| 2021-04-08 00:00:59 +0200 | heatsink | (~heatsink@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
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| 2021-04-08 00:11:04 +0200 | aerona | (~aerona@2600:6c54:4600:f300:a1c5:a27d:d58e:3c09) |
| 2021-04-08 00:11:11 +0200 | machinedgod | (~machinedg@24.105.81.50) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 00:13:16 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@c-68-54-25-135.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 2021-04-08 00:14:01 +0200 | <monochrom> | "type ResourceOpT r m a =" 3 arguments right there: r, m, a |
| 2021-04-08 00:14:39 +0200 | <monochrom> | Then apply https://www.haskell.org/onlinereport/haskell2010/haskellch4.html#x10-730004.2.2 |
| 2021-04-08 00:14:49 +0200 | <monochrom> | "Type constructor symbols T introduced by type synonym declarations cannot be partially applied; it is a static error to use T without the full number of arguments." |
| 2021-04-08 00:14:52 +0200 | <maerwald> | https://haskell.foundation/en/who-we-are/ is this outdated? |
| 2021-04-08 00:16:18 +0200 | <monochrom> | The less obvious trick is that you are allowed "type ResourceOpT r m = StateT (ResourceCache r) m" |
| 2021-04-08 00:16:57 +0200 | <monochrom> | Hell, delete that m too for maximum future convenience. |
| 2021-04-08 00:17:17 +0200 | <Althar> | Ok, this is starting to make sense, I think |
| 2021-04-08 00:17:23 +0200 | notzmv | (~zmv@unaffiliated/zmv) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 00:17:25 +0200 | <Althar> | I'll remove the m, I guess it is redundant here |
| 2021-04-08 00:17:56 +0200 | fendor | (~fendor@91.141.2.173.wireless.dyn.drei.com) (Remote host closed the connection) |
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| 2021-04-08 00:18:13 +0200 | dwt | (~dwt@c-98-200-58-177.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) |
| 2021-04-08 00:18:21 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@c-68-54-25-135.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 00:18:34 +0200 | <Althar> | So in this instance, is it better practice to define the instance for the more abstract type, or is there a way for me to not make ResourceOpT a type synonym? |
| 2021-04-08 00:20:02 +0200 | <monochrom> | Type synonym is pretended abstraction. |
| 2021-04-08 00:20:34 +0200 | arturh | (~arturh@93.176.180.48) |
| 2021-04-08 00:20:34 +0200 | <monochrom> | Hell, I'm be more frank and blunt. Type synonym is not making up one's mind whether it's an abstraction or not. |
| 2021-04-08 00:21:11 +0200 | <monochrom> | OK, in fairness, some people just intend an abberviation, not an abstraction. That's fine. |
| 2021-04-08 00:22:01 +0200 | coot | (~coot@37.30.55.131.nat.umts.dynamic.t-mobile.pl) (Quit: coot) |
| 2021-04-08 00:22:09 +0200 | <Althar> | it does mean that if I change ResourceOpT to be built from something else, my instance of StateT will no longer apply |
| 2021-04-08 00:22:39 +0200 | mnrmnaugh | (~mnrmnaugh@unaffiliated/mnrmnaugh) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2021-04-08 00:22:45 +0200 | <Althar> | I was hoping that by having instance of ResourceOpT, it would hold up, so long as the MonadIO constraint held |
| 2021-04-08 00:23:26 +0200 | <Althar> | call it 'encapsulation' if you will (for lack of a better term) |
| 2021-04-08 00:23:42 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@c-68-54-25-135.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 2021-04-08 00:24:07 +0200 | <monochrom> | "encapsulation" is even falser. |
| 2021-04-08 00:24:29 +0200 | <monochrom> | Type synonyms are completely transparent. |
| 2021-04-08 00:24:42 +0200 | mnrmnaugh | (~mnrmnaugh@unaffiliated/mnrmnaugh) |
| 2021-04-08 00:24:51 +0200 | maiqthefalse | (uid494950@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-lubjogfdgluyqicn) |
| 2021-04-08 00:25:02 +0200 | <monochrom> | Everything is exposed. Nothing is encapsulated. |
| 2021-04-08 00:25:22 +0200 | <Althar> | Ok, so this works : 'instance (MonadIO m) => Logger ( ResourceOpT r m )' |
| 2021-04-08 00:25:45 +0200 | arturh | (~arturh@93.176.180.48) (Quit: Lost terminal) |
| 2021-04-08 00:25:49 +0200 | <Althar> | With 'type ResourceOpT r = StateT (ResourceCache r)' |
| 2021-04-08 00:26:00 +0200 | <monochrom> | If you have "type MyType = [Int]" and attempt "instance Show MyType", compiler says you're doing "instance Show [Int]", this overlaps with everything else left right and centre. Not an encapsulation at all. |
| 2021-04-08 00:26:23 +0200 | <fresheyeball> | is there a way with cabal to have a common stanza in a file shared between cabal files? |
| 2021-04-08 00:26:39 +0200 | <fresheyeball> | I have the same stanza copy pasta all over the place |
| 2021-04-08 00:26:44 +0200 | <sclv> | nope |
| 2021-04-08 00:26:50 +0200 | <dcoutts_> | Within a cabal file yes, but between cabal files no. |
| 2021-04-08 00:27:01 +0200 | <fresheyeball> | well drat, I left hpack too soon |
| 2021-04-08 00:27:18 +0200 | <sclv> | cabal files are part of package manifests. since you have one cabal file per sdist tarball it wouldn't make much sense |
| 2021-04-08 00:27:34 +0200 | <Althar> | monochrom I get that, but what I didn't understand was that if they were synonymous, why it falls apart when I substitute the synonyms |
| 2021-04-08 00:27:39 +0200 | <sclv> | you could share some things (but not deps directly) through a shared .project file |
| 2021-04-08 00:27:43 +0200 | <dcoutts_> | And you can have multiple components (including multiple libs) in a single cabal file. |
| 2021-04-08 00:28:19 +0200 | <monochrom> | What is an example of "falls apart when I substitute the synonyms"? |
| 2021-04-08 00:28:23 +0200 | <Althar> | once I got rid of the redundant types from the type declaration as per your suggestion, the compiler is happy |
| 2021-04-08 00:28:43 +0200 | <Althar> | 'type ResourceOpT r m a = StateT (ResourceCache r) m a' |
| 2021-04-08 00:28:56 +0200 | <monochrom> | That's the "Type constructor symbols T introduced by type synonym declarations cannot be partially applied; it is a static error to use T without the full number of arguments." as said. |
| 2021-04-08 00:29:06 +0200 | pfurla | (~pfurla@ool-182ed2e2.dyn.optonline.net) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 00:29:18 +0200 | elliott_ | (~elliott@pool-108-51-101-42.washdc.fios.verizon.net) |
| 2021-04-08 00:29:24 +0200 | elliott_ | (~elliott@pool-108-51-101-42.washdc.fios.verizon.net) (Client Quit) |
| 2021-04-08 00:30:01 +0200 | <Althar> | Is it still a type synonym here ? |
| 2021-04-08 00:30:06 +0200 | elliott_ | (~elliott@pool-108-51-101-42.washdc.fios.verizon.net) |
| 2021-04-08 00:30:06 +0200 | <monochrom> | Yes. |
| 2021-04-08 00:30:08 +0200 | elliott_ | (~elliott@pool-108-51-101-42.washdc.fios.verizon.net) (Client Quit) |
| 2021-04-08 00:30:08 +0200 | <Althar> | 'type ResourceOpT r = StateT (ResourceCache r)' |
| 2021-04-08 00:30:12 +0200 | <monochrom> | Yes. |
| 2021-04-08 00:30:17 +0200 | <Althar> | so why does it work in this case |
| 2021-04-08 00:30:32 +0200 | <Althar> | I can do 'instance (MonadIO m) => Logger ( ResourceOpT r m )' |
| 2021-04-08 00:31:15 +0200 | <monochrom> | It expands to "instance (MonadIO m) => Logger ( StateT (ResourceCache r) m)" |
| 2021-04-08 00:32:08 +0200 | <haskellstudent> | fresheyeball: regarding your last message, maybe this is related? https://stackoverflow.com/questions/26902960/ghc-could-not-execute-htfpp so maybe your build generate-html-dsl is stored in the .stack-work/dist/... folder, but it is not in the path at the time you are trying to use it. maybe you could try using an absolute path to see if that is the problem, for example: {-# OPTIONS_GHC -F -pgmF /home/user/Projects/yourproject/. |
| 2021-04-08 00:32:08 +0200 | <haskellstudent> | stack-work/dist/x86_64-linux-tinfo6/Cabal-3.2.1.0/build/yourproject/generate-html-dsl #-} |
| 2021-04-08 00:32:16 +0200 | <Althar> | Yes, ok that is what I am going for - so I guess I am failing to understand why the previous way of writing it didn't expand to the same thing |
| 2021-04-08 00:32:29 +0200 | <fresheyeball> | haskellstudent: I figured it out, it needs to be in build tool depends |
| 2021-04-08 00:32:35 +0200 | <monochrom> | "Type constructor symbols T introduced by type synonym declarations cannot be partially applied; it is a static error to use T without the full number of arguments." again. |
| 2021-04-08 00:32:37 +0200 | <haskellstudent> | nice |
| 2021-04-08 00:32:53 +0200 | <monochrom> | You have to get past that rule before it's meaningful to talk about the rest. |
| 2021-04-08 00:33:13 +0200 | <Althar> | monochrom Sure, that's the sentence I don't quite understand/grasp then |
| 2021-04-08 00:33:18 +0200 | <monochrom> | No expansion until you clear that rule. |
| 2021-04-08 00:34:06 +0200 | <monochrom> | If you define "type T a b c d e f g" then you can only use it as "T Foo Bar John Mary Joe Alice Bob". |
| 2021-04-08 00:34:15 +0200 | <Althar> | I'm probably getting confused with the terminology between type constructor, and synonym |
| 2021-04-08 00:34:36 +0200 | <monochrom> | ResourceOpT is the type constructor. |
| 2021-04-08 00:34:41 +0200 | geowiesnot | (~user@i15-les02-ix2-87-89-181-157.sfr.lns.abo.bbox.fr) |
| 2021-04-08 00:34:44 +0200 | <Althar> | ok |
| 2021-04-08 00:35:10 +0200 | <Althar> | so the above only holds true if it is a type synonym? hence it working with StateT, or with my partial type constructor |
| 2021-04-08 00:35:26 +0200 | <Althar> | but not in my original definition |
| 2021-04-08 00:35:28 +0200 | <monochrom> | I defined my T to have formally 7 arguments. Now I'm stuck with using it with 7 arguments, I cannot supply fewer. |
| 2021-04-08 00:35:31 +0200 | stree | (~stree@68.36.8.116) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 00:35:34 +0200 | <Althar> | ok |
| 2021-04-08 00:35:49 +0200 | heatsink | (~heatsink@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) |
| 2021-04-08 00:35:55 +0200 | <Althar> | starting to make sense |
| 2021-04-08 00:35:59 +0200 | <Althar> | sorry for going round in circles |
| 2021-04-08 00:36:55 +0200 | <Althar> | As a final question then, is it better practice in Haskell, to define the instance for the most basic type, or am I right defining the instance for my more specific type? |
| 2021-04-08 00:37:08 +0200 | <Althar> | So Option #A : 'instance (MonadIO m) => Logger ( ResourceOpT r m )' |
| 2021-04-08 00:37:18 +0200 | <Althar> | Or Option #B : 'instance (MonadIO m) => Logger ( StateT s m )' |
| 2021-04-08 00:37:31 +0200 | <Althar> | given at this stage they are the same |
| 2021-04-08 00:37:43 +0200 | machinedgod | (~machinedg@24.105.81.50) |
| 2021-04-08 00:38:29 +0200 | <monochrom> | False dichotomy. The correct decision is based on the purpose of the class, the purpose of the basic type, the purpose of the specific type. |
| 2021-04-08 00:38:39 +0200 | dinciorip | (~dincio@5.170.5.195) (Quit: WeeChat 3.1) |
| 2021-04-08 00:39:53 +0200 | <Althar> | I might not want the user to use Logger in everything that uses StateT |
| 2021-04-08 00:39:56 +0200 | <monochrom> | "instance Eq a => Eq [a]" makes more sense than "instance Eq [Int]" because Eq should work the same for [Int], [Char], [Anything]. |
| 2021-04-08 00:40:04 +0200 | <Althar> | sure |
| 2021-04-08 00:40:33 +0200 | <monochrom> | But "instance MySpecialClass [Int]" can make more sense than "instance MySpecialClass [a]" if the purpose of MySpecialClass is special. |
| 2021-04-08 00:41:07 +0200 | Synthetica | (uid199651@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-igiuipnjkspialln) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) |
| 2021-04-08 00:41:50 +0200 | hpc | (~juzz@ip98-169-35-13.dc.dc.cox.net) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 00:41:51 +0200 | <monochrom> | The simplest thing to do is outlaw type synonyms. |
| 2021-04-08 00:42:14 +0200 | <Althar> | ok, I think I've got it now |
| 2021-04-08 00:42:25 +0200 | <Althar> | are type synonyms considered bad/dangerous then? |
| 2021-04-08 00:42:38 +0200 | <monochrom> | If you intend an encapsulation then use "data" or "newtype". If you don't intend an encapsulation then just write out the full type expression. Simple and clear. |
| 2021-04-08 00:42:57 +0200 | <monochrom> | Oh everyone else likes it. |
| 2021-04-08 00:43:08 +0200 | hpc | (~juzz@ip98-169-35-13.dc.dc.cox.net) |
| 2021-04-08 00:43:08 +0200 | nbloomf | (~nbloomf@2600:1700:ad14:3020:b94d:65d6:a9e1:d541) |
| 2021-04-08 00:43:15 +0200 | <dibblego> | there is also the use-case "pronunciation", though I would not use type synonym for that either |
| 2021-04-08 00:43:49 +0200 | <Althar> | ok, I think I've got enough to ponder about - thanks a lot for your help/explanations |
| 2021-04-08 00:45:21 +0200 | fiedlr | (~fiedlr@83.148.33.254) |
| 2021-04-08 00:45:51 +0200 | <monochrom> | 80% of the people mistake type synonyms for abstraction. They run into lots of confusions indeed. |
| 2021-04-08 00:46:11 +0200 | Narinas | (~Narinas@187-178-93-112.dynamic.axtel.net) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 00:46:25 +0200 | <monochrom> | The other 20% correctly understand that it's like "#define MAXNUM 100" in C. |
| 2021-04-08 00:46:45 +0200 | <monochrom> | There is benefit in "if one day I need to change 100 to 200 I just have to change it at one place". |
| 2021-04-08 00:46:53 +0200 | heatsink | (~heatsink@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 00:47:08 +0200 | <monochrom> | But this does not imply any abstraction, encapsulation, objectification, modularization. |
| 2021-04-08 00:47:30 +0200 | <dibblego> | I've also seen "use newtype for type-safety" |
| 2021-04-08 00:47:57 +0200 | pavonia | (~user@unaffiliated/siracusa) |
| 2021-04-08 00:48:00 +0200 | Narinas | (~Narinas@187-178-93-112.dynamic.axtel.net) |
| 2021-04-08 00:48:40 +0200 | stree | (~stree@68.36.8.116) |
| 2021-04-08 00:48:57 +0200 | gnumonic | (~gnumonic@c-73-170-91-210.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 2021-04-08 00:49:18 +0200 | <Althar> | Hopefully, I'll be one of the 20% one day :) |
| 2021-04-08 00:49:23 +0200 | hiroaki_ | (~hiroaki@2a02:908:4b18:8c40:bdf7:105d:7ce:39c2) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
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| 2021-04-08 00:50:19 +0200 | Alleria | (~textual@2603-7000-3040-0000-d06d-9c04-03df-c710.res6.spectrum.com) |
| 2021-04-08 00:50:43 +0200 | Alleria | Guest29374 |
| 2021-04-08 00:52:02 +0200 | rj | (~x@gateway/tor-sasl/rj) (Quit: rj) |
| 2021-04-08 00:52:06 +0200 | zebrag | (~inkbottle@aaubervilliers-654-1-2-51.w83-200.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2021-04-08 00:52:24 +0200 | zebrag | (~inkbottle@aaubervilliers-654-1-2-51.w83-200.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
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| 2021-04-08 00:59:40 +0200 | <infinisil> | I like how in Idris type synonyms are just variable definitions |
| 2021-04-08 00:59:41 +0200 | <d34df00d> | To be fair, newtypes offer some degrees of type safety (and documentation, for that matter). |
| 2021-04-08 00:59:55 +0200 | minoru_shiraeesh | (~shiraeesh@109.166.57.223) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 01:00:12 +0200 | <infinisil> | `type Foo = Bar` in Idris is `Foo : Type \n Foo = Bar` |
| 2021-04-08 01:00:31 +0200 | <d34df00d> | I'd much rather have trade :: Currency -> Amount -> Deadline -> ... than trade :: Int -> Int -> Int -> ... |
| 2021-04-08 01:00:37 +0200 | <dibblego> | that is not type-safety |
| 2021-04-08 01:00:56 +0200 | <monochrom> | I don't doubt the value of "#define MAXNUM 100" either. |
| 2021-04-08 01:01:07 +0200 | <monochrom> | I just doubt the belief that it's an abstraction. |
| 2021-04-08 01:01:08 +0200 | <d34df00d> | Type safety is about proving that your programs don't exhibit properties you don't want and do exhibit the ones you do want. |
| 2021-04-08 01:01:32 +0200 | <d34df00d> | A property of "don't accidentally pass amount where deadline is expected" is one example. |
| 2021-04-08 01:01:33 +0200 | <monochrom> | When an error message spills the gut, you know you don't have an abstraction. |
| 2021-04-08 01:01:34 +0200 | <dibblego> | Correct. newtype T = T U -- this program T exhibits the same properties as the program U |
| 2021-04-08 01:01:42 +0200 | <dibblego> | no |
| 2021-04-08 01:01:53 +0200 | <d34df00d> | A property of "don't add an amount to a deadline" is another one. |
| 2021-04-08 01:02:10 +0200 | <dibblego> | these are not examples of the correct statement |
| 2021-04-08 01:02:14 +0200 | <d34df00d> | dibblego: this is not a program, really. |
| 2021-04-08 01:02:31 +0200 | <d34df00d> | I mean, this is some Haskell source code, but it has no runtime behaviour, so you'll need extra lines of code around. |
