2022/04/14

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2022-04-14 00:09:10 +0000 <dons> interesting, hlint just suggested: null (filter (not.isSpace) rest) ~> all isSpace rest
2022-04-14 00:09:17 +0000 <dons> quite a good spot.
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2022-04-14 00:10:31 +0000 <abastro[m]> Was hlint this smart
2022-04-14 00:10:42 +0000 <dons> it took two steps, but it got there.
2022-04-14 00:11:36 +0000 <dons> @pointful \rest -> null (filter (not.isSpace) rest)
2022-04-14 00:11:37 +0000 <lambdabot> \ rest -> null (filter (\ x -> not (isSpace x)) rest)
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2022-04-14 00:19:27 +0000 <abastro[m]> @pointfree (null.filter (not.isSpace))
2022-04-14 00:19:27 +0000 <lambdabot> Unknown command, try @list
2022-04-14 00:19:35 +0000 <abastro[m]> Eh
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2022-04-14 00:21:37 +0000 <geekosaur> @pointless (null.filter (not.isSpace))
2022-04-14 00:21:37 +0000 <lambdabot> null . filter (not . isSpace)
2022-04-14 00:22:01 +0000 <geekosaur> which aside from spacing is a no-op because there are no points (bindings)
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2022-04-14 00:27:52 +0000 <dons> i vaguely recall @pointfree being able to reduce things with rewrite rules.
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2022-04-14 01:39:39 +0000 <abastro[m]> What do I do when want to infinitely loop until some condition is met?
2022-04-14 01:40:13 +0000 <abastro[m]> Well that was poorly put.. I mean
2022-04-14 01:40:16 +0000deadmarshal_(~deadmarsh@95.38.115.182)
2022-04-14 01:40:34 +0000 <abastro[m]> I have an IO action.
2022-04-14 01:40:34 +0000 <abastro[m]> It gives `IO (Either e a)`
2022-04-14 01:40:43 +0000 <sshine> :t iterate
2022-04-14 01:40:45 +0000 <lambdabot> (a -> a) -> a -> [a]
2022-04-14 01:40:59 +0000 <sshine> :t fix
2022-04-14 01:41:00 +0000 <abastro[m]> I want to run the action repeatedly until it gives `Left e`
2022-04-14 01:41:00 +0000 <lambdabot> (a -> a) -> a
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2022-04-14 01:41:50 +0000 <abastro[m]> And then return the value `e`
2022-04-14 01:41:54 +0000 <abastro[m]> How do I do that?
2022-04-14 01:42:15 +0000 <abastro[m]> I mean `iterate` sounds poor fit for impure action
2022-04-14 01:42:33 +0000 <sshine> yeah
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2022-04-14 01:43:08 +0000 <jackson99> loop = x <- action; case x of Right _ -> loop; Left e -> return e
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2022-04-14 01:44:23 +0000 <abastro[m]> Oh,
2022-04-14 01:44:23 +0000 <abastro[m]> `loop = action >>= either pure (const loop)`
2022-04-14 01:44:38 +0000 <abastro[m]> Soo that is actually quite simple
2022-04-14 01:44:51 +0000 <abastro[m]> I guess I should avoid overcomplicating problem :P
2022-04-14 01:45:07 +0000deadmarshal_(~deadmarsh@95.38.115.182) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
2022-04-14 01:54:23 +0000 <abastro[m]> I wonder why I did this:
2022-04-14 01:54:23 +0000 <abastro[m]> newtype TempHandle r = TempHandle{ withTemp :: (Handle -> IO r) -> IO r }
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2022-04-14 02:25:47 +0000 <dmj`> abastro[m]: fix is good for that, fix $ \loop -> action >>= \case { Left e -> pure e; Right r -> stuff r >> loop; }
2022-04-14 02:25:51 +0000AlexNoo_(~AlexNoo@178.34.151.248)
2022-04-14 02:26:45 +0000dmj`plays coldplay *fix you* (official video) on youtube
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2022-04-14 02:44:29 +0000 <abastro[m]> I like my loop version better tbh
2022-04-14 02:44:42 +0000 <abastro[m]> I was thinking of using `forever`, but that is.. meh
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2022-04-14 02:54:36 +0000 <Axman6> :t runExceptT . forever . ExceptT
2022-04-14 02:54:38 +0000 <lambdabot> Monad m => m (Either e a1) -> m (Either e a2)
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2022-04-14 02:57:47 +0000 <abastro[m]> Axman6: that one requires handling `Void`
2022-04-14 02:59:15 +0000 <Axman6> :t \m -> (runExceptT . forever $ ExceptT m) >>= \case Left e -> pure e -- not sure if GHC is smart enough to know that the right case is impossible
2022-04-14 02:59:17 +0000 <lambdabot> Monad m => m (Either b a) -> m b
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2022-04-14 03:41:21 +0000 <jackdk> Axman6: I get a warning with that; so I'd probably use
2022-04-14 03:41:40 +0000 <jackdk> :t \m -> (runExceptT . forever $ ExceptT m) >>= either pure absurd
2022-04-14 03:41:42 +0000 <lambdabot> Monad m => m (Either b a) -> m b
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2022-04-14 04:58:53 +0000 <abastro[m]> Yea, I'd prefer
2022-04-14 04:58:53 +0000 <abastro[m]> `loop = action >>= either pure (const loop)`
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2022-04-14 05:18:05 +0000 <jackdk> It was only after I posted that I realised I'd gone back to where you started ^^
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2022-04-14 05:47:59 +0000RevoGen(~RevoGen@136.167.108.23)
2022-04-14 05:48:12 +0000 <RevoGen> why are strict right folds not a thing?
2022-04-14 05:48:41 +0000xff0x(~xff0x@om126167120043.29.openmobile.ne.jp)
2022-04-14 05:48:51 +0000 <opqdonut> RevoGen: if you want one, you can just use reverse + foldl'
2022-04-14 05:49:05 +0000 <opqdonut> it's not a thing because it's not that efficient: you need to effectively reverse the list
2022-04-14 05:49:19 +0000 <opqdonut> which means that you'll force the whole lazy input
2022-04-14 05:50:07 +0000 <RevoGen> ah i see, thanks!
2022-04-14 05:51:19 +0000jonathanx(~jonathan@h-178-174-176-109.A357.priv.bahnhof.se)
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2022-04-14 05:53:42 +0000 <RevoGen> wait opqdonut, does that mean that it's impossible to do a strict fold on an infinite list?
2022-04-14 05:53:58 +0000 <opqdonut> yes
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2022-04-14 07:01:27 +0000 <abastro[m]> What was the elegant fizzbuzz implementation which uses monoid foldmap?
2022-04-14 07:01:47 +0000michalz(~michalz@185.246.204.121) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
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2022-04-14 07:30:06 +0000 <zero> i like this 1 a lot http://rubymanor.org/3/videos/programming_with_nothing/
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2022-04-14 08:40:39 +0000mikoto-chan(~mikoto-ch@213.177.151.239)
2022-04-14 08:52:26 +0000mastarija(~mastarija@2a05:4f46:e04:6000:68d9:b076:ca11:8c6e)
2022-04-14 08:52:44 +0000 <mastarija> > [5..3]
2022-04-14 08:52:45 +0000 <lambdabot> []
2022-04-14 08:52:51 +0000 <mastarija> > [3..5]
2022-04-14 08:52:53 +0000 <lambdabot> [3,4,5]
2022-04-14 08:53:07 +0000 <tomsmeding> > [5,4..3]
2022-04-14 08:53:09 +0000 <lambdabot> [5,4,3]
2022-04-14 08:53:13 +0000 <mastarija> Yes...
2022-04-14 08:53:22 +0000 <mastarija> but wasn't this working in earlier versions?
2022-04-14 08:53:25 +0000 <tomsmeding> no
2022-04-14 08:53:36 +0000 <tomsmeding> this behaviour has not changed
2022-04-14 08:53:49 +0000 <tomsmeding> > (enumFromTo 3 5, enumFromTo 5 3)
2022-04-14 08:53:51 +0000 <lambdabot> ([3,4,5],[])
2022-04-14 08:54:05 +0000 <mastarija> Any reason for that behavior?
