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2025-06-03 01:59:09 +0200 <EvanR> haskell type system could be construed as constructive: you start with nothing and can do nothing until you define new types, then you can create values according to the rules made so far, and that's it, until you define more types. In elixir's upcoming type system and typescript it's destructive. You start with a universe of possible values and the types divide the universe up into smaller and smaller subsets
2025-06-03 01:59:48 +0200 <EvanR> in some blog somewhere they argue that the first way gives you more stuff and goes farther, though the second way would be nice to have
2025-06-03 02:00:33 +0200 <EvanR> however now I'm wondering if they are even comparable because the universe is infinite, and dividing infinite space into infinite subspaces is not necessarily less
2025-06-03 02:00:42 +0200 <monochrom> Does it say what is nice about the second way?
2025-06-03 02:01:24 +0200 <EvanR> having the ability to control subtypes and restrict the values in a meticulous way, like liquid haskell
2025-06-03 02:01:31 +0200 <EvanR> they say it would be nice
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2025-06-03 02:04:24 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2025-06-03 02:05:22 +0200 <EvanR> @where typescript
2025-06-03 02:05:23 +0200 <lambdabot> I know nothing about typescript.
2025-06-03 02:06:35 +0200 <monochrom> I have trouble believing that elixir and typescript have refinement types (what liquid haskell does). (In my world they are called predicate subtypes.)
2025-06-03 02:07:36 +0200 <monochrom> But I wouldn't be surprised if their "subtype" just means the OOP kind, i.e., row subtypes. (A subtype has more fields than the supertype.)
2025-06-03 02:08:09 +0200 <monochrom> In that case, it's just "OOP would be nice".
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2025-06-03 02:09:26 +0200 <EvanR> they can't divide integers up or floats
2025-06-03 02:09:57 +0200 <EvanR> but they can divide e.g. list of a into non-empty list of a and general list of a
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2025-06-03 02:10:50 +0200 <EvanR> and list of a into list of integer, list of float
2025-06-03 02:11:04 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 02:11:24 +0200 <EvanR> and through "intersection types" they can divide functions up in weird ways
2025-06-03 02:12:05 +0200 <EvanR> so it goes beyond row types
2025-06-03 02:13:42 +0200 <EvanR> e.g. a function which accepts int or bool and returns string "has type" intersection of int->string and bool->string
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2025-06-03 02:17:39 +0200jmcantrell(~weechat@user/jmcantrell) jmcantrell
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2025-06-03 02:22:19 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> Scala does something like that with functions in regards to subtypes. Uh
2025-06-03 02:22:44 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> There was a term for it, when youre doing generics there, you specify [A+] i think?
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2025-06-03 02:23:17 +0200 <monochrom> covariant, contravariant, invariant
2025-06-03 02:23:23 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> Exactly
2025-06-03 02:23:26 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> Thanks
2025-06-03 02:23:41 +0200 <EvanR> looks like I might even be wrong about dividing up the basic types. You could do something like, a type which means exactly some string
2025-06-03 02:23:55 +0200swistak(~swistak@185.21.216.141) (Quit: bye bye)
2025-06-03 02:23:58 +0200 <EvanR> then union several of these together to get only string1, string2, or string3
2025-06-03 02:24:14 +0200swistak(~swistak@185.21.216.141)
2025-06-03 02:24:14 +0200 <EvanR> which is a subtype of the type of "any string"
2025-06-03 02:24:18 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> We learned that during a course in uni, just forgot the name. But yeah say "Int | Float" is a superclass of "Int" and also of "Float" than in scala it would work with the functions
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2025-06-03 02:24:44 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> *than -> then
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2025-06-03 02:25:41 +0200 <EvanR> Int and Float being subtypes of Int|Float definitely makes more sense than one of them being a subtype of the other
2025-06-03 02:25:45 +0200 <monochrom> In most languages, unlike Haskell, string is a basic type, too. :)
2025-06-03 02:26:37 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> Like, int is a subtype of float, but encoding that in a programming language is yikes
2025-06-03 02:26:47 +0200 <EvanR> no it is notttttttt
2025-06-03 02:26:56 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> Assuming infinite size
2025-06-03 02:27:03 +0200 <EvanR> infinite size what, int? xD
2025-06-03 02:27:12 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> Both :P
2025-06-03 02:27:18 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> So i guess i mean integral and real
2025-06-03 02:27:27 +0200 <EvanR> infinite float is pretty rare compared to int
2025-06-03 02:27:33 +0200 <monochrom> I can agree that 32-bit int is a subtype of 64-bit double-precision float. >:)
2025-06-03 02:27:44 +0200 <EvanR> that checks
2025-06-03 02:28:08 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> Well yes, which is why i said if you look at the math side, infinitely sized ints are subtypes of floats. But encoding that in a programming language is yikes :P
2025-06-03 02:28:37 +0200 <EvanR> Z "is a subset of" reals... this is also yikes xD
2025-06-03 02:28:37 +0200 <monochrom> If you say "float" then it is finite size.