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| 2021-04-08 01:47:06 +0200 | jakalx | (~jakalx@base.jakalx.net) () |
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| 2021-04-08 01:52:03 +0200 | zebrag | (~inkbottle@aaubervilliers-654-1-2-51.w83-200.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Quit: Konversation terminated!) |
| 2021-04-08 01:52:24 +0200 | zebrag | (~inkbottle@aaubervilliers-654-1-2-51.w83-200.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 2021-04-08 01:53:55 +0200 | atraii | (~atraii@2601:681:8700:c471:182c:49ac:c430:1f21) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 01:54:49 +0200 | j | (jess@freenode/staff/jess) (Quit: K-Lined) |
| 2021-04-08 01:56:02 +0200 | Deide | (~Deide@217.155.19.23) (Quit: Seeee yaaaa) |
| 2021-04-08 01:57:31 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@83-160-49-249.ip.xs4all.nl) |
| 2021-04-08 02:00:03 +0200 | Axman5892 | Axman6 |
| 2021-04-08 02:03:41 +0200 | s00pcan | (~chris@107.181.165.217) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2021-04-08 02:05:43 +0200 | s00pcan | (~chris@075-133-056-178.res.spectrum.com) |
| 2021-04-08 02:06:35 +0200 | Tario | (~Tario@201.192.165.173) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 02:07:13 +0200 | Tario | (~Tario@200.119.185.28) |
| 2021-04-08 02:12:53 +0200 | acidjnk_new | (~acidjnk@p200300d0c72b9506d42010f0580cba17.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 02:13:07 +0200 | deviantfero | (~deviantfe@190.150.27.58) (Quit: WeeChat 3.1) |
| 2021-04-08 02:13:27 +0200 | deviantfero | (~deviantfe@190.150.27.58) |
| 2021-04-08 02:17:05 +0200 | Kaiepi | (~Kaiepi@47.54.252.148) (Read error: No route to host) |
| 2021-04-08 02:17:47 +0200 | Kaiepi | (~Kaiepi@47.54.252.148) |
| 2021-04-08 02:17:55 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@c-68-54-25-135.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 02:20:36 +0200 | Tario | (~Tario@200.119.185.28) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2021-04-08 02:21:04 +0200 | <wrunt> | Alexis King had a post about this recently: https://lexi-lambda.github.io/blog/2020/11/01/names-are-not-type-safety/ |
| 2021-04-08 02:21:11 +0200 | Tario | (~Tario@201.192.165.173) |
| 2021-04-08 02:26:56 +0200 | hypercube | (hypercube@gateway/vpn/protonvpn/hypercube) |
| 2021-04-08 02:31:18 +0200 | tabemann | (~travisb@2600:1700:7990:24e0:f296:95e4:6efa:8660) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 02:31:34 +0200 | tabemann | (~travisb@2600:1700:7990:24e0:70e7:2dce:b9d2:60a7) |
| 2021-04-08 02:32:12 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@83-160-49-249.ip.xs4all.nl) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 02:34:06 +0200 | cole-h | (~cole-h@c-73-48-197-220.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 02:34:59 +0200 | elliott_ | (~elliott@pool-108-51-101-42.washdc.fios.verizon.net) |
| 2021-04-08 02:35:56 +0200 | jakalx | (~jakalx@base.jakalx.net) |
| 2021-04-08 02:38:13 +0200 | <carter> | Newtype is better than synonyms |
| 2021-04-08 02:39:43 +0200 | <carter> | Though at least for some stuff physics units would be even nicer :) |
| 2021-04-08 02:40:16 +0200 | elliott_ | (~elliott@pool-108-51-101-42.washdc.fios.verizon.net) (Quit: WeeChat 3.1) |
| 2021-04-08 02:40:54 +0200 | elliott_ | (~elliott@pool-108-51-101-42.washdc.fios.verizon.net) |
| 2021-04-08 02:41:19 +0200 | olligobber | (olligobber@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/olligobber) |
| 2021-04-08 02:41:20 +0200 | Tario | (~Tario@201.192.165.173) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2021-04-08 02:41:27 +0200 | Tario | (~Tario@200.119.185.109) |
| 2021-04-08 02:43:51 +0200 | Tario | (~Tario@200.119.185.109) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2021-04-08 02:44:05 +0200 | Tario | (~Tario@201.192.165.173) |
| 2021-04-08 02:47:59 +0200 | nbloomf | (~nbloomf@2600:1700:ad14:3020:b94d:65d6:a9e1:d541) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
| 2021-04-08 02:48:46 +0200 | hypercube | (hypercube@gateway/vpn/protonvpn/hypercube) (Quit: WeeChat 3.1) |
| 2021-04-08 02:49:05 +0200 | hypercube | (hypercube@gateway/vpn/protonvpn/hypercube) |
| 2021-04-08 02:49:56 +0200 | hypercube | (hypercube@gateway/vpn/protonvpn/hypercube) (Client Quit) |
| 2021-04-08 02:50:13 +0200 | heatsink | (~heatsink@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 02:50:34 +0200 | heatsink | (~heatsink@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) |
| 2021-04-08 02:52:04 +0200 | zebrag | (~inkbottle@aaubervilliers-654-1-2-51.w83-200.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Quit: Konversation terminated!) |
| 2021-04-08 02:52:25 +0200 | zebrag | (~inkbottle@aaubervilliers-654-1-2-51.w83-200.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 2021-04-08 02:53:40 +0200 | nbloomf | (~nbloomf@2600:1700:ad14:3020:6987:f17b:abed:1830) |
| 2021-04-08 02:56:59 +0200 | stree | (~stree@68.36.8.116) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 02:59:13 +0200 | solidus-river | (~mike@174.127.249.180) |
| 2021-04-08 03:04:47 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@c-68-54-25-135.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 2021-04-08 03:05:26 +0200 | bitdex | (~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) |
| 2021-04-08 03:06:44 +0200 | bitdex | (~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 03:07:26 +0200 | e2 | (e2@sponsored.by.bnc4you.xyz) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 03:07:39 +0200 | bitdex | (~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) |
| 2021-04-08 03:09:34 +0200 | stree | (~stree@68.36.8.116) |
| 2021-04-08 03:10:35 +0200 | drbean_ | (~drbean@TC210-63-209-180.static.apol.com.tw) |
| 2021-04-08 03:13:46 +0200 | falafel | (~falafel@pool-96-255-70-50.washdc.fios.verizon.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 03:15:05 +0200 | <d34df00d> | wrunt: I remember reading it and disagreeing but I don't precisely remember nicer its points nor my counterpoints. |
| 2021-04-08 03:18:16 +0200 | <solidus-river> | hey all, i'm trying to get better at reasoning about the different modes of haskell (arrow, applicative, monadic etc) I'm writing a lot of blocks of code that look odd to me in a monadic form and am wondering if theres a way to write them in an Applicative form better. I can't seem to make the compiler happy when trying to switch from do notation to an Applicative approach though. here's a quikc |
| 2021-04-08 03:18:22 +0200 | <solidus-river> | paste of the relevant funcs https://paste.tomsmeding.com/FK5tB1Gz |
| 2021-04-08 03:19:58 +0200 | e2 | (e2@sponsored.by.bnc4you.xyz) |
| 2021-04-08 03:20:03 +0200 | <solidus-river> | maybe I need to move away from newtype nad into data to get an applicative form of that to work around the lines of: MkVersionedEvent <$> parseId id <*> parseSeq seq <*> pure blob |
| 2021-04-08 03:20:17 +0200 | <solidus-river> | but i'm not sure what the trade-offs are of newtype vs data |
| 2021-04-08 03:21:43 +0200 | <solidus-river> | or maybe i could iteratively build a tuple up with , ... |
| 2021-04-08 03:21:48 +0200 | <wrunt> | solidus-river: I think you have the right idea with that change. There are a couple of un-idiomatic things you're doing currently. |
| 2021-04-08 03:22:06 +0200 | <wrunt> | You wouldn't typically newtype a tuple -- just use data. |
| 2021-04-08 03:22:33 +0200 | <wrunt> | And you wouldn't typically call your VersionedEvent constructor MkVersionedEvent, just call it VersionedEvent, though this doesn't really matter. |
| 2021-04-08 03:23:21 +0200 | <wrunt> | And you wouldn't typically pass three arguments to a function as a list. parseEvent should have type ByteString -> ByteString -> ByteString -> Maybe VersionedEvent |
| 2021-04-08 03:24:03 +0200 | vicfred | (~vicfred@unaffiliated/vicfred) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 03:25:11 +0200 | <solidus-river> | hey, those all make a lot of sense, going to try reworking things like that and see if some of this gets cleaned up |
| 2021-04-08 03:25:29 +0200 | elliott_ | (~elliott@pool-108-51-101-42.washdc.fios.verizon.net) (Quit: WeeChat 3.1) |
| 2021-04-08 03:25:42 +0200 | MrMobius | (~MrMobius@208.58.206.154) |
| 2021-04-08 03:26:11 +0200 | xff0x | (~xff0x@2001:1a81:52c6:f900:8bb9:4c7a:ec7:b51f) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 03:27:05 +0200 | rajivr | (uid269651@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jvyqvcvcmixmgtiu) |
| 2021-04-08 03:27:56 +0200 | xff0x | (~xff0x@2001:1a81:52e8:b700:3ebf:a81d:5544:d0a) |
| 2021-04-08 03:27:57 +0200 | cads | (~cads@ip-64-72-99-232.lasvegas.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2021-04-08 03:28:06 +0200 | cads | (~cads@ip-64-72-99-232.lasvegas.net) |
| 2021-04-08 03:28:35 +0200 | <solidus-river> | wrunt: thanks for the insight, I felt like things were getting more awkward than needed as I worked with more do notation while parsing |
| 2021-04-08 03:28:41 +0200 | notzmv | (~zmv@unaffiliated/zmv) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 03:29:08 +0200 | <pjb> | .br |
| 2021-04-08 03:32:33 +0200 | ddellaco_ | (~ddellacos@ool-44c73afa.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 2021-04-08 03:32:58 +0200 | cads | (~cads@ip-64-72-99-232.lasvegas.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2021-04-08 03:33:06 +0200 | cads2 | (~cads@ip-64-72-99-232.lasvegas.net) |
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| 2021-04-08 03:38:28 +0200 | trcm | (~trcm@103.153.243.79) |
| 2021-04-08 03:39:45 +0200 | notzmv | (~zmv@unaffiliated/zmv) |
| 2021-04-08 03:42:16 +0200 | geowiesnot | (~user@i15-les02-ix2-87-89-181-157.sfr.lns.abo.bbox.fr) |
| 2021-04-08 03:42:43 +0200 | zebrag | (~inkbottle@aaubervilliers-654-1-2-51.w83-200.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Quit: Konversation terminated!) |
| 2021-04-08 03:43:27 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) |
| 2021-04-08 03:43:56 +0200 | falafel | (~falafel@pool-96-255-70-50.washdc.fios.verizon.net) |
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| 2021-04-08 03:54:24 +0200 | fiedlr | (~fiedlr@83.148.33.254) |
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| 2021-04-08 04:08:52 +0200 | superstar64 | (6ccefa7c@108-206-250-124.lightspeed.miamfl.sbcglobal.net) |
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| 2021-04-08 04:32:29 +0200 | falafel | (~falafel@pool-96-255-70-50.washdc.fios.verizon.net) |
| 2021-04-08 04:36:41 +0200 | machinedgod | (~machinedg@24.105.81.50) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 04:37:30 +0200 | carlomagno | (~cararell@148.87.23.13) (Quit: Leaving.) |
| 2021-04-08 04:44:29 +0200 | lawt | (~lawt@c-73-151-3-92.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2021-04-08 04:45:14 +0200 | fosterite | (~fosterite@2600:6c46:7800:fecf:c1ad:8d4a:3143:388e) |
| 2021-04-08 04:47:07 +0200 | lawt | (~lawt@c-73-151-3-92.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 2021-04-08 04:51:26 +0200 | theDon | (~td@muedsl-82-207-238-149.citykom.de) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 04:53:38 +0200 | theDon | (~td@muedsl-82-207-238-224.citykom.de) |
| 2021-04-08 04:54:56 +0200 | fosterite | (~fosterite@2600:6c46:7800:fecf:c1ad:8d4a:3143:388e) () |
| 2021-04-08 04:56:00 +0200 | FinnElija | (~finn_elij@gateway/tor-sasl/finnelija/x-67402716) |
| 2021-04-08 04:56:00 +0200 | finn_elija | Guest82750 |
| 2021-04-08 04:56:00 +0200 | FinnElija | finn_elija |
| 2021-04-08 04:57:38 +0200 | Aquazi | (uid312403@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gutayqhfktjbgela) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) |
| 2021-04-08 04:58:47 +0200 | ulidtko | (~ulidtko@194.54.80.38) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 04:59:09 +0200 | Guest82750 | (~finn_elij@gateway/tor-sasl/finnelija/x-67402716) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 05:02:02 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@83-160-49-249.ip.xs4all.nl) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 05:02:28 +0200 | rdivyanshu | (uid322626@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xsuaebaitzobmxge) |
| 2021-04-08 05:04:42 +0200 | Tario | (~Tario@201.192.165.173) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2021-04-08 05:07:10 +0200 | mmmattyx | (uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zogxbflcfypzetqv) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) |
| 2021-04-08 05:10:58 +0200 | aerona | (~aerona@2600:6c54:4600:f300:fe08:6f18:f4e0:33dc) |
| 2021-04-08 05:11:46 +0200 | falafel | (~falafel@pool-96-255-70-50.washdc.fios.verizon.net) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 05:13:29 +0200 | Tario | (~Tario@201.192.165.173) |
| 2021-04-08 05:14:04 +0200 | xlei | (znc@unaffiliated/xlei) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2021-04-08 05:17:18 +0200 | stree | (~stree@68.36.8.116) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 05:18:16 +0200 | <Axman6> | pjb: you after this? https://ift.tt/3wCCaia |
| 2021-04-08 05:28:15 +0200 | solidus-river | (~mike@174.127.249.180) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 05:30:51 +0200 | stree | (~stree@68.36.8.116) |
| 2021-04-08 05:34:11 +0200 | s00pcan | (~chris@075-133-056-178.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 05:34:29 +0200 | fissureman | (~quassel@c-73-201-159-163.hsd1.dc.comcast.net) |
| 2021-04-08 05:34:38 +0200 | deviantfero | (~deviantfe@190.150.27.58) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 05:35:22 +0200 | <koz_> | Where can I find the list of boot packages again? |
| 2021-04-08 05:35:55 +0200 | s00pcan | (~chris@107.181.165.217) |
| 2021-04-08 05:36:19 +0200 | frozenErebus | (~frozenEre@37.231.244.249) |
| 2021-04-08 05:39:40 +0200 | alx741 | (~alx741@181.196.68.139) (Quit: alx741) |
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| 2021-04-08 05:43:59 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) |
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| 2021-04-08 05:47:08 +0200 | raym | (~ray@45.64.220.116) |
| 2021-04-08 05:47:26 +0200 | fakubish[m] | (fakubishne@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-pttnirxiqljdhzeo) |
| 2021-04-08 05:48:11 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 05:50:08 +0200 | bitdex | (~bitdex@gateway/tor-sasl/bitdex) (Remote host closed the connection) |
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| 2021-04-08 05:53:51 +0200 | Tario | (~Tario@201.192.165.173) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2021-04-08 05:54:06 +0200 | Tario | (~Tario@201.192.165.173) |
| 2021-04-08 05:55:33 +0200 | justanotheruser | (~justanoth@unaffiliated/justanotheruser) |
| 2021-04-08 05:55:47 +0200 | Sgeo | (~Sgeo@ool-18b98aa4.dyn.optonline.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
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| 2021-04-08 06:17:50 +0200 | glaceon | (~glaceon@117.222.66.35) |
| 2021-04-08 06:21:42 +0200 | drbean_ | (~drbean@TC210-63-209-180.static.apol.com.tw) (Quit: ZNC 1.8.2+cygwin2 - https://znc.in) |
| 2021-04-08 06:21:46 +0200 | frozenErebus | (~frozenEre@37.231.244.249) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 06:23:18 +0200 | <gnumonic> | This is probably a dumb question, but why does "f . g $ x" sometimes fail to typecheck even though "f $ g $ x" or "f (g x)" will? |
| 2021-04-08 06:23:45 +0200 | pfurla | (~pfurla@ool-182ed2e2.dyn.optonline.net) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 06:24:45 +0200 | <c_wraith> | in what situations? If it involves things with types like runST, it's because of the lack of impredicative instantiation. If it's something else, you probably misgrouped the identifiers |
| 2021-04-08 06:26:09 +0200 | <c_wraith> | I wonder if quick look impredicative types will actually make runST . foo typecheck |
| 2021-04-08 06:26:30 +0200 | Wuzzy | (~Wuzzy@p5790e46d.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 06:26:31 +0200 | <gnumonic> | Mostly I've run into it with 'withSingI' from singletons (where g is withSingI and x expects a SingI context) |
| 2021-04-08 06:31:51 +0200 | <koz_> | Where can I find the list of boot packages again? |
| 2021-04-08 06:32:03 +0200 | <c_wraith> | those types are weird. I'm betting GHC is hitting the same code paths mean it can't instantiate some parameter with a polytype |
| 2021-04-08 06:33:49 +0200 | NGravity | (csp@gateway/shell/xshellz/x-yvbxxozqugoitghs) (Quit: gone) |
| 2021-04-08 06:33:59 +0200 | NGravity | (csp@gateway/shell/xshellz/x-xeirqxdnpwrslhwp) |
| 2021-04-08 06:38:49 +0200 | alx741 | (~alx741@181.196.68.139) |
| 2021-04-08 06:38:49 +0200 | alx741 | (~alx741@181.196.68.139) (Client Quit) |