2022-04-14 08:54:10 +0000 <mastarija> Just interested
2022-04-14 08:54:12 +0000 <tomsmeding> it gets desugared to calls to those functions from Enum
2022-04-14 08:54:31 +0000 <tomsmeding> Enum doesn't need a reason to do anything :p
2022-04-14 08:54:39 +0000 <tomsmeding> Enum does whatever it wants
2022-04-14 08:54:40 +0000 <merijn> mastarija: It doesn't inspect the final value
2022-04-14 08:54:52 +0000 <merijn> mastarija: If no explicit increment, then the increment is 1
2022-04-14 08:54:59 +0000 <mastarija> oh..
2022-04-14 08:55:03 +0000 <mastarija> yes, that makes sense
2022-04-14 08:55:27 +0000kaph_(~kaph@dynamic-adsl-78-12-162-98.clienti.tiscali.it) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2022-04-14 08:55:27 +0000 <merijn> (the "explicit" increment getting derived from the second value)
2022-04-14 08:55:42 +0000 <tomsmeding> > ([3 .. 5.2], [5.2 .. 3])
2022-04-14 08:55:44 +0000 <lambdabot> ([3.0,4.0,5.0],[])
2022-04-14 08:56:03 +0000 <tomsmeding> what would the second one be, [5,4,3] or [5.2,4.2,3.2]?
2022-04-14 08:56:21 +0000 <tomsmeding> (perhaps this illustrates the weirdness of Enum Double more than anything else though
2022-04-14 08:56:22 +0000 <tomsmeding> )
2022-04-14 08:56:32 +0000 <mastarija> Yes
2022-04-14 08:56:45 +0000 <mastarija> Well.. guess I'll have to make a little helper function
2022-04-14 08:56:56 +0000 <merijn> Enum for Double is lies
2022-04-14 08:57:05 +0000 <mastarija> xD
2022-04-14 08:57:05 +0000tromp(~textual@dhcp-077-249-230-040.chello.nl)
2022-04-14 08:57:39 +0000 <tomsmeding> > length [0, 0.1+0.1+0.1-0.3 .. 1e-10]
2022-04-14 08:57:41 +0000 <lambdabot> 1801441
2022-04-14 08:58:00 +0000 <tomsmeding> clearly
2022-04-14 08:58:24 +0000 <mastarija> Yes, that was obvious even to me
2022-04-14 08:59:21 +0000 <mastarija> Btw, do we have any function that deals with "fixing" floating point integers
2022-04-14 08:59:37 +0000 <mastarija> Like `roundWithinMargin`
2022-04-14 09:00:06 +0000 <tomsmeding> multiply by 1/margin, round, multiply by margin?
2022-04-14 09:00:24 +0000solomon[m](~solomonco@2001:470:69fc:105::1:6000) (Quit: You have been kicked for being idle)
2022-04-14 09:00:26 +0000 <mastarija> If I do 3.6 - 0.6 and want to make sure I get 3.0 and not 3.0000000000000018
2022-04-14 09:00:36 +0000bahamas(~lucian@86.120.77.115) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2022-04-14 09:00:40 +0000solomon[m](~solomonco@2001:470:69fc:105::1:6000)
2022-04-14 09:01:28 +0000 <tomsmeding> are you not looking for something like https://hackage.haskell.org/package/Decimal-0.5.2/docs/Data-Decimal.html
2022-04-14 09:01:40 +0000bahamas(~lucian@93.122.251.65)
2022-04-14 09:02:12 +0000king_gs(~Thunderbi@2806:103e:29:1de5:8bc8:f08f:4d70:424) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2022-04-14 09:02:29 +0000solomon[m](~solomonco@2001:470:69fc:105::1:6000) ()
2022-04-14 09:02:41 +0000 <merijn> mastarija: Eh, how about "round"? :)
2022-04-14 09:02:43 +0000 <merijn> :p
2022-04-14 09:02:55 +0000 <merijn> > round (3.6 - 0.6)
2022-04-14 09:02:58 +0000 <lambdabot> 3
2022-04-14 09:03:08 +0000 <merijn> Alternatively, use fixed precision
2022-04-14 09:03:57 +0000 <merijn> > (3.6 :: Deci) - 0.6
2022-04-14 09:03:59 +0000 <lambdabot> 3.0
2022-04-14 09:04:05 +0000 <mastarija> merijn, I mean, I want to keep it a float until later
2022-04-14 09:04:09 +0000 <merijn> > (3.6 :: Centi) - 0.6
2022-04-14 09:04:13 +0000 <lambdabot> 3.00
2022-04-14 09:04:21 +0000 <merijn> > (3.6 :: Centi) - 0.22
2022-04-14 09:04:23 +0000 <lambdabot> 3.38
2022-04-14 09:04:49 +0000 <jackson99> > round 1.5
2022-04-14 09:04:51 +0000 <lambdabot> 2
2022-04-14 09:04:52 +0000 <jackson99> > round 2.5
2022-04-14 09:04:53 +0000 <mastarija> Ok, thanks. I never knew about Deci / Centi types
2022-04-14 09:04:54 +0000 <lambdabot> 2
2022-04-14 09:04:58 +0000 <merijn> mastarija: fixed precision and Rational are superior :)
2022-04-14 09:05:16 +0000 <merijn> mastarija: Deci/Centi are aliases for "Fixed a" which allows arbitrary precision
2022-04-14 09:05:17 +0000redb(~nmh@136.49.49.211)
2022-04-14 09:05:25 +0000 <merijn> > 3 :: Milli
2022-04-14 09:05:26 +0000 <lambdabot> 3.000
2022-04-14 09:05:33 +0000 <merijn> See Data.Fixed
2022-04-14 09:05:57 +0000 <mastarija> Cool. I do need a bit higher precision so that will work nicely.
2022-04-14 09:06:08 +0000 <merijn> jackson99: round uses banker's rounding (i.e. round to nearest even) as is the default rounding for IEEE-754
2022-04-14 09:06:27 +0000 <merijn> mastarija: You can extend it with custom precision super easily if you need it
2022-04-14 09:06:35 +0000 <jackson99> merijn, I know. I find it annoying in some cases
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2022-04-14 09:28:05 +0000 <Profpatsch> Is there
2022-04-14 09:28:07 +0000 <Profpatsch> loopCond :: Monad m1 => (ConduitT o o m1 ())
2022-04-14 09:28:09 +0000 <Profpatsch> loopCond = Cond.await >>= \case
2022-04-14 09:28:11 +0000 <Profpatsch> Nothing -> pure ()
2022-04-14 09:28:13 +0000 <Profpatsch> Just a -> do
2022-04-14 09:28:15 +0000 <Profpatsch> Cond.yield a
2022-04-14 09:28:17 +0000 <Profpatsch> loopCond
2022-04-14 09:28:19 +0000 <Profpatsch> In Conduit somewhere?
2022-04-14 09:28:32 +0000 <Profpatsch> awaitForever has a different signature and uses conduit internals for its implementation
2022-04-14 09:29:07 +0000 <Profpatsch> Is it the same as (awaitForever leftover)?
2022-04-14 09:29:16 +0000 <Profpatsch> At least the type signatures match up
2022-04-14 09:30:16 +0000 <Profpatsch> My use-case is that I’m building a conduit that strips the byte order mark from the beginning of a stream, so it `await`s once, checks if the BOM is there, strips it, then loops the conduit for every further input.
