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| 2025-06-02 15:37:50 +0200 | CiaoSen | (~Jura@2a02:8071:64e1:da0:5a47:caff:fe78:33db) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2025-06-02 15:36:00 +0200 | kuribas | (~user@ptr-17d51em5ayej71s7xap.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be) kuribas |
| 2025-06-02 15:32:29 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 2025-06-02 15:32:08 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2025-06-02 15:32:00 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@77.242.116.146) merijn |
| 2025-06-02 15:30:49 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@77.242.116.146) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2025-06-02 15:26:59 +0200 | AlexZenon | (~alzenon@178.34.162.18) |
| 2025-06-02 15:24:57 +0200 | AlexNoo | (~AlexNoo@178.34.162.18) |
| 2025-06-02 15:24:39 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 2025-06-02 15:24:15 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2025-06-02 15:21:53 +0200 | Frostillicus | (~Frostilli@pool-71-174-119-69.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) |
| 2025-06-02 15:19:10 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 2025-06-02 15:19:10 +0200 | Frostillicus | (~Frostilli@pool-71-174-119-69.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2025-06-02 15:18:48 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2025-06-02 15:14:07 +0200 | tromp | (~textual@2001:1c00:3487:1b00:7d34:d696:3458:218b) |
| 2025-06-02 15:12:32 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
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| 2025-06-02 15:08:28 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 2025-06-02 15:08:06 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2025-06-02 15:07:34 +0200 | ubert | (~Thunderbi@ip5f59455a.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) (Quit: ubert) |
| 2025-06-02 15:05:28 +0200 | Frostillicus | (~Frostilli@pool-71-174-119-69.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) |
| 2025-06-02 15:04:26 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
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| 2025-06-02 14:57:21 +0200 | Frostillicus | (~Frostilli@pool-71-174-119-69.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2025-06-02 14:57:06 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 2025-06-02 14:56:44 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2025-06-02 14:53:58 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | a 5-year old, or at least a 5-year-old of 10 years ago, has certainly used an eraser before |
| 2025-06-02 14:53:49 +0200 | <__monty__> | Did they not? We don't know what `z` is, maybe it's `z := y + 1`! |
| 2025-06-02 14:53:45 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | also, I posit that's primarily because of the notation using '=' |
| 2025-06-02 14:53:20 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | then they should have taken that example! |
| 2025-06-02 14:53:07 +0200 | <__monty__> | It immediately becomes less dubious with the example `y := y + 1`. |
| 2025-06-02 14:52:59 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | (another counterpoint: in the equation model, you have to keep the equations in mind in order to make sense of new ones. In the assignment model, you have to keep only the variables' values in mind) |
| 2025-06-02 14:52:50 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 2025-06-02 14:52:26 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2025-06-02 14:51:52 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | and also, the paper as a whole can be valid even if this particular claim is dubious :) |
| 2025-06-02 14:51:50 +0200 | <hellwolf> | it's amusing that some myth, or mistakes, can spread so far. |
| 2025-06-02 14:51:32 +0200 | <hellwolf> | (not saying that is a proof for it's validity) |
| 2025-06-02 14:51:31 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | well-cited papers can be wrong |
| 2025-06-02 14:51:17 +0200 | <hellwolf> | it's a well cited paper (3000+ citations) |
| 2025-06-02 14:51:10 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | (counterpoint: the formula has 3 quantities involved (old y, new y, z), whereas the assignment only has 2 (new y, z)) |
| 2025-06-02 14:50:25 +0200 | <tomsmeding> | hellwolf: it's definitely amusing, but not so sure about its validity :) |
| 2025-06-02 14:48:24 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 2025-06-02 14:48:01 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2025-06-02 14:44:32 +0200 | AlexNoo | (~AlexNoo@178.34.162.18) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2025-06-02 14:43:57 +0200 | <ski> | (in den. sem., you carry around a store mapping abstract locations to values, where those values could include other locations) |
| 2025-06-02 14:43:01 +0200 | <ski> | latter, and i suppose especially mutating references/pointers, would be harder to try to model in such a nicer way |
| 2025-06-02 14:42:46 +0200 | AlexZenon | (~alzenon@178.34.162.18) (Quit: ;-) |
| 2025-06-02 14:42:07 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 2025-06-02 14:41:43 +0200 | sabathan2 | (~sabathan@amarseille-159-1-12-107.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2025-06-02 14:41:30 +0200 | <ski> | well, one could draw a distinction between local mutation, and mutation via (possibly aliased) indirections/references/pointers (transitively) to data structures. the former can be modelled via a group of mutually tail-recursive functions (indicating labels for branching & joining, and for loops) (basically SSA, Single Static-Assignment, form) |