2025-06-03 02:29:26 +0200ljdarj1(~Thunderbi@user/ljdarj) ljdarj
2025-06-03 02:29:26 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> Its 2am, ill excuse my shitty terminology on account of that
2025-06-03 02:29:32 +0200 <EvanR> there's an order preserving or monoid preserving or ring preserving function from Z to R
2025-06-03 02:29:54 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> EvanR how so? On the also yikes part
2025-06-03 02:30:01 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> In my head it checks out
2025-06-03 02:30:07 +0200 <EvanR> but that's getting away with this "one universe" theory of dynamic languages
2025-06-03 02:30:13 +0200 <EvanR> getting away from
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2025-06-03 02:31:26 +0200 <monochrom> I thought the whole point of a one-universe theory is that Z can be safely a subset of R!
2025-06-03 02:31:38 +0200 <EvanR> yeah
2025-06-03 02:31:49 +0200 <monochrom> (And both being subsets of the one universe.)
2025-06-03 02:31:59 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> Im lost, im gonna go sleep, im too tired for this discussion i think
2025-06-03 02:32:02 +0200 <EvanR> in the chaotic period of 1920s math the one universe theory didn't yet win the debate
2025-06-03 02:32:05 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> Gn
2025-06-03 02:32:26 +0200 <EvanR> everything was separate unless you could prove an inclusion or isomorphism
2025-06-03 02:32:30 +0200 <monochrom> (And OK we have to s/set/something else/ lest a Russell paradox arises.)
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2025-06-03 02:37:08 +0200 <EvanR> additive synthesis, first you create N then using it create Z then ... eventually get R. subtractive synthesis, just say Z or R is this or that subset of surreals xD
2025-06-03 02:37:43 +0200 <EvanR> using schema of specification
2025-06-03 02:38:06 +0200 <monochrom> If you dig deeper, eventually it is just "is math invented or discovered" again.
2025-06-03 02:40:05 +0200 <EvanR> also is it dependent on or independent of logic
2025-06-03 02:40:25 +0200 <EvanR> or vice versa
2025-06-03 02:40:46 +0200 <monochrom> Whenever you think, you use some kind of logic.
2025-06-03 02:40:57 +0200 <monochrom> If you don't think, then WTF are you doing?!
2025-06-03 02:41:46 +0200 <EvanR> then you're an LLM
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2025-06-03 03:03:10 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 03:03:36 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 03:06:07 +0200paotsaq(~paotsaq@127.209.37.188.rev.vodafone.pt) paotsaq
2025-06-03 03:06:24 +0200qaotsap(~paotsaq@2001:818:ea0e:8300:6733:50c0:6d2:30c2) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2025-06-03 03:06:25 +0200Guest74(~Guest74@2605:a601:a88f:0:981e:3b52:4ed8:7c43) (Quit: Client closed)
2025-06-03 03:09:22 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 03:09:45 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 03:09:46 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2025-06-03 03:14:31 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
2025-06-03 03:17:06 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 03:17:28 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 03:21:14 +0200yin(~z@user/zero) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
2025-06-03 03:21:32 +0200Frostillicus(~Frostilli@pool-71-174-119-69.bstnma.fios.verizon.net)
2025-06-03 03:24:24 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 03:24:48 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 03:25:34 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2025-06-03 03:26:05 +0200yin(~z@user/zero) zero
2025-06-03 03:27:09 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 03:27:37 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 03:28:30 +0200humasect(~humasect@dyn-192-249-132-90.nexicom.net) humasect
2025-06-03 03:30:29 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2025-06-03 03:33:22 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 03:33:44 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 03:36:13 +0200humasect(~humasect@dyn-192-249-132-90.nexicom.net) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2025-06-03 03:41:08 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 03:41:22 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2025-06-03 03:41:31 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 03:46:25 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2025-06-03 03:49:13 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 03:49:37 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 03:55:45 +0200Frostillicus(~Frostilli@pool-71-174-119-69.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2025-06-03 03:57:09 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2025-06-03 03:57:28 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 03:57:53 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 04:02:04 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2025-06-03 04:03:29 +0200j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-06-03 04:04:25 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 04:04:51 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 04:09:09 +0200j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37
2025-06-03 04:10:02 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-06-03 04:10:11 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2025-06-03 04:10:25 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 04:15:23 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
2025-06-03 04:17:30 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 04:17:52 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 04:21:11 +0200machinedgod(~machinedg@d108-173-18-100.abhsia.telus.net) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
2025-06-03 04:23:13 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 04:23:37 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 04:25:57 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2025-06-03 04:28:23 +0200humasect(~humasect@dyn-192-249-132-90.nexicom.net) humasect
2025-06-03 04:29:13 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 04:29:40 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 04:30:49 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2025-06-03 04:33:30 +0200humasect(~humasect@dyn-192-249-132-90.nexicom.net) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2025-06-03 04:33:43 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 04:34:10 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 04:41:18 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 04:41:29 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2025-06-03 04:41:41 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 04:46:25 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2025-06-03 04:47:04 +0200down200(~down200@shell.lug.mtu.edu) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2025-06-03 04:47:07 +0200down200-(~down200@shell.lug.mtu.edu) down200
2025-06-03 04:47:43 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 04:48:07 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 04:51:51 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 04:52:15 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 04:56:49 +0200td_(~td@i53870908.versanet.de) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2025-06-03 04:57:16 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2025-06-03 04:58:17 +0200td_(~td@i53870931.versanet.de) td_