| 2021-04-08 06:45:02 +0200 | nbloomf | (~nbloomf@2600:1700:ad14:3020:6987:f17b:abed:1830) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
| 2021-04-08 06:46:15 +0200 | frozenErebus | (~frozenEre@37.231.244.249) |
| 2021-04-08 06:46:43 +0200 | NGravity | (csp@gateway/shell/xshellz/x-xeirqxdnpwrslhwp) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 06:47:29 +0200 | NGravity | (csp@gateway/shell/xshellz/x-fqlktjjmzfodnifg) |
| 2021-04-08 06:55:10 +0200 | Tario | (~Tario@201.192.165.173) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 06:58:39 +0200 | Tario | (~Tario@201.192.165.173) |
| 2021-04-08 06:58:45 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@83-160-49-249.ip.xs4all.nl) |
| 2021-04-08 07:04:46 +0200 | Gurkenglas | (~Gurkengla@unaffiliated/gurkenglas) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 07:05:57 +0200 | Sgeo | (~Sgeo@ool-18b98aa4.dyn.optonline.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 07:07:41 +0200 | molehillish | (~molehilli@2600:8800:8d06:1800:e032:860d:11aa:7812) |
| 2021-04-08 07:11:46 +0200 | myShoggoth | (~myShoggot@75.164.73.93) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 07:14:37 +0200 | Tario | (~Tario@201.192.165.173) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 07:17:27 +0200 | pmuir | (~pmuir@185.204.1.185) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 07:22:13 +0200 | arturh | (~arturh@93.176.180.48) |
| 2021-04-08 07:22:37 +0200 | Sgeo | (~Sgeo@ool-18b98aa4.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 2021-04-08 07:22:50 +0200 | notzmv | (~zmv@unaffiliated/zmv) |
| 2021-04-08 07:27:47 +0200 | trcm | (~trcm@103.153.243.79) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 07:28:31 +0200 | MarkusH1 | (~MarkusH@195.140.213.38) |
| 2021-04-08 07:32:26 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@83-160-49-249.ip.xs4all.nl) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 07:32:35 +0200 | Guest29374 | (~textual@2603-7000-3040-0000-d06d-9c04-03df-c710.res6.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 07:38:41 +0200 | stree | (~stree@68.36.8.116) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 07:40:40 +0200 | mctpyt | (~mctpyt@unaffiliated/mctpyt) |
| 2021-04-08 07:42:05 +0200 | Varis | (~Tadas@unaffiliated/varis) |
| 2021-04-08 07:42:19 +0200 | minoru_shiraeesh | (~shiraeesh@109.166.57.223) |
| 2021-04-08 07:43:55 +0200 | falafel | (~falafel@pool-96-255-70-50.washdc.fios.verizon.net) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 07:44:16 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) |
| 2021-04-08 07:48:38 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 07:52:06 +0200 | stree | (~stree@68.36.8.116) |
| 2021-04-08 07:55:27 +0200 | MarkusH1 | (~MarkusH@195.140.213.38) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 07:55:53 +0200 | ddellaco_ | (~ddellacos@ool-44c73afa.dyn.optonline.net) |
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| 2021-04-08 07:58:36 +0200 | cfricke | (~cfricke@unaffiliated/cfricke) |
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| 2021-04-08 08:01:38 +0200 | plutoniix | (~q@184.82.198.236) |
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| 2021-04-08 08:10:12 +0200 | marinelli | (~marinelli@gateway/tor-sasl/marinelli) |
| 2021-04-08 08:10:52 +0200 | marinelli | (~marinelli@gateway/tor-sasl/marinelli) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 08:10:56 +0200 | Varis | (~Tadas@unaffiliated/varis) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 08:11:13 +0200 | marinelli | (~marinelli@gateway/tor-sasl/marinelli) |
| 2021-04-08 08:14:16 +0200 | nut | (~user@roc37-h01-176-170-197-243.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr) |
| 2021-04-08 08:19:09 +0200 | _ht | (~quassel@82-169-194-8.biz.kpn.net) |
| 2021-04-08 08:20:31 +0200 | bitmapper | (uid464869@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-nyysfddoxuidbcdr) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) |
| 2021-04-08 08:22:15 +0200 | desophos | (~desophos@2601:249:1680:a570:34e2:d01d:ac0e:1b9) |
| 2021-04-08 08:23:00 +0200 | average | (uid473595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-emhfocwfjlhcyvsq) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) |
| 2021-04-08 08:27:09 +0200 | sord937 | (~sord937@gateway/tor-sasl/sord937) |
| 2021-04-08 08:27:14 +0200 | v01d4lph4 | (~v01d4lph4@223.177.183.27) |
| 2021-04-08 08:30:50 +0200 | Major_Biscuit | (~Major_Bis@82-169-100-198.biz.kpn.net) |
| 2021-04-08 08:33:24 +0200 | idhugo | (~idhugo@87-49-147-45-mobile.dk.customer.tdc.net) |
| 2021-04-08 08:34:58 +0200 | Ranhir | (~Ranhir@157.97.53.139) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 08:35:43 +0200 | danvet | (~Daniel@2a02:168:57f4:0:efd0:b9e5:5ae6:c2fa) |
| 2021-04-08 08:39:43 +0200 | graf_blutwurst | (~user@2001:171b:226e:adc0:7435:21b3:df2a:1469) |
| 2021-04-08 08:41:51 +0200 | gproto23 | (~gproto23@unaffiliated/gproto23) |
| 2021-04-08 08:48:04 +0200 | Ranhir | (~Ranhir@157.97.53.139) |
| 2021-04-08 08:50:35 +0200 | minoru_shiraeesh | (~shiraeesh@109.166.57.223) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 08:52:05 +0200 | minoru_shiraeesh | (~shiraeesh@109.166.57.223) |
| 2021-04-08 08:56:29 +0200 | fiedlr | (~fiedlr@83.148.33.254) |
| 2021-04-08 08:56:38 +0200 | s00pcan | (~chris@075-133-056-178.res.spectrum.com) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 08:57:00 +0200 | rdd | (~user@c-407ce255.012-81-73746f39.cust.ownit.se) |
| 2021-04-08 08:58:46 +0200 | s00pcan | (~chris@107.181.165.217) |
| 2021-04-08 09:00:20 +0200 | desophos | (~desophos@2601:249:1680:a570:34e2:d01d:ac0e:1b9) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2021-04-08 09:00:23 +0200 | idhugo_ | (~idhugo@80-62-116-143-mobile.dk.customer.tdc.net) |
| 2021-04-08 09:00:47 +0200 | malumore | (~malumore@151.62.113.39) |
| 2021-04-08 09:02:41 +0200 | idhugo | (~idhugo@87-49-147-45-mobile.dk.customer.tdc.net) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 09:02:57 +0200 | dpl | (~dpl@77-121-78-163.chn.volia.net) |
| 2021-04-08 09:03:18 +0200 | mananamenos | (~mananamen@62.red-88-11-67.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) |
| 2021-04-08 09:05:17 +0200 | black_mask | (user@gateway/vpn/mullvad/blackmask/x-17493077) |
| 2021-04-08 09:05:58 +0200 | Varis | (~Tadas@unaffiliated/varis) |
| 2021-04-08 09:06:38 +0200 | Sorna | (~Sornaensi@077213203030.dynamic.telenor.dk) |
| 2021-04-08 09:07:58 +0200 | srk | (~sorki@unaffiliated/srk) |
| 2021-04-08 09:08:41 +0200 | juri__ | juri_ |
| 2021-04-08 09:16:44 +0200 | minoru_shiraeesh | (~shiraeesh@109.166.57.223) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 09:17:02 +0200 | Pickchea | (~private@unaffiliated/pickchea) |
| 2021-04-08 09:18:23 +0200 | michalz | (~user@185.246.204.43) |
| 2021-04-08 09:19:31 +0200 | idhugo_ | (~idhugo@80-62-116-143-mobile.dk.customer.tdc.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 09:20:04 +0200 | idhugo | (~idhugo@87-49-147-45-mobile.dk.customer.tdc.net) |
| 2021-04-08 09:23:24 +0200 | idhugo_ | (~idhugo@80-62-116-143-mobile.dk.customer.tdc.net) |
| 2021-04-08 09:25:10 +0200 | <nshepperd> | when's the impredicative polymorphism that works coming? I've finally found a case where i think i need it heh |
| 2021-04-08 09:25:46 +0200 | idhugo | (~idhugo@87-49-147-45-mobile.dk.customer.tdc.net) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 09:26:08 +0200 | <c_wraith> | it's in the current alpha |
| 2021-04-08 09:28:01 +0200 | minoru_shiraeesh | (~shiraeesh@109.166.57.223) |
| 2021-04-08 09:28:39 +0200 | <nshepperd> | awesome |
| 2021-04-08 09:29:23 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@83-160-49-249.ip.xs4all.nl) |
| 2021-04-08 09:30:32 +0200 | poljar | (~poljar@93-141-129-205.adsl.net.t-com.hr) |
| 2021-04-08 09:31:34 +0200 | mkDoku | (~TheMule@aftr-37-201-195-134.unity-media.net) |
| 2021-04-08 09:31:49 +0200 | poljar1 | (~poljar@93-139-86-101.adsl.net.t-com.hr) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 09:32:05 +0200 | raym | (~ray@45.64.220.116) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 09:32:54 +0200 | shutdown_-h_now | (~arjan@2001:1c06:2d0b:2312:69eb:317d:6c76:80fb) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 09:36:48 +0200 | howdoi | (uid224@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ucsrbnmysyuxrtpn) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) |
| 2021-04-08 09:37:09 +0200 | Sorny | (~Sornaensi@79.142.232.102) |
| 2021-04-08 09:38:58 +0200 | raym | (~ray@45.64.220.116) |
| 2021-04-08 09:39:47 +0200 | Sorna | (~Sornaensi@077213203030.dynamic.telenor.dk) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 09:41:48 +0200 | rdivyanshu | (uid322626@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xsuaebaitzobmxge) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) |
| 2021-04-08 09:45:49 +0200 | stree | (~stree@68.36.8.116) (Quit: Caught exception) |
| 2021-04-08 09:46:14 +0200 | stree | (~stree@68.36.8.116) |
| 2021-04-08 09:47:27 +0200 | tzh | (~tzh@c-24-21-73-154.hsd1.or.comcast.net) (Quit: zzz) |
| 2021-04-08 09:47:54 +0200 | idhugo__ | (~idhugo@130.225.16.16) |
| 2021-04-08 09:48:49 +0200 | shutdown_-h_now | (~arjan@2001:1c06:2d0b:2312:cde1:2c3d:19e0:545) |
| 2021-04-08 09:50:06 +0200 | molehillish | (~molehilli@2600:8800:8d06:1800:e032:860d:11aa:7812) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 09:50:11 +0200 | idhugo_ | (~idhugo@80-62-116-143-mobile.dk.customer.tdc.net) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 09:51:49 +0200 | poljar1 | (~poljar@93-139-112-157.adsl.net.t-com.hr) |
| 2021-04-08 09:53:09 +0200 | Aquazi | (uid312403@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xxugdpxnjyuxwiyi) |
| 2021-04-08 09:53:52 +0200 | molehillish | (~molehilli@ip98-165-87-166.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 2021-04-08 09:54:18 +0200 | minoru_shiraeesh | (~shiraeesh@109.166.57.223) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 09:54:40 +0200 | pnotequalnp[m] | (pnotequaln@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-qksljgrocihfvtje) |
| 2021-04-08 09:54:58 +0200 | poljar | (~poljar@93-141-129-205.adsl.net.t-com.hr) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 09:55:21 +0200 | Sgeo_ | (~Sgeo@ool-18b98aa4.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 2021-04-08 09:55:34 +0200 | kritzefitz | (~kritzefit@p548c9398.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 2021-04-08 09:55:56 +0200 | machinedgod | (~machinedg@24.105.81.50) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 09:57:30 +0200 | Sgeo | (~Sgeo@ool-18b98aa4.dyn.optonline.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 09:58:50 +0200 | frozenErebus | (~frozenEre@37.231.244.249) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 09:59:55 +0200 | Sgeo_ | (~Sgeo@ool-18b98aa4.dyn.optonline.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2021-04-08 10:00:05 +0200 | minoru_shiraeesh | (~shiraeesh@109.166.57.223) |
| 2021-04-08 10:00:09 +0200 | aerona | (~aerona@2600:6c54:4600:f300:fe08:6f18:f4e0:33dc) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2021-04-08 10:00:49 +0200 | frozenErebus | (~frozenEre@37.231.244.249) |
| 2021-04-08 10:01:23 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@c-68-54-25-135.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 10:03:37 +0200 | cole-h | (~cole-h@c-73-48-197-220.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 10:06:46 +0200 | hendursaga | (~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga) |
| 2021-04-08 10:06:59 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@c-68-54-25-135.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 2021-04-08 10:09:09 +0200 | hendursa1 | (~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 10:09:21 +0200 | gitgood | (~gitgood@80-44-12-39.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) (Quit: Probably away to do something really awesome) |
| 2021-04-08 10:09:28 +0200 | louis41897 | (~textual@203.145.94.123) |
| 2021-04-08 10:11:41 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@c-68-54-25-135.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 10:13:07 +0200 | glaceon | (~glaceon@117.222.66.35) () |
| 2021-04-08 10:13:35 +0200 | stree | (~stree@68.36.8.116) (Quit: Caught exception) |
| 2021-04-08 10:14:00 +0200 | stree | (~stree@68.36.8.116) |
| 2021-04-08 10:14:05 +0200 | molehillish | (~molehilli@ip98-165-87-166.ph.ph.cox.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 10:20:38 +0200 | mananamenos | (~mananamen@62.red-88-11-67.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2021-04-08 10:21:21 +0200 | Narinas | (~Narinas@187-178-93-112.dynamic.axtel.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2021-04-08 10:22:04 +0200 | jpds | (~jpds@gateway/tor-sasl/jpds) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 10:22:40 +0200 | minoru_shiraeesh | (~shiraeesh@109.166.57.223) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 10:22:47 +0200 | Synthetica | (uid199651@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-tjgofyyagepnnbne) |
| 2021-04-08 10:23:47 +0200 | louis41897 | L0u1sChu |
| 2021-04-08 10:25:18 +0200 | minoru_shiraeesh | (~shiraeesh@109.166.57.223) |
| 2021-04-08 10:26:09 +0200 | minoru_shiraeesh | (~shiraeesh@109.166.57.223) (Client Quit) |
| 2021-04-08 10:26:18 +0200 | L0u1sChu | (~textual@203.145.94.123) ("Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com") |
| 2021-04-08 10:26:22 +0200 | L0u1sChu | (~textual@203.145.94.123) |
| 2021-04-08 10:26:23 +0200 | pjb | (~t@2a01cb04063ec50068b13f06583044a1.ipv6.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 10:26:23 +0200 | jpds | (~jpds@gateway/tor-sasl/jpds) |
| 2021-04-08 10:26:28 +0200 | minoru_shiraeesh | (~shiraeesh@109.166.57.223) |
| 2021-04-08 10:26:39 +0200 | Narinas | (~Narinas@187-178-93-112.dynamic.axtel.net) |
| 2021-04-08 10:28:14 +0200 | pjb | (~t@2a01cb04063ec500d887d9fd1a878571.ipv6.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 2021-04-08 10:28:37 +0200 | Narinas | (~Narinas@187-178-93-112.dynamic.axtel.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2021-04-08 10:33:04 +0200 | Narinas | (~Narinas@187-178-93-112.dynamic.axtel.net) |
| 2021-04-08 10:33:31 +0200 | Rudd0 | (~Rudd0@185.189.115.103) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 10:34:28 +0200 | thc202 | (~thc202@unaffiliated/thc202) |
| 2021-04-08 10:36:03 +0200 | minoru_shiraeesh | (~shiraeesh@109.166.57.223) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 10:36:33 +0200 | jacks2 | (~bc8134e3@217.29.117.252) |
| 2021-04-08 10:38:33 +0200 | frozenErebus | (~frozenEre@37.231.244.249) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 10:40:08 +0200 | minoru_shiraeesh | (~shiraeesh@109.166.57.223) |
| 2021-04-08 10:43:12 +0200 | minoru_shiraeesh | (~shiraeesh@109.166.57.223) (Client Quit) |
| 2021-04-08 10:43:28 +0200 | minoru_shiraeesh | (~shiraeesh@109.166.57.223) |
| 2021-04-08 10:45:16 +0200 | noCheese | (~nocheese@unaffiliated/nocheese) (Quit: I'm out!) |
| 2021-04-08 10:47:26 +0200 | kuribas | (~user@ip-188-118-57-242.reverse.destiny.be) |
| 2021-04-08 10:53:08 +0200 | LKoen | (~LKoen@65.250.88.92.rev.sfr.net) |
| 2021-04-08 10:53:18 +0200 | nut | (~user@roc37-h01-176-170-197-243.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 10:54:18 +0200 | coot | (~coot@37.30.55.131.nat.umts.dynamic.t-mobile.pl) |
| 2021-04-08 10:55:10 +0200 | arahael1 | Arahael |
| 2021-04-08 10:55:20 +0200 | noCheese | (~nocheese@gw2.aibor.de) |
| 2021-04-08 10:55:20 +0200 | noCheese | (~nocheese@gw2.aibor.de) (Changing host) |
| 2021-04-08 10:55:20 +0200 | noCheese | (~nocheese@unaffiliated/nocheese) |
| 2021-04-08 10:55:35 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) |
| 2021-04-08 10:55:43 +0200 | raehik | (~raehik@cpc95906-rdng25-2-0-cust156.15-3.cable.virginm.net) |
| 2021-04-08 10:55:57 +0200 | jpds | (~jpds@gateway/tor-sasl/jpds) (Remote host closed the connection) |
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| 2021-04-08 10:58:16 +0200 | lotuseater | (~user@p200300e7870616003c6015958754e9cf.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
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| 2021-04-08 13:53:21 +0200 | pfurla | (~pfurla@116.15.195.173.client.static.strong-in52.as13926.net) |
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| 2021-04-08 13:57:17 +0200 | dexterlb_ | (~dexterlb@2a01:9e40:2:2::2) |
| 2021-04-08 13:57:25 +0200 | minoru_shiraeesh | (~shiraeesh@109.166.57.223) (Client Quit) |
| 2021-04-08 13:57:29 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) |
