| 2026-06-02 00:04:50 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 00:06:39 +0000 | Pozyomka | (~pyon@user/pyon) (Quit: Fuck systemd and fuck D-Bus!!!) |
| 2026-06-02 00:11:30 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 00:12:08 +0000 | Pozyomka | (~pyon@user/pyon) pyon |
| 2026-06-02 00:13:18 +0000 | Inline | (~noOne@ipservice-092-208-182-236.092.208.pools.vodafone-ip.de) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 00:22:52 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 00:23:38 +0000 | wickedja` | (~user@2605:8d80:5432:3aa3:43c2:9d51:24ea:b6c9) |
| 2026-06-02 00:23:53 +0000 | Pozyomka | (~pyon@user/pyon) (Quit: brb) |
| 2026-06-02 00:25:10 +0000 | wickedjargon | (~user@207.194.126.24) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 00:27:52 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 00:30:08 +0000 | Pozyomka | (~pyon@user/pyon) pyon |
| 2026-06-02 00:38:40 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 00:40:21 +0000 | wickedja` | (~user@2605:8d80:5432:3aa3:43c2:9d51:24ea:b6c9) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 00:41:00 +0000 | GdeVolpiano | (~GdeVolpia@user/GdeVolpiano) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 00:43:45 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 247 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 00:47:42 +0000 | Pozyomka | (~pyon@user/pyon) (Quit: brb test) |
| 2026-06-02 00:48:55 +0000 | Pozyomka | (~pyon@user/pyon) pyon |
| 2026-06-02 00:54:11 +0000 | Pozyomka | (~pyon@user/pyon) (Quit: WeeChat 4.9.0) |
| 2026-06-02 00:54:31 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 00:59:29 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 01:01:54 +0000 | Pozyomka | (~pyon@user/pyon) pyon |
| 2026-06-02 01:10:15 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 01:12:45 +0000 | xff0x | (~xff0x@ai070051.d.east.v6connect.net) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 01:15:05 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 01:15:13 +0000 | marinelli | (~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/marinelli) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 01:15:41 +0000 | marinelli | (~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/marinelli) marinelli |
| 2026-06-02 01:18:23 +0000 | Pozyomka | (~pyon@user/pyon) (Quit: brb) |
| 2026-06-02 01:18:52 +0000 | rainbyte | (~rainbyte@181.47.219.31) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 01:19:05 +0000 | rainbyte | (~rainbyte@181.47.219.31) rainbyte |
| 2026-06-02 01:19:32 +0000 | Pozyomka | (~pyon@user/pyon) pyon |
| 2026-06-02 01:25:36 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 01:27:12 +0000 | humasect | (~humasect@dyn-192-249-132-90.nexicom.net) (Quit: Leaving...) |
| 2026-06-02 01:27:19 +0000 | Axman6 | (~Axman6@user/axman6) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 01:30:54 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 01:40:51 +0000 | Axman6 | (~Axman6@user/axman6) Axman6 |
| 2026-06-02 01:41:23 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 01:43:22 +0000 | humasect | (~humasect@dyn-192-249-132-90.nexicom.net) humasect |
| 2026-06-02 01:45:44 +0000 | acidjnk | (~acidjnk@p200300d6e700e5447240697420104f78.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 01:45:44 +0000 | acidjnk_new | (~acidjnk@p200300d6e700e5447240697420104f78.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 01:48:17 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 01:57:34 +0000 | cawfee | (root@2401:c080:3800:3460::babe) qjqqyy |
| 2026-06-02 01:59:27 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 02:04:00 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 02:11:29 +0000 | xff0x | (~xff0x@fsb6a9491c.tkyc517.ap.nuro.jp) |
| 2026-06-02 02:14:29 +0000 | td_ | (~td@i5387091C.versanet.de) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 02:15:06 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 02:16:27 +0000 | td_ | (~td@i5387092E.versanet.de) |
| 2026-06-02 02:17:54 +0000 | lisbeths | (uid135845@id-135845.lymington.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) |
| 2026-06-02 02:19:52 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 243 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 02:30:51 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 02:31:38 +0000 | chexum | (~quassel@gateway/tor-sasl/chexum) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 02:31:56 +0000 | chexum | (~quassel@gateway/tor-sasl/chexum) chexum |
| 2026-06-02 02:33:37 +0000 | skum | (~skum@user/skum) (Quit: WeeChat 4.9.0) |
| 2026-06-02 02:35:56 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 254 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 02:41:01 +0000 | user363627 | (~user@user/user363627) user363627 |
| 2026-06-02 02:44:04 +0000 | weary-traveler | (~user@user/user363627) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 02:46:37 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@62.45.136.136) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 02:47:39 +0000 | ChaiTRex | (~ChaiTRex@user/chaitrex) ChaiTRex |
| 2026-06-02 02:48:14 +0000 | Chai-T-Rex | (~ChaiTRex@user/chaitrex) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 02:50:13 +0000 | Axman6 | (~Axman6@user/axman6) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 02:51:00 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@62.45.136.136) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 02:52:07 +0000 | user363627 | (~user@user/user363627) (Quit: Konversation terminated!) |
| 2026-06-02 02:52:51 +0000 | Axman6 | (~Axman6@user/axman6) Axman6 |
| 2026-06-02 03:01:02 +0000 | gorignak | (~gorignak@user/gorignak) (Quit: quit) |
| 2026-06-02 03:01:59 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 03:07:11 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 03:07:30 +0000 | lisbeths | (uid135845@id-135845.lymington.irccloud.com) lisbeths |
| 2026-06-02 03:17:46 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 03:24:40 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 03:26:08 +0000 | michalz | (~michalz@185.246.207.221) |
| 2026-06-02 03:31:21 +0000 | m | (~travltux@user/travltux) (Quit: WeeChat 4.7.2) |
| 2026-06-02 03:32:39 +0000 | m | (~travltux@user/travltux) travltux |
| 2026-06-02 03:35:50 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 03:40:09 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 241 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 03:40:09 +0000 | gorignak | (~gorignak@user/gorignak) gorignak |
| 2026-06-02 03:47:27 +0000 | Googulator | (~Googulato@193-226-241-87.pool.digikabel.hu) (Quit: Client closed) |
| 2026-06-02 03:47:45 +0000 | Googulator | (~Googulato@193-226-241-87.pool.digikabel.hu) |
| 2026-06-02 03:47:49 +0000 | user363627 | (~user@user/user363627) user363627 |
