IRCBrowse

2021/02/04

2021-02-04 00:00:44 +0100endiruna(~endiendir@46.101.187.207)
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2021-02-04 07:43:08 +0100incertia(~incertia@d4-50-26-103.nap.wideopenwest.com)
2021-02-04 07:47:30 +0100 <psibi[m]> Liskni_si: When I get some time, I'm planning to use cnx: https://github.com/mjkillough/cnx and check how it compares to xmobar.
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2021-02-04 12:02:05 +0100 <Liskni_si> Solid: the instances PR adds a dependency that I vaguely remember was missing from one of the LTS versions we intended to support
2021-02-04 12:02:20 +0100 <Liskni_si> so I'd really like to somehow deal with the CI before that
2021-02-04 12:02:56 +0100 <Liskni_si> I'm thinking maybe if I just push something to master then peti won't get an e-mail and won't interfere
2021-02-04 12:03:09 +0100 <Liskni_si> yes, it really is that desperate.
2021-02-04 12:03:14 +0100 <Liskni_si> byorgey: ^
2021-02-04 12:03:38 +0100 <Solid> ah I see
2021-02-04 12:03:40 +0100 <Solid> fair point
2021-02-04 12:05:02 +0100 <Liskni_si> his last reason for revert was that we weren't testing the generatemanpage thing
2021-02-04 12:05:19 +0100 <Liskni_si> so why does his .github/workflows/haskell-ci.yaml not test it?
2021-02-04 12:05:29 +0100 <Liskni_si> this is just so fucked up.
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2021-02-04 15:30:25 +0100mc47(~yecinem@89.246.239.190)
2021-02-04 15:47:25 +0100 <Solid> oh great, I wanted to change ezconfig's internals a bit to provide an alternative `mkKeymap', but all of the parsers are exposed
2021-02-04 15:47:28 +0100 <Solid> sigh
2021-02-04 15:56:41 +0100 <Liskni_si> we could use a benevolent dictator who decides where compatibility must be kept and where not, and who's respected :-)
2021-02-04 15:57:14 +0100 <Solid> :)
2021-02-04 15:57:15 +0100 <Liskni_si> on the other hand, many existing users say that xmonad just works for them and they don't really need it to evolve any further
2021-02-04 15:57:44 +0100 <Liskni_si> software maintenance is hard
2021-02-04 15:57:45 +0100 <Solid> yes it'd be sort of a shame to break all of this
2021-02-04 15:58:14 +0100 <Solid> but now for every parsing function f I have to add f' and fWorker for this to work
2021-02-04 15:58:23 +0100 <Solid> I'm not sure it's worth it anymore ._.
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2021-02-04 16:00:09 +0100cfricke(~cfricke@unaffiliated/cfricke) (Quit: WeeChat 3.0)
2021-02-04 16:00:37 +0100 <Liskni_si> maybe we're overthinking this; how many users of the exposed parts of ezconfig are there? how many will actually upgrade and be inconvenienced by it?
2021-02-04 16:01:28 +0100 <Liskni_si> in the past when I had a busy day job, I'd either not upgrade xmonad at all, or upgrade and then revert the conflicting bits and just go on with what was more important in my life
2021-02-04 16:01:40 +0100 <mc47> tbh, I think most users just stop updating xmonad once they have a stable config
2021-02-04 16:01:51 +0100 <mc47> maybe check it once in a while to see if something exciting happens
2021-02-04 16:02:57 +0100 <Liskni_si> I actually still do this with xmobar: I could create a PR that adds a switch for features I don't like, but if all the other people do like them, it's just less work for everybody if I carry a revert in my fork
2021-02-04 16:03:35 +0100 <Liskni_si> mc47: maybe, but there are probably also users who just use it from the distro
2021-02-04 16:03:43 +0100 <Liskni_si> we have no idea how many of them, though
2021-02-04 16:03:51 +0100 <Liskni_si> configs may break for these people
2021-02-04 16:04:04 +0100 <Solid> I would imagine most people who are "satisfied with the way things are" will just use their distros package
2021-02-04 16:04:22 +0100 <Liskni_si> which is a good reminder that the sooner we deal with making deprecation warnings visible, the faster we can move in future
2021-02-04 16:04:43 +0100 <Solid> ah yes, that issue still looms behind the horizon
2021-02-04 16:04:51 +0100 <mc47> Liskni_si fair point
2021-02-04 16:05:38 +0100 <mc47> then maybe it doesn't make sense to deprecate things in the next release, and deprecate them after the release
2021-02-04 16:05:42 +0100 <Liskni_si> (although after several Wayland vs X11 related discussions hitting HN front page this week, I'm somewhat sceptical about the future in general.)
