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2026-04-20 00:03:04 +0000merijn(~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
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2026-04-20 00:06:14 +0000thaumavorio(~thaumavor@thaumavor.io) thaumavorio
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2026-04-20 00:17:20 +0000pavonia(~user@user/siracusa) siracusa
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2026-04-20 00:28:55 +0000 <janus> is anybody interested in swagger2/openapi3 packages? they are both abandoned and lts-25 is going to be released without them
2026-04-20 00:30:42 +0000 <haskellbridge> <sm> I'd like to have that stuff all working, but not enough to work on it
2026-04-20 00:31:15 +0000 <haskellbridge> <sm> I guess we don't have enough of an API builder community to maintain those ?
2026-04-20 00:32:09 +0000 <janus> i know my former employer uses it a lot, but i have cried wolf too many times
2026-04-20 00:33:19 +0000 <haskellbridge> <sm> last time I looked into that topic (API standards/builder/generators/checkers & haskell), it was so chaotic and complex I have been in no hurry to touch it again :)
2026-04-20 00:33:50 +0000merijn(~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2026-04-20 00:34:17 +0000 <janus> rick owens seems to be quite invested
2026-04-20 00:34:21 +0000 <janus> i will shoot him an e-mail
2026-04-20 00:36:04 +0000 <haskellbridge> <sm> outside of haskell, are those currently both standard/stable/preferred, do you know ?
2026-04-20 00:36:53 +0000haskellbridgesm checks
2026-04-20 00:37:28 +0000 <haskellbridge> <sm> > OpenAPI 3.x (and 3.1) is the current preferred standard for RESTful APIs, having replaced the outdated Swagger 2.0.
2026-04-20 00:37:38 +0000 <haskellbridge> <sm> I see
2026-04-20 00:37:45 +0000 <janus> they are pretty popular , i think
2026-04-20 00:37:49 +0000notzmv(~umar@user/notzmv) notzmv
2026-04-20 00:38:12 +0000 <janus> at my former employer we integrated with a lot of logistics companies any many of them would publish OpenAPI specs
2026-04-20 00:38:20 +0000merijn(~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
2026-04-20 00:39:59 +0000 <haskellbridge> <sm> so ideally https://hackage.haskell.org/package/openapi3 would be the one to focus on I guess (but it looks less maintained currently)
2026-04-20 00:42:37 +0000 <janus> it is a fork of the other one, and it was minimally maintained by maksbotan from Biocad, a russian biotech company
2026-04-20 00:43:01 +0000 <janus> and i think they have github notifications turned off because the updates do not come as response to pings
2026-04-20 00:43:42 +0000 <janus> cma cgm uses open API, that's a large company: https://api-portal.cma-cgm.com/products/allocation?summaryId=commercial.allocation.route.v1
2026-04-20 00:46:29 +0000 <haskellbridge> <sm> oh I see, yes. Minimal activity since it was created in 2016
2026-04-20 00:47:05 +0000 <haskellbridge> <sm> but ongoing small updates to both since the fork in 2020
2026-04-20 00:47:41 +0000 <haskellbridge> <sm> (it looks like, but maybe I'm wrong)
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2026-04-20 00:49:13 +0000merijn(~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2026-04-20 00:50:01 +0000 <janus> yeah, it's just so minimal. Oh well, someone might notice once build plans start failing. But if people use the Cabal solver, that might take a few more years :P
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2026-04-20 01:31:34 +0000 <sclv> janus: at work we use servant-swagger, which uses swagger2
2026-04-20 01:35:22 +0000 <jackdk> Yeah servant-openapi3 is good but has serious flaws in some of its type families. (certain uses will demand spurious instances for `NoContent`.) Needs a handover to a live maintainer or a fork.
2026-04-20 01:38:16 +0000merijn(~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2026-04-20 01:41:35 +0000somemathguy(~somemathg@user/somemathguy) somemathguy
2026-04-20 01:42:29 +0000 <haskellbridge> <sm> there's also the https://matrix.to/#/#haskell-webdev:matrix.org room where more interested folks might be found
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2026-04-20 01:53:39 +0000merijn(~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2026-04-20 01:57:30 +0000 <davean> jackdk: I had real issues with servant-openapi3, I tried using it for a project a few years ago and I had to hand-write basicly all of it :/
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2026-04-20 01:58:34 +0000humasect(~humasect@dyn-192-249-132-90.nexicom.net) humasect
2026-04-20 01:58:44 +0000 <davean> So I pretty much gave up on the package as useless if I had to hand write the spec just via types and type classs.