| 2026-06-02 03:51:21 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 03:56:25 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 04:00:26 +0000 | user363627 | (~user@user/user363627) (Quit: Konversation terminated!) |
| 2026-06-02 04:05:50 +0000 | takuan | (~takuan@141.134.185.233) |
| 2026-06-02 04:07:09 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 04:09:04 +0000 | user363627 | (~user@user/user363627) user363627 |
| 2026-06-02 04:09:47 +0000 | synchromesh | (~john@2406:5a00:247e:1500:29c5:b42c:d970:297d) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2026-06-02 04:10:53 +0000 | synchromesh | (~john@2406:5a00:247e:1500:29c5:b42c:d970:297d) synchromesh |
| 2026-06-02 04:12:06 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 04:13:02 +0000 | EvanR | (~EvanR@user/evanr) EvanR |
| 2026-06-02 04:15:19 +0000 | califax | (~califax@user/califx) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 04:15:19 +0000 | ChaiTRex | (~ChaiTRex@user/chaitrex) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 04:15:19 +0000 | marinelli | (~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/marinelli) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 04:15:19 +0000 | tusko | (~uwu@user/tusko) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 04:15:19 +0000 | gmg | (~user@user/gehmehgeh) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 04:15:40 +0000 | califax | (~califax@user/califx) califx |
| 2026-06-02 04:15:41 +0000 | ChaiTRex | (~ChaiTRex@user/chaitrex) ChaiTRex |
| 2026-06-02 04:15:43 +0000 | marinelli | (~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/marinelli) marinelli |
| 2026-06-02 04:16:01 +0000 | gmg | (~user@user/gehmehgeh) gehmehgeh |
| 2026-06-02 04:19:02 +0000 | emilym | (~Thunderbi@user/emilym) emilym |
| 2026-06-02 04:20:32 +0000 | tusko | (~uwu@user/tusko) tusko |
| 2026-06-02 04:22:56 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 04:23:52 +0000 | emilym | (~Thunderbi@user/emilym) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 04:28:15 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 04:32:09 +0000 | user363627 | (~user@user/user363627) (Quit: Konversation terminated!) |
| 2026-06-02 04:34:02 +0000 | euphores | (~SASL_euph@user/euphores) (Quit: Leaving.) |
| 2026-06-02 04:35:56 +0000 | Sgeo_ | (~Sgeo@user/sgeo) Sgeo |
| 2026-06-02 04:38:48 +0000 | Sgeo | (~Sgeo@user/sgeo) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 04:55:50 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 05:07:08 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 05:09:04 +0000 | divlamir_ | (~divlamir@user/divlamir) divlamir |
| 2026-06-02 05:09:16 +0000 | GdeVolpiano | (~GdeVolpia@user/GdeVolpiano) GdeVolpiano |
| 2026-06-02 05:11:25 +0000 | divlamir | (~divlamir@user/divlamir) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 05:11:25 +0000 | divlamir_ | divlamir |
| 2026-06-02 05:12:20 +0000 | peterbecich | (~Thunderbi@71.84.33.135) peterbecich |
| 2026-06-02 05:16:46 +0000 | Inline | (~noOne@ipservice-092-208-182-236.092.208.pools.vodafone-ip.de) Inline |
| 2026-06-02 05:23:52 +0000 | divlamir | (~divlamir@user/divlamir) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 05:24:00 +0000 | divlamir_ | (~divlamir@user/divlamir) divlamir |
| 2026-06-02 05:24:31 +0000 | vanishingideal | (~vanishing@user/vanishingideal) vanishingideal |
| 2026-06-02 05:24:58 +0000 | divlamir_ | divlamir |
| 2026-06-02 05:40:46 +0000 | haritz | (~hrtz@user/haritz) (Quit: ZNC 1.8.2+deb3.1+deb12u1 - https://znc.in) |
| 2026-06-02 05:43:48 +0000 | vanishingideal | (~vanishing@user/vanishingideal) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 05:44:59 +0000 | divlamir_ | (~divlamir@user/divlamir) divlamir |
| 2026-06-02 05:47:25 +0000 | divlamir | (~divlamir@user/divlamir) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 05:47:26 +0000 | divlamir_ | divlamir |
| 2026-06-02 05:47:56 +0000 | califax | (~califax@user/califx) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 05:48:11 +0000 | califax | (~califax@user/califx) califx |
| 2026-06-02 05:48:20 +0000 | peterbecich | (~Thunderbi@71.84.33.135) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 05:52:40 +0000 | vanishingideal | (~vanishing@user/vanishingideal) vanishingideal |
| 2026-06-02 05:53:35 +0000 | machinedgod | (~machinedg@d172-219-48-230.abhsia.telus.net) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 05:56:32 +0000 | tusko | (~uwu@user/tusko) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 05:56:44 +0000 | tusko | (~uwu@user/tusko) tusko |
| 2026-06-02 06:04:01 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 06:09:10 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 06:14:50 +0000 | Square3 | (~Square4@user/square) Square |
| 2026-06-02 06:19:27 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 06:19:52 +0000 | <jj> | a package i want to use is two years and three minor versions out of date on hackage; who should i bug about this? the package maintainer, or someone from hackage? |
| 2026-06-02 06:21:13 +0000 | emilym | (~Thunderbi@user/emilym) emilym |
| 2026-06-02 06:24:35 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 278 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 06:24:40 +0000 | tzh | (~tzh@c-76-115-131-146.hsd1.or.comcast.net) (Quit: zzz) |
| 2026-06-02 06:34:52 +0000 | Sgeo_ | (~Sgeo@user/sgeo) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2026-06-02 06:35:12 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 06:38:48 +0000 | gmg | (~user@user/gehmehgeh) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 06:39:30 +0000 | gmg | (~user@user/gehmehgeh) gehmehgeh |
| 2026-06-02 06:39:51 +0000 | lol_ | (~lol@2603:3016:1e01:b940:3d05:9239:ad58:5cc7) |
| 2026-06-02 06:40:29 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 06:41:42 +0000 | jcarpenter2 | (~lol@96.78.87.197) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2026-06-02 06:43:59 +0000 | CiaoSen | (~Jura@dynamic-046-114-170-219.46.114.pool.telefonica.de) CiaoSen |
| 2026-06-02 06:48:14 +0000 | emilym | (~Thunderbi@user/emilym) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 06:50:43 +0000 | vanishingideal | (~vanishing@user/vanishingideal) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 06:51:00 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 06:51:21 +0000 | emilym | (~Thunderbi@user/emilym) emilym |
| 2026-06-02 06:52:47 +0000 | peterbecich | (~Thunderbi@71.84.33.135) peterbecich |
| 2026-06-02 06:55:45 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 06:59:25 +0000 | emilym | (~Thunderbi@user/emilym) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 06:59:37 +0000 | emilym | (~Thunderbi@user/emilym) emilym |
| 2026-06-02 07:03:51 +0000 | <[exa]> | jj: send an issue to the repo |