| 2021-04-08 14:00:42 +0200 | <rann> | hi haskell peeps, quick question (very new to haskell). suppose I have a collection of handlers that take input and produce output. suppose that I want each handler in the collection (an ordered list) to call each other; how would you go about that in haskell? |
| 2021-04-08 14:00:47 +0200 | plutoniix | (~q@184.82.198.236) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2021-04-08 14:01:41 +0200 | Kronic | (sid480486@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-sohccpvegokjgbzc) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) |
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| 2021-04-08 14:02:26 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 14:03:26 +0200 | ukari | (~ukari@unaffiliated/ukari) |
| 2021-04-08 14:03:42 +0200 | <jacks2> | what is the type of the handler? |
| 2021-04-08 14:04:03 +0200 | nrh^ | (nrh@ip98-184-89-2.mc.at.cox.net) () |
| 2021-04-08 14:04:05 +0200 | <rann> | I haven't defined that yet, could esentially be a function |
| 2021-04-08 14:05:43 +0200 | <rann> | so, say [f1, f2, f3], then f1 calls f2, which in turn is triggered to call f3, (no different types of arguments, all string in, string out, which serves this example) |
| 2021-04-08 14:09:01 +0200 | nbloomf | (~nbloomf@2600:1700:ad14:3020:5145:4fc3:585b:3fa8) |
| 2021-04-08 14:09:15 +0200 | <jacks2> | > let handlers = [(++"!") . map toUpper] in foldr (.) (const "hello") handlers "" |
| 2021-04-08 14:09:17 +0200 | <lambdabot> | "HELLO!" |
| 2021-04-08 14:10:08 +0200 | geekosaur | (82650c7a@130.101.12.122) |
| 2021-04-08 14:13:11 +0200 | pfurla | (~pfurla@116.15.195.173.client.static.strong-in52.as13926.net) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 14:14:18 +0200 | <jacks2> | > let applyHandlers handlers s = foldr (.) (const s) handlers ""; in applyHandlers [(++"!") . map toUpper] "hello" |
| 2021-04-08 14:14:20 +0200 | <lambdabot> | "HELLO!" |
| 2021-04-08 14:15:00 +0200 | dsrt^ | (dsrt@ip98-184-89-2.mc.at.cox.net) |
| 2021-04-08 14:17:29 +0200 | <jacks2> | should have typed [(++"!"), map toUpper], ie, a list of two String -> String functions, but, it also worked with (.) :) |
| 2021-04-08 14:17:47 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) |
| 2021-04-08 14:18:03 +0200 | stef204 | (~stef204@unaffiliated/stef-204/x-384198) |
| 2021-04-08 14:18:36 +0200 | BosonCollider | (~olofs@90-227-86-119-no542.tbcn.telia.com) |
| 2021-04-08 14:18:45 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | I've been wondering |
| 2021-04-08 14:19:25 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | could you design something similar to ML functors but for typeclass implementations, if you view typeclasses like module signatures? |
| 2021-04-08 14:19:48 +0200 | <geekosaur> | backpack? |
| 2021-04-08 14:20:02 +0200 | frozenErebus | (~frozenEre@37.231.244.249) |
| 2021-04-08 14:20:35 +0200 | <geekosaur> | not quite the same thing but close |
| 2021-04-08 14:22:06 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | I don't really mean exactly implementing modules, but something like functorname : (quantifiers, typeclass constraints) -> Typeclass a b ... { body} |
| 2021-04-08 14:22:45 +0200 | waleee-cl | (uid373333@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-eacnnlwpubqgsxmt) |
| 2021-04-08 14:23:03 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | so that you can write a generic implementation of the typeclass on the right, and substitute in any specific type instead of implementing it by hand |
| 2021-04-08 14:23:37 +0200 | <geekosaur> | that's been done using Generics, yes |
| 2021-04-08 14:25:09 +0200 | <geekosaur> | or the way Foldable does it, just drop in a toList and the rest can be (un-optimally) generically implemented, or you can provide optimized versions |
| 2021-04-08 14:26:13 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | no, that's not what I mean |
| 2021-04-08 14:26:26 +0200 | Gurkenglas | (~Gurkengla@unaffiliated/gurkenglas) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 14:26:40 +0200 | nbloomf | (~nbloomf@2600:1700:ad14:3020:5145:4fc3:585b:3fa8) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
| 2021-04-08 14:26:59 +0200 | berberman | (~berberman@unaffiliated/berberman) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 14:27:04 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | because this would allow you to pick an implementation if you have conflicting generic implementations |
| 2021-04-08 14:27:07 +0200 | berberman_ | (~berberman@unaffiliated/berberman) |
| 2021-04-08 14:28:51 +0200 | <rann> | jacks2: thanks! |
| 2021-04-08 14:29:03 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | like for example, if I have a Heap typeclass and want to implement monofoldable for any type that implements Heap (foldable doesn't work here because of the Ord constraint, but that's a separate issue) |
| 2021-04-08 14:29:44 +0200 | kenanmarasli | (1fdf0dda@31.223.13.218) |
| 2021-04-08 14:31:53 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | then I can't implement monofoldable for all instances of heap for a number of reasons from conflicting implementations to orphan impls etc etc |
| 2021-04-08 14:32:53 +0200 | <kenanmarasli> | I don't know if this is a very noob question, but why is there an ambiguity problem with this code here? |
| 2021-04-08 14:32:54 +0200 | <kenanmarasli> | `sumList = foldl (\x y->x+y) 0 |
| 2021-04-08 14:32:54 +0200 | <kenanmarasli> | prodList = foldl (\x y->x*y) 1 |
| 2021-04-08 14:32:55 +0200 | <kenanmarasli> | main = print $ sumList [1,2,3]` |
| 2021-04-08 14:32:55 +0200 | <kenanmarasli> | Error: |
| 2021-04-08 14:32:56 +0200 | <kenanmarasli> | `689417354/source.hs:3:12: error: |
| 2021-04-08 14:32:56 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | but what this would do is allow someone to take an implementation I wrote and specify "this type uses this named implementation from X" |
| 2021-04-08 14:32:56 +0200 | <kenanmarasli> | • Ambiguous type variable ‘t0’ arising from a use of ‘foldl’ |
| 2021-04-08 14:32:57 +0200 | <kenanmarasli> | prevents the constraint ‘(Foldable t0)’ from being solved. |
| 2021-04-08 14:32:57 +0200 | <kenanmarasli> | Relevant bindings include |
| 2021-04-08 14:32:58 +0200 | <kenanmarasli> | prodList :: t0 Integer -> Integer |
| 2021-04-08 14:32:58 +0200 | <kenanmarasli> | (bound at 689417354/source.hs:3:1) |
| 2021-04-08 14:32:59 +0200 | <kenanmarasli> | Probable fix: use a type annotation to specify what ‘t0’ should be. |
| 2021-04-08 14:32:59 +0200 | <kenanmarasli> | These potential instances exist: |
| 2021-04-08 14:33:00 +0200 | <kenanmarasli> | instance Foldable (Either a) -- Defined in ‘Data.Foldable’ |
| 2021-04-08 14:33:00 +0200 | <kenanmarasli> | instance Foldable Maybe -- Defined in ‘Data.Foldable’ |
| 2021-04-08 14:33:01 +0200 | <kenanmarasli> | instance Foldable ((,) a) -- Defined in ‘Data.Foldable’ |
| 2021-04-08 14:33:01 +0200 | <kenanmarasli> | ...plus one other |
| 2021-04-08 14:33:02 +0200 | <kenanmarasli> | ...plus 22 instances involving out-of-scope types |
| 2021-04-08 14:33:15 +0200 | <kenanmarasli> | Ah damn it I thought it would markdown properly |
| 2021-04-08 14:33:57 +0200 | <geekosaur> | please don't paste into the channel |
| 2021-04-08 14:34:01 +0200 | <geekosaur> | @where paste |
| 2021-04-08 14:34:01 +0200 | <lambdabot> | Help us help you: please paste full code, input and/or output at e.g. https://paste.tomsmeding.com |
| 2021-04-08 14:34:15 +0200 | <kenanmarasli> | Alright, sorry about that |
| 2021-04-08 14:34:29 +0200 | <geekosaur> | anyway the usual cause of that is you need to specify that you want a list |
| 2021-04-08 14:35:01 +0200 | <geekosaur> | including the code that caused that error would help |
| 2021-04-08 14:35:34 +0200 | <rann> | jacks2: what does (++"!") do? |
| 2021-04-08 14:35:42 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | I also see this pop up in Rust a lot where a common pattern is writing a macro that implements a typeclass |
| 2021-04-08 14:35:48 +0200 | <rann> | just add the "!"? |
| 2021-04-08 14:35:52 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | or trait over there |
| 2021-04-08 14:35:56 +0200 | <geekosaur> | rann, it just appends the "!" |
| 2021-04-08 14:35:57 +0200 | <lortabac> | BosonCollider: I'm not 100% sure I understand, but it seems that DerivingVia can be used to achieve something similar |
| 2021-04-08 14:36:17 +0200 | <geekosaur> | it's a section on the (++) operator |
| 2021-04-08 14:36:42 +0200 | machinedgod | (~machinedg@135-23-192-217.cpe.pppoe.ca) |
| 2021-04-08 14:36:45 +0200 | <geekosaur> | (you can look up "haskell section operator" for full details, but it's basically partial application applied to an operator) |
| 2021-04-08 14:37:15 +0200 | <kenanmarasli> | geekosaur thank you sir. I have the code and error here: https://paste.tomsmeding.com/M5WXR9Im |
| 2021-04-08 14:37:49 +0200 | pfurla_ | (~pfurla@ool-182ed2e2.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 2021-04-08 14:39:23 +0200 | <kenanmarasli> | Here I don't understand why I need to specify that I want a list, when it works without the second function definition |
| 2021-04-08 14:39:26 +0200 | <geekosaur> | oh, this is the monomorphism restriction operating on prodList |
| 2021-04-08 14:39:36 +0200 | raichoo | (~raichoo@dslb-092-073-205-046.092.073.pools.vodafone-ip.de) (Quit: Lost terminal) |
| 2021-04-08 14:39:41 +0200 | <geekosaur> | it can guess for sumList because you apply it to a list later |
| 2021-04-08 14:39:51 +0200 | royal_screwup215 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) |
| 2021-04-08 14:40:15 +0200 | <geekosaur> | the root of the problem is that you don't specify parameters to either sumList or prodList, so it wants to monomorphize their types on the assumption that you want sharing to occur |
| 2021-04-08 14:40:30 +0200 | LKoen | (~LKoen@65.250.88.92.rev.sfr.net) |
| 2021-04-08 14:40:36 +0200 | <geekosaur> | so if you eta-expand them (prodList xs = ... xs) things will work |
| 2021-04-08 14:40:56 +0200 | <kenanmarasli> | I see, thank you very much :) |
| 2021-04-08 14:41:41 +0200 | <kenanmarasli> | Again, thank you for telling me how to share code here. Won't paste again :) |
| 2021-04-08 14:41:41 +0200 | star_cloud | (~star_clou@ec2-34-220-44-120.us-west-2.compute.amazonaws.com) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 14:42:38 +0200 | <geekosaur> | basically, without parameters it doesn't "look like a function" so it assumes you don't want it to behave like a function, but like a value. so make it look like a function. or you can specify the type with a type signature to tell it what you want to do instead of having it guess via the monomorphism restriction |
| 2021-04-08 14:43:31 +0200 | stree | (~stree@68.36.8.116) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 14:45:56 +0200 | <geekosaur> | this also won't happen in ghci because it can't see beyond the line you just threw at it, so it would monomorphize way too often; as such we turn off the monomorphism restriction in ghci by default |
| 2021-04-08 14:46:12 +0200 | mikoto-chan | (~anass@gateway/tor-sasl/mikoto-chan) |
| 2021-04-08 14:46:26 +0200 | star_cloud | (~star_clou@ec2-34-220-44-120.us-west-2.compute.amazonaws.com) |
| 2021-04-08 14:46:58 +0200 | v01d4lph4 | (~v01d4lph4@223.177.183.27) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 14:47:43 +0200 | <kenanmarasli> | Makes sense. In our lecture we use a compiler environment but I didn't know about monomorphism restriction before. I'll read more about it |
| 2021-04-08 14:47:52 +0200 | frozenErebus | (~frozenEre@37.231.244.249) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 14:50:32 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | lortabac: Ah, that just gets rid of newtypes afaik. I'm thinking more of something like: if I have a typeclass OkasakiHeap h that denotes a generic persistent heap, then there is a natural monofoldable definition for any instance of it |
| 2021-04-08 14:50:54 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) (Quit: Connection closed) |
| 2021-04-08 14:50:54 +0200 | royal_screwup215 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) (Quit: Connection closed) |
| 2021-04-08 14:51:01 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | which is basically equivalent to folding over a heapsorted list |
| 2021-04-08 14:51:19 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) |
| 2021-04-08 14:51:40 +0200 | <lortabac> | you can do that in plain Haskell |
| 2021-04-08 14:51:42 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | but I can't define a generic implementation of MonoFoldable h for all OkasakiHeap h |
| 2021-04-08 14:51:54 +0200 | kenanmarasli | (1fdf0dda@31.223.13.218) (Quit: Connection closed) |
| 2021-04-08 14:52:00 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | I have to define Monofoldable for all individual instances of OkasakiHeap |
| 2021-04-08 14:52:06 +0200 | zebrag | (~inkbottle@aaubervilliers-654-1-2-51.w83-200.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Quit: Konversation terminated!) |
| 2021-04-08 14:52:19 +0200 | <lortabac> | why? |
| 2021-04-08 14:52:26 +0200 | zebrag | (~inkbottle@aaubervilliers-654-1-2-51.w83-200.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 2021-04-08 14:52:30 +0200 | <olligobber> | yay https://gitlab.haskell.org/ghc/ghc/-/merge_requests/5495 |
| 2021-04-08 14:52:40 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | because typeclass bounds aren't subtyping |
| 2021-04-08 14:52:47 +0200 | <olligobber> | mpickering, nice work |
| 2021-04-08 14:53:32 +0200 | <lortabac> | BosonCollider: I think I don't understand, I'll let someone else answer |
| 2021-04-08 14:53:48 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | like, what do you do if a user implements your typeclass |
| 2021-04-08 14:53:58 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | on a foreign type that already implements monofoldable |
| 2021-04-08 14:54:28 +0200 | <geekosaur> | this sounds like instance Foo a => Bar a which overlaps everything |
| 2021-04-08 14:55:18 +0200 | cads2 | (~cads@ip-64-72-99-232.lasvegas.net) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 14:55:22 +0200 | <olligobber> | you could write some template haskell to automatically drive MonoFoldable from OkasakiHeap so it can be easily added and removed depending whether other instances exist |
| 2021-04-08 14:55:32 +0200 | fendor_ | (~fendor@178.115.129.223.wireless.dyn.drei.com) |
| 2021-04-08 14:55:58 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 14:56:07 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | right, to do it normally you inevitable end up with macros of some kind, which is usually an indication that you have a missing feature |
| 2021-04-08 14:56:47 +0200 | stree | (~stree@68.36.8.116) |
| 2021-04-08 14:57:01 +0200 | fendor | (~fendor@046125249018.public.t-mobile.at) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2021-04-08 14:57:28 +0200 | <olligobber> | yeah, I guess it would be nice to have a way to insert classes into the heirachy without either breaking stuff or manually considering each type... |
| 2021-04-08 14:57:59 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | so basically what I'm suggesting is something like NAMEDINSTANCE a : Foo a => Bar a |
| 2021-04-08 14:58:32 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | where the user can write NAMEDINSTANCE ConcreteType in their source file |
| 2021-04-08 14:58:38 +0200 | xlei | (znc@unaffiliated/xlei) |
| 2021-04-08 14:58:49 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) |
| 2021-04-08 14:58:55 +0200 | <olligobber> | right, a macro can do that |
| 2021-04-08 14:59:16 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | right, it's usually done with macros now, which is untyped |
| 2021-04-08 14:59:50 +0200 | <olligobber> | it will get type checked at some point though |
| 2021-04-08 15:00:00 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | I was thinking of how this would work as a first class feature |
| 2021-04-08 15:00:11 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | and then it sort of looks like a module functor |
| 2021-04-08 15:00:22 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | but where you view typeclasses as module signatures |
| 2021-04-08 15:00:54 +0200 | hyperisco | (~hyperisco@d192-186-117-226.static.comm.cgocable.net) |
| 2021-04-08 15:01:03 +0200 | <olligobber> | hmm, now you're tempting me to try and write a better class system... |
| 2021-04-08 15:01:29 +0200 | HannaM | (~quassel@p54849510.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 2021-04-08 15:01:30 +0200 | Chai-T-Rex | (~ChaiTRex@gateway/tor-sasl/chaitrex) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 15:02:02 +0200 | Chai-T-Rex | (~ChaiTRex@gateway/tor-sasl/chaitrex) |