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2022-04-14 09:38:14 +0000redb(~nmh@136.49.49.211)
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2022-04-14 09:43:05 +0000 <abastro[m]> > 0.1+0.1+0.1-0.3
2022-04-14 09:43:09 +0000 <lambdabot> 5.551115123125783e-17
2022-04-14 09:50:03 +0000 <merijn> Profpatsch: looks like you want mapMaybe ahead of that conduit instead
2022-04-14 09:50:16 +0000acidjnk(~acidjnk@p200300d0c722df08e4e71eddc7f69ce5.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2022-04-14 09:51:34 +0000 <merijn> Profpatsch: https://hackage.haskell.org/package/conduit-1.3.4.2/docs/Data-Conduit-List.html#v:mapMaybe
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2022-04-14 09:52:42 +0000 <Profpatsch> merijn: that’s applying it to all values in the stream
2022-04-14 09:52:50 +0000 <Profpatsch> not just the first stream element
2022-04-14 09:54:05 +0000 <merijn> oh, wait yours stops after nothing. hmm, maybe I don't understand the use
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2022-04-14 11:36:39 +0000 <abastro[m]> Why are there so many streaming libraries
2022-04-14 11:36:42 +0000 <abastro[m]> It is just soooo hard to decide what to use
2022-04-14 11:37:40 +0000Pickchea(~private@user/pickchea) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2022-04-14 11:38:02 +0000 <abastro[m]> So I end up resorting to more boilerplate and monad-loops
2022-04-14 11:39:14 +0000 <abastro[m]> And I like lazy IO but sometimes streaming is necessary
2022-04-14 11:39:55 +0000 <hpc> streaming is a big problem space, and something you end up dealing with rather frequently
2022-04-14 11:40:20 +0000 <hpc> it's like how javascript has so many event frameworks
2022-04-14 11:41:05 +0000 <abastro[m]> Oh no
2022-04-14 11:41:27 +0000 <abastro[m]> Then in which way can I be opinionated?
2022-04-14 11:41:35 +0000 <abastro[m]> I know I have to choose at some point
2022-04-14 11:41:48 +0000 <abastro[m]> And lazy IO is perhaps lame, considering how lazy ST is lame
2022-04-14 11:42:15 +0000 <abastro[m]> (IIRC some guy made me believe in lazy IO.. idk)
2022-04-14 11:43:34 +0000redb(~nmh@136.49.49.211)
2022-04-14 11:44:08 +0000 <tdammers> problem with lazy IO is that it's unsafe in surprising ways
2022-04-14 11:45:37 +0000 <tdammers> open file, read data, close file, delete file, do stuff with data, oops, you're now reading from a file that no longer exists
2022-04-14 11:47:39 +0000frost(~frost@user/frost)
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2022-04-14 11:50:52 +0000AlexNoo__AlexNoo
2022-04-14 11:51:17 +0000 <abastro[m]> UNIX has semantics that until the file is actually closed, it is not
2022-04-14 11:51:28 +0000deadmarshal_(~deadmarsh@95.38.115.182) (Quit: ZNC 1.8.2 - https://znc.in)
2022-04-14 11:51:53 +0000deadmarshal_(~deadmarsh@95.38.115.182)
2022-04-14 11:52:38 +0000 <tdammers> yes, but the problem is that you actually close the file and then proceed to read from it
2022-04-14 11:52:52 +0000 <tdammers> because lazy IO defers the actual reading until the data is demanded
2022-04-14 11:53:21 +0000natto(~natto@140.238.225.67)
2022-04-14 11:54:11 +0000 <abastro[m]> Yea, doesn't close also deferred then?
2022-04-14 11:54:12 +0000redb(~nmh@136.49.49.211) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2022-04-14 11:54:19 +0000 <abastro[m]> Oh right, `withFile` exists for this case
2022-04-14 11:54:48 +0000hololeap(~hololeap@user/hololeap) (Remote host closed the connection)
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2022-04-14 11:56:10 +0000hololeap(~hololeap@user/hololeap)
2022-04-14 11:56:28 +0000 <abastro[m]> Anyway. Someone persuaded me some time ago that lazy IO hate is actually laziness hate
2022-04-14 11:56:39 +0000epolanski(uid312403@id-312403.helmsley.irccloud.com)
2022-04-14 11:57:48 +0000frost(~frost@user/frost) (Quit: Client closed)
2022-04-14 11:57:53 +0000 <abastro[m]> And one should not be afraid of lazy IO
2022-04-14 11:57:58 +0000 <abastro[m]> I miss the person..
2022-04-14 12:00:13 +0000FinnElija(~finn_elij@user/finn-elija/x-0085643) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-04-14 12:00:14 +0000 <abastro[m]> tdammers: Now I wonder, is laziness a misfeature?
2022-04-14 12:00:31 +0000 <merijn> lazy IO /= laziness
2022-04-14 12:00:32 +0000travv0(sid293381@user/travv0) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
2022-04-14 12:00:38 +0000FinnElija(~finn_elij@user/finn-elija/x-0085643)
2022-04-14 12:01:03 +0000 <merijn> There's a reason lazy IO requires specific (unsafe!) primitives to introduce laziness
2022-04-14 12:03:55 +0000mikoto-chan(~mikoto-ch@213.177.151.239)
2022-04-14 12:04:19 +0000redb(~nmh@136.49.49.211)
2022-04-14 12:05:06 +0000 <abastro[m]> Hmmm
2022-04-14 12:05:14 +0000 <abastro[m]> Is IO supposed to be strict then?
2022-04-14 12:05:23 +0000 <abastro[m]> Strict for the effect exection I mean
2022-04-14 12:05:45 +0000 <abastro[m]> I guess `readFile` is also a misfeature
2022-04-14 12:05:59 +0000 <abastro[m]> It eases my mind that I do not have to connect lazy IO to laziness
2022-04-14 12:06:51 +0000xff0x(~xff0x@om126167120043.29.openmobile.ne.jp)
2022-04-14 12:08:16 +0000odnes(~odnes@5-203-176-169.pat.nym.cosmote.net) (Quit: Leaving)
2022-04-14 12:08:36 +0000chenqisu1(~chenqisu1@183.217.200.38)
2022-04-14 12:08:42 +0000redb(~nmh@136.49.49.211) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2022-04-14 12:14:15 +0000 <merijn> abastro[m]: The string version of readFile is lazy IO, yes. The text and bytestring packages have strict readFile's which are more sensible
2022-04-14 12:14:18 +0000mikoto-chan(~mikoto-ch@213.177.151.239) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2022-04-14 12:15:03 +0000 <merijn> abastro[m]: The principal guarantee of IO and it's Monad instance is that in "a >> b" all IO/effects of 'a' will have finished before those of 'b' start
2022-04-14 12:15:20 +0000 <merijn> unsafeInterleaveIO (aka the function used to create lazy IO) breaks that promise
2022-04-14 12:15:27 +0000 <merijn> (hence unsafe)
2022-04-14 12:16:07 +0000 <merijn> There's only, like, five lazy IO functions in base, though
2022-04-14 12:16:24 +0000cfricke(~cfricke@user/cfricke) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2022-04-14 12:16:35 +0000 <merijn> Off the top of my head I can only think of: readFile, getContents, hGetContents
2022-04-14 12:17:41 +0000 <merijn> All off those use String and are thus highly questionable anyway. You'd wanna use Text of ByteString, the strict versions of which give you strict readFile/getContents/hGetContents anyway
2022-04-14 12:20:39 +0000redb(~nmh@136.49.49.211)
2022-04-14 12:22:46 +0000 <abastro[m]> Yea, Text in base when
2022-04-14 12:23:08 +0000 <abastro[m]> ..but then sometimes you want streaming in the IO input
2022-04-14 12:24:23 +0000 <abastro[m]> I wonder if one could use Text.Lazy with it
2022-04-14 12:24:34 +0000tromp(~textual@dhcp-077-249-230-040.chello.nl) (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2022-04-14 12:24:53 +0000redb(~nmh@136.49.49.211) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
2022-04-14 12:27:27 +0000 <merijn> abastro[m]: That just brings back lazy IO :p You can already incrementally read using strict Text using hGetLine and hGetChunk
2022-04-14 12:27:27 +0000bahamas(~lucian@84.232.140.158)
2022-04-14 12:33:57 +0000gurkenglas(~gurkengla@dslb-178-012-018-212.178.012.pools.vodafone-ip.de) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
2022-04-14 12:34:13 +0000 <abastro[m]> :t T.hGetLine
2022-04-14 12:34:15 +0000 <lambdabot> error:
2022-04-14 12:34:15 +0000 <lambdabot> Not in scope: ‘T.hGetLine’
2022-04-14 12:34:15 +0000 <lambdabot> Perhaps you meant one of these:
2022-04-14 12:34:41 +0000 <abastro[m]> :t hGetChunk
2022-04-14 12:34:43 +0000 <lambdabot> error: Variable not in scope: hGetChunk
2022-04-14 12:34:48 +0000 <abastro[m]> Whyy
2022-04-14 12:35:38 +0000 <merijn> Because Text's IO stuff isn't in lambdabot :p
2022-04-14 12:35:50 +0000[itchyjunk](~itchyjunk@user/itchyjunk/x-7353470)
2022-04-14 12:36:08 +0000 <abastro[m]> :(
2022-04-14 12:36:59 +0000gurkenglas(~gurkengla@dslb-178-012-018-212.178.012.pools.vodafone-ip.de)
2022-04-14 12:37:19 +0000 <abastro[m]> Wouldn't using hGetChunk a bit unwieldy
2022-04-14 12:38:11 +0000gabiruh_(~gabiruh@vps19177.publiccloud.com.br) (Quit: ZNC 1.7.5 - https://znc.in)
2022-04-14 12:38:29 +0000gabiruh(~gabiruh@vps19177.publiccloud.com.br)
2022-04-14 12:38:42 +0000 <merijn> That's why most streaming libraries have support for Text already, which uses hGetChunk internally :p
2022-04-14 12:38:55 +0000 <abastro[m]> Hmm
2022-04-14 12:39:01 +0000 <abastro[m]> How can I become opinionated
2022-04-14 12:39:08 +0000 <abastro[m]> It is tooooooo hard to choose one :(
2022-04-14 12:39:37 +0000zyklotomic(~ethan@res380d-128-61-81-14.res.gatech.edu) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
2022-04-14 12:39:39 +0000 <abastro[m]> Are most haskellers using some kind of streaming library
2022-04-14 12:40:34 +0000geekosaurwonders if he should dig up the streaming libs discussion from a few weeks ago
2022-04-14 12:41:02 +0000 <abastro[m]> Where is it?