| 2026-06-02 07:04:35 +0000 | <[exa]> | if the maintainer is unresponsive there's workflows to keep the package updated without them |
| 2026-06-02 07:05:01 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 07:05:05 +0000 | <[exa]> | (esp if there are volunteers to take over, wink wink) |
| 2026-06-02 07:05:54 +0000 | jreicher | (~joelr@user/jreicher) (Quit: In transit) |
| 2026-06-02 07:11:50 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 07:19:24 +0000 | peterbecich | (~Thunderbi@71.84.33.135) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 07:23:19 +0000 | sord937 | (~sord937@gateway/tor-sasl/sord937) sord937 |
| 2026-06-02 07:23:21 +0000 | emilym | (~Thunderbi@user/emilym) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 07:41:56 +0000 | chele | (~chele@user/chele) chele |
| 2026-06-02 08:01:13 +0000 | lol__ | (~lol@2603:3016:1e01:b940:3d05:9239:ad58:5cc7) |
| 2026-06-02 08:04:07 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@77.242.116.146) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 08:04:09 +0000 | lol_ | (~lol@2603:3016:1e01:b940:3d05:9239:ad58:5cc7) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 08:05:45 +0000 | ft | (~ft@p4fc2aedc.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Quit: leaving) |
| 2026-06-02 08:10:21 +0000 | lol_ | (~lol@96.78.87.197) |
| 2026-06-02 08:11:11 +0000 | misterfish | (~misterfis@31.161.39.137) misterfish |
| 2026-06-02 08:11:12 +0000 | misterfish | (~misterfis@31.161.39.137) (Client Quit) |
| 2026-06-02 08:11:26 +0000 | misterfish | (~misterfis@31-161-39-137.biz.kpn.net) misterfish |
| 2026-06-02 08:12:33 +0000 | lol__ | (~lol@2603:3016:1e01:b940:3d05:9239:ad58:5cc7) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 08:12:48 +0000 | tavare | (~tavare@150.129.88.189) |
| 2026-06-02 08:12:49 +0000 | tavare | (~tavare@150.129.88.189) (Changing host) |
| 2026-06-02 08:12:49 +0000 | tavare | (~tavare@user/tavare) tavare |
| 2026-06-02 08:13:39 +0000 | Googulator | (~Googulato@193-226-241-87.pool.digikabel.hu) (Quit: Client closed) |
| 2026-06-02 08:13:54 +0000 | Googulator | (~Googulato@193-226-241-87.pool.digikabel.hu) |
| 2026-06-02 08:21:30 +0000 | emmanuelux | (~em@user/emmanuelux) (Quit: bye) |
| 2026-06-02 08:21:32 +0000 | tavare | (~tavare@user/tavare) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 08:21:55 +0000 | xff0x | (~xff0x@fsb6a9491c.tkyc517.ap.nuro.jp) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 08:34:36 +0000 | jreicher | (~joelr@user/jreicher) jreicher |
| 2026-06-02 08:38:30 +0000 | CiaoSen | (~Jura@dynamic-046-114-170-219.46.114.pool.telefonica.de) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 08:46:38 +0000 | <jaror> | sm: the new tagline is a spinoff from this thread: https://discourse.haskell.org/t/emphasize-why-haskell-on-haskell-org-landing-page/12036?u=jaror |
| 2026-06-02 08:46:50 +0000 | <jaror> | and then this infra issue: https://github.com/haskell-infra/www.haskell.org/pull/337 |
| 2026-06-02 08:47:30 +0000 | vanishingideal | (~vanishing@user/vanishingideal) vanishingideal |
| 2026-06-02 09:07:35 +0000 | __monty__ | (~toonn@user/toonn) toonn |
| 2026-06-02 09:11:31 +0000 | acidjnk_new | (~acidjnk@p200300d6e700e5985649f68ddf4fc506.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 2026-06-02 09:11:33 +0000 | acidjnk | (~acidjnk@p200300d6e700e5985649f68ddf4fc506.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) acidjnk |
| 2026-06-02 09:33:45 +0000 | vanishingideal | (~vanishing@user/vanishingideal) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 09:53:00 +0000 | vanishingideal | (~vanishing@user/vanishingideal) vanishingideal |
| 2026-06-02 09:54:29 +0000 | kuribas | (~user@2a02-1810-2825-6000-46b1-7c3d-a8cd-5cbd.ip6.access.telenet.be) |
| 2026-06-02 09:56:51 +0000 | CiaoSen | (~Jura@2a02:3030:aef:5ba2:4e50:ddff:fe9b:8922) CiaoSen |
| 2026-06-02 10:10:49 +0000 | picnoir | (~picnoir@about/aquilenet/vodoo/NinjaTrappeur) (Quit: WeeChat 4.9.0) |
| 2026-06-02 10:19:38 +0000 | <sm> | 👍🏻 |
| 2026-06-02 10:19:55 +0000 | tusko | (~uwu@user/tusko) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 10:20:09 +0000 | tusko | (~uwu@user/tusko) tusko |
| 2026-06-02 10:21:32 +0000 | user363627 | (~user@user/user363627) user363627 |
| 2026-06-02 10:25:44 +0000 | tusko | (~uwu@user/tusko) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 10:25:57 +0000 | tusko | (~uwu@user/tusko) tusko |
| 2026-06-02 10:27:25 +0000 | picnoir | (~picnoir@about/aquilenet/vodoo/NinjaTrappeur) NinjaTrappeur |
| 2026-06-02 10:27:54 +0000 | lisbeths | (uid135845@id-135845.lymington.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) |
| 2026-06-02 10:28:18 +0000 | vanishingideal | (~vanishing@user/vanishingideal) (Ping timeout: 241 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 10:44:46 +0000 | haritz | (~hrtz@2a01:4b00:bc2e:7000:d5af:a266:ca31:5ef8) |
| 2026-06-02 10:44:46 +0000 | haritz | (~hrtz@2a01:4b00:bc2e:7000:d5af:a266:ca31:5ef8) (Changing host) |
| 2026-06-02 10:44:46 +0000 | haritz | (~hrtz@user/haritz) haritz |
| 2026-06-02 10:51:29 +0000 | <gentauro> | sm: if you combine it with NixOS, the statement is actually true :) |
| 2026-06-02 10:53:05 +0000 | s3 | (~s3@user/bn) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 10:54:24 +0000 | bggd_ | (~bgg@2a01:e0a:fd5:f510:f74b:8209:ab3c:4567) |
| 2026-06-02 10:57:16 +0000 | s3 | (~s3@user/bn) bn |
| 2026-06-02 10:58:30 +0000 | arandombit | (~arandombi@user/arandombit) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 10:59:07 +0000 | arandombit | (~arandombi@2603:7000:4600:ffbe:a9a8:ebc7:8e25:8787) |
| 2026-06-02 10:59:07 +0000 | arandombit | (~arandombi@2603:7000:4600:ffbe:a9a8:ebc7:8e25:8787) (Changing host) |
| 2026-06-02 10:59:07 +0000 | arandombit | (~arandombi@user/arandombit) arandombit |
| 2026-06-02 11:04:57 +0000 | olivial | (~benjaminl@user/benjaminl) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2026-06-02 11:05:15 +0000 | olivial | (~benjaminl@user/benjaminl) benjaminl |
| 2026-06-02 11:06:52 +0000 | <sm> | I think it's quite true even without nix (it's why I switched to haskell) |
| 2026-06-02 11:07:57 +0000 | jreicher | (~joelr@user/jreicher) (Quit: Offline for a bit) |
| 2026-06-02 11:15:10 +0000 | comerijn | (~merijn@77.242.116.150) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 11:17:29 +0000 | L29Ah | (~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah) () |
| 2026-06-02 11:18:06 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@77.242.116.146) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 11:20:47 +0000 | L29Ah | (~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah) L29Ah |
