finishing the last couple issues needed for a Flora V1 |
| 2022-04-03 19:04:27 +0200 | <shapr> | What are those issues? |
| 2022-04-03 19:04:29 +0200 | monochrom | -o monochrom |
| 2022-04-03 19:05:10 +0200 | <Hecate> | shapr: https://github.com/flora-pm/flora-server/milestone/1 |
| 2022-04-03 19:05:32 +0200 | shapr | clones |
| 2022-04-03 19:05:36 +0200 | eggplantade | (~Eggplanta@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) |
| 2022-04-03 19:06:18 +0200 | shapr | builds |
| 2022-04-03 19:06:52 +0200 | <Hecate> | shapr: the worst one I'd say, is this one https://github.com/flora-pm/flora-server/issues/78 |
| 2022-04-03 19:08:19 +0200 | cosimone | (~user@93-47-228-79.ip115.fastwebnet.it) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 19:09:03 +0200 | stevenxl | (~stevenxl@c-73-72-2-81.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 19:10:27 +0200 | tzh | (~tzh@c-24-21-73-154.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 19:10:29 +0200 | Psybur | (~Psybur@c-76-123-45-25.hsd1.va.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 19:11:00 +0200 | <shapr> | whoa, datalog? |
| 2022-04-03 19:12:37 +0200 | coot | (~coot@213.134.190.95) (Quit: coot) |
| 2022-04-03 19:13:00 +0200 | <lechner> | Hi, what's a good way to understand, please, why Nix is so popular with some haskellers? Is it reproducibility? |
| 2022-04-03 19:13:15 +0200 | coot | (~coot@213.134.190.95) |
| 2022-04-03 19:13:40 +0200 | stevenxl | (~stevenxl@c-73-72-2-81.hsd1.il.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 19:14:12 +0200 | <hpc> | nix is also a pure functional language |
| 2022-04-03 19:14:29 +0200 | <hpc> | and someone went through the effort of making packaging haskell nix packages a lot easier |
| 2022-04-03 19:14:59 +0200 | <hpc> | and it's just interesting |
| 2022-04-03 19:15:02 +0200 | <shapr> | nix being pure means you can cache the compiled packages and then download them instead of rebuilding them locally. |
| 2022-04-03 19:15:03 +0200 | <Hecate> | shapr: ouais, j'utilise ça pour normaliser les catégories |
| 2022-04-03 19:15:10 +0200 | <shapr> | c'est choutte |
| 2022-04-03 19:15:46 +0200 | <Hecate> | yup' |
| 2022-04-03 19:15:50 +0200 | <Hecate> | c'est très chouette |
| 2022-04-03 19:15:58 +0200 | <shapr> | Is there a #haskell.fr ? |
| 2022-04-03 19:16:09 +0200 | <shapr> | huh, yes but it's dead |
| 2022-04-03 19:16:12 +0200 | shapr | shrugs |
| 2022-04-03 19:16:23 +0200 | <Hecate> | shapr: #haskell-fr actually |
| 2022-04-03 19:16:46 +0200 | <exarkun> | sometimes the cache even has stuff you wanted |
| 2022-04-03 19:17:49 +0200 | <Hecate> | exarkun: no way |
| 2022-04-03 19:18:54 +0200 | <lechner> | does nix in haskell refer to the whole nixos, or just the package manager? |
| 2022-04-03 19:19:32 +0200 | <Hecate> | lechner: just the package manager and the language |
| 2022-04-03 19:19:39 +0200 | cosimone | (~user@93-47-228-79.ip115.fastwebnet.it) |
| 2022-04-03 19:19:51 +0200 | <Hecate> | nix is popular amongst Haskellers because many here think that it is the redemption and salvation of programmers |
| 2022-04-03 19:20:00 +0200 | <lechner> | so nix is cabal for the non-haskell pieces |
| 2022-04-03 19:20:13 +0200 | <lechner> | ? |
| 2022-04-03 19:20:19 +0200 | <lechner> | that was a question |
| 2022-04-03 19:20:22 +0200 | <Hecate> | oh nix can even be for your haskell pieces |
| 2022-04-03 19:20:28 +0200 | <shapr> | lechner: I think that's a good description. |
| 2022-04-03 19:20:39 +0200 | <Hecate> | but that's another layer of complexity, and another culture |
| 2022-04-03 19:21:19 +0200 | <Hecate> | shapr: if you want to toy with Flora you're more than welcome to ask questions :) Just send them in PM so that I don't miss them in the channel |
| 2022-04-03 19:21:31 +0200 | <shapr> | lechner: one thing I like about nix is that I can specify all the dependencies for whatever I'm making, and they'll all be in scope when I switch to that project's context |
| 2022-04-03 19:21:40 +0200 | <shapr> | Hecate: or perhaps #haskell-in-depth ? |
| 2022-04-03 19:21:45 +0200 | <lechner> | how do you switch? |
| 2022-04-03 19:22:09 +0200 | <lechner> | or, what's a context? |
| 2022-04-03 19:22:09 +0200 | <shapr> | lechner: I use direnv so all the pieces are in scope when I change into that directory. |
| 2022-04-03 19:22:10 +0200 | <Hecate> | shapr: damn I didn't about this channel :D |
| 2022-04-03 19:22:15 +0200 | bitdex | (~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 19:22:40 +0200 | <shapr> | lechner: for example, my project https://github.com/shapr/takedouble does that |
| 2022-04-03 19:23:15 +0200 | <shapr> | lechner: the two popular ways I see nix used is "nix as package manager on top of other operating system" and "nix as operating system" |
