2024/01/11

2024-01-11 00:00:33 +0100califax(~califax@user/califx) (Remote host closed the connection)
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2024-01-11 00:25:14 +0100beogrif(~beogrif@066-065-097-119.res.spectrum.com)
2024-01-11 00:26:48 +0100acidjnk(~acidjnk@p200300d6e72b933818892410b5265f00.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
2024-01-11 00:31:10 +0100Tuplanolla(~Tuplanoll@91-159-69-171.elisa-laajakaista.fi) (Quit: Leaving.)
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2024-01-11 00:33:30 +0100 <waldo> how british do I have to become to use the glasgow compiler
2024-01-11 00:33:50 +0100 <waldo> does tht mean I need to start planting my seed in british women
2024-01-11 00:33:56 +0100 <waldo> because for political reasons i'm not too sure about that
2024-01-11 00:34:11 +0100 <waldo> honest question
2024-01-11 00:34:13 +0100 <EvanR> ops
2024-01-11 00:34:24 +0100 <waldo> dude are you serious
2024-01-11 00:34:32 +0100 <waldo> fuck you I will do it for you
2024-01-11 00:34:35 +0100waldo(~waldo@user/waldo) ()
2024-01-11 00:35:00 +0100 <geekosaur> o.O
2024-01-11 00:38:47 +0100Axman6(~Axman6@user/axman6)
2024-01-11 00:43:53 +0100pedrobat13(~pedrobat1@a79-169-139-65.cpe.netcabo.pt)
2024-01-11 00:44:07 +0100acidjnk(~acidjnk@p200300d6e72b934860da41a6d5111bb5.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
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2024-01-11 00:58:41 +0100pedrobat13(~pedrobat1@a79-169-139-65.cpe.netcabo.pt) (Quit: Client closed)
2024-01-11 01:02:39 +0100peterbecich(~Thunderbi@047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com)
2024-01-11 01:04:17 +0100 <beogrif> as a newcomer, is this what #haskell is usually like
2024-01-11 01:07:21 +0100Sgeo(~Sgeo@user/sgeo)
2024-01-11 01:07:41 +0100 <glguy> There's usually more chatter
2024-01-11 01:08:25 +0100 <glguy> I guess people are otherwise occupied today. Did you have something you wanted to chat about when you joined?
2024-01-11 01:10:30 +0100 <jackdk> It's a lot more on-topic and less bizarre than whatever that was
2024-01-11 01:10:49 +0100 <Axman6> beogrif: #haskell is a lot like any other IRC channel, there are often long periods of silence, with intense discussion occuring sporadically
2024-01-11 01:11:05 +0100 <Axman6> jackdk: dang, what'd I miss?
2024-01-11 01:11:58 +0100machinedgod(~machinedg@d198-53-218-113.abhsia.telus.net) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2024-01-11 01:12:03 +0100[_](~itchyjunk@user/itchyjunk/x-7353470)
2024-01-11 01:13:19 +0100 <glguy> 6 lines of trolling - it's nothing that merits pulling up logs
2024-01-11 01:15:21 +0100[itchyjunk](~itchyjunk@user/itchyjunk/x-7353470) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2024-01-11 01:15:53 +0100peterbecich(~Thunderbi@047-229-123-186.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2024-01-11 01:16:03 +0100 <Axman6> Yeah that, like, never happens these days (and I kinda miss it, though this channel has always been more immune to it than others I used to frequent)
2024-01-11 01:17:50 +0100 <EvanR> it's 20% category theory 80% boggling at cabal
2024-01-11 01:17:59 +0100 <haskellbridge> 06<s​m> I wouldn't say never, there's a small statistical chance of a troll-by or more severe spam attack on any given day
2024-01-11 01:19:23 +0100 <haskellbridge> 06<s​m> like all public chat rooms
2024-01-11 01:19:30 +0100Batzy(~quassel@user/batzy)
2024-01-11 01:19:56 +0100 <haskellbridge> 06<s​m> sorry beogrif! welcome!