| 2021-04-08 15:02:26 +0200 | <hyperisco> | olligobber, like socialism? |
| 2021-04-08 15:02:56 +0200 | <olligobber> | I'm also tempted to do that, but I'm better at maths and programming than economics and politics |
| 2021-04-08 15:03:19 +0200 | raehik1 | (~raehik@cpc95906-rdng25-2-0-cust156.15-3.cable.virginm.net) |
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| 2021-04-08 15:05:53 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | lol |
| 2021-04-08 15:06:21 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | anyway, I also noticed that in Rust which comes with syntax-rules macros out of the box, this like one of the top three most common uses |
| 2021-04-08 15:07:06 +0200 | v01d4lph4 | (~v01d4lph4@223.177.183.27) |
| 2021-04-08 15:07:48 +0200 | carlomagno | (~cararell@148.87.23.5) |
| 2021-04-08 15:08:21 +0200 | <BosonCollider> | though its syntax for generics is more boilerplate heavy than Haskells |
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| 2021-04-08 15:56:36 +0200 | _flow_ | flow |
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| 2021-04-08 16:22:29 +0200 | cr3 | (~cr3@192-222-143-195.qc.cable.ebox.net) |
| 2021-04-08 16:22:53 +0200 | royal_screwup217 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) (Quit: Connection closed) |
| 2021-04-08 16:22:54 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) (Quit: Connection closed) |
| 2021-04-08 16:23:16 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) |
| 2021-04-08 16:26:47 +0200 | raehik | (~raehik@cpc95906-rdng25-2-0-cust156.15-3.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 16:26:47 +0200 | geowiesnot | (~user@87-89-181-157.abo.bbox.fr) |
| 2021-04-08 16:27:41 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 16:28:56 +0200 | raehik | (~raehik@cpc95906-rdng25-2-0-cust156.15-3.cable.virginm.net) |
| 2021-04-08 16:32:44 +0200 | typetetris | (uid275937@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-mjjfisuvtdksxyob) |
| 2021-04-08 16:34:30 +0200 | ubert | (~Thunderbi@178.165.129.20.wireless.dyn.drei.com) |
| 2021-04-08 16:35:53 +0200 | dscho | (~dscho@178.239.168.171) |
| 2021-04-08 16:36:29 +0200 | gproto023 | (~gproto23@unaffiliated/gproto23) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2021-04-08 16:36:46 +0200 | gproto23 | (~gproto23@unaffiliated/gproto23) |
| 2021-04-08 16:37:23 +0200 | curlybangs | (185a6b4e@cpe-24-90-107-78.nyc.res.rr.com) |
| 2021-04-08 16:38:13 +0200 | jakalx | (~jakalx@base.jakalx.net) () |
| 2021-04-08 16:38:38 +0200 | BosonCollider | (~olofs@90-227-86-119-no542.tbcn.telia.com) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 16:40:58 +0200 | incertia | (~incertia@d4-50-26-103.nap.wideopenwest.com) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 16:41:11 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) |
| 2021-04-08 16:42:58 +0200 | raehik | (~raehik@cpc95906-rdng25-2-0-cust156.15-3.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 16:44:55 +0200 | <ixlun> | Hi all, just wondered if anyone knows when GHC 8.10.5 is scheduled for release? |
| 2021-04-08 16:45:15 +0200 | raehik | (~raehik@cpc95906-rdng25-2-0-cust156.15-3.cable.virginm.net) |
| 2021-04-08 16:45:58 +0200 | incertia | (~incertia@d4-50-26-103.nap.wideopenwest.com) |
| 2021-04-08 16:48:23 +0200 | __monty__ | (~toonn@unaffiliated/toonn) (Quit: leaving) |
| 2021-04-08 16:51:51 +0200 | nbloomf | (~nbloomf@2600:1700:ad14:3020:7dc6:188c:92ae:13ed) |
| 2021-04-08 16:52:06 +0200 | zebrag | (~inkbottle@aaubervilliers-654-1-2-51.w83-200.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Quit: Konversation terminated!) |
| 2021-04-08 16:52:26 +0200 | zebrag | (~inkbottle@aaubervilliers-654-1-2-51.w83-200.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 2021-04-08 16:52:35 +0200 | cfricke | (~cfricke@unaffiliated/cfricke) (Quit: WeeChat 3.1) |
| 2021-04-08 16:53:29 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) (Quit: Connection closed) |
| 2021-04-08 16:53:52 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) |
| 2021-04-08 16:53:52 +0200 | falafel | (~falafel@pool-96-255-70-50.washdc.fios.verizon.net) |
| 2021-04-08 16:54:53 +0200 | falafel | (~falafel@pool-96-255-70-50.washdc.fios.verizon.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 16:54:57 +0200 | Raito_Bezarius | (~Raito@unaffiliated/raito-bezarius/x-8764578) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 16:56:36 +0200 | nbloomf | (~nbloomf@2600:1700:ad14:3020:7dc6:188c:92ae:13ed) (Client Quit) |
| 2021-04-08 16:56:41 +0200 | Guest_22 | (54811c09@p54811c09.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 2021-04-08 16:58:16 +0200 | Guest_22 | (54811c09@p54811c09.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Client Quit) |
| 2021-04-08 16:58:34 +0200 | ulidtko|k | (~ulidtko@194.54.80.38) |
| 2021-04-08 16:58:37 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 16:58:59 +0200 | Raito_Bezarius | (~Raito@unaffiliated/raito-bezarius/x-8764578) |
| 2021-04-08 17:00:08 +0200 | <nut> | does <1,2,3> denote a vector? |
| 2021-04-08 17:00:18 +0200 | <nut> | like [1,2,3] a list |
| 2021-04-08 17:01:07 +0200 | ulidtko | (~ulidtko@31.133.98.215) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 17:01:12 +0200 | <c_wraith> | It denotes a syntax error in Haskell |
| 2021-04-08 17:01:23 +0200 | <c_wraith> | If you're seeing it used in a text, it's a meta-symbol |
| 2021-04-08 17:01:45 +0200 | <nut> | I am seeing it in the vector haddock |
| 2021-04-08 17:01:48 +0200 | BosonCollider | (~olofs@90-227-86-119-no542.tbcn.telia.com) |
| 2021-04-08 17:02:18 +0200 | <nut> | It would be wonderfuly useful if i could use it to easily denote a vector |
| 2021-04-08 17:03:32 +0200 | falafel | (~falafel@pool-96-255-70-50.washdc.fios.verizon.net) |
| 2021-04-08 17:04:41 +0200 | stree | (~stree@68.36.8.116) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 17:05:23 +0200 | xff0x | (~xff0x@2001:1a81:52e8:b700:3ebf:a81d:5544:d0a) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 17:06:10 +0200 | xff0x | (~xff0x@2001:1a81:52e8:b700:3001:b2c:785c:def8) |
| 2021-04-08 17:08:04 +0200 | solvr | (57e3c46d@87.227.196.109) |
| 2021-04-08 17:08:08 +0200 | Tuplanolla | (~Tuplanoll@91-159-68-239.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 2021-04-08 17:08:15 +0200 | Sheilong | (uid293653@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-bnpgsrhcqvxsgdns) |
| 2021-04-08 17:11:05 +0200 | maroloccio | (~marolocci@pousada3ja.mma.com.br) |
| 2021-04-08 17:13:08 +0200 | nek0 | (~nek0@mail.nek0.eu) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 17:13:31 +0200 | fendor_ | fendor |
| 2021-04-08 17:14:13 +0200 | <fendor> | Are there any other common command line interface parsers except for optparse-applicative? Just out of curiosity |
| 2021-04-08 17:14:43 +0200 | geowiesnot | (~user@87-89-181-157.abo.bbox.fr) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 17:17:10 +0200 | <maerwald> | yeah |
| 2021-04-08 17:17:28 +0200 | <maerwald> | https://hackage.haskell.org/package/cmdargs |
| 2021-04-08 17:17:54 +0200 | <maerwald> | sm[m] likes it, never used it myself |
| 2021-04-08 17:17:57 +0200 | LKoen | (~LKoen@65.250.88.92.rev.sfr.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 17:18:06 +0200 | stree | (~stree@68.36.8.116) |
| 2021-04-08 17:18:17 +0200 | arianvp_ | arianvp |
| 2021-04-08 17:18:46 +0200 | Sgeo_ | (~Sgeo@ool-18b98aa4.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 2021-04-08 17:19:52 +0200 | Sgeo_ | (~Sgeo@ool-18b98aa4.dyn.optonline.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2021-04-08 17:20:12 +0200 | Sgeo | (~Sgeo@ool-18b98aa4.dyn.optonline.net) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 17:20:30 +0200 | myShoggoth | (~myShoggot@75.164.73.93) |
| 2021-04-08 17:20:30 +0200 | <fendor> | thanks! |
| 2021-04-08 17:20:50 +0200 | Sgeo | (~Sgeo@ool-18b98aa4.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 2021-04-08 17:25:07 +0200 | kadobanana | (~mud@unaffiliated/kadoban) |
| 2021-04-08 17:25:13 +0200 | nek0 | (~nek0@mail.nek0.eu) |
| 2021-04-08 17:26:06 +0200 | heatsink | (~heatsink@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) |
| 2021-04-08 17:26:25 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@83-160-49-249.ip.xs4all.nl) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 17:26:53 +0200 | wrunt | (~ajc@vmx14030.hosting24.com.au) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 17:27:35 +0200 | heatsink | (~heatsink@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 17:27:51 +0200 | heatsink | (~heatsink@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) |
| 2021-04-08 17:29:03 +0200 | geowiesnot | (~user@i15-les02-ix2-87-89-181-157.sfr.lns.abo.bbox.fr) |
| 2021-04-08 17:29:43 +0200 | idhugo_ | (~idhugo@87-49-147-45-mobile.dk.customer.tdc.net) |
| 2021-04-08 17:30:59 +0200 | MindlessDrone | (~MindlessD@unaffiliated/mindlessdrone) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 17:31:00 +0200 | cub3s_ | (bifunc2@gateway/vpn/protonvpn/bifunc2) |
| 2021-04-08 17:31:07 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) |
| 2021-04-08 17:31:18 +0200 | <cub3s_> | Should library-only packages have nix-build ability? |
| 2021-04-08 17:31:28 +0200 | <cub3s_> | (Just wondering if that's just for packages with executables.) |
| 2021-04-08 17:33:11 +0200 | <maerwald> | cub3s_: there are tools to generate nix expressions, no? Just let ppl use those? |
| 2021-04-08 17:33:46 +0200 | ubert | (~Thunderbi@178.165.129.20.wireless.dyn.drei.com) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 17:35:19 +0200 | anandprabhu | (~anand@94.203.250.121) |
| 2021-04-08 17:35:28 +0200 | jakalx | (~jakalx@base.jakalx.net) |
| 2021-04-08 17:35:47 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 17:39:27 +0200 | geowiesnot | (~user@i15-les02-ix2-87-89-181-157.sfr.lns.abo.bbox.fr) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 17:41:52 +0200 | nut | (~user@roc37-h01-176-170-197-243.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 17:43:33 +0200 | howdoi | (uid224@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jeralxygfnojiedm) |
| 2021-04-08 17:45:16 +0200 | <dcbdan> | 3 |
| 2021-04-08 17:45:27 +0200 | <Zemyla> | > 3 |
| 2021-04-08 17:45:29 +0200 | <lambdabot> | 3 |
| 2021-04-08 17:45:57 +0200 | aishstha | (1b221163@27.34.17.99) |
| 2021-04-08 17:45:58 +0200 | aishstha | (1b221163@27.34.17.99) (Client Quit) |
| 2021-04-08 17:46:51 +0200 | Sorny | (~Sornaensi@077213203030.dynamic.telenor.dk) |
| 2021-04-08 17:48:50 +0200 | LKoen | (~LKoen@65.250.88.92.rev.sfr.net) |
| 2021-04-08 17:49:23 +0200 | ixlun | (~matthew@213.205.241.25) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2021-04-08 17:50:41 +0200 | Sorna | (~Sornaensi@79.142.232.102.static.router4.bolignet.dk) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 17:50:43 +0200 | jjhoo | (jahakala@dsl-trebng21-b048b5-171.dhcp.inet.fi) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 17:52:05 +0200 | zebrag | (~inkbottle@aaubervilliers-654-1-2-51.w83-200.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2021-04-08 17:52:26 +0200 | zebrag | (~inkbottle@aaubervilliers-654-1-2-51.w83-200.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 2021-04-08 17:52:44 +0200 | coot | (~coot@37.30.55.131.nat.umts.dynamic.t-mobile.pl) (Quit: coot) |
| 2021-04-08 17:55:25 +0200 | jpds | (~jpds@gateway/tor-sasl/jpds) (Quit: WeeChat 3.1) |
| 2021-04-08 17:55:31 +0200 | tzh | (~tzh@c-24-21-73-154.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 2021-04-08 17:56:35 +0200 | deviantfero | (~deviantfe@190.150.27.58) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 17:56:46 +0200 | frozenErebus | (~frozenEre@37.231.244.249) |
| 2021-04-08 17:57:05 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@c-68-54-25-135.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 2021-04-08 17:57:48 +0200 | geekosaur | (82650c7a@130.101.12.122) |
| 2021-04-08 17:58:43 +0200 | deviantfero | (~deviantfe@190.150.27.58) |
| 2021-04-08 17:59:09 +0200 | dexterlb | (~dexterlb@2a01:9e40:2:2::2) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 17:59:19 +0200 | alx741 | (~alx741@181.196.68.139) |
| 2021-04-08 17:59:22 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@83-160-49-249.ip.xs4all.nl) |
| 2021-04-08 17:59:31 +0200 | ericsagn1 | (~ericsagne@2405:6580:0:5100:7cd7:690c:dd62:864c) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 18:00:06 +0200 | rust-rocks[m] | (rust-rocks@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-ztvyhrreyiyrdiaw) (Quit: Idle for 30+ days) |
| 2021-04-08 18:00:23 +0200 | dexterlb | (~dexterlb@2a01:9e40:2:2::2) |
| 2021-04-08 18:01:45 +0200 | ep1ctetus | (~epictetus@ip72-194-215-136.sb.sd.cox.net) |
| 2021-04-08 18:01:50 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@c-68-54-25-135.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 18:02:55 +0200 | <maerwald> | <3 |
| 2021-04-08 18:03:32 +0200 | <cub3s_> | maerwald, only such tool i've seen is haskell.nix.. |
| 2021-04-08 18:03:43 +0200 | <maerwald> | cabal2nix? |
| 2021-04-08 18:04:17 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@83-160-49-249.ip.xs4all.nl) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 18:04:30 +0200 | heatsink | (~heatsink@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 18:04:47 +0200 | heatsink | (~heatsink@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) |
| 2021-04-08 18:09:26 +0200 | ddellacosta | (~ddellacos@ool-44c73afa.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 2021-04-08 18:09:58 +0200 | falafel | (~falafel@pool-96-255-70-50.washdc.fios.verizon.net) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 18:11:31 +0200 | ericsagn1 | (~ericsagne@2405:6580:0:5100:ea09:d4ec:d157:6a0d) |
| 2021-04-08 18:11:46 +0200 | myShoggoth | (~myShoggot@75.164.73.93) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 18:12:01 +0200 | anandprabhu | (~anand@94.203.250.121) (Quit: Konversation terminated!) |
| 2021-04-08 18:12:28 +0200 | myShoggoth | (~myShoggot@75.164.73.93) |
| 2021-04-08 18:12:51 +0200 | hexfive | (~hexfive@50.35.83.177) |
| 2021-04-08 18:13:21 +0200 | Deide | (~Deide@217.155.19.23) |
| 2021-04-08 18:13:56 +0200 | hexfive | (~hexfive@50.35.83.177) (Client Quit) |
| 2021-04-08 18:13:58 +0200 | elfets | (~elfets@ip-37-201-23-96.hsi13.unitymediagroup.de) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 18:14:32 +0200 | anandprabhu | (~anand@94.203.250.121) |
| 2021-04-08 18:14:45 +0200 | heatsink | (~heatsink@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 18:16:22 +0200 | curlybangs | (185a6b4e@cpe-24-90-107-78.nyc.res.rr.com) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 18:17:25 +0200 | <sm[m]> | fendor: let us know how it goes |
| 2021-04-08 18:17:42 +0200 | nbloomf | (~nbloomf@2600:1700:ad14:3020:cd1d:54ca:e159:c5c5) |
| 2021-04-08 18:17:42 +0200 | fmlatghor | (~lcoogan@2601:5cd:8100:2890:9220:3aff:fe1a:350d) |
| 2021-04-08 18:17:52 +0200 | jjhoo | (jahakala@dsl-trebng21-b048b5-171.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 2021-04-08 18:17:53 +0200 | fmlatghor | (~lcoogan@2601:5cd:8100:2890:9220:3aff:fe1a:350d) ("WeeChat 3.0.1") |
| 2021-04-08 18:18:11 +0200 | eacameron | (uid256985@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-dcmuyvkojmhnusok) |
| 2021-04-08 18:18:28 +0200 | <dmj`> | cub3s_: any haskell package can be built with nix |
| 2021-04-08 18:18:43 +0200 | nbloomf | (~nbloomf@2600:1700:ad14:3020:cd1d:54ca:e159:c5c5) (Client Quit) |
| 2021-04-08 18:18:50 +0200 | graf_blutwurst | (~user@2001:171b:226e:adc0:7435:21b3:df2a:1469) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 18:19:03 +0200 | <dmj`> | cub3s_: nix uses a Setup.hs script, not cabal nor stack. Just Cabal. |
| 2021-04-08 18:19:21 +0200 | Ariakenom | (~Ariakenom@2001:9b1:efb:fc00:c8d4:3b14:f195:e30f) |
| 2021-04-08 18:22:45 +0200 | <cub3s_> | dmj`, maerwald, well it seems to me that cabal2nix just converts a .cabal file into a .nix file. But the *surrounding stuff* (for nix-shell and nix-build) people seem to disagree on. |
| 2021-04-08 18:22:48 +0200 | <cub3s_> | Quoting https://github.com/cdepillabout/post-about-nix-and-haskell/blob/master/2019-08-03-q-and-as-about-n… : "I recommend disregarding the advice from both the haskell-nix walk-through and the nixpkgs manual. Instead, you should setup your repos similar to how the example repo is structured." |
| 2021-04-08 18:24:04 +0200 | ambiso99211 | (~ambiso@209.182.239.205) (Quit: Ping timeout (120 seconds)) |
| 2021-04-08 18:24:35 +0200 | ambiso99211 | (~ambiso@209.182.239.205) |
| 2021-04-08 18:25:08 +0200 | <dmj`> | cub3s_: you can just use vanilla nixpkgs, you don't need haskell.nix, that's moreso what I use |
