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| 2024-11-06 00:02:55 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
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| 2024-11-06 00:19:23 +0100 | remedan | (~remedan@ip-62-245-108-153.bb.vodafone.cz) (Quit: Bye!) |
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| 2024-11-06 00:24:24 +0100 | CoolMa7 | (~CoolMa7@ip5f5b8957.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) CoolMa7 |
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| 2024-11-06 00:31:29 +0100 | Everything | (~Everythin@178-133-16-55.mobile.vf-ua.net) (Quit: leaving) |
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| 2024-11-06 00:52:49 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
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| 2024-11-06 00:58:37 +0100 | JuanDaugherty | (~juan@user/JuanDaugherty) JuanDaugherty |
| 2024-11-06 01:01:15 +0100 | notzmv | (~daniel@user/notzmv) notzmv |
| 2024-11-06 01:08:05 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 01:13:00 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 01:13:22 +0100 | troojg | (~troojg@user/troojg) troojg |
| 2024-11-06 01:13:28 +0100 | Versality | (~Versality@user/Versality) Versality |
| 2024-11-06 01:13:54 +0100 | euphores | (~SASL_euph@user/euphores) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 01:21:39 +0100 | euphores | (~SASL_euph@user/euphores) euphores |
| 2024-11-06 01:22:51 +0100 | <jackdk> | Standards pricing is just obscene, TBQH. There has to be a way to compensate experts for their work without certain companies getting to overcharge for ancient documents forever. |
| 2024-11-06 01:23:26 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 01:28:06 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 01:28:22 +0100 | JuanDaugherty | (~juan@user/JuanDaugherty) (Quit: JuanDaugherty) |
| 2024-11-06 01:31:36 +0100 | xff0x | (~xff0x@2405:6580:b080:900:fc69:912f:320c:e811) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 01:32:02 +0100 | CoolMa7 | (~CoolMa7@ip5f5b8957.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) CoolMa7 |
| 2024-11-06 01:34:09 +0100 | <constxd> | mauke: my understanding is wg14 intentionally makes drafts public that are as close as possible to the final revision to circumvent the ISO pricing absurdity |
| 2024-11-06 01:34:38 +0100 | <constxd> | i was reading somewhere that they are like grandfathered in, most ISO standards have tighter restrictions on what can be released as a draft |
| 2024-11-06 01:34:51 +0100 | <constxd> | but basically there is no reason to buy the C standard |
| 2024-11-06 01:39:13 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 01:39:21 +0100 | CoolMa7 | (~CoolMa7@ip5f5b8957.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 01:42:38 +0100 | sprotte24_ | (~sprotte24@p200300d16f3f2c00b0d50a9d74dbbab9.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2024-11-06 01:43:47 +0100 | harveypwca | (~harveypwc@2601:246:d080:b40:1889:d9bf:2dd8:b288) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2024-11-06 01:44:33 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 01:46:34 +0100 | Versality | (~Versality@user/Versality) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2024-11-06 01:47:33 +0100 | Versality | (~Versality@84.237.180.62) |
| 2024-11-06 01:47:33 +0100 | Versality | (~Versality@84.237.180.62) (Changing host) |
| 2024-11-06 01:47:33 +0100 | Versality | (~Versality@user/Versality) Versality |
| 2024-11-06 01:48:18 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <zwro> is there a way to save the current ghci session? |
| 2024-11-06 01:49:36 +0100 | Versality | (~Versality@user/Versality) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2024-11-06 01:53:15 +0100 | Versality | (~Versality@84.237.180.62) |
| 2024-11-06 01:53:15 +0100 | Versality | (~Versality@84.237.180.62) (Changing host) |
| 2024-11-06 01:53:15 +0100 | Versality | (~Versality@user/Versality) Versality |
| 2024-11-06 01:55:16 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 01:58:32 +0100 | <monochrom> | I am not even convinced that the authors of the standards are compensated at all. |
| 2024-11-06 01:59:21 +0100 | <monochrom> | Right? I'm taking inspiration from the way academic journals work. The journal publishers get all the money. The editors and the peer reviewers do it all for free. |
| 2024-11-06 01:59:59 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 02:00:03 +0100 | ash3en | (~Thunderbi@2a03:7846:b6eb:101:93ac:a90a:da67:f207) (Quit: ash3en) |
| 2024-11-06 02:01:40 +0100 | <monochrom> | To the point even Knuth is sufficiently fed up to write an article to complain and advocate everyone to jump ship and start free online journals. |
| 2024-11-06 02:03:28 +0100 | <monochrom> | zwro: There is no plan to follow Python absurdity and evolve GHCi into its own IDE. |
| 2024-11-06 02:03:31 +0100 | <constxd> | yes i think the actual members of the ISO working groups are essentially volunteers |
| 2024-11-06 02:04:14 +0100 | <constxd> | what do u mean python absurdity? ipython? |
| 2024-11-06 02:05:35 +0100 | notzmv | (~daniel@user/notzmv) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 02:06:35 +0100 | Versality | (~Versality@user/Versality) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2024-11-06 02:07:59 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <zwro> monochrom: (: https://nbviewer.org/github/gibiansky/IHaskell/blob/master/notebooks/IHaskell.ipynb |
| 2024-11-06 02:08:19 +0100 | Guest7 | (~Guest7@137.79.192.219) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 02:09:57 +0100 | L29Ah | (~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah) (Read error: Connection timed out) |
| 2024-11-06 02:10:16 +0100 | <zero> | anyways i just want something like node's repl where it basically saves the session history to a file. i guess i can go edit .ghci_history manually... |
| 2024-11-06 02:10:50 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 02:11:22 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> zero: there has been a blog post or two about a way to save/restore ghci state, by chris done I think |
| 2024-11-06 02:12:18 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> https://chrisdone.com/posts/ghci-reload maybe |
| 2024-11-06 02:12:57 +0100 | <monochrom> | constxd: This: https://discourse.haskell.org/t/multiline-interpreter-with-editing-of-previous-lines/10551 |
| 2024-11-06 02:13:29 +0100 | <monochrom> | tl;dr the python REPL is now its own editor. |
| 2024-11-06 02:14:29 +0100 | <monochrom> | This is different from iPython and iHaskell. I have no quarrel with them. |
| 2024-11-06 02:14:37 +0100 | <constxd> | ah |
| 2024-11-06 02:15:26 +0100 | <monochrom> | Instead, since iPython and iHaskell exist, there is no point duplicating the effort in the basic REPL. |
| 2024-11-06 02:15:41 +0100 | <zero> | ooh is this hot reloading? |
| 2024-11-06 02:15:56 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 02:16:33 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> try it out, let us know ? |
| 2024-11-06 02:16:53 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> +how it goes |
| 2024-11-06 02:18:15 +0100 | <constxd> | wouldn't be the end of the world imo if it's "for free" by virtue of being built into libreadline or something |
| 2024-11-06 02:18:35 +0100 | <constxd> | but yeah i wouldn't want to implement that and maintain it as a part of a REPL |
| 2024-11-06 02:18:36 +0100 | <monochrom> | In the particular case of GHCi, given that dev time is a zero-sum game, when (not if, it's a certainty) the devs have to choose between improving GHCi's debugger and adding an editor to GHCi, why would anyone want the latter? Isn't debugger a much higher priority? Editors already exist, plentiifully. |
| 2024-11-06 02:19:35 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> dev time doesn't always have to be zero sum in FOSS.. motivated new devs / funders sometimes show up |
| 2024-11-06 02:19:53 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> just saying |
| 2024-11-06 02:21:59 +0100 | Tuplanolla | (~Tuplanoll@91-159-69-59.elisa-laajakaista.fi) (Quit: Leaving.) |
| 2024-11-06 02:22:07 +0100 | CoolMa7 | (~CoolMa7@ip5f5b8957.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) CoolMa7 |
| 2024-11-06 02:23:51 +0100 | <zero> | foreign-store is hacky. i would be more interested in something like https://hackage.haskell.org/package/rapid-0.1.4/docs/Rapid.html |
| 2024-11-06 02:24:50 +0100 | <zero> | which wraps it "nicely" |