2025-06-03 04:58:22 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-06-03 04:58:46 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 05:01:59 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
2025-06-03 05:04:30 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 05:04:54 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 05:11:22 +0200xff0x(~xff0x@fsb6a9491c.tkyc517.ap.nuro.jp)
2025-06-03 05:11:28 +0200tavare(~tavare@user/tavare) tavare
2025-06-03 05:12:01 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 05:12:20 +0200tavare(~tavare@user/tavare) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 05:12:24 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 05:13:04 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2025-06-03 05:19:03 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 05:19:28 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 05:20:13 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2025-06-03 05:25:31 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 05:25:55 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 05:31:00 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 05:31:07 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2025-06-03 05:31:21 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 05:33:34 +0200trickard(~trickard@cpe-51-98-47-163.wireline.com.au) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-06-03 05:33:48 +0200trickard(~trickard@cpe-51-98-47-163.wireline.com.au)
2025-06-03 05:35:47 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
2025-06-03 05:38:03 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 05:38:26 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 05:43:52 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 05:44:13 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 05:46:55 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2025-06-03 05:51:39 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2025-06-03 05:52:07 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 05:52:32 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 05:59:04 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 05:59:28 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 06:02:30 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2025-06-03 06:06:18 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 06:06:44 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 06:07:13 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2025-06-03 06:14:03 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 06:14:26 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 06:18:55 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 06:19:17 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 06:20:14 +0200peterbecich(~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) peterbecich
2025-06-03 06:23:18 +0200peterbecich(~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) (Client Quit)
2025-06-03 06:23:53 +0200peterbecich(~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) peterbecich
2025-06-03 06:25:51 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 06:26:16 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 06:26:55 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2025-06-03 06:26:55 +0200trickard(~trickard@cpe-51-98-47-163.wireline.com.au) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-06-03 06:27:09 +0200trickard(~trickard@cpe-51-98-47-163.wireline.com.au)
2025-06-03 06:31:55 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
2025-06-03 06:33:07 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 06:33:30 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 06:38:22 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 06:38:45 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 06:42:41 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2025-06-03 06:43:30 +0200remmie(ianremsen@tilde.team) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2025-06-03 06:43:57 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 06:44:22 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 06:46:43 +0200vulpine(~xfnw@user/meow/xfnw) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
2025-06-03 06:47:20 +0200bitdex(~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 06:47:50 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2025-06-03 06:47:51 +0200bitdex(~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) bitdex
2025-06-03 06:48:23 +0200vulpine(~xfnw@user/meow/xfnw) xfnw
2025-06-03 06:50:18 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 06:50:39 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 06:54:31 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 06:54:56 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 06:58:07 +0200Lord_of_Life_(~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915) Lord_of_Life
2025-06-03 06:58:28 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2025-06-03 06:58:48 +0200Lord_of_Life(~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2025-06-03 06:59:01 +0200harveypwca(~harveypwc@2601:246:d080:f6e0:27d6:8cc7:eca9:c46c) (Quit: Leaving)
2025-06-03 06:59:14 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 06:59:28 +0200Digit(~user@user/digit) Digit
2025-06-03 06:59:29 +0200Lord_of_Life_Lord_of_Life
2025-06-03 06:59:37 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 07:03:35 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
2025-06-03 07:04:00 +0200Digitdigitteknohippie
2025-06-03 07:06:35 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 07:07:02 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 07:12:12 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2025-06-03 07:13:17 +0200ChaiTRex(~ChaiTRex@user/chaitrex) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 07:13:34 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 07:13:43 +0200ChaiTRex(~ChaiTRex@user/chaitrex) ChaiTRex
2025-06-03 07:14:00 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 07:14:35 +0200j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-06-03 07:15:20 +0200ChaiTRex(~ChaiTRex@user/chaitrex) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 07:17:07 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2025-06-03 07:17:41 +0200j1n37(~j1n37@user/j1n37) j1n37
2025-06-03 07:19:38 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 07:19:40 +0200digitteknohippieDigit
2025-06-03 07:20:09 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 07:20:42 +0200puke(~puke@user/puke) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 07:21:07 +0200puke(~puke@user/puke) puke
2025-06-03 07:22:08 +0200Unicorn_Princess(~Unicorn_P@user/Unicorn-Princess/x-3540542) Unicorn_Princess
2025-06-03 07:24:19 +0200ChaiTRex(~ChaiTRex@user/chaitrex) ChaiTRex
2025-06-03 07:27:08 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 07:27:30 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 07:27:57 +0200merijn(~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2025-06-03 07:28:05 +0200mange(~mange@user/mange) mange
2025-06-03 07:31:45 +0200trickard(~trickard@cpe-51-98-47-163.wireline.com.au) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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2025-06-03 09:40:42 +0200 <hellwolf> is it possible to "repl" load a snippets of String/Text, and catch a compilation error in an IO?
