| 2026-03-15 00:08:19 +0100 | ThePenguin | (~ThePengui@cust-95-80-28-221.csbnet.se) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-03-15 00:10:11 +0100 | ThePenguin | (~ThePengui@cust-95-80-28-221.csbnet.se) ThePenguin |
| 2026-03-15 00:10:34 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 00:11:35 +0100 | machinedgod | (~machinedg@d172-219-48-230.abhsia.telus.net) machinedgod |
| 2026-03-15 00:15:10 +0100 | arandombit | (~arandombi@user/arandombit) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 00:15:19 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 00:15:43 +0100 | bitdex | (~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 00:17:31 +0100 | __monty__ | (~toonn@user/toonn) (Quit: leaving) |
| 2026-03-15 00:25:56 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 00:30:17 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 00:33:34 +0100 | tremon | (~tremon@83.80.159.219) (Quit: getting boxed in) |
| 2026-03-15 00:37:15 +0100 | target_i | (~target_i@user/target-i/x-6023099) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 00:41:19 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 00:44:53 +0100 | somemathguy | (~somemathg@user/somemathguy) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 00:45:46 +0100 | somemathguy | (~somemathg@user/somemathguy) somemathguy |
| 2026-03-15 00:45:54 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 00:47:18 +0100 | Guest62t | (~Guest62t@p200300ca8f2b26002bbd6a2e892b4429.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Quit: Client closed) |
| 2026-03-15 00:56:08 +0100 | wickedjargon | (~user@S0106f89e28d5699a.vc.shawcable.net) wickedjargon |
| 2026-03-15 00:56:41 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 01:01:32 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 01:09:03 +0100 | wickedjargon | (~user@S0106f89e28d5699a.vc.shawcable.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 01:12:03 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 01:16:39 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 01:27:29 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 01:34:31 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 01:37:41 +0100 | machinedgod | (~machinedg@d172-219-48-230.abhsia.telus.net) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 01:45:29 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 01:49:45 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 01:54:14 +0100 | chexum | (~quassel@gateway/tor-sasl/chexum) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 01:54:46 +0100 | chexum | (~quassel@gateway/tor-sasl/chexum) chexum |
| 2026-03-15 02:05:15 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 02:10:08 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 02:14:39 +0100 | APic | (apic@apic.name) (Quit: brb) |
| 2026-03-15 02:19:20 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 02:24:02 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 02:25:05 +0100 | APic | (apic@apic.name) APic |
| 2026-03-15 02:26:01 +0100 | APic | (apic@apic.name) (Client Quit) |
| 2026-03-15 02:26:52 +0100 | Tuplanolla | (~Tuplanoll@88-114-89-88.elisa-laajakaista.fi) (Quit: Leaving.) |
| 2026-03-15 02:34:41 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 02:38:56 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 02:44:30 +0100 | humasect | (~humasect@dyn-192-249-132-90.nexicom.net) humasect |
| 2026-03-15 02:46:19 +0100 | gabiruh | (~gabiruh@vps19177.publiccloud.com.br) (Quit: ZNC 1.7.5 - https://znc.in) |
| 2026-03-15 02:46:35 +0100 | gabiruh | (~gabiruh@vps19177.publiccloud.com.br) gabiruh |
| 2026-03-15 02:47:21 +0100 | wickedjargon | (~user@2605:8d80:5430:db35:9897:1236:e613:3e66) wickedjargon |
| 2026-03-15 02:48:39 +0100 | tcard_ | (~tcard@2400:4051:5801:7500:cf17:befc:ff82:5303) |
| 2026-03-15 02:49:12 +0100 | tcard | (~tcard@2400:4051:5801:7500:cf17:befc:ff82:5303) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2026-03-15 02:50:04 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 02:53:48 +0100 | humasect | (~humasect@dyn-192-249-132-90.nexicom.net) (Quit: Leaving...) |
| 2026-03-15 02:54:05 +0100 | CloneOfNone | (~CloneOfNo@user/CloneOfNone) CloneOfNone |
| 2026-03-15 02:54:26 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 02:58:54 +0100 | wickedjargon | (~user@2605:8d80:5430:db35:9897:1236:e613:3e66) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-03-15 03:05:26 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 03:10:03 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 03:20:47 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 03:27:55 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 03:28:47 +0100 | acidjnk_new | (~acidjnk@p200300d6e700e577005998611a6f2d89.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 03:38:50 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 03:40:26 +0100 | bitdex | (~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) bitdex |
| 2026-03-15 03:43:05 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 03:47:45 +0100 | gabiruh | (~gabiruh@vps19177.publiccloud.com.br) (Quit: ZNC 1.7.5 - https://znc.in) |
| 2026-03-15 03:51:07 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 03:53:08 +0100 | gabiruh | (~gabiruh@vps19177.publiccloud.com.br) gabiruh |
| 2026-03-15 03:56:05 +0100 | somemathguy | (~somemathg@user/somemathguy) (Quit: WeeChat 4.1.1) |
| 2026-03-15 03:56:07 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 04:00:01 +0100 | attlin | (~user@user/attlin) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2026-03-15 04:03:48 +0100 | attlin | (~user@user/attlin) attlin |
| 2026-03-15 04:05:03 +0100 | op_4 | (~tslil@user/op-4/x-9116473) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-03-15 04:05:39 +0100 | op_4 | (~tslil@user/op-4/x-9116473) op_4 |
| 2026-03-15 04:06:30 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 04:07:51 +0100 | bitdex | (~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-03-15 04:08:09 +0100 | bitdex | (~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) bitdex |
| 2026-03-15 04:11:12 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 04:12:21 +0100 | emmanuelux | (~em@user/emmanuelux) emmanuelux |
| 2026-03-15 04:19:53 +0100 | emmanuelux | (~em@user/emmanuelux) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2026-03-15 04:20:44 +0100 | acidjnk_new | (~acidjnk@p200300d6e700e577ac3e0b7a27078302.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 2026-03-15 04:21:52 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 04:26:43 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 04:31:31 +0100 | emmanuelux | (~em@user/emmanuelux) emmanuelux |
| 2026-03-15 04:37:13 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 04:41:43 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 04:48:09 +0100 | ZLima12 | (~zlima12@user/meow/ZLima12) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 04:48:37 +0100 | ZLima12 | (~zlima12@user/meow/ZLima12) ZLima12 |
| 2026-03-15 04:52:35 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 04:52:57 +0100 | <ski> | roconnor : someone mentioned something like that, here, a few days ago |
| 2026-03-15 04:57:07 +0100 | machinedgod | (~machinedg@d172-219-48-230.abhsia.telus.net) machinedgod |
| 2026-03-15 04:59:43 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 05:00:57 +0100 | emmanuelux | (~em@user/emmanuelux) (Quit: bye) |
| 2026-03-15 05:06:18 +0100 | emmanuelux | (~em@user/emmanuelux) emmanuelux |