2022-04-14 12:41:17 +0000 <abastro[m]> (I think it is going to be quite messy..)
2022-04-14 12:41:19 +0000 <geekosaur> tl;dr: most of the ecosystem uses conduit, but streamly is up and coming
2022-04-14 12:41:30 +0000 <geekosaur> it'll be in the irc logs somewhere
2022-04-14 12:41:38 +0000zyklotomic(~ethan@r4-128-61-88-254.res.gatech.edu)
2022-04-14 12:42:11 +0000 <abastro[m]> Oh, good
2022-04-14 12:42:18 +0000 <abastro[m]> conduit and streamly :D
2022-04-14 12:42:27 +0000 <abastro[m]> Now that makes it easier for me to choose
2022-04-14 12:42:49 +0000 <abastro[m]> How do I soothe my dislike towards streaming libraries?
2022-04-14 12:43:15 +0000 <abastro[m]> My lazyIO part of brain is revolting
2022-04-14 12:46:10 +0000 <tomsmeding> "opinionated [adjective] - Characterized by conceited assertiveness and dogmatism."
2022-04-14 12:46:32 +0000 <tomsmeding> I mean I know programming jargon has attached a somewhat different meaning to that word
2022-04-14 12:46:47 +0000 <tomsmeding> but, why do we need a "this is the best and the rest is crap" conclusion?
2022-04-14 12:47:04 +0000 <tomsmeding> what's more useful, I think, is a comparison showing which libraries are better for which circumstances
2022-04-14 12:47:22 +0000 <tomsmeding> (I don't know whether such a comparison already exists, perhaps the discussion that geekosaur referred to?)
2022-04-14 12:48:22 +0000 <abastro[m]> I intentionally used the word
2022-04-14 12:48:57 +0000 <abastro[m]> Because often in SW, ppl have exhaustion by design choices
2022-04-14 12:49:18 +0000 <abastro[m]> So they want an authorative source to follow through, however flawed and problematic it is.
2022-04-14 12:51:29 +0000 <tomsmeding> in which case, use the most common
2022-04-14 12:51:43 +0000 <abastro[m]> I also faced such problems and directly saw how haskell is "hard" - it is because we have to do educated choices
2022-04-14 12:51:44 +0000 <abastro[m]> Most common, yea
2022-04-14 12:51:45 +0000 <tomsmeding> which is presumably not a bad choice, otherwise why would it be the most common
2022-04-14 12:51:53 +0000bitdex(~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) (Quit: = "")
2022-04-14 12:52:04 +0000 <abastro[m]> Idk, what is the most common language in industry?
2022-04-14 12:52:15 +0000 <tomsmeding> but I feel it is not useful to actively push and search for one option to tout as "the best and the rest can suck"
2022-04-14 12:52:16 +0000 <abastro[m]> I guess *J a b a*
2022-04-14 12:52:21 +0000 <abastro[m]> And JS
2022-04-14 12:52:45 +0000 <tomsmeding> rather, if the point is to provide a default option for people who don't want to spend the time making a detailed comparison, phrase it like providing a default option :p
2022-04-14 12:52:56 +0000 <tomsmeding> right
2022-04-14 12:52:58 +0000 <abastro[m]> It is more that, worry about the rest later (and that can become never)
2022-04-14 12:53:15 +0000 <abastro[m]> Idk, I've seen ppl loving opinionated stuff
2022-04-14 12:53:22 +0000 <tomsmeding> one can go with the default choice on some parts that you care less about, and make an educated choice on other parts that you care more about
2022-04-14 12:53:33 +0000 <abastro[m]> And the rants/pointless arguments touting the most popular choices
2022-04-14 12:53:44 +0000 <abastro[m]> Which gets tons of likes because, you know, choice is hard
2022-04-14 12:53:45 +0000redb(~nmh@136.49.49.211)
2022-04-14 12:53:49 +0000 <tomsmeding> hence it's perfectly justifiable to go with haskell because you care about functional programming, but with conduit because you have no idea and want to do some streaming IO
2022-04-14 12:54:01 +0000 <tomsmeding> yes
2022-04-14 12:54:03 +0000 <tomsmeding> and fuck flamewars
2022-04-14 12:54:11 +0000 <tomsmeding> flamewars are fun, but not productive
2022-04-14 12:54:15 +0000 <abastro[m]> Yea
2022-04-14 12:54:16 +0000 <abastro[m]> streamly looks great tho
2022-04-14 12:54:16 +0000 <abastro[m]> Hmm
2022-04-14 12:54:27 +0000benin(~benin@183.82.204.110) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2022-04-14 12:54:33 +0000 <abastro[m]> I need some info on this
2022-04-14 12:54:34 +0000 <abastro[m]> Is streamly less stable?
2022-04-14 12:54:52 +0000tomsmedinghas no actual clue on streaming libraries, someone else take over from here :p
2022-04-14 12:55:08 +0000 <abastro[m]> <del>I love dramas, but instead of watching it on TV, I like it in chatting channels</del>
2022-04-14 12:55:08 +0000 <abastro[m]> Oof
2022-04-14 12:58:00 +0000redb(~nmh@136.49.49.211) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2022-04-14 12:58:31 +0000 <geekosaur> streamly is stable but its API is a bit rough at present
2022-04-14 12:58:52 +0000redb(~nmh@136.49.49.211)
2022-04-14 12:58:55 +0000 <geekosaur> which may mean a future version will change the API a bit
2022-04-14 12:59:15 +0000azimut(~azimut@gateway/tor-sasl/azimut) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
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2022-04-14 12:59:56 +0000 <geekosaur> it'salso got the best performance of all the streaming libraries
2022-04-14 13:00:08 +0000chenqisu1(~chenqisu1@183.217.200.38) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2022-04-14 13:00:14 +0000 <geekosaur> I'd say if you want stable and usable out of the box, conduit is your go-to
2022-04-14 13:00:29 +0000 <geekosaur> if you neef best performance, go for streamly
2022-04-14 13:00:32 +0000azimut(~azimut@gateway/tor-sasl/azimut)
2022-04-14 13:01:44 +0000 <geekosaur> there are a lot of conduit plug-ins for pretty much anything you need on hackage
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2022-04-14 13:56:04 +0000jakalx(~jakalx@base.jakalx.net) ()
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2022-04-14 14:08:55 +0000 <fockerized> any ghc flags for creating a smaller binary?