2025-06-03 09:40:59 +0200 <hellwolf> a very brief thought on how to test intended type errors in a test framework.
2025-06-03 09:41:18 +0200kuribas(~user@ip-188-118-57-242.reverse.destiny.be)
2025-06-03 09:41:19 +0200 <hellwolf> surely if GHCi can do, we could replicate that, right?
2025-06-03 09:41:22 +0200 <dminuoso> hellwolf: ghc is available as an API.
2025-06-03 09:41:45 +0200 <hellwolf> is such a test framework exist? (really dont' want to rebuild another wheel, I got my hands full)
2025-06-03 09:42:01 +0200 <dminuoso> hellwolf: Yes, its called ghc-lib.
2025-06-03 09:42:21 +0200tromp(~textual@2001:1c00:3487:1b00:7d34:d696:3458:218b)
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2025-06-03 09:44:15 +0200 <dminuoso> https://hackage.haskell.org/package/ghc-9.12.1/docs/GHC.html#v:parseModule and followingn typecheckModule
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2025-06-03 09:44:31 +0200 <dminuoso> (ghc-lib has the equivalent exports, but for some reason the haddock is missing on hackage)
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2025-06-03 10:03:11 +0200 <hellwolf> Okay, that changes things. I will look into it some day. I would still be surprised it's not how one should generally test type errors.
2025-06-03 10:03:33 +0200 <dminuoso> What do you mean you would be surprised?
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2025-06-03 10:04:50 +0200 <dminuoso> hellwolf: Alternatively you could invoke GHC as a binary and use -fdiagnostics-as-json
2025-06-03 10:05:44 +0200 <dminuoso> It's a bit less tightly coupled and might be easier to use.
2025-06-03 10:07:05 +0200machinedgod(~machinedg@d108-173-18-100.abhsia.telus.net) machinedgod
2025-06-03 10:07:54 +0200 <lortabac> **some** tests can also be performed with the Data.Type.Equality machinery
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2025-06-03 10:09:15 +0200 <lortabac> there is also shelltest
2025-06-03 10:09:44 +0200 <lortabac> I have used it in one of my projects for this exact purpose
2025-06-03 10:10:17 +0200 <hellwolf> I wonder if you use Unsatisfiable, would you be able to test if instance selection falls to the unsatisiable one.
2025-06-03 10:10:56 +0200 <lortabac> https://github.com/lortabac/parameters/blob/master/.github/workflows/haskell.yml#L53
2025-06-03 10:12:46 +0200 <lortabac> https://github.com/simonmichael/shelltestrunner
2025-06-03 10:15:27 +0200Lycurgus(~juan@user/Lycurgus) (Quit: irc.renjuan.org (juan@acm.org))
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2025-06-03 10:18:30 +0200 <dminuoso> hellwolf: Just to give more perspectives, GHC does these golden tests by having a python based test driver https://gitlab.haskell.org/ghc/ghc/-/tree/master/testsuite/driver and then keeping the testcases + expected stderr next to each other: https://gitlab.haskell.org/ghc/ghc/-/tree/master/testsuite/tests/typecheck/should_fail
2025-06-03 10:18:39 +0200 <dminuoso> Loads of options
2025-06-03 10:19:39 +0200fp(~Thunderbi@hof1.kyla.fi) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2025-06-03 10:19:44 +0200 <dminuoso> One thing I would keep in mind, if you do not use ghc-lib and invoke ghc as a binary instead, you should tightly control the version as error output can change across GHC versions.
2025-06-03 10:19:58 +0200 <dminuoso> Or use ghc-lib with tight bounds.
2025-06-03 10:20:26 +0200sawilagar(~sawilagar@user/sawilagar) sawilagar
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2025-06-03 10:25:39 +0200 <Leary> `-fdiagnostics-as-json` should be stable enough so long as you only check the fields you actually need to care about.
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2025-06-03 11:27:05 +0200Co0kie(~Jura@2a02:8071:64e1:da0:5a47:caff:fe78:33db) CiaoSen
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2025-06-03 11:43:45 +0200 <hellwolf> dminuoso: thanks, I will look into it. Perhaps during zurihac's friday session.