| 2026-03-15 05:10:54 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 05:15:36 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 05:18:31 +0100 | emmanuelux | (~em@user/emmanuelux) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2026-03-15 05:21:19 +0100 | <roconnor> | beginIO (pushIO '>') putCharIO (beginIO getCharIO putCharIO untilEofIO) endIO |
| 2026-03-15 05:26:16 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 05:30:55 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 05:35:21 +0100 | emmanuelux | (~em@user/emmanuelux) emmanuelux |
| 2026-03-15 05:36:59 +0100 | craunts795335385 | (~craunts@152.32.99.2) |
| 2026-03-15 05:41:39 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 05:41:56 +0100 | bitdex | (~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 05:45:58 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 05:46:03 +0100 | bitdex | (~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) bitdex |
| 2026-03-15 05:47:33 +0100 | humasect | (~humasect@dyn-192-249-132-90.nexicom.net) humasect |
| 2026-03-15 05:48:17 +0100 | dutchie | (~dutchie@user/dutchie) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 05:50:02 +0100 | jle` | (~jle`@2603:8001:3b00:11::1156) (Quit: WeeChat 4.8.1) |
| 2026-03-15 05:50:55 +0100 | dutchie | (~dutchie@user/dutchie) dutchie |
| 2026-03-15 05:53:36 +0100 | wickedjargon | (~user@S0106f89e28d5699a.vc.shawcable.net) wickedjargon |
| 2026-03-15 05:57:00 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 05:57:14 +0100 | euphores | (~SASL_euph@user/euphores) (Quit: Leaving.) |
| 2026-03-15 05:59:54 +0100 | chromoblob | (~chromoblo@user/chromob1ot1c) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 06:01:41 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 06:03:24 +0100 | humasect | (~humasect@dyn-192-249-132-90.nexicom.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-03-15 06:05:08 +0100 | chromoblob | (~chromoblo@user/chromob1ot1c) chromoblob\0 |
| 2026-03-15 06:12:22 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 06:13:17 +0100 | peterbecich | (~Thunderbi@71.84.33.135) peterbecich |
| 2026-03-15 06:17:12 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 06:20:53 +0100 | jle` | (~jle`@2603:8001:3b00:11:a2b9:f428:51ad:f7af) jle` |
| 2026-03-15 06:22:27 +0100 | euphores | (~SASL_euph@user/euphores) euphores |
| 2026-03-15 06:27:42 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 06:34:18 +0100 | Adran | (~adran@botters/adran) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2026-03-15 06:34:32 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 06:35:18 +0100 | Adran | (~adran@botters/adran) Adran |
| 2026-03-15 06:45:46 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 06:47:51 +0100 | takuan | (~takuan@d8D86B9E9.access.telenet.be) |
| 2026-03-15 06:50:02 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 06:53:17 +0100 | Guest88 | (~Guest88@31.205.11.202) |
| 2026-03-15 06:54:55 +0100 | Guest88 | (~Guest88@31.205.11.202) (Client Quit) |
| 2026-03-15 06:59:02 +0100 | tt12316070197 | (~tt1231@75.185.104.199) tt1231 |
| 2026-03-15 07:01:00 +0100 | tt1231607019 | (~tt1231@2603:6010:8700:4a81:a4f6:acff:fe95:3803) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 07:01:00 +0100 | tt12316070197 | tt1231607019 |
| 2026-03-15 07:01:10 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 07:05:48 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 07:07:12 +0100 | wickedjargon | (~user@S0106f89e28d5699a.vc.shawcable.net) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 07:16:32 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 07:21:26 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 07:25:41 +0100 | wickedjargon | (~user@S0106f89e28d5699a.vc.shawcable.net) wickedjargon |
| 2026-03-15 07:26:12 +0100 | wickedjargon | (~user@S0106f89e28d5699a.vc.shawcable.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-03-15 07:26:24 +0100 | wickedjargon | (~user@S0106f89e28d5699a.vc.shawcable.net) wickedjargon |
| 2026-03-15 07:26:45 +0100 | chromoblob | (~chromoblo@user/chromob1ot1c) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 07:26:57 +0100 | wickedjargon | (~user@S0106f89e28d5699a.vc.shawcable.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-03-15 07:27:02 +0100 | chromoblob | (~chromoblo@user/chromob1ot1c) chromoblob\0 |
| 2026-03-15 07:27:10 +0100 | wickedjargon | (~user@S0106f89e28d5699a.vc.shawcable.net) wickedjargon |
| 2026-03-15 07:27:55 +0100 | peterbecich | (~Thunderbi@71.84.33.135) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 07:31:54 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 07:33:38 +0100 | chromoblob | (~chromoblo@user/chromob1ot1c) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 07:36:28 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 07:37:44 +0100 | marinelli | (~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/marinelli) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-03-15 07:38:05 +0100 | marinelli | (~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/marinelli) marinelli |
| 2026-03-15 07:43:27 +0100 | Square2 | (~Square@user/square) Square |
| 2026-03-15 07:43:29 +0100 | humasect | (~humasect@dyn-192-249-132-90.nexicom.net) humasect |
| 2026-03-15 07:43:29 +0100 | humasect | (~humasect@dyn-192-249-132-90.nexicom.net) (Client Quit) |
| 2026-03-15 07:43:48 +0100 | humasect | (~humasect@dyn-192-249-132-90.nexicom.net) humasect |
| 2026-03-15 07:46:10 +0100 | Square3 | (~Square@user/square) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 07:47:15 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 07:48:56 +0100 | Square2 | (~Square@user/square) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 07:51:14 +0100 | chromoblob | (~chromoblo@user/chromob1ot1c) chromoblob\0 |
| 2026-03-15 07:51:45 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 07:52:35 +0100 | p3n | (~p3n@2a00:19a0:3:7c:0:d9c6:7cf6:1) (Quit: ZNC 1.10.1 - https://znc.in) |
| 2026-03-15 07:53:48 +0100 | p3n | (~p3n@217.198.124.246) p3n |
| 2026-03-15 08:01:01 +0100 | tt1231607019 | (~tt1231@75.185.104.199) (Quit: The Lounge - https://thelounge.chat) |
| 2026-03-15 08:02:37 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 08:06:28 +0100 | wickedja` | (~user@2605:8d80:5431:326b:f843:4622:5e47:57a5) |
| 2026-03-15 08:06:57 +0100 | tt12316070197 | (~tt1231@75.185.104.199) tt1231 |
| 2026-03-15 08:08:02 +0100 | wickedjargon | (~user@S0106f89e28d5699a.vc.shawcable.net) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 08:09:17 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 08:20:41 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 08:24:54 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 08:26:01 +0100 | hiecaq | (~hiecaq@user/hiecaq) hiecaq |
| 2026-03-15 08:28:01 +0100 | chromoblob | (~chromoblo@user/chromob1ot1c) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2026-03-15 08:31:00 +0100 | wickedja` | (~user@2605:8d80:5431:326b:f843:4622:5e47:57a5) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 08:32:34 +0100 | chromoblob | (~chromoblo@user/chromob1ot1c) chromoblob\0 |
| 2026-03-15 08:32:45 +0100 | Guest33 | (~Guest33@2401:4900:1c88:4bc9:7579:696e:50b3:a061) |
| 2026-03-15 08:34:55 +0100 | hakutaku | (~textual@user/hakutaku) hakutaku |
| 2026-03-15 08:36:03 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 08:37:50 +0100 | Guest33 | hsj |