| 2022-04-03 19:23:34 +0200 | <shapr> | if you have nix as pkg manager, you can do most of the same things |
| 2022-04-03 19:23:50 +0200 | <lechner> | How do I bring Nix's greatness to Debian? |
| 2022-04-03 19:24:02 +0200 | <shapr> | you can install nix-as-package-manager |
| 2022-04-03 19:24:40 +0200 | <lechner> | but the nix you run is completely sandboxed? |
| 2022-04-03 19:24:55 +0200 | <shapr> | mostly sandboxed, I have some things in global scope |
| 2022-04-03 19:25:07 +0200 | <shapr> | like zsh, firefox, emacs |
| 2022-04-03 19:25:26 +0200 | <geekosaur> | and even global scope isn't so global if you conditionalize the environment variable setup as I did |
| 2022-04-03 19:25:46 +0200 | bitdex | (~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) |
| 2022-04-03 19:25:54 +0200 | <lechner> | if a personal question is permitted, what is our base systom, please? |
| 2022-04-03 19:25:58 +0200 | <lechner> | your |
| 2022-04-03 19:26:17 +0200 | <shapr> | I'm using NixOS directly on my laptop, but I used nix on mac at my last job. |
| 2022-04-03 19:26:27 +0200 | stevenxl | (~stevenxl@c-73-72-2-81.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 19:26:34 +0200 | <geekosaur> | I've used Nix with Ubuntu in the past |
| 2022-04-03 19:26:57 +0200 | <lechner> | shapr: and NixOS has everything you need? |
| 2022-04-03 19:27:09 +0200 | <shapr> | lechner: for some value of everything, yes |
| 2022-04-03 19:27:17 +0200 | <lechner> | geekosaur: I'll need your advice in a minute! |
| 2022-04-03 19:27:34 +0200 | <geekosaur> | not using it currently but still have the setupif I do decide to reinstall it |
| 2022-04-03 19:27:48 +0200 | <shapr> | that is, some things are not yet packaged for nix/nixos, and it can be a pain to hammer a new package into the hermetically sealed viewpoint of nix |
| 2022-04-03 19:27:51 +0200 | mc47 | (~mc47@xmonad/TheMC47) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 19:28:05 +0200 | <lechner> | why sealed? |
| 2022-04-03 19:28:20 +0200 | <geekosaur> | one thing I did not like about Nix was duplication: not only do you have to gc regularly to avoid Nix installing multiple copues of things, but having it duplicate parts of the OS is also annoying |
| 2022-04-03 19:28:22 +0200 | <shapr> | you can't know the exact dependencies otherwise |
| 2022-04-03 19:28:42 +0200 | <shapr> | yeah, that duplication can use lots of disk space |
| 2022-04-03 19:28:46 +0200 | <exarkun> | geekosaur: There are simple toggles you can turn on to run GC automatically. |
| 2022-04-03 19:28:51 +0200 | <geekosaur> | but it goes along with the "sealed" thing |
| 2022-04-03 19:29:00 +0200 | <lechner> | too tight? |
| 2022-04-03 19:29:06 +0200 | <shapr> | ? |
| 2022-04-03 19:29:20 +0200 | <exarkun> | The duplication is not, of course *actual* duplication. It's more like almost-duplication. |
| 2022-04-03 19:29:21 +0200 | <lechner> | one upgrade triggers too many rebuilds? |
| 2022-04-03 19:29:46 +0200 | <exarkun> | On Debian, if you upgrade glibc-locale then it just switches out from underneath all the rest of the software on your system |
| 2022-04-03 19:30:05 +0200 | <exarkun> | You still have version X.Y.Z of some random Foo package, but it's not actually the same software anymore because now it's using a different from of one of its dependencies |
| 2022-04-03 19:30:11 +0200 | <exarkun> | On NixOS, this doesn't happen |
| 2022-04-03 19:30:20 +0200 | <lechner> | due the way NixOS works, they do not distribute binaries, right? And never will? |
| 2022-04-03 19:30:32 +0200 | <geekosaur> | there is cachix |
| 2022-04-03 19:30:36 +0200 | <exarkun> | If you get a new version of a dependency, you get a new version of everything that depends on it (and you can keep or toss the old version with the previous version of the dependency, as you prefer). |
| 2022-04-03 19:30:45 +0200 | <exarkun> | NixOS does distribute binaries |
| 2022-04-03 19:30:53 +0200 | <exarkun> | Terabytes and terabytes of binaries |
| 2022-04-03 19:31:22 +0200 | <lechner> | are they permutations? |
| 2022-04-03 19:31:41 +0200 | <exarkun> | If you're a regular computer user instead of a programmer, chances are you will never do a local build of anything when using NixOS |
| 2022-04-03 19:31:49 +0200 | <exarkun> | (Chances are if you are a regular computer user you are not using NixOS, of course) |
| 2022-04-03 19:31:53 +0200 | <shapr> | :-D |
| 2022-04-03 19:31:55 +0200 | mc47 | (~mc47@xmonad/TheMC47) |
| 2022-04-03 19:32:27 +0200 | <exarkun> | lechner: NixOS is developed in a repo named "nixpkgs". A revision of nixpkgs is basically a version of the whole first-party package tree and the OS definition. |