2026-04-20 02:02:19 +0000jmcantrell_(~weechat@user/jmcantrell) jmcantrell
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2026-04-20 02:05:43 +0000 <davean> I was very frustrated.
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2026-04-20 05:29:17 +0000 <dibblego> Does anything like this exist? class BiProfunctor p where dimapL :: (w -> w') -> (y' -> y) -> p w x y z -> p w' x y' z; dimapR :: (x -> x') -> (z' -> z) -> p w x y z -> p w x' y z'
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2026-04-20 06:42:42 +0000 <jackdk> dibblego: how is that different from holding a profunctor with tuples?
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2026-04-20 08:32:40 +0000 <gentauro> do we have a similar function like this one -> https://hackage-content.haskell.org/package/base-4.22.0.0/docs/Data-List.html#v:isPrefixOf that instead of returning a Bool, returns the index of the first occurence?
2026-04-20 08:32:57 +0000sord937(~sord937@gateway/tor-sasl/sord937) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2026-04-20 08:33:09 +0000gentauroif no occurence exists, the returned values should be -1
2026-04-20 08:33:20 +0000sord937(~sord937@gateway/tor-sasl/sord937) sord937
2026-04-20 08:34:18 +0000 <gentauro> oh, I guess it's this one -> https://hackage-content.haskell.org/package/MissingH-1.6.0.3/docs/Data-List-Utils.html#v:subIndex (Maybe type insted of Int)
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2026-04-20 10:23:19 +0000 <probie> gentauro: my intuition says you that you're probably doing the "wrong thing" if you want this function for lists (arrays, vectors, bytestrings and possibly text it makes some sense for)
2026-04-20 10:23:48 +0000CiaoSen(~Jura@p549cbfb1.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) CiaoSen
2026-04-20 10:31:13 +0000CloneOfNone(~CloneOfNo@user/CloneOfNone) CloneOfNone
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2026-04-20 10:45:29 +0000divlamir_divlamir
2026-04-20 10:51:50 +0000 <[exa]> is there some nice way to have type-level marks on various events that come to a program? I
2026-04-20 10:53:20 +0000 <[exa]> ...I'm writing a network app, each single thing has to manage like 10 different timeouts. I don't want to completely rely on green threads (instead I'd love to have actual event handlers etc.), so I'd have once somewhat central place where all timeouts and events would get processed and dispatched. Now, scheduled alarms to time-outs are the same "type" of event and I'd love to have them somehow
2026-04-20 10:53:22 +0000 <[exa]> distinguished
2026-04-20 10:53:49 +0000divlamir_(~divlamir@user/divlamir) divlamir
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2026-04-20 11:03:12 +0000Freakie(~Freakie@185.45.22.133)
2026-04-20 11:04:00 +0000 <Freakie> does anyone have suggestions for profiling compact regions?
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2026-04-20 11:52:24 +0000 <merijn> Freakie: Profiling in what way?
2026-04-20 11:52:30 +0000 <merijn> Memory usage, you mean?
2026-04-20 11:52:37 +0000socksbuny5(~socks@oberon.raccoon.fun) raccoonasdf
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2026-04-20 11:53:04 +0000 <Freakie> merijn more or less
2026-04-20 11:53:10 +0000CiaoSen(~Jura@p549cbfb1.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) CiaoSen
2026-04-20 11:53:16 +0000 <merijn> I'd suspect they just show as pinned memory?