| 2026-03-15 08:38:55 +0100 | hsj | (~Guest33@2401:4900:1c88:4bc9:7579:696e:50b3:a061) () |
| 2026-03-15 08:39:55 +0100 | <mesaoptimizer> | wow |
| 2026-03-15 08:40:36 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 08:47:10 +0100 | haritz | (~hrtz@user/haritz) (Quit: ZNC 1.8.2+deb3.1+deb12u1 - https://znc.in) |
| 2026-03-15 08:49:00 +0100 | machinedgod | (~machinedg@d172-219-48-230.abhsia.telus.net) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 08:51:25 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
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| 2026-03-15 09:14:25 +0100 | Vizious | (~bes@user/Vizious) Vizious |
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| 2026-03-15 09:47:34 +0100 | vidak | (~vidak@2407:e400:7800:2c01:d0be:76f8:cc84:bd4a) vidak |
| 2026-03-15 09:48:19 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
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| 2026-03-15 09:53:55 +0100 | hiecaq | (~hiecaq@user/hiecaq) (Quit: ERC 5.6.0.30.1 (IRC client for GNU Emacs 30.2)) |
| 2026-03-15 09:56:13 +0100 | Guest62t | (~Guest62t@p200300ca8f3baa00c0ef77f2b149c10e.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 2026-03-15 10:03:39 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
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| 2026-03-15 10:08:07 +0100 | arandombit | (~arandombi@2a02:2455:8656:7100:819d:767:3340:9085) arandombit |
| 2026-03-15 10:08:07 +0100 | arandombit | (~arandombi@2a02:2455:8656:7100:819d:767:3340:9085) (Changing host) |
| 2026-03-15 10:08:07 +0100 | arandombit | (~arandombi@user/arandombit) arandombit |
| 2026-03-15 10:09:47 +0100 | hiecaq | (~hiecaq@user/hiecaq) hiecaq |
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| 2026-03-15 10:14:07 +0100 | czan | (~czan@user/mange) czan |
| 2026-03-15 10:16:51 +0100 | <mesaoptimizer> | https://vitez.me/learn-haskell-in-two-weeks I don't recall if I've linked this here yet but it is a really nice essay about how Mercury gets their new hires up to speed with Haskell |
| 2026-03-15 10:19:00 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
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| 2026-03-15 10:56:51 +0100 | Beowulf | (florian@sleipnir.bandrate.org) (Quit: = "") |
| 2026-03-15 10:56:57 +0100 | humasect | (~humasect@dyn-192-249-132-90.nexicom.net) humasect |
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| 2026-03-15 11:01:35 +0100 | Beowulf | (florian@sleipnir.bandrate.org) |
| 2026-03-15 11:04:25 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
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| 2026-03-15 11:14:59 +0100 | Tuplanolla | (~Tuplanoll@88-114-89-88.elisa-laajakaista.fi) Tuplanolla |
| 2026-03-15 11:19:48 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
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| 2026-03-15 11:28:45 +0100 | <gentauro> | mesaoptimizer: really nice read. thx |
| 2026-03-15 11:37:51 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 11:40:46 +0100 | hakutaku | (~textual@user/hakutaku) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
| 2026-03-15 11:40:55 +0100 | cawfee | (root@2401:c080:3800:3460::babe) (Quit: WeeChat 4.8.1) |
| 2026-03-15 11:41:44 +0100 | ridcully_ | (~ridcully@p57b529aa.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) ridcully |
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| 2026-03-15 11:50:17 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 11:53:05 +0100 | APic | (apic@apic.name) APic |
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| 2026-03-15 12:05:27 +0100 | cawfee | (root@2401:c080:3800:3460::babe) qjqqyy |
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| 2026-03-15 12:21:01 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 12:24:08 +0100 | somemathguy | (~somemathg@user/somemathguy) somemathguy |
| 2026-03-15 12:26:02 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 12:36:23 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 12:41:06 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 12:42:51 +0100 | juri_ | (~juri@217-114-215-140.pool.ovpn.com) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 12:43:48 +0100 | arandombit | (~arandombi@user/arandombit) arandombit |
| 2026-03-15 12:44:58 +0100 | <ski> | mesaoptimizer : Mercury, the language ? |
| 2026-03-15 12:45:28 +0100 | zaquest | (~notzaques@5.130.79.72) zaquest |
| 2026-03-15 12:46:14 +0100 | <mesaoptimizer> | ski: Mercury, the fintech company in SF. https://mercury.com/ |
| 2026-03-15 12:48:29 +0100 | <ski> | hm, never heard |
| 2026-03-15 12:49:45 +0100 | juri_ | (~juri@217-114-215-140.pool.ovpn.com) juri_ |
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| 2026-03-15 12:51:46 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 12:52:19 +0100 | GdeVolpiano | (~GdeVolpia@user/GdeVolpiano) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 12:53:50 +0100 | GdeVolpiano | (~GdeVolpia@user/GdeVolpiano) GdeVolpiano |
| 2026-03-15 12:58:42 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 13:02:17 +0100 | <[exa]> | mesaoptimizer: hey that post is pretty cool |
| 2026-03-15 13:05:12 +0100 | <mesaoptimizer> | yeah, it made me quite optimistic about how easy it would be to get people up to speed to use Haskell |
| 2026-03-15 13:05:44 +0100 | arandombit | (~arandombi@user/arandombit) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 13:06:50 +0100 | <[exa]> | yeah like, the course I've been running for a few years now is essentially the same logic. I've got a talky part to explain stuff but the main part is chewing through a few relatively easy problems and getting code to work. |
| 2026-03-15 13:09:48 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
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| 2026-03-15 13:17:22 +0100 | somemathguy | (~somemathg@user/somemathguy) somemathguy |
| 2026-03-15 13:25:09 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
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| 2026-03-15 13:55:53 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
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| 2026-03-15 14:11:16 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 14:13:45 +0100 | m1dnight | (~m1dnight@d8D861A17.access.telenet.be) m1dnight |
| 2026-03-15 14:16:02 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 14:26:39 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
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| 2026-03-15 14:40:37 +0100 | huhuhuhuh | (~huhuhuhuh@220.158.168.165) |
| 2026-03-15 14:44:42 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 14:44:58 +0100 | huhuhuhuh | (~huhuhuhuh@220.158.168.165) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 14:48:29 +0100 | <gentauro> | mesaoptimizer: you need to have a base. I recall very bright people from the uni days that by taking the SML course were not able to understand what was going on (and skipping the class entirely). |
| 2026-03-15 14:49:01 +0100 | <gentauro> | I think the only person I know who have managed to make these concepts easy to use by almost everybody, is Evan with Elm. |
| 2026-03-15 14:49:04 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 14:49:19 +0100 | gentauro | and there are still many people who don't grasp the notions of it, sadly |
| 2026-03-15 14:51:11 +0100 | <Rembane> | I believe in the concept of Elm as a "gateway drug" |
| 2026-03-15 14:51:28 +0100 | <Rembane> | Gleam might work for that too, since it has a syntax that smells more of C |