| 2024-11-06 02:24:54 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> I could imagine integrating an already-maintained TUI editor (yi ?) could also be the way to improve GHCI's debugger, because a more visual UI is what it needs |
| 2024-11-06 02:25:15 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> or anyway, _a_ way |
| 2024-11-06 02:25:50 +0100 | postcerebral | (~postcereb@user/postcerebral) (Quit: WeeChat 4.4.2) |
| 2024-11-06 02:25:51 +0100 | <monochrom> | In practice, that doesn't happen often enough in the Haskell community. Look at how GHCi debugger has not received any further work, and how HLS still doesn't have any debugger. Even the GHCup effort is wearing thin and the guy is complaining: https://discourse.haskell.org/t/priorities-for-upcoming-ghc-releases/9605/60 |
| 2024-11-06 02:26:12 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 02:26:26 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> and sometimes a monolithic just works out of box tool is the only thing that'll get used |
| 2024-11-06 02:26:29 +0100 | CoolMa7 | (~CoolMa7@ip5f5b8957.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 02:26:43 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> I promise you this one would |
| 2024-11-06 02:26:47 +0100 | xff0x | (~xff0x@fsb6a9491c.tkyc517.ap.nuro.jp) |
| 2024-11-06 02:28:12 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> I have got the VS Code debugger extension working once, and it was so fragile and little known that pretty much no-one else will |
| 2024-11-06 02:29:18 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> a built in cheaper just works ui could help build the foundation |
| 2024-11-06 02:30:36 +0100 | <monochrom> | https://ro-che.info/ccc/26 |
| 2024-11-06 02:32:19 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> I think in this cartoon, something is missing from the company's offering. We just don't know what it is :) |
| 2024-11-06 02:33:05 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 02:33:11 +0100 | <monochrom> | IIRC the company is precisely FPComplete. |
| 2024-11-06 02:34:23 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> Ok. That IDE was good as I recall ! Lots of people had a beef with FP Complete so it had an uphill path. |
| 2024-11-06 02:34:26 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> Not a debugger thought |
| 2024-11-06 02:34:51 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> * UI though, that's what I'm thinking of particularly |
| 2024-11-06 02:35:30 +0100 | <monochrom> | Debugger is extremely hard. I don't really complain about lacking it. |
| 2024-11-06 02:36:00 +0100 | <monochrom> | OTOH, a nice IDE that lacks debugging feels like lacking a soul. |
| 2024-11-06 02:36:19 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> It doesn't seem _that_ hard. GHCI already has the core of it, and https://marketplace.visualstudio.com/items?itemName=phoityne.phoityne-vscode is an example of a UI on top |
| 2024-11-06 02:38:45 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> someone could whip that up in brick |
| 2024-11-06 02:39:41 +0100 | <monochrom> | Oh it's an extreme case of the 80-20 rule. Or at this extreme it's like a 99.99-0.01 rule. Hat, Buddha, GHCi, and that plug in prove that prototyping a Haskell debugger is easy, sure, and at the same time by their incompleteness and even bitrot, also prove that actually covering all of Haskell is way too annoying for anyone to finish it. |
| 2024-11-06 02:39:52 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> wait, didn't I see that already... |
| 2024-11-06 02:41:14 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> monochrom: I think those things prove that packaging and integration are also necessary.. so all of those are dead.. except the debugger built in to GHCI, which works perfectly (or anyway, works) |
| 2024-11-06 02:41:26 +0100 | <monochrom> | The cartoon? Yes I always link to it to rub it into people's faces. |
| 2024-11-06 02:41:54 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> I did see a more recent brick based debugger ui. I'd find it, if hackage wasn't down just now |
| 2024-11-06 02:42:18 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <zwro> what can an IDE provide that a language server can't? |
| 2024-11-06 02:42:31 +0100 | <monochrom> | A face? :) |
| 2024-11-06 02:42:58 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <zwro> I don't think people like changing editors just for the language |
| 2024-11-06 02:43:04 +0100 | <monochrom> | I talked about lacking a soul, but when you do have a soul, it needs a body too... |
| 2024-11-06 02:43:07 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> a language server is a small internal component that lets IDEs communicate with the language tools |
| 2024-11-06 02:44:14 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 02:44:18 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <zwro> sm: the "plus a capable editor" was implied in my question |
| 2024-11-06 02:44:57 +0100 | <monochrom> | Right exactly. I wouldn't change editors just for the language. So I wouldn't need a "save" button in the language's REPL either. My favourite editor already has one. |
| 2024-11-06 02:46:10 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <zwro> how do you save a ghci session with your editor? |
| 2024-11-06 02:47:16 +0100 | <monochrom> | By creating a "play.hs" file that has all the experimental expressions I want to try out in a session. |
| 2024-11-06 02:47:49 +0100 | Guest7 | (~Guest7@syn-172-249-181-078.res.spectrum.com) |
| 2024-11-06 02:48:09 +0100 | <monochrom> | Not currently done but available: I'm in emacs and my ghci session is also in emacs so in principle I would save that buffer content... |
| 2024-11-06 02:48:19 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> There's quite a few https://hackage.haskell.org/packages/search?terms=debug things, though most of them are not traditional debuggers allowing interactive stepping. https://hackage.haskell.org/package/ghc-debug-brick is the recent one I was thinking of. |
| 2024-11-06 02:48:36 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 02:48:38 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <zwro> at that point you might aswell use ghcid |
| 2024-11-06 02:49:04 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> zwro: yes rapid is a good find, that's the newer thing built on top of foreign store |
| 2024-11-06 02:49:17 +0100 | <Leary> | zwro: Yes, so use ghcid. :) |
| 2024-11-06 02:49:29 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> * foreign-store |
| 2024-11-06 02:49:29 +0100 | tabaqui | (~root@91.73.194.130) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 02:50:26 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <zwro> Leary: i usually do :) that's why i missed a :save command when i happened to use ghci for something quick on my phone |
| 2024-11-06 02:50:55 +0100 | <monochrom> | Oh, phone. Then I sympathize. |
| 2024-11-06 02:51:08 +0100 | <monochrom> | But you should use emacs on your phone instead. >:) |
| 2024-11-06 02:51:18 +0100 | <monochrom> | "go big or go home" |
| 2024-11-06 02:51:25 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <zwro> i'm using vim on my phone >>) |
| 2024-11-06 02:51:30 +0100 | ystael | (~ystael@user/ystael) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 02:51:43 +0100 | <monochrom> | I imagine vim should have something similar? |
| 2024-11-06 02:52:15 +0100 | <monochrom> | I mean why would there be a war (or why it hasn't ended already) if they were not on par. |
| 2024-11-06 02:52:31 +0100 | Guest7 | (~Guest7@syn-172-249-181-078.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 02:52:41 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <zwro> similar to what? |
| 2024-11-06 02:53:11 +0100 | <monochrom> | some haskell plugin for vim so you can also have a ghci session in a vim window/buffer. |
| 2024-11-06 02:53:30 +0100 | CoolMa7 | (~CoolMa7@ip5f5b8957.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) CoolMa7 |
| 2024-11-06 02:53:39 +0100 | Versality | (~Versality@user/Versality) Versality |
| 2024-11-06 02:53:50 +0100 | <monochrom> | If that doesn't exist, come join us in emacs! >:) |
| 2024-11-06 02:53:58 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <zwro> oh you don't need a plugin. you can just run ghcid directly in a vim buffer :) |
| 2024-11-06 02:54:01 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <hellwolf> I really don't like this "The type synonym ‘YulP’ should have 2 arguments, but has been given 1" |