2024-01-11 01:20:05 +0100ham|away(~ham@user/ham) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2024-01-11 01:24:52 +0100_d0t(~{-d0t-}@user/-d0t-/x-7915216) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2024-01-11 01:28:31 +0100 <beogrif> I wasn’t put off just thought it was funny; and thanks!
2024-01-11 01:30:51 +0100harveypwca(~harveypwc@2601:246:c280:7940:585a:99af:3e4c:209b)
2024-01-11 01:37:06 +0100 <beogrif> glguy: Oh also I didn’t have a topic, was just lurking
2024-01-11 01:40:04 +0100ham|away(~ham@user/ham)
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2024-01-11 09:43:09 +0100 <phma> I'm getting two errors on Hackage: "Couldn't figure out LLVM version!" and "could not execute: opt".
2024-01-11 09:43:50 +0100 <phma> This is after the Hackage admin upgraded the compiler and other packages build fine. My package builds fine on my box.
2024-01-11 09:44:07 +0100 <phma> https://hackage.haskell.org/package/WringTwistree-0.0.1.0/reports/5
2024-01-11 09:44:14 +0100 <dminuoso_> phma: We have a #hackage channel here on libera.
2024-01-11 09:44:28 +0100 <dminuoso_> Oh actually #haskell-infrastructure is the right place.
2024-01-11 09:45:53 +0100tzh(~tzh@c-71-193-181-0.hsd1.or.comcast.net) (Quit: zzz)
2024-01-11 09:46:15 +0100 <phma> I get "Cannot join channel (+r)" on #haskell-infrastructure, but successfully joined #hackage.
2024-01-11 09:46:39 +0100 <[exa]> phma: might require that you register with NickServ (iirc)
2024-01-11 09:47:17 +0100 <int-e> phma: you have -fllvm in your ghc-options
2024-01-11 09:47:26 +0100 <int-e> and evidently hackage doesn't have llvm support
2024-01-11 09:51:57 +0100 <phma> ah
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2024-01-11 10:50:12 +0100 <tomsmeding> what is the channel for cabal development again?
2024-01-11 10:50:42 +0100 <tomsmeding> would that be #hackage?
2024-01-11 10:51:00 +0100 <int-e> I think so
2024-01-11 10:51:17 +0100 <int-e> (actually I just checked, yeah it is)
2024-01-11 10:51:22 +0100 <tomsmeding> I just ask every time I need one of the channels for cabal/hackage/etc. because it makes zero sense :')
2024-01-11 10:51:46 +0100 <int-e> #haskell-infrastructure does the trouble shooting
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2024-01-11 13:48:46 +0100 <dminuoso_> tomsmeding: Of course #hackage is for cabal development, what else did you think the channel was for? :-)
2024-01-11 13:49:08 +0100 <tomsmeding> :p
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2024-01-11 16:02:55 +0100kubrat(~204-NB-00@154.14.244.146) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2024-01-11 16:04:59 +0100 <tomsmeding> text-1.2.5.0 does not have a Data.Text.Encoding method: https://hackage.haskell.org/package/text-1.2.5.0
2024-01-11 16:05:12 +0100 <tomsmeding> neither in the module listing, nor in the file listing (see the [browse] link)
2024-01-11 16:05:25 +0100 <tomsmeding> even though actually it does! https://hackage.haskell.org/package/text-1.2.5.0/docs/Data-Text-Encoding.html
2024-01-11 16:05:35 +0100 <tomsmeding> and it's also in the cabal file as an exposed module
2024-01-11 16:05:43 +0100 <tomsmeding> where does it come from?
2024-01-11 16:08:23 +0100nschoe2(~nschoe@37.166.228.186)
2024-01-11 16:09:27 +0100 <int-e> Huh?