| 2026-03-15 15:00:04 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 15:05:15 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 15:05:50 +0100 | pavonia | (~user@user/siracusa) (Quit: Bye!) |
| 2026-03-15 15:11:24 +0100 | califax | (~califax@user/califx) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-03-15 15:13:04 +0100 | califax | (~califax@user/califx) califx |
| 2026-03-15 15:13:56 +0100 | timide | (~timide@user/timide) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2026-03-15 15:14:07 +0100 | img | (~img@user/img) (Quit: ZNC 1.10.1 - https://znc.in) |
| 2026-03-15 15:14:28 +0100 | timide | (~timide@user/timide) timide |
| 2026-03-15 15:15:22 +0100 | img | (~img@user/img) img |
| 2026-03-15 15:15:26 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
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| 2026-03-15 15:26:08 +0100 | rekahsoft | (~rekahsoft@bras-base-orllon1103w-grc-20-76-67-111-168.dsl.bell.ca) rekahsoft |
| 2026-03-15 15:30:48 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 15:31:41 +0100 | __monty__ | (~toonn@user/toonn) (Quit: leaving) |
| 2026-03-15 15:32:00 +0100 | j1n37 | (~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37 |
| 2026-03-15 15:35:21 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
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| 2026-03-15 15:43:16 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 15:43:34 +0100 | m1dnight | (~m1dnight@d8D861A17.access.telenet.be) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 15:47:59 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 15:49:32 +0100 | m1dnight | (~m1dnight@d8D861A17.access.telenet.be) m1dnight |
| 2026-03-15 15:52:28 +0100 | Square2 | (~Square@user/square) Square |
| 2026-03-15 15:58:38 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 15:59:47 +0100 | karenw | (~karenw@user/karenw) karenw |
| 2026-03-15 16:00:31 +0100 | marinelli | (~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/marinelli) (Quit: marinelli) |
| 2026-03-15 16:02:52 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 16:04:37 +0100 | <chromoblob> | Hoogle-as-a-Haskell-mentor |
| 2026-03-15 16:09:11 +0100 | califax | (~califax@user/califx) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-03-15 16:09:27 +0100 | califax | (~califax@user/califx) califx |
| 2026-03-15 16:13:19 +0100 | <mesaoptimizer> | Hoogle isn't enough |
| 2026-03-15 16:13:45 +0100 | <mesaoptimizer> | you need one-on-one mentoring while you try to solve exercises |
| 2026-03-15 16:13:59 +0100 | <mesaoptimizer> | that's what I believe the essay states is the most effective strategy |
| 2026-03-15 16:14:01 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@62.45.136.136) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 16:14:52 +0100 | <mesaoptimizer> | gentauro: I feel like Haskell is likely easier to learn for people who didn't learn a traditional effectful impure imperative language |
| 2026-03-15 16:15:02 +0100 | <mesaoptimizer> | so au contraire |
| 2026-03-15 16:15:32 +0100 | arandombit | (~arandombi@user/arandombit) arandombit |
| 2026-03-15 16:18:44 +0100 | <c_wraith> | learning just about everything is most effective with a one-on-one mentor |
| 2026-03-15 16:20:42 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@62.45.136.136) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 16:21:59 +0100 | <mesaoptimizer> | I just realized that in my experience, I never could learn math in realtime in a one-on-one conversation with anyone experienced |
| 2026-03-15 16:23:07 +0100 | <mesaoptimizer> | people massively underestimate the deep bodies of knowledge they've built and try to walk you through an argument as if you've internalized the statement they've said a few seconds ago |
| 2026-03-15 16:23:40 +0100 | <mesaoptimizer> | its even worse if they are *bad* at this and get *frustrated* or worse, keep trying when you try to politely inform them of the futility of the attempt |
| 2026-03-15 16:25:31 +0100 | <c_wraith> | I didn't say it was easy to be a mentor! It's actually very hard to know when to stop explaining and say "try this on your own for a while and tell me you come up with" |
| 2026-03-15 16:32:02 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 16:37:05 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 16:45:00 +0100 | qqq | (~qqq@185.54.20.215) |
| 2026-03-15 16:46:17 +0100 | raincomplex | (~rain@user/raincomplex) (Quit: ZNC 1.8.2+deb2ubuntu0.1 - https://znc.in) |
| 2026-03-15 16:47:25 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 16:48:34 +0100 | raincomplex | (~rain@pool-173-54-183-192.nwrknj.fios.verizon.net) |
| 2026-03-15 16:48:34 +0100 | raincomplex | (~rain@pool-173-54-183-192.nwrknj.fios.verizon.net) (Changing host) |
| 2026-03-15 16:48:34 +0100 | raincomplex | (~rain@user/raincomplex) raincomplex |
| 2026-03-15 16:51:57 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 17:02:47 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 17:06:56 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 17:13:31 +0100 | spew | (~spew@user/spew) spew |
| 2026-03-15 17:13:56 +0100 | hiecaq | (~hiecaq@user/hiecaq) (Quit: ERC 5.6.0.30.1 (IRC client for GNU Emacs 30.2)) |
| 2026-03-15 17:17:51 +0100 | Digit | (~user@user/digit) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 17:18:12 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 17:18:23 +0100 | Digitteknohippie | (~user@user/digit) Digit |
| 2026-03-15 17:22:58 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 17:27:55 +0100 | emmanuelux | (~em@user/emmanuelux) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 17:33:31 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
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| 2026-03-15 17:43:33 +0100 | machinedgod | (~machinedg@d172-219-48-230.abhsia.telus.net) machinedgod |
| 2026-03-15 17:44:15 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 17:49:10 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 17:57:39 +0100 | madresch | (~Thunderbi@user/madresch) madresch |
| 2026-03-15 17:58:09 +0100 | Digitteknohippie | Digit |
| 2026-03-15 17:59:38 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 18:00:42 +0100 | madresch1 | (~Thunderbi@user/madresch) madresch |
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| 2026-03-15 18:02:11 +0100 | madresch1 | madresch |
| 2026-03-15 18:03:28 +0100 | marinelli | (~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/marinelli) marinelli |
| 2026-03-15 18:04:39 +0100 | arandombit | (~arandombi@user/arandombit) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 18:06:35 +0100 | spew | (~spew@user/spew) (Quit: nyaa~) |
| 2026-03-15 18:06:55 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 18:10:12 +0100 | bitdex | (~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 18:17:40 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 18:21:54 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 18:25:11 +0100 | arandombit | (~arandombi@user/arandombit) arandombit |
| 2026-03-15 18:33:02 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 18:37:22 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 18:45:15 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 18:47:06 +0100 | arandombit | (~arandombi@user/arandombit) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 18:49:39 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 18:51:05 +0100 | wickedjargon | (~user@S0106f89e28d5699a.vc.shawcable.net) wickedjargon |