| 2024-11-06 02:54:02 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | Is there a good general workaround? |
| 2024-11-06 02:54:08 +0100 | <monochrom> | OK that. :) |
| 2024-11-06 02:54:26 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <zwro> but ghcid is what's missing on my phone |
| 2024-11-06 02:54:48 +0100 | <monochrom> | General? How general can you take it? The most general, IMO anyway, is to use newtype altogether. |
| 2024-11-06 02:55:20 +0100 | <constxd> | u know how the zsh and bash shells have a key binding called C-x C-e ? |
| 2024-11-06 02:55:44 +0100 | <constxd> | that is trivial enough to add into something like GHCi and it gives u perhaps something useful |
| 2024-11-06 02:55:53 +0100 | <constxd> | just an idea |
| 2024-11-06 02:56:53 +0100 | Versality | (~Versality@user/Versality) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2024-11-06 02:57:05 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <zwro> yes! |
| 2024-11-06 02:57:12 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <zwro> that would be neat |
| 2024-11-06 02:57:15 +0100 | Versality | (~Versality@user/Versality) Versality |
| 2024-11-06 02:57:50 +0100 | <monochrom> | TIL bash C-x C-e edit-and-execute-command. |
| 2024-11-06 02:58:17 +0100 | <monochrom> | Thanks constxd. I had always opened up emacs and draft my command when I needed that. |
| 2024-11-06 02:58:20 +0100 | <probie> | hellwolf: Perhaps https://ghc.gitlab.haskell.org/ghc/doc/users_guide/exts/liberal_type_synonyms.html can do what you want, but it is still rather restricted |
| 2024-11-06 02:58:22 +0100 | CoolMa7 | (~CoolMa7@ip5f5b8957.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 02:58:35 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <zwro> just like pressing v inside less opens your $EDITOR |
| 2024-11-06 02:58:41 +0100 | flounders | (~flounders@2607:fb91:f6f:855:576:16c:1a7a:3eb2) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 02:59:20 +0100 | ljdarj | (~Thunderbi@user/ljdarj) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 02:59:35 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 03:00:28 +0100 | flounders | (~flounders@173.246.200.74) flounders |
| 2024-11-06 03:00:39 +0100 | <monochrom> | Yeah edit-and-execute would be great, both easy and valuable. |
| 2024-11-06 03:02:01 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <zwro> also if you have vi-style bindings in your shell with `set -o vi`, pressing v while in normal mode also achieves this |
| 2024-11-06 03:02:10 +0100 | monochrom | can now use C-x C-e to take time to craft docker commands that have 20 options... |
| 2024-11-06 03:03:20 +0100 | <monochrom> | I can also tell my students about this. It will help in the unix course. |
| 2024-11-06 03:04:42 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 03:05:07 +0100 | spew | (~spew@201.141.99.170) (Quit: spew) |
| 2024-11-06 03:06:47 +0100 | <monochrom> | Is it actually provided by the underlying readline? Because once upon a time, GHCi used readline as opposed to today's haskeline... |
| 2024-11-06 03:07:37 +0100 | <monochrom> | Would be funny if GHCi missed that opportunity... |
| 2024-11-06 03:08:36 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <zwro> ghci used readline? how i miss vim bindings in ghci |
| 2024-11-06 03:10:06 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <zwro> oh wait, does haskeline support it? |
| 2024-11-06 03:10:24 +0100 | <monochrom> | I think no. I just tried. |
| 2024-11-06 03:10:46 +0100 | <Leary> | zwro: echo 'editMode: Vi' > ~/.haskeline |
| 2024-11-06 03:11:10 +0100 | <monochrom> | Oh just vim bindings. Then yeah. |
| 2024-11-06 03:12:15 +0100 | machinedgod | (~machinedg@d108-173-18-100.abhsia.telus.net) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 03:13:11 +0100 | notzmv | (~daniel@user/notzmv) notzmv |
| 2024-11-06 03:14:21 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <zwro> Leary: tyvm |
| 2024-11-06 03:14:58 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 03:17:37 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> Ah! finally. https://hackage.haskell.org/package/ghcitui is the one I was thinking of. |
| 2024-11-06 03:17:56 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> needs more users |
| 2024-11-06 03:19:03 +0100 | <geekosaur> | ghci originally used readline, but that caused build issues on Windows (not there) and Macs (Apple ships a fake "readline") so someone wrote haskeline |
| 2024-11-06 03:19:18 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 03:26:31 +0100 | <monochrom> | Hrm I should try that. |
| 2024-11-06 03:28:52 +0100 | <monochrom> | Hrm it wants containers >= 0.6.8? That's neeewwww.... |
| 2024-11-06 03:30:21 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 03:34:48 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 03:40:32 +0100 | CoolMa7 | (~CoolMa7@ip5f5b8957.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) CoolMa7 |
| 2024-11-06 03:41:22 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> stack notes added at https://github.com/CrystalSplitter/ghcitui/issues/30 |
| 2024-11-06 03:44:57 +0100 | CoolMa7 | (~CoolMa7@ip5f5b8957.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 03:50:26 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 03:55:12 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 04:02:02 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 04:08:47 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 04:10:23 +0100 | comonad | (~comonad@p200300d0272bda000e01a379c24cc428.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 04:19:18 +0100 | tyzef | (~tyzef@user/tyzef) tyzef |
| 2024-11-06 04:19:19 +0100 | tyzef | (~tyzef@user/tyzef) (Max SendQ exceeded) |
| 2024-11-06 04:20:05 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 04:24:32 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 04:28:47 +0100 | alp | (~alp@2001:861:e3d6:8f80:fdaa:b613:f8c7:f917) |
| 2024-11-06 04:28:47 +0100 | gentauro | (~gentauro@user/gentauro) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2024-11-06 04:30:02 +0100 | abenson | (~user@109.255.240.83) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2024-11-06 04:30:11 +0100 | alp | (~alp@2001:861:e3d6:8f80:fdaa:b613:f8c7:f917) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2024-11-06 04:30:29 +0100 | alp | (~alp@2001:861:e3d6:8f80:a9c3:b9df:2274:a98b) |
| 2024-11-06 04:31:53 +0100 | alp | (~alp@2001:861:e3d6:8f80:a9c3:b9df:2274:a98b) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2024-11-06 04:32:12 +0100 | alp | (~alp@2001:861:e3d6:8f80:ffbd:ecef:4bf1:f51f) |
| 2024-11-06 04:32:54 +0100 | GoldsteinQ | (~goldstein@goldstein.rs) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 04:33:54 +0100 | alp_ | (~alp@2001:861:e3d6:8f80:f3e5:33f2:cda6:f534) |
| 2024-11-06 04:34:30 +0100 | gentauro | (~gentauro@user/gentauro) gentauro |
| 2024-11-06 04:35:27 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 04:35:37 +0100 | alp__ | (~alp@2001:861:e3d6:8f80:9d69:6c3d:dedb:c846) |
| 2024-11-06 04:35:38 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> e |
| 2024-11-06 04:37:48 +0100 | alp | (~alp@2001:861:e3d6:8f80:ffbd:ecef:4bf1:f51f) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
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| 2024-11-06 04:40:14 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 04:40:22 +0100 | CoolMa7 | (~CoolMa7@ip5f5b8957.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) CoolMa7 |
| 2024-11-06 04:40:36 +0100 | alp__ | (~alp@2001:861:e3d6:8f80:9d69:6c3d:dedb:c846) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 04:45:04 +0100 | CoolMa7 | (~CoolMa7@ip5f5b8957.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
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| 2024-11-06 04:50:51 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
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| 2024-11-06 04:53:39 +0100 | td_ | (~td@i53870906.versanet.de) td_ |
| 2024-11-06 04:55:29 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 05:06:12 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
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| 2024-11-06 05:18:03 +0100 | califax | (~califax@user/califx) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2024-11-06 05:18:03 +0100 | stiell_ | (~stiell@gateway/tor-sasl/stiell) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2024-11-06 05:18:18 +0100 | califax | (~califax@user/califx) califx |
| 2024-11-06 05:18:33 +0100 | stiell_ | (~stiell@gateway/tor-sasl/stiell) stiell |