2026-04-20 11:53:20 +0000buhman(sid411355@user/buhman) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2026-04-20 11:53:20 +0000astra(sid289983@user/amish) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2026-04-20 11:53:30 +0000 <Freakie> I have some input cases where the garbage collection time wasn't lowered as much as they should when I switched to compacting them
2026-04-20 11:53:39 +0000 <Freakie> the profiling just shows it as live NFDATA
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2026-04-20 11:53:46 +0000edwardk(sid47016@haskell/developer/edwardk) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2026-04-20 11:53:53 +0000 <Freakie> which makes it hard to tell if I have avoidable overhead or no
2026-04-20 11:54:06 +0000 <merijn> Freakie: How sure are you that your assumption that they should significantly reduce GC time? :)
2026-04-20 11:54:10 +0000carter(sid14827@id-14827.helmsley.irccloud.com) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
2026-04-20 11:54:21 +0000 <Freakie> well
2026-04-20 11:54:23 +0000hiredman(~hiredman@frontier1.downey.family) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2026-04-20 11:54:26 +0000idnar(sid12240@debian/mithrandi) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2026-04-20 11:54:26 +0000lbseale(~quassel@user/ep1ctetus) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2026-04-20 11:54:30 +0000 <gentauro> probie: with `Data.List` you can do -> `findIndices (isPrefixOf "PATTERN_GOES_HERE") (tails "STRING_LOOKING_IN")` and you get a nice list of ints
2026-04-20 11:54:44 +0000 <Freakie> let's say I have 4 to 8 gb gigabytes worth of accumulators in each of my algorithms
2026-04-20 11:54:59 +0000haasn(sid579015@id-579015.hampstead.irccloud.com) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2026-04-20 11:55:17 +0000 <Freakie> without compacting on that input size my program willl terminate in 30 minutes where about 28 of that is garbage collection
2026-04-20 11:55:23 +0000 <Freakie> with compacting the gc time is reduced by about half
2026-04-20 11:55:29 +0000mud(~mud@user/kadoban) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
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2026-04-20 11:55:41 +0000edwardk(sid47016@haskell/developer/edwardk) edwardk
2026-04-20 11:55:47 +0000lbseale(~quassel@user/ep1ctetus) ep1ctetus
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2026-04-20 11:55:57 +0000 <merijn> Freakie: Threaded runtime or non-threaded? Any GC options you're passing or just default?
2026-04-20 11:55:58 +0000 <Freakie> but it still feels like GC is dominating more than it should when I look at the profiling since the graph is overwhelmingly just the compacted
2026-04-20 11:56:06 +0000luke(~luke@user/luke) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
2026-04-20 11:56:18 +0000 <Freakie> just -O2 I believe and non-threaded
2026-04-20 11:56:23 +0000 <Freakie> well that's not GC
2026-04-20 11:56:26 +0000taktoa[c](sid282096@id-282096.tinside.irccloud.com) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
2026-04-20 11:56:34 +0000 <Freakie> so I guess none on these particular runs
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2026-04-20 11:56:45 +0000buhman(sid411355@user/buhman) buhman
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2026-04-20 11:57:01 +0000sclv(sid39734@haskell/developer/sclv) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
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2026-04-20 11:57:21 +0000 <Freakie> mind you I should still expect garbage collection to dominate over time because my priority queues aren't compacted (it's much easier to compact write-only data)
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2026-04-20 11:57:34 +0000 <Freakie> but the scaling seems a bit excessive to me still
2026-04-20 11:57:36 +0000 <gentauro> @pl let idxs pat cs = findIndices (isPrefixOf pat) (tails cs)
2026-04-20 11:57:36 +0000 <lambdabot> (line 1, column 58):
2026-04-20 11:57:36 +0000 <lambdabot> unexpected end of input