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| 2026-06-02 11:26:03 +0000 | Lord_of_Life | (~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 11:26:31 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@77.242.116.146) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 11:26:35 +0000 | Lord_of_Life | (~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915) Lord_of_Life |
| 2026-06-02 11:28:36 +0000 | ninjacato | (~Thunderbi@user/ninjacato) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 11:29:37 +0000 | comerijn | (~merijn@77.242.116.150) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
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| 2026-06-02 11:43:30 +0000 | ChaiTRex | (~ChaiTRex@user/chaitrex) ChaiTRex |
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| 2026-06-02 11:47:41 +0000 | weary-traveler | (~user@user/user363627) user363627 |
| 2026-06-02 11:48:07 +0000 | divlamir | (~divlamir@user/divlamir) divlamir |
| 2026-06-02 11:54:54 +0000 | CiaoSen | (~Jura@2a02:3030:aef:5ba2:4e50:ddff:fe9b:8922) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 11:58:02 +0000 | CiaoSen | (~Jura@dynamic-046-114-170-219.46.114.pool.telefonica.de) CiaoSen |
| 2026-06-02 11:59:38 +0000 | Pozyomka | (~pyon@user/pyon) (Quit: brb test) |
| 2026-06-02 12:00:34 +0000 | jreicher | (~joelr@user/jreicher) jreicher |
| 2026-06-02 12:01:57 +0000 | Pozyomka | (~pyon@user/pyon) pyon |
| 2026-06-02 12:14:44 +0000 | Pozyomka | (~pyon@user/pyon) (Quit: brb test) |
| 2026-06-02 12:16:04 +0000 | xff0x | (~xff0x@2405:6580:b080:900:e7a5:60a1:d1bb:8885) |
| 2026-06-02 12:18:25 +0000 | Pozyomka | (~pyon@user/pyon) pyon |
| 2026-06-02 12:26:26 +0000 | synchromesh | (~john@2406:5a00:247e:1500:29c5:b42c:d970:297d) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2026-06-02 12:26:32 +0000 | euphores | (~SASL_euph@user/euphores) euphores |
| 2026-06-02 12:27:33 +0000 | synchromesh | (~john@2406:5a00:247e:1500:5d87:ca3a:c15b:1909) synchromesh |
| 2026-06-02 12:41:10 +0000 | lisbeths | (uid135845@id-135845.lymington.irccloud.com) lisbeths |
| 2026-06-02 12:47:45 +0000 | Alex_delenda_est | (~al_test@178.34.160.200) (Quit: ;-) |
| 2026-06-02 12:48:27 +0000 | AlexZenon | (~alzenon@178.34.160.200) (Quit: ;-) |
| 2026-06-02 12:49:05 +0000 | tjbc | (~tjbc@user/fliife) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 12:49:18 +0000 | AlexNoo | (~AlexNoo@178.34.160.200) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2026-06-02 13:11:19 +0000 | tjbc | (~tjbc@user/fliife) fliife |
| 2026-06-02 13:21:23 +0000 | <gentauro> | sm: I mean, you can't even build for diff ghc versions without having to do shenanigans ;) |
| 2026-06-02 13:21:50 +0000 | gentauro | «Avoid success at all costs» SPJ ;) |
| 2026-06-02 13:22:44 +0000 | kuribas | (~user@2a02-1810-2825-6000-46b1-7c3d-a8cd-5cbd.ip6.access.telenet.be) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2026-06-02 13:22:57 +0000 | kuribas | (~user@2a02-1810-2825-6000-46b1-7c3d-a8cd-5cbd.ip6.access.telenet.be) |
| 2026-06-02 13:24:38 +0000 | AlexNoo | (~AlexNoo@178.34.160.200) |
| 2026-06-02 13:27:44 +0000 | AlexZenon | (~alzenon@178.34.160.200) |
| 2026-06-02 13:31:23 +0000 | <sm> | I agree the picture is a bit mixed. But those issues can be managed, and your codebase itself can live and grow for a long time |
| 2026-06-02 13:32:04 +0000 | <sm> | more so than most languages |
| 2026-06-02 13:33:07 +0000 | <yin> | i have bad feelings about this marketing wave around haskell |
| 2026-06-02 13:34:48 +0000 | bedbedbde | (~bedbedbde@user/bedbedbde) bedbedbde |
| 2026-06-02 13:35:58 +0000 | <yin> | i hope that i'm wrong |
| 2026-06-02 13:36:11 +0000 | <jaror> | what marketing wave? |
| 2026-06-02 13:36:45 +0000 | Alex_delenda_est | (~al_test@178.34.160.200) |
| 2026-06-02 13:37:42 +0000 | weary-traveler | (~user@user/user363627) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 13:38:11 +0000 | <gentauro> | the marketing is that if Haskell doesn't "do something", with the wave of AI-slop, instead of all Haskell devs could be in a Boeing 747, it might be all Haskell devs can be in a mini-bus ;) (not to sound the alarm but …) |
| 2026-06-02 13:38:33 +0000 | <yin> | i've been feeling a revival of the general effort to bring more people into Haskell lately, but maybe i'm wrong? |
| 2026-06-02 13:40:10 +0000 | <jaror> | I haven't noticed that much of such an effort. The change to haskell.org was also already a year ago. |
| 2026-06-02 13:40:12 +0000 | bggd_ | (~bgg@2a01:e0a:fd5:f510:f74b:8209:ab3c:4567) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 13:40:27 +0000 | <sm> | haskellers have always been wanting it to grow (in various directions), nothing new in that. The speed is not exactly breakneck |
| 2026-06-02 13:41:24 +0000 | <gentauro> | sm: "some" have, others, as long as their academic papers 👍 then … |
| 2026-06-02 13:47:32 +0000 | bedbedbde | (~bedbedbde@user/bedbedbde) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2026-06-02 13:48:16 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | I spoke to a devops engineer earlier this year, and he hadn't even heard of the name Haskell!! How can that be!!1 |
| 2026-06-02 13:49:33 +0000 | <yin> | i'd love for Haskell to grow, but not in all directions |
| 2026-06-02 13:49:53 +0000 | <yin> | i actually think a little pruning would be appropriate |
| 2026-06-02 13:50:43 +0000 | CiaoSen | (~Jura@dynamic-046-114-170-219.46.114.pool.telefonica.de) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 13:52:17 +0000 | CiaoSen | (~Jura@2a02:3030:aef:5ba2:4e50:ddff:fe9b:8922) CiaoSen |
| 2026-06-02 13:54:54 +0000 | <kuribas> | tomsmeding: They also don't know what is hygienic macro expansion... |
| 2026-06-02 13:55:18 +0000 | <kuribas> | It was solved 40 years ago. |
| 2026-06-02 13:55:38 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | clearly they must be enlightened! |
| 2026-06-02 13:55:58 +0000 | <yin> | are we dissing devops in general? |
| 2026-06-02 13:56:50 +0000 | <sm> | this is #haskell, we don't dis anyone |
| 2026-06-02 13:57:12 +0000 | <sm> | well, maybe ourselves sometimes |
| 2026-06-02 13:59:16 +0000 | <kuribas> | yin: I am fine, as long as I don't have to deal with helmfiles myself... |
| 2026-06-02 14:00:03 +0000 | gmg | (~user@user/gehmehgeh) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 14:00:16 +0000 | <yin> | man i remember when i was first learning haskell and discovering this channel, there was a great log going around of an obvious troll trying to spam and cause chaos, which was promptly convinced, after a very short interaction with the amazing people here, to try haskell |
| 2026-06-02 14:00:21 +0000 | <kuribas> | haskell is out of the hype phase. |
| 2026-06-02 14:00:46 +0000 | gmg | (~user@user/gehmehgeh) gehmehgeh |
| 2026-06-02 14:01:42 +0000 | <yin> | here it is https://gist.github.com/quchen/5280339 |
| 2026-06-02 14:01:43 +0000 | <kuribas> | yin: I didn't parse that sentence... How was convinced to use haskell? |