| 2024-11-06 05:20:24 +0100 | peterbecich | (~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) peterbecich |
| 2024-11-06 05:21:34 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 05:23:13 +0100 | Square2 | (~Square4@user/square) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 05:26:09 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 05:36:03 +0100 | dolio | (~dolio@130.44.140.168) (Quit: ZNC 1.9.1 - https://znc.in) |
| 2024-11-06 05:36:17 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
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| 2024-11-06 05:41:37 +0100 | CoolMa7 | (~CoolMa7@ip5f5b8957.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) CoolMa7 |
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| 2024-11-06 05:54:19 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
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| 2024-11-06 06:01:55 +0100 | finsternis | (~X@23.226.237.192) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2024-11-06 06:02:10 +0100 | haveo | (~weechat@pacamara.iuwt.fr) haveo |
| 2024-11-06 06:02:42 +0100 | immae | (~immae@2a01:4f8:141:53e7::) immae |
| 2024-11-06 06:04:06 +0100 | tyzef | (~tyzef@user/tyzef) tyzef |
| 2024-11-06 06:09:43 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 06:14:26 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 06:25:04 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
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| 2024-11-06 06:32:34 +0100 | sroso | (~sroso@user/SrOso) SrOso |
| 2024-11-06 06:35:41 +0100 | CoolMa7 | (~CoolMa7@ip5f5b8957.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) CoolMa7 |
| 2024-11-06 06:37:18 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 06:40:14 +0100 | CoolMa7 | (~CoolMa7@ip5f5b8957.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
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| 2024-11-06 06:42:39 +0100 | fired | (LA@2600:3c00::f03c:92ff:fee3:aace) |
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| 2024-11-06 06:48:22 +0100 | comonad | (~comonad@p200300d0272bda000e01a379c24cc428.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 2024-11-06 06:52:38 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
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| 2024-11-06 07:08:03 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
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| 2024-11-06 07:19:57 +0100 | wootehfoot | (~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2024-11-06 07:23:26 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 07:23:35 +0100 | tyzef | (~tyzef@user/tyzef) (Quit: It was nice to meet you o/) |
| 2024-11-06 07:27:42 +0100 | CoolMa7 | (~CoolMa7@95.91.137.87) CoolMa7 |
| 2024-11-06 07:28:02 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 07:31:00 +0100 | down200 | (~down200@shell.lug.mtu.edu) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 07:31:43 +0100 | ft | (~ft@p4fc2a216.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Quit: leaving) |
| 2024-11-06 07:32:17 +0100 | CoolMa7 | (~CoolMa7@95.91.137.87) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 07:32:18 +0100 | down200 | (~down200@shell.lug.mtu.edu) down200 |
| 2024-11-06 07:38:17 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 07:41:50 +0100 | michalz | (~michalz@185.246.207.201) |
| 2024-11-06 07:42:06 +0100 | hgolden_ | (~hgolden@204.152.216.122) hgolden |
| 2024-11-06 07:43:21 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 07:44:30 +0100 | hgolden | (~hgolden@static-198-44-129-51.cust.tzulo.com) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 07:47:47 +0100 | oneeyedalien | (~oneeyedal@user/oneeyedalien) oneeyedalien |
| 2024-11-06 07:50:37 +0100 | oneeyedalien | (~oneeyedal@user/oneeyedalien) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2024-11-06 07:51:23 +0100 | tromp | (~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) |
| 2024-11-06 07:52:41 +0100 | acidjnk | (~acidjnk@p200300d6e7283f63c008ff7276864804.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) acidjnk |
| 2024-11-06 07:53:38 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
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| 2024-11-06 07:59:16 +0100 | CoolMa7 | (~CoolMa7@ip5f5b8957.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) CoolMa7 |
| 2024-11-06 08:03:01 +0100 | tyzef | (~tyzef@user/tyzef) tyzef |
| 2024-11-06 08:03:01 +0100 | tyzef | (~tyzef@user/tyzef) (Max SendQ exceeded) |
| 2024-11-06 08:03:36 +0100 | CoolMa7 | (~CoolMa7@ip5f5b8957.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 08:04:12 +0100 | xff0x | (~xff0x@fsb6a9491c.tkyc517.ap.nuro.jp) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 08:06:00 +0100 | xff0x | (~xff0x@fsb6a9491c.tkyc517.ap.nuro.jp) |
| 2024-11-06 08:09:00 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 08:09:05 +0100 | ubert | (~Thunderbi@77.119.163.56.wireless.dyn.drei.com) ubert |
| 2024-11-06 08:09:06 +0100 | libertyprime | (~libertypr@118-92-73-199.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz) libertyprime |
| 2024-11-06 08:14:06 +0100 | Guest7 | (~Guest7@syn-172-249-181-078.res.spectrum.com) |
| 2024-11-06 08:16:49 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 08:18:21 +0100 | Guest7 | (~Guest7@syn-172-249-181-078.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 08:23:49 +0100 | libertyprime | (~libertypr@118-92-73-199.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 08:26:37 +0100 | sord937 | (~sord937@gateway/tor-sasl/sord937) sord937 |
| 2024-11-06 08:27:33 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 08:32:42 +0100 | tromp | (~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
| 2024-11-06 08:33:01 +0100 | libertyprime | (~libertypr@118-92-73-199.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz) libertyprime |
| 2024-11-06 08:34:24 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 08:35:00 +0100 | CoolMa7 | (~CoolMa7@ip5f5b8957.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) CoolMa7 |
| 2024-11-06 08:35:04 +0100 | weary-traveler | (~user@user/user363627) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2024-11-06 08:35:19 +0100 | CoolMa7 | (~CoolMa7@ip5f5b8957.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) (Client Quit) |
| 2024-11-06 08:39:18 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 08:41:27 +0100 | peterbecich | (~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) (Quit: peterbecich) |
| 2024-11-06 08:41:44 +0100 | peterbecich | (~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) peterbecich |
| 2024-11-06 08:44:54 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
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| 2024-11-06 08:46:51 +0100 | CoolMa7 | (~CoolMa7@ip5f5b8957.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) CoolMa7 |
| 2024-11-06 08:47:25 +0100 | tromp | (~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) |
| 2024-11-06 08:47:46 +0100 | Lord_of_Life_ | (~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915) Lord_of_Life |
| 2024-11-06 08:48:40 +0100 | gorignak | (~gorignak@user/gorignak) gorignak |
| 2024-11-06 08:48:47 +0100 | Lord_of_Life | (~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 08:49:39 +0100 | libertyprime | (~libertypr@118-92-73-199.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 08:50:44 +0100 | Lord_of_Life_ | Lord_of_Life |
| 2024-11-06 08:52:11 +0100 | CoolMa7 | (~CoolMa7@ip5f5b8957.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
| 2024-11-06 08:53:37 +0100 | lortabac | (~lortabac@2a01:e0a:541:b8f0:55ab:e185:7f81:54a4) lortabac |
| 2024-11-06 08:55:56 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 09:00:02 +0100 | caconym | (~caconym@user/caconym) (Quit: bye) |
| 2024-11-06 09:00:18 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 09:00:40 +0100 | caconym | (~caconym@user/caconym) caconym |
| 2024-11-06 09:03:06 +0100 | Sgeo | (~Sgeo@user/sgeo) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2024-11-06 09:11:15 +0100 | JuanDaugherty | (~juan@user/JuanDaugherty) JuanDaugherty |
| 2024-11-06 09:11:18 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 09:11:45 +0100 | _d0t | (~{-d0t-}@user/-d0t-/x-7915216) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2024-11-06 09:12:34 +0100 | _d0t | (~{-d0t-}@user/-d0t-/x-7915216) {-d0t-} |
| 2024-11-06 09:16:34 +0100 | misterfish | (~misterfis@84.53.85.146) misterfish |