| 2026-03-15 18:54:23 +0100 | madresch | (~Thunderbi@user/madresch) (Quit: madresch) |
| 2026-03-15 18:55:59 +0100 | <Rembane> | Math is ... math is never easy to learn nor to teach. IMHO. A compiler and some limit of the abstractions make things so much easier. |
| 2026-03-15 19:00:10 +0100 | pabs3 | (~pabs3@user/pabs3) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 19:00:38 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
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| 2026-03-15 19:11:18 +0100 | humasect | (~humasect@dyn-192-249-132-90.nexicom.net) humasect |
| 2026-03-15 19:11:36 +0100 | marinelli | (~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/marinelli) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-03-15 19:12:13 +0100 | marinelli | (~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/marinelli) marinelli |
| 2026-03-15 19:13:21 +0100 | pabs3 | (~pabs3@user/pabs3) pabs3 |
| 2026-03-15 19:16:00 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 19:20:14 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 19:31:22 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 19:36:13 +0100 | califax_ | (~califax@user/califx) califx |
| 2026-03-15 19:36:28 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
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| 2026-03-15 19:37:25 +0100 | califax_ | califax |
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| 2026-03-15 19:39:11 +0100 | marinelli | (~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/marinelli) marinelli |
| 2026-03-15 19:46:44 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 19:50:45 +0100 | sm__ | (~sm@66.8.200.171) |
| 2026-03-15 19:52:14 +0100 | sm__ | (~sm@66.8.200.171) (Client Quit) |
| 2026-03-15 19:53:15 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 19:53:20 +0100 | marinelli | (~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/marinelli) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-03-15 19:53:40 +0100 | marinelli | (~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/marinelli) marinelli |
| 2026-03-15 19:53:53 +0100 | arandombit | (~arandombi@user/arandombit) arandombit |
| 2026-03-15 19:53:54 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> mesaoptimizer: > a really nice essay |
| 2026-03-15 19:53:54 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | +1 |
| 2026-03-15 19:55:23 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> "stealing learning" was an interesting concept |
| 2026-03-15 19:58:12 +0100 | wootehfoot | (~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2026-03-15 19:59:48 +0100 | <gentauro> | Rembane: you can teach basic operation precedence with pattern matching ;) |
| 2026-03-15 20:00:03 +0100 | Sgeo | (~Sgeo@user/sgeo) Sgeo |
| 2026-03-15 20:00:16 +0100 | <Rembane> | gentauro: Are you thinking about the mnemonics or something else? :) |
| 2026-03-15 20:01:54 +0100 | <gentauro> | 18:55 < Rembane> Math is ... math is never easy to learn nor to teach … |
| 2026-03-15 20:02:27 +0100 | <Rembane> | gentauro: Ah. Got it. |
| 2026-03-15 20:03:55 +0100 | <gentauro> | I'm going to teach kidos (in April) how to make a basic calculator with FP ;) |
| 2026-03-15 20:04:07 +0100 | <Rembane> | Exciting! :) |
| 2026-03-15 20:04:08 +0100 | <gentauro> | (among other things) |
| 2026-03-15 20:04:18 +0100 | <Rembane> | Will it involve RPN? |
| 2026-03-15 20:04:51 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@62.45.136.136) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 20:05:51 +0100 | <EvanR> | is this calculator going to have a GUI |
| 2026-03-15 20:05:51 +0100 | <gentauro> | Rembane: we will start with an analog approach to MVU ;) https://imgur.com/a/bXA0MSw |
| 2026-03-15 20:05:54 +0100 | <gentauro> | xD |
| 2026-03-15 20:05:59 +0100 | <gentauro> | EvanR: it sure will |
| 2026-03-15 20:06:01 +0100 | <gentauro> | :P |
| 2026-03-15 20:06:03 +0100 | <EvanR> | wow what |
| 2026-03-15 20:06:19 +0100 | <EvanR> | I was sure you were going to have kids typing into a terminal emulator |
| 2026-03-15 20:06:31 +0100 | <gentauro> | EvanR: that would be to easy |
| 2026-03-15 20:06:50 +0100 | <Rembane> | Sweet! :D |
| 2026-03-15 20:06:51 +0100 | <EvanR> | as a kid who was typing into an apple II BASIC thing, was life changing |
| 2026-03-15 20:06:54 +0100 | <gentauro> | 3D printed numbers and (basick math) operations |
| 2026-03-15 20:07:05 +0100 | <gentauro> | a notebook for immutable traces |
| 2026-03-15 20:07:15 +0100 | <gentauro> | and then a marker to update state |
| 2026-03-15 20:07:21 +0100 | <EvanR> | whoa |
| 2026-03-15 20:07:24 +0100 | <gentauro> | oh, the buttons are just post its :D |
| 2026-03-15 20:07:58 +0100 | <gentauro> | when you put 5-6 kids to work concurrently with that, they actually do a good job |
| 2026-03-15 20:08:18 +0100 | <gentauro> | then I tell, go home and tell your (dev) parents that you are doing concurrent FP :P |
| 2026-03-15 20:08:21 +0100 | <gentauro> | hehe |
| 2026-03-15 20:09:02 +0100 | <gentauro> | 20:06 < EvanR> I was sure you were going to have kids typing into a terminal emulator |
| 2026-03-15 20:09:31 +0100 | <gentauro> | once they grasp the notions, we move to Elm (Ellie to be more precise) |
| 2026-03-15 20:09:32 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@62.45.136.136) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 20:12:09 +0100 | glguy | (glguy@libera/staff/glguy) (Ping timeout: 615 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 20:12:10 +0100 | diabloblanco | (~diablobla@user/diabloblanco) diabloblanco |
| 2026-03-15 20:12:35 +0100 | glguy | (glguy@libera/staff/glguy) glguy |
| 2026-03-15 20:14:14 +0100 | diabloblanco | (~diablobla@user/diabloblanco) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-03-15 20:14:21 +0100 | humasect | (~humasect@dyn-192-249-132-90.nexicom.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-03-15 20:14:37 +0100 | <Rembane> | This Ellie? https://ellie-app.com/new |
| 2026-03-15 20:14:45 +0100 | <gentauro> | Rembane: yes |
| 2026-03-15 20:15:15 +0100 | <gentauro> | It's quite nice as it stores state. So kidos can work when going home and send link when asking for help |
| 2026-03-15 20:15:54 +0100 | <Rembane> | That sounds like a nice way to work |
| 2026-03-15 20:17:01 +0100 | diabloblanco | (~diablobla@user/diabloblanco) diabloblanco |
| 2026-03-15 20:17:09 +0100 | <gentauro> | I've tried other ways by using local setups and you spend all time setting up infra (IDE, compilers, … and cross devices -> Apple, Windows and Linux) |
| 2026-03-15 20:17:18 +0100 | <gentauro> | Ellie SPA "just works" (Y) |
| 2026-03-15 20:17:38 +0100 | <geekosaur> | . o O { famous last words } |
| 2026-03-15 20:18:35 +0100 | <gentauro> | geekosaur: xD |
| 2026-03-15 20:18:50 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | the "you spend all time setting up infra" is true though |
| 2026-03-15 20:18:55 +0100 | <gentauro> | I tried the `F# + Fable` approach (heavily dependant on `npm`) and that was NO BUENO :'( |
| 2026-03-15 20:19:05 +0100 | <gentauro> | tomsmeding: exactly |
| 2026-03-15 20:19:06 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | it's true even in a university bachelor |
| 2026-03-15 20:19:41 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | true, there most students figure it out, but there's always a couple with a sufficiently aggressive virus scanner that breaks ghcup or something |