| 2026-06-02 14:02:23 +0000 | <yin> | kuribas: my english is not the best. read the link and you'll understand |
| 2026-06-02 14:08:18 +0000 | Square3 | (~Square4@user/square) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 14:15:19 +0000 | misterfish | (~misterfis@31-161-39-137.biz.kpn.net) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 14:17:15 +0000 | CiaoSen | (~Jura@2a02:3030:aef:5ba2:4e50:ddff:fe9b:8922) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 14:30:08 +0000 | machinedgod | (~machinedg@d172-219-48-230.abhsia.telus.net) machinedgod |
| 2026-06-02 14:42:01 +0000 | kuribas | (~user@2a02-1810-2825-6000-46b1-7c3d-a8cd-5cbd.ip6.access.telenet.be) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 15:13:03 +0000 | spew | (~spew@user/spew) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 15:21:06 +0000 | spew | (~spew@user/spew) spew |
| 2026-06-02 15:22:29 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | classic! |
| 2026-06-02 15:36:48 +0000 | <gentauro> | speaking of sentences. Working at a smaller IT place, we all devs ate lunch together. Then once (only happened that time) the HR person joined. First sentence she said, one of the devs replied: "Sorry, but I can't compile your sentence". |
| 2026-06-02 15:36:55 +0000 | <gentauro> | she just stood up and left xD |
| 2026-06-02 15:37:54 +0000 | gentauro | no wonder business want to get rid of us (AI-n't that something) xD |
| 2026-06-02 15:43:02 +0000 | tzh | (~tzh@c-76-115-131-146.hsd1.or.comcast.net) |
| 2026-06-02 15:50:22 +0000 | Digit | (~user@user/digit) (Ping timeout: 271 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 15:51:13 +0000 | pavonia | (~user@user/siracusa) (Quit: Bye!) |
| 2026-06-02 15:54:53 +0000 | kuribas | (~user@2a02-1810-2825-6000-eaa6-a4c8-27ec-be53.ip6.access.telenet.be) |
| 2026-06-02 15:57:47 +0000 | Digit | (~user@user/digit) Digit |
| 2026-06-02 16:00:00 +0000 | lisbeths | (uid135845@id-135845.lymington.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) |
| 2026-06-02 16:00:35 +0000 | spew | (~spew@user/spew) (Quit: zzz) |
| 2026-06-02 16:01:54 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | funny, but also a little sad |
| 2026-06-02 16:02:32 +0000 | spew | (~spew@user/spew) spew |
| 2026-06-02 16:18:05 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@77.242.116.146) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 16:27:11 +0000 | <gentauro> | yeah. That's what happens when you hire really good people with zero social skills :-\ |
| 2026-06-02 16:38:03 +0000 | sord937 | (~sord937@gateway/tor-sasl/sord937) (Quit: sord937) |
| 2026-06-02 16:44:10 +0000 | <int-e> | gentauro: I've heard about small talk, but I hate object-oriented programming languages. |
| 2026-06-02 16:49:07 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | yin: btw your english there was perfectly fine, except a human is referred to with "who" instead of "which" (the troll turned out to be human, after all) |
| 2026-06-02 16:54:22 +0000 | <probie> | Smalltalk is actually pretty great. I wouldn't personally recommend trying to build your next "big" system in it (or in any dynamically typed language), but it's pretty fun. If you're looking for a modern FOSS implementation, I recommend Pharo |
| 2026-06-02 16:54:26 +0000 | vanishingideal | (~vanishing@user/vanishingideal) vanishingideal |
| 2026-06-02 16:58:12 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@77.242.116.146) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 16:59:41 +0000 | Beowulf | (florian@sleipnir.bandrate.org) (Quit: = "") |
| 2026-06-02 17:03:47 +0000 | Digit | digitteknohippie |
| 2026-06-02 17:03:54 +0000 | digitteknohippie | Digit |
| 2026-06-02 17:05:09 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@77.242.116.146) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 17:07:28 +0000 | <gentauro> | int-e: xD |
| 2026-06-02 17:08:52 +0000 | <gentauro> | probie: I was actually quite surprised when one of the greater Danish logistic companies told me they were using smalltalk in PROD (we are talking +2020 ish) :o |
| 2026-06-02 17:09:15 +0000 | bggd_ | (~bgg@2a01:e0a:fd5:f510:dfb:7180:26ed:4cfc) |
| 2026-06-02 17:09:33 +0000 | Beowulf | (florian@sleipnir.bandrate.org) |
| 2026-06-02 17:15:44 +0000 | misterfish | (~misterfis@84.53.85.146) misterfish |
| 2026-06-02 17:17:25 +0000 | <probie> | gentauro: I don't think it's a terrible choice. Apart from the lack of library support and most implementations not playing too well with your favourite VCS (since with the exception of GNU smalltalk, smalltalks tend to be image based, not source based), I don't think it's any worse than picking Python or Ruby. |
| 2026-06-02 17:17:53 +0000 | <monochrom> | int-e: But smalltalk had lambda before it was cool! |
| 2026-06-02 17:20:18 +0000 | misterfish | (~misterfis@84.53.85.146) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 17:21:28 +0000 | m | (~travltux@user/travltux) (Quit: WeeChat 4.7.2) |
| 2026-06-02 17:22:04 +0000 | m | (~travltux@user/travltux) travltux |
| 2026-06-02 17:23:16 +0000 | m | (~travltux@user/travltux) (Client Quit) |
| 2026-06-02 17:23:16 +0000 | <gentauro> | probie: they only had 1 dev. And no replacement. For a big company that's a big no-no |
| 2026-06-02 17:23:43 +0000 | <int-e> | monochrom: tbh it's more that every major implementation of Smalltalk appears to be its own VM with its own goofy windowing system and editor and you're supposed to work inside that. |
| 2026-06-02 17:23:49 +0000 | m | (~travltux@user/travltux) travltux |
| 2026-06-02 17:24:12 +0000 | <int-e> | at which point I decided that I didn't want to try the language that badly |
| 2026-06-02 17:25:55 +0000 | skum | (~skum@user/skum) skum |
| 2026-06-02 17:28:11 +0000 | <probie> | int-e: Unfortunately most of the smalltalk community seem to consider that to be one of the best features (GNU smalltalk didn't, but I'm pretty sure that's barely been touched in the past 10 years) |
| 2026-06-02 17:30:39 +0000 | ystael | (~ystael@user/ystael) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 17:32:06 +0000 | <monochrom> | I didn't try the language either. Just saw a few examples. I think representative examples because I was in a reading group reading a paper on code optimizations for smalltalk. But at once I recognized that it's the closest to the "objects messaging each other" narrative, plus it has lambda! I concluded that only it (or squeak) does justice to untyped OO. |
| 2026-06-02 17:33:07 +0000 | <monochrom> | (And independently, I tried OCaml and concluded that only it does justice to typed OO, or generally static subtyping.) |