2024-01-11 16:09:31 +0100glguy_(g@libera/staff/glguy)
2024-01-11 16:09:39 +0100glguyGuest7110
2024-01-11 16:09:39 +0100Guest7110(g@libera/staff/glguy) (Killed (silver.libera.chat (Nickname regained by services)))
2024-01-11 16:09:39 +0100glguy_glguy
2024-01-11 16:10:58 +0100nschoe(nschoe@gateway/vpn/protonvpn/nschoe) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2024-01-11 16:11:03 +0100tomsmedingis probably doing something wrong
2024-01-11 16:11:19 +0100 <tomsmeding> oh er, s/method/module/
2024-01-11 16:11:46 +0100 <int-e> Sure, but it's clearly listed on https://hackage.haskell.org/package/text-1.2.5.0 for me so I'm confused. Unless JavaScript makes a difference hmm
2024-01-11 16:12:04 +0100tomsmedingis blind
2024-01-11 16:12:17 +0100 <tomsmeding> too many modules
2024-01-11 16:12:19 +0100 <int-e> Okay.
2024-01-11 16:12:21 +0100 <tomsmeding> was looking in the Internal hierarchy
2024-01-11 16:12:24 +0100 <tomsmeding> thank you
2024-01-11 16:13:21 +0100 <int-e> > "Data.Text.Encoding" `compare` "Data.Text.Internal"
2024-01-11 16:13:23 +0100 <lambdabot> LT
2024-01-11 16:13:30 +0100 <yushyin> ctrl-f ;)
2024-01-11 16:14:49 +0100mmhat(~mmh@p200300f1c7428288ee086bfffe095315.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2024-01-11 16:14:52 +0100 <int-e> Hmm what is a bit weird that the "missing" intermediate modules (like Data.Text.Internal.Encoding) don't have a fully qualified name.
2024-01-11 16:15:12 +0100mmhat(~mmh@p200300f1c742823fee086bfffe095315.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
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2024-01-11 17:51:03 +0100Unicorn_Princess(~Unicorn_P@user/Unicorn-Princess/x-3540542)
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2024-01-11 17:58:21 +0100 <danse-nr3> not sure how yesod manages to return a value with a monadic expression
2024-01-11 17:58:21 +0100 <danse-nr3> getYesod :: MonadHandler m => m (HandlerSite m)
2024-01-11 17:58:22 +0100 <danse-nr3> this HandlerSite is the web application with its settings, as if the values where stored in a singleton somewhere. Is there a simple way to write a similar type of singleton?
2024-01-11 18:02:09 +0100 <danse-nr3> oh, i guess it uses template haskell to achieve that
2024-01-11 18:02:40 +0100 <c_wraith> template haskell is heavily used in yesod, but it's not part of what's going on there
2024-01-11 18:02:52 +0100 <danse-nr3> phew...
2024-01-11 18:03:00 +0100kuribas(~user@ip-188-118-57-242.reverse.destiny.be) (Remote host closed the connection)
2024-01-11 18:03:19 +0100 <c_wraith> What's going on there is just a variation on a Reader monad
2024-01-11 18:03:24 +0100not_reserved(~not_reser@185.153.177.185)
2024-01-11 18:03:50 +0100 <danse-nr3> one needs to initialise a Reader with values though, while here they are bound to the type
2024-01-11 18:07:01 +0100machinedgod(~machinedg@d198-53-218-113.abhsia.telus.net) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2024-01-11 18:08:14 +0100 <c_wraith> Eh. MonadHandler is definitely a Reader monad
2024-01-11 18:10:17 +0100 <danse-nr3> hmm... my bad then. Thanks for the clue
2024-01-11 18:10:55 +0100 <c_wraith> It's a more sophisticated one than normal, but it's definitely a wrapper around functions that query some run-time environment for configuration data
2024-01-11 18:12:50 +0100igemnace(~ian@user/igemnace) (Quit: WeeChat 4.1.2)
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2024-01-11 18:14:31 +0100 <EvanR> Config -> IO a
2024-01-11 18:14:53 +0100 <EvanR> genius
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2024-01-11 19:52:15 +0100 <tomsmeding> ReaderT IO strikes again
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2024-01-11 20:05:39 +0100jil`(~user@37.166.17.42)
2024-01-11 20:05:54 +0100 <jil`> hello
2024-01-11 20:06:23 +0100 <tomsmeding> o/
2024-01-11 20:06:39 +0100waleee(~waleee@h-176-10-144-38.NA.cust.bahnhof.se)
2024-01-11 20:08:52 +0100 <jil`> How do I display the documentation for a module in gchi ? says the socket in Network.socket. `:doc socket` says I should recompile with haddock, but I install the network module using cabal. Is there an option to have cabal install the documentation alongside the module ?