| 2026-03-15 20:20:00 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | or not that but something unfathomable that nobody can figure out |
| 2026-03-15 20:21:08 +0100 | <Rembane> | The hardware is simply cursed by an old witch |
| 2026-03-15 20:22:00 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | I co-ran a course using haskell for ~190 students for 3 years, and I think 2 out of 3 times we had a student where we just gave up |
| 2026-03-15 20:22:05 +0100 | <gentauro> | wasn't it Joe Armstrong that gave a talk about how they setup two identical machines with Windows. 20 mins later, they had a totally diff setup |
| 2026-03-15 20:22:17 +0100 | <gentauro> | hw + os + sw :( |
| 2026-03-15 20:22:29 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <ijouw> I do workshops in schools and most have centrally administered computers. Installing something is a matter of years. |
| 2026-03-15 20:22:56 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | fun! |
| 2026-03-15 20:22:57 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <ijouw> Someone ported microhs to web (search xeus-haskell) |
| 2026-03-15 20:23:04 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | the workshops, that is |
| 2026-03-15 20:23:37 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <ijouw> Yes |
| 2026-03-15 20:23:39 +0100 | humasect | (~humasect@dyn-192-249-132-90.nexicom.net) humasect |
| 2026-03-15 20:24:12 +0100 | <gentauro> | ijouw: one kido borrowed his fathers (work) laptop (he is a cook that also does accouting and order stuff and such) |
| 2026-03-15 20:24:22 +0100 | <gentauro> | yeah, kido decided to make it all go away (as you do) xD |
| 2026-03-15 20:24:40 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | no backups? |
| 2026-03-15 20:24:55 +0100 | <gentauro> | tomsmeding: nope |
| 2026-03-15 20:25:00 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | oh no xD |
| 2026-03-15 20:25:31 +0100 | <gentauro> | at least the kid got his own laptop after that |
| 2026-03-15 20:25:41 +0100 | gentauro | kido was playing 4D chess |
| 2026-03-15 20:25:55 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | lol |
| 2026-03-15 20:26:39 +0100 | <gentauro> | btw, actually the kidos I will teach in april are all girls :o |
| 2026-03-15 20:28:09 +0100 | <gentauro> | lets hope they join the FP-madness !!! |
| 2026-03-15 20:29:40 +0100 | somemathguy | (~somemathg@user/somemathguy) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-03-15 20:29:43 +0100 | <Rembane> | \o/ |
| 2026-03-15 20:29:53 +0100 | diabloblanco | (~diablobla@user/diabloblanco) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-03-15 20:30:00 +0100 | tomku | (~tomku@user/tomku) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 20:37:59 +0100 | <gentauro> | 20:22 <+haskellbridge> <ijouw> Someone ported microhs to web (search xeus-haskell) |
| 2026-03-15 20:38:08 +0100 | <gentauro> | wow, missed that one :o https://jupyter-xeus.github.io/xeus-haskell/lab/index.html |
| 2026-03-15 20:39:09 +0100 | emmanuelux | (~em@user/emmanuelux) emmanuelux |
| 2026-03-15 20:46:18 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <ijouw> I only noticed because i read through most of the microhs github issues/discussion page |
| 2026-03-15 20:46:26 +0100 | craunts795335385 | (~craunts@152.32.99.2) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 20:47:46 +0100 | wootehfoot | (~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot) wootehfoot |
| 2026-03-15 20:48:05 +0100 | <gentauro> | thx for sharing |
| 2026-03-15 20:50:18 +0100 | Lord_of_Life_ | (~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915) Lord_of_Life |
| 2026-03-15 20:51:09 +0100 | Lord_of_Life | (~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 20:53:12 +0100 | Lord_of_Life_ | Lord_of_Life |
| 2026-03-15 20:56:29 +0100 | jreicher | (~joelr@user/jreicher) (Quit: In transit) |
| 2026-03-15 21:14:28 +0100 | humasect | (~humasect@dyn-192-249-132-90.nexicom.net) (Quit: Leaving...) |
| 2026-03-15 21:28:26 +0100 | michalz | (~michalz@185.246.207.193) |
| 2026-03-15 21:33:09 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 21:37:54 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 21:43:59 +0100 | wickedjargon | (~user@S0106f89e28d5699a.vc.shawcable.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-03-15 21:44:54 +0100 | wootehfoot | (~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2026-03-15 21:48:10 +0100 | karenw | (~karenw@user/karenw) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-03-15 21:48:30 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 21:51:57 +0100 | <sshine> | tomsmeding, I work somewhere where everyone has to use Windows. (fortunately, WSL has gotten better, and there is numtide/system-manager for Nix on Ubuntu) what I experience isn't that Windows is unmanageable, but rather that the average developer on Windows isn't the master of their own operating system, they more or less randomly use it and don't know what's under the hood, and so they can't help |
| 2026-03-15 21:52:03 +0100 | <sshine> | themselves when stuff breaks. |
| 2026-03-15 21:52:43 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | sshine: I see |
| 2026-03-15 21:52:57 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | and then because I don't know windows either, together we get no further |
| 2026-03-15 21:53:22 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 21:53:31 +0100 | <newmind> | sshine: a lot of windows installation in a corporate settings are also managed, so it's not even that they are not interested in it, it's often simply not permitted |
| 2026-03-15 21:53:33 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | while WSL is fine, in the course we tried to let students work on windows native instead of in the VM |
| 2026-03-15 21:53:54 +0100 | <newmind> | (and with windows 11+ that more and more applies for private use too) |
| 2026-03-15 21:54:24 +0100 | <sshine> | WSL + VSCode's client-server thingy, you can have the developer environment in Linux and the GUI on Windows. |
| 2026-03-15 21:54:26 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | and on windows native you notice very acutely that lots of the tooling we're used to comes from the unix world, so e.g. getting a shell with ghc and git both available is a challenge |
| 2026-03-15 21:54:49 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | yep that's what we did in earlier years, it worked okay |
| 2026-03-15 21:55:13 +0100 | <sshine> | I didn't like devcontainers, but having the WSL VM be the server-side feels better. |
| 2026-03-15 21:55:13 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | you get issues like students having Github Desktop on the windows side and git on the linux side and them not agreeing on line endings and such |
| 2026-03-15 21:55:40 +0100 | <sshine> | yeah, line endings. I experience that Windows users don't know what that is. |
| 2026-03-15 21:56:11 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | earlier because we had heavy dependencies (we fixed that last year) we also had a dev container inside WSL, and then SSH access with git was extremely finicky |
| 2026-03-15 21:56:15 +0100 | <sshine> | for the projects I service at work, I try to stay consistent per-file. |
| 2026-03-15 21:56:27 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | "I try to stay consistent per file" the horror |