| 2026-06-02 17:34:42 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 17:35:29 +0000 | <monochrom> | Over the years I noticed a high correlation between "this language is actually compositional" and "has lambda". :) |
| 2026-06-02 17:35:48 +0000 | m | (~travltux@user/travltux) (Quit: WeeChat 4.7.2) |
| 2026-06-02 17:36:15 +0000 | <monochrom> | and then think back "oh that's what Backus said" :) |
| 2026-06-02 17:36:33 +0000 | m | (~travltux@user/travltux) travltux |
| 2026-06-02 17:39:48 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 270 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 17:41:29 +0000 | wootehfoot | (~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot) wootehfoot |
| 2026-06-02 17:47:58 +0000 | vanishingideal | (~vanishing@user/vanishingideal) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 17:50:10 +0000 | whack | (~textual@2607:fb91:4c21:4a8a:c8a2:9161:db9c:dd0f) |
| 2026-06-02 17:50:25 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 17:52:48 +0000 | whack | (~textual@2607:fb91:4c21:4a8a:c8a2:9161:db9c:dd0f) (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com) |
| 2026-06-02 17:55:07 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 17:59:40 +0000 | ricardomaps | (~ricardoma@2804:14d:a040:81ea:732:f532:4ef6:e193) |
| 2026-06-02 17:59:50 +0000 | weary-traveler | (~user@user/user363627) user363627 |
| 2026-06-02 18:05:49 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 18:08:31 +0000 | machinedgod | (~machinedg@d172-219-48-230.abhsia.telus.net) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 18:10:40 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 18:12:53 +0000 | ft | (~ft@p4fc2aedc.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) ft |
| 2026-06-02 18:13:22 +0000 | <yin> | tomsmeding: thanks. wouldn't it be "whom" in extremely correct english? |
| 2026-06-02 18:14:57 +0000 | confusedalex | (~confuseda@user/confusedalex) confusedalex |
| 2026-06-02 18:15:45 +0000 | <yin> | i guess not |
| 2026-06-02 18:19:35 +0000 | confusedalex | (~confuseda@user/confusedalex) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 18:19:37 +0000 | humasect | (~humasect@dyn-192-249-132-90.nexicom.net) (Quit: Leaving...) |
| 2026-06-02 18:20:49 +0000 | <monochrom> | english sucks :) |
| 2026-06-02 18:20:53 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | apparently? |
| 2026-06-02 18:21:08 +0000 | <raincomplex> | i believe 'whom' is used when the pronoun is the object |
| 2026-06-02 18:21:19 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 18:21:21 +0000 | <raincomplex> | an easy way to remember this is that he/him are used in the same places as who/whom |
| 2026-06-02 18:21:29 +0000 | <raincomplex> | he->who, him->whom |
| 2026-06-02 18:21:37 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | what I'm reading is that 'whom' was used ~100y ago for the object, yes |
| 2026-06-02 18:22:02 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | but dative uses feel much more natural than accusative uses to me -- although my feeling here is very fraught as I'm not a native speaker |
| 2026-06-02 18:22:10 +0000 | <raincomplex> | so like "who did this" versus "you gave it to whom?" |
| 2026-06-02 18:22:24 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | (To whom did you give the book? vs Whom did you see?) |
| 2026-06-02 18:23:17 +0000 | <raincomplex> | "you saw whom?" does sound pretty weird haha |
| 2026-06-02 18:23:23 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | yes |
| 2026-06-02 18:23:26 +0000 | <raincomplex> | "who did you see" is much more common |
| 2026-06-02 18:23:37 +0000 | <raincomplex> | anyway |
| 2026-06-02 18:23:42 +0000 | Digit | (~user@user/digit) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 18:23:47 +0000 | Digitteknohippie | (~user@user/digit) Digit |
| 2026-06-02 18:23:59 +0000 | <raincomplex> | worse is better i guess? ;D |
| 2026-06-02 18:26:09 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 18:26:23 +0000 | <probie> | Whatever native speakers do is preferable to an artificial standard |
| 2026-06-02 18:26:52 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | wikipedia also rather clearly classifies the people prescribing 'whom' as, well, prescriptivists |
| 2026-06-02 18:27:42 +0000 | <probie> | Outside of set phrases ("to whom it may concern"), it's on the way out. |
| 2026-06-02 18:31:07 +0000 | emilym | (~Thunderbi@user/emilym) emilym |
| 2026-06-02 18:34:04 +0000 | <spew> | I use whom all the time |
| 2026-06-02 18:35:52 +0000 | <spew> | but I also have diagnosed ocd |
| 2026-06-02 18:35:53 +0000 | <monochrom> | What native speaker do is also an artificial standard. |
| 2026-06-02 18:36:01 +0000 | emilym | (~Thunderbi@user/emilym) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 18:36:07 +0000 | <spew> | nor do I ever ever split an infinitive |
| 2026-06-02 18:36:37 +0000 | <monochrom> | or at least also becomes |
| 2026-06-02 18:37:06 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 18:37:43 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | Dutch aggressively splits infinitives and doesn't have whom (any more), so I don't mind :p |
| 2026-06-02 18:38:13 +0000 | <raincomplex> | language is an illusion. programming languages doubly so |
| 2026-06-02 18:38:39 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | language being fixed is an illusion for sure |
| 2026-06-02 18:42:08 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 18:43:12 +0000 | <monochrom> | What's really happening is "following popular rules is preferrable to following unpopular rules". But then it exposes that principle as just a popularity contest and much less grandiose than "organic living language vs artificial dead language". |
| 2026-06-02 18:43:49 +0000 | confusedalex | (~confuseda@user/confusedalex) confusedalex |
| 2026-06-02 18:43:51 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | what are the popular and unpopular rules here? |
| 2026-06-02 18:45:17 +0000 | <monochrom> | "what native speakers do" is euphemism for "popular". the particular "artificial standard" mentioned is just a way to say "unpopular". |
| 2026-06-02 18:47:01 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | I'm fairly sure there are more non-native speakers of English than there are native speakers. There is probably some speech mannerism in English that native English speakers generally don't have but is nevertheless exhibited by more than half of all speakers. |
| 2026-06-02 18:47:34 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | Does that mean that that mannerism is now "popular" and hence the de-facto preferred way of pronouncing English? I doubt it |
| 2026-06-02 18:48:04 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | (just count all the Indian speakers of English) |