| 2024-11-06 09:16:49 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@128-137-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 09:21:06 +0100 | ubert | (~Thunderbi@77.119.163.56.wireless.dyn.drei.com) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 09:33:39 +0100 | notzmv | (~daniel@user/notzmv) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 09:34:29 +0100 | libertyprime | (~libertypr@118-92-73-199.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz) libertyprime |
| 2024-11-06 09:39:44 +0100 | Smiles | (uid551636@id-551636.lymington.irccloud.com) Smiles |
| 2024-11-06 09:41:31 +0100 | sprotte24 | (~sprotte24@p200300d16f45f600d44fabb86373a0dc.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 2024-11-06 09:42:12 +0100 | libertyprime | (~libertypr@118-92-73-199.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 09:51:31 +0100 | longlongdouble | (~longlongd@2405:201:5c16:135:1989:242:cab1:419a) |
| 2024-11-06 09:52:38 +0100 | kuribas | (~user@ip-188-118-57-242.reverse.destiny.be) |
| 2024-11-06 09:59:01 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@77.242.116.146) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 10:00:21 +0100 | machinedgod | (~machinedg@d108-173-18-100.abhsia.telus.net) machinedgod |
| 2024-11-06 10:07:35 +0100 | supercode | (~supercode@user/supercode) supercode |
| 2024-11-06 10:10:51 +0100 | sprotte24 | (~sprotte24@p200300d16f45f600d44fabb86373a0dc.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2024-11-06 10:16:30 +0100 | tzh | (~tzh@c-76-115-131-146.hsd1.or.comcast.net) (Quit: zzz) |
| 2024-11-06 10:17:38 +0100 | ljdarj | (~Thunderbi@user/ljdarj) ljdarj |
| 2024-11-06 10:22:09 +0100 | lxsameer | (~lxsameer@Serene/lxsameer) lxsameer |
| 2024-11-06 10:27:22 +0100 | supercode | (~supercode@user/supercode) (Quit: Client closed) |
| 2024-11-06 10:33:45 +0100 | libertyprime | (~libertypr@118-92-73-199.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz) libertyprime |
| 2024-11-06 10:45:34 +0100 | xff0x | (~xff0x@fsb6a9491c.tkyc517.ap.nuro.jp) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 10:45:35 +0100 | kritzefitz | (~kritzefit@debian/kritzefitz) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 10:47:28 +0100 | kritzefitz | (~kritzefit@debian/kritzefitz) kritzefitz |
| 2024-11-06 10:48:32 +0100 | zero | yin |
| 2024-11-06 10:48:50 +0100 | <yin> | ugh. ghcitui uses monad transformers |
| 2024-11-06 10:54:01 +0100 | ubert | (~Thunderbi@77.119.163.56.wireless.dyn.drei.com) ubert |
| 2024-11-06 10:56:38 +0100 | chele | (~chele@user/chele) chele |
| 2024-11-06 10:57:42 +0100 | misterfish | (~misterfis@84.53.85.146) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 10:57:53 +0100 | rvalue | (~rvalue@user/rvalue) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2024-11-06 10:58:24 +0100 | rvalue | (~rvalue@user/rvalue) rvalue |
| 2024-11-06 10:58:56 +0100 | misterfish | (~misterfis@84.53.85.146) misterfish |
| 2024-11-06 11:02:28 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@77.242.116.146) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 11:05:08 +0100 | <institor> | yin: so? |
| 2024-11-06 11:08:59 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@77.242.116.146) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 11:16:51 +0100 | <yin> | i'm allergic to mtl |
| 2024-11-06 11:17:56 +0100 | <yin> | seems like an unnecessary opinionated dependence |
| 2024-11-06 11:19:41 +0100 | <Leary> | transformers isn't mtl |
| 2024-11-06 11:22:56 +0100 | JuanDaugherty | (~juan@user/JuanDaugherty) (Quit: JuanDaugherty) |
| 2024-11-06 11:23:58 +0100 | <institor> | yin: how do you layer effects then |
| 2024-11-06 11:24:18 +0100 | <institor> | yin: e.g. ExceptT e IO a, for IO actions that might fail |
| 2024-11-06 11:24:40 +0100 | <institor> | i suppose you could use one of those fancy effects libraries, but that seems even more opinionated |
| 2024-11-06 11:25:59 +0100 | <Leary> | Bad example; any IO action might fail, and its built in exception system is recommended over ExceptT. |
| 2024-11-06 11:26:46 +0100 | <institor> | well suppose i'm running HTTP requests |
| 2024-11-06 11:26:52 +0100 | <institor> | and i could get Right with some payload |
| 2024-11-06 11:26:57 +0100 | <institor> | or Left in the event of a 4xx or 5xx error |
| 2024-11-06 11:27:10 +0100 | <institor> | it's really the Either after runExceptT that I care about |
| 2024-11-06 11:33:53 +0100 | <yin> | institor: you don't *need* transformers but i get that they are useful. in any case, i defend that their use should be internal and not exposed to the user of your library |
| 2024-11-06 11:35:54 +0100 | <yin> | see yesod, servant, warp... |
| 2024-11-06 11:38:15 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@77.242.116.146) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 11:38:41 +0100 | longlongdouble | (~longlongd@2405:201:5c16:135:1989:242:cab1:419a) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 11:41:33 +0100 | <yin> | Leary: right, i should have said transformers and not mtl in particular |
| 2024-11-06 11:41:56 +0100 | l-Shane-l | (~l-Shane-l@user/l-Shane-l) l-Shane-l |
| 2024-11-06 11:41:57 +0100 | landonf | (landonf@mac68k.info) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 11:42:08 +0100 | landonf | (landonf@mac68k.info) |
| 2024-11-06 11:42:39 +0100 | notzmv | (~daniel@user/notzmv) notzmv |
| 2024-11-06 11:42:58 +0100 | <Leary> | Weird, because unlike transformers, your objections might actually apply to mtl. The former is not at all an opinionated dependency. |
| 2024-11-06 11:42:59 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@77.242.116.146) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 11:43:10 +0100 | <institor> | yin: those libraries are all by the same author |
| 2024-11-06 11:45:55 +0100 | ash3en | (~Thunderbi@2a03:7846:b6eb:101:93ac:a90a:da67:f207) ash3en |
| 2024-11-06 11:47:15 +0100 | <Leary> | Also, ghcitui is first and foremost an executable; the library component it exposes is secondary, so the transformer usage pretty much is internal. |
| 2024-11-06 11:47:46 +0100 | <yin> | Leary: good point |
| 2024-11-06 11:48:55 +0100 | xff0x | (~xff0x@2405:6580:b080:900:3e16:56e8:fa8f:748e) |
| 2024-11-06 11:59:01 +0100 | lortabac | (~lortabac@2a01:e0a:541:b8f0:55ab:e185:7f81:54a4) (Quit: WeeChat 4.2.2) |
| 2024-11-06 12:03:17 +0100 | longlongdouble | (~longlongd@117.234.233.245) |
| 2024-11-06 12:05:17 +0100 | <mauke> | is hackage ok? |
| 2024-11-06 12:09:35 +0100 | <institor> | it's been slow |
| 2024-11-06 12:09:42 +0100 | Guest7 | (~Guest7@syn-172-249-181-078.res.spectrum.com) |
| 2024-11-06 12:10:20 +0100 | SlackCoder | (~SlackCode@64-94-63-8.ip.weststar.net.ky) SlackCoder |
| 2024-11-06 12:14:05 +0100 | Guest7 | (~Guest7@syn-172-249-181-078.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 12:15:37 +0100 | <yin> | yeah i've been getting 502s |
| 2024-11-06 12:19:03 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | it's being investigated in #hackage-infrastructure |
| 2024-11-06 12:19:06 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@77.242.116.146) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 12:19:07 +0100 | libertyprime | (~libertypr@118-92-73-199.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2024-11-06 12:20:45 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | er, #haskell-infrastructure |
| 2024-11-06 12:24:36 +0100 | tyzef | (~tyzef@user/tyzef) tyzef |
| 2024-11-06 12:31:54 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@77.242.116.146) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 12:37:38 +0100 | BolzmannPain | (~BolzmannP@user/BolzmannPain) BolzmannPain |
| 2024-11-06 12:39:08 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@77.242.116.146) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 12:40:19 +0100 | Everything | (~Everythin@195.138.86.118) Everything |
| 2024-11-06 12:42:41 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@77.242.116.146) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 12:43:05 +0100 | l-Shane-l | (~l-Shane-l@user/l-Shane-l) (Quit: Client closed) |
| 2024-11-06 12:47:51 +0100 | Pozyomka | (~pyon@user/pyon) pyon |
| 2024-11-06 12:48:13 +0100 | mreh | (~matthew@host86-128-2-51.range86-128.btcentralplus.com) mreh |
| 2024-11-06 12:48:31 +0100 | tyzef | (~tyzef@user/tyzef) (Quit: WeeChat 3.8) |
| 2024-11-06 12:52:08 +0100 | <absence> | Is anyone familiar with the internals of the effectful library and know what the parameters to the Effect kind represent? type Effect = (Type -> Type) -> Type -> Type |
| 2024-11-06 12:58:29 +0100 | sroso | (~sroso@user/SrOso) (Quit: Leaving :)) |