| 2022-04-03 19:32:43 +0200 | Psybur | (~Psybur@c-76-123-45-25.hsd1.va.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 19:32:49 +0200 | <lechner> | yeah, i have actually contributed to it |
| 2022-04-03 19:32:54 +0200 | <exarkun> | lechner: There are certain branches in the development workflow for which binaries are built for every revision |
| 2022-04-03 19:32:59 +0200 | kaph | (~kaph@net-93-67-57-97.cust.vodafonedsl.it) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 19:33:04 +0200 | <exarkun> | lechner: So if you install one of those revisions, all of the binaries are there. |
| 2022-04-03 19:33:15 +0200 | Psybur | (~Psybur@2600:1003:b12f:917d:c456:4602:f034:984a) |
| 2022-04-03 19:33:22 +0200 | <exarkun> | If you pick a different branch that's not part of that system, you get to build a ton of stuff |
| 2022-04-03 19:33:23 +0200 | <lechner> | i see |
| 2022-04-03 19:33:34 +0200 | <exarkun> | Or if you're packaging your own software that's not part of nixpkgs, you get to build that stuff |
| 2022-04-03 19:33:43 +0200 | <exarkun> | Cachix is pretty nice and makes it easy for you to have a binary cache of your own stuff |
| 2022-04-03 19:33:52 +0200 | <lechner> | it's like a completely declarative Gentoo |
| 2022-04-03 19:33:55 +0200 | <shapr> | yes |
| 2022-04-03 19:33:55 +0200 | littlebobeep | (~alMalsamo@gateway/tor-sasl/almalsamo) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 19:34:14 +0200 | zeenk | (~zeenk@2a02:2f04:a313:d600:8d26:ec9f:3ff6:fc94) |
| 2022-04-03 19:34:22 +0200 | <shapr> | I'd say most of the pain of nixos comes from everyday linux software taking a thoroughly non-declarative approach |
| 2022-04-03 19:34:43 +0200 | <exarkun> | yea, there's a /massive/ mismatch between the way nixos works and the way most people are used a linux working |
| 2022-04-03 19:35:03 +0200 | <exarkun> | the mismatch can create a little friction or a lot of friction, just depends |
| 2022-04-03 19:35:27 +0200 | [itchyjunk] | (~itchyjunk@user/itchyjunk/x-7353470) |
| 2022-04-03 19:37:01 +0200 | fizbin | (~fizbin@c-73-33-197-160.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 19:37:12 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@user/wroathe) (Quit: Lost terminal) |
| 2022-04-03 19:37:20 +0200 | [itchyjunk] | (~itchyjunk@user/itchyjunk/x-7353470) (Max SendQ exceeded) |
| 2022-04-03 19:37:28 +0200 | <shapr> | back to my question of an hour ago, is there a suggested URL type on hackage? |
| 2022-04-03 19:37:37 +0200 | <exarkun> | Some other pain of nixos comes from the nix language and toolchain being ... less than fully realized with respect to certain well-known desirable user affordances |
| 2022-04-03 19:37:46 +0200 | <shapr> | exarkun: ooh, I wanna hear you expand on that |
| 2022-04-03 19:37:56 +0200 | <lechner> | what's that is plain English, please? |
| 2022-04-03 19:38:08 +0200 | <exarkun> | eehh |
| 2022-04-03 19:38:19 +0200 | <shapr> | My biggest challenge is that I have never found a single document defining all the attributes and what they do. |
| 2022-04-03 19:38:28 +0200 | <hpc> | lechner: it's very hard to use :P |
| 2022-04-03 19:38:31 +0200 | crazazy | (~user@130.89.171.62) |
| 2022-04-03 19:38:33 +0200 | mon_aaraj | (~MonAaraj@user/mon-aaraj/x-4416475) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 19:38:48 +0200 | <lechner> | in Debian, we have what we call the "vendoring problem". it's a massive infrastructure mismatch between language-specific package managers and debian's traditional archive. debian must solve it in order to stay relevant |
| 2022-04-03 19:38:50 +0200 | <exarkun> | ty hpc |
| 2022-04-03 19:39:37 +0200 | <shapr> | I consider nix the language agnostic package manager, and once you get over the starting cost, it's really good at that. |
| 2022-04-03 19:39:41 +0200 | __monty__ | (~toonn@user/toonn) |
| 2022-04-03 19:39:41 +0200 | <exarkun> | For example one of the most common error messages I get from Nix is "error: value is a string while a set was expected" |
| 2022-04-03 19:39:43 +0200 | <shapr> | starting cost is high though |
| 2022-04-03 19:39:50 +0200 | jakalx | (~jakalx@base.jakalx.net) (Error from remote client) |
| 2022-04-03 19:39:57 +0200 | <exarkun> | (and various predictable variations) |
| 2022-04-03 19:40:06 +0200 | mon_aaraj | (~MonAaraj@user/mon-aaraj/x-4416475) |
| 2022-04-03 19:40:18 +0200 | <exarkun> | Ultimately this is caused by very simple, reasonable programming mistakes |
| 2022-04-03 19:41:04 +0200 | <exarkun> | Unfortunately you get very little extra help in finding the mistake |
| 2022-04-03 19:41:45 +0200 | fizbin | (~fizbin@c-73-33-197-160.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 19:41:56 +0200 | <exarkun> | shapr: I agree documentation is another big weakness. |