| 2026-06-02 18:48:29 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | (though I guess that's covered by naming that its own variety of English) |
| 2026-06-02 18:49:31 +0000 | <monochrom> | That's just because one seldom talks to the whole world at once. Instead usually less global, almost local community. |
| 2026-06-02 18:50:55 +0000 | <yin> | maybe we would do better with caveman language + a type system, but then the problem would become figuring out the best type system |
| 2026-06-02 18:51:16 +0000 | <monochrom> | So for example if I go to a school in the US I will be saying "I have a question". But if it's a school in India it will be "I have a doubt". "Majority" means majority within a radius of 10km or something. |
| 2026-06-02 18:52:14 +0000 | <monochrom> | (Until that school in the US takes in a whole lot of students from India. :) ) |
| 2026-06-02 18:52:32 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | I see; I guess you can see that as popularity, yes |
| 2026-06-02 18:52:54 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 18:53:03 +0000 | <monochrom> | It's a social construct. It's social constructs all the way down. Of course it's also just popularity all the way down! |
| 2026-06-02 18:54:20 +0000 | <probie> | Speech (or text) should always be chosen based on the target audience |
| 2026-06-02 18:54:45 +0000 | <monochrom> | Yes. The only reason why I'm still trying my best to use English here! |
| 2026-06-02 18:55:24 +0000 | <monochrom> | Not because it's better. (Like I said, it sucks.) But because I like you guys so I am happy to get along. |
| 2026-06-02 18:56:11 +0000 | <monochrom> | <--- a Chinese room through and through |
| 2026-06-02 18:56:59 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | back in high school, when some fellow student who had no clue whatsoever about programming learned that I did programming, asked "among programmers, can you speak in a programming language?" |
| 2026-06-02 18:57:12 +0000 | <monochrom> | heh |
| 2026-06-02 18:57:42 +0000 | <mauke> | dollar funny plus plus semicolon |
| 2026-06-02 18:58:05 +0000 | <monochrom> | "Yes I say 'for i=0 to n-1, please put sausage #i on the grill' all the time" |
| 2026-06-02 18:59:51 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 18:59:57 +0000 | <mauke> | re: non-native speakers of english, wasn't "long time no see" imported 1:1 from chinese at some point? |
| 2026-06-02 19:00:13 +0000 | <mauke> | it certainly doesn't follow the usual grammatical rules |
| 2026-06-02 19:00:24 +0000 | <monochrom> | In real analysis classes, when one says "for all epsilon, there exists delta ..." one may argue by Curry-Howard that it's a programming language! |
| 2026-06-02 19:00:55 +0000 | <yin> | mapM (put . sausage !!) <$> [0..pred $ length grill] |
| 2026-06-02 19:00:58 +0000 | <darkling> | Pretty much *everything* in modern English was imported from somewhere else, I think. :) |
| 2026-06-02 19:01:30 +0000 | <monochrom> | Yes totally mauke. And Sic Bo (made it into OED). |
| 2026-06-02 19:02:23 +0000 | <yin> | oops not <$> |
| 2026-06-02 19:02:44 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | "Sorry, but I can't compile your sentence" |
| 2026-06-02 19:02:47 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 19:02:53 +0000 | <monochrom> | And imported "heart" as in "I heart you" from the Internet. (The OED people were not brave enough to import <3 so they butched it to "heart".) |
| 2026-06-02 19:04:32 +0000 | <geekosaur> | …while in the real world I started hearing "I less-than-three you" |
| 2026-06-02 19:04:47 +0000 | <geekosaur> | (US at least) |
| 2026-06-02 19:04:57 +0000 | <mauke> | ell oh ell |
| 2026-06-02 19:05:03 +0000 | <monochrom> | haha |
| 2026-06-02 19:05:34 +0000 | <yin> | "sad face emoji" is something i've heard from youth |
| 2026-06-02 19:05:56 +0000 | <int-e> | double-u tea eff |
| 2026-06-02 19:05:57 +0000 | <mauke> | or "grass" in japanese |
| 2026-06-02 19:06:00 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | in NL we just pronounce "lol" as a word |
| 2026-06-02 19:06:13 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | w |
| 2026-06-02 19:06:46 +0000 | <monochrom> | My students say "lol" as a word too. |
| 2026-06-02 19:07:14 +0000 | <int-e> | tomsmeding: an excellent setup for some false etyomology for "lollipot" in half a century |
| 2026-06-02 19:07:21 +0000 | <int-e> | -o |
| 2026-06-02 19:07:23 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | I was actually taught in English class (in NL) that "lol" is spoken in three syllables in English, as opposed to the common usage in NL |
| 2026-06-02 19:07:31 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 19:07:47 +0000 | <geekosaur> | used to be |
| 2026-06-02 19:08:34 +0000 | <monochrom> | I'm a dinosaur and an ESL speaker, so I used to say "es queue ell", "es cee es eye" back when I was in Hong Kong. Didn't know you guys found a way to pronounce SCSI as if you were pronouncing YHWH. |
| 2026-06-02 19:08:36 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | int-e: I have never heard or seen that word |
| 2026-06-02 19:08:51 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | oh lollipop? |
| 2026-06-02 19:09:01 +0000 | <monochrom> | Oh and TCL/Tk |
| 2026-06-02 19:09:07 +0000 | <mauke> | https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/lol#Dutch |
| 2026-06-02 19:09:21 +0000 | <int-e> | tomsmeding: err, yeah |
| 2026-06-02 19:10:16 +0000 | <probie> | As a native speaker of [Australian] English, I pronounce it "es queue ell" and not "sequel", but "scuzzi" not "es cee es eye" |
| 2026-06-02 19:10:42 +0000 | <darkling> | I'm the same as probie (but UK English) |
| 2026-06-02 19:10:53 +0000 | <monochrom> | How do/did you pronounce PCMCIA? |
| 2026-06-02 19:11:06 +0000 | <darkling> | I always try not to. |
| 2026-06-02 19:11:10 +0000 | <monochrom> | heh |
| 2026-06-02 19:11:11 +0000 | <darkling> | But letter-by-letter. |
| 2026-06-02 19:11:22 +0000 | <darkling> | Like EBCDIC. |
| 2026-06-02 19:11:23 +0000 | <int-e> | monochrom: "people can't memorize compuiter industry acronyms" |
| 2026-06-02 19:11:31 +0000 | <monochrom> | haha |
| 2026-06-02 19:11:36 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | /p.km.kia/ |
| 2026-06-02 19:11:40 +0000 | <int-e> | (I actually might, because I still love that joke.) |
| 2026-06-02 19:11:49 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | (I actually haven't ever seen PCMCIA before) |
| 2026-06-02 19:11:50 +0000 | <geekosaur> | "eb-sə-dik" |
| 2026-06-02 19:11:57 +0000 | <int-e> | tomsmeding: you're young |
| 2026-06-02 19:12:00 +0000 | <mauke> | "send mail to people" |
| 2026-06-02 19:12:02 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | I am |
| 2026-06-02 19:12:06 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | somewhat |