| 2024-11-06 13:02:37 +0100 | <absence> | Oh right, it's the monad and return value. Effect m a |
| 2024-11-06 13:04:01 +0100 | mreh | (~matthew@host86-128-2-51.range86-128.btcentralplus.com) (Quit: Lost terminal) |
| 2024-11-06 13:09:21 +0100 | emmanuelux_ | (~emmanuelu@user/emmanuelux) emmanuelux |
| 2024-11-06 13:10:02 +0100 | misterfish | (~misterfis@84.53.85.146) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 13:10:02 +0100 | motherfsck | (~motherfsc@user/motherfsck) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 13:10:27 +0100 | motherfsck | (~motherfsc@user/motherfsck) motherfsck |
| 2024-11-06 13:12:12 +0100 | emmanuelux | (~emmanuelu@user/emmanuelux) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 13:17:04 +0100 | ham2 | (~ham@user/ham) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 13:21:14 +0100 | ash3en | (~Thunderbi@2a03:7846:b6eb:101:93ac:a90a:da67:f207) (Quit: ash3en) |
| 2024-11-06 13:22:16 +0100 | ash3en | (~Thunderbi@2a03:7846:b6eb:101:93ac:a90a:da67:f207) ash3en |
| 2024-11-06 13:22:43 +0100 | Pozyomka | (~pyon@user/pyon) (Quit: brb) |
| 2024-11-06 13:24:36 +0100 | Pozyomka | (~pyon@user/pyon) pyon |
| 2024-11-06 13:27:25 +0100 | longlongdouble | (~longlongd@117.234.233.245) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2024-11-06 13:29:05 +0100 | tromp | (~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
| 2024-11-06 13:29:23 +0100 | byorgey | (~byorgey@user/byorgey) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 13:29:30 +0100 | byorgey | (~byorgey@user/byorgey) byorgey |
| 2024-11-06 13:30:19 +0100 | CoolMa7 | (~CoolMa7@128.90.141.20) CoolMa7 |
| 2024-11-06 13:35:38 +0100 | CoolMa7_ | (~CoolMa7@ip5f5b8957.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) CoolMa7 |
| 2024-11-06 13:36:26 +0100 | ham2 | (~ham@user/ham) ham |
| 2024-11-06 13:36:45 +0100 | CoolMa7 | (~CoolMa7@128.90.141.20) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 13:46:01 +0100 | <yin> | do we have to use text in order to import Text? |
| 2024-11-06 13:46:54 +0100 | <yin> | Data.Text |
| 2024-11-06 13:47:11 +0100 | <yin> | i ask this because base has stuff like Text.Read |
| 2024-11-06 13:48:15 +0100 | <Rembane> | yin: Nope, you can use read from Text.Read without importing Text. |
| 2024-11-06 13:54:03 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | yin: module namespace are orthogonal to packages; `base` having `Text.Read` doesn't have anything to do with `text` |
| 2024-11-06 13:54:07 +0100 | <tomsmeding> | but yes, Data.Text is in `text` |
| 2024-11-06 13:56:17 +0100 | Everything | (~Everythin@195.138.86.118) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 13:58:16 +0100 | Everything | (~Everythin@178-133-20-16.mobile.vf-ua.net) Everything |
| 2024-11-06 14:06:26 +0100 | <merijn> | Also, notably, Text.Read doesn't actually use Text :p |
| 2024-11-06 14:06:42 +0100 | BolzmannPain | (~BolzmannP@user/BolzmannPain) (Quit: Client closed) |
| 2024-11-06 14:09:09 +0100 | lortabac | (~lortabac@2a01:e0a:541:b8f0:55ab:e185:7f81:54a4) lortabac |
| 2024-11-06 14:10:40 +0100 | BolzmannPain | (~BolzmannP@user/BolzmannPain) BolzmannPain |
| 2024-11-06 14:15:00 +0100 | ash3en | (~Thunderbi@2a03:7846:b6eb:101:93ac:a90a:da67:f207) (Quit: ash3en) |
| 2024-11-06 14:16:09 +0100 | CoolMa7_ | (~CoolMa7@ip5f5b8957.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
| 2024-11-06 14:17:31 +0100 | TheCoffeMaker | (~TheCoffeM@user/thecoffemaker) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2024-11-06 14:17:45 +0100 | <yin> | merijn: yeah i was confused |
| 2024-11-06 14:18:28 +0100 | TheCoffeMaker | (~TheCoffeM@user/thecoffemaker) TheCoffeMaker |
| 2024-11-06 14:18:31 +0100 | <yin> | hackage being down didn't help |
| 2024-11-06 14:23:06 +0100 | lxsameer | (~lxsameer@Serene/lxsameer) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 14:24:59 +0100 | BolzmannPain | (~BolzmannP@user/BolzmannPain) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 14:27:46 +0100 | ash3en | (~Thunderbi@2a03:7846:b6eb:101:93ac:a90a:da67:f207) ash3en |
| 2024-11-06 14:27:50 +0100 | ash3en | (~Thunderbi@2a03:7846:b6eb:101:93ac:a90a:da67:f207) (Client Quit) |
| 2024-11-06 14:28:13 +0100 | Guest7 | (~Guest7@syn-172-249-181-078.res.spectrum.com) |
| 2024-11-06 14:31:36 +0100 | Otabek | (~Otabek@213.230.93.9) |
| 2024-11-06 14:32:13 +0100 | <Otabek> | hey there |
| 2024-11-06 14:32:55 +0100 | Guest7 | (~Guest7@syn-172-249-181-078.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 14:41:37 +0100 | Versality | (~Versality@user/Versality) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2024-11-06 14:41:51 +0100 | Versality | (~Versality@user/Versality) Versality |
| 2024-11-06 14:42:06 +0100 | Otabek | (~Otabek@213.230.93.9) (Quit: Client closed) |
| 2024-11-06 14:47:54 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@77.242.116.146) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 14:48:53 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@77.242.116.146) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 14:49:26 +0100 | ash3en | (~Thunderbi@2a03:7846:b6eb:101:93ac:a90a:da67:f207) ash3en |
| 2024-11-06 14:51:06 +0100 | weary-traveler | (~user@user/user363627) user363627 |
| 2024-11-06 14:51:51 +0100 | euleritian | (~euleritia@ip4d16fc38.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 14:52:50 +0100 | euleritian | (~euleritia@dynamic-176-007-150-185.176.7.pool.telefonica.de) |
| 2024-11-06 14:55:50 +0100 | tromp | (~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) |
| 2024-11-06 14:57:34 +0100 | lortabac | (~lortabac@2a01:e0a:541:b8f0:55ab:e185:7f81:54a4) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 15:04:22 +0100 | BolzmannPain | (~BolzmannP@user/BolzmannPain) BolzmannPain |
| 2024-11-06 15:05:41 +0100 | ljdarj | (~Thunderbi@user/ljdarj) (Quit: ljdarj) |
| 2024-11-06 15:05:59 +0100 | ljdarj | (~Thunderbi@user/ljdarj) ljdarj |
| 2024-11-06 15:07:26 +0100 | ystael | (~ystael@user/ystael) ystael |
| 2024-11-06 15:08:19 +0100 | ljdarj1 | (~Thunderbi@user/ljdarj) ljdarj |
| 2024-11-06 15:12:43 +0100 | ljdarj | (~Thunderbi@user/ljdarj) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 15:12:43 +0100 | ljdarj1 | ljdarj |
| 2024-11-06 15:12:44 +0100 | ash3en | (~Thunderbi@2a03:7846:b6eb:101:93ac:a90a:da67:f207) (Quit: ash3en) |
| 2024-11-06 15:12:59 +0100 | ash3en | (~Thunderbi@2a03:7846:b6eb:101:93ac:a90a:da67:f207) ash3en |
| 2024-11-06 15:18:23 +0100 | CoolMa7 | (~CoolMa7@95.91.137.87) CoolMa7 |
| 2024-11-06 15:21:41 +0100 | SlackCoder | (~SlackCode@64-94-63-8.ip.weststar.net.ky) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2024-11-06 15:23:49 +0100 | <Inst> | honestly, when i think about it, and after arguing with lispers as to whether they have monads |
| 2024-11-06 15:24:21 +0100 | <Inst> | one of haskell's unique strengths is having both purity / referential transparency and a strong static type system |
| 2024-11-06 15:24:50 +0100 | <Inst> | when you look at (a -> a), without strong static types and pure functions, Normand's right in that this function cuold mean anything |
| 2024-11-06 15:25:06 +0100 | <Inst> | just as, in Haskell, it could be anything when you stuff in unsafePerformIO |
| 2024-11-06 15:26:02 +0100 | <Inst> | Haskell, unique for not-completely-research languages, with its type system and effect control, allows people to have a true concept of a composable pure function |
| 2024-11-06 15:31:41 +0100 | Square2 | (~Square4@user/square) Square |
| 2024-11-06 15:31:43 +0100 | <yin> | wasn't there an alternative to hackage for documentation? |
| 2024-11-06 15:32:11 +0100 | ash3en | (~Thunderbi@2a03:7846:b6eb:101:93ac:a90a:da67:f207) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2024-11-06 15:35:56 +0100 | <kuribas> | Inst: don't confuse (a -> a) with (Any -> Any). |
| 2024-11-06 15:36:40 +0100 | <kuribas> | Firstly, (a -> a) is typechecked, unlike the Any one. Secondly it requires the input type to be equal to the output type. |
| 2024-11-06 15:36:50 +0100 | <kuribas> | That already reduces the number of possible types. |
| 2024-11-06 15:37:33 +0100 | <kuribas> | Inst: with side effects you would get something like ocaml. |
| 2024-11-06 15:38:38 +0100 | noblehelm | (~noblehelm@200.17.111.30) noblehelm |
| 2024-11-06 15:39:48 +0100 | son0p | (~ff@181.237.206.243) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 15:42:55 +0100 | <Leary> | yin: stackage.org |
| 2024-11-06 15:46:26 +0100 | aforemny | (~aforemny@i577B13E8.versanet.de) aforemny |
| 2024-11-06 15:48:09 +0100 | turlando | (~turlando@user/turlando) () |
