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| 2025-05-07 23:41:19 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | embedding in javascript is very fashionable, I think |
| 2025-05-07 23:41:08 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | is it not fashionable? |
| 2025-05-07 23:40:50 +0200 | <hellwolf> | logic and "next 700 programming language" suggests embedding language is the way; but rationality not culturally fasionable atm. |
| 2025-05-07 23:40:48 +0200 | <int-e> | and it feels relevant to trying to sell Haskell :) |
| 2025-05-07 23:40:30 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | hellwolf: how advanced of a type system do you need? |
| 2025-05-07 23:40:07 +0200 | <int-e> | tomsmeding: it's a favorite |
| 2025-05-07 23:40:00 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | int-e: you've quoted that one before :p |
| 2025-05-07 23:39:37 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | building advanced type systems is tricky, yes |
| 2025-05-07 23:39:24 +0200 | <hellwolf> | I am not gonna be able to build it myself. |
| 2025-05-07 23:39:19 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | Futhark is a DSL |
| 2025-05-07 23:39:18 +0200 | <lambdabot> | these nods of agreement. "Well, I've found a new language that solves that problem." Audience: "Ooooh! How?" Me: "There's no variables!" And then they all start moving away from me slowly.... |
| 2025-05-07 23:39:18 +0200 | <lambdabot> | cjs says: I have to explain this shit to people. I mean, I start out right, "Hey, you know how you always have these bugs because what you thought was in the variable is not there?" And I get all of |
| 2025-05-07 23:39:18 +0200 | <int-e> | @quote o.v.r.a.l.s |
| 2025-05-07 23:39:09 +0200 | <hellwolf> | yea, but i need all the advanced type system. |
| 2025-05-07 23:38:54 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | it's not like Futhark is popular, really, but it does have users here and there |
| 2025-05-07 23:38:37 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | https://futhark-lang.org/ is a success story of a separate language that could very well have been an embedded one |
| 2025-05-07 23:38:20 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | if your users are not already in haskell, then it's a big downside |
| 2025-05-07 23:38:10 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | depends a lot on the audience; if you're already in haskell, then the fact that it's embedded is a selling point |
| 2025-05-07 23:38:08 +0200 | <hellwolf> | (if your goal is to have people using it.) |
| 2025-05-07 23:37:57 +0200 | <hellwolf> | but building your own language sounds so daunting and a likely burnout experience. |
| 2025-05-07 23:37:34 +0200 | <hellwolf> | I wonder which could be easier selling your own language or selling a deeply embedded language in Haskell. |
| 2025-05-07 23:36:47 +0200 | <hellwolf> | :) good place to be. |
| 2025-05-07 23:36:29 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | it's purely research so far, yes -- and because I've been publishing in PL venues so far, one doesn't need to sell FP :p |
| 2025-05-07 23:36:15 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2025-05-07 23:35:49 +0200 | <hellwolf> | *research |
| 2025-05-07 23:35:45 +0200 | <hellwolf> | or is it mostly researched? |
| 2025-05-07 23:35:39 +0200 | <hellwolf> | but you will somehow need to sell the languages you build, right? |
| 2025-05-07 23:35:23 +0200 | <hellwolf> | I see |
| 2025-05-07 23:34:28 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | most people don't build compilers |
| 2025-05-07 23:34:21 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | I like it a lot for the kind of code that I write, but I'm aware that the kind of code that I write is unlike what most people program for :p |
| 2025-05-07 23:33:54 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | I don't think I've ever tried to sell Haskell to people; people have asked me why I like the language, and I've answered, but never with the intent to _sell_ the language per se |
| 2025-05-07 23:29:31 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@host-vr.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2025-05-07 23:27:47 +0200 | <hellwolf> | (also, I will dogfood it myself, so at least there will be one user.) |
| 2025-05-07 23:27:18 +0200 | <hellwolf> | but I will try. have you ever tried to sell Haskell to people? |
| 2025-05-07 23:24:38 +0200 | ljdarj | (~Thunderbi@user/ljdarj) ljdarj |
| 2025-05-07 23:24:06 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | ah :) |
| 2025-05-07 23:23:54 +0200 | <hellwolf> | I am the manager. I am trying to convince a crowd to use it, who may not be the right audience :p |
| 2025-05-07 23:23:34 +0200 | Tuplanolla | (~Tuplanoll@91-159-69-59.elisa-laajakaista.fi) Tuplanolla |
| 2025-05-07 23:23:02 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | managers to convince that what you're doing is useful? |
| 2025-05-07 23:22:43 +0200 | weary-traveler | (~user@user/user363627) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2025-05-07 23:22:16 +0200 | <hellwolf> | kinda. but I am preaching to anti-choir. if that's an expresison. |
| 2025-05-07 23:21:44 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | sounds like fun |
| 2025-05-07 23:21:37 +0200 | <hellwolf> | and end-to-end working demo, etc. |
| 2025-05-07 23:21:25 +0200 | <hellwolf> | with repl, show code generated, or diagrams generated. |
| 2025-05-07 23:21:09 +0200 | <hellwolf> | I am happy where it is. I need to now develop some live demo technique |
| 2025-05-07 23:20:46 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | that would be a judgement call |
| 2025-05-07 23:20:33 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | the more accurate way would be to count a _modified_ line as 1 instead of 2, but then you get into what counts as a modified line and not a deletion and an insertion |
| 2025-05-07 23:19:44 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | the +421 -53 was somewhat compliated, but also a bunch of blasting out lines |
| 2025-05-07 23:19:39 +0200 | <hellwolf> | ah, should use + |
| 2025-05-07 23:19:31 +0200 | <lambdabot> | 63.4 |