2026-04-20 11:57:36 +0000 <lambdabot> expecting variable, "(", operator, ";" or "in"
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2026-04-20 11:57:55 +0000edm(sid147314@id-147314.hampstead.irccloud.com) (Excess Flood)
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2026-04-20 11:58:05 +0000luke(~luke@user/luke) luke
2026-04-20 11:58:05 +0000taktoa[c](sid282096@id-282096.tinside.irccloud.com) taktoa[c]
2026-04-20 11:58:06 +0000meejah(~meejah@rutas.meejah.ca) meejah
2026-04-20 11:58:06 +0000jonrh(sid5185@2a03:5180:f:3::1441) jonrh
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2026-04-20 11:58:11 +0000degraafk(sid71464@id-71464.lymington.irccloud.com) degraafk
2026-04-20 11:58:12 +0000T_S_____(sid501726@id-501726.uxbridge.irccloud.com)
2026-04-20 11:58:14 +0000gaze__(sid387101@id-387101.helmsley.irccloud.com) gaze__
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2026-04-20 11:58:21 +0000tromp(~textual@2001:1c00:340e:2700:c9bc:b29c:36e3:d32a) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2026-04-20 11:58:27 +0000 <gentauro> @pl f pat cs = findIndices (isPrefixOf pat) (tails cs)
2026-04-20 11:58:28 +0000 <lambdabot> f = (. tails) . findIndices . isPrefixOf
2026-04-20 11:58:29 +0000carter(sid14827@id-14827.helmsley.irccloud.com) carter
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2026-04-20 11:58:33 +0000weary-traveler(~user@user/user363627) user363627
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2026-04-20 11:58:34 +0000edmundnoble_(sid229620@id-229620.helmsley.irccloud.com) edmundnoble_
2026-04-20 11:58:48 +0000 <merijn> Freakie: I wonder how much of the reported GC time is you compacting. (Since building a compact region is literally just "GC this root into, but into a separate region, rathern than heap", so it could be that compacting is reported as GC time)
2026-04-20 11:59:06 +0000integral(sid296274@user/integral) integral
2026-04-20 11:59:12 +0000Lord_of_Life(~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915) (Excess Flood)
2026-04-20 11:59:14 +0000Adeon(sid418992@id-418992.lymington.irccloud.com) Adeon
2026-04-20 11:59:35 +0000 <Freakie> I will admit that I just used an implementation of a package I found that I couldn't install through cabal because it was too old, so I haven't looked too much into how it works
2026-04-20 12:00:09 +0000hook54321(sid149355@user/hook54321) hook54321
2026-04-20 12:00:23 +0000 <Freakie> all I know is that appending uses CompactAdd# which is a GHC primitive
2026-04-20 12:01:09 +0000 <merijn> Freakie: Yeah, I just mean that the way GHC implements compacting is the exact same code as GC. i.e. starting from a root, traverse the memory and copy to new heap (except the heap is now a compact region instead of the normal heap)
2026-04-20 12:01:10 +0000sclv(sid39734@haskell/developer/sclv) sclv
2026-04-20 12:01:16 +0000dy(sid3438@user/dy) \\\\\
2026-04-20 12:01:18 +0000mustafa(sid502723@rockylinux/releng/mustafa) mustafa
2026-04-20 12:01:41 +0000 <merijn> So it might report that as GC time, I don't know :)
2026-04-20 12:01:56 +0000 <Freakie> I would assume the profiler would report it differently since it's a using a public API though?
2026-04-20 12:02:04 +0000 <merijn> Freakie: can you pastebin the GC report?
2026-04-20 12:02:35 +0000Lord_of_Life(~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915) Lord_of_Life
2026-04-20 12:03:11 +0000 <Freakie> https://pastebin.com/CN8itK6R
2026-04-20 12:03:22 +0000 <Freakie> or sorry what do you mean by report?
2026-04-20 12:03:47 +0000 <merijn> That one was what I meant :p
2026-04-20 12:04:05 +0000 <merijn> oof, productivity 12% is kinda abysmal xD
2026-04-20 12:04:29 +0000 <merijn> And what was it without the compact regions?
2026-04-20 12:04:34 +0000 <Freakie> my peeve is that the profiler only reports all the compacted data as having been allocated by the system instead of the modules
2026-04-20 12:04:46 +0000 <Freakie> total time was about 30 minutes, MUT I believe was a little less
2026-04-20 12:05:05 +0000 <merijn> Even less? o.O
2026-04-20 12:05:16 +0000 <merijn> So even lower productivity?