| 2021-04-08 18:25:22 +0200 | gitgood | (~gitgood@80-44-12-39.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 2021-04-08 18:25:32 +0200 | <dmj`> | cub3s_: echo "(import ./default.nix {}).env" > nix |
| 2021-04-08 18:25:38 +0200 | <dmj`> | cub3s_: nix-shell --run 'ghc-pkg list' |
| 2021-04-08 18:26:21 +0200 | <dmj`> | cub3s_: I put this in my .zshrc and just call `dn` when I hop into new projects |
| 2021-04-08 18:26:26 +0200 | <dmj`> | cub3s_: function dn () { echo "{ pkgs ? import <nixpkgs> {} }: pkgs.haskellPackages.callCabal2nix \"$(basename $PWD)\" ./. {}" > default.nix } |
| 2021-04-08 18:26:32 +0200 | <dmj`> | cub3s_: then you can just call "nix-build" |
| 2021-04-08 18:26:47 +0200 | nbloomf | (~nbloomf@2600:1700:ad14:3020:dad:d126:3eb2:c0dc) |
| 2021-04-08 18:26:48 +0200 | <dmj`> | echo "(import ./default.nix {}).env" > shell.nix, rather |
| 2021-04-08 18:27:03 +0200 | nbloomf | (~nbloomf@2600:1700:ad14:3020:dad:d126:3eb2:c0dc) (Client Quit) |
| 2021-04-08 18:29:02 +0200 | anandprabhu | (~anand@94.203.250.121) (Quit: Konversation terminated!) |
| 2021-04-08 18:29:33 +0200 | nbloomf | (~nbloomf@2600:1700:ad14:3020:dad:d126:3eb2:c0dc) |
| 2021-04-08 18:29:42 +0200 | deviantfero | (~deviantfe@190.150.27.58) (Quit: WeeChat 3.1) |
| 2021-04-08 18:30:05 +0200 | deviantfero | (~deviantfe@190.150.27.58) |
| 2021-04-08 18:30:49 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@c-68-54-25-135.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 2021-04-08 18:31:10 +0200 | maroloccio | (~marolocci@pousada3ja.mma.com.br) (Quit: WeeChat 2.3) |
| 2021-04-08 18:34:32 +0200 | nbloomf | (~nbloomf@2600:1700:ad14:3020:dad:d126:3eb2:c0dc) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
| 2021-04-08 18:35:07 +0200 | coot | (~coot@37.30.55.131.nat.umts.dynamic.t-mobile.pl) |
| 2021-04-08 18:35:33 +0200 | maroloccio | (~marolocci@pousada3ja.mma.com.br) |
| 2021-04-08 18:35:58 +0200 | hypercube | (hypercube@gateway/vpn/protonvpn/hypercube) |
| 2021-04-08 18:38:09 +0200 | incertia | (~incertia@d4-50-26-103.nap.wideopenwest.com) (Quit: ZNC 1.7.5 - https://znc.in) |
| 2021-04-08 18:38:53 +0200 | __minoru__shirae | (~shiraeesh@109.166.57.223) |
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| 2021-04-08 18:40:40 +0200 | v01d4lph4 | (~v01d4lph4@223.177.183.27) (Remote host closed the connection) |
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| 2021-04-08 19:00:07 +0200 | hypercube | (hypercube@gateway/vpn/protonvpn/hypercube) (Client Quit) |
| 2021-04-08 19:00:11 +0200 | ChanServ | +o monochrom |
| 2021-04-08 19:00:14 +0200 | fiedlr | (~fiedlr@83.148.33.254) |
| 2021-04-08 19:00:26 +0200 | hypercube | (hypercube@gateway/vpn/protonvpn/hypercube) |
| 2021-04-08 19:00:30 +0200 | monochrom | +b-bo $a:perdent *!*@192.145.118.58 monochrom |
| 2021-04-08 19:00:44 +0200 | kritzefitz | (~kritzefit@212.86.56.80) |
| 2021-04-08 19:01:09 +0200 | hendursaga | (~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 19:02:28 +0200 | <solvr> | "Functional programming is to turn on the light, you need to rebuild your house" |
| 2021-04-08 19:02:40 +0200 | <solvr> | How to avoid this |
| 2021-04-08 19:02:47 +0200 | fiedlr_ | (~fiedlr@83.148.33.254) |
| 2021-04-08 19:03:20 +0200 | <[exa]> | solvr: why'd rebuild? |
| 2021-04-08 19:03:31 +0200 | <solvr> | Because it's immutable, duh :P |
| 2021-04-08 19:03:35 +0200 | fiedlr | (~fiedlr@83.148.33.254) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2021-04-08 19:03:37 +0200 | <dolio> | Stop reading blog posts. |
| 2021-04-08 19:03:42 +0200 | <[exa]> | +1 ^ |
| 2021-04-08 19:03:48 +0200 | <monochrom> | Any objection if I ban? |
| 2021-04-08 19:04:03 +0200 | <solvr> | Rly? |
| 2021-04-08 19:04:32 +0200 | <monochrom> | They were at this at length just a couple of days ago. |
| 2021-04-08 19:05:11 +0200 | <solvr> | Can you remind me? |
| 2021-04-08 19:05:14 +0200 | <[exa]> | what's the blog post though |
| 2021-04-08 19:06:27 +0200 | fiedlr_ | (~fiedlr@83.148.33.254) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 19:06:46 +0200 | fiedlr | (~fiedlr@83.148.33.254) |
| 2021-04-08 19:06:58 +0200 | ChanServ | +o monochrom |
| 2021-04-08 19:07:07 +0200 | monochrom | +b $a:solvr |
| 2021-04-08 19:07:09 +0200 | <sm[m]> | monochrom: yes, please try to minimise banning |
| 2021-04-08 19:07:20 +0200 | <geekosaur> | if this is who I think it is they were reading snoyberg's "the bad parts" and taking it as gospel |
| 2021-04-08 19:07:26 +0200 | <geekosaur> | and "how do I avoid all of this" |
| 2021-04-08 19:07:35 +0200 | <monochrom> | OK fine, your poison. |
| 2021-04-08 19:07:42 +0200 | monochrom | -b $a:solvr |
| 2021-04-08 19:07:47 +0200 | monochrom | -o monochrom |
| 2021-04-08 19:08:00 +0200 | heatsink | (~heatsink@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 19:09:09 +0200 | lykke | (05ba7881@5.186.120.129.cgn.fibianet.dk) |
| 2021-04-08 19:09:17 +0200 | <[exa]> | whew, that was a heated discussion I guess |
| 2021-04-08 19:10:31 +0200 | <sm[m]> | how close are we to the ecosystem being ghc 9.0 ready, do you think |
| 2021-04-08 19:11:19 +0200 | <sm[m]> | I feel there should be some threshold at which to declare victory |
| 2021-04-08 19:12:26 +0200 | <sm[m]> | eg when ghc 9 appears in stackage nightly ? but last time, stackage nightly seemed really slow |
| 2021-04-08 19:12:37 +0200 | <monochrom> | I usually take a look at "ghcup list" and whichever one it says "recommended" is ready. |
| 2021-04-08 19:13:24 +0200 | <sm[m]> | when does that happen, maerwald ? |
| 2021-04-08 19:14:50 +0200 | <sm[m]> | I saw a haskell foundation proposal about tweaking GHC preview releases and encouraging packages to update promptly, but couldn't find it again |
| 2021-04-08 19:15:08 +0200 | aerona | (~aerona@2600:6c54:4600:f300:5cd6:f603:caf:6cd0) |
| 2021-04-08 19:15:13 +0200 | m0rphism | (~m0rphism@HSI-KBW-085-216-104-059.hsi.kabelbw.de) |
| 2021-04-08 19:15:23 +0200 | <sm[m]> | ok, google is my friend. https://discourse.haskell.org/t/ghc-proposal-ghc-maintainer-previews/2309 |
| 2021-04-08 19:16:37 +0200 | <monochrom> | geekosaur: I think the good-part-bad-part person was different, shalokshalom |
| 2021-04-08 19:16:40 +0200 | Gurkenglas | (~Gurkengla@unaffiliated/gurkenglas) |
| 2021-04-08 19:17:22 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) |
| 2021-04-08 19:19:14 +0200 | <maerwald> | sm[m]: we look at a) are there outstanding serious bugs, b) how far is ecosystem adoption, c) is there a stackage version |
| 2021-04-08 19:19:30 +0200 | <maerwald> | for 9.0 there are still bugs |
| 2021-04-08 19:21:13 +0200 | curlybangs | (185a6b4e@cpe-24-90-107-78.nyc.res.rr.com) |
| 2021-04-08 19:21:59 +0200 | <sm[m]> | maerwald: I see.. good things to consider |
| 2021-04-08 19:22:02 +0200 | <cub3s_> | dmj`, interesting. so from that point of you, seems like you prefer haskell projects without any .nix files already in it |
| 2021-04-08 19:22:15 +0200 | <cub3s_> | dmj`, for otherwise you have to merge your stuff into existing stuff |
| 2021-04-08 19:22:22 +0200 | <sm[m]> | and I guess "is there a stackage version" depends on the other two |
| 2021-04-08 19:22:37 +0200 | <geekosaur> | so does the ecosystem, for that matter |
| 2021-04-08 19:23:44 +0200 | <sm[m]> | I like cdsmith's idea at https://github.com/ghc-proposals/ghc-proposals/pull/417 of notifying maintainers when their package is blocking the ecosystem |
| 2021-04-08 19:23:59 +0200 | <sm[m]> | ie, all your deps build with new ghc but you don't |
| 2021-04-08 19:24:17 +0200 | justanotheruser | (~justanoth@unaffiliated/justanotheruser) |
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| 2021-04-08 19:42:53 +0200 | vicfred | (~vicfred@unaffiliated/vicfred) |
| 2021-04-08 19:43:20 +0200 | <dmj`> | cub3s_: doesn't matter, you can choose to ignore the existing nix files in a project, or if its something hairy like building GHC itself (which really sucks), or building llvm, its nice to use pre-existing nix files |
| 2021-04-08 19:44:55 +0200 | vicfred_ | (~vicfred@unaffiliated/vicfred) |
| 2021-04-08 19:45:07 +0200 | gproto023 | (~gproto23@unaffiliated/gproto23) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 19:45:17 +0200 | <dmj`> | cub3s_: if your project is just haskell you can use stack + docker, but if it uses third party deps, or you want to build and deploy projects in multiple languages nix is where its at |
| 2021-04-08 19:45:24 +0200 | rajivr | (uid269651@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jvyqvcvcmixmgtiu) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) |
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| 2021-04-08 19:52:05 +0200 | zebrag | (~inkbottle@aaubervilliers-654-1-2-51.w83-200.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Quit: Konversation terminated!) |
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| 2021-04-08 19:57:22 +0200 | geekosaur | (82650c7a@130.101.12.122) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
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| 2021-04-08 20:00:17 +0200 | mkDoku | (~TheMule@aftr-37-201-195-134.unity-media.net) |
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| 2021-04-08 20:01:42 +0200 | ixlun | (~matthew@213.205.241.25) |
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| 2021-04-08 20:04:56 +0200 | <maerwald> | sm[m]: I think the only way to achieve swifter ecosystem migrations is to incorporate a bug tracker on hackage |
| 2021-04-08 20:05:43 +0200 | viluon | (uid453725@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ocirbhfxzaypqcdp) |
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| 2021-04-08 20:08:14 +0200 | puke | (~vroom@217.138.252.196) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 20:08:34 +0200 | puke | (~vroom@217.138.252.196) |
| 2021-04-08 20:08:47 +0200 | rond_ | (59402191@89-64-33-145.dynamic.chello.pl) |
| 2021-04-08 20:08:51 +0200 | haskellstudent | (~quassel@213-225-9-45.nat.highway.a1.net) |
| 2021-04-08 20:09:21 +0200 | <sm[m]> | homebrew seems quite good at this |
| 2021-04-08 20:10:09 +0200 | <sm[m]> | often before I get to update my formula there, random brew maintainers have already done it |
| 2021-04-08 20:14:06 +0200 | <maerwald> | distros usually have a stronger identity component (e.g. NixOS), while language ecosystem often drift apart |
| 2021-04-08 20:14:57 +0200 | <maerwald> | so to compensate for that drift, you need a platform that is minimal in annoyance and has low entry barrier in coordinating issues |
| 2021-04-08 20:15:04 +0200 | p3n_ | (~p3n@2a00:19a0:3:7c:0:d9c6:7cf6:1) (Quit: ZNC 1.8.2 - https://znc.in) |
| 2021-04-08 20:15:06 +0200 | kritzefitz | (~kritzefit@212.86.56.80) |
| 2021-04-08 20:15:08 +0200 | <maerwald> | hackage is not that |
| 2021-04-08 20:15:14 +0200 | p3n | (~p3n@2a00:19a0:3:7c:0:d9c6:7cf6:1) |
| 2021-04-08 20:15:55 +0200 | geekosaur | (82650c7a@130.101.12.122) |
| 2021-04-08 20:16:06 +0200 | merijn | (~merijn@83-160-49-249.ip.xs4all.nl) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 20:17:40 +0200 | nilof | (~olofs@90-227-86-119-no542.tbcn.telia.com) |
| 2021-04-08 20:18:27 +0200 | star_cloud | (~star_clou@ec2-34-220-44-120.us-west-2.compute.amazonaws.com) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 20:18:30 +0200 | <sm[m]> | maerwald: how about an etherpad page |
| 2021-04-08 20:18:54 +0200 | <maerwald> | not sure that's the right tool |
| 2021-04-08 20:18:58 +0200 | <sm[m]> | I'm only half joking, it would probably help a lot |
| 2021-04-08 20:19:10 +0200 | <maerwald> | I'm actually thinking about something really boring, like bugzilla |
| 2021-04-08 20:19:26 +0200 | <sm[m]> | plus a team of migrators to file issues etc./ |
| 2021-04-08 20:19:36 +0200 | <sm[m]> | oh god not bugzilla |
| 2021-04-08 20:19:48 +0200 | incertia | (~incertia@d4-50-26-103.nap.wideopenwest.com) |
| 2021-04-08 20:20:15 +0200 | <maerwald> | it should be something boring |
| 2021-04-08 20:20:26 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) |
| 2021-04-08 20:20:26 +0200 | <sm[m]> | I would say github issues, but I know that stops progress right there |
| 2021-04-08 20:20:26 +0200 | BosonCollider | (~olofs@90-227-86-119-no542.tbcn.telia.com) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 20:20:34 +0200 | <maerwald> | no, github is proprietary |
| 2021-04-08 20:20:37 +0200 | jjhoo | (jahakala@dsl-trebng21-b048b5-171.dhcp.inet.fi) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 20:20:43 +0200 | <maerwald> | and many ppl don't host their project even there |
| 2021-04-08 20:20:44 +0200 | <sm[m]> | gitlab! github! ... |
| 2021-04-08 20:20:56 +0200 | <maerwald> | ppl already have hackage credentials |
| 2021-04-08 20:21:07 +0200 | <maerwald> | those same credentials have to work for the issue tracker |
| 2021-04-08 20:21:14 +0200 | <maerwald> | no additional steps |
| 2021-04-08 20:21:19 +0200 | <sm[m]> | sure, but hackage doesn't have this tool and it's a big job to build it |
| 2021-04-08 20:21:48 +0200 | <maerwald> | how hard can that be... |
| 2021-04-08 20:21:48 +0200 | <sm[m]> | it's possible to do this with low tech solutions too |
| 2021-04-08 20:22:05 +0200 | <sm[m]> | should be easy right ?! |
| 2021-04-08 20:22:13 +0200 | mctpyt | (~mctpyt@unaffiliated/mctpyt) (Quit: WeeChat 3.1) |
| 2021-04-08 20:22:17 +0200 | <maerwald> | yeah, simple backend :) |
| 2021-04-08 20:23:49 +0200 | <sm[m]> | we could ask a php dev for help. We'd be up and running in a day :) |
| 2021-04-08 20:24:05 +0200 | lykke | (05ba7881@5.186.120.129.cgn.fibianet.dk) (Quit: Connection closed) |
| 2021-04-08 20:24:27 +0200 | <monochrom> | That would make headline news. |
| 2021-04-08 20:24:43 +0200 | <sm[m]> | yup, we'd get on HN front page |
| 2021-04-08 20:24:59 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 20:25:07 +0200 | <sm[m]> | and it would work, but it would require us to be rather humble |
| 2021-04-08 20:25:36 +0200 | <sm[m]> | it would actually be a marketing masterstoke I think |
| 2021-04-08 20:25:45 +0200 | <xerox_> | what does $mWNode.\ here https://pastebin.com/raw/TYJ0VDPg correspond to in here https://github.com/antalsz/urn-random/blob/master/src/Data/Urn/Internal.hs ? |
| 2021-04-08 20:25:50 +0200 | <xerox_> | is it the pattern synonym? |
| 2021-04-08 20:28:31 +0200 | nbloomf | (~nbloomf@2600:1700:ad14:3020:4552:1533:b307:c3a6) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
| 2021-04-08 20:29:07 +0200 | <monochrom> | I heard yesterday that \ refers to lambdas. In your case, the pattern defines a function too, that would be the lambda. |
| 2021-04-08 20:30:06 +0200 | <xerox_> | how lucky, just yesterday! |
| 2021-04-08 20:30:26 +0200 | <sm[m]> | maerwald, just curious, would you still not make use of github for haskell infrastructure if we had nightly data backups and a way for importing that elsewhere when necessary ? (per sclv) |
| 2021-04-08 20:30:56 +0200 | <maerwald> | sm[m]: why do you thinkg ghc is on its own gitlab? |
| 2021-04-08 20:31:18 +0200 | jpds | (~jpds@gateway/tor-sasl/jpds) |
| 2021-04-08 20:31:27 +0200 | <monochrom> | Plot twist: they go to gitlab, and use github for backup >:) |
| 2021-04-08 20:32:41 +0200 | danso | (~dan@23-233-111-52.cpe.pppoe.ca) |
| 2021-04-08 20:32:48 +0200 | <sclv> | the trustees repo is used to track migration issues already fwiw |
| 2021-04-08 20:33:43 +0200 | <maerwald> | yeah, most ppl have never heard of it and 98% of maintainers aren't notified :) |
| 2021-04-08 20:34:03 +0200 | <maerwald> | so it's a group of a few ppl manually writing patches and sending emails etc |
| 2021-04-08 20:34:08 +0200 | <sclv> | it certainly lacks automation! |
| 2021-04-08 20:34:16 +0200 | <maerwald> | that doesn't scale well, which is why I said hackage needs a bug tracker |
| 2021-04-08 20:34:18 +0200 | <sclv> | building on matrix would be a way to improve this |
| 2021-04-08 20:34:19 +0200 | <maerwald> | that is the automation |
| 2021-04-08 20:34:34 +0200 | <sclv> | ok what is the difference between a hackage bugtracker and the existing tracker? |
| 2021-04-08 20:34:38 +0200 | <sclv> | just moar links from hackage? |
| 2021-04-08 20:34:58 +0200 | <maerwald> | sclv: 1) not proprietary, 2) better integrated with hackage, 3) no additional login credentials |
| 2021-04-08 20:35:11 +0200 | <sm[m]> | matrix eh.. is matrix a separate codebase from hackage ? easier to deploy changes to perhaps ? |
| 2021-04-08 20:35:22 +0200 | <sclv> | matrix is for the automation |
| 2021-04-08 20:35:34 +0200 | <sclv> | i.e. sending notifications and perhaps creating issues |
| 2021-04-08 20:35:50 +0200 | <sclv> | i agree not prop would be nice, the "integrated" thing is really a links question, easy to solve |