| 2022-04-03 19:41:57 +0200 | jakalx | (~jakalx@base.jakalx.net) |
| 2022-04-03 19:43:27 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@206-55-188-8.fttp.usinternet.com) |
| 2022-04-03 19:43:28 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@206-55-188-8.fttp.usinternet.com) (Changing host) |
| 2022-04-03 19:43:28 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@user/wroathe) |
| 2022-04-03 19:44:22 +0200 | [itchyjunk] | (~itchyjunk@user/itchyjunk/x-7353470) |
| 2022-04-03 19:44:23 +0200 | bahamas | (~lucian@84.232.140.158) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 19:45:24 +0200 | <shapr> | what's the suggested SHA1 type at the moment? |
| 2022-04-03 19:46:11 +0200 | <shapr> | I'll try cryptonite |
| 2022-04-03 19:46:28 +0200 | <maerwald> | uh-oh |
| 2022-04-03 19:46:29 +0200 | MajorBiscuit | (~MajorBisc@86-88-79-148.fixed.kpn.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 19:46:42 +0200 | <exarkun> | did I hear some people poo-pooing cryptonite recently |
| 2022-04-03 19:47:13 +0200 | <exarkun> | details are not coming to me |
| 2022-04-03 19:48:00 +0200 | <geekosaur> | various people distrust it because it does its own crypto and hasn't been validated |
| 2022-04-03 19:48:03 +0200 | <shapr> | maerwald: what would you suggest instead? |
| 2022-04-03 19:48:52 +0200 | <maerwald> | shapr: https://github.com/haskell-crypto/cryptonite/issues/330 |
| 2022-04-03 19:49:01 +0200 | <maerwald> | shapr: I use something else, let me check |
| 2022-04-03 19:49:25 +0200 | jgeerds | (~jgeerds@d5364b87.access.ecotel.net) |
| 2022-04-03 19:49:25 +0200 | <shapr> | ouch |
| 2022-04-03 19:49:36 +0200 | <maerwald> | https://hackage.haskell.org/package/cryptohash-sha1 |
| 2022-04-03 19:49:40 +0200 | bahamas | (~lucian@84.232.140.158) |
| 2022-04-03 19:49:41 +0200 | <shapr> | ok, I'll use that, thanks |
| 2022-04-03 19:51:22 +0200 | <exarkun> | ouch indeed :/ |
| 2022-04-03 19:52:34 +0200 | lbseale | (~ep1ctetus@user/ep1ctetus) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 19:52:46 +0200 | <maerwald> | was also discussed here https://mail.haskell.org/pipermail/libraries/2020-August/030670.html with some... ehm, "strong" replies |
| 2022-04-03 19:54:12 +0200 | bahamas | (~lucian@84.232.140.158) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 19:55:10 +0200 | bahamas | (~lucian@84.232.140.158) |
| 2022-04-03 19:58:28 +0200 | gehmehgeh | (~user@user/gehmehgeh) |
| 2022-04-03 19:58:57 +0200 | kaph | (~kaph@151.47.165.211) |
| 2022-04-03 19:59:37 +0200 | spacenautx | (~spacenaut@user/spacenautx) (Quit: WeeChat 3.4.1) |
| 2022-04-03 19:59:59 +0200 | spacenautx | (~spacenaut@user/spacenautx) |
| 2022-04-03 20:00:03 +0200 | bahamas | (~lucian@84.232.140.158) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 20:00:04 +0200 | vicfred | (~vicfred@user/vicfred) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2022-04-03 20:02:27 +0200 | Psybur | (~Psybur@2600:1003:b12f:917d:c456:4602:f034:984a) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 20:02:38 +0200 | jonathanx | (~jonathan@h-178-174-176-109.A357.priv.bahnhof.se) |
| 2022-04-03 20:02:46 +0200 | Psybur | (~Psybur@2600:1003:b12f:917d:c456:4602:f034:984a) |
| 2022-04-03 20:02:53 +0200 | Topsi | (~Tobias@dyndsl-095-033-019-200.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 2022-04-03 20:05:27 +0200 | rekahsoft | (~rekahsoft@cpe001b21a2fd89-cm64777ddc63a0.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 2022-04-03 20:07:33 +0200 | kaph | (~kaph@151.47.165.211) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 20:08:56 +0200 | kaph | (~kaph@151.47.165.211) |
| 2022-04-03 20:11:49 +0200 | geranim0 | (~geranim0@modemcable242.171-178-173.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 2022-04-03 20:12:44 +0200 | deadmars- | (~deadmarsh@95.38.117.185) |
| 2022-04-03 20:12:58 +0200 | simendsjo | (~user@84.211.91.241) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 20:13:33 +0200 | deadmarshal_ | (~deadmarsh@95.38.113.202) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 20:14:32 +0200 | entbsagtc^ | (~entbsagtc@c-24-99-107-170.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 20:15:05 +0200 | cdman | (~dcm@user/dmc/x-4369397) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2022-04-03 20:18:05 +0200 | d34df00d | (~d34df00d@2600:1700:8c60:3a10::46) |
| 2022-04-03 20:18:13 +0200 | <d34df00d> | Hi! |
| 2022-04-03 20:18:16 +0200 | stevenxl | (~stevenxl@c-73-72-2-81.hsd1.il.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 20:18:50 +0200 | <shapr> | howdy d34df00d, how you doin? |