2024-01-11 20:09:50 +0100 <sclv> using :doc doesn't require the documentation be placed alongside the module iirc. just compiling with haddocks enabled should suffice to pack the raw haddock information into the object files.
2024-01-11 20:09:58 +0100 <tomsmeding> jil`: if this is a dependency of your project, you should be able to do 'cabal build --enable-documentation' where you'd normally do 'cabal build'
2024-01-11 20:10:18 +0100 <sclv> or that, right :-)
2024-01-11 20:10:35 +0100 <tomsmeding> if you want cabal to _always_ generate documentation by default, you can set the 'documentation' flag to True in ~/.cabal/config
2024-01-11 20:11:25 +0100 <tomsmeding> building documentation takes a little while and takes up some disk space though, so you choose whether the trade-off is worth it
2024-01-11 20:11:54 +0100hueso(~root@user/hueso)
2024-01-11 20:13:10 +0100 <jil`> I'm not ready to build projects yet, I'm wanted to use ghci explore some functions and their documentation. So I used `cabal install --verbose=3 --lib --package-env . network` to install the module and was hoping to be able to read it's documentation in ghci.
2024-01-11 20:13:26 +0100 <tomsmeding> you could try adding --enable-documentation to that
2024-01-11 20:13:37 +0100 <jil`> ok
2024-01-11 20:14:19 +0100 <tomsmeding> TIL --package-env
2024-01-11 20:14:28 +0100 <tomsmeding> cabal sandboxes still exist after all?
2024-01-11 20:15:08 +0100 <geekosaur> they're not really sandboxes, but can do in a pinch
2024-01-11 20:15:11 +0100 <sclv> package env isnt a sandbox, but its a similar replacement
2024-01-11 20:15:38 +0100 <tomsmeding> okay I got two people piling on me saying that I'm wrong for that
2024-01-11 20:15:56 +0100 <sclv> old school sandboxes had a different actual package database. this version they all share the store, but the env file picks out a "slice" of it as a "virtual database"
2024-01-11 20:16:04 +0100 <tomsmeding> I see
2024-01-11 20:16:07 +0100 <sclv> enables more sharing
2024-01-11 20:16:17 +0100 <tomsmeding> from my perspective that sounds like observationally the same thing
2024-01-11 20:16:28 +0100 <tomsmeding> apart from two things: performance and disk space management
2024-01-11 20:16:33 +0100 <sclv> very close -- unfortunately the new version has a somewhat worse ui
2024-01-11 20:16:53 +0100 <tomsmeding> it's funny that you have to 'cabal install --lib --package-env . base' before anything works
2024-01-11 20:16:56 +0100 <geekosaur> they're also a little unstable, with various cabal versions you may run into issues with packages being hidden that shouldn't be
2024-01-11 20:17:11 +0100 <sclv> tomsmeding: we fixed that in the most recent cabal, but its a process of successive refinement
2024-01-11 20:17:24 +0100 <tomsmeding> I see!
2024-01-11 20:17:56 +0100 <sclv> the way they Work Very Well is if you have the list of all the stuff you want in an env and you install it all at once. the rough edges are all about iteratively adding more stuff
2024-01-11 20:18:20 +0100 <tomsmeding> oh hey I get base in there, indeed
2024-01-11 20:18:34 +0100 <tomsmeding> what's hard about adding more stuff?
2024-01-11 20:18:55 +0100 <tomsmeding> I mean, apart from the usual problem of "this thing is incompatible with the set of packages you have so far, good luck" which is not really cabal's fault
2024-01-11 20:18:57 +0100 <sclv> we fixed most of the issues, but there's complexities about making sure its all compat with the existing stuff
2024-01-11 20:19:31 +0100 <sclv> there's one remaining corner case where you can accidentally get a diamond conflict without a good UI for understanding it or handling it
2024-01-11 20:19:43 +0100 <sclv> again, a process of successive refinement..
2024-01-11 20:21:00 +0100 <sclv> basically if i install `foo` depending on containers, then foo goes in the env, but containers doesn't. but then if i try to install containers at a different version it works, because it doesn't notice a conflict, and now the `foo` and the `containers` in the env don't work together.
2024-01-11 20:21:07 +0100 <sclv> so we probably need to install transitive deps into the env
2024-01-11 20:22:31 +0100ChaiTRex(~ChaiTRex@user/chaitrex) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2024-01-11 20:24:00 +0100 <tomsmeding> oh right
2024-01-11 20:24:09 +0100ChaiTRex(~ChaiTRex@user/chaitrex)
2024-01-11 20:24:17 +0100 <tomsmeding> can't cabal see what the dependencies of a particular environment entry are?
2024-01-11 20:24:52 +0100 <tomsmeding> like, given name-version-hash, what are all the [name-version-hash]es that it was built with
2024-01-11 20:27:17 +0100mokee(~mokee@37.228.215.150) (Quit: off)
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2024-01-11 20:29:06 +0100 <geekosaur> it can, but you don't always want them
2024-01-11 20:29:20 +0100 <geekosaur> usually you don't care about the dependencies
2024-01-11 20:30:47 +0100azimut(~azimut@gateway/tor-sasl/azimut)
2024-01-11 20:32:04 +0100danza(~danza@151.43.139.118) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
2024-01-11 20:34:20 +0100 <tomsmeding> yes but I mean, as you say you typically don't want the transitive dependencies in the env as well
2024-01-11 20:34:42 +0100 <tomsmeding> so if cabal can query the whole dependency tree of a single env entry, then cabal can reconstruct the entire dependency graph of the environment
2024-01-11 20:34:46 +0100 <tomsmeding> and check consistency with that
2024-01-11 20:35:32 +0100 <sclv> yes, cabal can do that. this is not a deep conceptual flaw that is unfixable. its a bug that has not been fixed.
2024-01-11 20:35:51 +0100 <tomsmeding> right :)
2024-01-11 20:36:07 +0100 <tomsmeding> thinking about it more it definitely sounds like a finicky thing to get right in a large codebase
2024-01-11 20:36:08 +0100 <sclv> that said, i don't know that we can pull the deps just from the name-version-hash
2024-01-11 20:36:15 +0100 <sclv> hashes are one way :-P
2024-01-11 20:36:29 +0100 <tomsmeding> the hash is a key in the global store, right?
2024-01-11 20:36:45 +0100 <tomsmeding> sure, the info is not _in_ the hash :p
2024-01-11 20:36:48 +0100 <sclv> i just don't know if we have the full linked-dependency-data lying around in the current datamodel
2024-01-11 20:36:54 +0100 <tomsmeding> right
2024-01-11 20:37:03 +0100 <sclv> it might just be like, in the linker info, and we don't want to deal with that
2024-01-11 20:37:13 +0100dtman34(~dtman34@c-76-156-89-180.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2024-01-11 20:37:19 +0100azimut(~azimut@gateway/tor-sasl/azimut) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2024-01-11 20:37:20 +0100 <tomsmeding> because cabal hasn't needed it before this
2024-01-11 20:37:32 +0100 <tomsmeding> you re-configure from zero and then apply memoisati
2024-01-11 20:37:35 +0100 <tomsmeding> -on
2024-01-11 20:43:10 +0100azimut(~azimut@gateway/tor-sasl/azimut)
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2024-01-11 20:49:11 +0100 <geekosaur> isn't it in plan.json?