| 2021-04-08 20:35:55 +0200 | jjhoo | (jahakala@dsl-trebng21-b048b5-171.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 2021-04-08 20:36:00 +0200 | <sclv> | the creds i care less about tbqh |
| 2021-04-08 20:36:00 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) |
| 2021-04-08 20:36:15 +0200 | hendursaga | (~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga) |
| 2021-04-08 20:37:46 +0200 | <sclv> | btw sm[m] git-annex doesn't let you "import that elsewhere" nicely afaik? it would be great if it did! |
| 2021-04-08 20:37:55 +0200 | <sclv> | it just ensures you have the data, which is in itself worthwhile |
| 2021-04-08 20:39:06 +0200 | <sm[m]> | sclv: yes, actually recreating it as a working tools would be a big job. Not yet easy at all |
| 2021-04-08 20:39:43 +0200 | <sm[m]> | hopefully before too long this kind of data will have a standard schema and multiple apps to load it into |
| 2021-04-08 20:40:08 +0200 | <sclv> | i think that'll require more competition than i see existing anytime soon |
| 2021-04-08 20:40:13 +0200 | <sclv> | laziness and lock-in are strong forces |
| 2021-04-08 20:40:16 +0200 | <sm[m]> | though I guess that probably won;t happen until github screws up.. right |
| 2021-04-08 20:40:38 +0200 | <sclv> | right, lol was going to say the same thing. M$ giving people a scare would really inject some urgency |
| 2021-04-08 20:40:42 +0200 | ezzieyguywuf | (~Unknown@unaffiliated/ezzieyguywuf) |
| 2021-04-08 20:40:47 +0200 | <maerwald> | github is just a source code mirror |
| 2021-04-08 20:41:37 +0200 | <maerwald> | real haskellers use darcsden :p |
| 2021-04-08 20:42:11 +0200 | <sm[m]> | darcs hub! darcsden is old hat :) |
| 2021-04-08 20:43:40 +0200 | <sm[m]> | darcsweb.cgi -> patch-tag.com -> darcsden.com -> hub.darcs.net |
| 2021-04-08 20:43:48 +0200 | m0rphism | (~m0rphism@HSI-KBW-085-216-104-059.hsi.kabelbw.de) (Quit: WeeChat 2.9) |
| 2021-04-08 20:43:55 +0200 | <maerwald> | I think the two main reasons for the success of github etc are: 1. free CI and 2. UI usability. Beating the UI usability is really hard |
| 2021-04-08 20:44:21 +0200 | <sm[m]> | the CI is great, but just a recent addition |
| 2021-04-08 20:44:34 +0200 | <sm[m]> | UI usability and network effect I'd say |
| 2021-04-08 20:45:21 +0200 | <sclv> | out of the box, git leaves a lot to be desired. you really need some gui chrome to make it a nice workflow |
| 2021-04-08 20:46:11 +0200 | aerona | (~aerona@2600:6c54:4600:f300:ec35:c665:ee7f:e84a) |
| 2021-04-08 20:46:16 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) (Quit: Connection closed) |
| 2021-04-08 20:46:31 +0200 | <sm[m]> | agreed. It first became usable/useful to me when I gathered a few decent command aliases in .gitconfig (then magit, IDEs etc.) |
| 2021-04-08 20:47:00 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) |
| 2021-04-08 20:47:35 +0200 | <maerwald> | I only use tig |
| 2021-04-08 20:48:11 +0200 | <sclv> | i think its as simple as the fact that the whole "PR" concept is fundamental to modern workflows, and doesn't exist natively in git proper at all |
| 2021-04-08 20:48:56 +0200 | <sm[m]> | some say PRs are bad. I forget what the alternative is |
| 2021-04-08 20:49:10 +0200 | <maerwald> | sm[m]: patches |
| 2021-04-08 20:49:22 +0200 | ixlun | (~matthew@213.205.241.25) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2021-04-08 20:49:26 +0200 | <maerwald> | PRs are pretty native |
| 2021-04-08 20:49:31 +0200 | <sm[m]> | isn't a PR a patch plus notification ? |
| 2021-04-08 20:49:58 +0200 | <geekosaur> | it's a patch implemented as a branch |
| 2021-04-08 20:50:00 +0200 | <maerwald> | a PR can simple be an email (as was done by the linux workflow) giving you a link to a repo, info of branch name |
| 2021-04-08 20:50:10 +0200 | <sm[m]> | I think we don't like github PRs because of all the ceremony involved - fork, branch, etc. |
| 2021-04-08 20:50:10 +0200 | <maerwald> | no, PRs are not patches |
| 2021-04-08 20:50:33 +0200 | <yushyin> | it even has a manpage (man git-request-pull) |
| 2021-04-08 20:50:47 +0200 | <maerwald> | branches are not patches either |
| 2021-04-08 20:50:50 +0200 | <sclv> | PRs being integrated with / coupled to discussion and intertwingled with issue tracking feels like it was a github innovation |
| 2021-04-08 20:50:52 +0200 | <maerwald> | commits are not patches |
| 2021-04-08 20:51:06 +0200 | <hyperisco> | patches are not patches either, if you really scrutinize it |
| 2021-04-08 20:51:33 +0200 | <maerwald> | patch workflow can be done with git too (git send-email) |
| 2021-04-08 20:51:38 +0200 | <maerwald> | but a PR is not that |
| 2021-04-08 20:51:43 +0200 | <sclv> | no i've thought about it a lot and a patch is a patch |
| 2021-04-08 20:51:44 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 20:52:04 +0200 | DavidEichmann | (~david@47.27.93.209.dyn.plus.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 20:52:06 +0200 | zebrag | (~inkbottle@aaubervilliers-654-1-2-51.w83-200.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 2021-04-08 20:52:27 +0200 | zebrag | (~inkbottle@aaubervilliers-654-1-2-51.w83-200.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 2021-04-08 20:52:38 +0200 | <hyperisco> | I'm glad someone has looked into it for us |
| 2021-04-08 20:52:53 +0200 | <davean> | sm[m]: git pull rrequests and github bull requests are somewhat different is one of the complaints |
| 2021-04-08 20:53:01 +0200 | <maerwald> | and the advantage of PR workflow is, that you don't have to deal with patches |
| 2021-04-08 20:53:10 +0200 | <maerwald> | you can just checkout out the branch and test |
| 2021-04-08 20:53:14 +0200 | <maerwald> | with no applying of patches |
| 2021-04-08 20:53:29 +0200 | <davean> | Right which was a git thing, but the way github does it mixed it with other things |
| 2021-04-08 20:53:44 +0200 | <hyperisco> | "feature branch" |
| 2021-04-08 20:54:06 +0200 | <davean> | no, it was litterly "git pull", not feature branches |
| 2021-04-08 20:54:12 +0200 | <davean> | because git is desentralized |
| 2021-04-08 20:54:38 +0200 | <davean> | see kernel.org |
| 2021-04-08 20:55:07 +0200 | <hyperisco> | I have never worked with source control in a decentralised way |
| 2021-04-08 20:55:19 +0200 | <davean> | I have, I much prefer it |
| 2021-04-08 20:55:20 +0200 | hidedagger | (~nate@unaffiliated/hidedagger) (Quit: WeeChat 3.1) |
| 2021-04-08 20:55:37 +0200 | <maerwald> | it can be quite annoying wrt CI :) |
| 2021-04-08 20:55:46 +0200 | <hyperisco> | makes sense for open source where everyone needs their own variants |
| 2021-04-08 20:55:51 +0200 | <davean> | Ci is run differently for it |
| 2021-04-08 20:56:09 +0200 | <davean> | if you try to fit CI as you expect for a centralized system on a distributed one, of course theres issues |
| 2021-04-08 20:56:17 +0200 | <davean> | CI just looks entirely different |
| 2021-04-08 20:56:32 +0200 | <davean> | I'll point out the commit IDs are still globally stable when distributed |
| 2021-04-08 20:56:48 +0200 | <davean> | So its not even hard to do the CI for it |
| 2021-04-08 20:57:06 +0200 | <maerwald> | e.g. my GHC PR failed, because I don't have permissions for some of the gitlab runners or something |
| 2021-04-08 20:57:42 +0200 | <maerwald> | s/GHC/ci-images/ |
| 2021-04-08 20:57:53 +0200 | <davean> | But you're sticking a centralized approach on a distirbuted solution to get that issue there |
| 2021-04-08 20:58:09 +0200 | <davean> | Thats exactly why I said you couldn't bring that centralized mindset and get good results |
| 2021-04-08 20:58:15 +0200 | frozenErebus | (~frozenEre@37.231.244.249) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 20:58:17 +0200 | <maerwald> | I've never seen a decentralized CI workflow that works |
| 2021-04-08 20:58:27 +0200 | <sm[m]> | what's the essence of "source control in a decentralised way", compared to github, davean ? More repos, hosted in more places ? |
| 2021-04-08 20:58:31 +0200 | heatsink | (~heatsink@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 20:58:40 +0200 | <davean> | sm[m]: Everyone has their own seperate repos |
| 2021-04-08 20:58:50 +0200 | <davean> | everything is pull based, not push based |
| 2021-04-08 20:59:13 +0200 | <maerwald> | yeah, github doesn't have separate repos internally if you fork, so that was a common attack vector for various jokers |
| 2021-04-08 20:59:31 +0200 | <maerwald> | so if you fork, make sure to not fork :p |
| 2021-04-08 20:59:58 +0200 | <sclv> | there's a huge irony in that git was designed to be distributed, and the whole appeal of github is it recentralized everything |
| 2021-04-08 21:00:34 +0200 | <davean> | sclv: Hum, thats why I don't use github isn't it? ;) |
| 2021-04-08 21:01:03 +0200 | <sclv> | imho decenralized discussion is not a fully solved problem, i'll note |
| 2021-04-08 21:01:18 +0200 | <yushyin> | ^ this |
| 2021-04-08 21:01:22 +0200 | <maerwald> | sclv: yes, it doesn't work |
| 2021-04-08 21:01:40 +0200 | <sm[m]> | davean: on github, everyone making pull requests has their own repo, and it's pull based, too |
| 2021-04-08 21:01:42 +0200 | <maerwald> | that's why we have this mess of ecosystem migrations in haskell |
| 2021-04-08 21:01:49 +0200 | <sm[m]> | at least, IME |
| 2021-04-08 21:02:37 +0200 | <maerwald> | some ppl use github, some not, some only respond via emails |
| 2021-04-08 21:02:58 +0200 | <maerwald> | it's impossible to coordinate anything |
| 2021-04-08 21:03:06 +0200 | <davean> | sm[m]: no, it very much isn't |
| 2021-04-08 21:03:13 +0200 | minoru_shiraeesh | (~shiraeesh@5.101.59.91) |
| 2021-04-08 21:03:36 +0200 | <maerwald> | sm[m]: internally it's one repo if you fork |
| 2021-04-08 21:03:42 +0200 | <davean> | Its not even interally |
| 2021-04-08 21:03:46 +0200 | <maerwald> | the UI makes you think it's separate |
| 2021-04-08 21:03:47 +0200 | <davean> | that shows up VERY clearly |
| 2021-04-08 21:03:47 +0200 | __minoru__shirae | (~shiraeesh@109.166.57.223) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 21:03:53 +0200 | <davean> | And its very much push based |
| 2021-04-08 21:04:09 +0200 | <sm[m]> | what do you mean by push based here ? |
| 2021-04-08 21:04:14 +0200 | <davean> | I can see how you don't see that if you don't git hard, but if you git ... |
| 2021-04-08 21:06:43 +0200 | zyeri- | zyeri |
| 2021-04-08 21:06:44 +0200 | zyeri | (zyeri@gateway/shell/tilde.team/x-oxjvkgeanxdxtgws) (Changing host) |
| 2021-04-08 21:06:44 +0200 | zyeri | (zyeri@tilde.team/users/zyeri) |
| 2021-04-08 21:07:42 +0200 | vicfred | (~vicfred@unaffiliated/vicfred) |
| 2021-04-08 21:09:55 +0200 | heatsink | (~heatsink@108-201-191-115.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) |
| 2021-04-08 21:11:08 +0200 | kiweun | (~kiweun@2607:fea8:2a62:9600:4d74:8eef:fc60:8feb) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 21:11:23 +0200 | cub3s_ | (bifunc2@gateway/vpn/protonvpn/bifunc2) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2021-04-08 21:11:29 +0200 | ericsagn1 | (~ericsagne@2405:6580:0:5100:ea09:d4ec:d157:6a0d) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 21:11:37 +0200 | frozenErebus | (~frozenEre@37.231.244.249) |
| 2021-04-08 21:13:59 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@c-68-54-25-135.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 21:15:42 +0200 | <monochrom> | If you own the repo, you push all the time, I know I do. |
| 2021-04-08 21:17:24 +0200 | <monochrom> | I push from my computer to my github repo. |
| 2021-04-08 21:17:59 +0200 | <maerwald> | the only time you don't push is when you work directly on the bare git repo, which you probably shouldn't |
| 2021-04-08 21:18:11 +0200 | jjhoo | (jahakala@dsl-trebng21-b048b5-171.dhcp.inet.fi) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 21:18:17 +0200 | jjhoo_ | (jahakala@dsl-trebng21-b048b5-171.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 2021-04-08 21:18:57 +0200 | <maerwald> | the only plague that github introduces is the merge button in the UI |
| 2021-04-08 21:18:58 +0200 | falafel | (~falafel@pool-96-255-70-50.washdc.fios.verizon.net) |
| 2021-04-08 21:19:25 +0200 | <maerwald> | that's what breaks all the original workflow (and also other things like proper gpg signatures) |
| 2021-04-08 21:19:50 +0200 | <sm[m]> | I push from my machine to my github repo too. Does that make github push based ? I thought we were talking more about the collaboration flow |
| 2021-04-08 21:20:01 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@c-68-54-25-135.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 2021-04-08 21:20:57 +0200 | <monochrom> | Alright, my workflow is push-based, and it's a very personal repo. |
| 2021-04-08 21:22:07 +0200 | <maerwald> | though Linus said that github isn't radical enough with their usability UI... he wants a better online editor |
| 2021-04-08 21:22:21 +0200 | <maerwald> | because that's the only reason he uses that website anyway |
| 2021-04-08 21:22:36 +0200 | <yushyin> | haha |
| 2021-04-08 21:22:49 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) |
| 2021-04-08 21:23:08 +0200 | <monochrom> | Yeah sounds like an oversimplified merge button is a sorry excuse for a merge-and-resolve-conflict editor. |
| 2021-04-08 21:23:29 +0200 | <monochrom> | But let me have some fun here. |
| 2021-04-08 21:23:43 +0200 | ericsagn1 | (~ericsagne@2405:6580:0:5100:889c:8645:b190:195f) |
| 2021-04-08 21:23:52 +0200 | <monochrom> | Back then I used RCS and then CVS. It was ci-based, and it was ci both ways. |
| 2021-04-08 21:24:07 +0200 | <monochrom> | And back then "ci" meant "check in". And it was always snowing. |
| 2021-04-08 21:24:51 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@c-68-54-25-135.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 21:25:11 +0200 | <maerwald> | doing rebases against remote branches in git with large local branches is an insane task... you have to fix conflicts for every single commit and it's easy to lose track what's going on, what commit you're on etc |
| 2021-04-08 21:25:21 +0200 | <maerwald> | the cli doesn't help much here |
| 2021-04-08 21:25:33 +0200 | <maerwald> | github failed to do anything about that |
| 2021-04-08 21:26:04 +0200 | <maerwald> | but these days everyone just does merges, including reverse merges |
| 2021-04-08 21:26:29 +0200 | <monochrom> | Only a 60-inch 4K screen helps. So that you can see all of the mess on your table. |
| 2021-04-08 21:26:50 +0200 | <maerwald> | That's when I go home and eat Ramen instead |
| 2021-04-08 21:27:17 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 21:27:19 +0200 | <maerwald> | or dream what if darcs had won the VCS race |
| 2021-04-08 21:28:05 +0200 | cansis | (uid90033@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ntyzgjywyljhqpqt) |
| 2021-04-08 21:28:06 +0200 | <maerwald> | also: https://github.com/mhagger/git-imerge |
| 2021-04-08 21:28:13 +0200 | <maerwald> | good example why git can be too hard :) |
| 2021-04-08 21:29:20 +0200 | solvr | (57e3c46d@87.227.196.109) |
| 2021-04-08 21:31:07 +0200 | elfets | (~elfets@ip-37-201-23-96.hsi13.unitymediagroup.de) |
| 2021-04-08 21:38:35 +0200 | falafel | (~falafel@pool-96-255-70-50.washdc.fios.verizon.net) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 21:39:13 +0200 | <hololeap> | git-cola's pretty nice |
| 2021-04-08 21:39:23 +0200 | jacks2 | (~bc8134e3@217.29.117.252) (Quit: http://www.okay.uz/ (Session timeout)) |
| 2021-04-08 21:39:35 +0200 | <hololeap> | not sure if it would help in that case |
| 2021-04-08 21:41:22 +0200 | Sornaensis | (~Sornaensi@79.142.232.102.static.router4.bolignet.dk) |
| 2021-04-08 21:42:41 +0200 | <maerwald> | one thing is: whenever I run `git mergetool`, I have to figure out which of those 3 sides is what exactly |
| 2021-04-08 21:43:06 +0200 | Mrbuck | (~Mrbuck@gateway/tor-sasl/mrbuck) (Quit: WeeChat 2.8) |
| 2021-04-08 21:44:45 +0200 | Sorny | (~Sornaensi@077213203030.dynamic.telenor.dk) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 21:44:52 +0200 | <sm[m]> | maerwald: if you want to feel better about git merge conflicts, try darcs' for a bit! |
| 2021-04-08 21:45:16 +0200 | <maerwald> | I don't even understand the concepts of darcs :) |
| 2021-04-08 21:45:25 +0200 | <sm[m]> | darcs just has no idea which side is which :) |
| 2021-04-08 21:46:32 +0200 | <maerwald> | https://shafiul.github.io/gitbook/1_the_git_object_model.html this is the only thing you need to know about git |
| 2021-04-08 21:47:04 +0200 | <maerwald> | with darcs, I don't know where to start |
| 2021-04-08 21:47:11 +0200 | stree | (~stree@68.36.8.116) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 21:48:44 +0200 | Lord_of_Life_ | (~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362) |