| 2026-03-15 21:58:05 +0100 | <mesaoptimizer> | https://hackage.haskell.org/package/time is this really the standard datetime library that Haskell users use? |
| 2026-03-15 21:58:09 +0100 | <sshine> | there are so many ways to garble line endings. people use all kinds of tools configured differently. I haven't seen two setups being the same. some do most things from PowerShell, but a few switch between WSL and PowerShell, and yet fewer use only WSL; but do the files live in Windows or in Linux? do we assume case sensitive filenames? |
| 2026-03-15 21:58:23 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | mesaoptimizer: generally, yes |
| 2026-03-15 21:58:50 +0100 | <newmind> | sshine: then you have wsl1 vs wsl2, which function completely differently |
| 2026-03-15 21:58:58 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | wsl1 shall not be used |
| 2026-03-15 21:59:02 +0100 | <mesaoptimizer> | I ask because `fromGregorian` docs state: " Invalid values will be clipped to the correct range, month first, then day." |
| 2026-03-15 21:59:16 +0100 | <mesaoptimizer> | which is a rather impressive silent failure |
| 2026-03-15 21:59:26 +0100 | <newmind> | oh, and if you really want to add another fun layer, add in cygwin too |
| 2026-03-15 22:00:05 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | mesaoptimizer: fromGregorianValid? |
| 2026-03-15 22:00:07 +0100 | <sshine> | mesaoptimizer, https://web.archive.org/web/20211225193627/https://jacobstanley.io/3-packages-you-need-to-know-abo… |
| 2026-03-15 22:02:09 +0100 | <sshine> | newmind, my students use Cygwin via "Git Bash" which comes with when you install git on Windows. |
| 2026-03-15 22:02:23 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | isn't that minGW? |
| 2026-03-15 22:02:27 +0100 | <sshine> | oh, right |
| 2026-03-15 22:02:33 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | a rather different beast :) |
| 2026-03-15 22:03:14 +0100 | <sshine> | I like how "Git Bash" kind of works in spite of all the brokenness of trying to marry Unix tools with Windows. |
| 2026-03-15 22:03:32 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | but do you have ghc in git bash? |
| 2026-03-15 22:03:32 +0100 | <newmind> | didn't microsoft include some unix tools/compability with windows itself once? |
| 2026-03-15 22:03:50 +0100 | jreicher | (~joelr@user/jreicher) jreicher |
| 2026-03-15 22:04:01 +0100 | <davean> | sshine: Only one of those handles TAI, and only partially at that? |
| 2026-03-15 22:04:14 +0100 | <davean> | And if you care about time, you'll be using TAI so ... |
| 2026-03-15 22:05:27 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | I do not usually care about time enough to make the effort to deal with leap seconds |
| 2026-03-15 22:05:48 +0100 | fernando-basso | (~fernando-@2a01:4f9:c012:63d3::1) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 22:06:31 +0100 | fernando-basso | (~fernando-@2a01:4f9:c012:63d3::1) fernando-basso |
| 2026-03-15 22:08:07 +0100 | <geekosaur> | newmind, Windows 2000 had a POSIX subsystem. It didn't play along well with native stuff, didn't work well by itself, and was abandoned |
| 2026-03-15 22:08:22 +0100 | <geekosaur> | WSL2 exists but is hasically a single-seat Hyper-V |
| 2026-03-15 22:08:28 +0100 | <geekosaur> | *basically |
| 2026-03-15 22:08:39 +0100 | <newmind> | yeah, i seemed to recall something like that, and also that is was mostly a flop that got dropped |
| 2026-03-15 22:08:44 +0100 | <geekosaur> | (by default running Ubuntu but you can find instructions for installing other distros) |
| 2026-03-15 22:08:45 +0100 | <mesaoptimizer> | sshine: thanks |
| 2026-03-15 22:08:50 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | it's a VM in essentially all important ways |
| 2026-03-15 22:09:10 +0100 | <newmind> | and wsl1 is basically a reverse wine, right? |
| 2026-03-15 22:09:17 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | it just has a bit of polish like auto-mounting of its disk as a network drive on the windows side |
| 2026-03-15 22:09:17 +0100 | <geekosaur> | yes |
| 2026-03-15 22:09:19 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | yes |
| 2026-03-15 22:09:26 +0100 | francois_y | (~Thunderbi@bras-vprn-toroon4839w-lp130-02-142-113-110-153.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 2026-03-15 22:09:29 +0100 | <geekosaur> | it also worked poorly, which is why WSL2 is a Hyper-V |
| 2026-03-15 22:09:54 +0100 | <mesaoptimizer> | tomsmeding: I did use `fromGregorianValid`, I was just dismayed by the existence of a function that fails silently. (and it exists in the `thyme` package with silent failure too) |
| 2026-03-15 22:09:58 +0100 | <newmind> | but also comes with all virtualization costs, and running an extra kernel, etc... good that ram got so inexpensive :P |
| 2026-03-15 22:10:31 +0100 | <geekosaur> | WSL1 was also a separate kernel; remember that modern Windows is a microkernel architecture |
| 2026-03-15 22:11:02 +0100 | <geekosaur> | WSL1 was a heavily hacked Linux single server running alongside the Windows microkernel services |
| 2026-03-15 22:12:02 +0100 | <newmind> | but the wsl1 applicaions run in the same memory space as windows executables? |
| 2026-03-15 22:12:03 +0100 | <geekosaur> | it wanted its own filesystem, in particular; you could access Windows files but via Samba IIRC |
| 2026-03-15 22:12:17 +0100 | takuan | (~takuan@d8D86B9E9.access.telenet.be) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 22:12:32 +0100 | <geekosaur> | yes |
| 2026-03-15 22:13:53 +0100 | <newmind> | so technically it might have even been the "better" approach, but comes with a whole lot of edge cases and compability to implement, while the wsl2/hypervisor approach basically fully works out of the box and you just need to implement how you interact with it |
| 2026-03-15 22:13:56 +0100 | <sshine> | WSL uses 9p |
| 2026-03-15 22:14:01 +0100 | <geekosaur> | compatibility was pretty poor |
| 2026-03-15 22:14:03 +0100 | <sshine> | WSL2, sorry |
| 2026-03-15 22:14:25 +0100 | <sshine> | which is great but slow |
| 2026-03-15 22:15:17 +0100 | francois_y | (~Thunderbi@bras-vprn-toroon4839w-lp130-02-142-113-110-153.dsl.bell.ca) (Quit: francois_y) |
| 2026-03-15 22:15:32 +0100 | <geekosaur> | and yes, technically it couldl have been made to work better, but (a) would have been a massive effort (b) which would probably have needed to be redone every new kernel release, since rewiring a Linux standalone kernel as a single server is a massive undertaking |
| 2026-03-15 22:16:09 +0100 | somemathguy | (~somemathg@user/somemathguy) somemathguy |
| 2026-03-15 22:16:27 +0100 | <newmind> | you kind of see it in wine too, always playing catch-up with any api changes or new libraries/applications that expose new edge cases |
| 2026-03-15 22:19:17 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 22:20:43 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <ijouw> I only remember that using wsl git on windows filesystem failed (some while back, don't know if wsl2 was available yet). |
| 2026-03-15 22:20:45 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | My windows laptop is rarely used and somehow forgot how to strip executables (i think 32/64 bit mismatch). |
| 2026-03-15 22:24:19 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 22:24:25 +0100 | <jreicher> | gentauro: Re teaching kids RPN; any particular reason that over PN? (I know RPN is more common, but I wonder what reasons people really have beyond popularity) |