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2025-06-03 12:02:51 +0200 <Unhammer> woah, clean build time went down from 2m20 to 1m30 when upgrading 9.2.8 to 9.6.7 that's Amazing
2025-06-03 12:03:21 +0200tromp(~textual@2001:1c00:3487:1b00:7d34:d696:3458:218b) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2025-06-03 12:03:38 +0200 <Unhammer> (and I see from git logs that 8.8.4 took it from 3m→2m30s)
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2025-06-03 12:19:25 +0200Eoco(~ian@128.101.131.218) Eoco
2025-06-03 12:20:18 +0200 <tomsmeding> yay ghc :)
2025-06-03 12:21:04 +0200remexre(~remexre@user/remexre) remexre
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2025-06-03 12:45:41 +0200tinjamin4(~tinjamin@banshee.h4x0r.space)
2025-06-03 12:47:38 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> Im getting evil ideas about scripting in my little game im making, and i could maybe use https://hackage.haskell.org/package/plugins-1.6.2.1 but i wonder if this produces machine code or bytecode and interprets it
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2025-06-03 12:50:54 +0200 <tomsmeding> magic_rb: seems to compile by calling ghc on the command line, and then load in the resulting .o
2025-06-03 12:51:16 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> And if using hint? That would then be interpreted i think
2025-06-03 12:51:27 +0200 <tomsmeding> think so, yes
2025-06-03 12:51:36 +0200tinjamin4(~tinjamin@banshee.h4x0r.space)
2025-06-03 12:51:46 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> I wonder if i can ship ghc with my game :P
2025-06-03 12:52:23 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> (I should just use lua or make a simple lisp)
2025-06-03 12:52:37 +0200lortabac(~lortabac@2a01:e0a:541:b8f0:55ab:e185:7f81:54a4) lortabac
2025-06-03 12:52:38 +0200fp(~Thunderbi@2001:708:20:1406::10c5) fp
2025-06-03 12:53:04 +0200 <tomsmeding> $ du -hd0 ~/.ghcup/ghc/9.8.4
2025-06-03 12:53:06 +0200 <tomsmeding> 2.7G /home/tom/.ghcup/ghc/9.8.4
2025-06-03 12:53:15 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> Oof
2025-06-03 12:53:21 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> Maybe not
2025-06-03 12:53:29 +0200 <tomsmeding> now this includes profiling libs and documentation
2025-06-03 12:53:35 +0200 <tomsmeding> but a pruned install is still _large_
2025-06-03 12:53:35 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> I could use a small c compiler and microhs maybe
2025-06-03 12:53:41 +0200 <tomsmeding> microhs, or hugs
2025-06-03 12:53:50 +0200 <tomsmeding> if you can get hugs to work
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2025-06-03 12:55:02 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> Or just a simple lisp
2025-06-03 12:55:16 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 12:55:22 +0200 <tomsmeding> build your own! it's fun
2025-06-03 12:56:10 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> Possibly
2025-06-03 12:56:39 +0200 <haskellbridge> <magic_rb> I need like 10 data types, basic control flow and operations on those data types. Its for an ECS so not complex
2025-06-03 12:57:00 +0200 <tomsmeding> as long as you don't need the combination of type inference and polymorphic user functions, it's all easy enough
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2025-06-03 14:47:21 +0200 <hellwolf> | traceBool b msg = if b then True else trace msg False
2025-06-03 14:47:21 +0200 <hellwolf> is this silly, can we rely on "||" to short circuit here with Haskell's trace.
2025-06-03 14:47:45 +0200 <hellwolf> "b || trace msg False"?
2025-06-03 14:49:57 +0200 <__monty__> Don't see why not, that even works in Bash.
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2025-06-03 14:54:49 +0200raym(~ray@user/raym) raym
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2025-06-03 14:59:53 +0200 <ski> EvanR : "Two conceptions of natural number" (in "Truth in Mathematics", eds. H. G. Dales,G. Oliveri) by Alexander George,Daniel J. Velleman in 1998 at <https://www.amherst.edu/media/view/18770/original/Two_Conceptions_of_Natural_Number.pdf> talks about a Build Up (constructive) and a Pare Down (carving out) approach to conceptualizing how the type of natural numbers is formed, which seems to be reminiscent
2025-06-03 15:00:00 +0200 <ski> of what you mentioned
2025-06-03 15:02:42 +0200tromp(~textual@2001:1c00:3487:1b00:7d34:d696:3458:218b)
2025-06-03 15:03:25 +0200 <ski> magic_rb : "int is a subtype of float" -- the integers can be *regarded* as being embedded in the reals (which is what EvanR indicated by "there's an order preserving or monoid preserving or ring preserving function from Z to R"). but even in a ZF set theoretic setting, when you construct the reals, out of (the rationals, out of) the integers, the set of integers does *not* become a subset of the reals.
2025-06-03 15:03:32 +0200 <ski> unless you manually filter out all "integral reals" from the set of reals, replacing them with the original integers (assuming there's no overlap of representation as hereditary ZF sets in the particular construction/implementation you've chosen ..)
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2025-06-03 15:06:54 +0200 <ski> hellwolf : yes, `if b then True else c' is `b || c', `if b then c else False' is `b && c', `if b then False else True' is `not b', `if b then True else False' is `b'
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2025-06-03 15:10:30 +0200o-90(~o-90@gateway/tor-sasl/o-90) o-90
2025-06-03 15:10:50 +0200 <ski> (and `if b then c else True' is (the unfortunately named) `b <= c', which is implication from `b' to `c')
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2025-06-03 15:26:09 +0200 <ski> > let divides :: Integral i => i -> i -> Bool; d `divides` n = (n /= 0) <= (d /= 0 && n `rem` d == 0); gregorialLeapYear :: Integral i => i -> Bool; gregorialLeapYear n = 4 `divides` n && (100 `divides` n) <= (400 `divides` n) in map gregorialLeapYear [1941,1980,1900,2000]
2025-06-03 15:26:11 +0200 <lambdabot> [False,True,False,True]
2025-06-03 15:26:26 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 15:29:48 +0200skiidly ponders "but not" connective (coexponential, "subtraction", "except", `A && not B' (`A >- B') .. `(4 | n) >- ((100 | n) >- (400 | n))')
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2025-06-03 15:32:58 +0200trickard(~trickard@cpe-51-98-47-163.wireline.com.au)
2025-06-03 15:36:36 +0200 <ski> d `divides` n = not (n /= 0 >- (d /= 0 >- (n `rem` d /= 0))) -- hmm, doesn't really seem to help here
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2025-06-03 16:05:12 +0200yin(~z@user/zero) zero
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2025-06-03 16:24:58 +0200Tuplanolla(~Tuplanoll@91-159-69-59.elisa-laajakaista.fi) Tuplanolla
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2025-06-03 16:34:59 +0200 <hellwolf> huh, so with rebindable syntax "-128 :: I8" is - (fromInteger 128)
2025-06-03 16:35:01 +0200 <hellwolf> which blows up
2025-06-03 16:35:03 +0200 <hellwolf> whaaa
2025-06-03 16:35:20 +0200 <hellwolf> it's not on the label: https://ghc.gitlab.haskell.org/ghc/doc/users_guide/exts/rebindable_syntax.html
2025-06-03 16:37:01 +0200halloy1965(~halloy196@2a07:244:46:2400:d975:6182:4849:9ab)
2025-06-03 16:38:51 +0200halloy1965(~halloy196@2a07:244:46:2400:d975:6182:4849:9ab) ()
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2025-06-03 16:45:18 +0200 <geekosaur> it doesn't need to be, it's using Report translation unless you use LexicalNegation (although I'm not sure if the numeric extensions are active in RebindableSyntax)
2025-06-03 16:45:42 +0200 <geekosaur> more specifically it's `negate (fromInteger 128)`
2025-06-03 16:47:14 +0200 <geekosaur> the users guide doesn't, in general, repeat anything specified by the Report; only where it differs
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2025-06-03 16:53:29 +0200 <hellwolf> a glaring issue of using rebindable syntax for negative numbers then.
2025-06-03 16:54:00 +0200 <geekosaur> actually you'll find it does the same thing without RebindableSyntax
2025-06-03 16:55:08 +0200 <hellwolf> for which data type?
2025-06-03 16:55:26 +0200 <geekosaur> it's a glaring issue with the Report's specification of how negated literals work, combined with ghc reporting bounds overflow/underflow for numeric literals (I think even worse things go wrong if it didn't warn). LexicalNegation exists because of this.
2025-06-03 16:55:50 +0200 <geekosaur> any bounded numeric type
2025-06-03 16:56:21 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 16:56:46 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 16:57:04 +0200 <geekosaur> basically the Report version of negative numeric literals is a trainwreck and LexicalNegation should be used
2025-06-03 16:59:11 +0200tromp(~textual@2001:1c00:3487:1b00:7d34:d696:3458:218b)
2025-06-03 16:59:11 +0200 <EvanR> > negate (fromInteger 128) :: Int8
2025-06-03 16:59:13 +0200 <lambdabot> -128
2025-06-03 16:59:20 +0200 <geekosaur> it's one of the few extensions that I would say "always turn on if you value your sanity"
2025-06-03 16:59:55 +0200 <geekosaur> hm, that actually surprises me
2025-06-03 17:00:28 +0200 <EvanR> ok that's what I should have expected
2025-06-03 17:00:39 +0200 <EvanR> not "blow up"
2025-06-03 17:00:53 +0200phma_(~phma@host-67-44-208-79.hnremote.net)
2025-06-03 17:00:59 +0200 <hellwolf> > negate (fromInteger 128 :: Int8) :: Int8
2025-06-03 17:01:00 +0200 <lambdabot> -128
2025-06-03 17:01:09 +0200 <hellwolf> > fromInteger 128 :: Int8
2025-06-03 17:01:10 +0200 <lambdabot> -128
2025-06-03 17:01:14 +0200 <hellwolf> fml
2025-06-03 17:01:24 +0200 <geekosaur> oh, hm, if it's actually using that translation then it's Integer at the point over/underflow is checked. hellmonk, are you sure it translated that way? the "128" would always be an `Integer` with yours
2025-06-03 17:01:37 +0200 <geekosaur> er, hellwolf, sorry
2025-06-03 17:01:48 +0200 <geekosaur> (there's a hellmonk in another channel I frequent 🙂 )
2025-06-03 17:01:55 +0200 <hellwolf> haha
2025-06-03 17:02:04 +0200 <hellwolf> I was wondering if that's a expression from some state.
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2025-06-03 17:03:08 +0200 <EvanR> -128 is a fixed point
2025-06-03 17:03:17 +0200jakesyl_____(sid56879@id-56879.hampstead.irccloud.com) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2025-06-03 17:03:25 +0200Ekho(~Ekho@user/ekho) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2025-06-03 17:03:34 +0200Lears(~Leary@user/Leary/x-0910699) Leary
2025-06-03 17:04:06 +0200 <hellwolf> PendingBlowup
2025-06-03 17:04:06 +0200snek(sid280155@id-280155.lymington.irccloud.com) snek
2025-06-03 17:04:09 +0200unlucy(sid572875@user/unlucy) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2025-06-03 17:04:18 +0200Leary(~Leary@user/Leary/x-0910699) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2025-06-03 17:04:19 +0200 <hellwolf> CancellableBlowUp
2025-06-03 17:04:32 +0200trickard(~trickard@cpe-51-98-47-163.wireline.com.au) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2025-06-03 17:04:53 +0200LearsLeary
2025-06-03 17:04:53 +0200phma(~phma@2001:5b0:210d:9c38:6091:34d1:6f16:4051) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2025-06-03 17:05:09 +0200jakesyl_____(sid56879@id-56879.hampstead.irccloud.com)
2025-06-03 17:06:01 +0200unlucy(sid572875@user/unlucy) unlucy
2025-06-03 17:06:39 +0200trickard(~trickard@cpe-51-98-47-163.wireline.com.au)
2025-06-03 17:07:32 +0200Ekho(~Ekho@user/ekho) Ekho
2025-06-03 17:08:40 +0200 <EvanR> smh shoulda used ones complement
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2025-06-03 17:14:51 +0200gaze__(sid387101@id-387101.helmsley.irccloud.com) gaze__
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2025-06-03 17:18:29 +0200natto17(~natto@129.154.243.159) natto
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2025-06-03 17:19:18 +0200dolio(~dolio@130.44.140.168) dolio
2025-06-03 17:19:27 +0200 <hellwolf> rust people is gonna laugh at my handling of Integer -> [Word8]
2025-06-03 17:19:35 +0200tritlo(sid58727@id-58727.hampstead.irccloud.com)
2025-06-03 17:19:35 +0200 <hellwolf> and vice versa
2025-06-03 17:19:42 +0200hellwolffeeling embarrased
2025-06-03 17:19:51 +0200 <EvanR> unfoldr?
2025-06-03 17:19:54 +0200hamishmack(sid389057@id-389057.hampstead.irccloud.com) hamishmack
2025-06-03 17:20:04 +0200mistivia(~mistivia@user/mistivia) mistivia
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2025-06-03 17:20:26 +0200foul_owl(~kerry@94.156.149.99) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2025-06-03 17:20:35 +0200 <hellwolf> oh, I should indeed. But I think the performance will be uncharitable, thought it is not what I am after here.
2025-06-03 17:20:56 +0200 <hellwolf> *laughable
2025-06-03 17:21:03 +0200edmundnoble_(sid229620@id-229620.helmsley.irccloud.com) edmundnoble_
2025-06-03 17:21:03 +0200 <hellwolf> not sure why emacs auto corrected the word.
2025-06-03 17:21:10 +0200 <EvanR> I don't bet against GHC xD
2025-06-03 17:21:12 +0200shawwwn(sid6132@id-6132.helmsley.irccloud.com) shawwwn
2025-06-03 17:21:23 +0200 <hellwolf> it's all boxed, so all bets are off.
2025-06-03 17:21:25 +0200notzmv(~daniel@user/notzmv) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2025-06-03 17:21:25 +0200connrs(~connrs@user/connrs) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2025-06-03 17:21:33 +0200 <EvanR> compiling of known types with known functions
2025-06-03 17:21:37 +0200sam113101(~sam@modemcable200.189-202-24.mc.videotron.ca) sam113101
2025-06-03 17:21:37 +0200 <hellwolf> if I really needed performance, I need a different set of data types.