2024-01-11 20:49:38 +0100 <tomsmeding> you don't get a plan.json for a --lib env
2024-01-11 20:49:45 +0100 <geekosaur> mm, may not have that if installing… that
2024-01-11 20:49:55 +0100 <tomsmeding> but yes
2024-01-11 20:49:57 +0100dtman34(~dtman34@2601:447:d000:93c9:2823:eb8b:c0aa:2c12)
2024-01-11 20:50:07 +0100azimut(~azimut@gateway/tor-sasl/azimut) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2024-01-11 20:50:17 +0100 <tomsmeding> at least, name-version-hash triples for the whole dependency graph, which is presumably enough :p
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2024-01-11 23:25:58 +0100Henrique69(~Henrique@191.242.55.148)
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2024-01-11 23:27:05 +0100fansly(~fansly@103.3.220.62) (Client Quit)
2024-01-11 23:27:20 +0100sroso(~sroso@user/SrOso)
2024-01-11 23:27:21 +0100Henrique69(~Henrique@191.242.55.148) (Client Quit)
2024-01-11 23:27:22 +0100fansly(~fansly@103.3.220.62)
2024-01-11 23:27:31 +0100Henrique69(~Henrique6@2804:4ec:10af:e900:ddb6:503f:2dd7:8742)
2024-01-11 23:27:53 +0100HenriqueDev(~HenriqueD@191.242.55.148)
2024-01-11 23:28:18 +0100HenriqueDev(~HenriqueD@191.242.55.148) (Client Quit)
2024-01-11 23:29:28 +0100Henrique69(~Henrique6@2804:4ec:10af:e900:ddb6:503f:2dd7:8742) (Client Quit)
2024-01-11 23:29:45 +0100samuelDev(~samuelDev@2804:4ec:10af:e900:ddb6:503f:2dd7:8742)
2024-01-11 23:33:00 +0100samuelDev(~samuelDev@2804:4ec:10af:e900:ddb6:503f:2dd7:8742) (Client Quit)
2024-01-11 23:37:17 +0100sawilagar(~sawilagar@user/sawilagar) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2024-01-11 23:40:53 +0100ChaiTRex(~ChaiTRex@user/chaitrex) (Remote host closed the connection)
2024-01-11 23:40:53 +0100chexum(~quassel@gateway/tor-sasl/chexum) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2024-01-11 23:40:54 +0100ec(~ec@gateway/tor-sasl/ec) (Remote host closed the connection)
2024-01-11 23:41:15 +0100chexum(~quassel@gateway/tor-sasl/chexum)
2024-01-11 23:41:36 +0100ChaiTRex(~ChaiTRex@user/chaitrex)
2024-01-11 23:41:41 +0100ec(~ec@gateway/tor-sasl/ec)
2024-01-11 23:45:45 +0100ChaiTRex(~ChaiTRex@user/chaitrex) (Remote host closed the connection)
2024-01-11 23:46:15 +0100ChaiTRex(~ChaiTRex@user/chaitrex)
2024-01-11 23:48:35 +0100oo_miguel(~Thunderbi@78-11-179-96.static.ip.netia.com.pl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2024-01-11 23:57:25 +0100fansly(~fansly@103.3.220.62) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2024-01-11 23:57:52 +0100fansly(~fansly@2001:448a:2010:476e:5d30:627d:73c3:a75f)
2024-01-11 23:59:18 +0100acidjnk(~acidjnk@p200300d6e72b9348594c270ad51062e8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)