| 2026-03-15 22:25:01 +0100 | <geekosaur> | RPN leads itself to simple stack-based implementations |
| 2026-03-15 22:25:12 +0100 | <jreicher> | PN does also. That's why I'm asking. |
| 2026-03-15 22:25:40 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | isn't it a control stack with PN and a data stack with RPN? |
| 2026-03-15 22:26:14 +0100 | <jreicher> | If you consider the operators on input to be control, then yes, but they're input... |
| 2026-03-15 22:27:25 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | what is the implementation you have in mind for PN? A stack of operators, and each number you see slots into the next available argument slot of the topmost stack entry; if that operator is now full, it becomes a number and falls down? |
| 2026-03-15 22:27:43 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | that's a least a _little_ more complicated than "a stack of numbers" |
| 2026-03-15 22:28:08 +0100 | Guest62t | (~Guest62t@p200300ca8f3baa00c0ef77f2b149c10e.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Quit: Client closed) |
| 2026-03-15 22:28:30 +0100 | <jreicher> | PN is particularly nice in FP (IMO). The operators can be curried, so if you see a number, pop the function at the top, apply it to the number, and push. |
| 2026-03-15 22:28:58 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | and loop |
| 2026-03-15 22:29:03 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | you don't need to loop with RPN |
| 2026-03-15 22:29:14 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | (I'm digging for arguments here) |
| 2026-03-15 22:29:24 +0100 | <jreicher> | You need an input loop for both. |
| 2026-03-15 22:29:41 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | yeah, but with PN, a single input symbol may trigger an unbounded number of stack operations, right? |
| 2026-03-15 22:30:47 +0100 | <jreicher> | Yes. You do need to check if the result of the application is another (curried) operator or a number. If it's a number then you do something else. But I'm not sure that's very different from checking the type of the next token on input. |
| 2026-03-15 22:31:07 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | you have a nested loop instead of a single loop |
| 2026-03-15 22:31:26 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | I'm not sure if this makes it "significantly" more complicated. I'm playing devil's advocate here a little. But it's a difference at least |
| 2026-03-15 22:32:15 +0100 | <jreicher> | I see what you mean. I wonder if it's possible to do it with a single loop. My hunch is it is. |
| 2026-03-15 22:33:23 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <ijouw> Do you mean you can unify the loops (definitly) or use a different algorithm with only input loop? |
| 2026-03-15 22:33:25 +0100 | bitdex | (~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) bitdex |
| 2026-03-15 22:34:01 +0100 | <jreicher> | Both, actually. I was just thinking this might be a nice way of teaching tail calls. If the result of the operator application is a number, recurse to another application. |
| 2026-03-15 22:34:06 +0100 | <jreicher> | (with a pop) |
| 2026-03-15 22:35:16 +0100 | <jreicher> | It kind of makes explicit that stack of continuations that are in the Haskell runtime. Also perhaps a nice way of teaching that concept. |
| 2026-03-15 22:36:33 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 22:38:33 +0100 | humasect | (~humasect@dyn-192-249-132-90.nexicom.net) humasect |
| 2026-03-15 22:43:38 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 22:44:24 +0100 | hakutaku | (~textual@user/hakutaku) hakutaku |
| 2026-03-15 22:49:14 +0100 | qqq | (~qqq@185.54.20.215) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-03-15 22:54:37 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 22:58:47 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 22:59:34 +0100 | michalz | (~michalz@185.246.207.193) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-03-15 23:01:35 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | jreicher: I'm with you, but I think we can agree that having to introduce the idea of tail calls in order to achieve a single loop is more complicated than RPN's... single loop |
| 2026-03-15 23:02:51 +0100 | bitdex | (~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-03-15 23:03:14 +0100 | bitdex | (~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) bitdex |
| 2026-03-15 23:09:58 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 23:10:34 +0100 | <jreicher> | I'm not sure. I'm inclined to think it depends on the programmer's mental model of runtime, and that PN is the functional way and RPN is the imperative way. So the latter is easier if you presuppose an imperative mental model, but should we...? (I'm not sure I can argue this hunch, but I feel it strongly; it's the control stack vs data stack) |
| 2026-03-15 23:11:28 +0100 | <mesaoptimizer> | https://coalton-lang.github.io/20260312-coalton0p2/ coalton is now less Haskell and more common lisp than before |
| 2026-03-15 23:11:52 +0100 | <jreicher> | A possible argument might run like this. The most "optimal" way to evaluate a long sum (for example) is RPN, because the expression can be held outside the program (on input) while evaluation is being done. But this "relies" on the effectful nature of the world. |
| 2026-03-15 23:14:17 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 23:24:54 +0100 | <EvanR> | that sounds more like streaming is more efficient than buffering, rather than a prefix postfix thing |
| 2026-03-15 23:25:10 +0100 | weary-traveler | (~user@user/user363627) user363627 |
| 2026-03-15 23:25:21 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 23:25:36 +0100 | <jreicher> | Yes, with the (predictable?) observation that only postfix can be streamed. |
| 2026-03-15 23:26:05 +0100 | <EvanR> | this sounds very mixing up levels of abstraction. RPN is a notation not an implementation backend |
| 2026-03-15 23:26:17 +0100 | <EvanR> | syntax vs (operational) semantics |
| 2026-03-15 23:26:36 +0100 | <EvanR> | with the bridge being a compiler as usual |
| 2026-03-15 23:26:49 +0100 | <jreicher> | I know. But I'm asking why RPN is a preferred example for an "implementation of something". I think the nature of that question mixes things, necessarily. |
| 2026-03-15 23:29:23 +0100 | <EvanR> | ok a calculator based on RPN is like a combination of programming language and UI in one |
| 2026-03-15 23:30:00 +0100 | <EvanR> | I guess it's simple enough there's not much room for philosophizing |
| 2026-03-15 23:30:19 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 23:32:09 +0100 | <Rembane> | Also, stacks are neat! |
| 2026-03-15 23:37:19 +0100 | craunts795335385 | (~craunts@152.32.99.2) |
| 2026-03-15 23:40:43 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-03-15 23:42:31 +0100 | craunts795335385 | (~craunts@152.32.99.2) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 23:45:19 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 23:49:31 +0100 | euphores | (~SASL_euph@user/euphores) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-03-15 23:56:04 +0100 | euphores | (~SASL_euph@user/euphores) euphores |
| 2026-03-15 23:56:06 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |