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| 2025-06-03 01:59:09 +0200 | <EvanR> | haskell type system could be construed as constructive: you start with nothing and can do nothing until you define new types, then you can create values according to the rules made so far, and that's it, until you define more types. In elixir's upcoming type system and typescript it's destructive. You start with a universe of possible values and the types divide the universe up into smaller and smaller subsets |
| 2025-06-03 01:59:48 +0200 | <EvanR> | in some blog somewhere they argue that the first way gives you more stuff and goes farther, though the second way would be nice to have |
| 2025-06-03 02:00:33 +0200 | <EvanR> | however now I'm wondering if they are even comparable because the universe is infinite, and dividing infinite space into infinite subspaces is not necessarily less |
| 2025-06-03 02:00:42 +0200 | <monochrom> | Does it say what is nice about the second way? |
| 2025-06-03 02:01:24 +0200 | <EvanR> | having the ability to control subtypes and restrict the values in a meticulous way, like liquid haskell |
| 2025-06-03 02:01:31 +0200 | <EvanR> | they say it would be nice |
| 2025-06-03 02:03:33 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2025-06-03 02:03:55 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 2025-06-03 02:04:24 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-06-03 02:05:22 +0200 | <EvanR> | @where typescript |
| 2025-06-03 02:05:23 +0200 | <lambdabot> | I know nothing about typescript. |
| 2025-06-03 02:06:35 +0200 | <monochrom> | I have trouble believing that elixir and typescript have refinement types (what liquid haskell does). (In my world they are called predicate subtypes.) |
| 2025-06-03 02:07:36 +0200 | <monochrom> | But I wouldn't be surprised if their "subtype" just means the OOP kind, i.e., row subtypes. (A subtype has more fields than the supertype.) |
| 2025-06-03 02:08:09 +0200 | <monochrom> | In that case, it's just "OOP would be nice". |
| 2025-06-03 02:09:25 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2025-06-03 02:09:26 +0200 | <EvanR> | they can't divide integers up or floats |
| 2025-06-03 02:09:57 +0200 | <EvanR> | but they can divide e.g. list of a into non-empty list of a and general list of a |
| 2025-06-03 02:10:39 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2025-06-03 02:10:50 +0200 | <EvanR> | and list of a into list of integer, list of float |
| 2025-06-03 02:11:04 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 2025-06-03 02:11:24 +0200 | <EvanR> | and through "intersection types" they can divide functions up in weird ways |
| 2025-06-03 02:12:05 +0200 | <EvanR> | so it goes beyond row types |
| 2025-06-03 02:13:42 +0200 | <EvanR> | e.g. a function which accepts int or bool and returns string "has type" intersection of int->string and bool->string |
| 2025-06-03 02:16:42 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2025-06-03 02:17:07 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 2025-06-03 02:17:39 +0200 | jmcantrell | (~weechat@user/jmcantrell) jmcantrell |
| 2025-06-03 02:20:11 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-06-03 02:22:19 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> Scala does something like that with functions in regards to subtypes. Uh |
| 2025-06-03 02:22:44 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> There was a term for it, when youre doing generics there, you specify [A+] i think? |
| 2025-06-03 02:23:09 +0200 | Tuplanolla | (~Tuplanoll@91-159-69-59.elisa-laajakaista.fi) (Quit: Leaving.) |
| 2025-06-03 02:23:17 +0200 | <monochrom> | covariant, contravariant, invariant |
| 2025-06-03 02:23:23 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> Exactly |
| 2025-06-03 02:23:26 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> Thanks |
| 2025-06-03 02:23:41 +0200 | <EvanR> | looks like I might even be wrong about dividing up the basic types. You could do something like, a type which means exactly some string |
| 2025-06-03 02:23:55 +0200 | swistak | (~swistak@185.21.216.141) (Quit: bye bye) |
| 2025-06-03 02:23:58 +0200 | <EvanR> | then union several of these together to get only string1, string2, or string3 |
| 2025-06-03 02:24:14 +0200 | swistak | (~swistak@185.21.216.141) |
| 2025-06-03 02:24:14 +0200 | <EvanR> | which is a subtype of the type of "any string" |
| 2025-06-03 02:24:18 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> We learned that during a course in uni, just forgot the name. But yeah say "Int | Float" is a superclass of "Int" and also of "Float" than in scala it would work with the functions |
| 2025-06-03 02:24:26 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2025-06-03 02:24:44 +0200 | <haskellbridge> | <magic_rb> *than -> then |
| 2025-06-03 02:24:47 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 2025-06-03 02:25:27 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2025-06-03 02:25:41 +0200 | <EvanR> | Int and Float being subtypes of Int|Float definitely makes more sense than one of them being a subtype of the other |
| 2025-06-03 02:25:45 +0200 | <monochrom> | In most languages, unlike Haskell, string is a basic type, too. :) |