| 2026-06-02 19:12:11 +0000 | lisbeths | (uid135845@id-135845.lymington.irccloud.com) lisbeths |
| 2026-06-02 19:12:44 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | > Starting with the PCMCIA card in 1990 (the name later simplified to PC Card) |
| 2026-06-02 19:12:46 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | I can see why |
| 2026-06-02 19:12:52 +0000 | <darkling> | int-e: Don't forget Never Twice Same Colour, Systéme Electronique pour Confuser les AMericains, and Perfect At Last. |
| 2026-06-02 19:12:56 +0000 | <monochrom> | Oh heh. |
| 2026-06-02 19:12:58 +0000 | <geekosaur> | that said I always avoided "sequel" because it's an IBM trademark (it derives from their SEQUEL II language) |
| 2026-06-02 19:13:20 +0000 | <mauke> | I pronounce Haskell "Miranda" |
| 2026-06-02 19:13:27 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | (tm) |
| 2026-06-02 19:13:37 +0000 | <darkling> | Do people use a see ell eye, or a cly? |
| 2026-06-02 19:13:46 +0000 | <darkling> | (Or something else) |
| 2026-06-02 19:14:01 +0000 | <olsner> | a tooey? |
| 2026-06-02 19:14:02 +0000 | <mauke> | ... "silly"? |
| 2026-06-02 19:14:19 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | see ell eye, for me, though I would use tee you eye in english and tui in dutch |
| 2026-06-02 19:14:23 +0000 | <int-e> | "command line" has just as many syllables as "cee ell eye" |
| 2026-06-02 19:14:31 +0000 | <mauke> | a gooey |
| 2026-06-02 19:14:44 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | int-e: but the d in "command line" makes it harder to say |
| 2026-06-02 19:14:57 +0000 | <int-e> | tomsmeding: so suppress it |
| 2026-06-02 19:15:13 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | c'mon-line |
| 2026-06-02 19:15:16 +0000 | <mauke> | "comman' line" works fine |
| 2026-06-02 19:16:48 +0000 | <darkling> | I used "cly" a couple of years ago, and got a wince, and a couple of sharp intakes of breath from the others present. |
| 2026-06-02 19:17:04 +0000 | <darkling> | Apparently spelling it out was considered correct. |
| 2026-06-02 19:17:20 +0000 | <int-e> | tomsmeding: Also I'm german so maybe double consonants don't trouble me as much? |
| 2026-06-02 19:17:55 +0000 | <int-e> | (or triple, whatever) |
| 2026-06-02 19:18:05 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 19:18:07 +0000 | <mauke> | streichholzschächtelchen |
| 2026-06-02 19:18:14 +0000 | <monochrom> | Yeah I was thinking "you guys have triple" :) |
| 2026-06-02 19:18:16 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | I'm not sure german is much worse in that than dutch is |
| 2026-06-02 19:18:28 +0000 | Digitteknohippie | Digit |
| 2026-06-02 19:18:46 +0000 | emilym | (~Thunderbi@user/emilym) emilym |
| 2026-06-02 19:18:56 +0000 | <mauke> | the trouble with the dutch is that they refuse to pronounce GUI as "gui" |
| 2026-06-02 19:19:18 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | what do they do instead? |
| 2026-06-02 19:19:26 +0000 | <monochrom> | Did they say "guy" instead? |
| 2026-06-02 19:19:36 +0000 | <mauke> | the ones I know use the english "gooey" |
| 2026-06-02 19:19:52 +0000 | <mauke> | and not what to my german ears sounds like a "chäöü" combo |
| 2026-06-02 19:19:55 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | [xyi] for me in IPA |
| 2026-06-02 19:20:02 +0000 | <monochrom> | Ah. |
| 2026-06-02 19:20:34 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | (I guess güi in German spelling, but with the Dutch 'g') |
| 2026-06-02 19:23:28 +0000 | emilym | (~Thunderbi@user/emilym) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 19:23:28 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 19:23:44 +0000 | <int-e> | . o O ( so, хый ) |
| 2026-06-02 19:24:31 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | (letting gtranslate pronounce that in russian) yes roughly |
| 2026-06-02 19:27:25 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | the source pronunciation here https://translate.google.com/?sl=nl&tl=en&text=guu%27i&op=translate |
| 2026-06-02 19:27:44 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | (getting it to do the right thing took some tinkering, with occasionally hilarious results) |
| 2026-06-02 19:30:39 +0000 | <tomsmeding> | (I tried some online automatic IPA pronouncers but they were exceedingly crap) |
| 2026-06-02 19:33:50 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 19:36:51 +0000 | ystael | (~ystael@user/ystael) ystael |
| 2026-06-02 19:39:19 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 19:40:50 +0000 | chele | (~chele@user/chele) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 19:42:58 +0000 | weary-traveler | (~user@user/user363627) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 19:43:07 +0000 | vanishingideal | (~vanishing@user/vanishingideal) vanishingideal |
| 2026-06-02 19:43:23 +0000 | target_i | (~target_i@user/target-i/x-6023099) target_i |
| 2026-06-02 19:49:36 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 19:53:56 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 20:03:15 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 20:07:49 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 20:14:33 +0000 | michalz | (~michalz@185.246.207.221) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 20:18:39 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 20:23:52 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 20:34:31 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@62.45.136.136) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 20:36:12 +0000 | kuribas | (~user@2a02-1810-2825-6000-eaa6-a4c8-27ec-be53.ip6.access.telenet.be) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 20:36:20 +0000 | cross | (~cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net) cross |
| 2026-06-02 20:41:25 +0000 | merijn | (~merijn@62.45.136.136) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 20:43:58 +0000 | synchromesh | (~john@2406:5a00:247e:1500:5d87:ca3a:c15b:1909) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2026-06-02 20:45:17 +0000 | synchromesh | (~john@2406:5a00:247e:1500:5d87:ca3a:c15b:1909) synchromesh |
| 2026-06-02 20:52:29 +0000 | comerijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn |
| 2026-06-02 20:57:16 +0000 | comerijn | (~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 20:57:48 +0000 | takuan | (~takuan@141.134.185.233) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2026-06-02 20:59:42 +0000 | arandombit | (~arandombi@user/arandombit) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2026-06-02 20:59:50 +0000 | arandombit | (~arandombi@24.168.84.88) |
| 2026-06-02 20:59:51 +0000 | arandombit | (~arandombi@24.168.84.88) (Changing host) |
| 2026-06-02 20:59:51 +0000 | arandombit | (~arandombi@user/arandombit) arandombit |