| 2021-04-08 21:49:45 +0200 | <sm[m]> | Oh darcs is pretty easy - just "it'll munge my text edits together in any order as long as they don't overlap" |
| 2021-04-08 21:50:19 +0200 | <haskellstudent> | fresheyeball: i finished my miso vs reflex vs shpadoinkle evaluation. i spent the last week learning the basics and reading the todomvc code in all 3 and implemented the same small program (this https://i.imgur.com/YbTvJoB.png) in each. its the same in miso and shpadoinkle, but in reflex i could not figure out how to do the add/remove page buttons which add and remove "pages" and buttons at runtime even after an entire day. i am |
| 2021-04-08 21:50:19 +0200 | <haskellstudent> | most pleased with spadoinkle, it seems like the most elegant and straightforward way to do it and i had a great experience with it so far so thank you for creating it and recommending it to me! |
| 2021-04-08 21:50:21 +0200 | kritzefitz | (~kritzefit@212.86.56.80) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 21:50:43 +0200 | <sm[m]> | and I can push/pull those around to other repos. All you need to know |
| 2021-04-08 21:50:43 +0200 | Lord_of_Life | (~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 21:50:43 +0200 | Lord_of_Life_ | Lord_of_Life |
| 2021-04-08 21:50:46 +0200 | <haskellstudent> | if anyone is interested, this is the code for the same thing (minus add/remove page) in reflex for the 3 libs: |
| 2021-04-08 21:50:47 +0200 | <haskellstudent> | shpadoinkle https://pastebin.com/Z9dkdw3e |
| 2021-04-08 21:50:47 +0200 | <haskellstudent> | miso https://pastebin.com/HA225uWC |
| 2021-04-08 21:50:47 +0200 | <haskellstudent> | reflex https://pastebin.com/HLRM5RMA |
| 2021-04-08 21:52:05 +0200 | gproto023 | (~gproto23@unaffiliated/gproto23) |
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| 2021-04-08 22:04:20 +0200 | siers | ij |
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| 2021-04-08 22:19:28 +0200 | nbloomf | (~nbloomf@2600:1700:ad14:3020:4552:1533:b307:c3a6) |
| 2021-04-08 22:20:27 +0200 | nut | (~user@roc37-h01-176-170-197-243.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr) |
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| 2021-04-08 22:21:03 +0200 | <dcbdan> | is there a debugger / program stepper? i.e. walk through the values of variables in a program step by step? Kinda like gdb, but with haskell values? Right now I make a lot of print statements, is that un-advisable? |
| 2021-04-08 22:21:26 +0200 | <nut> | my algorithm needs to modify elements in an arry often, do people use mutable vectors in such situations or stick to immutable vectors? |
| 2021-04-08 22:21:28 +0200 | justanotheruser | (~justanoth@unaffiliated/justanotheruser) |
| 2021-04-08 22:21:52 +0200 | <nut> | dcbdan: ghci, the repl is a debugger |
| 2021-04-08 22:22:25 +0200 | <nut> | dcbdan: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L7QZwH_844s&t=145s |
| 2021-04-08 22:22:51 +0200 | <nut> | dcbdan: check that youtube tutorial, it's the best |
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| 2021-04-08 22:26:34 +0200 | deu- | (de@uio.re) |
| 2021-04-08 22:26:40 +0200 | <dcbdan> | ahhhhh, I had no idea! that's good to know |
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| 2021-04-08 22:26:55 +0200 | deu- | deu |
| 2021-04-08 22:27:32 +0200 | Eliel | (~jojkaart@163.172.153.251) |
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| 2021-04-08 22:29:29 +0200 | L1Cafe | (~L1Cafe@kydara.com) |
| 2021-04-08 22:30:15 +0200 | <sm[m]> | dcbdan: let us know how you get on with the one in ghci. It's not used much, perhaps it should be used more. Print statements are used a lot and there's nothing wrong with that, use Debug.Trace |
| 2021-04-08 22:32:06 +0200 | reda | (~niemand@unaffiliated/reda) |
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| 2021-04-08 22:38:15 +0200 | <dcbdan> | I just kinda assumed that something like Debug.Trace wouldn't exist |
| 2021-04-08 22:38:17 +0200 | acidjnk_new | (~acidjnk@p200300d0c72b9564e895d5f110e04519.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 2021-04-08 22:38:37 +0200 | <dcbdan> | since as the docs say, it isn't refer transparent |
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| 2021-04-08 22:52:05 +0200 | zebrag | (~inkbottle@aaubervilliers-654-1-2-51.w83-200.abo.wanadoo.fr) (Quit: Konversation terminated!) |
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| 2021-04-08 22:54:46 +0200 | <koz_> | nut: Do you have the modifications 'all at once', and then use the array immutably? |
| 2021-04-08 22:54:53 +0200 | <koz_> | Are the modifications in fairly random places? |
| 2021-04-08 22:55:02 +0200 | <koz_> | Or, perhaps more concretely: what are you trying to do? |
| 2021-04-08 22:55:05 +0200 | star_cloud | (~star_clou@ec2-34-220-44-120.us-west-2.compute.amazonaws.com) |
| 2021-04-08 22:56:02 +0200 | ddellaco_ | (~ddellacos@ool-44c73afa.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 2021-04-08 22:56:03 +0200 | rond_ | (59402191@89-64-33-145.dynamic.chello.pl) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 22:57:12 +0200 | <nut> | koz_: I'm reading a string and test if characters repeat. for this the easiest is to use array of bools and toggle the flag |
| 2021-04-08 22:57:20 +0200 | pfurla | (~pfurla@mx141.canadialed.com) |
| 2021-04-08 22:57:32 +0200 | <koz_> | The solution to this is 'use a Map'. |
| 2021-04-08 22:57:38 +0200 | <koz_> | Or HashMap, either or. |
| 2021-04-08 22:57:50 +0200 | <koz_> | Zero arrays or mutation needed, probably faster too. |
| 2021-04-08 22:58:19 +0200 | <nut> | zero arrays? |
| 2021-04-08 22:58:26 +0200 | <koz_> | As in, you don't need any arrays. |
| 2021-04-08 22:58:35 +0200 | <nut> | i see |
| 2021-04-08 22:58:59 +0200 | <nut> | I'm just so accustomed to imperative arrays |
| 2021-04-08 22:59:13 +0200 | <koz_> | Get un-accustomed. |
| 2021-04-08 22:59:22 +0200 | <koz_> | You're in a different environment, it requires different tools. |
| 2021-04-08 22:59:40 +0200 | <koz_> | Otherwise you'll be stuck forever in XY problem hell. |
| 2021-04-08 23:00:17 +0200 | <nut> | I do realize that Data.Map could be the one because it offers O(log n) lookup and 'modification' |
| 2021-04-08 23:00:21 +0200 | <monochrom> | It is possible that the mutable array of bool may be faster than the Map (balanced binary search tree). But the other way round is also possible. Perhaps benchmark them. |
| 2021-04-08 23:00:40 +0200 | <koz_> | monochrom: If you use HashMap, I'll be _very_ surprised if a mutable array wins. |
| 2021-04-08 23:00:44 +0200 | <nut> | by modification i mean update the Data.Map value |
| 2021-04-08 23:00:57 +0200 | <monochrom> | Don't forget that you also have IntMap and unordered-container's HashMap to choose from. Moar indecisions. |
| 2021-04-08 23:01:05 +0200 | <monochrom> | Also, s/Map/Set/ |
| 2021-04-08 23:01:22 +0200 | <koz_> | monochrom: It depends whether you wanna know which are duplicated, not whether there's a dup or not. |
| 2021-04-08 23:01:38 +0200 | <koz_> | If you only need to know if dupes are present, you just use 'hashNub' and do a size comparison. |
| 2021-04-08 23:02:08 +0200 | <koz_> | Either way, if confronted with either of those problems, mutable arrays aren't even the _third_ thing I'd reach for. |
| 2021-04-08 23:02:24 +0200 | <nut> | wow |
| 2021-04-08 23:02:25 +0200 | abrar | (~abrar@static-108-30-103-121.nycmny.fios.verizon.net) |
| 2021-04-08 23:02:43 +0200 | <nut> | mutable vectors are a bit difficult to use |
| 2021-04-08 23:02:46 +0200 | <nut> | for beginners |
| 2021-04-08 23:02:48 +0200 | <nut> | at least |
| 2021-04-08 23:02:53 +0200 | <koz_> | They're more involved. |
| 2021-04-08 23:03:10 +0200 | <koz_> | Since you need to know a) what ST is and how to use it, and b) why GHC occasionally fails to infer stuff with runST. |
| 2021-04-08 23:03:11 +0200 | danso | (~dan@23-233-111-52.cpe.pppoe.ca) (Quit: WeeChat 3.0) |
| 2021-04-08 23:03:19 +0200 | <koz_> | (at least b) is going away once quick-look lands) |
| 2021-04-08 23:03:55 +0200 | <koz_> | a), combined with the fact that mutable arrays often don't offer any improvement in perf (and indeed can make it _worse_ sometimes) is why I don't recommend reaching for them in the first instance. |
| 2021-04-08 23:04:06 +0200 | <koz_> | It's a lot of additional ceremony for.. no reason. |
| 2021-04-08 23:04:10 +0200 | <nut> | Those two reasons are enough to push beginners towards Maps |
| 2021-04-08 23:04:32 +0200 | <koz_> | Immutable array/vector is also a good choice in many cases. |
| 2021-04-08 23:04:38 +0200 | hyperisco | (~hyperisco@d192-186-117-226.static.comm.cgocable.net) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 23:04:45 +0200 | <koz_> | Heck, 'generate' alone obviates the need for mutation at least half the time. |
| 2021-04-08 23:04:49 +0200 | <koz_> | (and 'generateM') |
| 2021-04-08 23:05:10 +0200 | <nut> | numerical analysis or number crunching? |
| 2021-04-08 23:05:24 +0200 | <koz_> | Depends on the problem. |
| 2021-04-08 23:05:28 +0200 | <koz_> | I can't generalize for whole fields. |
| 2021-04-08 23:05:38 +0200 | <koz_> | Your choice of data structure is highly problem-specific. |
| 2021-04-08 23:06:26 +0200 | <monochrom> | Immutable vector shines when either it's write-only-read-many-times (e.g., dynamic programming) or the new vector is a streaming transform of the old vector. |
| 2021-04-08 23:06:43 +0200 | gehmehgeh | (~ircuser1@gateway/tor-sasl/gehmehgeh) (Quit: Leaving) |
| 2021-04-08 23:06:44 +0200 | <monochrom> | err write-once-read-many-times |
| 2021-04-08 23:07:04 +0200 | <koz_> | I'd supplement by saying 'it also depends how the vector is produced'. |
| 2021-04-08 23:07:18 +0200 | <koz_> | If you can phrase your construction in terms of 'generate' or 'generateM'? You win very big. |
| 2021-04-08 23:07:27 +0200 | <monochrom> | Yeah, that. |
| 2021-04-08 23:07:29 +0200 | <koz_> | (and they're surprisingly powerful primitives) |
| 2021-04-08 23:07:51 +0200 | pfurla | (~pfurla@mx141.canadialed.com) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 23:07:57 +0200 | <koz_> | I've had at least two cases in recent memory where someone tried to do something gory with arrays, and it ran terribly; upon further inspection, what they wanted was 'generate'. |
| 2021-04-08 23:07:57 +0200 | <nut> | How do you 'write' once immutable vectors? |
| 2021-04-08 23:08:08 +0200 | <koz_> | nut: You don't - you use a construction function which builds them. |
| 2021-04-08 23:08:10 +0200 | <koz_> | (like 'generate') |
| 2021-04-08 23:08:18 +0200 | <monochrom> | The same way you write-once a binary tree |
| 2021-04-08 23:08:19 +0200 | <nut> | i see |
| 2021-04-08 23:08:51 +0200 | <monochrom> | The same way you set up "final variables" in Java. |
| 2021-04-08 23:09:08 +0200 | <nut> | that's indeed a new idea for me |
| 2021-04-08 23:09:19 +0200 | <koz_> | nut: It takes adjustment. |
| 2021-04-08 23:09:33 +0200 | <koz_> | But trying to hammer the square peg of mutation into every possible Haskell hole won't end well. |
| 2021-04-08 23:09:45 +0200 | <koz_> | A good practice - start by doing _everything_ immutably. |
| 2021-04-08 23:09:51 +0200 | nbloomf | (~nbloomf@2600:1700:ad14:3020:4552:1533:b307:c3a6) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) |
| 2021-04-08 23:10:07 +0200 | <koz_> | You can always change it later if you find it's slow. However, you probably won't. |
| 2021-04-08 23:10:39 +0200 | nckx | (~nckx@tobias.gr) (Quit: Updating my Guix System — https://guix.gnu.org) |
| 2021-04-08 23:10:47 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) |
| 2021-04-08 23:11:57 +0200 | kiweun | (~kiweun@2607:fea8:2a62:9600:1169:451:f7b9:a016) |
| 2021-04-08 23:12:30 +0200 | <dcbdan> | what is 'generate' , 'generateM' ? |
| 2021-04-08 23:12:44 +0200 | <koz_> | https://hackage.haskell.org/package/vector-0.12.3.0/docs/Data-Vector.html#v:generate |
| 2021-04-08 23:12:50 +0200 | <koz_> | https://hackage.haskell.org/package/vector-0.12.3.0/docs/Data-Vector.html#v:generateM |
| 2021-04-08 23:13:27 +0200 | <dcbdan> | got it |
| 2021-04-08 23:14:04 +0200 | shalokshalom | (~quassel@2a02:1748:dd5e:7f60:cf49:8384:7c93:3106) |
| 2021-04-08 23:15:06 +0200 | <minoru_shiraeesh> | dcbdan: regarding a question about debugging: there is a ghc-vis too |
| 2021-04-08 23:15:33 +0200 | <minoru_shiraeesh> | not sure if it's convenient to debug with, but looks cool |
| 2021-04-08 23:16:44 +0200 | kiweun | (~kiweun@2607:fea8:2a62:9600:1169:451:f7b9:a016) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 23:16:49 +0200 | <dcbdan> | look at the image about 3/4s down: http://felsin9.de/nnis/ghc-vis/#basic-usage |
| 2021-04-08 23:16:58 +0200 | <dcbdan> | kinda scary, kinda beautiful |
| 2021-04-08 23:17:37 +0200 | <dcbdan> | ^ minoru_shiraeesh |
| 2021-04-08 23:18:21 +0200 | malumore | (~malumore@151.62.113.39) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 23:19:15 +0200 | danvet | (~Daniel@2a02:168:57f4:0:efd0:b9e5:5ae6:c2fa) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 23:20:32 +0200 | Habib | (~Habib@185.169.233.238) |
| 2021-04-08 23:20:43 +0200 | ddellaco_ | (~ddellacos@ool-44c73afa.dyn.optonline.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 23:21:26 +0200 | <minoru_shiraeesh> | dcbdan: an image like that may seem intimidating, that's for sure |
| 2021-04-08 23:21:39 +0200 | ddellaco_ | (~ddellacos@ool-44c73afa.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 2021-04-08 23:21:43 +0200 | pera | (~pera@unaffiliated/pera) |
| 2021-04-08 23:22:34 +0200 | nckx | (~nckx@tobias.gr) |
| 2021-04-08 23:23:20 +0200 | <koala_man> | . o O (How do they expect me to find a specific image in that long p..oh I see) |
| 2021-04-08 23:23:21 +0200 | <minoru_shiraeesh> | here is a video that shows an example |
| 2021-04-08 23:23:23 +0200 | <minoru_shiraeesh> | Screencast: The Haskell heap and the infinite list of primes |
| 2021-04-08 23:23:28 +0200 | <minoru_shiraeesh> | https://youtu.be/UPy7TXgrK1A |
| 2021-04-08 23:24:16 +0200 | <minoru_shiraeesh> | *an example of how to interpret images in ghc-vis |
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| 2021-04-08 23:27:03 +0200 | fiedlr | (~fiedlr@83.148.33.254) |
| 2021-04-08 23:27:26 +0200 | ixlun | (~matthew@213.205.241.25) |
| 2021-04-08 23:29:02 +0200 | pfurla_ | (~pfurla@24.46.210.226) |
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| 2021-04-08 23:31:26 +0200 | michalz | (~user@185.246.204.43) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 23:32:05 +0200 | <dcbdan> | that's pretty neat. I assume ghc-vis can show Show instances |
| 2021-04-08 23:33:35 +0200 | chenshen | (~chenshen@2620:10d:c090:400::5:2016) |
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| 2021-04-08 23:36:41 +0200 | justsomeguy | (~justsomeg@unaffiliated/--/x-3805311) |
| 2021-04-08 23:38:29 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) (Quit: Connection closed) |
| 2021-04-08 23:38:51 +0200 | raehik | (~raehik@cpc95906-rdng25-2-0-cust156.15-3.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 23:38:51 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) |
| 2021-04-08 23:39:08 +0200 | LKoen | (~LKoen@65.250.88.92.rev.sfr.net) (Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.”) |
| 2021-04-08 23:39:31 +0200 | nut | (~user@roc37-h01-176-170-197-243.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 23:41:23 +0200 | dycan | (~dycan@101-137-245-60.mobile.dynamic.aptg.com.tw) |
| 2021-04-08 23:42:45 +0200 | ixlun | (~matthew@213.205.241.25) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 23:43:46 +0200 | Kaiepi | (~Kaiepi@47.54.252.148) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 23:43:57 +0200 | royal_screwup21 | (52254809@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.82.37.72.9) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 23:46:18 +0200 | is_null | (~jpic@pdpc/supporter/professional/is-null) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 23:48:36 +0200 | wroathe | (~wroathe@c-68-54-25-135.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 2021-04-08 23:55:16 +0200 | lawt | (~lawt@c-73-151-3-92.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 2021-04-08 23:55:38 +0200 | neiluj | (~jco@unaffiliated/neiluj) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 23:57:09 +0200 | ddellaco_ | (~ddellacos@ool-44c73afa.dyn.optonline.net) (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 2021-04-08 23:58:10 +0200 | ddellaco_ | (~ddellacos@ool-44c73afa.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 2021-04-08 23:59:33 +0200 | hendursaga | (~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 2021-04-08 23:59:44 +0200 | puffnfresh1 | (~puffnfres@119-17-138-164.77118a.mel.static.aussiebb.net) |