2021-02-04 16:06:44 +0100 <Liskni_si> (as in, shouldn't I be spending my time figuring out wayland and what we can do about this, instead of obsessing over whether xmonad core is tested against lts 12)
2021-02-04 16:07:23 +0100 <mc47> I mean, it would be fun making a spinoff of xmonad with wayland :-) (coming from me who still has very little idea on X-programming and the xmonad core :D)
2021-02-04 16:07:54 +0100 <Solid> I don't think it would be very fun, seeing how a wayland compositor has to do so much :D
2021-02-04 16:07:55 +0100 <Liskni_si> I'm seriously afraid of it though
2021-02-04 16:08:27 +0100 <mc47> really? I have no idea what I'm talking about btw hahah
2021-02-04 16:08:35 +0100 <Liskni_si> the super awesome thing about xmonad is that one can hack on it while using it
2021-02-04 16:08:50 +0100 <Liskni_si> kind of like what all the smalltalk people have
2021-02-04 16:09:25 +0100 <Liskni_si> but a wayland compositor can't be restarted without losing the entire session, I think
2021-02-04 16:09:39 +0100 <Liskni_si> and that makes it waaayyy less fun to work on
2021-02-04 16:10:05 +0100 <mc47> that's a bummer
2021-02-04 16:10:31 +0100 <Liskni_si> I mean if we could figure out a way to run the compositor separate from the wm
2021-02-04 16:10:39 +0100 <Liskni_si> then it could be real fun
2021-02-04 16:11:17 +0100 <Liskni_si> someone mentioned in one of the HN discussions that maybe kwin is designed that way
2021-02-04 16:13:03 +0100 <Liskni_si> anyway I think that's a good place to start: figure out a good design where things can be iterated quickly, either using some existing compositor, or hacking some rpc into an existing compositor, or building a minimal compositor with windowmanager rpc or something
2021-02-04 16:13:26 +0100 <Liskni_si> it's extra work though, X had this almost forever :-/
2021-02-04 16:17:01 +0100 <mc47> this might be a stupid question, but what's wrong with X in the first place?
2021-02-04 16:19:16 +0100 <Liskni_si> there was a talk about it a long time ago
2021-02-04 16:19:20 +0100 <Liskni_si> maybe this one https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIctzAQOe44
2021-02-04 16:19:58 +0100 <Liskni_si> I don't remember all the point unfortunately
2021-02-04 16:20:49 +0100 <mc47> awesome, I'll check it out
2021-02-04 16:20:50 +0100 <mc47> thanks!
2021-02-04 16:21:26 +0100 <Liskni_si> people these days talk mainly about security; that we'd love to be able to run somewhat untrusted apps like in android, where if you don't give the app some permission, it can only use actual security exploits to do stuff
2021-02-04 16:21:49 +0100 <Liskni_si> with X11, there is absolutely no hope of ever achieving any kind of isolation
2021-02-04 16:22:42 +0100 <Liskni_si> obviously many people say that running untrusted code on your computer is a bad idea in general, but the world at large doesn't seem very willing to accept this argument
2021-02-04 16:23:28 +0100 <Liskni_si> and then there are some technical reasons around multiple gpus and different pixel densities and so on which Daniel explains and I don't remember any more
2021-02-04 16:31:55 +0100 <Liskni_si> (I really don't know where I am on this. I'd obviously love most software to be free (libre), and I'm willing to go a long way to avoid proprietary crap and even decline jobs where proprietary stuff is needed for day to day operation, yet on the other I'd really like to be able to just play games through Steam without having to worry about what those games might be doing behind the scenes. I have
2021-02-04 16:31:56 +0100 <Liskni_si> this pet theory that we all have an obsession budget, and once that budget is spent, we can't afford to give a fuck about other things any more.)