| 2022-04-03 20:19:05 +0200 | <d34df00d> | I bumped my stackage lts to 19.1 (the one with ghc 9.0.2), and now I get `Could not find module ‘Prelude’ // Perhaps you haven't installed the profiling libraries for package ‘base-4.15.1.0’?` when I try to build a just created project with `stack build --profile`. |
| 2022-04-03 20:19:18 +0200 | <d34df00d> | So, what am I doing wrong and how to fix this? |
| 2022-04-03 20:19:30 +0200 | <d34df00d> | shapr: can't profile, that sucks :( |
| 2022-04-03 20:19:38 +0200 | <shapr> | oh, that's no fun |
| 2022-04-03 20:19:43 +0200 | <shapr> | I don't know anything about stack, sorry |
| 2022-04-03 20:20:03 +0200 | <maerwald> | maybe https://gitlab.haskell.org/ghc/ghc/-/issues/21190 ? |
| 2022-04-03 20:20:22 +0200 | <maerwald> | they're switching to hadrian produced bindists, so maybe 9.0.2 is affected as well |
| 2022-04-03 20:20:31 +0200 | <d34df00d> | maerwald: that looks related, except that's 9.2.2 and I'm having that with 9.0.2. |
| 2022-04-03 20:20:43 +0200 | <d34df00d> | Yep, would be interesting if 9.0.2 is also affected. |
| 2022-04-03 20:21:03 +0200 | <d34df00d> | Curious what's the fix. |
| 2022-04-03 20:21:11 +0200 | <d34df00d> | (except rolling back to 8.10) |
| 2022-04-03 20:21:42 +0200 | <maerwald> | I think it is affected |
| 2022-04-03 20:22:47 +0200 | bahamas | (~lucian@84.232.140.158) |
| 2022-04-03 20:24:59 +0200 | Graham31415 | (~Graham@user/Graham31415) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 20:26:24 +0200 | <maerwald> | so you'll have to build from source |
| 2022-04-03 20:27:29 +0200 | <d34df00d> | Ugh, probably not worth it. |
| 2022-04-03 20:27:42 +0200 | <maerwald> | ghcup compile ghc -j 10 -v 9.0.2 -b 8.10.7 |
| 2022-04-03 20:27:42 +0200 | <d34df00d> | I think I'll just revert to ghc-8.10/lts-18.x |
| 2022-04-03 20:28:48 +0200 | <maerwald> | you can use ghc-8.10.7 with lts-19.1 |
| 2022-04-03 20:30:05 +0200 | <geekosaur> | there have been a couple reports of the 9.0.2 bindist missing profiling libraries; best you can currently do is still to 8.10.7 apparently |
| 2022-04-03 20:30:17 +0200 | <geekosaur> | s/still/stick |
| 2022-04-03 20:30:42 +0200 | <maerwald> | d34df00d: what distro? |
| 2022-04-03 20:30:53 +0200 | cosimone | (~user@93-47-228-79.ip115.fastwebnet.it) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 20:31:16 +0200 | Graham31415 | (~Graham@user/Graham31415) |
| 2022-04-03 20:31:19 +0200 | deadmars- | (~deadmarsh@95.38.117.185) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 20:32:27 +0200 | <d34df00d> | maerwald: gentoo lol |
| 2022-04-03 20:32:48 +0200 | stevenxl | (~stevenxl@c-73-72-2-81.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 20:32:52 +0200 | waleee | (~waleee@2001:9b0:213:7200:cc36:a556:b1e8:b340) |
| 2022-04-03 20:32:58 +0200 | <maerwald> | d34df00d: I think that's binary compatible with fedora34... I'm building 9.0.2 there right now and can upload the bindist afterwards |
| 2022-04-03 20:35:56 +0200 | Sgeo | (~Sgeo@user/sgeo) |
| 2022-04-03 20:36:46 +0200 | <d34df00d> | maerwald: that'd be useful, thanks! |
| 2022-04-03 20:36:55 +0200 | <d34df00d> | maerwald: how would I marry that to stack? |
| 2022-04-03 20:36:59 +0200 | <maerwald> | system-ghc: true |
| 2022-04-03 20:37:03 +0200 | <d34df00d> | Ah, makes sense. |
| 2022-04-03 20:37:07 +0200 | <maerwald> | https://docs.haskellstack.org/en/stable/yaml_configuration/#system-ghc |
| 2022-04-03 20:37:14 +0200 | stevenxl | (~stevenxl@c-73-72-2-81.hsd1.il.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 20:37:30 +0200 | <d34df00d> | Hmm, how do I check if a ghc installation has a version of base libraries with profiling enabled? |
| 2022-04-03 20:37:58 +0200 | <d34df00d> | I already have gentoo's own prebuilt binaries, so wonder if they'd work. |
| 2022-04-03 20:38:55 +0200 | <maerwald> | you try to build a project with profiling enabled |
| 2022-04-03 20:40:20 +0200 | cosimone | (~user@2001:b07:ae5:db26:c24a:d20:4d91:1e20) |
| 2022-04-03 20:40:54 +0200 | <geekosaur> | you can dig around for libHSbase-x.y.z.w-somehash.p_a, but just trying to build a profiled helloworld app would probably be easier |
| 2022-04-03 20:41:57 +0200 | <geekosaur> | hm,or just look in its install for any file with suffix .p_a I guess would be enough |
| 2022-04-03 20:42:10 +0200 | foul_owl | (~kerry@23.82.193.88) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 20:42:37 +0200 | <d34df00d> | Nope, no p_a for me :( |
| 2022-04-03 20:43:09 +0200 | geranim0 | (~geranim0@modemcable242.171-178-173.mc.videotron.ca) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 20:44:54 +0200 | <geekosaur> | oh, looks like it's _p.a |
| 2022-04-03 20:45:39 +0200 | jao | (~jao@cpc103048-sgyl39-2-0-cust502.18-2.cable.virginm.net) |
| 2022-04-03 20:45:48 +0200 | <geekosaur> | interestingly, whatever build it used on my system has the p.a and p_hi files in at least 9.2.2 |