| 2024-11-06 15:49:38 +0100 | Everything | (~Everythin@178-133-20-16.mobile.vf-ua.net) (Quit: leaving) |
| 2024-11-06 15:51:05 +0100 | tromp | (~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2024-11-06 15:54:16 +0100 | Guest7 | (~Guest7@syn-172-249-181-078.res.spectrum.com) |
| 2024-11-06 15:58:29 +0100 | Guest7 | (~Guest7@syn-172-249-181-078.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 16:05:11 +0100 | tzh | (~tzh@c-76-115-131-146.hsd1.or.comcast.net) tzh |
| 2024-11-06 16:06:37 +0100 | JuanDaugherty | (~juan@user/JuanDaugherty) JuanDaugherty |
| 2024-11-06 16:16:38 +0100 | alphazone | (~alphazone@2.219.56.221) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 16:18:12 +0100 | <yin> | Leary: ty |
| 2024-11-06 16:25:01 +0100 | alphazone | (~alphazone@2.219.56.221) |
| 2024-11-06 16:25:55 +0100 | ash3en | (~Thunderbi@2a03:7846:b6eb:101:93ac:a90a:da67:f207) ash3en |
| 2024-11-06 16:26:44 +0100 | spew | (~spew@201.141.99.170) spew |
| 2024-11-06 16:27:03 +0100 | noblehelm | (~noblehelm@200.17.111.30) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 16:30:27 +0100 | ash3en | (~Thunderbi@2a03:7846:b6eb:101:93ac:a90a:da67:f207) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 16:38:15 +0100 | hiecaq | (~hiecaq@user/hiecaq) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2024-11-06 16:42:16 +0100 | EvanR | (~EvanR@user/evanr) EvanR |
| 2024-11-06 16:43:29 +0100 | spew | (~spew@201.141.99.170) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2024-11-06 16:44:59 +0100 | kilolympus | (~kilolympu@2a04:ee41:4:32b3:6573:d8d:c873:5381) kilolympus |
| 2024-11-06 16:45:20 +0100 | <kilolympus> | Hi, not sure if this is the right place to ask, but is Hackage down for other people as well? |
| 2024-11-06 16:47:08 +0100 | BolzmannPain | (~BolzmannP@user/BolzmannPain) (Quit: Client closed) |
| 2024-11-06 16:48:03 +0100 | <kuribas> | yes |
| 2024-11-06 16:50:35 +0100 | ash3en | (~Thunderbi@2a03:7846:b6eb:101:93ac:a90a:da67:f207) ash3en |
| 2024-11-06 16:51:13 +0100 | ash3en | (~Thunderbi@2a03:7846:b6eb:101:93ac:a90a:da67:f207) (Client Quit) |
| 2024-11-06 16:51:31 +0100 | lxsameer | (~lxsameer@Serene/lxsameer) lxsameer |
| 2024-11-06 16:53:10 +0100 | misterfish | (~misterfis@84.53.85.146) misterfish |
| 2024-11-06 17:00:21 +0100 | lbseale_ | (~quassel@user/ep1ctetus) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 17:02:02 +0100 | <JuanDaugherty> | its maintained by some guy isn it? |
| 2024-11-06 17:02:34 +0100 | <JuanDaugherty> | rather than glasgow or whatever |
| 2024-11-06 17:02:54 +0100 | <JuanDaugherty> | expect outages in such a situation |
| 2024-11-06 17:03:01 +0100 | <Hecate> | it's not "maintained by some guy" |
| 2024-11-06 17:03:16 +0100 | <Hecate> | there has been lots of traffic from malicious AI scraper bots |
| 2024-11-06 17:03:29 +0100 | <JuanDaugherty> | ah |
| 2024-11-06 17:03:30 +0100 | <Hecate> | and the tech team is tweaking the cloudflare config right now |
| 2024-11-06 17:03:39 +0100 | <JuanDaugherty> | i c |
| 2024-11-06 17:03:41 +0100 | <Hecate> | I've seen them in my own application logs as well |
| 2024-11-06 17:05:47 +0100 | <Inst> | (a -> a) also implies that there's no ability to read the content of the data besides knowing that it exists |
| 2024-11-06 17:06:29 +0100 | <Inst> | thanks for all the work, Hecate |
| 2024-11-06 17:07:00 +0100 | <Inst> | also (Any -> Any) is actually (a -> b), when you think of it, no? |
| 2024-11-06 17:07:08 +0100 | <Inst> | kuribas |
| 2024-11-06 17:08:49 +0100 | <Inst> | hmmm, probably not, since it makes itself meaningful by Any being a wrapper over types, i.e, if you consider Any -> Any to be typeless, it's essentially (a -> b), if you consider Any -> Any to be equivalent to Dynamic -> Dynamic, then it's a different content |
| 2024-11-06 17:09:01 +0100 | sprotte24 | (~sprotte24@p200300d16f45f600c5ad94218b2aa1c2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 2024-11-06 17:09:52 +0100 | spew | (~spew@201.141.99.170) spew |
| 2024-11-06 17:10:20 +0100 | <JuanDaugherty> | the apex doesn even refer to hackage, just blather about 'community' |
| 2024-11-06 17:12:17 +0100 | Digitteknohippie | (~user@user/digit) Digit |
| 2024-11-06 17:12:44 +0100 | Digit | (~user@user/digit) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 17:12:50 +0100 | Guest7 | (~Guest7@syn-172-249-181-078.res.spectrum.com) |
| 2024-11-06 17:13:00 +0100 | <EvanR> | Inst, Any (uhg at this name, but it corresponds with typescript) means you don't know what the type is. a -> b means the caller can choose to instantiate a or b at any type they want |
| 2024-11-06 17:13:30 +0100 | <Inst> | iirc there's an Any in the GHC internal somewhere |
| 2024-11-06 17:13:31 +0100 | <EvanR> | so Any = some type, while a = any type. |
| 2024-11-06 17:13:48 +0100 | <EvanR> | that's what we're talking about |
| 2024-11-06 17:14:29 +0100 | <Inst> | what does Any -> Any even mean in a Haskell context? |
| 2024-11-06 17:15:00 +0100 | <EvanR> | it's a function type for functions that expect an Any as argument (explained above) and return an Any, which is not necessarily related to the input at all |
| 2024-11-06 17:15:02 +0100 | JuanDaugherty | (~juan@user/JuanDaugherty) (Quit: JuanDaugherty) |
| 2024-11-06 17:16:13 +0100 | Sgeo | (~Sgeo@user/sgeo) Sgeo |
| 2024-11-06 17:16:18 +0100 | <ncf> | if you think of Any as (∃ a. a) then it is isomorphic to (); in other words you can't do anything safe with an Any without making assumptions that are not tracked by the types |
| 2024-11-06 17:17:16 +0100 | <kuribas> | Inst: no, (a -> b) is type checked, (Any -> Any) is not, except for the number of inputs. |
| 2024-11-06 17:17:29 +0100 | tomboy64 | (~tomboy64@user/tomboy64) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 17:17:35 +0100 | <Inst> | is it? |
| 2024-11-06 17:17:36 +0100 | <kuribas> | Inst: yeah, it's like Dynamic -> Dynamic. |
| 2024-11-06 17:17:41 +0100 | <Inst> | since (Any -> Any) is a member of Any |
| 2024-11-06 17:18:06 +0100 | <EvanR> | it's not like Dynamic because Dynamic can actually be used safely, in ways that aren't just STLC with 1 base type |
| 2024-11-06 17:18:09 +0100 | <Inst> | i was just looking for whether or not the argument that only Haskell has true functions has ever been made |
| 2024-11-06 17:18:36 +0100 | <Inst> | it's weird because I'm the guy lambasting "pure, functional programming" as meaningless, but now I'm going back to "pure, functional programming" is good |
| 2024-11-06 17:18:38 +0100 | <kuribas> | True functions are total. |
| 2024-11-06 17:18:51 +0100 | <EvanR> | I object to your theory that "Any -> Any is a member of Any" as if Any (a type) is a set, and it's members are types |
| 2024-11-06 17:19:08 +0100 | <EvanR> | or that it is a class and it's instances are types |
| 2024-11-06 17:19:22 +0100 | <Inst> | What is your objection? |
| 2024-11-06 17:19:27 +0100 | <EvanR> | that that makes no sense |
| 2024-11-06 17:19:31 +0100 | Guest7 | (~Guest7@syn-172-249-181-078.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 17:19:51 +0100 | <EvanR> | we discussed positively 2 ways you can explain what Any means |
| 2024-11-06 17:20:01 +0100 | <EvanR> | "a set of types" is not one of them |
| 2024-11-06 17:20:04 +0100 | TonyStone | (~TonyStone@user/TonyStone) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 17:20:19 +0100 | Digitteknohippie | Digit |
| 2024-11-06 17:20:40 +0100 | <EvanR> | it's also not a supertype since we don't have subtypes |
| 2024-11-06 17:20:59 +0100 | <EvanR> | "purely function programming" is not meaningless |
| 2024-11-06 17:21:28 +0100 | <EvanR> | though not everyone knows what this is supposed to mean, some people hear it and think they're talking about proportion of paradigms the language is based on |
| 2024-11-06 17:21:35 +0100 | <Inst> | it refers to functional programming, referential transparency, and the equal result of call-by-name, call-by-value, and call-by-need function calls |
| 2024-11-06 17:21:50 +0100 | <Inst> | it's a bit gimmicky that purely here is a term of art, not the colloquial term |
| 2024-11-06 17:21:54 +0100 | <EvanR> | like haskell is purely functional because it's 100% functional, while closure is 40% functional, or something, and so not pure lol |
| 2024-11-06 17:22:03 +0100 | <EvanR> | because they never heard of the term "pure function" before |
| 2024-11-06 17:22:14 +0100 | <Inst> | iirc there are no more "mainstream" languages than Haskell that employ purity |
| 2024-11-06 17:22:30 +0100 | <EvanR> | all functions in haskell are pure so there's that |