2021-02-04 16:39:27 +0100 <mc47> As much as I love FLOSS, I'm still not willing to switch over to gaming on Linux
2021-02-04 16:39:33 +0100 <mc47> I guess your theory makes sense
2021-02-04 16:42:26 +0100 <Liskni_si> I'd probably just play on Windows or XBOX too, with no bad feelings, if other life choices (not having TV and not having a single place/town/country to live) didn't make it difficult :-)
2021-02-04 16:43:09 +0100 <Liskni_si> (and I love big uptimes on my laptop :-))
2021-02-04 16:44:17 +0100 <Solid> hah
2021-02-04 16:44:44 +0100 <Solid> that theory does make sense; I'd probably still dual boot if I played games much anymore
2021-02-04 16:45:04 +0100 <Solid> but since I don't I'm rocking nouveau drivers atm even =)
2021-02-04 16:46:21 +0100 <mc47> I endured dual booting from an external ssd that I attached to my laptop with some velcro, just to be able to play games
2021-02-04 16:46:27 +0100 <Solid> lol
2021-02-04 16:46:31 +0100 <Solid> that sounds amazing
2021-02-04 16:46:44 +0100 <mc47> (I had one around, a tight budget, and not enough space to dual boot on the internal ssd)
2021-02-04 16:47:09 +0100 <mc47> it was :D I loved the weird looks people gave me when they saw my laptop
2021-02-04 16:48:43 +0100 <Solid> oh btw
2021-02-04 16:49:09 +0100Solidwill be MIA for the next one or two months
2021-02-04 16:49:28 +0100 <Solid> I'll probably still answer e-mails, but can't really review (or write) any code
2021-02-04 16:51:31 +0100 <Liskni_si> good to know
2021-02-04 17:00:34 +0100 <Liskni_si> Solid: are you going to be travelling round the world or would you prefer to keep this private?
2021-02-04 17:00:43 +0100 <Liskni_si> (just curious)
2021-02-04 17:02:46 +0100growpotkin(~growpotki@130-45-30-154.dyn.grandenetworks.net)
2021-02-04 17:03:22 +0100 <Solid> ah, nothing so exciting, no :)
2021-02-04 17:03:43 +0100 <Solid> it's just the usual exam period in my place of the world
2021-02-04 17:04:18 +0100 <Solid> and that usually degenerates to me spending 10 hours a day inside the mathematics building because I have no life
2021-02-04 17:04:35 +0100 <Liskni_si> oh I see :-)
2021-02-04 17:04:37 +0100 <Solid> and after that I just don't have the energy to do computer things
2021-02-04 17:05:11 +0100 <Solid> so I'd rather just play some guitar or run :)
2021-02-04 17:05:38 +0100 <mc47> Solid figured as much, since you recognized the Club Mate logo in my doom emacs :D ... the party is also soon starting with me
2021-02-04 17:06:48 +0100 <Solid> it'll probably be the last "proper" exam period for me
2021-02-04 17:06:52 +0100 <Solid> feels weird :o
2021-02-04 17:07:08 +0100 <Solid> also yes how could I not recognize that logo :>
2021-02-04 17:07:36 +0100 <Liskni_si> it just seemed weird to be able to answer e-mails but not view any code; if I had to spend 10 hours a day on something, I'd probably just redirect all github e-mail to a separate folder to not feel the FOMO :-)
2021-02-04 17:08:21 +0100 <Solid> but then I'd know that mails were being redirected; this would probably lead to much worse FOMO for me :D
2021-02-04 17:08:26 +0100 <Solid> (my brain is weird)
2021-02-04 17:09:24 +0100 <Solid> so the best I can do is to spend a few minutes a day going through mails and possibly telling emacs to remind me to reply to some important ones at the end of the day
2021-02-04 17:09:46 +0100 <Solid> this has worked surprisingly well for me in the last couple of years
2021-02-04 17:11:46 +0100 <Liskni_si> fair enough :-)
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