| 2022-04-03 20:45:55 +0200 | geekosaur | checks 9.0.2 |
| 2022-04-03 20:46:08 +0200 | <geekosaur> | missing there |
| 2022-04-03 20:47:55 +0200 | foul_owl | (~kerry@23.82.193.88) |
| 2022-04-03 20:47:56 +0200 | kaph | (~kaph@151.47.165.211) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 20:49:01 +0200 | stevenxl | (~stevenxl@c-73-72-2-81.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 20:49:02 +0200 | <d34df00d> | Well, I actually just grepped the installed files for libHSbase and got libHSbase-4.15.1.0-ghc9.0.2.so and libHSbase-4.15.1.0.a, and that's it. |
| 2022-04-03 20:53:48 +0200 | stevenxl | (~stevenxl@c-73-72-2-81.hsd1.il.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 20:54:07 +0200 | <janus> | d34df00d: did you already see https://gitlab.haskell.org/ghc/ghc/-/issues/20707 ? |
| 2022-04-03 20:54:13 +0200 | kaph | (~kaph@151.35.76.11) |
| 2022-04-03 20:54:45 +0200 | geranim0 | (~geranim0@modemcable242.171-178-173.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 2022-04-03 20:55:55 +0200 | bitdex | (~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 20:56:05 +0200 | <janus> | i don't understand why there is both 21190 and 20707.. |
| 2022-04-03 20:56:27 +0200 | <lechner> | different versions? |
| 2022-04-03 20:58:08 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 20:58:20 +0200 | bitdex | (~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) |
| 2022-04-03 20:59:26 +0200 | <janus> | well you'd think the fix for 9.2.1 would make it such that no issue for 9.2.2 would be needed |
| 2022-04-03 20:59:27 +0200 | Graham31415 | (~Graham@user/Graham31415) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 20:59:57 +0200 | kaph | (~kaph@151.35.76.11) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 21:01:49 +0200 | kaph | (~kaph@151.35.76.11) |
| 2022-04-03 21:02:23 +0200 | <lechner> | "issues like #21190" https://gitlab.haskell.org/ghc/ghc/-/merge_requests/7753 |
| 2022-04-03 21:02:27 +0200 | hololeap | (~hololeap@user/hololeap) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 21:03:49 +0200 | hololeap | (~hololeap@user/hololeap) |
| 2022-04-03 21:04:17 +0200 | BlackboardN | (~nathan@user/BlackboardN) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 21:12:19 +0200 | sammelweis | (~quassel@2601:401:8200:2d4c:bd9:d04c:7f69:eb10) (Quit: https://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.) |
| 2022-04-03 21:13:59 +0200 | bahamas | (~lucian@84.232.140.158) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 21:16:02 +0200 | rekahsoft | (~rekahsoft@cpe001b21a2fd89-cm64777ddc63a0.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 21:16:26 +0200 | rekahsoft | (~rekahsoft@cpe001b21a2fd89-cm64777ddc63a0.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 2022-04-03 21:17:07 +0200 | fef | (~thedawn@user/thedawn) |
| 2022-04-03 21:18:32 +0200 | <maerwald> | d34df00d: https://downloads.haskell.org/~ghcup/unofficial-bindists/ghc/9.0.2/ghc-9.0.2-x86_64-linux-fedora-3… |
| 2022-04-03 21:18:51 +0200 | Sgeo | (~Sgeo@user/sgeo) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 21:19:35 +0200 | mikoto-chan | (~mikoto-ch@213.177.151.239) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 21:20:36 +0200 | mvk | (~mvk@2607:fea8:5ce3:8500::3800) |
| 2022-04-03 21:20:59 +0200 | Sgeo | (~Sgeo@user/sgeo) |
| 2022-04-03 21:21:30 +0200 | kaph | (~kaph@151.35.76.11) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 21:24:47 +0200 | liz | (~liz@cpc84585-newc17-2-0-cust60.16-2.cable.virginm.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 21:24:59 +0200 | liz | (~liz@cpc84585-newc17-2-0-cust60.16-2.cable.virginm.net) |
| 2022-04-03 21:26:06 +0200 | stevenxl | (~stevenxl@c-73-72-2-81.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 21:27:20 +0200 | <d34df00d> | maerwald: yay, thanks! |
| 2022-04-03 21:27:27 +0200 | mikoto-chan | (~mikoto-ch@213.177.151.239) |
| 2022-04-03 21:30:35 +0200 | fef | (~thedawn@user/thedawn) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 21:30:53 +0200 | stevenxl | (~stevenxl@c-73-72-2-81.hsd1.il.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 21:32:22 +0200 | alMalsamo | (~alMalsamo@gateway/tor-sasl/almalsamo) |
| 2022-04-03 21:33:02 +0200 | Sgeo | (~Sgeo@user/sgeo) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 21:37:21 +0200 | Sgeo | (~Sgeo@user/sgeo) |
| 2022-04-03 21:37:26 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 21:41:18 +0200 | Pickchea | (~private@user/pickchea) |