2022-04-14 14:09:18 +0000 <fockerized> my main = return () creates a 11M binary
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2022-04-14 14:10:44 +0000 <[exa]> fockerized: you can strip it, should remove a lot of unnecessary data
2022-04-14 14:11:25 +0000wroathe(~wroathe@user/wroathe) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
2022-04-14 14:12:03 +0000 <fockerized> manually strip it with a editor?
2022-04-14 14:12:33 +0000 <[exa]> no, there's a `strip` program that removes unnecessary stuff from binaries, like debug info and symbols
2022-04-14 14:12:52 +0000 <[exa]> if you are on some kind of unix just type `strip yourProgram` and that's it
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2022-04-14 14:13:47 +0000jao(~jao@92.233.85.247)
2022-04-14 14:14:01 +0000 <[exa]> the other option is to go for dynamic libraries, just compile with `-dynamic`, my test program here is literally 10616 bytes with that, after stripping
2022-04-14 14:14:33 +0000phma(phma@2001:5b0:211c:1d48:c79f:ef32:78e6:f8b1)
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2022-04-14 14:15:28 +0000 <[exa]> (and roughly 18kB before stripping)
2022-04-14 14:15:38 +0000CiaoSen(~Jura@p200300c9572d40002a3a4dfffe84dbd5.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
2022-04-14 14:15:56 +0000 <[exa]> without -dynamic I'm getting something like 3.5MB (unstripped) and 900kB (stripped)
2022-04-14 14:18:11 +0000 <fockerized> 3.5MB is still quite smaller than mine 11MB
2022-04-14 14:18:25 +0000 <fockerized> I tried with ghc file.hs -o h.out
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2022-04-14 15:42:01 +0000 <carbolymer> fockerized: you can also use upx to compress your binary
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2022-04-14 15:44:23 +0000 <geekosaur> dynamic will reduce it by quite a lot, ghc's default is to use static which makes for more self-contained but significantly larger binaries
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2022-04-14 15:45:11 +0000 <geekosaur> if you use dynamic you have to make sure the exact versions of the shared objects are available (and I think there are location restrictions as well)
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2022-04-14 16:27:41 +0000tmo24(~tmo24@2a02:8108:8440:16f4:541b:f0fd:c53f:72c3)
2022-04-14 16:29:13 +0000benin(~benin@183.82.204.110)
2022-04-14 16:31:18 +0000tmo24(~tmo24@2a02:8108:8440:16f4:541b:f0fd:c53f:72c3) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-04-14 16:31:35 +0000tmo24(~tmo24@2a02:8108:8440:16f4:541b:f0fd:c53f:72c3)
2022-04-14 16:35:28 +0000tmo24(~tmo24@2a02:8108:8440:16f4:541b:f0fd:c53f:72c3) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-04-14 16:35:46 +0000tmo24(~tmo24@2a02:8108:8440:16f4:541b:f0fd:c53f:72c3)
2022-04-14 16:38:16 +0000ishaan(~ishaan@122.161.51.210)
2022-04-14 16:39:57 +0000rawley(~rawley@142.99.241.242) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2022-04-14 16:44:04 +0000Vajb(~Vajb@hag-jnsbng11-58c3a8-176.dhcp.inet.fi) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2022-04-14 16:44:36 +0000Vajb(~Vajb@2001:999:504:1dda:267d:6860:bdf7:f68b)
2022-04-14 16:47:03 +0000Vajb(~Vajb@2001:999:504:1dda:267d:6860:bdf7:f68b) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2022-04-14 16:47:07 +0000eggplantade(~Eggplanta@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-04-14 16:47:26 +0000eggplantade(~Eggplanta@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net)
2022-04-14 16:47:53 +0000axeman(~quassel@2a02:8109:a380:78:be44:98d7:7a12:c9cf) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2022-04-14 16:48:11 +0000Vajb(~Vajb@85-76-73-177-nat.elisa-mobile.fi)
2022-04-14 16:49:08 +0000alp_(~alp@user/alp)
2022-04-14 16:54:42 +0000tmo24(~tmo24@2a02:8108:8440:16f4:541b:f0fd:c53f:72c3) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-04-14 16:54:59 +0000tmo24(~tmo24@2a02:8108:8440:16f4:541b:f0fd:c53f:72c3)
2022-04-14 16:56:46 +0000tmo24(~tmo24@2a02:8108:8440:16f4:541b:f0fd:c53f:72c3) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-04-14 16:57:04 +0000tmo24(~tmo24@2a02:8108:8440:16f4:541b:f0fd:c53f:72c3)
2022-04-14 16:57:59 +0000vicfred(~vicfred@user/vicfred) (Quit: Leaving)
2022-04-14 16:58:20 +0000cheater(~Username@user/cheater) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2022-04-14 16:59:09 +0000cheater(~Username@user/cheater)
2022-04-14 17:09:26 +0000tmo24(~tmo24@2a02:8108:8440:16f4:541b:f0fd:c53f:72c3) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-04-14 17:09:46 +0000tmo24(~tmo24@2a02:8108:8440:16f4:541b:f0fd:c53f:72c3)
2022-04-14 17:12:22 +0000Codaraxis(~Codaraxis@user/codaraxis) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2022-04-14 17:14:02 +0000tmo24(~tmo24@2a02:8108:8440:16f4:541b:f0fd:c53f:72c3) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-04-14 17:14:19 +0000tmo24(~tmo24@2a02:8108:8440:16f4:541b:f0fd:c53f:72c3)
2022-04-14 17:14:57 +0000statusbot3(~statusbot@ec2-34-198-122-184.compute-1.amazonaws.com) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-04-14 17:15:11 +0000statusbot(~statusbot@ec2-34-198-122-184.compute-1.amazonaws.com)
2022-04-14 17:17:20 +0000wroathe(~wroathe@206-55-188-8.fttp.usinternet.com)
2022-04-14 17:17:20 +0000wroathe(~wroathe@206-55-188-8.fttp.usinternet.com) (Changing host)
2022-04-14 17:17:20 +0000wroathe(~wroathe@user/wroathe)
2022-04-14 17:19:06 +0000Hanicef(~gustaf@81-229-9-108-no92.tbcn.telia.com) (Quit: leaving)
2022-04-14 17:21:20 +0000_ht(~quassel@231-169-21-31.ftth.glasoperator.nl)
2022-04-14 17:22:14 +0000Guest31(~Guest31@201.110.214.194)
2022-04-14 17:25:00 +0000tmo24(~tmo24@2a02:8108:8440:16f4:541b:f0fd:c53f:72c3) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-04-14 17:25:18 +0000tmo24(~tmo24@2a02:8108:8440:16f4:541b:f0fd:c53f:72c3)
2022-04-14 17:25:49 +0000Guest31(~Guest31@201.110.214.194) (Client Quit)
2022-04-14 17:26:31 +0000Athas_(athas@2a01:7c8:aaac:1cf:1c09:1958:649b:4873)
2022-04-14 17:26:36 +0000califax(~califax@user/califx) (Quit: ZNC 1.8.2 - https://znc.in)
2022-04-14 17:26:41 +0000lemonsni-(~lemonsnic@cpc159519-perr18-2-0-cust114.19-1.cable.virginm.net)
2022-04-14 17:26:49 +0000califax(~califax@user/califx)
2022-04-14 17:27:10 +0000hammock(~Hammock@2600:1700:19a1:3330::588)
2022-04-14 17:27:11 +0000zachel_(~zachel@user/zachel)
2022-04-14 17:27:41 +0000eggplant_(~Eggplanta@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net)
2022-04-14 17:27:48 +0000jinsun__(~jinsun@user/jinsun)
2022-04-14 17:28:01 +0000hyiltiz_(~quassel@31.220.5.250)
2022-04-14 17:28:09 +0000coot(~coot@213.134.190.95) (Quit: coot)
2022-04-14 17:28:13 +0000Trattue-(~Trattue@152.70.182.158)
2022-04-14 17:28:17 +0000eggplant_(~Eggplanta@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-04-14 17:28:39 +0000ptrcmd_(~ptrcmd@user/ptrcmd)
2022-04-14 17:28:42 +0000janus__(janus@anubis.0x90.dk)
2022-04-14 17:28:44 +0000Cheery_(~cheery@7-239-179-185.static.tentacle.fi)
2022-04-14 17:28:45 +0000a1paca_(~a1paca@user/a1paca)
2022-04-14 17:28:57 +0000Zemyla_(~ec2-user@ec2-54-80-174-150.compute-1.amazonaws.com)
2022-04-14 17:28:58 +0000zyklotom1(~ethan@r4-128-61-88-254.res.gatech.edu)
2022-04-14 17:29:05 +0000simeon_(~pi@dslb-088-076-113-221.088.076.pools.vodafone-ip.de)
2022-04-14 17:29:07 +0000sweater1(~sweater@206.81.18.26)
2022-04-14 17:29:07 +0000Maxdaman1us(~Maxdamant@user/maxdamantus)
2022-04-14 17:29:11 +0000lucifero(~satan@ip-046-223-003-068.um13.pools.vodafone-ip.de)
2022-04-14 17:29:15 +0000some02(~cat@user/sudden)