2026-04-20 12:05:41 +0000 <Freakie> I mean GC would continually traverse append-only data during the algorithms
2026-04-20 12:06:28 +0000 <Freakie> I assume consing to compact regions is more expensive than a pure cons operation, all else equal
2026-04-20 12:06:57 +0000puke(~puke@user/puke) (Remote host closed the connection)
2026-04-20 12:07:22 +0000puke(~puke@user/puke) puke
2026-04-20 12:08:15 +0000 <Freakie> I have a smaller input where both compact and non-compact runs use about 20 seconds of mut time but the pure version uses about 4-5x as much GC time than the one compacted
2026-04-20 12:08:39 +0000Eoco(~ian@128.101.131.218) Eoco
2026-04-20 12:09:09 +0000 <Freakie> but also I think the productivity reporting has seemed off sometimes
2026-04-20 12:09:16 +0000totbwf(sid402332@id-402332.uxbridge.irccloud.com)
2026-04-20 12:09:38 +0000 <Freakie> sometimes it would be something along the lines of 5% MUT-to-GC reported but productivity was reported to be something like 20-30%
2026-04-20 12:13:59 +0000edm(sid147314@id-147314.hampstead.irccloud.com)
2026-04-20 12:15:48 +0000totbwf(sid402332@id-402332.uxbridge.irccloud.com) (Changing host)
2026-04-20 12:15:48 +0000totbwf(sid402332@user/totbwf) totbwf
2026-04-20 12:17:08 +0000 <Freakie> the input arguments can be quite large so maybe they are just a consequence of garbage collection or something, idk
2026-04-20 12:20:59 +0000gawen_(~gawen@user/gawen) gawen
2026-04-20 12:21:25 +0000gawen(~gawen@user/gawen) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2026-04-20 12:45:39 +0000 <merijn> I mean, I would expect/want productivity of >80% ideally >90%
2026-04-20 12:47:46 +0000tromp(~textual@2001:1c00:340e:2700:c9bc:b29c:36e3:d32a)
2026-04-20 12:53:11 +0000 <Freakie> do you have a reference on best practices with regions?
2026-04-20 13:01:12 +0000rekahsoft(~rekahsoft@bras-base-orllon1103w-grc-20-76-67-111-168.dsl.bell.ca) rekahsoft
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2026-04-20 13:18:05 +0000 <Freakie> or other good suggestions for keeping productivity high I guess
2026-04-20 13:19:41 +0000tromp(~textual@2001:1c00:340e:2700:c9bc:b29c:36e3:d32a)
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2026-04-20 15:23:17 +0000machinedgod(~machinedg@d172-219-48-230.abhsia.telus.net) machinedgod
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2026-04-20 15:55:51 +0000misterfish(~misterfis@84.53.85.146) misterfish
2026-04-20 15:57:21 +0000 <dcb> for a practical point of view check boric's two presidential terms on chile, or, how I got elected following the anti pinochet-reformed constitution protests and paved the way for the far-right
2026-04-20 15:59:07 +0000 <dcb> p.s.: yes, I copied the subtitle from clara mattei's Capital Order book
2026-04-20 15:59:33 +0000danza(~danza@user/danza) (Remote host closed the connection)
2026-04-20 15:59:39 +0000 <dcb> oops, sorry... wrong channel :O
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2026-04-20 17:20:46 +0000EvanR(~EvanR@user/evanr) EvanR
2026-04-20 17:21:20 +0000merijn(~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
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2026-04-20 18:00:24 +0000wootehfoot(~wootehfoo@user/wootehfoot) wootehfoot
2026-04-20 18:10:08 +0000merijn(~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
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2026-04-20 18:23:22 +0000Tuplanolla(~Tuplanoll@85-156-32-112.elisa-laajakaista.fi) Tuplanolla
2026-04-20 18:27:19 +0000merijn(~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2026-04-20 18:31:08 +0000ft(~ft@p508db287.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) ft
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2026-04-20 18:42:10 +0000 <haskellbridge> <slack1256> Didn't know there were other Chileans on #haskell-irc:matrix.org (https://matrix.to/#/#haskell-irc:matrix.org)
2026-04-20 18:42:41 +0000merijn(~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2026-04-20 18:42:43 +0000misterfish(~misterfis@84.53.85.146) misterfish
2026-04-20 18:47:39 +0000merijn(~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
2026-04-20 18:47:59 +0000 <dcb> sorry, I'm from latin america but not chile. that was from a discussion in another channel, rougly about "the underwhelming electoral performance of (various regional incarnations of) the left"
2026-04-20 18:51:27 +0000Alex_delenda_est(~al_test@178.34.150.30)
2026-04-20 18:52:15 +0000 <haskellbridge> <slack1256> Send me that channel name pls
2026-04-20 18:55:33 +0000karenw(~karenw@user/karenw) karenw
2026-04-20 18:58:04 +0000merijn(~merijn@host-cl.cgnat-g.v4.dfn.nl) merijn
2026-04-20 18:58:17 +0000Tuplanolla(~Tuplanoll@85-156-32-112.elisa-laajakaista.fi) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)