| 2024-11-06 17:22:32 +0100 | <Inst> | I heard that D has a concept of pure function, but it's opt in instead of opt-out, maybe I'm wrong here? |
| 2024-11-06 17:22:41 +0100 | <EvanR> | it does not |
| 2024-11-06 17:22:48 +0100 | Guest7 | (~Guest7@syn-172-249-181-078.res.spectrum.com) |
| 2024-11-06 17:22:54 +0100 | <EvanR> | D is a miserable pile of hacks and missed opportunities |
| 2024-11-06 17:23:09 +0100 | <EvanR> | refusing to look outside its C++ origins |
| 2024-11-06 17:23:15 +0100 | <EvanR> | C++ of the 90s |
| 2024-11-06 17:23:52 +0100 | <EvanR> | "concept of a pure function" was well known in lisp since forever |
| 2024-11-06 17:24:42 +0100 | <Inst> | but iirc... oh wait, lisp macros, but generally languages don't have special support for pure functions |
| 2024-11-06 17:25:31 +0100 | <Inst> | and yeah, D has a pure declaration for a function |
| 2024-11-06 17:25:33 +0100 | <Inst> | https://tour.dlang.org/tour/en/gems/functional-programming#:~:text=Pure%20functions,functions%20wh… |
| 2024-11-06 17:26:13 +0100 | <EvanR> | I wager $10 that it's for documentation purposes and doesn't actually stop side effects |
| 2024-11-06 17:26:26 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@77.242.116.146) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 17:26:28 +0100 | <Inst> | if i win, will you donate to maerwald? |
| 2024-11-06 17:27:01 +0100 | <EvanR> | I don't know what that refers to, but anyway, you're not supporting "pure functional programming is meaningless" |
| 2024-11-06 17:27:13 +0100 | <EvanR> | just that it's unpopular |
| 2024-11-06 17:27:15 +0100 | <EvanR> | which is true |
| 2024-11-06 17:27:23 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@77.242.116.146) merijn |
| 2024-11-06 17:28:06 +0100 | <Inst> | onlineapp.d(20): Error: `pure` function `onlineapp.bigPow` cannot call impure function `std.stdio.writefln!(char, BigInt).writefln` |
| 2024-11-06 17:28:20 +0100 | <Inst> | you didn't agree to the bet, so i can't try to cajole you into passing maerwald some money for GHC upkeep |
| 2024-11-06 17:28:42 +0100 | <Inst> | erm, GHCup upkeep |
| 2024-11-06 17:29:08 +0100 | <Inst> | i mean that purely functional programming, as an advertising phrase, at least, is misleading |
| 2024-11-06 17:30:14 +0100 | <EvanR> | you're misleading |
| 2024-11-06 17:30:19 +0100 | <EvanR> | or confused |
| 2024-11-06 17:30:27 +0100 | <Inst> | probably, and now is not a good time |
| 2024-11-06 17:30:35 +0100 | <Inst> | given certain events |
| 2024-11-06 17:30:58 +0100 | tomboy64 | (~tomboy64@user/tomboy64) tomboy64 |
| 2024-11-06 17:33:27 +0100 | TonyStone | (~TonyStone@user/TonyStone) TonyStone |
| 2024-11-06 17:38:46 +0100 | Smiles | (uid551636@id-551636.lymington.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) |
| 2024-11-06 17:44:48 +0100 | chele | (~chele@user/chele) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2024-11-06 17:44:48 +0100 | merijn | (~merijn@77.242.116.146) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 17:47:08 +0100 | son0p | (~ff@186.119.84.155) son0p |
| 2024-11-06 17:48:01 +0100 | euleritian | (~euleritia@dynamic-176-007-150-185.176.7.pool.telefonica.de) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2024-11-06 17:48:16 +0100 | euleritian | (~euleritia@ip4d16fc38.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) |
| 2024-11-06 17:51:57 +0100 | sprotte24 | (~sprotte24@p200300d16f45f600c5ad94218b2aa1c2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2024-11-06 18:00:51 +0100 | pabs3 | (~pabs3@user/pabs3) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 18:09:17 +0100 | jrm | (~jrm@user/jrm) (Quit: ciao) |
| 2024-11-06 18:09:57 +0100 | Guest7 | (~Guest7@syn-172-249-181-078.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 18:10:46 +0100 | jrm | (~jrm@user/jrm) jrm |
| 2024-11-06 18:13:52 +0100 | pabs3 | (~pabs3@user/pabs3) pabs3 |
| 2024-11-06 18:19:18 +0100 | peterbecich | (~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) peterbecich |
| 2024-11-06 18:27:32 +0100 | ljdarj1 | (~Thunderbi@user/ljdarj) ljdarj |
| 2024-11-06 18:29:48 +0100 | ljdarj | (~Thunderbi@user/ljdarj) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 18:29:48 +0100 | ljdarj1 | ljdarj |
| 2024-11-06 18:31:36 +0100 | kuribas | (~user@ip-188-118-57-242.reverse.destiny.be) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2024-11-06 18:35:16 +0100 | briandaed | (~root@185.234.210.211.r.toneticgroup.pl) |
| 2024-11-06 18:57:28 +0100 | peterbecich | (~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 19:01:58 +0100 | peterbecich | (~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) peterbecich |
| 2024-11-06 19:07:32 +0100 | <statusbot6> | Status update: there is a network outage affecting hackage, we are investigating -- http://status.haskell.org/pages/incident/537c07b0cf1fad5830000093/672bb063281978053cb3d85e |
| 2024-11-06 19:17:54 +0100 | jco | (~jco@78-70-217-44-no600.tbcn.telia.com) jco |
| 2024-11-06 19:19:59 +0100 | wootehfoot | (~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot) wootehfoot |
| 2024-11-06 19:22:36 +0100 | <jco> | Hey, what's up with https://hackage.haskell.org? Get 503s and it feels like that site has been having problems for a while. https://status.haskell.org seems to indicate there's an ongoing incident. Does anyone here know more about this? |
| 2024-11-06 19:23:13 +0100 | ljdarj | (~Thunderbi@user/ljdarj) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 19:23:44 +0100 | <geekosaur> | from what I've seen, it seems like a lot of AI crawlers have been hammering hackage and hoogle |
| 2024-11-06 19:23:53 +0100 | <geekosaur> | and ignoring things like robots.txt |
| 2024-11-06 19:24:42 +0100 | <institor> | that would explain the intermittent behavior |
| 2024-11-06 19:24:51 +0100 | <institor> | maybe the app server is overloaded |
| 2024-11-06 19:26:27 +0100 | <jco> | I see, thanks... |
| 2024-11-06 19:27:07 +0100 | <briandaed> | like geekosaur said, it's probably an effect of 'bot fighting' functionality from cloudflare, sclv and chreekat can shed some light.. |
| 2024-11-06 19:28:19 +0100 | <geekosaur> | that was only activated yesterday, it remains to be seen how much it's contributing because the bot spam had been going on for weeks (it's largely why hoogle was down a lot, apparently) |
| 2024-11-06 19:29:15 +0100 | peterbecich | (~Thunderbi@syn-047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 19:30:15 +0100 | pie_ | (~pie_bnc@user/pie/x-2818909) __ |
| 2024-11-06 19:30:49 +0100 | krei-se | (~krei-se@p5085d46e.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2024-11-06 19:31:22 +0100 | <briandaed> | I spend some time testing why hoogle is so slow, build it from sources and made requests same as sclv has shown us, it was spending 58% of the time calculatin inRanges https://github.com/ndmitchell/hoogle/blob/master/src/General/Util.hs#L359 |
| 2024-11-06 19:31:32 +0100 | <geekosaur> | and apparently a lot of other internet services are being affected as well |
| 2024-11-06 19:32:27 +0100 | <sm> | I set up https://haskell-status.joyful.com today, which updates quicker |
| 2024-11-06 19:33:13 +0100 | <sm> | briandaed nice |
| 2024-11-06 19:33:19 +0100 | krei-se | (~krei-se@p5085d46e.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) krei-se |
| 2024-11-06 19:33:35 +0100 | <sm> | any such optimising is valuable |
| 2024-11-06 19:34:23 +0100 | <briandaed> | had no time to dig deeper, tested on virtualized fedora with four cores and 6gigs of ram |
| 2024-11-06 19:38:18 +0100 | jco | (~jco@78-70-217-44-no600.tbcn.telia.com) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2024-11-06 19:39:22 +0100 | Tuplanolla | (~Tuplanoll@91-159-69-59.elisa-laajakaista.fi) Tuplanolla |
| 2024-11-06 19:39:38 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <Morj> Did stackage also go down just now? |
| 2024-11-06 19:39:56 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <Morj> Not according to the website, huh |
| 2024-11-06 19:40:12 +0100 | krei-se | (~krei-se@p5085d46e.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2024-11-06 19:40:21 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> no |
| 2024-11-06 19:40:52 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> unless it was very quick :) but seems unlikely |
| 2024-11-06 19:41:27 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <Morj> Yeah, it's up, just some links don't load |
| 2024-11-06 19:41:49 +0100 | <haskellbridge> | <sm> got an example Morj ? |
| 2024-11-06 19:41:50 +0100 | krei-se | (~krei-se@p5085d46e.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) krei-se |