2022-04-14 17:29:16 +0000stilgart_(~Christoph@chezlefab.net)
2022-04-14 17:29:31 +0000tomku|two(~tomku@user/tomku)
2022-04-14 17:29:33 +0000opqdonut_(opqdonut@pseudo.fixme.fi)
2022-04-14 17:29:38 +0000gabriel_1(~gabriel@188-167-229-200.dynamic.chello.sk)
2022-04-14 17:29:53 +0000_ht_(~quassel@231-169-21-31.ftth.glasoperator.nl)
2022-04-14 17:31:28 +0000Vajb(~Vajb@85-76-73-177-nat.elisa-mobile.fi) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2022-04-14 17:31:56 +0000Vajb(~Vajb@hag-jnsbng11-58c3a8-176.dhcp.inet.fi)
2022-04-14 17:32:47 +0000mniip_(mniip@libera/staff/mniip)
2022-04-14 17:33:22 +0000tromp(~textual@dhcp-077-249-230-040.chello.nl) (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)
2022-04-14 17:33:56 +0000_ht(~quassel@231-169-21-31.ftth.glasoperator.nl) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:56 +0000wroathe(~wroathe@user/wroathe) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:56 +0000cheater(~Username@user/cheater) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:56 +0000eggplantade(~Eggplanta@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:56 +0000jinsun(~jinsun@user/jinsun) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:56 +0000oxide(~lambda@user/oxide) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:56 +0000zebrag(~chris@user/zebrag) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:56 +0000zyklotomic(~ethan@r4-128-61-88-254.res.gatech.edu) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:56 +0000theproffesor(~theprofff@user/theproffesor) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:56 +0000Midjak(~Midjak@82.66.147.146) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:56 +0000haskl[error](~haskl@user/haskl) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:56 +0000toulene(~toulene@user/toulene) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:56 +0000russruss(~russruss@my.russellmcc.com) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:56 +0000tomku(~tomku@user/tomku) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:56 +0000Maxdamantus(~Maxdamant@user/maxdamantus) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:56 +0000JimL(~quassel@89-162-2-132.fiber.signal.no) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:56 +0000wolfshappen(~waff@irc.furworks.de) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:56 +0000Putonlalla(~sapekiis@it-cyan.it.jyu.fi) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:56 +0000blades(~blades@204.48.29.163) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:56 +0000drewr(~drew@user/drewr) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:56 +0000janus(janus@anubis.0x90.dk) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:56 +0000asm(~alexander@burner.asm89.io) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:56 +0000lemonsnicks(~lemonsnic@cpc159519-perr18-2-0-cust114.19-1.cable.virginm.net) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:56 +0000dwt_(~dwt_@c-98-198-103-176.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000statusfailed(~statusfai@statusfailed.com) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000simeon(~pi@dslb-088-076-113-221.088.076.pools.vodafone-ip.de) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000sweater(~sweater@206.81.18.26) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000gabriel_sevecek(~gabriel@188-167-229-200.dynamic.chello.sk) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000mniip(~mniip@libera/staff/mniip) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000Athas(athas@sigkill.dk) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000belphegor666(~satan@user/belphegor666) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000sudden(~cat@user/sudden) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000Cheery(~cheery@7-239-179-185.static.tentacle.fi) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000a1paca(~a1paca@user/a1paca) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000APic(~apic@apic.name) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000adium(adium@user/adium) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000bah(~bah@l1.tel) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000stilgart(~Christoph@chezlefab.net) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000ptrcmd(~ptrcmd@user/ptrcmd) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000opqdonut(~opqdonut@pseudo.fixme.fi) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000zachel(~zachel@user/zachel) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000Zemyla(~ec2-user@ec2-54-80-174-150.compute-1.amazonaws.com) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000hyiltiz(~quassel@31.220.5.250) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000finsternis(~X@23.226.237.192) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000lyxia(~lyxia@poisson.chat) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000Benzi-Junior(~BenziJuni@dsl-149-64-179.hive.is) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000eL_Bart0(eL_Bart0@dietunichtguten.org) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000troydm(~troydm@host-176-37-124-197.b025.la.net.ua) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000lechner(~lechner@debian/lechner) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:33:57 +0000Trattue(~Trattue@152.70.182.158) (*.net *.split)
2022-04-14 17:34:05 +0000bah_(~bah@l1.tel)
2022-04-14 17:35:00 +0000tromp(~textual@dhcp-077-249-230-040.chello.nl)
2022-04-14 17:35:12 +0000tubogram4(~tubogram@user/tubogram)
2022-04-14 17:36:29 +0000jonathanx(~jonathan@h-178-174-176-109.A357.priv.bahnhof.se) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-04-14 17:37:07 +0000econo(uid147250@user/econo)
2022-04-14 17:37:15 +0000JimL(~quassel@89-162-2-132.fiber.signal.no)
2022-04-14 17:37:15 +0000cheater(~Username@user/cheater)
2022-04-14 17:37:15 +0000oxide(~lambda@user/oxide)
2022-04-14 17:37:15 +0000zebrag(~chris@user/zebrag)
2022-04-14 17:37:15 +0000theproffesor(~theprofff@user/theproffesor)
2022-04-14 17:37:15 +0000Midjak(~Midjak@82.66.147.146)
2022-04-14 17:37:15 +0000haskl[error](~haskl@user/haskl)
2022-04-14 17:37:15 +0000russruss(~russruss@my.russellmcc.com)
2022-04-14 17:37:15 +0000wolfshappen(~waff@irc.furworks.de)
2022-04-14 17:37:15 +0000blades(~blades@204.48.29.163)
2022-04-14 17:37:15 +0000dwt_(~dwt_@c-98-198-103-176.hsd1.tx.comcast.net)
2022-04-14 17:37:15 +0000statusfailed(~statusfai@statusfailed.com)
2022-04-14 17:37:15 +0000adium(adium@user/adium)
2022-04-14 17:37:15 +0000finsternis(~X@23.226.237.192)
2022-04-14 17:37:15 +0000Benzi-Junior(~BenziJuni@dsl-149-64-179.hive.is)
2022-04-14 17:37:15 +0000eL_Bart0(eL_Bart0@dietunichtguten.org)
2022-04-14 17:37:15 +0000troydm(~troydm@host-176-37-124-197.b025.la.net.ua)
2022-04-14 17:37:15 +0000lechner(~lechner@debian/lechner)
2022-04-14 17:37:53 +0000finsternis(~X@23.226.237.192) (Max SendQ exceeded)
2022-04-14 17:37:53 +0000wolfshappen(~waff@irc.furworks.de) (Max SendQ exceeded)
2022-04-14 17:38:10 +0000wolfshappen(~waff@irc.furworks.de)
2022-04-14 17:38:35 +0000finsternis(~X@23.226.237.192)
2022-04-14 17:38:48 +0000ishaan(~ishaan@122.161.51.210) (Quit: Client closed)
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2022-04-14 17:39:47 +0000kaph(~kaph@151.38.238.0)
2022-04-14 17:40:11 +0000vicfred(~vicfred@user/vicfred)
2022-04-14 17:40:43 +0000asm(~alexander@burner.asm89.io)
2022-04-14 17:41:00 +0000APic(apic@apic.name)
