IRCBrowse

2022/07/02

2022-07-02 00:00:25 +0200atwm(~atwm@81.28.193.19)
2022-07-02 00:00:45 +0200motherfsck(~motherfsc@user/motherfsck)
2022-07-02 00:05:12 +0200Schrostfutz(~Schrostfu@217.150.146.150) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 00:05:29 +0200Schrostfutz(~Schrostfu@217.150.146.150)
2022-07-02 00:06:59 +0200fockerize(~finn@roc37-h01-176-170-197-243.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
2022-07-02 00:08:46 +0200Unicorn_Princess(~Unicorn_P@93-103-228-248.dynamic.t-2.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 00:09:04 +0200Unicorn_Princess(~Unicorn_P@93-103-228-248.dynamic.t-2.net)
2022-07-02 00:11:42 +0200dolio(~dolio@130.44.130.54) (Quit: ZNC 1.8.2 - https://znc.in)
2022-07-02 00:13:01 +0200dolio(~dolio@130.44.130.54)
2022-07-02 00:15:22 +0200thatcher(lp0@heathens.club) (Quit: https://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.)
2022-07-02 00:15:54 +0200prolic(~prolic@2803:2a00:2c0f:b96d:ec0c:c7f6:efb5:4ff5)
2022-07-02 00:16:01 +0200thatcher(lp0@heathens.club)
2022-07-02 00:16:42 +0200dolio(~dolio@130.44.130.54) (Client Quit)
2022-07-02 00:17:11 +0200merijn(~merijn@c-001-001-028.client.esciencecenter.eduvpn.nl)
2022-07-02 00:18:28 +0200dolio(~dolio@130.44.130.54)
2022-07-02 00:19:27 +0200chslt^(~chslt@128-092-179-067.biz.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
2022-07-02 00:20:58 +0200chslt^(~chslt@128-092-179-067.biz.spectrum.com)
2022-07-02 00:24:40 +0200jakalx(~jakalx@base.jakalx.net) ()
2022-07-02 00:24:50 +0200hgolden(~hgolden2@cpe-172-251-233-141.socal.res.rr.com) (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
2022-07-02 00:28:05 +0200hgolden(~hgolden2@cpe-172-251-233-141.socal.res.rr.com)
2022-07-02 00:36:54 +0200michalz(~michalz@185.246.204.119) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 00:38:40 +0200noteness(~noteness@user/noteness) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 00:38:41 +0200jpds(~jpds@gateway/tor-sasl/jpds) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 00:39:26 +0200eggplantade(~Eggplanta@2600:1700:bef1:5e10:c904:ea1d:dddd:db50) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 00:39:59 +0200jpds(~jpds@gateway/tor-sasl/jpds)
2022-07-02 00:40:04 +0200noteness(~noteness@user/noteness)
2022-07-02 00:41:10 +0200BusConscious(~martin@ip5f5bdf11.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) (Quit: leaving)
2022-07-02 00:43:15 +0200vglfr(~vglfr@46.96.180.13) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
2022-07-02 00:45:31 +0200chslt^(~chslt@128-092-179-067.biz.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
2022-07-02 00:48:16 +0200waleee(~waleee@h-176-10-144-223.NA.cust.bahnhof.se)
2022-07-02 00:48:31 +0200chslt^(~chslt@128-092-179-067.biz.spectrum.com)
2022-07-02 00:51:00 +0200gmg(~user@user/gehmehgeh) (Quit: Leaving)
2022-07-02 00:51:24 +0200merijn(~merijn@c-001-001-028.client.esciencecenter.eduvpn.nl) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2022-07-02 00:52:30 +0200Schrostfutz(~Schrostfu@217.150.146.150) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2022-07-02 00:54:38 +0200Schrostfutz(~Schrostfu@217.150.146.150)
2022-07-02 00:54:39 +0200winny(~weechat@user/winny) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 00:54:39 +0200ChaiTRex(~ChaiTRex@user/chaitrex) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 00:54:39 +0200jpds(~jpds@gateway/tor-sasl/jpds) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 00:55:22 +0200chslt^(~chslt@128-092-179-067.biz.spectrum.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 00:55:32 +0200FinnElija(~finn_elij@user/finn-elija/x-0085643) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 00:56:10 +0200ChaiTRex(~ChaiTRex@user/chaitrex)
2022-07-02 00:56:17 +0200jpds(~jpds@gateway/tor-sasl/jpds)
2022-07-02 00:56:22 +0200FinnElija(~finn_elij@user/finn-elija/x-0085643)
2022-07-02 00:56:52 +0200winny(~weechat@user/winny)
2022-07-02 00:57:24 +0200jao(~jao@cpc103048-sgyl39-2-0-cust502.18-2.cable.virginm.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2022-07-02 00:57:59 +0200Tuplanolla(~Tuplanoll@91-159-69-97.elisa-laajakaista.fi) (Quit: Leaving.)
2022-07-02 00:59:03 +0200chslt^(~chslt@128-092-179-067.biz.spectrum.com)
2022-07-02 00:59:05 +0200jao(~jao@cpc103048-sgyl39-2-0-cust502.18-2.cable.virginm.net)
2022-07-02 01:03:32 +0200eggplantade(~Eggplanta@2600:1700:bef1:5e10:c904:ea1d:dddd:db50)
2022-07-02 01:06:00 +0200hgolden(~hgolden2@cpe-172-251-233-141.socal.res.rr.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 01:06:41 +0200winny(~weechat@user/winny) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 01:06:41 +0200jpds(~jpds@gateway/tor-sasl/jpds) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 01:07:06 +0200jpds(~jpds@gateway/tor-sasl/jpds)
2022-07-02 01:07:07 +0200winny(~weechat@user/winny)
2022-07-02 01:08:14 +0200pleo(~pleo@user/pleo) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
2022-07-02 01:09:55 +0200azimut_(~azimut@gateway/tor-sasl/azimut)
2022-07-02 01:10:27 +0200safinaskar(~quassel@178.160.244.66)
2022-07-02 01:10:43 +0200azimut(~azimut@gateway/tor-sasl/azimut) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
2022-07-02 01:11:52 +0200FinnElija(~finn_elij@user/finn-elija/x-0085643) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 01:12:24 +0200FinnElija(~finn_elij@user/finn-elija/x-0085643)
2022-07-02 01:14:17 +0200hgolden(~hgolden2@cpe-172-251-233-141.socal.res.rr.com)
2022-07-02 01:14:33 +0200dsp(~dsp@cpc152107-haye27-2-0-cust227.17-4.cable.virginm.net) (Quit: Leaving)
2022-07-02 01:15:02 +0200califax(~califax@user/califx) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
2022-07-02 01:15:37 +0200winny(~weechat@user/winny) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 01:15:39 +0200pleo(~pleo@user/pleo)
2022-07-02 01:16:44 +0200winny(~weechat@user/winny)
2022-07-02 01:17:47 +0200califax(~califax@user/califx)
2022-07-02 01:18:21 +0200waleee(~waleee@h-176-10-144-223.NA.cust.bahnhof.se) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2022-07-02 01:21:11 +0200chslt^(~chslt@128-092-179-067.biz.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
2022-07-02 01:21:13 +0200safinaskar(~quassel@178.160.244.66) ()
2022-07-02 01:22:15 +0200pnotequalnp(~pnotequal@user/pnotequalnp)
2022-07-02 01:22:52 +0200chslt^(~chslt@128-092-179-067.biz.spectrum.com)
2022-07-02 01:28:35 +0200yauhsien(~yauhsien@61-231-22-150.dynamic-ip.hinet.net)
2022-07-02 01:28:56 +0200takuan(~takuan@178-116-218-225.access.telenet.be) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 01:29:48 +0200Lord_of_Life_(~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915)
2022-07-02 01:30:26 +0200Lord_of_Life(~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
2022-07-02 01:31:05 +0200Lord_of_Life_Lord_of_Life
2022-07-02 01:33:14 +0200yauhsien(~yauhsien@61-231-22-150.dynamic-ip.hinet.net) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2022-07-02 01:36:50 +0200chslt^(~chslt@128-092-179-067.biz.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2022-07-02 01:46:41 +0200mvk(~mvk@2607:fea8:5ce3:8500::909a)
2022-07-02 01:52:17 +0200drlkf(~drlkf@2001:41d0:a:62bb::1) (Quit: q=)
2022-07-02 01:53:56 +0200drlkf(~drlkf@2001:41d0:a:62bb::1)
2022-07-02 01:54:21 +0200jmcarthur(~jmcarthur@c-73-29-224-10.hsd1.nj.comcast.net)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200mvk(~mvk@2607:fea8:5ce3:8500::909a) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200Lord_of_Life(~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200eggplantade(~Eggplanta@2600:1700:bef1:5e10:c904:ea1d:dddd:db50) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200dolio(~dolio@130.44.130.54) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200thatcher(lp0@heathens.club) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200Unicorn_Princess(~Unicorn_P@93-103-228-248.dynamic.t-2.net) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200atwm(~atwm@81.28.193.19) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200mima(~mmh@aftr-62-216-210-244.dynamic.mnet-online.de) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200perrierjouet(~perrier-j@modemcable012.251-130-66.mc.videotron.ca) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200foul_owl(~kerry@23.82.194.107) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200pavonia(~user@user/siracusa) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200justsomeguy(~justsomeg@user/justsomeguy) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200kimjetwav(~user@2607:fea8:2340:da00:eadc:b566:9c61:625) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200Sciencentistguy(~sciencent@hacksoc/ordinary-member) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200geekosaur(~geekosaur@xmonad/geekosaur) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200zmt00(~zmt00@user/zmt00) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200shapr(~user@2600:4040:2d31:7100:fe62:9285:d8a9:96db) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200jinsun(~jinsun@user/jinsun) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200inversed(~inversed@05412f44.skybroadband.com) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200aeka(~aeka@2606:6080:1001:e:2e9c:bad5:dbdd:84ea) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200gdd1(~gdd@129.199.146.230) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200notzmv(~zmv@user/notzmv) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200sympt(~sympt@user/sympt) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200sagax(~sagax_nb@user/sagax) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200vgtw(~vgtw@user/vgtw) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200zaquest(~notzaques@5.130.79.72) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200yaroot(~yaroot@2409:12:ac0:2300:680e:dbff:fe1e:4953) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200Alex_test(~al_test@178.34.160.206) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200mtjm(~mutantmel@2604:a880:2:d0::208b:d001) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200averell(~averell@user/averell) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200feliix42(~felix@gibbs.uberspace.de) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200noctux(~noctux@user/noctux) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200Kaipei(~Kaiepi@156.34.47.253) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200jonathanx_(~jonathan@h-178-174-176-109.A357.priv.bahnhof.se) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200ozkutuk(~ozkutuk@176.240.173.153) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200mstksg(~jle`@cpe-23-240-75-236.socal.res.rr.com) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200sudden(~cat@user/sudden) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200siers(~ij@user/ij) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200mcglk(~mcglk@131.191.49.120) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200bliminse(~bliminse@host109-152-184-218.range109-152.btcentralplus.com) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200belphegor666(~satan@ip-046-223-003-073.um13.pools.vodafone-ip.de) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200lambdabot(~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200megaTherion(~therion@unix.io) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200tristanC(~tristanC@user/tristanc) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200haveo(~haveo@sl35.iuwt.fr) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:04 +0200forell(~forell@user/forell) (*.net *.split)
2022-07-02 02:00:21 +0200Alex_test(~al_test@178.34.160.206)
2022-07-02 02:00:23 +0200mima(~mmh@aftr-62-216-210-244.dynamic.mnet-online.de)
2022-07-02 02:00:26 +0200jonathanx_(~jonathan@h-178-174-176-109.A357.priv.bahnhof.se)
2022-07-02 02:00:28 +0200thatcher(lp0@heathens.club)
2022-07-02 02:00:31 +0200haveo(~haveo@sl35.iuwt.fr)
2022-07-02 02:00:32 +0200noctux(~noctux@user/noctux)
2022-07-02 02:00:32 +0200pavonia(~user@ip5f5bf425.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de)
2022-07-02 02:00:34 +0200feliix42(~felix@gibbs.uberspace.de)
2022-07-02 02:00:34 +0200bliminse(~bliminse@host109-152-184-218.range109-152.btcentralplus.com)
2022-07-02 02:00:36 +0200zaquest(~notzaques@5.130.79.72)
2022-07-02 02:00:38 +0200sudden(~cat@user/sudden)
2022-07-02 02:00:46 +0200inversed(~inversed@05412f44.skybroadband.com)
2022-07-02 02:00:47 +0200aeka(~aeka@2606:6080:1001:e:2e9c:bad5:dbdd:84ea)
2022-07-02 02:00:49 +0200pavonia(~user@ip5f5bf425.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) (Changing host)
2022-07-02 02:00:49 +0200pavonia(~user@user/siracusa)
2022-07-02 02:00:51 +0200forell(~forell@host-178-216-90-220.sta.tvknaszapraca.pl)
2022-07-02 02:01:00 +0200perrierjouet(~perrier-j@modemcable012.251-130-66.mc.videotron.ca)
2022-07-02 02:01:03 +0200belphegor666(~satan@ip-046-223-003-073.um13.pools.vodafone-ip.de)
2022-07-02 02:01:12 +0200aeka(~aeka@2606:6080:1001:e:2e9c:bad5:dbdd:84ea) (Changing host)
2022-07-02 02:01:12 +0200aeka(~aeka@user/hiruji)
2022-07-02 02:01:15 +0200megaTherion(~therion@unix.io)
2022-07-02 02:01:18 +0200forell(~forell@host-178-216-90-220.sta.tvknaszapraca.pl) (Changing host)
2022-07-02 02:01:18 +0200forell(~forell@user/forell)
2022-07-02 02:01:26 +0200averell(~averell@irc.nf3.eu)
2022-07-02 02:01:33 +0200averell(~averell@irc.nf3.eu) (Changing host)
2022-07-02 02:01:33 +0200averell(~averell@user/averell)
2022-07-02 02:01:41 +0200Sciencentistguy(~sciencent@hacksoc/ordinary-member)
2022-07-02 02:01:45 +0200vgtw(~vgtw@user/vgtw)
2022-07-02 02:01:52 +0200yaroot(~yaroot@2409:12:ac0:2300:680e:dbff:fe1e:4953)
2022-07-02 02:01:56 +0200siers(~ij@user/ij)
2022-07-02 02:01:56 +0200Lord_of_Life(~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915)
2022-07-02 02:01:57 +0200jmcarthur(~jmcarthur@c-73-29-224-10.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) (Quit: My MacBook Air has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2022-07-02 02:02:00 +0200mtjm(~mutantmel@2604:a880:2:d0::208b:d001)
2022-07-02 02:02:12 +0200lambdabot(~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu)
2022-07-02 02:02:13 +0200lambdabot(~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu) (Changing host)
2022-07-02 02:02:13 +0200lambdabot(~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot)
2022-07-02 02:02:20 +0200dolio(~dolio@130.44.130.54)
2022-07-02 02:02:23 +0200jinsun(~jinsun@user/jinsun)
2022-07-02 02:02:25 +0200chomwitt(~chomwitt@2a02:587:dc17:ef00:a734:f93:648c:824f) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2022-07-02 02:02:33 +0200geekosaur(~geekosaur@xmonad/geekosaur)
2022-07-02 02:02:56 +0200eggplantade(~Eggplanta@2600:1700:bef1:5e10:38a1:df0f:1ea3:e329)
2022-07-02 02:03:03 +0200gdd1(~gdd@2001:470:1f13:187:2e9b:467c:7a38:be67)
2022-07-02 02:03:10 +0200mstksg(~jle`@cpe-23-240-75-236.socal.res.rr.com)
2022-07-02 02:03:49 +0200atwm(~atwm@81.28.193.19)
2022-07-02 02:04:28 +0200justsomeguy(~justsomeg@user/justsomeguy)
2022-07-02 02:04:36 +0200foul_owl(~kerry@23.82.194.107)
2022-07-02 02:04:55 +0200pretty_dumm_guy(trottel@gateway/vpn/protonvpn/prettydummguy/x-88029655) (Quit: WeeChat 3.5)
2022-07-02 02:05:20 +0200tristanC(~tristanC@user/tristanc)
2022-07-02 02:06:10 +0200mcglk(~mcglk@131.191.49.120)
2022-07-02 02:07:07 +0200prolic(~prolic@2803:2a00:2c0f:b96d:ec0c:c7f6:efb5:4ff5) (Quit: Ping timeout (120 seconds))
2022-07-02 02:07:56 +0200atwm(~atwm@81.28.193.19) (Client Quit)
2022-07-02 02:09:23 +0200prolic(~prolic@2803:2a00:2c0f:b96d:ec0c:c7f6:efb5:4ff5)
2022-07-02 02:10:56 +0200jgeerds(~jgeerds@55d45f48.access.ecotel.net) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2022-07-02 02:11:34 +0200gurkenglas(~gurkengla@dslb-002-203-144-112.002.203.pools.vodafone-ip.de) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2022-07-02 02:13:12 +0200NaturalNumber123(~monadam@137.229.82.64)
2022-07-02 02:15:42 +0200merijn(~merijn@c-001-001-028.client.esciencecenter.eduvpn.nl)
2022-07-02 02:20:11 +0200ddb(~ddb@ipv6two.tilde.club) (Quit: WeeChat 3.5)
2022-07-02 02:21:42 +0200dcoutts_(~duncan@host86-155-218-176.range86-155.btcentralplus.com)
2022-07-02 02:24:05 +0200dcoutts__(~duncan@host86-150-18-54.range86-150.btcentralplus.com) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2022-07-02 02:25:12 +0200NaturalNumber123(~monadam@137.229.82.64) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2022-07-02 02:28:02 +0200geekosaur(~geekosaur@xmonad/geekosaur) (Quit: Leaving)
2022-07-02 02:30:02 +0200califax(~califax@user/califx) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 02:30:02 +0200noteness(~noteness@user/noteness) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 02:30:02 +0200winny(~weechat@user/winny) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 02:30:02 +0200azimut_(~azimut@gateway/tor-sasl/azimut) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 02:30:02 +0200jpds(~jpds@gateway/tor-sasl/jpds) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 02:30:21 +0200califax(~califax@user/califx)
2022-07-02 02:30:31 +0200azimut(~azimut@gateway/tor-sasl/azimut)
2022-07-02 02:30:31 +0200jpds(~jpds@gateway/tor-sasl/jpds)
2022-07-02 02:30:37 +0200winny(~weechat@user/winny)
2022-07-02 02:31:24 +0200king_gs(~Thunderbi@2806:103e:29:12be:accf:d6c3:d87:7820)
2022-07-02 02:33:10 +0200geekosaur(~geekosaur@xmonad/geekosaur)
2022-07-02 02:33:23 +0200noteness(~noteness@user/noteness)
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2022-07-02 02:55:50 +0200 <byorgey> Anyone know of a good way to extract Haddock comments from some code? Like, say I want to get the Haddock comments corresponding to the constructors of a particular data type.
2022-07-02 02:55:53 +0200dextaa(~DV@user/dextaa)
2022-07-02 02:56:02 +0200liz(~liz@host86-159-158-175.range86-159.btcentralplus.com)
2022-07-02 02:56:45 +0200 <hpc> use haddock as a library?
2022-07-02 02:58:18 +0200 <geekosaur> or ghc as a library, they should be in the AST in particular in 9.x
2022-07-02 02:59:16 +0200 <hpc> https://hackage.haskell.org/package/haddock-library-1.10.0/docs/Documentation-Haddock-Parser.html seems promising
2022-07-02 02:59:21 +0200 <byorgey> The Haddocks for the latest haddock-api package don't build =P If I go back several versions, I find "The Haddock API: A rudimentory, highly experimental API exposing some of the internals of Haddock. Don't expect it to be stable.". Not very confidence inspiring.
2022-07-02 02:59:26 +0200 <hpc> parseParas, then drill down through the data structure
2022-07-02 02:59:44 +0200 <hpc> weird, haddock itself depends on haddock-api
2022-07-02 02:59:50 +0200 <byorgey> aha, I was looking at the wrong package!
2022-07-02 02:59:59 +0200 <byorgey> perfect, thanks hpc
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2022-07-02 03:00:27 +0200 <hpc> byorgey: i started from the haddock package and just clicked through its listed dependencies :P
2022-07-02 03:03:28 +0200 <byorgey> hpc: fair enough. I probably would have gotten there eventually, but thought I would ask in case anyone had done it before. Thanks for doing my work for me =)
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2022-07-02 05:41:39 +0200 <Square> What is a good setup (using nix) to be able to create new projects on a whim? I fear, if doing it with my shallow nix knowledge, id download new versions of ghc all the time. "> nix-channel --list" gives "nixpkgs https://nixos.org/channels/nixpkgs-unstable"
2022-07-02 05:43:43 +0200 <Square> oh.. it works like apt. I need to issue an "> nix-channel --update" to change coordinates right?
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2022-07-02 06:25:57 +0200 <gdown> That's right, as long as you're using 'import <nixpkgs>'. It's also possible to pin nixpkgs for that specific project, in which case it could have it's own version of ghc.
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2022-07-02 10:52:28 +0200 <jackdk> Square: the following `default.nix` works surprisingly often: `let nixpkgs = import <nixpkgs> {}; in nixpkgs.haskellPackages.developPackage { root = ./.; }`
2022-07-02 10:52:44 +0200 <jackdk> it's normally what I use when hacking on someone else's non-nixified library to send a PR or whatever.
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2022-07-02 11:06:21 +0200 <maralorn> Square: I also just have a ghc.withPackages with a collection of my favorite packages in my global path so for a lot of projects I don‘t need to load anything at all.
2022-07-02 11:07:36 +0200 <maralorn> Does Hackage verify any properties of uploaded sdists? Are precompiled binaries allowed in there? Are there known packages on hackage which contain binaries?
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2022-07-02 12:16:20 +0200 <ncf> int-e: fixed misfortune :)
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2022-07-02 14:50:09 +0200 <darchitect> hi all, I know that's not the right group to ask, but are there any Plutus (Cardano) devs here that can help me with something ? (or point me to the right group to ask my questions in...)
2022-07-02 14:52:13 +0200 <Axman6> try asking your question, it's hard for us to know where the right place would be without knowing what you want
2022-07-02 14:52:26 +0200renzhi(~xp@2607:fa49:6500:b100::cf) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
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2022-07-02 14:54:11 +0200 <darchitect> Axman6: I want to know if it's possible to update datum of a script using the EUTXO model
2022-07-02 14:54:30 +0200jpds(~jpds@gateway/tor-sasl/jpds)
2022-07-02 14:55:17 +0200 <darchitect> Axman6: my initial reaction is NO, since every UTXO has to be consumed, but was wondering if anyone more experienced can tell me why YES or why NO in more detail. an example scenario is say you have a CounterDatum (with just 1 Integer in it) and every time the validator is run -> the Integer value of the datum changes.
2022-07-02 14:55:42 +0200 <darchitect> Axman6: is this possible or not ?
2022-07-02 14:55:55 +0200mon_aaraj(~MonAaraj@user/mon-aaraj/x-4416475)
2022-07-02 14:56:46 +0200 <Axman6> I personally don't have any experience with Plutus, so I won't be able to help. Is there not a forum or slack/discord that people use for it?
2022-07-02 14:58:10 +0200 <darchitect> yeah I think there's a discord, but I wanted to see if there are any lively groups here I can use, since Discord doesn't really have a good TUI
2022-07-02 14:59:31 +0200jpds(~jpds@gateway/tor-sasl/jpds) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
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2022-07-02 15:02:37 +0200 <Axman6> My experience is with Daml, where to update anyting on the ledger you need to archive it and create a new one, I would be surprised if it weren't too different in plutus, but I know next to nothing about the language
2022-07-02 15:03:14 +0200mon_aaraj(~MonAaraj@user/mon-aaraj/x-4416475)
2022-07-02 15:03:46 +0200BusConscious(~martin@ip5f5bded3.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de)
2022-07-02 15:04:35 +0200renzhi(~xp@2607:fa49:6500:b100::c32e)
2022-07-02 15:04:47 +0200 <BusConscious> hello everyone. So I'm trying to build a ghc crosscompiler from a gcc crosscompiler
2022-07-02 15:06:02 +0200 <BusConscious> and autoconf creates weird errormessages before I even get to configuring for the target
2022-07-02 15:06:48 +0200yauhsien(~yauhsien@61-231-22-150.dynamic-ip.hinet.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2022-07-02 15:07:06 +0200dcoutts__(~duncan@host86-184-242-41.range86-184.btcentralplus.com) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2022-07-02 15:07:07 +0200jakalx(~jakalx@base.jakalx.net)
2022-07-02 15:10:47 +0200 <BusConscious> ah nevermind
2022-07-02 15:15:26 +0200pleo(~pleo@user/pleo)
2022-07-02 15:16:07 +0200jpds(~jpds@gateway/tor-sasl/jpds)
2022-07-02 15:16:22 +0200edinwood(~edinwood@109.249.184.205)
2022-07-02 15:18:55 +0200 <edinwood> Hi, I have been away for a while, are there any new developments in the haskell language?
2022-07-02 15:19:08 +0200 <edinwood> last time i was here linear types had just been added
2022-07-02 15:19:26 +0200 <geekosaur> QuickLook maybe
2022-07-02 15:19:49 +0200 <geekosaur> redesign of the primitive types to support Apple AArch64, but that's mostly not user visible
2022-07-02 15:20:37 +0200 <geekosaur> (QuickLook is a consistent, lawful implementation of impredicative types, replacing the series of hacks ghc had that was unreliable and apt to change every release)
2022-07-02 15:21:48 +0200 <edinwood> erp
2022-07-02 15:21:54 +0200 <edinwood> quicklook sounds complicated
2022-07-02 15:22:15 +0200 <edinwood> hope the ghc-prim thing might help fix some arch install issues?
2022-07-02 15:22:36 +0200 <edinwood> i thought ghc does not support impredictive types
2022-07-02 15:22:44 +0200 <geekosaur> as of QuickLook it does
2022-07-02 15:22:51 +0200 <edinwood> wait, Apple Arch?
2022-07-02 15:22:53 +0200 <edinwood> nvm then
2022-07-02 15:22:59 +0200 <geekosaur> (added in 9.2 although some of the groundwork was in 9.0)
2022-07-02 15:23:02 +0200 <edinwood> thats like a devil combo
2022-07-02 15:23:20 +0200 <geekosaur> apple decided to come up with their own incompatible calling conventions on aarch64
2022-07-02 15:23:24 +0200 <edinwood> hmm, so Quicklook actually sounds like quite a major development
2022-07-02 15:23:49 +0200 <edinwood> geekosuar: lol, yeah, i guess its a niche
2022-07-02 15:23:50 +0200liz(~liz@host86-159-158-175.range86-159.btcentralplus.com) (Quit: Lost terminal)
2022-07-02 15:23:55 +0200 <BusConscious> Do you guys have any resources on how to add a crosscompile target in ghc? (Not different architecture, just different OS)
2022-07-02 15:24:24 +0200 <geekosaur> BusConscious, "normal" cross-compilation isn't really a thing yet although there's some work on it
2022-07-02 15:25:59 +0200 <geekosaur> afaik you need to treat a different OS the same way you'd treat a different architecture, except you'll already have most of the ugly work done for you instead of having to come up with your own native codegen (but see discussion of apple aarch64 above)
2022-07-02 15:26:18 +0200darchitect(~darchitec@82-132-215-123.dab.02.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2022-07-02 15:26:24 +0200merijn(~merijn@c-001-001-028.client.esciencecenter.eduvpn.nl)
2022-07-02 15:26:42 +0200 <geekosaur> which means using a custom-built ghc and unregisterised backend to dump C code to build on the target machine. but this is probably a question for #ghc
2022-07-02 15:27:02 +0200malte(~malte@mal.tc) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2022-07-02 15:29:34 +0200malte(~malte@mal.tc)
2022-07-02 15:34:32 +0200 <BusConscious> geekosaur: This is what I'm going of so far: https://gitlab.haskell.org/ghc/ghc/-/wikis/building/using https://gitlab.haskell.org/ghc/ghc/-/wikis/building/cross-compiling https://downloads.haskell.org/~ghc/6.2/docs/html/building/sec-porting-ghc.html I would love to port my unix shell to sortix. They have a POSIX compliant libc and a lot of other stuff like lua and pythons ported so in theory should
2022-07-02 15:34:39 +0200 <BusConscious> be possible
2022-07-02 15:34:52 +0200coot(~coot@213.134.190.95) (Quit: coot)
2022-07-02 15:35:03 +0200 <BusConscious> But it won't suffice to just crosscompile. I would have to patch some files first to add a new target
2022-07-02 15:36:05 +0200 <edinwood> isnt this why they made the JVM?
2022-07-02 15:37:04 +0200sammelweis(~quassel@2601:401:8200:2d4c:bd9:d04c:7f69:eb10)
2022-07-02 15:39:08 +0200 <BusConscious> edinwood: Are you talking to me?
2022-07-02 15:39:28 +0200 <edinwood> geekosaur, i never really understood the impredictive types situation very well, and never really understood exactly when that error appeared, and it only showed up when i was doing really difficult type level stuff that i propably didnt understand all that well anyway
2022-07-02 15:40:14 +0200 <edinwood> BusConscious: its more of a quip, i think you are mad for doing all this crosscompiling, and that it is unfortunate that you should have to, but the only tech i can think of thats close to a standardised OS is the JVM
2022-07-02 15:40:44 +0200 <edinwood> i think we were compiling to that with some kind of java outputting backend
2022-07-02 15:40:48 +0200bitdex(~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 15:40:55 +0200 <edinwood> maybe llvm is somewhat cross platform, idk
2022-07-02 15:41:47 +0200 <geekosaur> llvm is cross platform but in a different way. you generate portable llvm code, then generate target code from that
2022-07-02 15:41:50 +0200bitdex(~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex)
2022-07-02 15:41:56 +0200 <geekosaur> ghc supports cross-platform that way too
2022-07-02 15:42:40 +0200 <edinwood> oh right, so its more of a cross compilation intermediate stage handled under the hood to allow users to cross compile in a more straitforwards way
2022-07-02 15:42:52 +0200 <edinwood> not sure how that helps the issue mind
2022-07-02 15:43:23 +0200 <BusConscious> I mean obviously I have to crosscompile, because ghc is not ported to that operating system, but yes "in theory" is doing a lot of work and POSIX has its fair share of ambiguity
2022-07-02 15:43:27 +0200 <edinwood> isnt there the possiblility of some kind of haskell bytecode machine or something
2022-07-02 15:43:28 +0200 <geekosaur> think supercomputers, where the original idea was users compiled to llvm ir and each actual machine finished the compilation to its own native arch
2022-07-02 15:43:49 +0200 <geekosaur> (the effective victory of intel kinda made this unnecessary in the end)
2022-07-02 15:43:51 +0200 <edinwood> BusConsious: and its less work than trying to cross compile GHC?
2022-07-02 15:44:17 +0200 <geekosaur> but back when llvm was developed there were still alpha, sparc, ppc, etc. supercomputers around
2022-07-02 15:44:24 +0200raym(~raym@user/raym) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2022-07-02 15:45:00 +0200 <edinwood> geekosaur: i thought a pupercomputer would have homogenous architecture, but maybe in some kind of distributed setting on the cloud like bayowulf or something
2022-07-02 15:45:20 +0200 <BusConscious> I mean it is possible to compile to C code with ghc right?
2022-07-02 15:45:30 +0200 <edinwood> again as an intermediate stage
2022-07-02 15:45:45 +0200 <edinwood> right?
2022-07-02 15:45:47 +0200 <geekosaur> back in the day you would want some parts of your program to run on a vector processor, another part to run on an alpha with huge array support, another part on intel, etc.
2022-07-02 15:45:56 +0200 <geekosaur> this could still be useful with gpus
2022-07-02 15:46:11 +0200 <geekosaur> BusConscious, only with unregisterised mode
2022-07-02 15:46:19 +0200 <geekosaur> which requires building your own ghc
2022-07-02 15:46:28 +0200 <edinwood> i guess supercomputers dont rely on OS threading!
2022-07-02 15:46:45 +0200 <edinwood> my gpu i guess just kicks in occasionally
2022-07-02 15:46:57 +0200 <edinwood> there was some CUDA stuff and repa, but i never understood
2022-07-02 15:46:59 +0200jakalx(~jakalx@base.jakalx.net) (Error from remote client)
2022-07-02 15:47:06 +0200bitdex(~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 15:47:31 +0200 <edinwood> what was the other thing, like some kind of flag you activate and it starts being all parallel
2022-07-02 15:47:44 +0200 <edinwood> accelerate
2022-07-02 15:47:51 +0200 <edinwood> i think it scared users that were used to having to specify the paralelism manually
2022-07-02 15:47:59 +0200 <geekosaur> ghc doesn't automatically parallelize programs, that's still a very unsolved problem
2022-07-02 15:48:15 +0200 <edinwood> didnt HAXL have some kind of thing
2022-07-02 15:48:16 +0200 <edinwood> wait
2022-07-02 15:48:18 +0200 <BusConscious> geekosaur: I don't understand what you mean by building ghc? Of course I would have to build my own ghc to get a crosscompiler?
2022-07-02 15:48:33 +0200bitdex(~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex)
2022-07-02 15:48:41 +0200 <edinwood> it like, examined a tree of applicatives or something to see which parts could be disentangled and run in parallel
2022-07-02 15:48:57 +0200 <geekosaur> BusConscious, -fvia-C in a released ghc will print a warning and use the native codegen
2022-07-02 15:49:21 +0200 <edinwood> BusConscious
2022-07-02 15:49:22 +0200 <edinwood> erp
2022-07-02 15:49:29 +0200 <edinwood> you would need to crosscompile the compiler?
2022-07-02 15:49:41 +0200 <geekosaur> you need to build a non-release ghc to get a -fvia-C that used unregisterised backend to generate portable C, then use that GHC to compile GHC again into C files for the target
2022-07-02 15:49:54 +0200pleo(~pleo@user/pleo) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2022-07-02 15:50:02 +0200 <geekosaur> then take the C files to the target and compile them there
2022-07-02 15:50:16 +0200 <edinwood> oof
2022-07-02 15:50:17 +0200 <BusConscious> edinwood: no but build it on my own in the first place
2022-07-02 15:50:30 +0200 <edinwood> how are you going to get that?
2022-07-02 15:50:31 +0200 <BusConscious> geekosaur ah
2022-07-02 15:50:38 +0200 <BusConscious> I see
2022-07-02 15:50:56 +0200 <BusConscious> This seems like the easiest way to port haskell software to an OS with no haskell
2022-07-02 15:51:16 +0200 <geekosaur> alternatively if llvm supports the target you can use -keep-llvm-files and copy those over, but you'd have to ask #ghc what you do with them afterward
2022-07-02 15:51:41 +0200 <edinwood> couldnt you do it with just object files or something?
2022-07-02 15:51:44 +0200fweht(uid404746@id-404746.lymington.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
2022-07-02 15:51:49 +0200pleo(~pleo@user/pleo)
2022-07-02 15:51:57 +0200 <edinwood> i think this is how they were doing hotswapping
2022-07-02 15:52:01 +0200jao(~jao@cpc103048-sgyl39-2-0-cust502.18-2.cable.virginm.net)
2022-07-02 15:52:04 +0200 <BusConscious> you use a generic target and then compile to C which you then compile with the OS's gcc crosscompiler and link to its libc
2022-07-02 15:52:09 +0200 <edinwood> but maybe on a consistent architecture
2022-07-02 15:52:20 +0200 <BusConscious> not as cool as directly crosscompiling to binary but still
2022-07-02 15:52:41 +0200 <edinwood> yeah, you want ghc to do the linking
2022-07-02 15:52:51 +0200 <geekosaur> object files are stamped with theoir architecture and ABI, you have to hope those match (and that the machoines agree as to what an object file is)
2022-07-02 15:53:03 +0200 <edinwood> the issue with different libc actually is easiliy solved with nix
2022-07-02 15:53:21 +0200 <edinwood> nix coppy closure should use the host OS libc
2022-07-02 15:53:59 +0200causal(~user@50.35.83.177) (Quit: WeeChat 3.5)
2022-07-02 15:54:17 +0200 <edinwood> but maybe thats more for spinning up to the same OS, and not having to worry about setting it up to have the correct libc
2022-07-02 15:55:03 +0200 <edinwood> like, where you compile and where you run being different when you have a lightweight requirement of a server, where you dont want a full ghc
2022-07-02 15:55:22 +0200 <edinwood> i guess in this case nixos is advocated for
2022-07-02 15:55:47 +0200 <edinwood> but debian is fine. i guess you dont want to *not use the OS your trying to crosscompile to*
2022-07-02 15:55:55 +0200 <edinwood> but i guessw thats always the easyest fix!
2022-07-02 15:56:32 +0200 <edinwood> did you say the reason was mostly to use an existing linking infrastructure?
2022-07-02 15:56:55 +0200 <edinwood> and then at what point does that become redundant to something like letting the nix team fix it
2022-07-02 15:57:23 +0200 <edinwood> the amount of trouble we have with build tools....
2022-07-02 15:59:06 +0200bitdex(~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 15:59:10 +0200coot(~coot@213.134.190.95)
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2022-07-02 16:02:21 +0200 <edinwood> geekosaur: can you say anything more about this impredictive fix?
2022-07-02 16:02:23 +0200jakalx(~jakalx@base.jakalx.net)
2022-07-02 16:03:00 +0200bitdex(~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex)
2022-07-02 16:03:40 +0200 <geekosaur[m]> Not a whole lot, I barely know what impredicative types are
2022-07-02 16:11:18 +0200alp(~alp@user/alp) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2022-07-02 16:11:27 +0200acidjnk_new(~acidjnk@dynamic-046-114-174-017.46.114.pool.telefonica.de)
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2022-07-02 16:13:37 +0200jakalx(~jakalx@base.jakalx.net) ()
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2022-07-02 16:14:03 +0200Pickchea(~private@user/pickchea) (Quit: Leaving)
2022-07-02 16:15:08 +0200jakalx(~jakalx@base.jakalx.net)
2022-07-02 16:15:36 +0200nek0(~nek0@2a01:4f8:222:2b41::12)
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2022-07-02 16:17:23 +0200 <edinwood> hmm
2022-07-02 16:18:57 +0200 <edinwood> i cant even find a link in the realase notes
2022-07-02 16:19:01 +0200 <edinwood> https://downloads.haskell.org/ghc/9.2.2/docs/html/users_guide/9.2.2-notes.html
2022-07-02 16:19:45 +0200 <edinwood> i can find old links on quicklook proposals
2022-07-02 16:19:46 +0200 <edinwood> v
2022-07-02 16:19:47 +0200 <edinwood> https://gitlab.haskell.org/ghc/ghc/-/issues/18126
2022-07-02 16:20:49 +0200 <Hecate> edinwood: QL is not done yet
2022-07-02 16:21:20 +0200 <edinwood> geekosaur said it was in 9.2.2
2022-07-02 16:21:35 +0200 <Hecate> SPJ says it's not-done
2022-07-02 16:21:40 +0200 <geekosaur> that was apparently the start of it. I didn't realize there was more work coming
2022-07-02 16:21:52 +0200edinwood(~edinwood@109.249.184.205) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 16:22:00 +0200 <Hecate> damn, he couldn't handle the truth
2022-07-02 16:22:01 +0200 <Hecate> heya geekosaur
2022-07-02 16:22:02 +0200 <geekosaur> oops?
2022-07-02 16:22:05 +0200 <geekosaur> hi
2022-07-02 16:22:12 +0200edinwood(~edinwood@109.249.184.205)
2022-07-02 16:22:19 +0200 <edinwood> <geekosaur> as of QuickLook it does <geekosaur> (added in 9.2 although some of the groundwork was in 9.0)
2022-07-02 16:22:37 +0200 <edinwood> i find this https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/research/publication/a-quick-look-at-impredicativity/
2022-07-02 16:22:51 +0200 <edinwood> but i recall actually watching this talk already and still i have no idea
2022-07-02 16:22:59 +0200 <edinwood> something to do with foralls
2022-07-02 16:23:32 +0200 <geekosaur> the short version as I know it (which is probably incomplete) is impredicativity is instantiating a type variable to a forall-ed type
2022-07-02 16:23:57 +0200 <geekosaur> so b can unify with (a -> a) but not with (forall a. a -> a)
2022-07-02 16:24:25 +0200 <geekosaur> because the latter is impredicative ("can't be represented as a predicate")
2022-07-02 16:24:34 +0200 <edinwood> and it was sometihng to do with inference from examing terms or something
2022-07-02 16:24:55 +0200 <edinwood> a "predicate" ?
2022-07-02 16:24:59 +0200 <geekosaur> unfortunately that last only makes sense if you visualize the type inference engine as written in Prolog, I think
2022-07-02 16:25:10 +0200 <edinwood> this seems like it would help with understanding whatim-predicate-ive is
2022-07-02 16:25:17 +0200 <edinwood> i thought it was im-predict-ive
2022-07-02 16:25:56 +0200 <edinwood> ah the ol' curry-howerd debacle
2022-07-02 16:26:08 +0200alp(~alp@user/alp)
2022-07-02 16:26:46 +0200 <edinwood> so, the issue is not understanding the diffence between (a->a) and forall a. (a->a) as some kind of logic expression
2022-07-02 16:27:04 +0200 <geekosaur> the forall has to be inside the parens for it to be impredicative
2022-07-02 16:27:16 +0200 <edinwood> because i can give you (a->a) but not a (forall a. a -> a) ?#
2022-07-02 16:27:22 +0200 <geekosaur> if it's outside then it can be floated to the left, so there are no problems
2022-07-02 16:27:42 +0200acidjnk_new(~acidjnk@dynamic-046-114-174-017.46.114.pool.telefonica.de) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2022-07-02 16:27:55 +0200 <geekosaur> if you can give me a (forall a. a -> a) at all, it will be monomorphized (that is, it will have its type fixed, losing the forall)
2022-07-02 16:27:56 +0200 <edinwood> so its some kind of internal variable decleration or something?
2022-07-02 16:28:04 +0200arahael(~arahael@121-44-28-164.tpgi.com.au)
2022-07-02 16:28:22 +0200 <edinwood> foralls are called "existential quantifiers" right?
2022-07-02 16:28:30 +0200 <geekosaur> things get much more complex if you need it to remain usable at any type
2022-07-02 16:28:40 +0200 <geekosaur> it depends on how they're used
2022-07-02 16:28:53 +0200 <geekosaur> I'm still a little fuzzy on this though
2022-07-02 16:29:07 +0200 <edinwood> yeah, tbh i cant understand the difference
2022-07-02 16:29:19 +0200 <edinwood> sure `a' in (a->a) is already polymorfic
2022-07-02 16:29:26 +0200 <geekosaur> "any" vs. "all", very roughly
2022-07-02 16:29:39 +0200 <geekosaur> or "there exists" instead of "for all"
2022-07-02 16:29:43 +0200 <edinwood> but if i can act on any of them i can act on all of them
2022-07-02 16:29:46 +0200 <edinwood> er, oh
2022-07-02 16:29:47 +0200 <geekosaur> the former is the existential
2022-07-02 16:29:58 +0200 <edinwood> i mean, (a->a) says "all a" right?
2022-07-02 16:29:59 +0200 <geekosaur> this is more logic than math
2022-07-02 16:30:12 +0200 <geekosaur> only if a hasn't been fixed otherwse
2022-07-02 16:30:28 +0200 <geekosaur> you can consider the forall when inside the parentheses as a local variable declaration
2022-07-02 16:30:41 +0200 <edinwood> hmm, so your saying eg `id` would have its type monomorphised in the expression where its used
2022-07-02 16:30:47 +0200 <geekosaur> yes
2022-07-02 16:31:05 +0200 <edinwood> and whats different here?
2022-07-02 16:31:49 +0200 <edinwood> could i do like: f a b c = (a b,a c)
2022-07-02 16:31:57 +0200 <geekosaur> without the inner forall, ghc will pick a specific type for `a` based on how it's used
2022-07-02 16:31:58 +0200 <edinwood> for type of b /= type of c
2022-07-02 16:32:17 +0200 <geekosaur> so the passed-in `id` will end up only being used for that type
2022-07-02 16:32:39 +0200 <edinwood> yeah, `a' was id here
2022-07-02 16:32:54 +0200acarrico(~acarrico@dhcp-68-142-48-19.greenmountainaccess.net) (Quit: Leaving.)
2022-07-02 16:33:42 +0200 <geekosaur> so if you declare it in `f` as being forall-ed, it will keep that and work as you expect. if you don't, it's impredicative and ghc will normally reject it
2022-07-02 16:33:49 +0200 <edinwood> :t \f a b c -> (a b,a c)
2022-07-02 16:33:50 +0200 <lambdabot> p -> (t -> b) -> t -> t -> (b, b)
2022-07-02 16:33:55 +0200 <edinwood> so t is the same there
2022-07-02 16:34:15 +0200nate4(~nate@98.45.169.16)
2022-07-02 16:34:42 +0200 <edinwood> % :t \f (a :: forall a. a->a) b c -> (a b,a c)
2022-07-02 16:34:42 +0200 <yahb2> <interactive>:1:5: error: ; Illegal type signature: ‘forall a. a -> a’ ; Type signatures are only allowed in patterns with ScopedTypeVariables
2022-07-02 16:34:55 +0200 <edinwood> why yahb is not have this extension on
2022-07-02 16:35:11 +0200 <edinwood> % :set -XScopedTypeVariables
2022-07-02 16:35:11 +0200 <yahb2> <no output>
2022-07-02 16:35:18 +0200 <edinwood> % :t \f (a :: forall a. a->a) b c -> (a b,a c)
2022-07-02 16:35:19 +0200 <yahb2> \f (a :: forall a. a->a) b c -> (a b,a c) ; :: p -> (forall a1. a1 -> a1) -> a -> b -> (a, b)
2022-07-02 16:35:22 +0200 <geekosaur> my sister just pinged me, I need to run
2022-07-02 16:35:47 +0200 <edinwood> ok ill work through this on my own
2022-07-02 16:36:20 +0200 <edinwood> % (\f (a :: forall a. a->a) b c -> (a b,a c)) id "a" 'a'
2022-07-02 16:36:20 +0200 <yahb2> <interactive>:74:48: error: ; • Couldn't match expected type ‘a -> a’ with actual type ‘[Char]’ ; • In the second argument of ‘\ f (a :: forall a. a -> a) b c ; ...
2022-07-02 16:37:01 +0200 <edinwood> % (\ (f :: forall a. a->a) a b -> (f a,f b)) id "a" 'a'
2022-07-02 16:37:01 +0200 <yahb2> ("a",'a')
2022-07-02 16:37:04 +0200 <edinwood> wey
2022-07-02 16:37:07 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2022-07-02 16:37:15 +0200 <edinwood> % (\f a b c -> (a b,a c)) id "a" 'a'
2022-07-02 16:37:15 +0200 <yahb2> <interactive>:78:28: error: ; • Couldn't match expected type ‘Char -> b’ ; with actual type ‘[Char]’ ; • In the second argument of ‘\ f a b c -> (a b, a c)’, namely ‘"a"’ ...
2022-07-02 16:37:19 +0200 <edinwood> woop
2022-07-02 16:37:25 +0200 <edinwood> so your saying this never used to work?
2022-07-02 16:38:03 +0200 <edinwood> nah, this works in GHC 8.2 also
2022-07-02 16:38:10 +0200 <edinwood> i wonder what they changed...
2022-07-02 16:38:51 +0200nate4(~nate@98.45.169.16) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2022-07-02 16:39:05 +0200 <edinwood> % (\ f a b -> (f a,f b)) id "a" 'a'
2022-07-02 16:39:05 +0200 <yahb2> <interactive>:80:31: error: ; • Couldn't match expected type ‘[Char]’ with actual type ‘Char’ ; • In the third argument of ‘\ f a b -> (f a, f b)’, namely ‘'a'’ ; In the expression: (...
2022-07-02 16:39:35 +0200 <edinwood> thats better (one above had a typo)
2022-07-02 16:40:51 +0200 <yin> isn't this the monomorphism restriction?
2022-07-02 16:41:21 +0200 <edinwood> the realease notes mention neither quicklook or impredictive...
2022-07-02 16:41:45 +0200 <edinwood> yin: that was mentioned before, or at least, something got monomorphized
2022-07-02 16:41:55 +0200 <edinwood> https://downloads.haskell.org/~ghc/9.2.2/docs/html/users_guide/9.2.2-notes.html
2022-07-02 16:42:20 +0200 <edinwood> i think this may have been a wild goose chase, i wonder where geekosaur got the idea about quicklook in 9.2.2 from
2022-07-02 16:51:16 +0200raym(~raym@user/raym)
2022-07-02 16:52:05 +0200xheimlich(~xheimlich@179.218.1.150) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 16:54:57 +0200Topsi(~Topsi@37.84.244.102)
2022-07-02 16:56:13 +0200 <yin> we need to polish some rough edges in haskell imo
2022-07-02 16:56:44 +0200 <yin> let generalization is not very intuitive in some edge cases
2022-07-02 16:56:44 +0200Topsi(~Topsi@37.84.244.102) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2022-07-02 16:59:25 +0200 <yin> the monomorphism restriction is weird and the f a = f a vs f = \a -> f a distinction makes no sense imho
2022-07-02 16:59:29 +0200regr(~regr@user/regr)
2022-07-02 16:59:30 +0200Guest1281(~Gambino@pool-100-34-212-74.phlapa.fios.verizon.net)
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2022-07-02 16:59:35 +0200Guest1281(~Gambino@user/polo)
2022-07-02 16:59:42 +0200Guest1281Polo
2022-07-02 16:59:59 +0200 <yin> *f g a = g a vs f g = \a -> g a
2022-07-02 17:00:01 +0200cawfee_cawfee
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2022-07-02 17:03:15 +0200turlando(~turlando@user/turlando) ()
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2022-07-02 17:03:56 +0200turlando(~turlando@user/turlando)
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2022-07-02 17:04:55 +0200Polo(~Gambino@user/polo)
2022-07-02 17:07:51 +0200 <geekosaur> I can't stick around but https://downloads.haskell.org/ghc/9.2.1/docs/html/users_guide/exts/impredicative_types.html
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2022-07-02 17:20:45 +0200eggplantade(~Eggplanta@2600:1700:bef1:5e10:38a1:df0f:1ea3:e329)
2022-07-02 17:22:33 +0200gurkenglas(~gurkengla@dslb-002-203-144-112.002.203.pools.vodafone-ip.de)
2022-07-02 17:24:08 +0200pleo(~pleo@user/pleo) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2022-07-02 17:30:39 +0200jz99[m](~jz99matri@2001:470:69fc:105::1:d5f1)
2022-07-02 17:40:54 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl)
2022-07-02 17:42:50 +0200regr(~regr@user/regr) (Quit: WeeChat 2.8)
2022-07-02 17:47:40 +0200zer0bitz(~zer0bitz@2001:2003:f748:2000:c429:cbdc:14b0:bcca)
2022-07-02 17:48:34 +0200 <monochrom> The monomorphism restriction fixed a rough edge.
2022-07-02 17:49:28 +0200 <edinwood> oh right, so allowing to define a function with a nested forall in the type signature?
2022-07-02 17:50:20 +0200 <monochrom> That if you wrote a top-level "n = <expression that takes 5 minutes to compute but comes down to 42>", without the monomorphism restriction, it would take 5 minutes every time to use n, despite the syntax suggesting otherwise.
2022-07-02 17:53:50 +0200qwym(~qwym@pool-96-253-29-94.prvdri.fios.verizon.net)
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2022-07-02 17:54:01 +0200Topsi(~Topsi@host-88-217-154-179.customer.m-online.net) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
2022-07-02 17:54:07 +0200Vajb(~Vajb@hag-jnsbng11-58c3a8-176.dhcp.inet.fi)
2022-07-02 17:55:37 +0200raehik(~raehik@cpc95906-rdng25-2-0-cust156.15-3.cable.virginm.net)
2022-07-02 17:57:10 +0200merijn(~merijn@c-001-001-028.client.esciencecenter.eduvpn.nl)
2022-07-02 18:00:15 +0200 <hololeap> anyone really familiar with tasty? I can't figure out how to use this: https://hackage.haskell.org/package/tasty-1.4.2.3/docs/Test-Tasty.html#v:withResource
2022-07-02 18:00:21 +0200tzh(~tzh@c-24-21-73-154.hsd1.or.comcast.net)
2022-07-02 18:01:10 +0200 <hololeap> the problem is the third argument, (IO a -> TestTree). if I want to use that 'a', I have to convert an IO action to a TestTree, and I don't see any way to do that
2022-07-02 18:01:17 +0200 <hololeap> except unsafePerformIO
2022-07-02 18:06:04 +0200pleo(~pleo@user/pleo)
2022-07-02 18:10:20 +0200 <int-e> TestTree embeds IO via IsTest, see for example https://hackage.haskell.org/package/tasty-hunit-0.10.0.3/docs/Test-Tasty-HUnit.html#v:testCase (note that Assertion = IO ())
2022-07-02 18:12:04 +0200 <int-e> (I'm *not* familiar with tasty... I have not checked what other providers it has. And I suppose you could make your own if you wish to do so.)
2022-07-02 18:12:05 +0200tzh_(~tzh@c-24-21-73-154.hsd1.wa.comcast.net)
2022-07-02 18:14:50 +0200tzh(~tzh@c-24-21-73-154.hsd1.or.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2022-07-02 18:22:41 +0200Haskelytic(~Haskelyti@118.179.211.17)
2022-07-02 18:24:31 +0200sympt(~sympt@user/sympt)
2022-07-02 18:30:13 +0200 <Haskelytic> how does one even pronounce weird operators like `(<$)`
2022-07-02 18:30:24 +0200 <dolio> I don't.
2022-07-02 18:30:50 +0200 <Haskelytic> i just realized that i tend to think in words when I code and in Haskell, my brain just hiccups whenever I reach for these operators
2022-07-02 18:30:54 +0200 <Haskelytic> dolio: :(
2022-07-02 18:31:12 +0200merijn(~merijn@c-001-001-028.client.esciencecenter.eduvpn.nl) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2022-07-02 18:31:14 +0200 <int-e> sequence-taking-left-result
2022-07-02 18:31:16 +0200 <int-e> :P
2022-07-02 18:31:25 +0200econo(uid147250@user/econo)
2022-07-02 18:31:32 +0200 <dolio> That's (<*)
2022-07-02 18:31:41 +0200 <int-e> :t (<$)
2022-07-02 18:31:43 +0200 <lambdabot> Functor f => a -> f b -> f a
2022-07-02 18:31:51 +0200 <int-e> oh. grr.
2022-07-02 18:32:01 +0200 <int-e> pacman-eating-money
2022-07-02 18:32:11 +0200 <int-e> (yeah, I mixed those up)
2022-07-02 18:32:13 +0200 <Haskelytic> int-e: XD
2022-07-02 18:32:59 +0200 <Haskelytic> shouldn't it be pacman-eating-left-money
2022-07-02 18:33:09 +0200 <int-e> no, the money is to the right
2022-07-02 18:33:18 +0200 <Haskelytic> the fuctor?
2022-07-02 18:33:24 +0200 <Haskelytic> oh lol
2022-07-02 18:33:34 +0200 <Haskelytic> haha I guess that's a decent mnemonic
2022-07-02 18:33:48 +0200 <int-e> It wasn't supposed to make sense. But... if you want it to, the right argument is the one whose result gets eaten
2022-07-02 18:34:34 +0200 <dolio> If I really had to tell someone English words, I'd just say "less than dollar." But I don't pronounce it to myself when reading.
2022-07-02 18:34:47 +0200 <dolio> I just see it and know what it is.
2022-07-02 18:35:04 +0200 <int-e> (I don't actually pronounce these things. I do see the < as an arrow pointing to where the result comes from. That works for <* and *> and also for <$ ... hmm. what about $>, do we have that?)
2022-07-02 18:35:08 +0200 <int-e> :t ($>)
2022-07-02 18:35:10 +0200 <lambdabot> error:
2022-07-02 18:35:10 +0200 <lambdabot> • Variable not in scope: $>
2022-07-02 18:35:10 +0200 <lambdabot> • Perhaps you meant one of these:
2022-07-02 18:35:25 +0200atwm(~atwm@81.28.193.19) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2022-07-02 18:35:48 +0200 <int-e> Ah you can flip the two arguments and use <$ instead.
2022-07-02 18:37:24 +0200 <dolio> English is not good for communicating programs even when the tokens are easy to pronounce.
2022-07-02 18:37:44 +0200 <int-e> the COBOL fallacy
2022-07-02 18:38:04 +0200 <dolio> It might not seem that way, but if you ever try to get someone to write a program by telling them what the program is in English, you'll probably find that out.
2022-07-02 18:38:42 +0200 <int-e> Yeah, don't describe programs. Describe algorithms. Even that is hard.
2022-07-02 18:38:43 +0200 <Haskelytic> results may vary based on how synced up your jargons are
2022-07-02 18:39:06 +0200 <Haskelytic> but yeah I see the point
2022-07-02 18:39:07 +0200 <int-e> (And data structures. Probably more important than the algorithms.)
2022-07-02 18:41:55 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
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2022-07-02 18:50:45 +0200polo(~Gambino@user/polo) (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)
2022-07-02 18:51:02 +0200 <edinwood> im trying to work on a "scanning language!
2022-07-02 18:51:06 +0200 <edinwood> can anyone help?
2022-07-02 18:51:14 +0200Polo(~Gambino@pool-100-34-212-74.phlapa.fios.verizon.net)
2022-07-02 18:51:14 +0200Polo(~Gambino@pool-100-34-212-74.phlapa.fios.verizon.net) (Changing host)
2022-07-02 18:51:14 +0200Polo(~Gambino@user/polo)
2022-07-02 18:51:16 +0200 <edinwood> im not too good with language design
2022-07-02 18:52:14 +0200 <edinwood> at the moment im doing type checking at list constructors for adding functions to a growing program
2022-07-02 18:52:31 +0200 <edinwood> the program is on its side, running the outputs into inputs of graphically composed scanners
2022-07-02 18:52:47 +0200 <edinwood> if they were linealy composed with the monoidal algebra, i wouldnt need a language
2022-07-02 18:53:03 +0200 <edinwood> but to define the composition graph im using variable names to represent edges for derreferencing
2022-07-02 18:53:17 +0200 <edinwood> or substitution of the evaluated terms
2022-07-02 18:55:26 +0200Polo(~Gambino@user/polo) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 19:02:07 +0200pavonia(~user@user/siracusa) (Quit: Bye!)
2022-07-02 19:02:57 +0200mima(~mmh@aftr-62-216-210-244.dynamic.mnet-online.de)
2022-07-02 19:04:39 +0200darchitect(~darchitec@2a00:23c6:3584:df01:bc89:6791:4f2d:5d5)
2022-07-02 19:04:50 +0200 <yin> how do we set cabal to -v0 by default in .cabal/config?
2022-07-02 19:04:55 +0200yauhsien(~yauhsien@61-231-22-150.dynamic-ip.hinet.net)
2022-07-02 19:05:19 +0200 <darchitect> from personal experience Haskell seems like the most abstract programming language I've worked with, do you guys think the same ?
2022-07-02 19:05:30 +0200 <edinwood> abstract?
2022-07-02 19:05:40 +0200 <edinwood> seems a bit of an abstract thing
2022-07-02 19:05:45 +0200 <monochrom> Do you see the line "-- verbose: 1" that you can uncomment and change 1 to 0?
2022-07-02 19:06:31 +0200 <darchitect> yeah I know, a bit clearer of a definition -> smallest code/abstraction ratio
2022-07-02 19:06:34 +0200 <darchitect> ?
2022-07-02 19:06:45 +0200 <monochrom> I was also taught Prolog, so I think functional languages are only the 2nd most abstract.
2022-07-02 19:06:58 +0200leah2(~leah@vuxu.org) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2022-07-02 19:07:00 +0200 <monochrom> Oh hey I was also taught SQL too.
2022-07-02 19:07:17 +0200 <Haskelytic> darchitect: in the grand scheme of things, everything is abstract :)
2022-07-02 19:07:18 +0200 <darchitect> monochrom: what's the 1st ?
2022-07-02 19:07:28 +0200 <darchitect> Haskelytic: hahaha
2022-07-02 19:07:31 +0200pleo(~pleo@user/pleo) (Quit: quit)
2022-07-02 19:07:32 +0200 <monochrom> Like I implied, Prolog and SQL
2022-07-02 19:07:32 +0200 <Haskelytic> it's a matter of getting used to it
2022-07-02 19:07:47 +0200 <monochrom> Generally really declarative languages.
2022-07-02 19:07:58 +0200 <yin> how do you find sql abstract?
2022-07-02 19:08:01 +0200 <darchitect> is SQL considered programming language ?
2022-07-02 19:08:02 +0200 <Haskelytic> I would bet my whole life salary that if you started kids on Haskell, they would complain that C was hard to understand :)
2022-07-02 19:08:09 +0200 <yin> darchitect: yes
2022-07-02 19:08:21 +0200 <monochrom> You specify "I want a relational join" instead of "let me write my own loop"?
2022-07-02 19:08:52 +0200 <yin> depends on what you mean by abstract then
2022-07-02 19:08:56 +0200 <yin> anyways
2022-07-02 19:08:59 +0200 <yin> how do we set cabal to -v0 by default in .cabal/config?
2022-07-02 19:08:59 +0200 <int-e> you create an index and a lot of queries will use binary search instead of iterating over the whole table
2022-07-02 19:09:03 +0200 <Haskelytic> monochrom: one could argue that "write my own loop" is still abstract because you can't see the electrons whizzing about in the CPU
2022-07-02 19:09:16 +0200 <sclv> yin: monochrom just told you above!
2022-07-02 19:09:30 +0200 <Haskelytic> I think "abstract" itself is too abstract to be useful
2022-07-02 19:09:41 +0200 <int-e> (with no change to how you issue those queries)
2022-07-02 19:09:46 +0200 <yin> sclv: oops got my channels confused :p
2022-07-02 19:09:52 +0200yauhsien(~yauhsien@61-231-22-150.dynamic-ip.hinet.net) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
2022-07-02 19:10:06 +0200 <monochrom> In the context of this conversation, "clearly" we are speaking comparatively, not absolutelty.
2022-07-02 19:10:26 +0200 <int-e> sql is that weird breed of declarative where you have to know how the queries get executed anyway if you run into performance issues
2022-07-02 19:10:38 +0200 <monochrom> Clearly, you people are context-free automata.
2022-07-02 19:10:44 +0200 <maerwald> int-e: sounds like Haskell
2022-07-02 19:10:49 +0200 <int-e> maerwald: true :P
2022-07-02 19:10:59 +0200 <darchitect> now that I think of it, I guess I meant -> the least amount of boilerplate :D
2022-07-02 19:11:15 +0200 <Haskelytic> int-e: every abstraction leaks :)
2022-07-02 19:11:35 +0200 <Haskelytic> monochrom: joke's on you I identify as a pen-paper pair
2022-07-02 19:11:47 +0200 <int-e> Haskelytic: Maybe one day we'll find the right one :P (Nah. I don't believe in silver bullets.)
2022-07-02 19:11:49 +0200 <monochrom> I'm pretty sure you also run into Prolog performance issues and then you have to know the exact order of the resolutions plus how to use cuts.
2022-07-02 19:12:23 +0200 <Haskelytic> monochrom: reminds me of the prolog days :)
2022-07-02 19:12:32 +0200 <Haskelytic> I learned a lot but I would not want to use it agian
2022-07-02 19:12:38 +0200 <monochrom> In addition to when you want to determinize definitions and/or queries.
2022-07-02 19:12:45 +0200mc47(~mc47@xmonad/TheMC47) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 19:13:14 +0200 <int-e> I've found Prolog kind of awful... it *looks* declarative but really all you're doing is controlling backtracking so that your program still completes in reasonable time (or at all)
2022-07-02 19:13:53 +0200 <int-e> But I've never used it seriously. (Because of that impression.)
2022-07-02 19:14:06 +0200 <dolio> SQL has the same problem.
2022-07-02 19:14:31 +0200 <monochrom> At least SQL is a total language >:)
2022-07-02 19:14:57 +0200 <edinwood> darchitect: you mean expressive, and yes, haskell is one of the most expressive languages
2022-07-02 19:14:59 +0200 <dolio> It's designed to be declarative, but practically you need to learn exactly what variations of equivalent things cause the query optimizer to produce a good plan.
2022-07-02 19:15:50 +0200 <dolio> Unless you just don't care how slow your queries are.
2022-07-02 19:15:54 +0200 <darchitect> is that because it is is purely functional or is just a property of the Haskell language specifically
2022-07-02 19:15:56 +0200 <Haskelytic> int-e: but but...what about my expert system :)
2022-07-02 19:16:44 +0200 <Haskelytic> dolio: sounds like pretty much any system out there. isn't that what spawns those "X optimization expert" jobs
2022-07-02 19:17:23 +0200 <dolio> Yeah.
2022-07-02 19:17:37 +0200 <edinwood> i guess nobody is going to take me up on my call to arms to help me write a scanner language
2022-07-02 19:18:19 +0200 <yin> monochrom: verbose: 0 does nothing apparently. i still get the annoying "Up to date" line in front of my output when i cabal run
2022-07-02 19:18:23 +0200leah2(~leah@vuxu.org)
2022-07-02 19:18:49 +0200 <edinwood> data Program (fs :: [Signature]) (i :: Vars) (o :: Vars) where Inputs :: Proxy i -> Program '[] i o Define :: True ~ (os `Contains` a) => (a +-> b) -> Program fs i os -> Program (f:fs) i o Outputs :: True ~ (os `Contains` o) => Proxy o -> Program fs i os -> Program fs i o
2022-07-02 19:18:57 +0200 <edinwood> thats what iv got so far..
2022-07-02 19:19:45 +0200 <edinwood> its a strange language in that you have to define the variable names that a function outputs too
2022-07-02 19:19:57 +0200 <edinwood> i think because its "scanning" it has "linear parametric functions"
2022-07-02 19:19:59 +0200 <edinwood> one per scanner
2022-07-02 19:20:12 +0200 <edinwood> so its no difficulty to name the outputs at the function definition
2022-07-02 19:20:29 +0200 <edinwood> and that enables you to typecheck the program graph, that all the outputs are consmed or returned at the end
2022-07-02 19:21:11 +0200 <edinwood> i also had a question about if this "linear function" idea could be related to that of "linear types" which im not sure if they just correspond to values
2022-07-02 19:21:47 +0200 <edinwood> (in this language all values are [Double] and functions are not passed as arguments at all)
2022-07-02 19:25:36 +0200 <Haskelytic> edinwood: would be easier if you paste snippets https://paste.tomsmeding.com/
2022-07-02 19:25:43 +0200Haskelytic(~Haskelyti@118.179.211.17) (Quit: Client closed)
2022-07-02 19:25:50 +0200atwm(~atwm@81.28.193.19)
2022-07-02 19:25:58 +0200 <edinwood> sure, but its not done yet
2022-07-02 19:25:58 +0200 <edinwood> https://paste.tomsmeding.com/XoPeORvW
2022-07-02 19:26:27 +0200 <edinwood> so forgive any glaring errors
2022-07-02 19:28:41 +0200 <edinwood> i hope its almost readable?
2022-07-02 19:30:21 +0200edinwood(~edinwood@109.249.184.205) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 19:30:39 +0200edinwood(~edinwood@109.249.184.205)
2022-07-02 19:30:43 +0200 <int-e> 1 space indentation :(
2022-07-02 19:30:45 +0200 <edinwood> line 30 is wrong, it should have a constraint that typechecks the program, but this version should typecheck automatically by the constraint on the constructor
2022-07-02 19:30:57 +0200alexhandy(~trace@user/trace) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2022-07-02 19:31:01 +0200 <edinwood> int-e: its pure haskell idom!
2022-07-02 19:31:18 +0200alexhandy(~trace@user/trace)
2022-07-02 19:32:07 +0200 <monochrom> At least it is not 0.3333... spaces indentation :)
2022-07-02 19:32:40 +0200 <edinwood> i think the point was that there might be "compiling programs" where the criterea for typechecking could not be issued by placing a constraint on the constructor
2022-07-02 19:33:05 +0200qwym(~qwym@pool-96-253-29-94.prvdri.fios.verizon.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 19:33:11 +0200 <edinwood> such as allowing definitions in any order that make a proper graph, which here its doing by saying you have to supply the functions in the correct order
2022-07-02 19:33:32 +0200 <edinwood> so that all the inputs needed by a function being added are avilable in scope as outputs from the previous functions, or the overall inputs
2022-07-02 19:33:56 +0200 <edinwood> beause the scope grows like this, the output layer simply discards the variables in scope that arent meant to be output
2022-07-02 19:34:33 +0200 <yin> int-e: i'm more concerned about the inconsistent spacing on the language extensions list
2022-07-02 19:34:41 +0200 <edinwood> argh!
2022-07-02 19:34:51 +0200 <edinwood> at least people are reading it...
2022-07-02 19:35:04 +0200 <yin> edinwood: ;)
2022-07-02 19:35:24 +0200perrierjouet(~perrier-j@modemcable012.251-130-66.mc.videotron.ca) (Quit: WeeChat 3.5)
2022-07-02 19:35:29 +0200 <int-e> yin: I skipped that :P
2022-07-02 19:35:53 +0200 <edinwood> im not sure how best to ask for help here...
2022-07-02 19:36:32 +0200 <darchitect> :d
2022-07-02 19:37:41 +0200 <int-e> edinwood: Line 28... wouldn't `Proxy i -> Program '[] i i` make more sense?
2022-07-02 19:38:18 +0200 <edinwood> no!
2022-07-02 19:38:25 +0200 <edinwood> you dont specify the outputs here
2022-07-02 19:38:36 +0200 <edinwood> only on the close layer
2022-07-02 19:38:44 +0200 <edinwood> everything is just added to scope until then
2022-07-02 19:39:36 +0200 <edinwood> until then you want the intermediate steps to have polymorphic output type
2022-07-02 19:39:45 +0200 <edinwood> i think... unless im being stupid ofc
2022-07-02 19:39:54 +0200 <int-e> line 29, why is b unconstrained?
2022-07-02 19:40:12 +0200 <edinwood> your only checking that the inputs are available
2022-07-02 19:40:50 +0200 <edinwood> hmm, i guess then you *would* want the inputs to be mapped to outputs. thanks
2022-07-02 19:42:12 +0200 <edinwood> Inputs :: Proxy i -> Program '[] i i
2022-07-02 19:42:16 +0200 <edinwood> Define :: True ~ (os `Contains` a) => (a +-> b) -> Program fs i os -> Program (f:fs) i (b ++ os)
2022-07-02 19:42:50 +0200 <edinwood> at least now the scope is initialised and grows as required
2022-07-02 19:42:59 +0200 <edinwood> sorry i didnt realise there would be so many mistakes
2022-07-02 19:45:13 +0200 <int-e> I'm not sure what `Signature` should be. Maybe just a pair?
2022-07-02 19:45:58 +0200 <edinwood> this was the bit i was getting confused over
2022-07-02 19:46:19 +0200 <int-e> Anyway... I'm making too many guesses about the intent here.
2022-07-02 19:46:32 +0200 <edinwood> ok, so
2022-07-02 19:46:33 +0200 <edinwood> Define :: True ~ (os `Contains` a) => (a +-> b) -> Program fs i os -> Program (f:fs) i (b ++ os)
2022-07-02 19:46:38 +0200 <edinwood> there is no `f' here
2022-07-02 19:47:01 +0200 <int-e> f could be a better named version of (a,b)
2022-07-02 19:47:12 +0200 <hololeap> @hoogle ($>)
2022-07-02 19:47:13 +0200 <lambdabot> Data.Functor ($>) :: Functor f => f a -> b -> f b
2022-07-02 19:47:13 +0200 <lambdabot> Data.Functor.Compat ($>) :: Functor f => f a -> b -> f b
2022-07-02 19:47:13 +0200 <lambdabot> Data.Functor.Apply ($>) :: Functor f => f a -> b -> f b
2022-07-02 19:47:21 +0200 <edinwood> thats why i thought i needed a signature, but maybe i just dont need any extra params, ie to store the "function", other than just its input output names
2022-07-02 19:47:22 +0200arjun(~arjun@user/arjun)
2022-07-02 19:47:31 +0200 <int-e> or, if f acts as a name, (f,a,b)
2022-07-02 19:47:38 +0200 <edinwood> i dont think there is any typechecking on just the name...
2022-07-02 19:48:37 +0200 <edinwood> oh right, thats why you were suggesting a pair of the input and output names for the signature
2022-07-02 19:48:40 +0200 <edinwood> fair enough
2022-07-02 19:48:41 +0200 <int-e> (so the function environment ([Signature]) will act as an associative map from names to the function's type)
2022-07-02 19:48:59 +0200 <int-e> using "type" loosely
2022-07-02 19:49:17 +0200 <edinwood> sure, if the names are at all needed at all
2022-07-02 19:49:49 +0200 <edinwood> i suppose i could do without, since the typechecking stores the names in the running scope, which is all thats required
2022-07-02 19:49:51 +0200 <edinwood> i guess
2022-07-02 19:49:52 +0200 <edinwood> ah
2022-07-02 19:50:00 +0200 <edinwood> if you didnt typecheck at the constructor...
2022-07-02 19:50:07 +0200 <edinwood> like, to allow functions defined in any order
2022-07-02 19:50:20 +0200 <edinwood> then you would need to do an opperation on the [Signature] storing the io names
2022-07-02 19:50:29 +0200 <int-e> I'm not sure this fits together as is, there's enough questions here that I think you should do a bit more planning and then maybe redo the central `Function`, `Signature`, and `Program` types from scratch.
2022-07-02 19:51:06 +0200 <edinwood> its a design choice i think about if i need to allow "better language" where the functions can be supplied in any ordedr
2022-07-02 19:51:10 +0200 <int-e> the list helper is probably fine as is, for now
2022-07-02 19:51:16 +0200 <edinwood> this is what i mean
2022-07-02 19:51:37 +0200 <edinwood> not sure if theres anything else to do for typechecking...
2022-07-02 19:51:48 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl)
2022-07-02 19:51:51 +0200 <edinwood> like, any other reason for the [Signature] to be made
2022-07-02 19:52:29 +0200 <edinwood> the next step after figuring that out was supposed to be to add 2 extra constructors, for "constant memory values" (not functions) to be added
2022-07-02 19:52:36 +0200 <edinwood> and for some kind of "spark" variable
2022-07-02 19:52:41 +0200 <edinwood> to be carried between itterations
2022-07-02 19:52:57 +0200 <edinwood> there was a weird condition here that these had to be read from before they could be written too
2022-07-02 19:53:40 +0200 <edinwood> so you cant add a function that has output to the variable unless it was already used as an input to a previously added function
2022-07-02 19:53:46 +0200 <edinwood> but im not sure if thats the right condition
2022-07-02 19:54:25 +0200 <edinwood> a scanner above can output to a scanner below, using the spark memory so it can also take this value as *input*, because there is one there from the output on the prev itteration
2022-07-02 19:54:40 +0200 <edinwood> so adding these "spark" varibles also demands an initial data value
2022-07-02 19:55:24 +0200 <edinwood> which is different from the "carry" which just pertains to the "state" (eg the basecase to mapAccumL) transfers under the hood - which i have no idea how to do at all!!!
2022-07-02 19:55:28 +0200sagax(~sagax_nb@user/sagax)
2022-07-02 19:55:30 +0200 <edinwood> was going to figure that part out
2022-07-02 19:55:40 +0200 <edinwood> makes sense?#
2022-07-02 19:58:39 +0200 <edinwood> im not sure how to detatch the state transfer from the output function
2022-07-02 19:58:43 +0200 <int-e> Hmm, have you sketched this thing without almost-dependent types, so that you have a clear picture of the stuff you want to track in those types?
2022-07-02 19:59:05 +0200 <edinwood> i tried idris but it was dementing
2022-07-02 19:59:27 +0200 <edinwood> i think my brain rejected it from being just similar enough to haskell to trick my brain into an erronious sense of security
2022-07-02 19:59:30 +0200 <int-e> I meant in Haskell with plain data types.
2022-07-02 19:59:49 +0200 <edinwood> hmm, all the typechecking stuff is done at type level
2022-07-02 19:59:53 +0200 <edinwood> im not sure what you mean
2022-07-02 19:59:59 +0200 <edinwood> do it all without any type safety
2022-07-02 20:00:08 +0200 <edinwood> the whole process is a typelevel one pretty much
2022-07-02 20:00:27 +0200 <edinwood> and i have enough experience working at typelevel to make that quite straitforwards
2022-07-02 20:00:42 +0200 <edinwood> i dont think much would be gained elsewise, unless i misunderstood what you meant
2022-07-02 20:00:45 +0200 <int-e> Okay.
2022-07-02 20:01:27 +0200 <edinwood> i know its hard to get from the code what this has to do with scanners, except what i just said about sparks
2022-07-02 20:01:56 +0200king_gs(~Thunderbi@187.201.228.209)
2022-07-02 20:02:03 +0200 <edinwood> but its basically from (\a b -> (c,b)) factoring into (\a b -> c,\a b -> b)
2022-07-02 20:02:04 +0200king_gs(~Thunderbi@187.201.228.209) (Client Quit)
2022-07-02 20:02:19 +0200 <edinwood> er, i dont know why i wrote those with lambdas, they are just types
2022-07-02 20:02:38 +0200 <edinwood> (a -> b -> (c,b)) factoring into (a -> b -> c,a -> b -> b)
2022-07-02 20:02:51 +0200 <edinwood> i can do the "state transfer" and the "observation" seperately
2022-07-02 20:02:51 +0200 <int-e> Yeah I don't understand it well enough to give concrete advice... (and I guess I'm not really willing to dive into it more deeply)
2022-07-02 20:03:03 +0200 <edinwood> i assume that
2022-07-02 20:03:21 +0200 <edinwood> but im just at the crux of what its actually doing...
2022-07-02 20:03:45 +0200 <edinwood> its supposed to be a program for composing together the observations, while doing the state transfers under the hood
2022-07-02 20:03:57 +0200 <edinwood> since there is just one of those per scanner and they dont compose together at all
2022-07-02 20:04:19 +0200 <edinwood> the whole point is to generate these sparks, so you can scan over your own outputs pretty much
2022-07-02 20:04:35 +0200 <edinwood> idk if i can say anything else...
2022-07-02 20:06:19 +0200 <edinwood> but yeah, i have to take a bunch of scanners seperated into state transfer and observer functions, and handle these seperately, passing all the observations into this program construction and doing all the state transfers under the hood
2022-07-02 20:06:33 +0200 <edinwood> at least, having said that you should be able to uderstand what its actually doing
2022-07-02 20:06:35 +0200Haskelytic(~Haskelyti@118.179.211.17)
2022-07-02 20:08:10 +0200 <edinwood> some language based extension of SISO scanner compositionality from monoidal on making MIMO scanners, to a graph compositional algebra expressed as a program graph
2022-07-02 20:09:02 +0200 <edinwood> ok ill be back sometime
2022-07-02 20:09:03 +0200edinwood(~edinwood@109.249.184.205) (Remote host closed the connection)
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2022-07-02 20:46:54 +0200Unicorn_Princess(~Unicorn_P@93-103-228-248.dynamic.t-2.net)
2022-07-02 20:51:05 +0200 <Haskelytic> when i place a function in backticks like `intercalate` to turn it into infix op, what's the precendence value for it?
2022-07-02 20:51:08 +0200perrierjouet(~perrier-j@modemcable012.251-130-66.mc.videotron.ca) (Quit: WeeChat 3.5)
2022-07-02 20:52:05 +0200 <dsal> It can be specified.
2022-07-02 20:52:47 +0200 <dsal> % :i mod
2022-07-02 20:52:47 +0200 <yahb2> type Integral :: * -> Constraint ; class (Real a, Enum a) => Integral a where ; ... ; mod :: a -> a -> a ; ... ; -- Defined in ‘GHC.Real’ ; infixl 7 `mod`
2022-07-02 20:53:04 +0200 <dsal> % :i intercalate
2022-07-02 20:53:04 +0200 <yahb2> <interactive>:1:1: error: Not in scope: ‘intercalate’
2022-07-02 20:53:11 +0200 <EvanR> by default it is highest precedence
2022-07-02 20:53:23 +0200ns(~ns@66-90-198-187.dyn.grandenetworks.net)
2022-07-02 20:53:41 +0200 <EvanR> which is 10 ?
2022-07-02 20:53:59 +0200 <int-e> 9
2022-07-02 20:54:14 +0200 <EvanR> doh, off by 1
2022-07-02 20:54:33 +0200int-ehigh-fours EvanR.
2022-07-02 20:54:42 +0200 <Haskelytic> EvanR: story of my life
2022-07-02 21:00:35 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl)
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2022-07-02 21:03:32 +0200mon_aaraj(~MonAaraj@user/mon-aaraj/x-4416475)
2022-07-02 21:06:49 +0200 <geekosaur> % :i Data.List.intercalate
2022-07-02 21:06:50 +0200 <yahb2> base-4.14.3.0:Data.OldList.intercalate :: [a] -> [[a]] -> [a] ; -- Defined in ‘base-4.14.3.0:Data.OldList’
2022-07-02 21:07:01 +0200 <geekosaur> not shown/specified, so infixl 9
2022-07-02 21:10:44 +0200bitdex(~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) (Quit: = "")
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2022-07-02 21:34:43 +0200`2jt(~jtomas@141.red-88-17-65.dynamicip.rima-tde.net)
2022-07-02 21:35:34 +0200Polomoney
2022-07-02 21:39:10 +0200michalz(~michalz@185.246.204.93)
2022-07-02 21:40:29 +0200segfaultfizzbuzz(~segfaultf@192-184-223-90.static.sonic.net)
2022-07-02 21:41:14 +0200 <segfaultfizzbuzz> so there are several layers of cache hierarchy,... registers, l1, l2, l3, ram, disk (let's including only fast pcie ssds here), network
2022-07-02 21:41:43 +0200 <segfaultfizzbuzz> as a bad programmer, how do i understand how those relate to my code
2022-07-02 21:42:07 +0200 <segfaultfizzbuzz> i also may be missing some layers there
2022-07-02 21:42:50 +0200moneyPolo
2022-07-02 21:43:09 +0200 <geekosaur> you mostly don't care unless you seriously need to eke the very last bit of performance out of your code, and in that case I suspect you're not programming in a higher level language but sticking to C
2022-07-02 21:44:09 +0200raehik(~raehik@cpc95906-rdng25-2-0-cust156.15-3.cable.virginm.net)
2022-07-02 21:44:19 +0200Polo(~Gambino@user/polo) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2022-07-02 21:45:13 +0200 <segfaultfizzbuzz> so like the vm/compiler/etc figures out all/most of the fetching?
2022-07-02 21:47:02 +0200 <geekosaur> ideally yes, but you run into various other issues because the higher level the language is, the less low level control it gives you to e.g. fit data (much less instructions) into cache lines
2022-07-02 21:47:50 +0200 <geekosaur> so it's much harder to reason about cache in C++ than in C, never mind Haskell
2022-07-02 21:48:15 +0200 <segfaultfizzbuzz> i can't reason about C++ at all
2022-07-02 21:48:22 +0200 <geekosaur> and don't even bother if it's Java, Scala, Python, Javascript, etc. because those run in virtual machines and you have zero access to that level
2022-07-02 21:49:11 +0200 <segfaultfizzbuzz> cache considerations come down to memory ordering and size of objects?
2022-07-02 21:49:17 +0200 <geekosaur> yes
2022-07-02 21:49:20 +0200 <segfaultfizzbuzz> and that's it?
2022-07-02 21:49:28 +0200perrierjouet(~perrier-j@modemcable012.251-130-66.mc.videotron.ca) (Quit: WeeChat 3.5)
2022-07-02 21:49:31 +0200 <jjhoo> python + numpy?
2022-07-02 21:50:03 +0200perrierjouet(~perrier-j@modemcable012.251-130-66.mc.videotron.ca)
2022-07-02 21:50:12 +0200 <geekosaur> other things you have to worry about are delayed jump slots and how those affect cache usage, but at that point you're either trusting the compiler or writing hand assembler
2022-07-02 21:50:25 +0200 <geekosaur> jjhoo, you're at numpy's mercy there
2022-07-02 21:50:47 +0200 <segfaultfizzbuzz> "delayed jump slot" is fairly equivalent to branch hints?
2022-07-02 21:50:54 +0200 <geekosaur> likewise with something like repa or accelerate in haskell
2022-07-02 21:51:47 +0200 <geekosaur> not exacly. it means you get to execute one more instruction before you branch
2022-07-02 21:52:34 +0200 <geekosaur> which can make it easier to fit into a cache line in the case where you would otherwise have to set a flag, do something, then branch based on the flag
2022-07-02 21:52:38 +0200 <geekosaur> I think
2022-07-02 21:52:50 +0200 <geekosaur> this rapidly gets complex and my EE education didn't quite get that far
2022-07-02 21:53:01 +0200 <geekosaur> also I'm not sure how much of these tricks Intel supports
2022-07-02 21:53:04 +0200 <segfaultfizzbuzz> are there instructions which say what to do with the cache itself, or is that something the CPU handles...?
2022-07-02 21:53:08 +0200 <geekosaur> some of it was RISC
2022-07-02 21:53:23 +0200edinwood(~edinwood@109.249.184.205)
2022-07-02 21:53:33 +0200 <edinwood> https://paste.tomsmeding.com/DXfHlbOQ
2022-07-02 21:53:38 +0200 <geekosaur> there are
2022-07-02 21:53:39 +0200 <edinwood> now i get a strange type error
2022-07-02 21:53:39 +0200 <segfaultfizzbuzz> can i tag data and say "keep this in L2 cache or L3 cache no matter what you think" for example
2022-07-02 21:54:06 +0200 <geekosaur> I don't think so since it would mess up how anything else being cached was handled
2022-07-02 21:54:23 +0200 <Rembane> segfaultfizzbuzz: IIRC that's up to the CPU, this makes it possible for the people doing the hardware to make even more interesting optimziations.
2022-07-02 21:54:30 +0200 <geekosaur> so you have to just code very carefully to avoid the cache line being evicted to hold something else
2022-07-02 21:54:32 +0200ns(~ns@66-90-198-187.dyn.grandenetworks.net) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2022-07-02 21:54:37 +0200 <segfaultfizzbuzz> so CPU design dictates cache handling
2022-07-02 21:54:47 +0200arjun(~arjun@user/arjun) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 21:54:47 +0200 <edinwood> i dont think its scoping the types from the constraint properly
2022-07-02 21:55:08 +0200 <geekosaur> I think the limit oof your cache control is saying "evict now" which is typically done by using a jump instead of a branch
2022-07-02 21:55:15 +0200 <segfaultfizzbuzz> "very carefully" means "crap code which will break because an invariant is not made explicit"
2022-07-02 21:55:37 +0200 <int-e> there's prefetching, and there's hints (e.g. something called non-temporal loads that bypass the cache)
2022-07-02 21:55:50 +0200kjak(~kjak@pool-108-31-68-111.washdc.fios.verizon.net) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
2022-07-02 21:56:17 +0200 <Rembane> Also, the cpu will try to reorder the instructions to make the code faster. Not all cpus, not all the time, but still.
2022-07-02 21:56:41 +0200 <geekosaur> yes. this rapidly gets tricky
2022-07-02 21:56:57 +0200 <segfaultfizzbuzz> wild
2022-07-02 21:57:13 +0200 <int-e> and let's not forget that atomic instructions are also in part about cache control
2022-07-02 21:57:33 +0200perrierjouet(~perrier-j@modemcable012.251-130-66.mc.videotron.ca) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 21:57:48 +0200 <geekosaur> this kind of thing is also what sank itanium, since that added even more fancies (look up VLIW) and compilers already weren't up to snuff for what already existed, let alone that
2022-07-02 21:57:48 +0200 <Rembane> int-e: How? Tell me more!
2022-07-02 21:57:49 +0200 <int-e> CPUs are messy. It's amazing that they work :P
2022-07-02 21:58:00 +0200 <Rembane> That's why I love CPUs. :D
2022-07-02 21:58:01 +0200perrierjouet(~perrier-j@modemcable012.251-130-66.mc.videotron.ca)
2022-07-02 21:58:35 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2022-07-02 21:58:42 +0200 <edinwood> should i add the bool to the first class's params?
2022-07-02 21:58:57 +0200 <int-e> Rembane: In an SMP system, you need exclusive access to the corresponding address for the duration of the atomic operation.
2022-07-02 21:59:12 +0200 <edinwood> it can only see things from the rhs of the class => right?
2022-07-02 21:59:21 +0200 <hololeap> @type \f -> fmap f . sequenceA
2022-07-02 21:59:23 +0200 <lambdabot> (Traversable t, Applicative f) => (t a -> b) -> t (f a) -> f b
2022-07-02 21:59:28 +0200perrierjouet(~perrier-j@modemcable012.251-130-66.mc.videotron.ca) (Client Quit)
2022-07-02 21:59:48 +0200 <hololeap> @type \f -> sequenceA . fmap f
2022-07-02 21:59:49 +0200 <lambdabot> (Traversable t, Applicative f) => (a1 -> f a2) -> t a1 -> f (t a2)
2022-07-02 21:59:56 +0200perrierjouet(~perrier-j@modemcable012.251-130-66.mc.videotron.ca)
2022-07-02 22:00:07 +0200 <hololeap> ok, so the second is traverse. is there a name for the first?
2022-07-02 22:00:14 +0200 <edinwood> im trying to implement subselection of a type annotated list by a proxy list of types
2022-07-02 22:00:47 +0200 <Rembane> int-e: Cool, is this connected to some of the atomicity guarantees that GHC can give?
2022-07-02 22:00:55 +0200 <hololeap> @hoogle (Traversable t, Applicative f) => (t a -> b) -> t (f a) -> f b
2022-07-02 22:00:57 +0200 <lambdabot> No results found
2022-07-02 22:01:07 +0200 <edinwood> during tail recursion i ask if the heads type is in the proxy list, but the typechecker complains about this being asked in 2 different locations
2022-07-02 22:01:28 +0200 <edinwood> saying it cant match them up
2022-07-02 22:01:48 +0200 <int-e> Rembane: well, lock-free data structures and locks depend on this stuff. So... yes... as an implementation detail.
2022-07-02 22:02:33 +0200 <Rembane> int-e: Good. There are turtles all the way down.
2022-07-02 22:03:03 +0200 <int-e> . o O ( I have thought long and hard about this and I've come to the conclusion that modern CPUs cannot work. :-P (Nah, I'm joking. I really haven't thought *too* deeply about this. I am amazed though that we don't have more hardware bugs.) )
2022-07-02 22:04:26 +0200 <int-e> (And I don't mean stuff like Spectre. That's technically not a bug at all; CPUs don't guarantee constant time execution is all. Too bad it has security implications...)
2022-07-02 22:04:57 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl)
2022-07-02 22:09:52 +0200Vajb(~Vajb@hag-jnsbng11-58c3a8-176.dhcp.inet.fi) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2022-07-02 22:10:41 +0200 <geekosaur> .oO { f00f bug }
2022-07-02 22:11:08 +0200 <geekosaur> and I used to work in a department where that was people's biggest nightmare
2022-07-02 22:11:14 +0200Vajb(~Vajb@2001:999:485:209:bc32:5580:b7a6:e68b)
2022-07-02 22:11:28 +0200 <segfaultfizzbuzz> i wonder what fraction of software can be implemented as an asic
2022-07-02 22:12:11 +0200 <Rembane> I would cockily wave my Turing flag around and say all of it, but maybe it wouldn't be useful or a good use of time.
2022-07-02 22:12:29 +0200pseigo(~pseigo@node-1w7jr9ye7hx4fsjarlsl1lkjw.ipv6.telus.net)
2022-07-02 22:14:50 +0200 <edinwood> i extracted the code with the bug to make it easier to read
2022-07-02 22:14:50 +0200 <edinwood> https://paste.tomsmeding.com/W0lmkO1X
2022-07-02 22:14:59 +0200pavonia(~user@user/siracusa)
2022-07-02 22:15:48 +0200 <edinwood> i cant figure out where it gets all these xs1 type variables from
2022-07-02 22:15:56 +0200 <edinwood> everything is specified as far as i can tell
2022-07-02 22:16:15 +0200pleo(~pleo@user/pleo)
2022-07-02 22:18:06 +0200 <edinwood> perhaps there is an easyer way to write this...
2022-07-02 22:18:26 +0200 <edinwood> im never sure exactly how many parameters these kinds of classes should take
2022-07-02 22:21:12 +0200jgeerds(~jgeerds@55d45f48.access.ecotel.net)
2022-07-02 22:25:12 +0200 <segfaultfizzbuzz> well thanks for the fun discussion cya l8r
2022-07-02 22:25:16 +0200segfaultfizzbuzz(~segfaultf@192-184-223-90.static.sonic.net) (Quit: segfaultfizzbuzz)
2022-07-02 22:26:10 +0200motherfsck(~motherfsc@user/motherfsck) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2022-07-02 22:26:13 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2022-07-02 22:27:28 +0200motherfsck(~motherfsc@user/motherfsck)
2022-07-02 22:29:22 +0200 <monochrom> The conference-of-rats Aesop fable applies. Every programmer agrees that all software can be made ASIC; furthermore, every programmers agrees that if it is to be done, it should be someone else. >:)
2022-07-02 22:29:59 +0200 <Rembane> monochrom: It's that Spiderman pointing meme. :D
2022-07-02 22:31:13 +0200fockerize(~finn@roc37-h01-176-170-197-243.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr)
2022-07-02 22:33:40 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl)
2022-07-02 22:37:43 +0200nate4(~nate@98.45.169.16)
2022-07-02 22:39:06 +0200takuan(~takuan@178-116-218-225.access.telenet.be) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 22:39:57 +0200merijn(~merijn@c-001-001-028.client.esciencecenter.eduvpn.nl)
2022-07-02 22:41:16 +0200hpc. o O ( the next circuit editor tool should be called "isual asic" )
2022-07-02 22:41:58 +0200nate4(~nate@98.45.169.16) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2022-07-02 22:42:41 +0200 <monochrom> haha that's a great one
2022-07-02 22:43:01 +0200 <geekosaur> better than "icfb"
2022-07-02 22:45:35 +0200mmhat(~mmh@p200300f1c70907f9ee086bfffe095315.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
2022-07-02 22:46:44 +0200 <monochrom> w00t full-stack devop vs front-to-back electronics engineer!
2022-07-02 22:47:00 +0200 <edinwood> dejavu
2022-07-02 22:50:51 +0200 <edinwood> typed list subset anyone?
2022-07-02 22:50:57 +0200Polo(~Gambino@user/polo)
2022-07-02 22:52:38 +0200leah2(~leah@vuxu.org) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2022-07-02 22:53:09 +0200gmg(~user@user/gehmehgeh) (Quit: Leaving)
2022-07-02 22:54:24 +0200Polo(~Gambino@user/polo) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2022-07-02 22:56:04 +0200fockerize(~finn@roc37-h01-176-170-197-243.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2022-07-02 22:56:22 +0200ns(~ns@66-90-198-187.dyn.grandenetworks.net)
2022-07-02 22:56:31 +0200_ht(~quassel@231-169-21-31.ftth.glasoperator.nl) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 23:00:23 +0200tromp(~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2022-07-02 23:01:01 +0200quarkyalice_(~alice@user/quarkyalice/x-8092822) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2022-07-02 23:01:52 +0200quarkyalice_(~alice@user/quarkyalice/x-8092822)
2022-07-02 23:02:17 +0200mon_aaraj(~MonAaraj@user/mon-aaraj/x-4416475) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
2022-07-02 23:02:37 +0200mc47(~mc47@xmonad/TheMC47) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 23:03:01 +0200leah2(~leah@vuxu.org)
2022-07-02 23:04:25 +0200mon_aaraj(~MonAaraj@user/mon-aaraj/x-4416475)
2022-07-02 23:04:58 +0200jmcarthur(~jmcarthur@c-73-29-224-10.hsd1.nj.comcast.net)
2022-07-02 23:05:29 +0200quarkyalice_(~alice@user/quarkyalice/x-8092822) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2022-07-02 23:06:03 +0200quarkyalice_(~alice@172.77.17.54)
2022-07-02 23:06:03 +0200quarkyalice_(~alice@172.77.17.54) (Changing host)
2022-07-02 23:06:03 +0200quarkyalice_(~alice@user/quarkyalice/x-8092822)
2022-07-02 23:06:22 +0200lisk1n(~liskin@xmonad/liskin)
2022-07-02 23:07:39 +0200liskin(~liskin@xmonad/liskin) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
2022-07-02 23:09:27 +0200Haskelytic(~Haskelyti@118.179.211.17) (Quit: Client closed)
2022-07-02 23:11:10 +0200ns(~ns@66-90-198-187.dyn.grandenetworks.net) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2022-07-02 23:13:18 +0200merijn(~merijn@c-001-001-028.client.esciencecenter.eduvpn.nl) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2022-07-02 23:14:04 +0200ns(~ns@66-90-198-187.dyn.grandenetworks.net)
2022-07-02 23:19:53 +0200lainon(~lainon@c-68-46-201-40.hsd1.al.comcast.net)
2022-07-02 23:20:29 +0200causal(~user@50.35.83.177)
2022-07-02 23:30:37 +0200acidjnk(~acidjnk@dynamic-046-114-174-017.46.114.pool.telefonica.de) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
2022-07-02 23:32:10 +0200 <edinwood> i cant even tell why its throwing that error...
2022-07-02 23:32:18 +0200ns(~ns@66-90-198-187.dyn.grandenetworks.net) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2022-07-02 23:32:21 +0200 <edinwood> https://paste.tomsmeding.com/W0lmkO1X
2022-07-02 23:32:45 +0200leah2(~leah@vuxu.org) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2022-07-02 23:33:23 +0200quarkyalice_(~alice@user/quarkyalice/x-8092822) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-07-02 23:33:57 +0200quarkyalice_(~alice@172.77.17.54)
2022-07-02 23:33:57 +0200quarkyalice_(~alice@172.77.17.54) (Changing host)
2022-07-02 23:33:57 +0200quarkyalice_(~alice@user/quarkyalice/x-8092822)
2022-07-02 23:36:30 +0200mon_aaraj(~MonAaraj@user/mon-aaraj/x-4416475) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2022-07-02 23:38:46 +0200mon_aaraj(~MonAaraj@user/mon-aaraj/x-4416475)
2022-07-02 23:43:12 +0200`2jt(~jtomas@141.red-88-17-65.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2022-07-02 23:43:51 +0200quarkyalice_(~alice@user/quarkyalice/x-8092822) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2022-07-02 23:44:24 +0200ns(~ns@66-90-198-187.dyn.grandenetworks.net)
2022-07-02 23:48:59 +0200leah2(~leah@vuxu.org)
2022-07-02 23:50:30 +0200pseigo(~pseigo@node-1w7jr9ye7hx4fsjarlsl1lkjw.ipv6.telus.net) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2022-07-02 23:56:37 +0200motherfsck(~motherfsc@user/motherfsck) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)