| 2022-04-03 21:41:19 +0200 | entbsagtc^ | (~entbsagtc@c-24-99-107-170.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 21:43:00 +0200 | odnes | (~odnes@5-203-146-18.pat.nym.cosmote.net) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2022-04-03 21:46:56 +0200 | zincy | (~zincy@2a00:23c8:970c:4801:9dee:240c:5988:ddb8) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 21:48:14 +0200 | cosimone | (~user@2001:b07:ae5:db26:c24a:d20:4d91:1e20) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 21:48:29 +0200 | Psybur | (~Psybur@2600:1003:b12f:917d:c456:4602:f034:984a) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 21:48:49 +0200 | Psybur | (~Psybur@c-76-123-45-25.hsd1.va.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 21:50:24 +0200 | zer0bitz_ | (~zer0bitz@2001:2003:f750:a200:f9d1:c665:a064:ac5a) |
| 2022-04-03 21:50:45 +0200 | Inst | (~Liam@2601:6c4:4080:3f80:854:307a:efd:ab95) |
| 2022-04-03 21:51:51 +0200 | zer0bitz | (~zer0bitz@2001:2003:f750:a200:d960:d98a:f624:8ef) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 21:52:38 +0200 | machinedgod | (~machinedg@24.105.81.50) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 21:52:42 +0200 | sammelweis | (~quassel@2601:401:8200:2d4c:bd9:d04c:7f69:eb10) |
| 2022-04-03 21:56:48 +0200 | mvk | (~mvk@2607:fea8:5ce3:8500::3800) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 21:56:57 +0200 | alMalsamo | littlebobeep |
| 2022-04-03 21:58:37 +0200 | vicfred | (~vicfred@user/vicfred) |
| 2022-04-03 21:59:03 +0200 | jonathanx | (~jonathan@h-178-174-176-109.A357.priv.bahnhof.se) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 21:59:18 +0200 | machinedgod | (~machinedg@24.105.81.50) |
| 2022-04-03 22:00:16 +0200 | yauhsien | (~yauhsien@61-231-37-33.dynamic-ip.hinet.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 22:00:35 +0200 | hololeap | (~hololeap@user/hololeap) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
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| 2022-04-03 22:02:41 +0200 | zincy | (~zincy@host86-160-236-152.range86-160.btcentralplus.com) |
| 2022-04-03 22:05:02 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 22:05:58 +0200 | _ht | (~quassel@231-169-21-31.ftth.glasoperator.nl) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 22:06:43 +0200 | yauhsien | (~yauhsien@61-231-37-33.dynamic-ip.hinet.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 22:06:50 +0200 | zincy | (~zincy@host86-160-236-152.range86-160.btcentralplus.com) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 22:09:06 +0200 | hololeap | (~hololeap@user/hololeap) |
| 2022-04-03 22:11:41 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@c-001-001-001.client.esciencecenter.eduvpn.nl) |
| 2022-04-03 22:15:52 +0200 | zer0bitz_ | (~zer0bitz@2001:2003:f750:a200:f9d1:c665:a064:ac5a) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 22:16:26 +0200 | stevenxl | (~stevenxl@c-73-72-2-81.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 22:16:32 +0200 | Lord_of_Life_ | (~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915) |
| 2022-04-03 22:17:11 +0200 | sammelweis | (~quassel@2601:401:8200:2d4c:bd9:d04c:7f69:eb10) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2022-04-03 22:17:35 +0200 | Lord_of_Life | (~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 22:19:19 +0200 | Lord_of_Life_ | Lord_of_Life |
| 2022-04-03 22:21:18 +0200 | stevenxl | (~stevenxl@c-73-72-2-81.hsd1.il.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 22:23:30 +0200 | Midjak | (~Midjak@82.66.147.146) (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep) |
| 2022-04-03 22:27:19 +0200 | kaph | (~kaph@151.35.76.11) |
| 2022-04-03 22:27:53 +0200 | <maerwald> | good to know optparse-applicative isn't runtime-safe just because it compiles |
| 2022-04-03 22:28:03 +0200 | <maerwald> | you can just get an infinite loop |
| 2022-04-03 22:28:05 +0200 | dudek | (~dudek@185.150.236.127) |
| 2022-04-03 22:28:46 +0200 | <maerwald> | https://github.com/pcapriotti/optparse-applicative/issues/58 |
| 2022-04-03 22:29:56 +0200 | hueso | (~root@user/hueso) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 22:30:59 +0200 | stevenxl | (~stevenxl@c-73-72-2-81.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 22:32:18 +0200 | hueso | (~root@user/hueso) |
| 2022-04-03 22:32:47 +0200 | jushur | (~human@user/jushur) (Quit: ¯\_(ツ)_/¯) |
| 2022-04-03 22:34:43 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 22:35:43 +0200 | zincy | (~zincy@2a00:23c8:970c:4801:9dee:240c:5988:ddb8) |
| 2022-04-03 22:38:17 +0200 | pavonia | (~user@user/siracusa) |
| 2022-04-03 22:38:31 +0200 | stevenxl | (~stevenxl@c-73-72-2-81.hsd1.il.comcast.net) (Quit: leaving) |