2022-04-14 17:41:10 +0000coot(~coot@213.134.190.95)
2022-04-14 17:41:10 +0000anomal(~anomal@87.227.196.109)
2022-04-14 17:41:10 +0000lyxia(~lyxia@poisson.chat)
2022-04-14 17:41:13 +0000drewr(~drew@user/drewr)
2022-04-14 17:42:52 +0000Putonlalla(~sapekiis@it-cyan.it.jyu.fi)
2022-04-14 17:42:58 +0000kaph_(~kaph@151.82.248.223)
2022-04-14 17:43:02 +0000MajorBiscuit(~MajorBisc@83.22.32.182.ipv4.supernova.orange.pl)
2022-04-14 17:43:05 +0000kaph(~kaph@151.38.238.0) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2022-04-14 17:45:12 +0000kaph_(~kaph@151.82.248.223) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2022-04-14 17:45:14 +0000kaph(~kaph@151.82.248.223)
2022-04-14 17:45:18 +0000Tisoxin(~ikosit@user/ikosit)
2022-04-14 17:46:16 +0000niemand(~niemand@p2e52f858.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
2022-04-14 17:46:20 +0000Vajb(~Vajb@hag-jnsbng11-58c3a8-176.dhcp.inet.fi) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2022-04-14 17:46:32 +0000Vajb(~Vajb@hag-jnsbng11-58c3a8-176.dhcp.inet.fi)
2022-04-14 17:46:57 +0000ishaan(~ishaan@122.161.51.210)
2022-04-14 17:47:34 +0000MrLi(~MrLi@240e:47c:2c38:1908:d804:ffb6:8a7e:7082)
2022-04-14 17:48:24 +0000MrLi(~MrLi@240e:47c:2c38:1908:d804:ffb6:8a7e:7082) (Client Quit)
2022-04-14 17:48:55 +0000vysn(~vysn@user/vysn) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2022-04-14 17:50:00 +0000kaph(~kaph@151.82.248.223) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2022-04-14 17:50:48 +0000haskellberryfinn(~nut@roc37-h01-176-170-197-243.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr)
2022-04-14 17:52:46 +0000tmo24(~tmo24@2a02:8108:8440:16f4:541b:f0fd:c53f:72c3) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-04-14 17:53:03 +0000tmo24(~tmo24@2a02:8108:8440:16f4:541b:f0fd:c53f:72c3)
2022-04-14 17:53:52 +0000dextaa(~dextaa@user/dextaa) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2022-04-14 17:58:48 +0000ptrcmd_(~ptrcmd@user/ptrcmd) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2022-04-14 17:59:20 +0000zyklotom1(~ethan@r4-128-61-88-254.res.gatech.edu) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2022-04-14 18:00:30 +0000niemand(~niemand@p2e52f858.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Quit: Connection closed)
2022-04-14 18:00:54 +0000eggplantade(~Eggplanta@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net)
2022-04-14 18:01:17 +0000zyklotom1(~ethan@res380d-128-61-83-86.res.gatech.edu)
2022-04-14 18:03:06 +0000niemand(~niemand@p2e52f858.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
2022-04-14 18:03:55 +0000FinnElija(~finn_elij@user/finn-elija/x-0085643) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2022-04-14 18:04:01 +0000arjun(~arjun@user/arjun)
2022-04-14 18:04:34 +0000ptrcmd(~ptrcmd@user/ptrcmd)
2022-04-14 18:05:35 +0000ec(~ec@gateway/tor-sasl/ec) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2022-04-14 18:06:36 +0000FinnElija(~finn_elij@user/finn-elija/x-0085643)
2022-04-14 18:11:50 +0000tmo24(~tmo24@2a02:8108:8440:16f4:541b:f0fd:c53f:72c3) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-04-14 18:12:07 +0000tmo24(~tmo24@2a02:8108:8440:16f4:541b:f0fd:c53f:72c3)
2022-04-14 18:17:54 +0000tmo24(~tmo24@2a02:8108:8440:16f4:541b:f0fd:c53f:72c3) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-04-14 18:18:03 +0000axeman(~quassel@2a02:8109:a380:78:5d90:f8a6:2503:657b)
2022-04-14 18:18:11 +0000tmo24(~tmo24@2a02:8108:8440:16f4:541b:f0fd:c53f:72c3)
2022-04-14 18:19:17 +0000xkuru(~xkuru@user/xkuru)
2022-04-14 18:19:54 +0000haskellberryfinn(~nut@roc37-h01-176-170-197-243.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2022-04-14 18:20:57 +0000 <hololeap> it looks like changing the line endings of a .cabal file changes the hash string on the resulting .so library file
2022-04-14 18:22:01 +0000 <hololeap> so does this mean the hashing algorithm just uses a byte-by-byte encoding of the .cabal file, rather than some logical parsing of the contents?
2022-04-14 18:22:40 +0000anomal(~anomal@87.227.196.109) (Remote host closed the connection)
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2022-04-14 18:23:08 +0000Codaraxis(~Codaraxis@user/codaraxis)
2022-04-14 18:25:44 +0000 <hololeap> I could be wrong here, something else might have changed the hash, but I'm not sure what...
2022-04-14 18:26:31 +0000 <glguy> just hashing the file bytes seems like the most likely approach
2022-04-14 18:28:18 +0000tmo24(~tmo24@2a02:8108:8440:16f4:541b:f0fd:c53f:72c3) (Remote host closed the connection)
2022-04-14 18:28:19 +0000 <geekosaur> I think it's not supposed to be that simple: cabal distinguishes between options that change the generated objects and those that don't
2022-04-14 18:28:35 +0000tmo24(~tmo24@2a02:8108:8440:16f4:541b:f0fd:c53f:72c3)
2022-04-14 18:28:52 +0000 <geekosaur> plus versions etc.
2022-04-14 18:29:01 +0000 <geekosaur> this might be a question for #hackage
2022-04-14 18:29:20 +0000 <hololeap> ok
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2022-04-14 18:38:44 +0000 <sclv> its not clear to me why a cabal file would be hashed into an so at all? the latter is ghc and the former is cabal
2022-04-14 18:39:43 +0000 <sclv> and certainly the calculated component hash uses a data structure and not raw bytes
2022-04-14 18:40:44 +0000redb(~nmh@136.49.49.211) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2022-04-14 18:40:51 +0000bahamas(~lucian@84.232.140.158)
2022-04-14 18:42:04 +0000 <hololeap> I can't reproduce it now. _something_ changed the hash for a package and the only difference I saw was running dos2unix on the .cabal file, but now it is keeping the same hash even on a freshly fetched project directory
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2022-04-14 18:42:53 +0000 <hololeap> this was not a package that showed up when running `ghc-pkg check`, so I don't know what could have changed... is there possibly a debug setting that shows how the hash is calculated?
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2022-04-14 18:45:01 +0000 <hololeap> I can try looking in the ghc docs or asking in #ghc, but what is the technical name for this hash I'm referring to?
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2022-04-14 18:53:11 +0000Zemyla_Zemyla
2022-04-14 18:54:35 +0000 <geekosaur> ABI hash
2022-04-14 18:55:18 +0000 <geekosaur> I believe ghc computes it from the object and .hi files, and doesn't even know about the cabal file
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2022-04-14 19:00:19 +0000 <hololeap> ok, that's good
2022-04-14 19:00:48 +0000jakalx(~jakalx@base.jakalx.net) (Error from remote client)
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2022-04-14 19:02:25 +0000 <sclv> i think this is the code one would want to look at https://hackage.haskell.org/package/Cabal-3.6.3.0/docs/src/Distribution.Simple.GHC.html#libAbiHash
2022-04-14 19:02:55 +0000redb(~nmh@136.49.49.211)
2022-04-14 19:03:47 +0000 <sclv> actually wait that's just cabal reinvoking ghc, sigh
2022-04-14 19:04:27 +0000vicfred(~vicfred@user/vicfred)
2022-04-14 19:06:02 +0000 <sclv> the ghc code for computing the actual abi hash of an so in particular seems to be a bit hard to pin down. it may be done incrementally in various places
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2022-04-14 19:07:14 +0000tmo24(~tmo24@2a02:8108:8440:16f4:541b:f0fd:c53f:72c3) ()
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2022-04-14 19:16:24 +0000 <energizer> is there an AVX-512 foldr?