2025-06-03 17:21:40 +0200cbarrett(sid192934@helmsley.irccloud.com) cbarrett
2025-06-03 17:21:51 +0200JamesMowery17(~JamesMowe@ip68-228-212-232.ph.ph.cox.net) JamesMowery
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2025-06-03 17:22:09 +0200coldmountain(uid484352@id-484352.helmsley.irccloud.com) coldmountain
2025-06-03 17:22:24 +0200jaror(~jaror@5070ACC7.static.ziggozakelijk.nl)
2025-06-03 17:22:35 +0200jmct(sid160793@id-160793.tinside.irccloud.com)
2025-06-03 17:22:42 +0200Eoco(~ian@128.101.131.218) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
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2025-06-03 17:23:08 +0200Eoco(~ian@128.101.131.218) Eoco
2025-06-03 17:23:08 +0200nacation(~m-3l4s76@user/nacation) nacation
2025-06-03 17:23:16 +0200mustafa(sid502723@rockylinux/releng/mustafa) mustafa
2025-06-03 17:23:26 +0200 <EvanR> a function which may or may not need to access GMP representation which divMods by 256 and gets an unboxed Word8 might help
2025-06-03 17:23:40 +0200alfiee(~alfiee@user/alfiee) alfiee
2025-06-03 17:24:18 +0200taktoa[c](sid282096@id-282096.tinside.irccloud.com) taktoa[c]
2025-06-03 17:24:32 +0200 <EvanR> also, how would rust do it
2025-06-03 17:24:38 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 17:25:03 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 17:25:07 +0200 <hellwolf> libgmp, unsafe, ba bing, ba bang
2025-06-03 17:25:10 +0200connrs(~connrs@user/connrs) connrs
2025-06-03 17:25:29 +0200 <EvanR> assuming you're using the GMP version of Integer
2025-06-03 17:25:36 +0200 <hellwolf> how can I know?
2025-06-03 17:25:40 +0200 <hellwolf> how can I find out?
2025-06-03 17:25:44 +0200Jonno_FTW(~come@api.carswap.me)
2025-06-03 17:25:44 +0200Jonno_FTW(~come@api.carswap.me) (Changing host)
2025-06-03 17:25:44 +0200Jonno_FTW(~come@user/jonno-ftw/x-0835346) Jonno_FTW
2025-06-03 17:26:21 +0200j0lol(~j0lol@132.145.17.236) j0lol
2025-06-03 17:26:31 +0200pabs3(~pabs3@user/pabs3) pabs3
2025-06-03 17:27:49 +0200Putonlalla(~Putonlall@it-cyan.it.jyu.fi) Tuplanolla
2025-06-03 17:28:08 +0200 <EvanR> :i Integer
2025-06-03 17:28:15 +0200 <EvanR> % :i Integer
2025-06-03 17:28:15 +0200 <yahb2> type Integer :: * ; data Integer ; = GHC.Num.Integer.IS GHC.Prim.Int# ; | GHC.Num.Integer.IP GHC.Prim.ByteArray# ; | GHC.Num.Integer.IN GHC.Prim.ByteArray# ; -- Defined in ‘GHC.Num.Integer...
2025-06-03 17:28:46 +0200shapr(~user@2600:4040:5c49:5600:3574:8b25:1fec:466e) shapr
2025-06-03 17:29:13 +0200lortabac(~lortabac@2a01:e0a:541:b8f0:55ab:e185:7f81:54a4) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2025-06-03 17:30:38 +0200 <hellwolf> alright, my embarrassing un-optimized code: https://paste.tomsmeding.com/f8CgpLh2
2025-06-03 17:30:55 +0200 <hellwolf> would love to learn how to handle numbers better in Haskell
2025-06-03 17:31:03 +0200 <EvanR> I did ghc-pkg list | grep integer
2025-06-03 17:31:48 +0200 <hellwolf> integer-gmp-1.1
2025-06-03 17:31:50 +0200 <hellwolf> for me
2025-06-03 17:32:00 +0200nisstyre(wes@user/nisstyre) nisstyre
2025-06-03 17:32:01 +0200 <Leary> If it's embarrassing, just use `integerToMutableByteArray#`.
2025-06-03 17:32:14 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 17:32:25 +0200foul_owl(~kerry@94.156.149.99) foul_owl
2025-06-03 17:32:36 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 17:33:58 +0200 <EvanR> alternatively since there's no behavioral spec, f _ = []
2025-06-03 17:34:12 +0200 <EvanR> blazing fast
2025-06-03 17:35:55 +0200 <hellwolf> :) that'd make all "IO ()" function impelementation easy
2025-06-03 17:36:58 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 17:37:22 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 17:37:22 +0200 <dolio> Does anyone have a cabal workflow for toggling -Werror that's more convenient than editing a cabal.project?
2025-06-03 17:37:23 +0200 <EvanR> that's a good monoid
2025-06-03 17:38:04 +0200 <dolio> I need to build with -Werror to satisfy some CI, but it constantly bites me when I'm experimenting with stuff trying to fix things.
2025-06-03 17:42:00 +0200danza(~danza@user/danza) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 17:42:43 +0200phma_phma
2025-06-03 17:44:51 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection)
2025-06-03 17:45:17 +0200sabathan2(~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)
2025-06-03 17:46:28 +0200 <haskellbridge> <Morj> > rust people is gonna laugh at my handling of Integer -> [Word8]
2025-06-03 17:46:28 +0200 <haskellbridge> As a rust people I cry at non-lgpl versions being at least 3 times slower TT
2025-06-03 17:46:28 +0200 <haskellbridge> <hellwolf> what's that?
2025-06-03 17:47:58 +0200 <geekosaur> https://paste.tomsmeding.com/GdKV0cev
2025-06-03 17:48:11 +0200 <geekosaur> (re -Werror)