| 2022-04-03 22:40:03 +0200 | zincy | (~zincy@2a00:23c8:970c:4801:9dee:240c:5988:ddb8) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 22:41:59 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@c-001-001-001.client.esciencecenter.eduvpn.nl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 22:41:59 +0200 | alp | (~alp@user/alp) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 22:43:43 +0200 | rawley | (~rawley@216-197-141-102.nbfr.hsdb.sasknet.sk.ca) |
| 2022-04-03 22:51:19 +0200 | mon_aaraj | (~MonAaraj@user/mon-aaraj/x-4416475) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 22:53:24 +0200 | mon_aaraj | (~MonAaraj@user/mon-aaraj/x-4416475) |
| 2022-04-03 22:56:11 +0200 | <janus> | is it going to be a lot slower to do `length . Map.elems` instead of just `length` straight on the map? |
| 2022-04-03 22:58:05 +0200 | <geekosaur> | it will be slower, since length on Map is probably using Map.size |
| 2022-04-03 23:09:33 +0200 | DNH | (~DNH@2a02:8109:b740:2c4:b89d:8c20:3683:54c9) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
| 2022-04-03 23:09:48 +0200 | zincy | (~zincy@2a00:23c8:970c:4801:9dee:240c:5988:ddb8) |
| 2022-04-03 23:12:28 +0200 | <janus> | ok, makes sense, thanks |
| 2022-04-03 23:13:09 +0200 | <janus> | turns out i can't avoid constructing iterating the map anyway because i wanna get rid of deprecated packages |
| 2022-04-03 23:13:18 +0200 | <janus> | s/constructing// |
| 2022-04-03 23:13:22 +0200 | acidjnk | (~acidjnk@p200300d0c7049f70e9fe474f3be10533.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 23:13:50 +0200 | <janus> | oh well, should still be faster now... |
| 2022-04-03 23:14:05 +0200 | zincy | (~zincy@2a00:23c8:970c:4801:9dee:240c:5988:ddb8) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 23:15:04 +0200 | belphegor666 | (~satan@user/belphegor666) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 23:17:30 +0200 | <janus> | sclv: these two commits are kinda independent but i put them in the same PR because i think they should both be palatable: https://github.com/haskell/hackage-server/pull/1049/commits |
| 2022-04-03 23:19:24 +0200 | cosimone | (~user@2001:b07:ae5:db26:c24a:d20:4d91:1e20) |
| 2022-04-03 23:21:53 +0200 | <sclv> | janus: nice. on the face of it it looks better |
| 2022-04-03 23:22:32 +0200 | <janus> | i am kinda thinking now that the huge slowdown for non-search is just because it wasn't using itemCache |
| 2022-04-03 23:22:40 +0200 | <janus> | so turns out there was a cache already, i guess :) |
| 2022-04-03 23:24:12 +0200 | <sclv> | cool. maybe i'll let the dust settle a bit and redeploy again on the weekend |
| 2022-04-03 23:24:23 +0200 | <janus> | yep yep |
| 2022-04-03 23:24:49 +0200 | alp | (~alp@user/alp) |
| 2022-04-03 23:25:13 +0200 | deadmarshal_ | (~deadmarsh@95.38.119.185) |
| 2022-04-03 23:29:35 +0200 | deadmarshal_ | (~deadmarsh@95.38.119.185) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 23:30:11 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 23:34:42 +0200 | yauhsien | (~yauhsien@61-231-37-33.dynamic-ip.hinet.net) |
| 2022-04-03 23:38:15 +0200 | bitdex | (~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 23:38:34 +0200 | fizbin | (~fizbin@c-73-33-197-160.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 2022-04-03 23:39:23 +0200 | yauhsien | (~yauhsien@61-231-37-33.dynamic-ip.hinet.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 23:40:03 +0200 | bitdex | (~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) |
| 2022-04-03 23:40:18 +0200 | Alleria | (~textual@user/alleria) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 23:42:55 +0200 | wyrd | (~wyrd@gateway/tor-sasl/wyrd) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
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| 2022-04-03 23:45:22 +0200 | zincy | (~zincy@2a00:23c8:970c:4801:9dee:240c:5988:ddb8) |
| 2022-04-03 23:49:25 +0200 | zincy | (~zincy@2a00:23c8:970c:4801:9dee:240c:5988:ddb8) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 23:49:54 +0200 | wyrd | (~wyrd@gateway/tor-sasl/wyrd) |
| 2022-04-03 23:50:58 +0200 | gehmehgeh | (~user@user/gehmehgeh) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2022-04-03 23:52:01 +0200 | sammelweis | (~quassel@2601:401:8200:2d4c:bd9:d04c:7f69:eb10) |
| 2022-04-03 23:52:13 +0200 | kaph | (~kaph@151.35.76.11) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 23:52:55 +0200 | lavaman | (~lavaman@c-174-63-118-52.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2022-04-03 23:53:18 +0200 | kaph | (~kaph@151.35.76.11) |
| 2022-04-03 23:54:30 +0200 | kaph | (~kaph@151.35.76.11) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2022-04-03 23:55:37 +0200 | __monty__ | (~toonn@user/toonn) (Quit: leaving) |
| 2022-04-03 23:55:47 +0200 | kaph | (~kaph@151.35.76.11) |
| 2022-04-03 23:55:55 +0200 | Alleria | (~textual@user/alleria) |
| 2022-04-03 23:56:46 +0200 | DNH | (~DNH@2a02:8109:b740:2c4:b89d:8c20:3683:54c9) |