2022-04-14 19:16:28 +0000kaph(~kaph@37.39.168.109.cust.ip.kpnqwest.it)
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2022-04-14 19:18:44 +0000 <[exa]> how'd that work?
2022-04-14 19:19:00 +0000niemand(~niemand@p2e52f858.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
2022-04-14 19:19:52 +0000 <energizer> s/foldr/fold/
2022-04-14 19:20:29 +0000 <energizer> replacing individual steps with a batch of steps
2022-04-14 19:21:36 +0000 <niemand> (GHC) Haskell doesn't first compare the pointers when testing lists on equality, does it?
2022-04-14 19:24:09 +0000merijn(~merijn@c-001-001-001.client.esciencecenter.eduvpn.nl)
2022-04-14 19:27:01 +0000alp_(~alp@user/alp)
2022-04-14 19:27:03 +0000redb(~nmh@136.49.49.211) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
2022-04-14 19:27:28 +0000 <sclv> absolutely not
2022-04-14 19:28:28 +0000 <geekosaur> % let l = [traceShowId 'a', traceShowId 'b'] in l == l
2022-04-14 19:28:28 +0000 <yahb> geekosaur: 'a'; 'b'; True
2022-04-14 19:28:48 +0000merijn(~merijn@c-001-001-001.client.esciencecenter.eduvpn.nl) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2022-04-14 19:28:49 +0000 <geekosaur> comparing pointers is a bit unsafe since a gc may happen
2022-04-14 19:29:41 +0000 <geekosaur> energizer, I think nothing uses AVX as yet except possibly some libraries like Accelerate
2022-04-14 19:32:40 +0000hololeap_(~hololeap@user/hololeap)
2022-04-14 19:33:10 +0000rawley(~rawley@142.99.241.242)
2022-04-14 19:33:35 +0000hololeap(~hololeap@user/hololeap) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2022-04-14 19:34:47 +0000 <niemand> kk
2022-04-14 19:35:45 +0000 <[exa]> energizer: it might make sense as a specialization in very specific cases (eg. on vectors of unboxed stuff), but certainly I wouldn't expect the traditional list-ish fold to benefit from any SIMD
2022-04-14 19:36:20 +0000 <niemand> I wondered if this was this case, since I made an optimization on my code under the assumption that it compares the value but it didn't get noticeable faster
2022-04-14 19:37:08 +0000 <niemand> (though there are other areas that could be the bottleneck)
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2022-04-14 20:00:15 +0000 <Zemyla> geekosaur: Other languages can compare pointers while having gc. Why not GHC?
2022-04-14 20:00:43 +0000redb(~nmh@136.49.49.211)
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2022-04-14 20:07:09 +0000 <geekosaur> can they gc in the middle of an operation because some other thread allocated? (python, for instance, can't trigger this)
2022-04-14 20:07:13 +0000justsomeguy(~justsomeg@user/justsomeguy)
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2022-04-14 20:08:24 +0000 <dolio> Can't the unsafe pointer equality only give false negatives? Or am I forgetting?
2022-04-14 20:08:40 +0000redb(~nmh@136.49.49.211)
2022-04-14 20:09:00 +0000wroathe(~wroathe@206-55-188-8.fttp.usinternet.com)
2022-04-14 20:09:00 +0000wroathe(~wroathe@206-55-188-8.fttp.usinternet.com) (Changing host)
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2022-04-14 20:10:08 +0000Athas_Athas
2022-04-14 20:10:19 +0000 <dolio> Not that I'm an advocate for using it on all comparisons.
2022-04-14 20:10:39 +0000 <geekosaur> it could be a false positive if something in gen1 or later gets moved in just the right way
2022-04-14 20:10:49 +0000 <geekosaur> this should be fairly rare, but possible
2022-04-14 20:13:15 +0000 <dolio> The docs aren't very specific.
2022-04-14 20:14:48 +0000jhagborg(~jhagborg@068-187-237-099.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
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2022-04-14 20:15:12 +0000 <[exa]> this would require == to be a primitive operation, right?
2022-04-14 20:15:27 +0000wroathe(~wroathe@user/wroathe) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2022-04-14 20:16:08 +0000 <dolio> Yeah, it'd probably mean you'd define structural equality in the Eq class, and then (==) would be a wrapper, if you wanted it to happen for everything.
2022-04-14 20:16:23 +0000 <[exa]> also, what should the magic == say when comparing 2 same-pointer thunks and (philosophically more intense:) 2 same-pointer functions?
2022-04-14 20:16:32 +0000redb(~nmh@136.49.49.211)
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2022-04-14 20:19:29 +0000hololeap_hololeap
2022-04-14 20:20:41 +0000 <[exa]> finally, since there can be 2 equal things with different pointers, you'd need to be prepared for false negatives anyway-- so why not do the same in a less unsafe way by e.g. hashing the subtree in each object and safely quickfailing on hash inequality?
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2022-04-14 21:40:16 +0000 <lechner> Hi, what's a common Hackage module with external C library prerequisites, please?
2022-04-14 21:41:36 +0000 <geekosaur> https://hackage.haskell.org/package/zlib
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2022-04-14 21:53:21 +0000redb(~nmh@136.49.49.211)
2022-04-14 21:54:06 +0000 <Guest27> Is there a function-composition version of <$>? So rather than writing e.g. `k >=> return . f` it'd be something like `f <comp$> k`
2022-04-14 21:54:24 +0000 <hpc> :t \k f -> k >=> return . f
2022-04-14 21:54:25 +0000 <lambdabot> Monad m => (a1 -> m a2) -> (a2 -> c) -> a1 -> m c
2022-04-14 21:54:55 +0000 <lechner> geekosaur: thanks!
2022-04-14 21:54:56 +0000 <koz> :t flip traverse
2022-04-14 21:54:57 +0000 <lambdabot> (Traversable t, Applicative f) => t a -> (a -> f b) -> f (t b)
2022-04-14 21:55:24 +0000 <koz> :t flip traverse [1, 2, 3]
2022-04-14 21:55:26 +0000 <lambdabot> (Applicative f, Num a) => (a -> f b) -> f [b]
2022-04-14 21:55:36 +0000haskellberryfinn(~nut@roc37-h01-176-170-197-243.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2022-04-14 21:55:54 +0000 <hpc> :t fmap (.)
2022-04-14 21:55:55 +0000 <lambdabot> Functor f => f (b -> c) -> f ((a -> b) -> a -> c)
2022-04-14 21:56:07 +0000geekosaur(~geekosaur@xmonad/geekosaur) (Killed (NickServ (GHOST command used by allbery_b)))
2022-04-14 21:56:07 +0000allbery_b(~geekosaur@xmonad/geekosaur)
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2022-04-14 21:57:44 +0000 <dolio> @type \k f -> k . fmap f
2022-04-14 21:57:45 +0000 <lambdabot> Functor f => (f b -> c) -> (a -> b) -> f a -> c
2022-04-14 21:58:12 +0000 <hpc> @src (>=>)
2022-04-14 21:58:12 +0000 <lambdabot> Source not found. Have you considered trying to match wits with a rutabaga?
2022-04-14 21:59:06 +0000 <dolio> Oh, that's backwards.
2022-04-14 22:00:11 +0000 <Guest27> dolio the forwards version is just what I needed, thanks
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2022-04-14 22:15:30 +0000 <shapr> is there a friendly help ghc core viewer?
2022-04-14 22:16:04 +0000sander(~sander@user/sander) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2022-04-14 22:16:17 +0000 <shapr> oh, didn't know about https://hackage.haskell.org/package/dump-core
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2022-04-14 22:25:57 +0000 <geekosaur> there used to be ghc-core as well, dunno how supported it is
2022-04-14 22:26:03 +0000anon12545(~anon12545@2a01:e34:ef4f:30c0:9452:1f20:3db:7152)
2022-04-14 22:26:36 +0000 <shapr> also turns out my ancient zsh alias is really handy: alias ghci-core="ghci -ddump-simpl -dsuppress-idinfo -dsuppress-coercions -dsuppress-type-applications -dsuppress-uniques -dsuppress-module-prefixes"
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2022-04-14 22:56:59 +0000 <niemand> Do SCC pragrams affect optimization (ghc)?
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